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CNN This Morning
Trump Rails Against Criminal Charges after Arrest; New Tornado Watch Issued for Portions of Arkansas, Oklahoma, and Texas; McCarthy to Meet with Taiwan's President. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired April 05, 2023 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: -- taunt your opponent. It doesn't -- it's probably --
[06:00:04]
POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: It's a bunch of sand (ph).
LEMON: Yes.
HARLOW: -- they smack-talked through the tournament. Not just us.
LEMON: They probably seen each other after and hug it out or something, or have -- do whatever they do. But that was like you're on the court. You know.
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN ANCHOR: If you watch any other professional sports games, any other college games, you see this all time. And yes, there's a line obviously, but I mean --
LEMON: Especially the guys, right? I mean, it's not -- no double standards here. You get to taunt your opponent.
COLLINS: And watch the end zone after someone scores a touchdown.
HARLOW: Exactly.
COLLINS: It's like they plot their dances.
HARLOW: Exactly.
LEMON: Thank you.
HARLOW: All right. CNN THIS MORNING continues now.
LEMON: That was a quick transition.
HARLOW: That was quick. Usually, we get a little music.
LEMON: So -- to indictments.
COLLINS: A lot of -- a lot of news going on.
HARLOW: So good morning, everyone. It's early. We're glad you're with us. Let's get started with five things to know for this Wednesday, April 5, 2023.
Donald Trump defiant after pleading not guilty to 34 felony counts of falsifying business records. During a speech last night, he vowed to fight the charges. He railed against prosecutors and the judge.
LEMON: There's a new sheriff in town. There's a new mayor in town. I'm talking about Chicago. CNN projects that progressive Brandon Johnson has won the runoff. He's going to join us live in the 8 a.m. hour. We're going to talk a lot about why he thinks he won: what needs to be done in Chicago.
A sea change for Wisconsin. CNN projects liberals will now hold the majority on the state Supreme Court, a significant flip that could have major implications for abortion rights and future elections.
COLLINS: And speaking of major implications for the international community, Speaker Kevin McCarthy is defying China as he is preparing to meet face-to-face with Taiwan's president on American soil. Beijing is already threatening to retaliate.
Also, a large and extremely dangerous tornado has just been confirmed in Missouri. It is still dark there, as you can see here, severe weather has continued to pummel the Midwest. We'll tell you more.
CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.
LEMON: Ah, hello. Usually we're on at this hour. This is when we start, but we just -- if you're just tuning in, we already did a whole hour before this.
COLLINS: Little warm up.
LEMON: I know. That was our warm up.
But listen, we're talking about something that was historic, as we've been saying. It was going to be historic yesterday.
But the response is the big thing that people are talking about now, and that's what we're going to talk about, as well, among other things. Because the former president going on a tirade after his arrest here in New York City.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: USA! USA! USA!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Just hours after his historic arraignment, Trump gave a defiant speech at Mar-a-Lago. It was full of grievances and false claims. He rallied against -- he railed against the charges, attacked the judge and cast himself as a victim of political persecution.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And I never thought any --
This fake case was brought only to interfere with the upcoming 2024 election, and it should be dropped immediately. Immediately.
I have a Trump-hating judge with a Trump-hating wife and family.
They can't beat us at the ballot box, so they try and beat us through the law.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So the former president was mostly silent when he was actually in court. Didn't say much, aside from "not guilty" when he entered his plea.
Trump is facing 34 felony counts of falsifying business records. Prosecutors say he orchestrated a hush-money scheme to cover up alleged affairs with an adult film actress and a "Playboy" model.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: President Trump, are you going to us? President Trump?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So Trump looked somber at the courthouse. Look at those pictures, ignoring questions from reporters.
Notably, the judge warned Trump to stop making inflammatory public comments regarding the case, just hours before Trump blasted the same judge, the judge's family, and the district attorney. So there you go.
Our Senior Legal Affairs Correspondent, Paula Reid, is here with more.
Paula, good morning to you. So he was admonished, and yet and still afterwards, still went and blasted the judge.
PAULA REID, CNN SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: He did and he can do that, because there's no gag order at this point.
The judge reminded all the parties, don't say or do anything that would incite violence here or impact the proceedings. It's really tricky for this judge, because former President Trump is also a candidate for office, so putting any restrictions on what he says raises some real constitutional questions.
And it's the first of many tests for this judge in this unprecedented case.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
REID (voice-over): According to the Manhattan district attorney's office, former president Donald Trump was at the center of an alleged catch-and-kill scheme to suppress negative stories about him in order to influence the 2016 presidential election and to benefit his electoral prospects.
Trump appeared in a New York courtroom on Tuesday and pleaded not guilty to 34 felony counts of falsifying business records.
[06:05:01]
Speaking at Mar-a-Lago Tuesday night, he lashed out at the district attorney, the judge in the case and the indictment itself.
TRUMP: And I never thought anything like this could happen in America. Never thought it could happen. The only crime that I have committed is to fearlessly defend our nation from those who seek to destroy it.
REID (voice-over): According to Manhattan prosecutors, the alleged scheme involved Trump; his former personal attorney, Michael Cohen; and the then-head off American Media Incorporated, David Pecker.
During an August 2015 meeting at Trump Tower, Pecker said he would act as the "eyes and ears" of the campaign by alerting Cohen to negative stories about Trump, according to court documents.
CYRUS VANCE JR., FORMER MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY: I found the document actually quite detailed. I mean, the -- it is a speaking indictment, and it has quite a bit of detail about the history and laid out the facts underlying, then, the various counts that are listed.
REID (voice-over): Before the 2016 presidential election, payments were made to at least three individuals to suppress their negative stories involving Trump, including alleged affairs with adult film star Stormy Daniels and "Playboy" model Karen McDougal, according to court documents. Trump denies both affairs.
ALVIN BRAGG, MANHATTAN DISTRICT ATTORNEY: These are felony crimes in New York state, no matter who you are.
REID (voice-over): Cohen has also pleaded guilty to federal crimes pertaining to this indictment.
MICHAEL COHEN, FORMER ATTORNEY FOR DONALD TRUMP: I will continue to speak truth to power. I will continue to provide transparency to the American people.
It's amazing how, once again, Donald is trying to shift all of the blame, which he's so good at. It's always somebody else's fault.
REID (voice-over): Trump's lawyers vowing to fight the charges.
JOE TACOPINA, ATTORNEY FOR DONALD TRUMP: A motion to dismiss is coming, on several grounds. Prosecutorial misconduct, selective prosecution, for sure will be two of them. Legal insufficiency is another one.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
REID: The former president has faced decades of investigations, two impeachment trials, multiple special-counsel probes. Again, it was yesterday, in that Manhattan courtroom, the first time he has ever faced criminal charges.
And this is a test, not just for candidate and former President Trump. It's a test for the district attorney's office, and arguably, the rule of law.
LEMON: And we can see this repeated in other jurisdictions.
REID: Yes.
LEMON: Potentially. Thank you, Paula Reid -- Poppy.
HARLOW: All right. With more on what is in this indictment and the key takeaways from the court documents, let's bring in CNN senior legal analyst, former assistant U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, Elie Honig. He's a former colleague of Manhattan D.A. Alvin Bragg, who of course, is prosecuting Trump. I should note, he also worked with Trump's newest defense counsel, Todd Blanche.
OK. So hush-money payments are not illegal. Falsifying business records is a misdemeanor in New York. How does this indictment tell the story of what would be a misdemeanor, 34 counts, becoming 34 felonies? What's the underlying crime?
ELIE HONIG, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So Poppy, we learned so much yesterday. We know so much more now than we did yesterday.
So we saw the two key prosecution documents here: the indictment and the statement of facts. Now, the indictment is the formal charging instrument. It has very little detail, but the statement of facts gives us 13 pages of narrative.
Now as you said, this crime is based on the payment of hush money. However, paying hush money itself is not a crime. The crime under New York state law is falsifying business records.
The theory is they falsely categorized these payments as legal fees. There are 34 counts in the indictment based on that payment. If you're wondering, how did they get to 34 --
HARLOW: The checks and the --
HONIG: Each individual check, each individual invoice, each individual ledger entry is charged as its own separate count.
Now, to your question about what the crimes would be. If prosecutors can prove falsification of business records, that's a misdemeanor, which is not much, as your expression is showing. Nobody goes to prison for a misdemeanor.
HARLOW: Never.
HONIG: It is the -- ever. It is the lower-level of crime.
However -- and here's the big catch -- if prosecutors can prove the plus factor, that they falsified business records in order to commit or conceal another crime, then we're in the realm of a felony, it's called a Class E felony, which is the lowest level felony but way more serious than a misdemeanor.
HARLOW: And could carry prison time. But isn't it right that prosecutors don't even have to prove the completion of that crime, just the intent to commit that underlying crime?
HONIG: They have to prove that there was some plan in place, yes, to commit a second crime. And to that question, the indictment doesn't tell us.
HARLOW: I don't understand that, Elie.
HONIG: Nor do I.
HARLOW: Why would you not? You're talking about the former president, and it's never happened in American history. Why on earth would you not lay everything out?
HONIG: I completely agree with you, especially knowing the kind of spotlight. But all the indictment tells us is some other crime.
However, if we sort of go through the statement of facts, and look at what the D.A., Alvin Bragg, again, a former colleague of mine, said, they identify three possible theories here. But all of them have problems.
First of all, federal campaign finance crimes, they said. But this is New York state court, so they're going to have a legal problem. Cy Vance, the former D.A., said it's never been charged this way. He said that on our air last night.
[06:10:04]
Alvin Bragg also said maybe it's a New York state campaign finance crime. But this is a presidential election. That's a federal election.
And then very quickly in passing, they mentioned possible tax crimes. But the Trump Org never claimed any of this as a deduction. So they've got some real issues here, and look for the defense lawyers to go after that.
HARLOW: Aren't -- doesn't defense counsel -- don't Trump's lawyers deserve to know what the underlying crime alleged here is, so they can properly put forward their motion to dismiss?
HONIG: The whole purpose of an indictment is notice. You're notifying the defendant, Here's what you're charged for. Here's what you're going to be defending yourself against. One of their motions is going to be, we need more detail.
HARLOW: Well, don't you think the judge will grant that?
HONIG: I do. Absolutely. Now as to the evidence we've learned about, of course, the key moment
here was the pay-off to Stormy Daniels. Michael Cohen paid Stormy Daniels $130,000 right before the election and then was reimbursed by Donald Trump afterwards by these checks. And we've seen these checks. We know there are some documents that do back up Cohen; shows the repayment from Trump to Cohen.
We also know from the statement of facts, they mention payoffs to Karen McDougal and this doorman. However, they're not charged as crimes themselves. Stormy Daniels is the only thing charged as a crime.
Now as for what's next, Poppy, discovery. That's where prosecution has to turn over all its evidence. That's due in June.
Motions -- both parties have to file motions, as we were talking about -- in August and September. And really importantly, the next conference is not until December of this year, eight months away.
I've got to tell you, I've never seen a judge set the next conference date for eight months out. That could play to Donald Trump's advantage, if he's trying to push this out past the election.
HARLOW: Fascinating. Elie, thank you.
HONIG: Thanks, Poppy.
HARLOW: Great job on the breaking news coverage yesterday, too.
HONIG: Thank you.
HARLOW: Appreciate it. Kaitlan.
COLLINS: The former president might have said fewer than a dozen words yesterday while he was inside that New York courtroom, including his plea of not guilty. But when he returned to his Mar-a-Lago resort last night, he did have a lot to say, including lashing out at the judge; District Attorney Alvin Bragg; and both of their families.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: And I never thought anything like this could happen in America. Never thought it could happen. The only crime that I've committed is to fearlessly defend our nation from those who seek to destroy it.
Beginning with the radical left, George Soros-backed prosecutor, Alvin Bragg of New York --
(CROWD BOOING)
TRUMP: -- who campaigned on the fact that he would "get President Trump."
As it turns out, virtually everybody that has looked at this case, including RINOs and even hard-core Democrats, say there is no crime and that it should never have been brought. This fake case was brought only to interfere with the upcoming 2024
election, and it should be dropped immediately.
This is where we are right now. I have a Trump-hating judge with a Trump-hating wife and family, whose daughter worked for Kamala Harris and now receives money from the Biden-Harris campaign, and a lot of it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
COLLINS: Should obviously note, no basis for his comments there about the Trump-hating judge, as he referred to Judge Merchan.
Joining us now is former Deputy White House Press Secretary under President Trump, Sarah Matthews.
Sarah, good morning and thank you for being here. I just want to get your initial reaction to what you heard from Trump last night in that 45-minute speech at Mar-a-Lago.
SARAH MATTHEWS, FORMER DEPUTY WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY UNDER TRUMP: I thought that it was a speech that we've heard him give a million times before, where he kind of ticks through his laundry list of personal grievances and slights.
I felt like it was a missed opportunity, though. He could have used his platform, knowing that millions of people were tuning in to see his reaction, since he hadn't really spoken on camera yet, to talk about the indictment.
And instead of presenting a forward-looking message to the American people, it kind of felt like he was just solely focused on the past.
And then on top of that, I thought it was ill-advised and, quite frankly, disgusting for him to attack not only the prosecutor and the judge but the judge's family, despite a warning from the judge about his rhetoric.
COLLINS: Yes. The judge said yesterday, please refrain from making comments or engaging in conduct that has the potential to incite violence, create civil unrest, or jeopardize the safety or wellbeing of any individuals.
But given you worked for him, does it -- does it surprise you at all, though, that he -- he did make these attacks personal against the judge, against the district attorney; you know, making these unsubstantiated claims about the political leanings of their family members?
MATTHEWS: No, it doesn't surprise me at all. If I know anything after working for communications for Donald Trump, both for the campaign and at the White House, he is going to do what he wants to do. And despite, you know, probably being advised from his own lawyers and his communications team, and the judge telling him to tamp down the rhetoric, he just couldn't help himself.
[06:14:57]
COLLINS: He also talked a lot about the other investigations. I was kind of surprised by how little time he actually spent on what happened here in New York. He talked about the documents investigation, what was happening in Georgia, obviously, the January 6th investigation.
You testified about your experience in the West Wing in those final days of the Trump White House. Did it seem to give you an indication that he is more worried about the other investigations? More so than the merits of what's happening here in New York?
MATTHEWS: I definitely think he's more worried about the other investigations down the road. The -- his team even said that the indictment that came down yesterday, there were no real big surprises in there for them.
But I think that Trump's speech last night just shows his state of mind, that he's more worried about the cases that are down the line, especially the classified documents case. He seemed to focus a lot on that one.
And I also think he should be worried about the Fulton County, Georgia, case. That's another one looking into election interference that I think his -- him and his team should be quite worried about.
COLLINS: Does this seem like a successful 2024 campaign platform to you?
MATTHEWS: I don't think it's a successful 2024 campaign platform. When you look back at Trump during the 2016 election, he seemed to be focused on fighting for the American people and what the problems facing, you know, everyday Americans were.
The Trump of 2023 seems more focused on his problems. And I think that it's not going to bode well for Republicans if he's the nominee in 2024.
You look last night at the Supreme Court race in Wisconsin, and the Democrat was the, you know, winner there. And I think that is a warning call to Republicans, when you look not only at the 2022 midterms but that race specifically. Because the Republican candidate in that Wisconsin race was someone who was advising Republicans on the 2020 elector scheme to try to overturn the election.
And so, if Trump is at the top of the ticket, it's going to be a disaster for Republicans in 2024.
COLLINS: Yes. What happened in Wisconsin could have major implications for Republicans in that state.
Sarah Matthews, thanks for getting up early with us this morning.
MATTHEWS: Thank you so much.
LEMON: That was -- that was good. And I think that the question that you asked about, Is this a successful 2024 campaign at this point, I felt that was probably the most important question. Because when you think about 2016, right, as you covered, Trump was sort of an unknown figure. Right, unusual.
People were like, Who is he?
HARLOW: Unknown as a politician, yes.
LEMON: As a politician. And then in 2020, you know, more known. But now he has all of this hanging over him, and it's going to be interesting to see what happens in 2024. Specifically, you have indictments coming down in possible other jurisdictions.
COLLINS: And in 2016, even his own advisers will note this, he talked about "our problems."
HARLOW: Yes.
COLLINS: That was how he framed --
HARLOW: Not "my problems."
COLLINS: -- the problems. Last night, there was a moment where he said, It's not about me. It's about us. He went out of his way, and obviously, that is something they have been urging him to.
LEMON: How can he say -- he's been saying, I'm your protector. How can you say, I'm your protector, when you're in a courtroom and you're, you know, under arrest, and --
COLLINS: That may work to their advantage.
HARLOW: In his point, this could happen to you. Look what's happening to me.
LEMON: Yes.
HARLOW: Fascinating.
COLLINS: I'm not sure how many people are making hush-money payments. I don't think that that is totally --
HARLOW: Fair.
COLLINS: It's not like immigration or other issues that he's been talking about.
LEMON: With that -- those amounts of money.
So progressives, as was just mentioned in the last interview in the upper Midwest are celebrating this morning after two big victories in Chicago and Wisconsin.
In Chicago, CNN projects the next mayor will be liberal Cook County Commissioner Brandon Johnson. He beat the moderate, the former school school board -- I should say, excuse me, school superintendent Paul Vallas, who ran on a pro-police platform in a race that was heavily focused on Chicago's violent crime problem.
Next door in Wisconsin, the race for a seat to the Supreme Court. Well, it went to Democrat-backed Janet Protasiewicz. She defeated the conservative candidate, Daniel Kelly, flipping control to liberals in a race that shattered all-time U.S. spending records for state judicial elections.
The shift in the balance of power comes with the state high court due to rule in coming months on a strict abortion ban and on GOP gerrymandering that could affect the outcome of the 2024 presidential race.
COLLINS: I'm obsessed with this story.
LEMON: You are? Why?
COLLINS: Because I think it has -- you heard this candidate, when she was on the trail, she did not hide her views on things, especially the political maps and Wisconsin. She often called them unfair. She is going to be in this seat when they redraw those maps.
And Republicans kind of a near supermajority in Wisconsin. They've had a lock on it for a decade now. This could be the beginning of the end for that.
LEMON: It's shocking, in Wisconsin now, that you have this progressive when?
HARLOW: For 10 years. They have a term of 10 years, and it was a 4-3 balance the conservative favor now. And now, it's not going to be. Really, really important.
And you've been saying this, by the way. It's in the national headlines this morning. But you've been saying this for a long time. This is incredibly important to watch.
[06:20:02]
COLLINS: Yes. In 2024, too.
HARLOW: Yes.
LEMON: So we're going to -- 2024 is going to be very interesting.
Millions are waking up under weather watches right now. Tornadoes and hail the size of baseballs, devastating communities in the South and the upper Midwest, the last thing that they need right now. Where the storm is heading at this hour. That's next.
HARLOW: Also, later today, House Speaker Kevin McCarthy will meet with Taiwan's president, despite warnings of, quote, "serious repercussions" from China. The big issues on the table next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:23:57] LEMON: All right, so everyone pay attention, because we are keeping a really close eye on extreme weather hitting from the South to the Midwest right now.
Just this morning, the National Weather Service has issued a new tornado watch for portions of Arkansas, Oklahoma and Texas. The new threat comes as folks in some areas are still cleaning up from a string of storms that hit yesterday and over the weekend.
Our meteorologist here is Derek Van Dam. He is live in Little Rock.
Derek, what's the threat? What's happening?
DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, Don, we are in a tornado watch where I'm located in Little Rock. And the damage you see behind me is from Friday evening's storm. So we've got a very storm-battered and very storm-weary community who is frankly, quite scared of what's potentially to come still.
I want you to see what these storms have been capable of other than just tornadoes, because there has been some impressive hailstones that have already fallen. Get this. In Davenport, Iowa, there was a four- inch hailstone that fell from the sky. That is something you cannot take shelter from. That will dent your vehicle, put holes in your windshield. That's the size of a grapefruit.
[06:25:10]
So let's get to the ground and talk about what's actually happening now. That newest tornado watch that Don just mentioned, that includes the Northwestern portions of Arkansas and Northeastern Texas. So just outside of Dallas-Fort Worth.
but I want to focus in on what's happening across the Chicago suburbs because this is significant. A very powerful line of thunderstorms currently moving into Madison, Wisconsin; Peoria, Indiana [SIC] -- Illinois; and Chicago, right around that 7 to 9 a.m. time frame. That is right during the peak of rush hour. You will be hit with strong winds and the potential for large hail, as well.
Here's a tornado watch across Little Rock. We are still very much in the zone here. There are tornado-warn storms to our West.
Don, very active, very fluid situation. More tornadoes to come.
LEMON: Yes. You and everyone else in the area, please be safe. Thank you, meteorologist Derek Van Dam.
COLLINS: And as we keep an eye on that, also, just hours from now, the president of Taiwan is going to sit down in Los Angeles with House Speaker Kevin McCarthy at the Reagan Presidential Library.
This as tensions are already ratcheting up between the United States and China. China obviously views the self-governing island of Taiwan as its own. Beijing has threatened to, quote, "resolutely fight back" if the meeting goes ahead as planned. CNN's Will Ripley is live in Taiwan.
Will, this meeting is very much going ahead as planned. Can you just remind our viewers why this is such something that Beijing is going to be watching so closely today?
WILL RIPLEY, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Tsai Ing-Wen has said, you know, that she's not going to let external pressure, pressure from China, stop her from, you know, making an unofficial visit to the United States.
She's in between official visits to Central America and she happens to be in California. Speaker McCarthy is going there to sit down and meet with her.
It is viewed as less provocative than if Speaker McCarthy flew to Taiwan, even though he's saying he won't rule that out.
But -- but the purpose here, you know, is to continue this, you know, unofficial, yet very important bond and relationship between the United States and Taiwan.
Now in China, the state media right now relatively muted about this, but a lot of analysts believe it's really not a question of if China will put on some sort of military display, but how far will they go?
Because if they go too far, like they did when Nancy Pelosi visited Taiwan last August, and they encircled the island with military drills, really unprecedented in their scale, even erasing the unofficial but respected median line across the Taiwan Strait, which is only 110 miles wide. You know, Chinese warships and planes now regularly crossing, you know, that sensitive dividing line on the Taiwan Strait. And Taiwan is still reeling from that from that -- from that meeting.
But Kaitlan, state media in China relatively muted about this right now, because they have a lot to lose on the global stage if they push this too far.
COLLINS: Yes. Quite a historic meeting. We'll be watching it closely here. Will Ripley, thank you.
Also this morning, police are finding new evidence after they searched the home of the alleged Nashville school shooter, as the officers who stopped the attack and played a critical role are now speaking out. We'll take you live to the ground in Nashville, next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
