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Russian Government Not Cooperating with New START Treaty Provisions for Nuclear Arms Control; President Biden to Give Speech in Poland; Russian President Putin Gives Speech to Russian Nation about Ongoing War in Ukraine. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired February 21, 2023 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: Antony Blinken blasts that, saying it is an irresponsible decision, he believes. It's not Russia formally pulling out of the agreement yet, but it remains to be seen what that looks like, Poppy and Sara. And, obviously, big questions for what President Biden is going to say when he has the world stage in a matter of hours from now.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: It's a great point. Let's bring in to talk about that and a lot more, Clarissa Ward joins us live again this morning in Kyiv, former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine Bill Taylor, and retired Major General James "Spider" Marks. And General, let me just begin with you where Kaitlan left off, and that is on new START, the agreement, right, between the United States, Russia, et cetera, that was supposed to expire in 2026, the fact that Russia is saying now it will not go along anymore with any inspections on a full withdrawal, but the significance of that and the fact that Antony Blinken, the secretary of state, said it is deeply unfortunate and irresponsible, but also, I should note, Spider, said the U.S. will talk to Russia about this at any point regardless of what's happening on the world stage with Russia and Ukraine. That is how critical the U.S. believes this is.

MAJ. GEN. JAMES "SPIDER" MARKS (RET), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Absolutely critical. Look, the only way that the nuclear threat is going to cool down in any way is if you look at past history where the United States and formerly the Soviet Union agreed to have their SALT talks, to have the START talks, and then to continue with the new START talks that we see right now.

That competition has been in place for over four to five decades, and it must be addressed. Look, one nuclear weapon alone is sufficient to give us all concern, right? What we're talking about is Russia has in excess of 5,000 nuclear weapons. The United States on this graphic right here has about 5,000 as well. China, we need to keep in mind, is increasing their nuclear stockpile. So the discussion about nukes has to take place very broadly. It needs to be we serious, and it needs to be isolated and not tied to any other conflicts or challenges that exist, i.e., the problem in Ukraine is that Russia had this war of conquest and they are not giving any indication that they are going to leave. That needs to be addressed, but separately from the discussion in terms of strategic nuclear drawdown. That must take place. SARA SIDNER, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Major General, I can't help

but ask this, because it's been annoying me. There is talk of giving F-16s to the Ukrainians from the United States. How long does it take to train for those? Like, can you give us some sense of how long it would take if those actually ended up in the country for their air force, their version of the air force, to train and to be competent on them?

MARKS: Well, just don't fly an F-16. You fight an F-16 in concert with ground activity, ground maneuver intelligence, air engagements, et cetera. It's not just flying an aircraft. It's fighting that aircraft effectively. This a year-long, minimal year-long type of training environment. But what you want -- look, the Ukrainian air force has some competency is in a cockpit like that. So you could get them up to the ability to fly the ting, but then you have to put them through some training so that they can fight it. So that's a distinction with a difference.

SIDNER: Major General Marks, that is --

HARLOW: That is eye-opening.

SIDNER: Right? I didn't realize it was that long. Wow. That's incredible. Kaitlan?

COLLINS: And that's what we have heard from the Ukrainian foreign minister saying start training the Ukrainians on them now so that if you do ultimately decide, that they are already trained.

Clarissa Ward, you are live on the ground in Kyiv. You were there as President Biden was there. We're even seeing signs here today saying send the F-16 to Ukraine now, a clear message to President Biden. I wonder what Ukrainians are making not only what President Biden might say today but also what President Putin said this morning?

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: I think it's been interesting to see, obviously, there was a hugely post positive reaction to President Biden's visit here yesterday. People will be watching to see what might be said in Warsaw today, particularly after we heard from Andriy Yermak, the chief of staff of the office of the presidency. He alluded to the fact that potentially there could be some movement on some of these stickier issues. He talked about issues being resolved, things that were stuck being sped up. Not clear if he is referring specifically to any of the heavier weaponry that we have been talking about, whether that's fighter jets, whether that's long- range artillery or missiles. But that's certainly what people here will be looking out for.

In terms of President Putin's speech, I think it really just affirmed for people, or reaffirmed, I should say, the alternate reality that President Putin is living in.

[08:05:00]

The idea that Ukraine's government is somehow responsible for the misfortunes of this country, that they are responsible for the plummeting economic situation, they are acting in the best interest of the west and not their own people, these are all the types of sort of categorizations that most people find preposterous. And we actually heard from Mikhail Podolyak, who is a senior advisor to the presidency, who said Putin demonstrated, quote, "irrelevance and confusion because everywhere there are Nazis, Martians, and conspiracy theories." Essentially, really laying the groundwork for the broader idea here, which is how on earth could we be expected to sit down and try to hash out some kind of a political solution when the Russian president is talking in these terms and clearly is living in a different universe to what people here are seeing and experiencing on the ground every day.

HARLOW: Ambassador Taylor, as we are a few hours away from President Biden speaking, we know that from the White House this won't be a direct rebuttal to Putin, but Putin did sort of set the stage for this. How do you think his remarks are impacted by the reality that the secretary of state is very concerned about China possibly supplying lethal aid to Russia, and now Russia this morning saying it won't comply with new START inspections?

BILL TAYLOR, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE: So, Poppy, it just demonstrates the problems that we have with the Russians. The Russians have not been cooperative about anything. Indeed, they have been clearly responsible for this invasion. There is no reason -- there was no reason for the Russians to invade. It was totally unprovoked. And so they have now indicated that they are not going to cooperate on new START. As Spider Marks says, this is a problem that can be addressed. We tried to address it, the Americans tried to address it with the Russians, and they pulled out of the conversation. They would not engage in this kind of conversation.

So it's clearly the Russians' issue. Back on the issue about the F- 16s, just one thing on that, that's a long-term, as Spider Marks just indicated, that's going to take a year. There are two issues here. One is how to enable the Ukrainians to win on the battlefield right now in the next couple of months, and that won't be with F-16s. That will be with the kinds of weapons that are already there and that will include some of the European tanks, the Leopards. That's the immediate fight which they can win. The longer-term fight is where the F-16s and other weapons come in. That's where Ukraine needs to be able to deter and defend against another Russian attack. So there are two different timeframes here. F-16s are in the longer-term timeframe.

HARLOW: And Kaitlan, it wasn't just, as you pointed out, the Ukraine foreign minister saying let's train them now. It was also U.S. Senator Lindsey Graham echoing some others in the U.S. Congress who have said train them now.

COLLINS: Yes. But Wolf asked John Kirby about this last night. He said right now no plans to train them on that.

I want to bring in Christiane Amanpour who is here with us. You're listening to Ambassador Bill Taylor. What do you make about what they have said about the F-16s?

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Look, I think, certainly having come from the Munich Security Conference and interviewing a lot of people there who are in the decision making process, that might come, as we've said, in sort of a way everything that Ukraine has asked for a year has been no, no, no, yes. Everything from long-range artillery to anti-aircraft systems to HIMARS and tanks, and who knows, perhaps they will eventually get the planes. as Ambassador Taylor said may not need them right now, but.

But the most important thing is that the Ukrainians need the ammunition to go with the weapons systems that they have right now. This is the most important and crucial thing that is sort of not flying under the radar because the Europeans and NATO are trying to address this. But the production capacity in NATO is not as fast as they would like right now. They need shells and ammunitions for all the systems that they have, and that's for the current battle underway.

Having said that, we do not and nor have these experts yet seen a sort of special evidence of any kind of new and different so-called Russian spring offensive. It just hasn't materialized yet.

COLLINS: And is the idea that even if they do launch that and it does materialize it could be successful? We talk about it like it's guaranteed that it will, but it's not really.

AMANPOUR: The question is, and all the military experts will answer this better than I do, has Russia, has the military there figured out how to fix everything that we've seen that's gone wrong on their battlefield over the last year? We don't know that. But what we do know, and this is frantically important, is that what they may lack in quality they make up for in quantity. In other words, the number of people that they are ready to shove at this in human waves because they do not care about the loss of their own lives, much less the loss of Ukrainian lives. So they have an advantage of people.

[08:10:11]

COLLINS: And Putin had that moment of silence in his very lengthy speech this morning for the Russian soldiers that they lost. What did you make of his speech this morning?

AMANPOUR: I was actually kind of interested that he did not lay out a battle plan for this next few weeks and months. It was all the stuff that we have heard in the past, the narrative of the Russians that portrays them as the victims, them as the saviors, Ukrainians as the evil monsters, the Nazis, again, again he said that.

Of course, he had to address with a moment of silence and other things that he said, congratulating their heroes he kept saying, because the mothers, the sisters and brothers, the fathers of all these people who have been thrown at this battle like into a meat grinder, he wants to make sure that it doesn't come to a head whereby they come out of their homes and start to protest, because that could happen. That's what happened at the end of the Afghan occupation in 1989. It was the parents who came out and said enough already. Our children are, are dying for nothing. So I think that's really important. COLLINS: Yes, trying to keep popular opinion. You talked about giving

soldiers vacation days, talking about those two weeks once a year. He has used these speeches to, a, announce the special military operation, as he called it, to announce the conscription. Are you surprised there wasn't an announcement like that beyond the suspension?

AMANPOUR: Not really, because, again, he knows how domestically tricky that is. He might do it, but maybe that was not the speech whereby he was going to announce it. What I found interesting was that he addressed sort of obliquely the problems with the Russian military, saying that in the next five years -- how about right now -- we have got to figure out how to get our military better than it is, essentially, he was saying. We have to modernize. We have to do all these things that he was saying, Clearly knowing, especially through the Russian military bloggers on the ground, knowing that there has been a huge amount of criticism of the ministry of defense and the Russian military operation. A huge amount of criticism not about the war, but about the way it's being prosecute by the Russians. So he had to do that.

And then, of course, he did fling a few salvos at the utter corruption that we've seen, talking about people in their yachts and fleeing and having a good time with all their, quote-unquote, ill-gotten gains abroad.

COLLINS: Yes, he had a clear audience in mind. And Sara, we were listening to that speech. He also was talking about how resilient the Russian economy is. That's something that's actually been -- it's more resilient than you've heard from some people in the west, I think, than what they were surprised by.

AMANPOUR: Well, yes. But in the long-term, the west, and again, this was said at Munich, that's because of the price of gas. But as you can see, that's already going down. And Russia has been caught off from the international -- a lot of the international financial system, and they are also having problems getting spare parts, getting all the high-tech that they need.

That's why the west is legitimately worried about any move by China, whose foreign minister is going there today, is probably there, to send any kind of lethal weaponry. I am told that as yet they have seen no evidence that that has started. But the west is really, the E.U. and the United States, really trying to convince China that it would not be in anybody's best interests. And I think President Biden's trip to Kyiv was a monument of courage and timeliness, and not just a symbol, but an absolute declaration that we, as leaders of the free world, are here to support you in your fight. That was a really important visit.

COLLINS: Yes. It was such a moment for his presidency.

AMANPOUR: And not for his presidency. For the prosecution of this war and for what it says if in the battle of democracy against autocracy.

COLLINS: Yes. And that's a theme, I think, Sara and Poppy, that we will also hear from President Biden who is speaking just a few hours from now.

SIDNER: Kaitlan, I love to see you and Christiane there. Please give Christiane my best. I bow down to that woman. She has been an inspiration my whole life.

(LAUGHTER)

SIDNER: All right, everyone, please stand by. There is a lot more to come there.

First, we're going to go to Fred, though, and whether or not he is hearing any reaction. Look, we haven't heard Biden actually say anything yet, but there is a speech coming, and certainly we've heard quite a bit from the Kremlin already.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we certainly have. First of all, I agree with everything that Christiane says, obviously, just like you guys probably do. And then second of all, you are absolutely right. Obviously, a lot of strong words from Vladimir Putin today. But I think really the key thing that he was trying to do is he was trying to point out from the Russian perspective the sort of inevitability of the war that is now going on in Ukraine and also, of course, trying to frame this as a conflict between Russia and the west, specifically Russia and the leader of the west, Russia and the United States. I want to listen into a little more of what Putin had to say.

[08:15:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA (through translator): The elite of the West, does not conceal their ambitions, which is to strategically defeat Russia. What does that mean? It means to finish yourself once and for all. And to make local, they do that by making local conflicts into much wider and bigger ones.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PLEITGEN: So, you have Vladimir Putin saying, he believes that all this is essentially a conspiracy by the West against Russia, that they had to take action. That was something that he -- that he specifically said. He also, you know, sort of tried to say that the Authorities and Kyiv are not legitimate, saying he believes that they're alien to the actual people in Ukraine. And you know, some of that might sound awkward to people internationally. But there are a lot of folks here in Russia actually believe that and I think it's important for our viewers to understand that we've actually spoken to top Russian pollsters here.

And he said 80 percent of the people in Russia support Vladimir Putin and a large part of the people also, at least, are not negative to the special military operation, that obviously meaning the war in Ukraine. So, certainly, you know, some of the things that we hear from Vladimir Putin, a lot of folks are buying them here in Russia. And that's obviously very important to know, especially when we look at the way things are going to move forward. Obviously, the Russians are saying they are in it for the long run, and certainly not willing to back down guys.

HARLOW: Fred Pleitgen in Moscow. Thank you, Fred. We'll get back to you soon. Kaitlan, let's go back to you as Christiane.

COLLINS: We were just talking about also the idea that, you know, President Biden is meeting behind closed doors with President Duda. We're going to see them any moment now. We'll see if they offer any comments, you know, this is their second meeting in less than a year, it's pretty remarkable to see how that relationship hasn't changed and how Poland is viewed.

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: What well, it is. But of course, Poland is right on the coalface of this conflict, you know, it's on the border. And what's happened over these last 12 months, is these East European states, plus the Baltic states, other former Warsaw Pact states, have come into their own. Now they are the ones who are pushing the West, and the United States to do as much as they can. Why? Because they're the ones who are going to be rolled over next. I mean, nobody really thinks that's going to happen anymore.

But it was a possibility at the beginning. But with Putin having bitten off apparently more than you can chew right now. It's unlikely that he's going to try but he might, you know, so they're worried about that. Having said that, of course, the United States has proved that no matter how much it gets from East Europe, now, it is the West, that is the strongest, that has the most power, that is still in charge of this transatlantic security architecture.

COLLINS: Yes, and to see how Poland has boosted its defense spending. It also --

AMANPOUR: Yes.

COLLINS: -- just alone and what they're buying from South Korea, we're getting live images. Also, this morning, just moments from now President Biden, President Duda meeting inside the presidential palace. There you can see the two delegations, this is an expanded, bilateral meeting between the two of them, that means both of their top advisors will be accompanying them in this meeting. As the White House has talked about what this relationship has looked like -- were listen in.

ANDRZEJ DUDA, POLISH PRESIDENT (through translator): On behalf of myself, and the entire public delegation, but also on behalf of the entire Polish society, and all those present in our country, all guests, our friends, and neighbors from Ukraine. I would like to thank you, for yesterday's visit to Kyiv. It was spectacular indeed, a very strategic and very political move. Very crucial indeed, that was a political signal. Especially for Ukraine, of course, to a large extent, it has boosted their morale, I'm convinced about that, the morale of the defenders of Ukraine. And all those who today decide, about the defensive agreement, like my friend, President Zelenskyy and his team. But that was also an extraordinary gesture shown to our allies within NATO, and generally, people standing on the side of the free world and the entire global public opinion. Also, it was a signal to those who violate international rules, who invaded a sovereign and independent state that is Ukraine who are bombing houses, who are destroying the infrastructure, which is used by people for their everyday lives. I'm thinking here unfortunately about our European neighbors, I'm thinking about Russian, I'm thinking about Russian authorities, about President Putin who almost one year ago, decided to attack every independent and sovereign country on a full scale.

[08:20:00]

He carried out that full-scale attack because the first attack against Ukraine was carried out in 2014. As a matter of fact, however, after eight years, Vladimir Putin, decided to attack Ukraine on a full scale, causing a tragedy and a catastrophe for millions of the inhabitants of Ukraine. And causing a huge crisis, both a crisis of security and economic crisis all over the world and also a humanitarian crisis. And thus, he doomed to millions of people to tragic fate, those people have to flee from their country, from bombs from murderers from rapes, from murderers from horrible, brutal and bestial treatment from, Russian soldiers, unfortunately.

So, having said that, thank you, once again, for your visit yesterday, Mr. President, because that was a significant sign for all those people. The sign that the free world has not forgotten them, that a free world and its biggest leader, the President of the United States stands by them. So, I know that perfectly well, Mr. President, I know how big courage requires. Thank you very much for that. I can imagine it was not easy, especially for all those who are responsible for your security, sir. So, please pass my gratitude to them from me. They're standing somewhere in the background but still, that was hard work that we're doing. So, thank you, Mr. President, for that decision.

We are delighted to host you in Poland. This is also a crucially important sign to us, a sign of security. Tomorrow, we will meet with our allies from the Eastern Flank of NATO because to all of us, this visit is crucially important, it is a symbolic visit here to our region. We are seeing it and not only as a visit pate (PH) here in Poland. It is a visit to our region combined to the visit to Kyiv. It sends a very powerful message of responsibility, which the United States of America carries constantly the responsibility for the security of Europe and the world. The United States, which has demonstrated on multiple occasions, its responsibility for European matters during the First World War, during the Second World War, during the Cold War, every single time.

They restored the democratic rules. Every time the United States brought back freedom, people were able to restore their freedom, sometimes after 10s of years, as it was the case in Poland in 1989. Thanks to the movement of solidarity, of course, here in Poland, thanks to that determination of the people, thanks to the influence exerted by a son, John Paul the second, whom we admire so much, but we know perfectly well. This was brought about thanks to a very decisive American policy conducted by the U.S. authorities, by President Ronald Reagan. And at last, the evil empire collapsed. The Berlin wall collapsed, and as a result and we regained our freedom.

So, all of us were looking at what you did yesterday. And we believe that America is able to maintain the global order, to guard the global order and to show all the aggressors who want to destroy other people's lives, who wants to take control of other countries, who want to enslave other nations. It shows that there is no acceptance of the democratic community represented by the United States of America to such behavior, to such acted. Thank you for that from the bottom of my heart. As I said, it sends a very important signal to us -- to us, the Polish people, your presence, Mr. President, is extremely important from the perspective of the security.

We are delighted that you will give your speech Mr. President, here in Poland. We are delighted that this message will be sent from here of you, sir, and message address the whole world because I'm sure that the whole world is going to follow your speech. Thank you for this decision. We are very glad with it. On the one hand, it proves how it is important for the United States, how our part of Europe is important to the United States from the Allied perspective, but also to us. It is to a certain extent a confirmation that we are doing the right thing. That the actions which we have been taking recently, this of the Ukraine by supporting Ukraine, by sending weapons to Ukraine, by helping Ukrainians, by supporting them in all different ways.

It is proved that this is the right path. It is approved that we are supported in this respect by the United States. We also tried to give the support to our neighbors and we are trying to be not only the ones who are -- who have got the security guaranteed by the United States and NATO. But we try to be the ones who are providing the security to other states to the Baltic states, where we are part of the air policing mission. We're providing the security to our allies from Romania, we're Polish soldiers are deployed as part of NATO contingent.

[08:25:06]

And in Latvia, our soldiers are stationed there as well. And our tanks also are guarding the security of Latvia. So, simply set, we are trying to demonstrate allied solidarity. Having said that, I'm even more grateful, Mr. President, thank you for paying this visit here in Poland because I believe that the Polish people see it also as an appreciation of the contribution that we have made in the construction of the security in our part of Europe. And we are delighted to be able to host you here today, Mr. President, this also is a powerful signal to the Global and American investors, your presence, sir, your speech, sir. It's proved that Poland is safe and secure, it is a country where you can safely come from the other side of the globe, but these distances not seem to be that much.

Some people might think that this is a dangerous place, but Poland is safe and secure. Thanks to the presence of the U.S. armed forces, thanks to the presence of NATO troops. And also, thanks to our efforts to reinforce Poland's security, Poland's defense capabilities. We are implementing all of that and we're happy. Mr. President, at your presence here is a visible sign of this presence. Recently, we are -- were talking speaking to our allies in Europe. I did it during my meetings, which I had in London, and also at the Munich Security Conference. I was saying that these developments and this unique role, which is being played through use by the United States, it shows in a very clear way that a transatlantic bond is a key importance to Europe.

We're here together with a Polish Prime Minister attending this meeting, the Polish Prime Minister, who is the head of the government, and by this function, he has in his hands, their responsibility for the parliamentary majority today. In 2025, for Poland, will take over the presidency in the European Union. So, we want and we will pass a special resolution in May this year. We would like that this resolution marks the anniversary of our presence in the European Union. We would like our presidency, to be conducted under the motto of tightening transatlantic bond, what more American Europe has stronger bonds between the European Union and the United States more cooperation between the European Union and the United States.

And in economic matters and security-related matters are which is so important to us. This difficult time, which we are experiencing in Europe, right now, and this extraordinary role played by the United States is an absolute demonstration of the fact that this is a key importance to the security, and to the future development of our continent. So, we in Poland have made a lot of experiences over the last centuries in our history and especially over the last one hundred years, now history have no doubt about that. So, Mr. President, once again, we are delighted and a warm welcome to you, sir.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF UNITED STATES: You're welcome. And any excuse to come back to Poland, I take advantage of the welcome has always been extremely generous. And I appreciate it. And I -- so, thank you for inviting me back to Warsaw at this critical moment. You know, you mentioned John Paul, I think I told you the story. When I was a young senator, I wrote a report and I had a very senior staff member on the Foreign Relations Committee, who was -- and that was a committee, the next youngest person on that committee was 32 years older than me.

And I came back from Europe, I wrote a report saying that Poland would be free within a matter of a year. And my Chief of Staff then said, please don't write that, because you're going to look foolish. And I got a phone call from John Paul, asking where I'd meet with him. And as a practicing Catholic, who I joke with him that he was more conservative, and my views were, and I went to see him, and he finished the conversation. And it was all about Poland, he never once mentioned anything about Catholicism, mystery story.

And we're walking from one end of your bend to the papal library. It's about as wide and as long as this room with a simple desk at one end, and nothing much else. And as we he said, would you like a photograph? And I said, sure, he (INAUDIBLE) inside, I'd like one. And we're walking from the desk to the other end. We're having a photograph and he put his hand on the (INAUDIBLE) and he said Senator, remember today I spoke to you as a poll, a proud poll not as your Pope as a poll. So, I've realized the power of polling all across the board. Look at all kidding aside, it had happened to be a true story but, you know, I was here last year we visited the base where Polish American troops were and [08:30:00]