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Officials Rush To Set Up Detours After I-95 Collapse; Trump Indictment Divides 2024 Republican Hopefuls; Poll: Trump Leads 2024 GOP Race By Double Digits. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired June 12, 2023 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[07:33:00]

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: OK, this is just a normal bump -- a normal little brushfire. Then once I realized what happened when I looked in my rearview mirror, I see 95 -- all the cars stopping. And then I learned shortly after that the road had just collapsed.

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PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: Now, our special coverage of the indictment is continuing but we want to take you to Philadelphia now, this morning, where officials are scrambling to set up detours for morning commuters after a section of Interstate 95 collapsed on Sunday. Now, it's a major artery for commuters and travelers that will create real travel problems for months to come. Now, a portion of the crucial East Coast highway was destroyed after a tanker truck caught fire.

And a want to turn to CNN's Danny Freeman. He is live for us in Philadelphia. I think everybody's stunned by the pictures and also how this actually happened. What do people need to know right now as they try to get to work or try and travel by I-95 this morning?

DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well listen, I think the main message that all government officials in this area are trying to get to the public in terms of commuters and what they need to know is stay away from this area. I can speak from experience. I came from my home almost in South Philly and it was a nightmare. There were huge trucks on small roads that really are not meant for that. This whole area is clogged up because I-95 is still shut down in both directions.

Like you said, though, there are still a lot of questions that we don't have answers to -- why and how this all started -- but I will tell you what we do know. Basically, yesterday morning, almost 24 hours ago on Sunday morning, a tanker truck was underneath this part of I-95 behind me. It caught fire. And then, the northbound lanes over here in this section of I-95 collapsed right on the ground -- right on top of that tanker. The southbound lanes -- the closest lanes that we are to right now -- they also have been compromised. And I've got to say at this point, and far as we know, the truck is still trapped in that wreckage. Crews have been sifting overnight trying to take basically 500 tons of concrete mess off of the road and off of that truck to try and piece together what exactly happened here. And we've been hearing that heavy machinery dig away for hours and hours now.

[07:35:10]

There have been no reported injuries at this time and that's a good thing. However, the governor said at a news conference yesterday that they still are not sure if there was someone inside that truck when this collapse happened yesterday morning.

Take a listen to some of the things that the governor said when he first laid eyes on this scene.

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GOV. JOSH SHAPIRO, (D), PENNSYLVANIA: Remarkable devastation, and I found myself thanking the lord that no motorists who were on 95 -- on I-95 were injured or died. Just a remarkably devastating sight -- one that our first responders, law enforcement, and others contained very, very quickly. They got people out of harm's way. And now, under the leadership of Sec. Carroll and others, the hard work of clearing this site and rebuilding it will be underway, and we're going to move as quickly as possible.

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FREEMAN: And, of course, that's Pennsylvania Gov. Josh Shapiro. He said in that news conference yesterday that the cleanup here could take some number of months. But he did say that he has issued a disaster declaration to get some funds more quickly to fix this mess behind me.

Back to you.

MATTINGLY: All right, Danny Freeman. Stick with us. We're going to be asking for updates on this throughout the course of the morning. Thanks so much.

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Former President Trump wasting no time in rallying support following his indictment. How his competitors for the presidential nomination are reacting to that news.

MATTINGLY: And this morning, more than 80 million people are under a severe storm threat from the Central U.S. through the Southeast and into the Northeast. More than 200 storm reports in the south on Sunday from this system.

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[07:40:49]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) VIVEK RAMASWAMY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Reading that indictment and looking at the selective omissions of both fact and law, Dana, I'm even more convinced that a pardon is the right answer here.

ASA HUTCHINSON, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: We shouldn't be promising and holding out the fig leaf of a pardon because that undermines our jury system. We don't need a commander in chief that disregards the nation's secrets.

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HILL: Contenders for the Republican presidential nomination really grappling and certainly finding different tones as they talk about the indictment for frontrunner Donald Trump. They sat down with co-anchor of "STATE OF THE UNION" -- our colleague, Dana Bash, who joins us now. She is also, of course, the host of "INSIDE POLITICS" premiering today at noon, which we're all very excited about.

Dana, these conversations were fascinating over the weekend and really painted such a picture of this divide that we see among the 2024 Republican hopefuls. Anything that really stood out to you or even surprised you in terms of those comments and those very clear lanes?

DANA BASH, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, CO-ANCHOR, "STATE OF THE UNION", CNN ANCHOR, "INSIDE POLITICS": Well, surprised me? These days, probably not --

HILL: Not.

BASH: -- because we have seen the sort of precursor to the indictment with the comments from most of the 2024 candidates. That even those who -- like you heard Vivek Ramaswamy who is -- I mean, he and the others -- they are running against Donald Trump. They are competitors. And yet, they understand where the base is from which they need to get votes.

And it is not, for the most part, where Asa Hutchinson is. Asa Hutchinson is speaking as a traditional, conservative. Somebody who has governed both in the governor's mansion in Arkansas and also in Washington as an administration official during Bush. And he is a more traditional kind of old-school Republican. And he is saying wait a minute, guys -- what are we doing?

And if you just look at the polling, both just the horse race polling of where Donald Trump is and the polling on how people are consuming this and their reaction within the Republican primary electorate, they are very sort of forgiving of Donald Trump and dismissive of what is going on when it comes to where they want their vote to be.

MATTINGLY: You know, Dana, I was watching with great interest your interview with Ohio Congressman Jim Jordan -- longtime, very fervent defender of the former president. In part, I was taking notes on your back-and-forth and how you pushed back and tried to probe on that.

I want you to listen to some of the sound from yesterday.

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REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): I'm just saying he didn't.

BASH: There are classified documents in the bathroom --

JORDAN: I have.

BASH: -- in a ballroom stage, and classified information that he -- that -- we're talking about information that the United States shares with its allies -- critical information strewn on the floor.

Does that look secure to you?

JORDAN: Again, Dana, the standard is the standard. The President of the United States has -- he can classify and he can control access to national security information however he wants. The standard is what the Constitution says, and the commander in chief -- the President of the United States has the ability to classify and control access to information. That's what the Constitution and the court have said.

BASH: He's not the President of the United States anymore.

JORDAN: So you can't obstruct when there's -- you can't obstruct when there's no underlying crime.

BASH: He is not the President of the United States.

JORDAN: That is the fundamental flaw.

BASH: If you -- and you're just taking him at his word.

JORDAN: When he was president he declassified --

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MATTINGLY: I mean, it's a combative back-and-forth because it always is, and that's fine. It's part of the discussion. But what was your takeaway from that actual conversation with one of the closest allies the former president has?

BASH: With one of the closest allies and let's be clear, he is the chairman of the House Judiciary Committee.

MATTINGLY: Right.

BASH: He has a very, very big role not just on this but on oversight of the entire judicial system in America.

And I have to say that in prepping for the discussion that I was having with Chairman Jordan, saying that the president -- former president had the right to have these documents was not on my bingo card. That was an argument that we had heard historically but not recently, particularly after we saw the indictment.

[07:45:08] And the fact that he made that argument over and over again despite the fact that Donald Trump is no longer the president, despite the fact that in the document -- more than once in the indictment document he is quoted as saying this is classified -- basically, you're not supposed to see this -- effectively admitting that he's not supposed to have it. And, by the way, he didn't declassify the document, in particular, that he was talking about in this anecdote before he left office.

It just -- it just disproves the argument that Mr. Jordan is making. I was very surprised about that because the Supreme Court case that he was citing was about sitting presidents and Donald Trump is not a sitting president.

HILL: But Margaret, in many ways, right, to Dana's point about his facts not adding up there, that doesn't matter. I mean, it does matter. But what I'm talking about in terms of the defense that is often put out there by the former president's biggest supporters --

MARGARET TALEV, SENIOR CONTRIBUTOR, AXIOS, DEMOCRACY, JOURNALISM, AND CITIZENSHIP INSTITUTE DIRECTOR, SYRACUSE UNIVERSITY: Yes.

HILL: -- it is not about looking to the facts to bolster your argument -- and certainly not in this case. It's about being the loudest voice in the rooms and in many times trying to distract you to some shiny object over here, whether it's with whataboutism or oh, this thing happened and nobody's going to have time to fact-check it, and I'm just going to say it loudly enough that it's just going to -- people will believe me.

TALEV: The former president does have a playbook. We've seen the playbook used again and again and it does involve sort of getting ahead of your own defense the best you can and setting the narrative yourself and rallying the troops. And in this case, the troops are Jim Jordan.

The troops are also Kevin McCarthy who is over a barrel right now with the right flank of his caucus because of the debt ceiling vote. Trying to hang on to support. Trying to gather enough Republicans to have any votes to do the business of the House.

And as long as the former president has a lock on his base it's going to be very difficult for this GOP rivals to take him on head-on to challenge him. But it's also going to be very difficult for them to find their own path --

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN CORRESPONDENT, HOST, "THE ASSIGNMENT" PODCAST: Yes.

TALEV: -- to run around him. And I think when you're looking at Ron DeSantis and many of the other Republicans in the field they have tried to offer themselves as an alternative to Trump that's just not Trump, saying I'm all the stuff you like about Trump and none of the baggage of Trump. And what the base is saying is we're OK with the baggage --

HILL: Yes.

TALEV: -- of Donald Trump right now.

CORNISH: And I think you saw that in Dana's really strong interview with a Republican rival, right? Someone basically, in a way -- and I'm just going to think of this in kind of like a higher-up sort of media strategy way -- it's let me say something sharp enough to put this reporter on their back foot. That's the clip everyone's going to play -- me saying that I would pardon Donald Trump. They're not going to play the follow-up. They're not going to play any of the facts around the case. And that might be the only way this week to get any media support when you're one of those candidates who is down in the two and three, and four percent.

MATTINGLY: Dana, one of my favorite things about when they're crazy enough to let me sit in this chair is I can ask my good friends and reporters who I often text with or have conversations with but they're actually here and behind the scenes.

BASH: Yes.

MATTINGLY: When you talk to Republican campaigns -- top Republican officials and they're being candid about what they see and these 37 charges in this indictment, what are they saying?

BASH: It's bad. It's bad. I mean, on its face it is bad. Anybody who can read and has even the most basic understanding of the rule of law and of the legal system -- it is bad on the legal front.

On the political front, they are worried. They see the idea that the Republican electorate is already kind of leaning towards distrusting the very institution that is involved in prosecuting him and the fact that Donald Trump is playing into that and is stoking that, as he always does. And they realize that in the short term, politically, it is not -- it is not good for their bosses, for their candidates -- the aides and the campaigns who are his competitors. They admit it, which is --

Again, I just have to say that it used to be that those two issues would dovetail.

MATTINGLY: Right.

BASH: Something that was bad legally would be bad politically. And the fact that we are in a scenario where the two things are at odds is not normal and it is very much about Trump and Trumpism, and the Trump era.

HILL: It's a great point and important -- and so important to continue to play it out.

MATTINGLY: Yes. No, absolutely.

Audie, Margaret, Dana, thanks so much as always.

And this is very important. You can see more of Dana in just a couple of hours. "INSIDE POLITICS WITH DANA BASH" -- my good friend, colleague, and a wonderful, wonderful reporter -- premieres today at noon. You must be watching.

[07:50:06]

HILL: Well, you heard Dana mention -- we've been talking about there is new information. There's new polling about how voters feel about the indictment. So what are they saying since this news broke? We're going to break that down for you next.

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DONALD TRUMP, (R) 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If they come to me -- how do you stand this? And I usually look at them and say in a sick way, I sort of enjoy it because it exposes them -- it exposes them for what they are and it's also lifted the poll numbers to even higher lengths. Have you seen this? The polls are through the roof and the fundraising -- small-dollar fundraising is setting records.

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MATTINGLY: Now, the point about the numbers -- Donald Trump may actually be right about that. New polling suggesting his supporters have not waivered one bit despite this being his second indictment and potentially more to come.

Here to crunch those numbers is the one, the only, CNN senior data reporter Harry Enten.

All right, Harry, some of the media polls out in the field right after this happened -- what are they telling us?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yes, they're showing exactly what the former president indicated, right? So, look, these are the top choices for a GOP nominee. This is a CBS News-YouGov poll.

Look, back in late April, look where Donald Trump was. He was at 58 percent. Look where he is today, and half this poll was taken post that second indictment -- 61 percent. Nearly a 40-point advantage over his nearest opponent, Ron DeSantis.

And what does the polling say? "Should Trump have been charged with a crime for the classified documents handling?" Look, when you look at the overall public 48 percent say yes. That's more than the 35 percent who say no.

But look at the GOP. Just 16 percent say yes versus 67 percent who say no. And you know what? That 16 percent that say no on the classified documents handling -- should Trump have been charged with a crime -- equal Stormy Daniels hush-money case at 16 percent. So that GOP is locked in on saying no, Trump should not have been charged with a crime.

[07:55:09] HILL: Harry, you also have some interesting numbers -- not just polling, but there were numbers in that indictment talking about -- were talking about where the documents were stored at Mar-a-Lago -- in terms of how many people were in that space over this number of months.

ENTEN: Yes. So, take a look here. Look, all about numbers. The FBI searched Mar-a-Lago on day about 565 after Trump left office. That's a long period of time. So how many people and how many events happened between January of 2021 and August of 2022?

Look at this. Mar-a-Lago hosted 10,000-plus people and over 150 events. So the number of people who are going through these halls when Trump allegedly kept classified documents there after his presidency, a lot of folks, potentially.

HILL: That is a lot.

MATTINGLY: Are you just jealous that you weren't one of them?

ENTEN: You know what? I'd like to go on vacation (INAUDIBLE).

MATTINGLY: You could definitely get into the ballroom and the bathroom.

Harry Enten, great, as always. Thanks.

ENTEN: Thanks, buddy.

HILL: Former President Trump set to leave his New Jersey golf club soon and head back down to Florida for tomorrow's court appearance. We're going to take a closer look at the security preparations in Miami. That's, of course, all related to Donald Trump's historic indictment. Stay with us.

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MAYOR FRANCIS SUAREZ, (R) MIAMI: We want to make sure that all our citizens know that they're going to be able to express their First Amendment rights and at the same time, we're going to keep them safe and we're going to make sure that there is no disorder.

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HILL: Good Monday morning, everyone. Poppy is off today. I'm Erica Hill alongside Phil Mattingly. Nice to be with you on a big, big morning -- the start of a really important week.

That, of course, was the mayor of Miami just there. That city ramping up security as Donald Trump prepares to surrender himself on federal charges tomorrow.