Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken Meets with Chinese President Xi Jinping in China; Secretary of State Antony Blinken Says China Did Not Agree to Military-to-Military Communications Channels with U.S.; Chinese Government Promises Not to Provide Lethal Aid to Russia in War with Ukraine. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired June 19, 2023 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ANTONY BLINKEN, U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE: Establishing open communications channels, directly raising issues of concern, exploring cooperation in places where it's in our mutual interest to do so. We did all of that on this trip. But progress is hard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning to you. So good to be with you. I'm Victor Blackwell here with Erica Hill. Claiming success after a high-stakes meeting, what Secretary of State Antony Blinken told our Kylie Atwood after his talks with China's Xi Jinping.

ERICA HILL, CNN ANCHOR: Plus, new video shows the moment a Florida deputy and a man got sucked into a drain. The 30 terrifying seconds that feel more like an eternity.

BLACKWELL: And it's Juneteenth, an annual commemoration of the end of slavery in the U.S. after the Civil War. This is the third year Juneteenth will be observed as a federal holiday.

This hour of CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.

HILL: High stakes, critical timing. Secretary of State Antony Blinken wrapping up a two-day visit to China to help repair the fractured relationship between Washington and Beijing and get the two superpowers talking again. Blinken spoke a short time after meeting with President Xi Jinping.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLINKEN: With regard to crisis communications and military-to- military channels, this is also something that I raised repeatedly during this trip. I think it's absolutely vital that we have these kinds of communications, military-to-military. That imperative, I think, was only underscored by recent incidents that we saw in the air and on the seas. And at this moment, China has not agreed to move forward with that. I think that's an issue that we have to keep working on. (END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: CNN national security correspondent Kylie Atwood is in Beijing and joins us now. So both sides really kind of downplaying any big breakthroughs here during Blinken's visit. Is there a sense, though, that this was successful in terms of a first step, Kylie?

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: I think that's exactly it, Erica. The secretary of state called this a healthy dialogue, said it was candid, said it was constructive. Basically, what he was able to do over the course of the last two days here in Beijing was really effectively engage his Chinese counterparts, something that he hasn't done here in Beijing to date. This was his first visit to China as secretary of state, the first Biden cabinet official to visit China.

But we really should note that they didn't make progress on one of the key issues that the Biden administration was hoping to push the ball forward on. That is military-to-military channels of communication between the U.S. and China. As you heard in that introduction, the secretary told me that that was something that he raised repeatedly with his Chinese counterparts here in Beijing. He said it is critical to establish those channels. But it's not something that China agreed to do on this visit. He said that is something that the United States will continue working on.

And I asked him why the United States would be sending other U.S. officials to China in the coming weeks if they wouldn't agree to these military-to-military channels, because he did say that there was the expectation for further administration officials to visit Beijing. He essentially said that there needs to be engagement between the two sides. Diplomacy, talking to one another is more effective than not having those conversations.

When it comes to the war in Ukraine, the secretary said that China has said that it will not provide lethal aid to Russia to be used in the war in Ukraine. He said that isn't a new position, necessarily, for China, but he reiterated concerns to his Chinese counterparts about Chinese companies providing that lethal aid to Russian.

And then, it's also important to note when it comes to issues of economic stability. He said that he really sought to make sure that the Chinese knew that the United States isn't trying to contain them. They're trying to make sure that they take actions that protect the United States in the realm of national security. And that is leading the Biden administration's policies that have angered the Chinese counterparts in some areas, specifically on semiconductors and the like. He also mentioned human rights, the Americans who are wrongfully detained here in China, among other issues.

And of course, we'll watch to see what happens over the course of the following days as this meeting is really kind of digested in Washington.

HILL: Yes, so important, and glad that you were there to ask those questions, Kylie. Thank you. BLACKWELL: Taiwan is caught in the middle of this complicated

relationship. Beijing's top foreign affairs adviser says that there's no room for compromise when it comes to Taiwan, while Secretary Blinken says the U.S. position has not changed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[08:05:04]

BLINKEN: Were there to be a crisis over Taiwan, the likelihood is that that would produce an economic crisis that could affect, quite literally, the entire world. President Biden believes strongly that one of the successful aspects of our relationship with China going back five decades has been the responsible management of the Taiwan question. We continue to believe that that's essential.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: CNN's chief national security correspondent Jim Sciutto is with us now. Jim, you were in Taiwan last week. What's the Taiwan government perspective on their role in this tense relationship?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Well, frankly, they're worried about getting caught in the middle, right, between two superpowers, as they are, and as was made clear by this meeting between Blinken and Xi and other senior Chinese officials. It's good that they're talking, but there is still a great distance between the U.S. and China on the Taiwan issue.

Taiwan taking the threat of Chinese military action very seriously. They're preparing every day. I watched military exercises. They're preparing for the possibility of a Chinese invasion. But they're deliberately trying to avoid provoking China. They prefer the status quo. They don't want it to escalate. And they, of course, have a hand in that, their own actions, but they also worry about the hands of other superpowers, China and the U.S. here.

It's good that China and the U.S. are talking about this issue, but in their public comments, you see there is still great distance. Secretary Blinken accused China of provocative actions in the Taiwan Strait, placing the blame on China. For instance, we saw a Chinese jet fly close to a U.S. surveillance aircraft recently, a Chinese warship sail close to a U.S. warship recently. And then you have China on the other side, basically warning the U.S. away from any upset to the One China policy, as it's known.

So big picture, on the issue of Taiwan, good that the super powers are talking here, but those talks show that there's still a lot of distance there. And one specific point, as Kylie was noting, the U.S. wanted to come out of these meetings with an agreement on military-to- military contact so that those incidents, as we've seen recently, don't escalate into something bigger. They didn't leave with an agreement on such contacts.

BLACKWELL: Important that there was no progress on that, no immediate progress, according to the secretary. Jim Sciutto, thanks. SCIUTTO: Thanks.

HILL: Joining us now, the president of the Eurasia Group, Ian Bremmer. Ian, good to see you this morning. Based on what we heard, what we learned from Secretary Blinken, calling this healthy, candid, constructive, saying to our own Kylie Atwood that he had raised the matter about communication channels, specifically, those military-to- military communications channels, raised it repeatedly, there's no movement on that front. What is your main takeaway, based on what we're hearing from both officials in terms of how you would classify this meeting and this trip?

IAN BREMMER, EURASIA GROUP FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT: Well, first, how I would classify it would be positive. The main takeaway, which I haven't heard anyone mention yet, is the fact that President Xi Jinping decided to meet with Tony Blinken. Tony's not the head of state. He's secretary of state.

That is an intentional and symbolically important move by the Chinese government to show a desire to continue to work constructively on the relationship. And I firmly expect on the back of that that Xi Jinping will be coming to the United States, absent any sudden crisis, to the Apex Summit in San Francisco this fall where President Biden intends to be for a couple of days. So that's what everyone is going to be focusing on and talking about for the future.

But as you suggest, the reality is that we do not have any high-level military-to-military ties. We don't have arms agreements with the Chinese as they are dramatically expanding their nuclear capabilities, their advanced defense capabilities, their A.I. capabilities in national security. And as we've seen in the past few weeks, there have been a couple of near-miss intentional provocations/accidents in the Taiwan straits and in the South China Sea. And if the Americans and Chinese end up directly in conflict by mistake, we don't have the level of trust or engagement on the defense side to try to bring down those tensions. So the relationship is incredible important, and it's also becoming more dangerous.

BLACKWELL: Secretary Blinken says that the U.S. and other countries have received assurances from the Chinese government that they would not be providing lethal aid to Russia in their war on Ukraine. He did say that they do not have assurance as it relates to Chinese companies. Without that assurance about the companies and sending components, potentially, what's the assurance from the government worth?

[08:10:01]

BREMMER: Well, it's worth a fair amount in the sense that the Chinese government does not want to be called out for providing that level of sport going forward. And of course, when you talk about the defense sector, Chinese owned -- state-owned corporations and state-linked corporations are the most important in the space. So the government does have a lot more control and ownership than the U.S. government does or any sort of free market democracy. Also keep in mind that this is not just about believing the Chinese.

It's about verification and deterrence. The United States found out that there were Chinese government activities to provide support militarily. That was never executed on, but there was such engagement. The Americans not only called the Chinese out on that back in February, but they also made it public, as did the U.K., as did NATO. That embarrassed the Chinese, but it also made it very clear that there would be direct secondary U.S. sanctions against Chinese companies if that were to pass. That would be a radically worse U.S.- China relationship than we presently have. China's having a hard time with a strong growth this year. They're thinking about stimulus on the back of their end of zero COVID policy. They don't need that kind of an economic fight with the Americans. So this is less about trust, this is more about capabilities.

HILL: And you mentioned the economy here. We know how important that is in terms of China. There's been a lot made. We even spoke with former Defense Secretary Esper earlier this morning, who -- and I'm paraphrasing here -- but basically was saying, there is concern that the U.S. looks a little too eager in this meeting in sending Antony Blinken over, in having this meeting with Xi. We know that what's behind it in many ways for China is economic, in terms of what they're concerned about. Could that also, could you flip that? Does that give the U.S. a little bit of an upper hand in terms of certain relationships, certain meetings if this is about economic interests and perhaps what the U.S. could control there?

BREMMER: You know, the United States has gotten more alignment with the Japanese, the South Koreans, the Australians, Canada, all the Europeans on China over the past six months, in part because everyone is more concerned about the way Xi Jinping is behaving on the global stage, both economically and from a national security perspective. So if there's greater leverage for the Americans, I think it comes from that.

But I agree with you that the Americans look eager. And by the way, I don't put that primary on the government. I actually put it primarily on the American CEOs, who have been working hard to get back over to China and get their business going. And in that regard, we should recognize that most American bankers, technology sector leaders, manufacturers, they look a lot more -- they're more aligned with European and Asian governments than they are with Washington. They're the ones that were a lot faster to go to Beijing than Tony Blinken was, frankly. And so I do think that the level of interdependence between the two countries matters an awful lot. It is a guardrail, a more important guardrail than the ones we don't have diplomatically or from a security perspective.

HILL: Ian Bremmer, always appreciate your perspective. Thank you.

BLACKWELL: Overnight, a powerful tornado hit Mississippi in the towns of Louin and Bay Springs. This is about an hour southeast of Jackson. It left behind catastrophic damage. Look at this. Homes and businesses ripped apart. A shelter is now open to help the affected families there. More than 50 million people in the southeast now are under severe storm threats today. HILL: In Florida, dramatic body cam video showing the terrifying

moments a sheriff's deputy was sucked into and through a drainage pipe during heavy flooding. Take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: The deputy there was responding to one of many stranded drivers when suddenly the driver and the deputy both pulled under the water for almost 30 seconds. They struggled for air. Officials say both men are really lucky to be alive.

BLACKWELL: Certainly.

Jailed Putin critic Alexei Navalny appeared in a Moscow courtroom today facing extremism charges. What he told the court and why his team is calling it an incredible mess.

HILL: And former President Obama says the GOP isn't serious in addressing systemic racism. How Republican candidates Tim Scott and Nikki Haley are responding.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:18:09]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: There is no substitute for victory, and we've developed a culture of losing in this party where we've had three successive elections with substandard results.

And you're not going to get a mulligan on the 2024 election, and you're not going to be able to make any excuses about the 2024 election.

The time for excuses is over.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Florida governor and 2024 hopeful, Ron DeSantis took a not so veiled yet veiled shot at Donald Trump this weekend and he did it in the heart of Trump country.

This is Gardnerville, Nevada during the annual conservative gathering known as the Basque Fry.

You go and look up in your own time what they are frying.

Let's bring in "Los Angeles Times" op-ed columnist, LZ Granderson, and CNN senior political analyst, Ron Brownstein. LZ, we say not so veiled, he didn't say his name, he didn't go

directly at him when some of the other opponents in the race are doing just that.

LZ GRANDERSON, OP-ED COLUMNIST, "LOS ANGELES TIMES": Well, he's not doing well when he does that, right? Like he looks at the numbers in Florida, he is trailing.

So if you're trailing your opponent in your own state, then of course, you're not trying to add more, I guess, attention by saying his name. And oh, by the way, not saying Trump's name is not necessarily a Governor DeSantis issue.

Like there are a lot of Republicans, right, who aren't saying his name for a variety of reasons whether they're running for office, they don't want to upset MAGA voters, whether they are in office and trying to hold on to power, shout out to you, Kevin McCarthy.

So like when you think about all the different motives why people aren't saying his name, it all boils down to one thing -- fear.

BLACKWELL: But none of that worked in 2016.

GRANDERSON: Yes.

BLACKWELL: None of it worked in 2016.

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: And he is bigger than he was in 2016. He's a former president. He's got support from 50 percent or more in national polls. I mean, very few candidates ever in either party's primary has been that high this early.

[08:20:00]

If you don't go at him directly, you know, this is not going to collapse by itself like termites. You know, they are essentially accepting his framing of the indictment, and thus of the race that it is the deep state trying to take out Donald Trump because they fear him more than any other Republican candidate.

As long as you accept that as one of his rivals, you are basically making yourself the chorus in his play. The play is Donald Trump against all of these forces conspiring against him and thus, you, the Republican voter, and yes, we're kind of -- you know, we're kind of in the background supporting that.

GRANDERSON: And also, Ron, I mean, they are also auditioning to be as VP choice, right?

BROWNSTEIN: Yes.

GRANDERSON: Like, because they know, likely he's not going back to Pence, he is not getting the band back together again, so another reason why you don't say his name too harshly is that in the event, he needs a VP --

HILL: Yes, yes. Oh, I'm available.

GRANDERSON: Right.

HILL: See, I never said your name. Don't worry. Here I am.

GRANDERSON: Exactly.

HILL: I mean, let's talk about Tim Scott and Nikki Haley. So there were comments that former President Obama made with David Axelrod on his podcast, his most recent podcast, about how the Republican Party deals with race and deals with the conversation about race and, frankly, the history of this country.

And they really pushed back, both Tim Scott and Nikki Haley. I think we have some of the tweet from Nikki Haley saying that, tweeting in part: "Obama sent minorities back by singling them out as victims instead of empowering them." Tim Scott arguing, "Obama missed an opportunity here to unite the country as America's first Black president."

This was very strong pushback on this idea that there needs to be a real conversation, right, which is really what the former president was getting at and he is yet to see it.

GRANDERSON: Right.

HILL: Does that work?

GRANDERSON: No, because the proof is in the pudding. Right? Like, Tim Scott, right? Like it took a hundred years from reconstruction to his election to get an African-American Republican from the south represented in the Senate. That's not by accident. That's by design.

And for him to not acknowledge that design as part of his story is really unfortunate. And what's even more unfortunate, when you look at that quote from -- that tweet from Governor Haley -- Ambassador Haley, the word, the pronoun them, distancing herself from minorities, despite being a racial minority herself reveals a lot more about her understanding of how she factors into race in this country, more so than Obama's impact on minorities or how minorities view themselves in general.

BROWNSTEIN: Their comments are very revealing because the assertion that systemic discrimination does not exist against minorities and against women is defining maybe the defining unifying belief of the Republican coalition in the Trump era.

And political scientists have studied to say that both in 2016 and 2020, the best predictor of who voted for Trump was the denial that racism and sexism exists. Three-quarters of Republicans say in polls that discrimination against Whites is now as big a problem as bias against minorities, over three-fifths say White men are the most discriminated group in society.

There are virtually no Republican leaders who challenge that belief despite substantial evidence to the contrary on wealth gaps and poverty and concentrated poverty in schools. And especially, I think, for Republicans of color, that it is very hard to get hurt on anything else if you challenge that bedrock belief within the coalition that the real victims of discrimination in society now are conservatives, Whites, Christians, conservatives, and you just don't see anybody in the party challenging that.

And Haley and Scott have fallen very much into that line.

GRANDERSON: Which is the reason why their comments are so disappointing, because I think there is a hunger to get past this two- party system. But you're really putting a lot of people in -- you know, minorities, queer people, people who believe in reproductive rights, you're really putting them in a box, because not having a healthy conversation really makes it this or that, and I don't think Americans want that.

That's the reason why so many people identify as Independents because you don't want that.

BROWNSTEIN: And you're saying, I mean, two-thirds of Black and Hispanic kids attend schools where a majority of their classmates live in poverty, like, are you fundamentally saying that that is because all of their parents didn't try hard enough? Like is that the argument like if you're saying that there is not systemic inequity in society?

So at some level, just the argument is just -- it can't sustain the lived reality of modern American life.

GRANDERSON: And neither argument to keep the framework together.

BROWNSTEIN: Yeah, absolutely.

BLACKWELL: But at this moment, there doesn't appear to be any audience for the honest accounting that former President Obama is calling for.

Thank you all. LZ, Ron, thank you very much.

HILL: Turning now to Russia where jailed Putin critic Alexey Navalny appeared in a prison courtroom earlier this morning to answer new charges of extremism.

Navalny's team called the hearing an incredible mess, says the audio was poor, the video feed and volume was cut off without warning.

Navalny is already serving nine years behind bars for fraud and contempt of court, a new conviction could add another 30 years onto his sentence.

[08:25:06]

BLACKWELL: So this was one of America's most prolific slave trading ports in Charleston, South Carolina. It's now set to open as a museum, a memorial, and a research center.

Expert genealogists there took me back centuries to tell the story of my ancestors.

What was revealed blew me away.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: It is remarkable.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're not done.

BLACKWELL: We're not done. We're not done. Okay. We're not done. Let me get a Kleenex.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BLACKWELL: There is a new museum in Charleston, South Carolina dedicated to hundreds of years of African-American history.

It is Black history in global context and through individual stories, too. And to show off the expanse and residents of the museum, Center for Family History, researchers traced my genealogy.

Now listen as a Black man with deep roots in the American South, I thought I knew where my story was headed. I was very wrong.

[08:30:08]