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At Least Two Dead After Powerful Storms Ravage East Coast; House Republicans Privately Saying it is a Foregone Conclusion Biden will Face Impeachment Inquiry in Fall; Trump Ally Bernie Kerik Meets with Special Counsel Investigators as Part of 2020 Election Probe. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired August 08, 2023 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: For fair contracts.

[07:00:01]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Polls open now in Ohio. Voters there deciding whether to make it harder to amend their state's Constitution. It's basically a proxy fight over abortion rights in a state that's part of it. Early voting turnout has been huge. More than half a million votes already cast.

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Let's get to the powerful storms ripping across the East Coast. They've been deadly. We know this morning at least two people have died, hundreds of thousands of people, though, waking up to power outages this morning.

That is a tree snapped in half in North Carolina, while Indiana residents are digging out after a tornado touched down there.

BLACKWELL: Maryland State Police say 47 people were rescued after being trapped in their vehicles for hours. Look at this. This is the people who were trapped between these power lines.

Today already, nearly 900 flights have been delayed, more than 300 canceled. Here is a look at long lines at Reagan National Airport. You can barely tell through the maze where the line starts and ends.

Meteorologist Derek Van Dam is in the Weather Center. It was just awful yesterday, still more coming today. But yesterday, just all across the country, people in bad shape.

DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes. Victor, Poppy, after yesterday's hurricane-force wind gusts and softball-sized hail that dropped from the sky, today is going to feel like a walk in the park, especially for the areas that were hit hardest across the Mid- Atlantic. But the severe weather threat is not over just yet. It's all part of the larger storm system that rocked the eastern sea board yesterday. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VAN DAM (voice over): With wind gusts estimated over 75 miles per hour, the impact was immediate.

In Mooresville, North Carolina, Tyson Winter captured this video of a tree snapping in half and falling to a ground near an apartment complex. Heavy rain, thunder and violent winds hammered cities and town east of the Mississippi River. By Monday night, there had been more than 400 reports of strong winds across the region. And more than a million customers were without power across 11 states, in states like North Carolina, Pennsylvania, Georgia and Maryland, according to poweroutage.us.

Monday's severe weather is impacting around 120 million people along the eastern U.S., from downed trees in Hartford County, Maryland, to widespread damage, to homes and public buildings Upstate New York all the down to Alabama, causing a lot of mess and spreading hazards along the way.

In Washington, D.C., CNN captured this video of a man removing a large branch from a city street. This photo shows downed power lines littering a roadway in Carroll County, Maryland, after a storm passed through the area. Another driver captured the chaos caused by those electric poles in Maryland's Route 140 in Westminster. Maryland State Police say more than 30 vehicles were stuck in the incident, but no injuries were reported.

In many parts, the storm caused extreme low visibility. In downtown Philadelphia, a live tower camera showed the magnitude of the weather conditions. In Victory Gardens, New Jersey, several residents displaced after a tree fell on a home, bringing down power lines and crashing cars. According to CNN-affiliate WABC, the house was occupied at the time but there were no injuries reported. The storms caused major travel disruptions in the skies on Monday.

According to data from FlightAware, more than 10,000 U.S. flights were impacted by the severe storms on Monday. Among them, over 8,500 flights were delayed and more than 1,700 canceled, all this as new weather threats are expected to develop for Tuesday afternoon with risk of severe thunderstorms in several southern states.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

VAN DAM (on camera): That's what 600 reports of severe weather looks like. And today's severe weather threat largely coming to an end along the eastern sea board. The only exception near the greater Boston area, but it's just too hot across the Deep South.

[07:05:00]

That's where we focus our attention, that and along with the central plains. That's our chance of large hail, damaging winds, can't rule out a tornado for those locations. But for the East Coast, we're in clean-up mode for the rest of the day. Victor, Poppy?

HARLOW: I appreciate it. Thanks for the reporting.

BLACKWELL: Behind the scenes on Capitol Hill, many House Republicans are saying privately that it is a fore gone conclusion that President Biden will face an impeachment inquiry this fall, that's according to our Manu Raju. Speaker Kevin McCarthy has been insistent to reporters a decision has not been made yet to open a form of inquiry and evidence is still being gathered. Here is what he said last night on Fox last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): I raised it on this show not long ago that because the actions of the Biden administration, withholding information, that that would rise to the level where we would need impeachment inquiry to give the strength of the Congress, to get the information that we need to give to the American public and follow through on our constitutional authority. That is exactly what we're doing and that's exactly what we'll continue to do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Manu Raju is live on Capitol Hill. Manu, good morning to you. What are you hearing on the Hill about this potential inquiry?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Even though Speaker McCarthy says that they have not made an official decision to launch an impeachment inquiry, the belief among Republicans that I have talked to, that my colleagues also have talked to, is that it is almost certain that they will go down this route in the fall because of what they believe is a pay-to-play scheme involving Joe Biden when vice president with his son Hunter Biden while -- Hunter Biden's business dealings.

Now, they have not been able to corroborate the very provocative claim but they have been able to show some allegations about Joe Biden's ties with his son, namely about that came out during a private interview last week with Hunter Biden's business partner showing that Joe Biden was on the speakerphone some 20 times with Hunter Biden and his foreign business partners back in the time when Joe Biden was vice president.

Now, that same business partner, Devon Archer, said that no business was actually discussed in those 20 or so interactions. But Republicans believe this is all underscores the effort by Hunter Biden to use his dad's name as leverage to try to score foreign business dealings. And Republicans say they're going to try to prove that Joe Biden was influenced in some way while by those actions and may have profited from them. But they have not come up with that evidence yet to -- that would be central to their inquiry.

Now, what they are saying is they need to launch an impeachment inquiry in order to obtain some of that very critical information that could be difficult to obtain unless they are in that aggressive posture, oversight posture with an impeachment inquiry. And leading part of that push is House Oversight Chairman James Comer, whose committee held that interview that Hunter Biden business partner last week and indicated to us over the weekend in Kentucky that more interviews were to come as they try to get more bank records to try to corroborate their claims.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES COMER (R-KY): This next week we will release more bank records. We'll do our third bank memo, where we show some interesting wire transfers and some suspicious bank activity that I think the American people will have a lot of questions about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

RAJU: Now, Republicans are also telling us that if they don't move forward with an impeachment inquiry in the fall, it will essentially clear Joe Biden of any potential wrongdoing. It could potentially boost him in the -- his run for re-election here.

Democrats believe this is all an effort to run interference for Donald Trump as he faces his own criminal charges and try to hurt Joe Biden even as they have yet to corroborate their most salacious allegations, the White House and Democrats pushing back on all of this. But Republicans expect a big fight and a big focus on this issue and potential impeachment inquiry this fall, guys.

HARLOW: But it puts McCarthy's members in districts that Biden won in quite a pickle. And does he have the votes to go forward with it?

BLACKWELL: Yes. That is the big question here because McCarthy, as we know, has a very narrow House majority. He can only afford to lose four Republican votes on any party line vote. And the way that it would probably work is there would be a vote to formally open up an impeachment inquiry. That means that that would be a first vote that would likely go along party lines. He cannot afford to lose more than four members in that vote. And then they have the investigation.

And then if they decide to go down that route, they would draft articles of impeachment to try to accuse the president of committing high crimes or misdemeanors in office, a very serious charge. Only three other presidents in history have gone -- have faced impeachment, Donald Trump, of course, was impeached twice by the House.

But in talking to some members in those swing districts, guys, they are not 100 percent there. One of them is Don Bacon of Nebraska, who told me yesterday he wants an investigation first before they go down that route. He's not begging an impeachment inquiry, but if they do go down that route, it will put those members in a tough spot. They have primaries to worry about back home, which is one reason why some Republicans believe ultimately they will impeach the president, because once they go down that road, it's hard to pull back.

[07:10:07]

BLACKWELL: Yes. It could also be a rallying cry for Democrats with the president suffering with some enthusiasm issues from his supporters.

Manu Raju for us on Capitol hill, thank you.

BLACKWELL: Great reporting, Manu.

Just hours from now Donald Trump is set to hit the campaign trail. He's facing a whirlwind of developments in the multiple criminal cases against him. He is going to speak today in New Hampshire where his defense team -- while his defense team battles with the special counsel, Jack Smith, in the election interference case.

And this developing overnight, the judge is preparing to schedule a hearing to decide whether to issue a protective order in that case. The special counsel is trying to block Trump from disclosing evidence to the public and potentially undermine the case before it even goes to trial.

Meantime in Atlanta, Georgia, there are signs indictments could be imminent for the alleged scheme to overturn Joe Biden's victory in that state. The state's lieutenant governor and CNN contributor, Geoff Duncan, you see him often on this program, we've learned he's been subpoenaed to testify to the Fulton County grand jury.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) GEOFF DUNCAN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I'm going to certainly keep the details to myself just to protect the integrity of the investigation. But very clear subpoena that was delivered to us late last week. And we will certainly answer the questions that they have before us and answer their call to show up for the grand jury.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Also the judge in the Mar-a-Lago classified documents case is adding a new wrinkle to this. She is questioning whether it's legal for the Justice Department to use that out of state grand jury in D.C. for this ongoing probe of documents.

BLACKWELL: Now as the judge in the election interference case weighs a decision, Jack Smith is still busy pursuing witnesses. CNN has learned that special counsel investigators met with Bernie Kerik yesterday.

Kerik, as you know, is the former disgraced New York City Police commissioner. He's close with Rudy Giuliani and coordinated with him in the weeks and months after the 2020 election. Here is what Kerik's attorney, Tim Parlatore, told CNN about the meeting.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TIM PARLATORE, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: It was mostly about, you know, all the efforts in between the election and January 6th of what the Giuliani team was doing and really just going through all of the efforts that they took at the time, to take all the complaints of fraud, see what they could do to chase him down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BLACKWELL: Well, Parlatore added that he does not think that Giuliani will be indicted.

Let's go now to CNN Senior Legal Analyst Elie Honig. Elie, lots of big questions here about this indictment, including what happens with Giuliani and the other unindicted co-conspirators.

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, Victor. We learn more information about this case every day, but three big questions to me persist. First of all, what will happen with the co-conspirators?

Now, in this indictment, Jack Smith identifies not by name but by abbreviations, C.C., co-conspirators one through six in the indictment, Rudy Giuliani, John Eastman, Sidney Powell, Jeffrey Clark, Kenneth Cheseboro, and we still don't know exactly who C.C. 6 is.

Now, the use of this term, co-conspirators, is really significant by prosecutors because you only use that term if you believe you can prove that these people were in on the crime and part of it. But the big question, of course, is will they be charged?

Now, we know, because we just heard from Tim Parlatore, who represents Bernie Kerik, the he went into the grand jury, he was questioned about co-conspirator 1, Rudy Giuliani. Parlatore says he doesn't think Rudy Giuliani is going to be charged. Tim knows this case better than I do, but I'm going to respectfully disagree with him on that. We will see.

One of the big questions, if Jack Smith does choose to indict any or all of these co-conspirators, does he include them, add them into the existing indictment against Donald Trump or does he bring a separate indictment? If it's my decision, I'm doing it separate. Because if you add them into the Donald Trump indictment, you are setting the stage for this thing to be pushed back and delayed. We know that's a continuing strategy of Donald Trump and his team to get it pushed back past the election.

So, what do these co-conspirators going to do? Are they going to be charged? Are they going to cooperate? We have got to watch and see.

BLACKWELL: Another mystery involves a person closest to the former president.

HONIG: Yes, International Man of Mystery, Mark Meadows.

BLACKWELL: Where has he been?

HONIG: Who knows where he is, Mark Meadows, former chief of staff to Donald Trump. We know where he was. He was by Donald Trump's side literally in the weeks and days leading up to January 6th, on January 6th and after.

Let's start with what we know for sure about Mark Meadows. Forget about the speculation for a moment. He has testified in the grand jury. If you look through the indictment, there are few, not many, but a few references to Mark Meadows. It doesn't say his name but says chief of staff. In one instance, he's told by people in Georgia there's no evidence of fraud here. And in another instance, Meadows sort of relays that back to Donald Trump, says, hey, our investigation here is not finding fraud.

That's not a problem for Mark Meadows. If anything, maybe that's good for Mark Meadows. However, there's another section of the indictment where Mark Meadows says, quote, we just need to have someone coordinating the electors for states. That refers to the fake elector scheme. That's going to be a problem for Mark Meadows.

So, what will become of him, will he flip, will he remain a witness in some capacity, or will he just sort of slide out of this.

[07:15:03]

BLACKWELL: Okay. And then, of course, the question you referenced earlier, when, the timing of it all.

HONIG: It's all about when. There is going to be a court appearance on August 28th in front of the judge. She likely will set a trial date. Let's take a quick look at 2024, because this is all important, the election is in November. There's no realistic way we'll have a trial this close to the election. I think we can safely write off October and September. We already have the hush money case scheduled to start in March. You can bet that's going to carry through April. We already have the Mar-a-Lago case scheduled to start in May. You can bet that will carry through July.

This January 6th case, Trump's team has said it's going to take nine months to try. I think that's high. Even if you cut it in half, there's not a four-month opportunity here to do it.

Now these can move. Let's keep in mind, trial dates are fluid. So, we've got to see, there's a lot of moving parts here.

BLACKWELL: Yes, certainly are. Elie, thanks for helping us understand it.

HONIG: All right. Thanks, Victor.

HARLOW: Let's talk about all this, CNN Senior Political Analyst and Anchor John Avlon is back with us and Politics Reporter at Semafor Shelby Talcott. Good morning, guys. Good to have you. Shelby, welcome to the table.

What do you make of what we just went through in terms of all of these head winds and the Justice Department's argument that, really, Trump should be very limited in his speech? They pointed to what Trump has put out there about Mike Pence. They actually pointed to the five interviews John Lauro, his lawyer, did on the Sunday morning shows as part of this.

SHELBY TALCOTT, POLITICS REPORTER, SEMAFOR: Yes. I don't think it's surprising the DOJ does not want this tried in the court of public opinion. They don't want the material that they give for discovery to be just widely given to the public, as it's not what it's intended to do. But I also think it's really important whatever -- however this decision ends up is really important for Trump's team because that's exactly what Trump's team wants to do.

You have seen every speech that Trump has done. He brings in the legal stuff. And his team will tell you, all of this is intertwined, the legal stuff, the campaign, it is all one in the same. And so Trump's team really wants to fight hard to keep being able to effectively say whatever they want regarding all of this.

HARLOW: They're sort of asking for a middle ground in terms of what their client should be able to say.

TALCOTT: Yes. But I think the middle ground that they're asking for is quite broad. And that's why the DOJ is pushing back on it. I mean, lawyers would probably know better, but that's just my read on the situation.

HONIG: So the cleverness of Trump's team response here is they've said, we propose that you keep sensitive information, not from us, but that we're not allowed to talk about, only sensitive information. Trump's team said, and we're going to let you, DOJ, tell us what you consider sensitive information. We may challenge that. But they're really sort of punting the ball in a way that I think is smart back to DOJ and say, you tell us what's sensitive and we'll agree that there could be limits on our ability to talk about that particular evidence.

BLACKWELL: Is he even going to follow the rule if it comes? Once he gets up on the stage at one of these rallies and he starts riffing about the anger that he has about the special counsel and the cases, is this something you expect Trump will even abide by?

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST AND ANCHOR: Why would anyone think he would abide by that?

BLACKWELL: I set you up.

AVLON: Right. I mean, let's just be real. This is the problem. This is the issue. When you put out a statement, you go after me, I go after you. There's a clear pattern of threats and intimidation being cored to Donald Trump's communication style that bleeds over into the legal avenues that we saw play out on January 6th itself in the attempt to intimidate people not to certify the election. So, that's why you have got to get real and take this off the dusty shelf and actually deal with the real world implications, which is what we're dealing with as a democracy.

BLACKWELL: All right. Right now, the polls are open in Ohio. Let's talk about this. Voters will decide whether they can still amend the state Constitution with just a simple majority. That's the way it's been since Millard Fillmore's presidency. But the Republican state house wants to change that by requiring amendments to get 60 percent of the vote, instead 50 percent plus one of the vote. Why now?

Well, one reason is access to abortion. That's one. It's not on the ballot today, but it will be in November. And raising the threshold will make it harder to pass an abortion rights amendment. Still some Republicans say this is about protecting the state from special interests.

But, if you think a summertime special election in an off-year with no candidates on the ballot would have a low voter turnout, look at these lines. More than a half million Ohioans have cast early ballots.

John, I give this back to you that this is about not just the special interest but abortion. Your view on what we're watching in Ohio.

AVLON: This is about direct democracy. This is about representative democracy. This is about majoritarian democracy.

Let's take a step back. In the redistricting system that the Republicans overrode, there was a ballot initiative passed just a few years ago that enshrined in the Constitution a balanced bipartisan representative redistricting system that was utterly ignored and basically a partisan power grab. That's also what played out with regard to this six-week abortion ban.

[07:20:01]

And this is an attempt to change the rules the middle of the game by Republicans in order to stave off an attempt to enshrine abortion rights in reaction to that bill passage. The larger backdrop is there's an attempt to overturn majoritarian democracy by partisan special interests. And that's why this demands national attention today.

BLACKWELL: You know, John, yes, for a long time leading up to this, what John brings up direct democracy, I mean, what Dobbs did overturning Roe versus Wade was, say, states. It's up to states. And people in states took action through direct democracy. And what this ballot initiative does, right, is it makes it a lot -- it's not just a simple majority vote change to 60 percent, it's also a change in how they can gather the votes on the ballot and the fact that they have to do it not in half the counties but in all 88 of them. So, it's a significant hurdle to make changes to the state Constitution.

TALCOTT: Yes, certainly. And I'll also note just more broadly as we're ramping up with 2024, the abortion issue in particular is hugely important, not just for Democrats but for Republicans. And we have seen Republicans really struggle on their messaging with the abortion issue for that exact reason because the country is so split on things. And there was overturn of Dobbs. And now there's the question is, well, what do we do now?

And so Republicans have not really figured out an easy solution that makes majority of the country happy. And so they're really struggling any time they get asked on this issue.

HONIG: You know, we knew this was going to be the post-Dobbs reality, and here we are a year and change out from it. But it hasn't quite played out exactly as we expected. Because I think the standing presumption was all the red states are going to say -- take away abortion rights.

HARLOW: They haven't all.

HONIG: They haven't, exactly. That's the point. But because of direct democracy, because of what we're talking about here, people have said, not so fast. We're not sure we're in on this. And that's one of the virtues of direct democracy.

AVLON: But the attempt to change those standards, to roll back direct democracy and majoritarian rule is a direct insult to the alleged, the states are going to figure it out for themselves impulse that Dobbs opened the door to. So, it's not that simple. It is an attempt to rig and push back direct democracy and majoritarian democracy.

HONIG: The states will figure it out but we may change the rules.

AVLON: If you change the rules, that's not the states figuring it out an even playing field.

HARLOW: Thank you, guys, really important discussion. We appreciate it. We'll watch Ohio very closely and tell you what happens.

New CNN reporting this morning also reveals that Ukraine's western allies are receiving increasingly sobering updates on Ukraine's counteroffensive.

BLACKWELL: Have you seen this video? It is all over social media, this brawl on the dock in Montgomery, Alabama. What we could hear from officials later today.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:25:00]

HARLOW: Overnight, two Russian missiles struck a city in Eastern Ukraine, killing seven people, injuring 80 others. Officials say those missile strikes happened within 30 to 40 minutes of one another. The second missile striking right as first responders arrived to help people.

There's also this new CNN reporting this morning on Ukraine's counteroffensive just weeks into it. Western officials tell our colleague, Jim Sciutto, they're concerned the assessment of the battle to regain territory is increasingly sobering.

Illinois Congressman Mike Quigley just recently returned from meetings in Europe with U.S. commanders training Ukrainian forces told CNN, quote, our briefings are sobering. We're reminded of the challenges they face. This is the most difficult time of the war.

Joining us now, retired Army Major Mike Lyons. Do you agree with Quigley's assessment? I mean, he was meeting with the people that are training the Ukrainians.

MAJOR MIKE LYONS (RET.), U.S. ARMY: Yes. So, it's two months to the day since the counteroffensive started. They've gained maybe ten square miles or so, not a lot. But, you know, attacking frontal fortifications reinforced by minefields without air superiority, not a lot of times in history you can show that's been successful.

I think we set the expectation high for what the Ukraine military can do but they're not fighting a combined arms fight. They're not fighting a counteroffensive the way that historically shown has been successful. Not their fault but they're doing the best they can. So, I'm glad to see we have got some sober reality with regard to the situation there.

BLACKWELL: Abrams tanks will be there in the fall. So, that will be obviously helpful. But as Jim's reporting that it's not about hardware, it's not about weapon support. So, how much can that help?

LYONS: You know, the Abrams tanks are going to get there at a time when the rainy season is going to start. And the way tanks are deployed effectively is when their used for shock effect. And if you're Russia, you're seeing where those tanks are going to go because that's exactly where the offensive priority is going to be at that time. And what you'll do is you'll move troops there to counterbalance them.

There're only 30 tanks or so showing up. They're not going to that much of a difference maker. There's huge logistical tooth to tail ratio that goes with those tanks. Will they make a difference? They're going to allow more Ukrainian crews to survive but those tanks still don't have any more capability to go through minefields or do other things.

So, again, without the combined arms, without the air superiority, I think this is still going to remain a stalemate.

HARLOW: There's a real question about what Ukraine is going to need from the U.S. in terms of additional funding, additional weapons, et cetera.

LYONS: Right.

HARLOW: And the U.S. public sentiment on it is changing. There is really striking reality in this new CNN polling. What it shows is that a majority of Americans disapprove of another support package for Ukraine. 45 percent approve it. Should Congress authorize more funding to Ukraine? 55 percent oppose it.

LYONS: Yes. This is what Vladimir Putin wants to happen if he hangs on to this land that he has right now that he seized illegally, get to the fall and then winter. We're now into next spring here and our political season presidential election is running. Who knows what the politicians will say because that's really what -- you know, where the money will come from.

The Ukraine government needs a commitment from NATO, from the United States, saying, we're all in for however long it takes. The problem is that doesn't jive with our political cycles here and the United States leads the way with all these economic packages as well as the military packages. So, that's what Putin is hoping that will happen that we'll lose interest.

BLACKWELL: So, you're saying if the U.S. fails to authorize further funding, you think western allies will follow?

LYONS: I'm not sure the western allies have the capability and capacity to make the difference that Ukraine is going to need in order to sustain itself.

[07:30:00]

They need Patriot missiles. They need things that only come from the United States and U.S. defense contractor. And you can't crank that machine up quick enough to get some of that material there at the time. Look at the tanks.