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CNN This Morning

Former President Trump's Legal Team to Ask for Change of Venue from Washington, D.C., for Election Interference Trial; Former Vice President Mike Pence Says Former President Trump Demanded He Take Steps to Overturn 2020 Presidential Election; Crowd in Kentucky Jeers Republican Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell During Speech; Firefighters in California Die in Helicopter Crash while Battling Wildfire. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired August 07, 2023 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:00:40]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Good Monday morning, everyone. It is 8:00 a.m. here on the east coast, 5:00 a.m. out west. So happy to have Victor Blackwell with me this week.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: Glad to be here.

HARLOW: Good weekend?

BLACKWELL: Very good weekend.

HARLOW: Good, good, good. We have a lot to get to. This breaking overnight, helicopters collide while fighting wildfires in California. Three people killed including a fire chief. An investigation now underway.

BLACKWELL: Plus, thousands of Beyonce concertgoers forced to take shelter as severe storms swept through D.C. How much her tour spent to keep metro trains running.

HARLOW: And Simone Biles is back, blowing away the competition after a two-year hiatus.

This hour of CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.

This is where we begin this morning. Donald Trump just hours away from a crucial deadline in the 2020 election interference case. A federal judge has ordered him to respond to Special Counsel Jack Smith's request for a protective order by 5:00 today. Smith is trying to block Trump from disclosing evidence and making public comments that could intimidate witnesses or undermine the case.

BLACKWELL: At the same time, we're keeping a close eye on the Fulton County courthouse in Atlanta, where Trump is facing another potential indictment for trying to overturn the election. This morning, the sheriff's office has closed streets outside the courthouse where a grand jury is considering charges. Let's bring in CNN justice correspondent Jessica Schneider. So Trump's team is vowing to oppose the protective order in the federal case, right?

JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right. And they're expected to oppose it in that filing by 5:00 tonight. It will be the first in a long list of fights that Trump's lawyers are preparing for. The former president and his attorney over the weekend saying that they'll ask the judge to step aside from the case. They claim she can't be impartial. They're also planning to ask for a change of venue, to move this case outside of Washington, D.C. And this is all as both sides will start to make their case for how soon a trial should start.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

SCHNEIDER: Former President Donald Trump and his legal team going on offense this weekend, after Trump pleaded not guilty to four charges alleging that he tried to overturn the results of the 2020 presidential election.

JOHN LAURO, TRUMP ATTORNEY: The point is that we will not agree to keeping information that's not sensitive from the press.

SCHNEIDER: Trump's lawyer says his legal team plans to oppose a protective order requested by prosecutors that would put some restrictions on what Trump and his team would do with evidence shared with them. Federal prosecutors arguing limits need to be imposed on Trump, citing his previous public statements about witnesses, judges, and lawyers in the case. And in the filing attached a Truth Social post of Trump's, where he warns, "If you go after me, I'm coming after you."

Trump rebuking the concerns of federal prosecutors, continuing to lash out on social media at the case and the judge over the weekend, claiming he cannot get a fair trial in Washington, D.C. Trump writes that he plans to ask Judge Tonya Chutkin, who is presiding over the case, to recuse herself, and further claiming that he will also request a change of venue for the trial. One of Trump's rivals for the Republican nomination for president disagrees.

CHRIS CHRISTIE, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I believe jurors can be fair. I believe in the American people. And I believe in the fact that jurors will listen fairly and impartially.

SCHNEIDER: Despite his legal troubles mounting, Trump hit the campaign trail this weekend, visiting South Carolina, where he again criticized his latest indictment and Special Counsel Jack Smith.

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: He's a deranged human being. You take a look at that face, you say, that guy is a sick man. There's something wrong with him.

(LAUGHTER)

SCHNEIDER: A Trump campaign adviser tells CNN Trump has no plans to change his rhetoric. The former president also took aim at his former vice president, Mike Pence, disputing the claims in the indictment that he pressured him to reject the election results. Trump's attorney, John Lauro, says that Trump was merely asking the vice president to act.

LAURO: What President Trump did do is direct Vice President Pence to do anything. He asked him, in an aspirational way. Asking is covered by the First Amendment.

SCHNEIDER: Pence confirming the claims in the indictment and says he has no plans to testify, but will, quote, comply with the law.

MIKE PENCE, (R) FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: Frankly, the day before January 6th, if memory serves, they came back, his lawyers did, and said, we want you to reject votes outright.

[08:05:00]

They were asking me to overturn the election. I had no right to overturn the election. I know we did our duty that day.

(END VIDEO TAPE)

SCHNEIDER (on camera): So this week, we are expecting a flurry of filings, a flurry of court fights, all before the next court date in this 2020 election case. That court date is set for August 28th.

Now, as for Trump's claims that he'll try to get this case moved out of Washington, D.C., it's interesting to note here that about three dozen January 6th defendants, they've already tried to move their cases, and no judge, even those appointed by Donald Trump, have ever agreed. So Poppy and Victor, there could be a long and unlikely legal fight ahead for Trump legal team.

WALKER: Jessica Schneider, thank for all of that reporting this morning, starting us off.

BLACKWELL: Joining us now, politics reporter at Semafor, Shelby Talcott, and John Avlon is back with us. And that's the point, right, John? No other defendant has gotten that change of venue. It's delayed. That's the point.

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST AND ANCHOR: Of course it's delayed, because that's what Donald Trump does. He projects, he deflects, and he tries to delay when it comes to court cases.

But this is an incident that happened definitively in Washington, D.C., when he was president living in Washington, D.C. So if the other three dozen folks haven't had luck in changing the venue, Donald Trump won't either.

HARLOW: What do you make of what we heard from Mike Pence over the weekend on the Sunday shows, talking to Dana, et cetera? But then also Trump's lawyers saying, like, Mike Pence is going to be our best defense witness?

SHELBY TALCOTT, POLITICS REPORTER, SEMAFOR: Yes, I noticed that also. I think that's really interesting. And I'm curious why they're so confident, I guess, in why he would be their best defense.

HARLOW: Let's play it to get sort of -- this is what he said on CBS. CBS.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN LAURO, TRUMP ATTORNEY: The reason why Vice President Pence would be so important to the defense is the following. Number one, he agrees that John Eastman, who gave legal advice to President Trump, was an esteemed legal scholar. Number two, he agrees that there were election irregularities, fraud, unlawful actions at the state level. All of that will eviscerate any allegation of criminal intent on the part of President Trump.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TALCOTT: Yes, I almost wonder if he's overselling Mike Pence's testimony, because what we're hearing from Mike Pence out on the campaign trail is very different. And in fact, in recent weeks, as this particular indictment has heated up, Mike Pence has really opened the floodgates into how he actually feels on this situation. So I'm not convinced that that's going to be the defense that Trump's team thinks it is.

AVLON: It's bluster. I mean, and to that point, when Dana interviewed Mike Pence, he completely demolished the argument that Trump's lawyer was trying to set up, saying I was specifically asked. This was not a request, this was not an ask. This was a demand.

TALCOTT: And not a pause. I wasn't asked for a pause.

AVLON: No, that's right. So this is just bluster on the part of Trump's team, and that's to be expected because they're channeling the candidate.

BLACKWELL: But although Pence is becoming more aggressive in his language about the former president's actions ahead of January 6th, Dana asked him specifically, can you say you won't vote for him if he's the nominee? And he wouldn't say, no, I'm not going to vote for him. Now, maybe that's, well, I'm going to be nominee of the party, but why can't you draw that line?

AVLON: That line would seem to be fundamental, right. If someone's been indicted or tried to overturn an election in the United States of America, if that's not a dealbreaker, what is? But we also all understand that they're trying to win a Republican nomination. Trump is still popular, 37 percent of Republicans would support him no matter what. And all of these candidates are trying to chip away at that.

The thing I would say, taking a big step back, is what has provoked a lot of this is this Truth Social he put out, saying, if you come after me, I'll come after you. And the question is, why isn't that just free speech? I think we've seen a long pattern of Donald Trump trying to intimidate people in Congress, rallying his supporters to attack them on social media in a way that has had a restraining effect.

So I think, while every person is entitled to protection of the First Amendment, you also need to take into context of this particular individual and the way he has threatened people who threaten to cross him, and it's worked with a lot of Republican candidates, too many. But I think you're starting to see that aperture open. People are starting to have the courage of their convictions to speak out and call it out.

HARLOW: I want to talk about what happened with Mitch McConnell over the weekend. So he was booed at home, this is a political gathering in his state. Here's what happened.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CROWD: You lost the Senate. You lost the Senate.

Retire. Retire. Retire. Retire.

Ditch Mitch. Ditch Mitch.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: They're saying, "You lost the Senate," "Retire," and "Ditch Mitch." This follows him freezing at the podium about a week ago for over 20 seconds. There are concerns about his health. But is this deeper than his health and voter concerns on that? Because that's not what they were saying.

TALCOTT: Yes, yes, I think it is a little bit deeper. I also think it goes to -- back to what you were just saying about Trump, and how his rhetoric, regarding anything, including certain politicians, has an effect on the Republican Party as a whole.

[08:10:09]

And Mitch McConnell is one of those people who he's gone after in the past. And so I think, a, it's deeper than that, but I also think from the perspective of health concerns, there is a broader frustration within both sides of the party, quite frankly, voters across the country about aging and aged leadership. And it's not just McConnell. It's Trump included. When I'm on the ground, that's one of the concerns. It's Joe Biden. It's Feinstein. It's age as a broad issue. And so I think that's really come to the forefront more and more in the past few months.

AVLON: But that was -- that's absolutely correct. There is a gerontocracy in the country that people are getting frustrated at, and concerns about McConnell's health. But that hostility, that lack of civility, that cruelty in shouting him down.

HARLOW: I felt bad watching him there, just as a human, all politics aside.

AVLON: We are losing sight of that basic decency and kindness in this environment.

BLACKWELL: It can be counterproductive for the people trying to heckle him there. John, Shelby, thank you. HARLOW: We told you earlier in the program, at least three people we

know this morning have died after two helicopters collided in southern California. CAL Fire officials say the two aircraft were responding to a wildfire in Riverside County, that's just east of Los Angeles. One of the choppers landed safely, the other did not.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHIEF DAVID FULCHER, CALFIRE SOUTHERN REGION: Unfortunately, the second helicopter crashed, and tragically, all three members perished, which included one CAL Fire division chief, one CAL Fire captain, and one contract pilot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Our Camila Bernal is following all of this from Los Angeles. It's tragic, and it's such a reminder of these, they really are heroes that go on the front lines of these wildfires, up in the air and on the ground.

CAMILA BERNAL, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They really are, Poppy and Victor. Good morning. And unfortunately, these are the first three deaths of the California 2023 fire season. Here's what happened. CAL Fire saying that around 6:00 p.m. on Sunday, they were battling the Broadway fire. They had six helicopters up in the air. This was a fire that started in a structure and then spread to the vegetation, so it became a wildland fire. It was about three acres big. They're fighting this fire, making progress, and two of the helicopters crash, as you guys mentioned.

There was one helicopter that landed safely. That was an observer helicopter with two people onboard. The other one was a helicopter that throws the retardant and the water drops. And that helicopter had three people inside. It was the captain, the division chief, and also the pilot. BERNAL saying these were three husbands, three fathers, three friends. They are mourning their loss and saying that it was tragic but are thankful that that second helicopter was able to land safely. Poppy, Victor?

HARLOW: Camila Bernal, we appreciate it. Our thoughts are with their kids, with their wives, everything this morning. Thank you.

BLACKWELL: A former Trump White House staffer and the wife of former Congressman Adam Kinzinger speaking now for the first time about the hateful rhetoric and threats her family received during a January 6th House investigation. Sofia Kinzinger joins us live, next.

HARLOW: And later, Hollywood still really at a standstill as the first step towards negotiations falls through. How long are these strikes going to last? Fran Drescher with us to discuss.

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[08:16:52]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR AND POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: You can say right

here that you will rule out voting for Donald Trump again for president.

MIKE PENCE (R), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Dana, I will tell you, I don't think we'll have to make that decision.

BASH: What if you do?

PENCE: I am confident I'll be able to support the Republican nominee, especially if it's me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That's Mike Pence not directly answering Dana's question saying whether he would support Trump if he is the eventual Republican nominee.

The former vice president now playing a central role in Trump's indictment while Pence has criticized his former boss' actions on January 6. He told CNN last month that he's not yet convinced those actions were criminal.

Pence's life was put at risk on January 6th. He said this earlier about Trump: "His reckless words endangered my family." Trump's rhetoric about overturning the 2020 election has put others in danger, too, including the family of my next guest who is speaking out for the first time.

Sofia Kinzinger worked in the Trump White House, including directly for then Vice President Mike Pence as his director of strategic media. She is also married to Adam Kinzinger, the former Republican congressman and now CNN senior political commentator.

Last year, Congressman Kinzinger revealed some of the threats his family had faced over his role on the January 6 committee.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I guess I can't say a whole lot more other than I hope you naturally die as quickly as [bleep] possible, you [bleep] piece of [bleep].

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You backstabbing son of a [bleep]. You go against Trump, y'all know y'all [bleep] are sitting up there lying like a [bleep] dog.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey you little [bleep]. Going to come protest in front of your house this weekend. We know where your family is and we're going to get you, you little [bleep].

(END AUDIO CLIP)

HARLOW: Wow. Sofia Kinzinger joins me now.

Thank you very much for speaking out. I can't imagine those threats coming to my family. I'm sorry that you have had to endure all of this. Tell me why you wanted to speak out now.

SOFIA KINZINGER, FORMER WHITE HOUSE STAFFER UNDER TRUMP: Hi, Poppy.

And yes, it is not easy to hear those.

The last few years have not been easy, Poppy. I mean, we've endured with so much, but we've never questioned or doubted what we were doing. I mean, the truth was far more important.

We truly believe that the American people needed to know what happened on January 6th and prior. And yes, it's very personal. This indictment is very personal to us.

And like you mentioned I worked for Mike Pence. We know a lot of these people that are running for President right now in the Republican Party and yes, it's there's a lot of emotions for us to tide when we see how the truth is still not completely out.

HARLOW: You have a one-and-a-half-year-old child and for any for any parent, anyone can imagine just how immense those threats are if they come just toward you, but when they come towards your family, you have to talked about the fact that you and you've tweeted -- you tweeted: "Heavenly Father, may the Republican Party wake up," because this is not the party you recognize.

[08:20:12 ]

KINZINGER: It's not, Poppy.

And listen, there's -- I guess, the public gets to see Adam on camera doing his role as a politician, as a public figure, but we have personal lives, too. I mean, there was a lot happening in our lives when January 6 happened. I mean, we were newlyweds, I was pregnant most of 2021, and then Christian was born in 2022 when the committees were basically getting ready for the hearings.

I have this vivid memories of being in the nursery with Christian and in the background, having all these testimonies, playing because Adam was online, listening to the testimonies, asking questions.

So this is like our past two years. This was -- our lives was dedicated to this, and it is extremely personal, especially when we hear like Vice President Pence saying that the committee was a partisan witch hunt. Yes, it is personal, and the lies are still there. We still feel an obligation to speak truth to them.

HARLOW: Do you recognize that person? That Mike Pence? I mean, you worked for him as a director of strategic media operations and, and yet, it sort of seems like you can't believe some of the things you hear him say about the work that your husband did and that committee in general.

KINZINGER: Listen, so I worked in campaigns. I know what it takes to strategically draft talking points because you're trying to pursue voters, but listen, we're not talking about policies here, we are talking about our democracy. HARLOW: Yes.

KINZINGER: We're talking about a man that did everything he could to steal the election from the American people. And Mike Pence, he knows us. He knows very well Adam, he knows me. We're not Democrats, and we would definitely not allow Democrats to use us as political pawns.

Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger really exposed the truth when he was quiet. And honestly, I would love to know what he thinks about Adam Kinzinger and Liz Cheney. Is he grateful for what they did? Because he is confirming absolutely everything that he is now brave enough to come up to the public and explain. So yes, it is personal, Poppy.

HARLOW: Yes, I think that's a fair and important question, actually to ask the former vice president.

Given what you just said about silence of Vice President Mike Pence, for a time being, he has now become more outspoken, as you know, saying what Trump did then was wrong. It was wrong then, it was wrong now, et cetera.

But I thought that Dana Bash, my colleague and friend asked him a really good question yesterday, when she said, do you wish you had spoken out sooner, that you've been more vocal that Trump was wrong on the election then? Because perhaps that would have prevented him from really solidifying this huge lead as the GOP frontrunner to be the president again, and I'll just ask you the same question. Do you wish that former Vice President had spoken out sooner on that?

KINZINGER: Absolutely. And not because I'm Adam's wife and what we had to endure, but as an American. He was our number two, we deserved his truth on January 7th of 2021.

He now makes it sound like he's been out there speaking about this a long time. Listen, we don't forget. He was absent for a long time. And this is where again, it becomes personal because there were two that were willing to fight for that truth, his truth.

The narrative out of the committee was that he acted heroically like I would like to know if he prefer that Jim Jordan was in the committee. Would that have been the narrative? I don't know. So yes, it's very unfair and very disappointing.

HARLOW: So it sounds like you're supportive of the actions that he took to uphold democracy, right, on the 6th of January, but you wanted to hear it. You wanted to hear the truth and those words spoken loudly right away.

KINZINGER: Well, our democracy was at stake, Poppy. This is where I like -- we're not talking about a policy that he went against the president. No, we're talking about our democracy and the right to vote.

I mean, both parties should be standing together saying when it comes to democracy, we crossed the line, like our democracy is untouchable. The fact that we are still playing with talking points and make this like a partisan thing when it's not, like shame on them.

HARLOW: Yes. All of this exposes have delicate a democracy this is.

Sofia Kinzinger, I really am -- I know it's not easy to come out and speak especially when you're not even working in the public sector anymore. I appreciate it. I'm sorry what your family has endured and I really think it's valuable for our viewers to hear from you, so thank you.

KINZINGER: Thank you, Poppy. Thank you.

HARLOW: Yes.

[08:25:07]

BLACKWELL: Such an important conversation when you hear those voicemails that she received.

HARLOW: I know.

BLACKWELL: Threatening her family.

HARLOW: And that's just a few of so many.

BLACKWELL: Yes, it went on for some time.

A home in Alaska collapses into the river after an unprecedented flooding event. We'll show you the shocking video.

HARLOW: Plus, thousands of Beyonce fans forced to shelter in place last night at a concert right outside of Washington, DC. Our very own Abby Phillip was there. She is going to join us next with what it was like.

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BLACKWELL: This morning, we have dramatic video that shows a house as it collapses and falls into a flooded river in Alaska. Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, there it goes. There it goes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: So this two-story home fell into the swollen Mendenhall River near the capitol of Juneau. Officials say, a glacial break caused the waters to rise and then the situation we know is still unstable.

At least two homes have been destroyed and the people there are being advised to of course, stay away from the riverbanks.

It turns out, not even Queen Bey herself yourself is safe from the extreme weather plaguing the United States. Folks at the Renaissance Concert, Beyonce there on the screen. Her world tour stop in Washington, DC last night had to shelter in place for hours as the storm delayed the show.

The stadium says a number of people were treated on site for heat exhaustion given the high temperatures and how packed people were in the concourse. One person was taken to the hospital.

HARLOW: Her performance was then paused as rain swept through FedEx Field. Her tour did cover the $100,000.00 it cost to keep the DC Metro running for an extra hour after the show, and our friend and CNN anchor, Abby Phillip was there at the show and she joins us now on the phone.

This is really dangerous. People were treated for heat exhaustion, super crowded, Abby. We are looking at these photos. What was it like to actually be there?

[08:30:26]