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Will Hurd is Interviewed about his Presidential Campaign Positions; Look at Will Hurd's Comments; Man Arrested in Obama's Neighborhood; Cocaine Found at the White House. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired July 06, 2023 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

WILL HURD 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Seat majority in the House and it ended up being five. He's someone who's not even willing to sign the pledge and doesn't want to debate, right? And he's someone that is just cavalier and careless with our national secrets, endangering the lives of thousands of men and women who make -- who put themself in harm's way every single day in order to keep us safe. I just can't - I can't support that.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: OK. OK.

HURD: And I can't say, hey, I'm going to do it, and then he gets -

HARLOW: Yes.

HURD: He gets, you know - and then - and then change my mind. I just can't do it.

HARLOW: OK. Tim Alberta (ph) wrote - well, he's written two really interesting profiles of you. But one of them was in 2017. And he wrote about an experience you had at Texas A&M, You're a senior. You are running for student body president. And here's the story he tells. Hurd and some friends hoped for buzz by painting hundreds of ping pong balls with his campaign logo, a black smile on a yellow face, and dumping them into a campus fountain, but the balls wash into a corner and went unnoticed.

How do you avoid repeating the ping pong ball stunt again because what worked for you is when you changed strategies and you went out and you shook everyone's hand. You've said, look, I'm a dark horse candidate. How do you make sure that experience doesn't repeat itself in your run for the White House?

HURD: Well, look, one, we're not going to paint ping pong balls. It would be hard to put an, you know, an "r" on that ping pong ball.

But here's - here's the issue. You know, I ran for office in 2009. Everybody -- nobody thought a black Republican could win in a 72 percent Latino district. I won the primary. Didn't get 50 percent of the vote and went to a runoff. And I lost - I won the primary by 900 votes and I lost the runoff by 700 votes. Here's what I learned from that experience. You've got to ID your

voters and turn them out. It's that - it's not complicated, it's just hard. We know the people that are interested in a candidate that's not afraid of Donald Trump but is articulating a vision for the future.

When you were talking to, in your previous segment, about the problems with Joe Biden's numbers, even Democrats, independents want to see something different. We know who those people are, and we are working to make sure, you know, we get the 40,000 people to go to hurdforamerica.com, who give at least a dollar, I'm going to try to have the requirements to get on the debate stage in order to take this message to people.

We know who they are. We're going to go talk to them. That's why I was in the north country of New Hampshire. I was the first presidential candidate to go to that part of the state this cycle. That's why I was in the rain and, you know, walking in parades. That's the fun part to me n this job, I actually like people. And we're going to take this message to folks because people are ready for something different. People know we live in complicated times and need common sense.

HARLOW: Something that is also striking about the way that you have run your offices before in politics is something else that Alberta points out in his profile of you, and that is, how many Democrats you have employed. I mean he talks about your veteran case worker not shy about denouncing the Republican Party, your district staffer headache her head when asked if she's a Republican. Your chief of staff, at that point, used to work for a Democrat.

I'm interested in if you were to make it to the White House, would you bring Democrats in to work with you? Would they be in your cabinet?

HURD: Well, I want to bring -- so this is a long way off to think through those issues, but I'm going to bring the best people that I trust who's going to get the job done. I - and that's why I think --

HARLOW: I know, but that's a non-answer. You've talked about how important it is to bring people of --

HURD: No, look, it is. Look, I'm also not going to -- you know, is there a scenario in which I can see me putting Democrats in an administration? Of course, right?

HARLOW: OK.

HURD: But saying that I have clear plans to do that right now is not the case. And ultimately what I want, I want smart people that are going to be able to help us deal with things, like how do we ensure that artificial intelligence doesn't upend every industry and leads to, you know, to actually improve jobs, not unemployment. How are we going to finally deal and win this new cold war with the Chinese government. I need the best minds. And if some of them are Democrats, then of course we'll evaluate that.

HARLOW: OK. You -

HURD: But making that pledge right now would be - would be - would be difficult for me to do.

HARLOW: You just brought up AI and you brought this up last time you were on the program noting a poll that says 65 percent of Americans are concerned that AI is essentially going to take their jobs. You've also touted, in your words, writing the first national strategy on AI. But can you actually tell people what that would mean if you were to be president, what you would do? You're on the board, for example, of OpenAI, the creator of ChatGPT. You know, that's accelerating this. What would you do as president that would save those jobs?

HURD: Sure. So, first and foremost, right, artificial intelligence is here and it's coming and it is going to upend every industry, not in ten years, but in two, three years.

[08:35:02]

And the first thing that I would do is work with Congress to pass legislation that says AI has to follow the law, period, full stop. We have a number of rules to protect our civil liberties, to protect our civil rights, and we shouldn't carve technologies out from that legislation. That would be the first thing.

Second thing, Poppy, you and I can't build a nuclear power plant without getting some kind of permits. So, if you have a tool, and an AI system that is powerful, and we could define what powerful is, hey, this has got to be submitted to some kind of review and permitting process. Maybe NIST (ph), all right, this is the National Institute of Standards and Technology. That would be the second thing.

And then, three, we would be making sure that identifying the skills that our kids are going to need, that we start getting those even as early as middle school. We should have coding in middle school, in every middle school. And then when it comes to high school, we should have things like advanced statistics so that our kids are ready for jobs that don't exist today.

HARLOW: Just to put a button on it, the permitting you just talked about in the second part of your answer would mean that something like ChatGPT, which again you're on the board of OpenAI, wouldn't be allowed under a Hurd presidency?

HURD: I was on the board. I'm no longer -

HARLOW: Was. You were. I apologize.

HURD: Yes. Yes.

HARLOW: Wouldn't be allowed to be on the market without being permitted? Wouldn't - people couldn't use it?

HURD: That's correct. You -- well, you would have to have a -- some kind of a review. You know, we know some of the things that we should, you know, an algorithm shouldn't do in order to protect people's rights, not be biased, make sure that it's not doing things that you don't intend it to do. And so, yes, before those things were - would be able to be put out into the wild, there should be some review and some permitting.

And guess what, Poppy, most of the companies that are involved in this space are supportive of this concept and this idea because they recognize the tools are being so powerful. Like the best analogy I can make for artificial intelligence is its equivalent to nuclear fission. Nuclear fission controlled gives us nuclear power. A clean energy that can last forever. Nuclear fission uncontrolled gives you nuclear weapons. And so we need to be taking those steps now while we can and remember that this is not about us perfecting an algorithm. This is a race. And our existential threat, the Chinese government, is trying to do the same thing and they are not developing this tool with the idea of civil -- protecting civil liberties and protecting civil rights in mind. And so that's why this has ramifications all over the world.

HARLOW: Will Hurd, thank you very much. Please come back.

HURD: Of course.

HARLOW: Good to have you.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: All right, let's get into it now with CNN's senior political analyst and anchor John Avlon, CNN political commentator and host of PBS "Firing Line," Margaret Hoover, and Elie Honig, CNN's senior legal analyst and former assistant U.S. attorney in the Southern District of New York.

I've been taking notes on grunts and hmms and Oks while you all have been watching that interview with Will Hurd. Also our conversation with Congressman Clyburn.

John, let me start with you.

On this pledge, he says, he can't lie. He won't lie. He won't sign it. He won't get on to the stage by RNC rules right now if he doesn't.

JOHN AVLON, CNN ANCHOR AND SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Look, this is a bit of a double blind that the RNC is playing, right, because Trump himself -- this is not a typical candidate. You can't, you know -- this is - this is a former president. He listed all these reasons you hear from some Republicans. He's been a loser. It's more than that. He tried to overturn an election. And that's why it's perfectly reasonable for candidates to say I couldn't support him.

HARLOW: Yes.

AVLON: And so the RNC needs to create some flexibility around that reality rather than trying to create this group think that forces everybody in to a position that people don't hold as a matter of conscious.

BLACKWELL: What did you think of his reasoning?

MARGARET HOOVER CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well he - well, I thought - well, I think the reasoning is terrible. I don't - I don't think you say, we don't support Donald Trump because he's a loser because he's losing until he's winning. I mean he was a loser when he came down the escalator, and then he started winning and everyone loves him. You've got to make a moral argument against the man if you're Will Hurd, if you're Chris Christie, if you're Asa Hutchinson. You make the moral argument that his man cares more about himself and his own narcissism than the Constitution of the United States, than our own national security secrets. That's the argument.

The problem Will Hurd is going to have -- and I like Will Hurd. I am glad he is in the race. But he has to have 40,000 individual donors, he has to have -- from 20 different states.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

HOOVER: He has to have 1 percent in polling, by the way, from those early primary states with polls that have 800 self-identified Republican GOP voters in their sample.

AVLON: Math (ph).

HOOVER: So this -- the RNC has created incredibly difficult standards. The pledge is the least of it. Incredibly difficult standards for any candidate to reach the threshold to get on that stage.

The pledge, forget it about it. I mean Chris Christie is - Chris Christie will sign the pledge and say he's going to take it just as seriously as Donald Trump did in 2016. So, the pledge isn't the hard part. The hard part is what the RNC, a wholly owned subsidiary of Trump, Inc., is making it impossible for anyone else to get on the stage in a fair way.

[08:40:07]

AVLON: That's it (ph).

HARLOW: I'm interested in what you thought about - we ran out of time, but his answer about making private companies get this -- so he's saying, for example, that ChatGPT couldn't be put out without government regulation was just an interesting sort of big government statement from a Republican as it has to do with the private sector. I was interested in what you thought of that.

AVLON: I was fascinated to hear him talk about AI, and he should be talking about AI. Everyone running for president, all of us should be talking about AI all the time. It is the most important thing that's happening technologically that will transform society.

And, look, this is a place that exists outside of the (INAUDIBLE). We have a long pattern in America of technology outpacing our laws. And the point he made about nuclear fusion or whatever -- fission, whatever - whatever you want to -- parallel you want to make, we need rules of the road. We need to make sure that there's some common sense measures. That's not necessarily big government. It's saying that, look, this -- we can't allowed this to -- the horse to get out of the barn because its implications for humanity are too profound.

HARLOW: But Congress hasn't effectively been able to pass anything to regulate social media. AVLON: Not even on social media.

HOOVER: But Congress hasn't - Congress hasn't been able to regulate anything. I mean that's -

BLACKWELL: But -

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: (INAUDIBLE).

BLACKWELL: How do you do that?

HONIG: Yes, I mean, Will Hurd has some interesting, I think, and bold ideas. But this idea of an AI review and licensing board is not going to fly. First of all, there's First Amendment concerns.

HARLOW: Right.

HONIG: Second of all, how do you do that? What qualifies? If some individual who has a sound board in his house wants to create an AI version of a song, does that have to go through the board? If a graphic designer wants to use AI to help come up with a logo, does that have to go through the board?

So, I think it's good that he's on the forefront of AI for the reasons John says, but an all-seeing licensing and approval board is not going to happen.

AVLON: Yes, I -

HOOVER: Yes, I say credit to him for putting the ideas out there. I mean we all recognize this is a new technology. We've got to just - we've got to do something about it. There should be some kind of -- I mean Sam Altman himself, the founder of ChatGPT -

AVLON: Yes.

HOOVER: Says, I welcome regulation. Let's be partners in this. I mean industry needs to work with government in order to figure out how to properly regulate this thing. Inevitably, government will just be a half beat behind industry as is in every technological innovation.

HARLOW: Thank you, guys, very much. We appreciate it.

HOOVER: Thanks.

AVLON: (INAUDIBLE).

BLACKWELL: All right, the man accused of targeting former President Obama's home did so after a Trump Truth Social post. What Trump shared to his millions of followers ahead.

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[08:45:21] BLACKWELL: New details about the man arrested last week with weapons in former President Obama's D.C. neighborhood. Fed prosecutors say he traveled there after seeing and resharing a social media post by Donald Trump that revealed what he claimed was Obama's address. In a detention memo filed earlier this week, prosecutors say that Taylor Taranto began live-streaming in the area shortly after resharing Trump's post. Now, the filing also notes that Taranto made previous threats against House Speaker Kevin McCarthy and Democratic Congressman Jamie Raskin.

Now, Taranto has not yet been charged in connection with the last week indictment. Separately, Taranto had an open warrant for his arrest related to the January 6th Capitol attack.

Joining us now is CNN's chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst John Miller.

John, I wonder if we're just in a different landscape. There have been threats against presidents, sure. But now to consider that as part of this is a posting from a previous president. Are we in a completely different space?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: So, we are. And, you know, it started off with the unwritten rule that former presidents didn't, you know, bash current presidents. So that went out the window a while ago.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

MILLER: This takes a different step when a former president is posting.

Now, to be clear, because some of these stories come out as shorthand, Donald Trump didn't say this is Barack Obama's home address, go there now. But he post -- he reposted an old article which talks about the street that the former president lives on, in the neighborhood he lives on, who else lives in the neighborhood. And this individual, who had - who was already live-streaming in the area talking about blowing up a federal building, apparently redirected himself to that neighborhood and said, I'm on that street now. And this is where Podestas and the Obamas are and I'll meet them in hell. That's threatening language.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

HARLOW: He said, we've got those losers surrounded. See you in hell, Podestas and Obamas.

He had an open warrant for his arrest tied to January 6th and the insurrection. He didn't try to hide the fact that he was there. He posted on his YouTube page things like, look, mom, I'm an insurrectionist now. The fact that this got to this point, it shouldn't have happened, right?

MILLER: Well, I don't know. There's a thousand people -

HARLOW: Yes.

MILLER: Actually more than a thousand people who have been charged in the January 6th case.

HARLOW: Yes.

MILLER: It is simply the largest federal criminal prosecution in the history of America. He is one of them. And that warrant was issued on that day, the 29th. So, what you actually saw here was the Capitol Police issuing the be on the lookout for, the FBI monitoring the social media and pushing that out, the Secret Service sending their uniform division, already on patrol there, that information, agents coming to the area. You saw intelligence moving because his rhetoric had changed.

BLACKWELL: Yes. I wonder, should people be surprised that this man got that close to the home, to the neighborhood?

MILLER: I don't think so.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

MILLER: He's living out of his van. He doesn't have a fixed address. He was already on their radar. That's a good thing. And, frankly, if you Google the addresses of various significant politicians, you know, you can find either the address or the approximation or a picture of the house. He got where a lot of people could have gotten. But being spurred on by a former president is the thing that's really attracting attention.

BLACKWELL: Yes.

HARLOW: That's what makes it so different - that's what makes it so different, right?

MILLER: Yes.

HARLOW: John Miller, thank you.

BLACKWELL: Thank you, John.

HARLOW: So, the Secret Service is reviewing cameras, they're looking at visitor logs, trying to figure out who brought cocaine, that's right, cocaine, into the White House. We'll take you live to the White House, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:52:09]

HARLOW: This morning, the Secret Service launching a full-scale investigation into what one Secret Service official called a dime- sized bag of cocaine. It was discovered at the entrance area of the White House. Officials say there are many people, staff, visitors who travel through that area.

Arlette Saenz joins us live from the White House with more.

So, they were -- yesterday they were sort of testing it, figuring out what it was. Now they know who it was. Now who brought it is the big question.

SAENZ: Yes, and the Secret Service is really trying to use every tool at their disposal to determine who brought this baggy of cocaine into the White House. A federal law enforcement officials said that they are running fingerprint analysis and DNA tests on the bag, as well as having Secret Service comb through surveillance video and the visitors log.

Now, this bag, this Ziploc bag of a white powdery substance, which was later confirmed to be cocaine, was found on Sunday evening. We're told that there were tours that were led by staff in the West Wing from Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. And this was found in an area that's a cubby area, where people can leave their cell phones and other items as they are going through the tour.

Now, the White House notes that this is an area that is heavily traveled through by both visitors and staff. Sometimes staff leave devices there if they're heading into an area where they're viewing classified information. But the Secret Service is engaged in this full-throated investigation to try to find the person who brought that cocaine to the White House.

But an official cautions that there is a chance they may not be able to determine exactly who brought it due to the number of people who are traveling through that area, as well as the size of the bag. So still so many questions about how exactly that baggy of cocaine got here to the White House, that the Secret Service is trying to get an answer to at this moment.

HARLOW: OK. Arlette Saenz, thank you.

BLACKWELL: The Washington Nationals pitchers cannot stop Cincinnati Reds superstar Elly De La Cruz. Neither can their dugout. Why the Nationals wanted the umps to check his bat, next.

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[08:58:44]

BLACKWELL: What happens when two people who don't watch baseball do a story about baseball? We're about to see.

HARLOW: See, I usually like lean on Phil for this baseball stuff, and then -

BLACKWELL: Phil ain't here. So we're going to try to get through it.

HARLOW: You sold it in the tease, so I thought you knew a lot about baseball.

BLACKWELL: I can just read loudly. The Washington Nationals doing whatever they can to slow down

Cincinnati Reds rookie sensation Elly De La Cruz. I know Elly. They had umpires check the knob of his bat during the second inning after sometime -- everything checked out OK, but it turns out the Reds had special approval from the league for De La Cruz to keep a plastic covering on the knobs of his bat but the umps were not aware of that.

You want to pick this up.

HARLOW: I can't sell it as well as you, but sure.

But just three innings later, he blasted a 455 foot moon shot to right field. But before he started his home run trot, the 21-year-old gestured towards the handle of his bat, appearing to tell the Nationals' dugout to check it again. Cincinnati went on to win in a blowout, 9-2.

BLACKWELL: That was believable.

HARLOW: How did I do?

BLACKWELL: I -- I believed it. I believed it. You -

HARLOW: Yes.

BLACKWELL: Double headers and all.

HARLOW: Sorry, Phil.

Thank you, friend. See you here tomorrow.

BLACKWELL: Yes, be here tomorrow.

HARLOW: All right, "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" is now.

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