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Impeachment Trial For Ken Paxton To Begin No Later Than August 28; Today: Emergency Summit After Deaths Of 12 Horses At Churchill Downs; Carnival Passenger Recounts Nightmare Return From Bahamas Cruise. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired May 30, 2023 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[07:30:57]

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Lawmakers in the Texas Senate now setting a timeline to hold an impeachment trial against State Attorney General Ken Paxton. That's happening in the coming months and it will determine whether Paxton is removed from office. The articles of impeachment were delivered to the Senate on Monday and that was just two days after the unprecedented move by the GOP-controlled House. Members there voting to impeach Paxton.

CNN's Ed Lavandera is live this morning in Dallas. So, Ed, Paxton has been dogged, really, by ethics scandals since taking office in 2014. What happened in the State Senate?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, it's really kind of the first step to what we are going to see here in Texas as the summer of impeachment. But Ken Paxton has been elected as attorney general three times but it's clear he's not going to go quietly.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

LAVANDERA (voice-over): A history-making impeachment trial is going forward in the Texas State Senate.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I am directed by the House of Representatives to present to the Senate the articles of impeachment preferred against Warren Kenneth Paxton Jr., attorney general of the State of Texas.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): The House delivered 20 articles of impeachment to the State Senate Monday evening. Ten of the 20 articles stem from a whistleblower lawsuit filed by four now-fired top staffers for the attorney general. That suit was settled for $3.3 million and a state investigative committee investigation followed.

Paxton faces allegations of bribery, abuse of public trust, conspiracy, termination of whistleblowers, misuse of official information, and obstruction of justice, among other charges.

The trial will start by August 28 and be presided over by the lieutenant governor, Dan Patrick. ANDREW MURR, (R) TEXAS HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: This is about facts

and this is about evidence. And at the end of the day, my colleagues and I will not stand for public corruption, and that's why we're preceding to a trial in the Texas Senate.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): Paxton denies any wrongdoing and has railed against the investigation.

KEN PAXTON, (R) IMPEACHED TEXAS ATTORNEY GENERAL: The fact that I was prohibited from presenting evidence to defend myself reveals that this shameful process was curated from the start as an act of political retribution.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): According to the lead impeachment manager, Paxton will be able to participate in the trial, but there are already concerns Paxton could be trying to intimidate elected officials.

CHARLIE GEREN, (R) TEXAS HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES: Several members of this House, while on the floor of this House doing the state business, received telephone calls from Gen. Paxton personally, threatening them with political consequences in their next election.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): Paxton is temporarily suspended from his duties and Texas Gov. Greg Abbott can appoint a replacement, but Abbott has yet to publicly comment on the matter.

Former President Trump did speak out in defense of Paxton --

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And he's a great man.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): -- writing in a Truth Social post that the impeachment vote was unfair. Trump's words held no sway in the Republican-majority House who still went ahead and voted to impeach the former president's longtime ally.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We don't want Ken Paxton around these parts, right?

LAVANDERA (voice-over): Supporters of the pair did gather outside a courthouse in Texas on Monday to vote their support.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We cannot continue on with this. The people have to stand up against tyranny.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

LAVANDERA: And so, the fate of Ken Paxton will rest later this summer in the hands of 31 state senators. Twelve of those are Democrats. They would need at least nine Republicans to vote him -- to convict him and push him out of office. And a reminder that one of those senators is Ken Paxton's own wife. There are calls for her to recuse herself but so far, she has not said what she is going to do -- Erica.

HILL: It will be interesting to see if she decides to, in fact, recuse herself or not. Ed, really appreciate it -- thanks.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Absolutely fascinating.

All right. Happening today, horse racing regulating officials are holding an emergency veterinary summit after an unusually high number of horse deaths at Churchill Downs -- of course, the home of the Kentucky Derby. Veterinary officials from Churchill Downs and the Kentucky Horse Racing Commission will meet after 12 horses died -- 12 of them in a month at the track since April 27. The Horse Racing Integrity and Safety Authority will also dispatch experts to analyze Churchill Downs' racing and training surfaces.

[07:35:13]

HILL: One doctor is calling this the most important virus you have never heard of. That is exactly where we're going to bring you up to speed in the CNN medical report just ahead.

HARLOW: Plus, $38.8 billion. That is how much cash the Treasury Department has on hand this morning. We'll tell you which people actually have more money than the U.S. Treasury coffers right now as we get closer to the default deadline.

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[07:40:14]

HARLOW: Welcome back.

President Biden and House Speaker Kevin McCarthy are rushing to sell this debt limit to their respective parties with just days until the U.S. Treasury runs out of money to pay our bills that are due.

So here is the number -- $38.8 billion. That is how much cash the Treasury Department had on hand as of last Thursday. That's their latest count. It's down from nearly $240 billion at the start of the month when the coffers were relatively flush from April tax collections.

To give you a sense of how empty the Treasury cash coffer is, $38.8 billion is lower than the net worth of more than two dozen of the world's wealthiest people, including Elon Musk, Jeff Bezos, Bill Gates, Warren Buffett, Mark Zuckerberg, and Nike co-founder Phil Knight.

So joining us now, chief economist at Moody's Analytics, Mark Zandi. Sorry you're not on that list, Mark, but we do appreciate your brain this morning on all of this.

Look, I think it's interesting. Your prediction and your analysis before this deal got reached was that if we default it would kill seven million jobs. It would really hurt the U.S. economy. But now what? If this thing goes through as written -- as the legislative text is this morning, what does that mean for the U.S. economy?

MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST, MOODY'S ANALYTICS: Well, Poppy, yes -- try that I might, $30 million feels like --

HARLOW: Billion.

ZANDI: -- a long way from here where I am.

But anyway, you know, I'll have to say from the perspective of what it means for the economy -- this deal, if it gets through Congress, and I think it will -- is pretty good. It's about as good as we can expect. I mean, given all the drama and sturm and drang, and all the things that are going on here, and all the darker scenarios that could have unfolded I'll take this one.

Of course, the biggest impact will come from the spending cuts. But if you do a little bit of arithmetic it's probably going to shave no more than 150,000 jobs from what it would have been otherwise. And that sounds like a lot of jobs and it is, but just for context, the U.S. economy creates about -- has been creating about 250,000 jobs per month. It will raise the unemployment rate about a tenth of a percent.

It's not great.

HARLOW: Right.

ZANDI: I mean, the economy is weak. I would -- if I were king I wouldn't have done this the way it's been done, obviously, but given all the things that have gone on here I'll take it.

HARLOW: Can it achieve a soft landing and avoid a recession?

ZANDI: I think so. You know, the economy is showing just incredible resilience. Consumers are hanging tough. They're doing their part. They're not spending with abandon but they're doing what they need to do to keep the economy moving forward.

And businesses are very reluctant to lay off workers. We've seen some pick-up in layoffs --

HARLOW: Yes.

ZANDI: -- in the tech sector and financial services but generally, they've been low. And I think the economy has enough resilience to digest this.

You know, obviously, again, risks are high and nothing else can go wrong. But if nothing else goes wrong I think we can make it -- our way through without a recession -- yes.

HARLOW: I think it's -- well, that's great news. I think it's really interesting to think about this in the context of 2011 -- sort of the last time we were on the brink and the impact it had on the economy. It was such a different time for the economy. Interest rates were near zero. Unemployment was really high at nine percent. It was different.

And it was at that time that now-Harvard economist Jason Furman, who was deputy director of President Obama's National Economic Council, was dealing with these issues. But what's interesting is that he tells The New York Times this morning that all of this could actually help the Fed's fight on inflation. He says from a macroeconomic perspective, this deal is a small help because the economy still needs cooling off, and takes pressure off interest rates.

Do you agree? Can it help?

ZANDI: Well, the good news is that monetary policy with what the Fed does and fiscal policy -- what the lawmakers are doing now are at least working in the right direction. They're working to kind of slow things down and to cool things off. To get inflation back to the Fed's target. And we need that to occur so that the Fed doesn't need to raise rates more because if they do, then in all likelihood we would go into a recession. So in that sense, I agree.

But my sense is the Fed has done enough already. They've raised rates very aggressively over the past more than a year. We don't need any more restraint, and any more restraint we add to the economy in the course of this debt limit will add some restraint. It raises the risk that we go into a recession.

So, you know, I don't want to cut too fine a hair here but my sense is that we certainly don't need this.

HARLOW: You have been making the argument -- you made it to us last week when you were here in studio that it's just time to basically get rid of the debt limit.

President Biden was asked about that, essentially, this weekend as well, and he still doesn't like that idea. Listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No. I think it would cause more controversy getting rid of the debt limit, although I do -- I am exploring the idea that we would, at a later date -- a year or two from now -- decide whether or not the 14th Amendment -- how that actually would impact on whether or not you need to redo the debt limit every year. But that's another day.

Thank you all.

REPORTER: Mr. President --

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[07:45:13]

HARLOW: He had previously called it irresponsible to not have a debt ceiling. Now he says it would cause more controversy to get rid of the debt limit. But you still think it's the most prudent path ahead?

ZANDI: Yes, absolutely. I don't see any benefit to this -- to the debt limit. I mean, it just creates a lot of drama and damage. I mean, we've been -- Poppy, you and I have been talking about this now for three-four weeks --

HARLOW: I know.

ZANDI: -- and the whole world is. And we're spending all this energy on this for exactly what? I mean, what are we accomplishing here? We're not solving our long-term fiscal issues. And so, I think this time could have been better spent. So I would do away with it in an instant.

You know, now, there's something that has to follow, right? We need some kind of budget process to that the Republicans and Democrats can come together and figure out what we need to do for the -- for our long-run fiscal health. But the debt limit, as we can see, is not the way to go. So, yes, I'd do away with that in an instant.

HARLOW: All right, Mark Zandi, appreciate it. Thanks very much. And some good news. If we can get this thing through maybe not a recession -- maybe a soft landing. That's his headline.

All right. In our next hour, we'll speak with Democratic Congresswoman Debbie Dingell. Where does she stand on this deal?

HILL: The most important virus you have never heard of. This morning, the CDC is warning cases of that virus -- it's the human metapneumovirus -- surged about 36 percent more than usual this spring, and it could be a little bit of a doozy. Doctors say it can cause just as much misery as the flu and RSV.

CNN medical correspondent Meg Tirrell is here. So, they're concerned. How concerned should we be? What should we know about this virus?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So if you've ever taken a COVID test and it's been negative but you've got all these symptoms -- I've done this so many times --

HARLOW: Yes.

TIRRELL: -- with my kids when I've caught something they got in school. It could be this human metapneumovirus.

And we really don't know that much about it. A lot of people haven't heard of it but it can cause a lot of the same symptoms -- these hacking coughs, fever, shortness of breath, runny nose. And in really severe cases, bronchitis and pneumonia. So it can be very dangerous for young children and for older people.

We did see this spike in the spring 36 percent higher than the seasonal averages before COVID, so it's getting disrupted the same way we've seen a number of respiratory viruses sort of change their behaviors as a result of the pandemic. And they say it's something we should keep an eye on.

HARLOW: How dangerous?

TIRRELL: So, for children under five, the estimates for 2018 is that there were more than 14 million infections worldwide, 600,000 hospitalizations among these little kids, and 16,000 deaths. They're worse in developing countries. But this is a problem. The pharmaceutical industry has not devoted a lot of resources to developing vaccines. Moderna is one company that's working on it. I spoke with the CEO and he pointed out the toll that they see, particularly in toddlers, as one reason they're trying to develop a vaccine for it.

HILL: Interesting. I appreciate it. Thanks, Meg.

TIRRELL: Thank you, guys.

HARLOW: It's being called quite the cruise from hell. That's a term that people are using and you'll see why in a minute because this Carnival cruise ship was rocked by a powerful storm and then hallways have been flooded with water and debris. Terrified passengers reaching for their life preservers. One of those passengers joins us with their experience next.

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[07:52:30]

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Video of Carnival Sunshine cruise ship going through a violent storm.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Good (INAUDIBLE). That's something out of the movies, isn't it?

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HILL: Whew! A dream vacation in the Bahamas quickly became a living nightmare for cruise passengers after severe weather violently rocked the Carnival Sunshine. The ship was returning to South Carolina over the weekend when it hit rough seas -- rough putting it mildly -- leaving passengers frightened, wondering if they would make it back home.

This, of course, according to one of our next guests, Bill Hassler, who was there for all of the fun.

HARLOW: Not so sure if was fun.

BILL HASSLER, PASSENGER ON CRUISE SHIP THAT HIT ROUGH WEATHER: No, it was not.

HARLOW: Let's show you this video that he shot. You can see all sorts of debris being tossed around the ship. Also, water rushing into hallways and rooms.

Carnival said this in a statement. Quote, Carnival Sunshine's return to Charleston was impacted by the weather and rough seas on Saturday. The weather's prolonged impact on the Charleston area delayed the ship's arrival on Sunday and as a result, the next voyage's embarkation was also delayed. We appreciate the patience and understanding of all our guests. Carnival Sunshine is now sailing on its next cruise." Well, Bill Hassler was on that ship and joins us now. Good morning.

HASSLER: Good morning.

HARLOW: I totally grew up going on cruises. Never -- never did I see something like this. What was it like to live through?

HASSLER: Actually, I'm surprised I'm still alive.

HARLOW: Really?

HASSLER: Yes. It's -- it was that bad. It's a -- I've seen the looks on people's face when -- I was a crane operator in New York City and I was running a locomotive for the sandhogs and I flipped the train over and slid it 650 feet on its roof. And when I climbed out of that train the look of fear and death -- they thought I -- it was like I seen ghosts. Like they seen ghosts.

And when I got off the ship at six-seven o'clock Saturday evening, when it was supposed to dock at eight in the morning, the look -- that look I seen on these sandhogs faces years ago was the same look I seen on all these people coming off the ship. Like, they were just white. White as ghosts.

HILL: You said at one point it seemed like Carnival was playing God with your lives.

HASSLER: Yes, exactly. I mean, why would you sail into this storm with 80-mile-an-hour-plus winds? I mean, who does that?

I mean, I was a crane operator and everybody that worked around me -- around a crane or any equipment I was on, their lives were in my hands. So when the winds were bad or the weather was bad we would shut the job down and not work for safety.

What were they thinking?

HARLOW: Well, what do you think they should have done? Turn around?

[07:55:00]

HASSLER: I think they should have stayed down in port in the Bahamas and waited a day for the storm to subside a little bit, and then go -- or when they got into the storm why didn't they go further out into the ocean to get to the other side of it, you know -- to the back side?

HILL: How accessible -- in the statement which Poppy just shared, they thanked you for your patience and your understanding. How much communication was there as all of this was happening? Was there information on the loudspeakers? Were you told to go into certain areas?

HASSLER: No -- very little. I don't even think the crew knew what they were doing. I don't think they were trained enough for a situation like that. They were actually, at one point, scavenging to get the lifeboats ready to throw us out into the sea with 40-plus-foot waves. I don't even know how you would even get in the lifeboat. If that thing we down we were all dead.

HILL: Wow.

HASSLER: Yes.

At one point, a wave hit my window and broke my window and water was coming in.

HILL: Coming into the boat and into your stateroom?

HASSLER: Yes.

HILL: What did you do at that point?

HASSLER: Put on my life preserver.

HARLOW: You did?

HASSLER: Yes. I actually fell asleep at one point for a little while with my life preserver on.

HARLOW: You heard us read Carnival's statement. I wonder if you want something else from them. I mean, it sounds like you are very concerned that preparations weren't made and safety wasn't prioritized.

HASSLER: They shouldn't have went through that storm and they need to be held accountable.

HARLOW: What does that look like to you?

HASSLER: Meaning as far as what?

HARLOW: Well, just -- not in terms of just you being compensated for that --

HASSLER: Oh, no.

HARLOW: -- but do you fear that could happen again to another --

HASSLER: Oh, yes. I mean, listen, it was like --

HARLOW: -- trip?

HASSLER: -- a coin toss for them and they got lucky. Maybe the next time they won't be as lucky, you know?

HILL: What do you think should then -- just to follow up on Poppy's point there, what should change? What do you want to see change?

HASSLER: There's got to be different laws about heading into storms, especially when you're not in one. How do you sail out of sun into a storm like that? It made no sense.

HILL: Yes.

HARLOW: We're glad you're OK.

HASSLER: Yes.

HARLOW: And I'm sure it's traumatizing and it's probably all just starting to, like, soak in, right?

HASSLER: When I got home Sunday night I had to crack open a beer and think about it, and I started shaking --

HILL: Really?

HASSLER: -- because it just sat in. Like, that -- like, I couldn't even believe I'm still here. Like, when they say kiss the ground --

HARLOW: Kiss the ground.

HASSLER: Yes.

HILL: And you're staying on dry land for a while?

HASSLER: Yes.

HILL: Yes.

HASSLER: I'm staying away from the ocean.

HARLOW: We're so glad you're OK.

HASSLER: Thank you.

HARLOW: Thank you very much.

Of course, we welcome anyone from Carnival to join us on the program and talk about that -- if changes are coming as well.

And CNN THIS MORNING continues right now.

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Drone flying over Moscow.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Speaking foreign language).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: All right, so take a look at that.

Good morning, everyone. It is 8:00 a.m. Eastern and we have a lot of news to get to. I'm here with Erica Hill and we're glad you're with us.

What you just was a drone flying over Moscow. The Kremlin accusing Ukraine of launching an attack on the Russian capital with drones. The Ukrainians are denying any direct involvement. HILL: A manhunt is underway in Mississippi after another jailbreak at the same facility where a group of inmates escaped just weeks ago.

HARLOW: And the Miami Heat are heading to the NBA Finals to face the Denver Nuggets after dominating the Boston Celtics in game seven.

This hour of CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.

HILL: We begin this hour on Capitol Hill where the debt limit deal is about to face a crucial hurdle today. The powerful House Rules Committee set to hold a make-or-break vote that could potentially tank this bill before it even reaches the floor.

Some of the loudest Republican opponents of the deal are on this committee. Among them, Congressmen Ralph Norman and Chip Roy. Those are the same hardliners who Speaker Kevin McCarthy agreed to put on the committee as part of his deal to win the speakership back in January.

Well, here is where Congressman Roy stands. This is what he told Fox News ahead of today's meeting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. CHIP ROY (R-TX): I'm going to be making that loud and clear to my Republican colleagues that this is not a deal that we should be taking. The whole point of the Rules Committee was to say that we are going to have a power-sharing where we had a representation of the entire conference. And I'm not thrilled with this bill right now so I'm not going into the Rules Committee with a very positive view towards this bill.

Kevin's a friend. I think the Republican Party is best when we're unified, but not for the sake of unity.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Not for the sake of unity.

On the other side of the aisle, President Biden is trying to convince progressives and other skeptical Democrats to vote yes.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BIDEN: You know I never say I'm confident what the Congress is going to do, but I feel very good about it. I've spoken with a number of the members.

REPORTER: What's your message to House Democrats who have reservations about this compromise bill?

BIDEN: Talk to me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Let's bring in House Democratic Congresswoman who has been critical of the deal, Congresswoman Debbie Dingell of Michigan. Congresswoman, good morning.

REP. DEBBIE DINGELL (D-MI): Good morning to both of u.

HARLOW: We'll get into the energy components of it in a moment. That's a big deal to you, obviously.

But we just saw, moments ago, your Republican counterpart. Congresswoman Nancy Mace, of South Carolina, just said she's going to vote no. How are you going to vote on this compromise?