Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

Today, Zelenskyy Set to Visit Capitol Hill Amid Shutdown Chaos and Growing Republican Opposition to Ukraine Aid; CNN Poll Shows Trump Leads in New Hampshire as Gov. Ron DeSantis (R-FL) Stumbles; Garland Clashes With House GOP in Judiciary Committee Hearing. Aired 7-7:30a ET

Aired September 21, 2023 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:00:00]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Maybe some good news out of Hollywood in Money This Morning. There appears to be real optimism about progress to maybe ending the Hollywood writers strike. Writers and heads of four major studios will meet for a second consecutive day today.

A person familiar with the talks tells CNN yesterday attendees left the meeting feeling encouraged. The deadline is nearing for both sides to try to hammer out this deal if they want to salvage the winter portion of a new television season.

The economic toll for the writers and the act of strike is staggering. It's approaching $6 billion.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: When both sides are saying nothing, usually a good sign. We've got a lot more on that and so much other news.

CNN This Morning continues right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Russian missiles rain down on Kyiv as President Zelenskyy is in Washington to meet with lawmakers on Capitol Hill.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They're going to need to look to Democrats to try to fund the government.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We will stand with Ukraine as long as they meet us.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Republicans grilling the attorney general. Some of them couldn't seem to get their facts straight.

REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): He picks the one guy he knows will protect Joe Biden.

REP. PRAMILA JAYAPAL (D-WA): That's about a soapbox for these baseless conspiracy theories. MERRICK GARLAND, ATTORNEY GENERAL: I have intentionally not involved myself. I'm trying to pursue my responsibility.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: A new fight for number two, and it is not Governor Ron DeSantis.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Haley, Ramaswamy and Christie have doubled their numbers in New Hampshire.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ron DeSantis is dropping like a rock in the Granite State.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anybody but Trump has to figure out, is there some other way?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Good morning, everyone. Happy Thursday. We're so glad you're with us.

Maybe it's not over. The polling, the race, it's interesting. It's not a done deal.

MATTINGLY: There's also I think the issues we were talking about earlier in the week, particularly on abortion, perhaps giving some of the others in the Republican primary some grounds to make some headway, particularly in Iowa, for Ron DeSantis, probably not in New Hampshire, based on the most recent polling, but also focus here at home, a huge day in Washington, and it connects directly to the war in Ukraine.

HARLOW: That's exactly right. And let's tell you this morning what is happening as we speak in Ukraine. Russia is unleashing a barrage of missiles on Kyiv and other cities across the country, as Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy gets ready to meet with Congress today and also President Biden in Washington. The widespread strikes come just hours before Zelenskyy heads the Capitol Hill to plead for more aid and weapons.

MATTINGLY: His visit comes at what could be generously called a very turbulent time, a government shutdown looming, House Republicans in chaos and a growing number of them completely opposed to more aid for Ukraine.

Two hours from now, Zelenskyy is set to make his case to House lawmakers in a closed-door meeting. After that, he's meeting with the entire U.S. Senate. Then, he'll stop by the Pentagon before heading to the White House for talks with President Biden.

Let's start with CNN Congressional Correspondent Lauren Fox. Lauren, House Republicans are not exactly open-arm welcoming President Zelenskyy. What's the expectation for what today may bring?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, this is a second visit for Zelenskyy, Phil, in less than a year, and it looks so different than what he saw last year when he was at the U.S. Capitol, when Democrats were in control of that chamber. There was a joint meeting of Congress, and he had an opportunity really to see a sea of yellow and blue on the floor of the House, as members were standing behind him.

Now, he is facing a new speaker who is facing his own rebellion on the right and is struggling to keep his conference together as he tries to fund the government. And right now, there is not an appetite among Republican hardliners to give Ukraine more aid.

That is what Zelenskyy is up against this morning when he walks into a bipartisan meeting with House leaders and committee chairman as he tries to make his case. He will not have an opportunity to meet with the full Republican House of Representatives, where he might be able to argue for more money with members like Byron Donalds. Here he is.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. BYRON DONALDS (R-FL): The first thing I'll tell you is there's no money in the House right now for Ukraine.

It's not a good time for him to be here, quite frankly. That's just the reality.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOX: The picture in the Senate, Phil, is going to look very different.

[07:05:02]

There's a bipartisan meeting with all members of the U.S. Senate invited and leadership. That is a place where Ukraine funding has been front and center, as Majority Leader Chuck Schumer has made clear he thinks additional money for Ukraine should be included even on a short-term spending bill.

So, that just gives you a sense of the dichotomy here that's happening on Capitol Hill between not even just Republican and Democrats but also for Republican leaders in the House and Senate.

MATTINGLY: Yes, such a dramatically different environment from last year when Zelenskyy was here.

Lauren, I do have to ask, Republicans have been trying to figure out in the House how to find a path forward on that stop gap bill, Kevin McCarthy saying that they've been making progress. Define progress for me, Lauren.

FOX: Well, there's some good news and bad news. McCarthy unveiled a new plan to fund the government for just a month at a time. But one of the issues he's facing is conservative backlash. Once again, you have people like Tim Burchett saying that there are a number of House Republicans who are never going to get to yes on a short-term spending bill.

And last night, there was the added development of former President Donald Trump, who still has a strong grip on the Republican Party, coming out against that plan for the short-term C.R. So, a very complicated picture for the speaker this morning as he wakes up, again, ready for that meeting with Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

MATTINGLY: A new plan that is dead on arrival in the United States Senate wouldn't be signed by President Biden and may not have the votes in the House Republican Conference. Lauren Fox keeping me busy. Thank you.

HARLOW: So, also this morning, The Wall Street Journal Editorial Board describing this fight amongst Republicans in the conference as a, quote, circular firing squad, one that threatens to lose McCarthy both the funding battle that he wants to win, and, by the way, the speaker's gavel, perhaps. Here is how Tennessee Republican Congressman Tim Burchett describes it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. TIM BURCHETT (R-TN): We're dysfunctional.

REPORTER: It's just that simple?

BURCHETT: That simple, we are so dysfunctional. When we got nobody at the head, you know, I've said this train has left the station.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Joining us now, Republican Congressman from New York Anthony D'Esposito. It's nice to have you, Congressman. Good morning.

REP. ANTHONY D'ESPOSITO (R-NY): Good morning. How are you?

HARLOW: I'm well, thank you.

I want to read you a little bit more from this "Wall Street Journal" Editorial Board, because it's striking that it's in "The Wall Street Journal," quote, "Hakeem Jeffries probably can't believe his luck as House Minority Leader for less than a year, he gets to watch the Republican majority implode without having to do a thing." Are they right?

D'ESPOSITO: I have to disagree. I mean, listen, is there issues that we're facing here? Absolutely. And as any family faces discrepancies, and perhaps the circular firing squad is a little dramatic.

But what I do believe is over the last 48 hours, I think as young children when we're playing in the playground, we sort of go with people who we are friendly with and we make connections. And I think over the last 48 hours, it's given us a lot of us the opportunity to go outside of our comfort zone and have conversations with different people throughout the country to understand what they believe in, what they're fighting for and come to some sort of consensus to move forward for the American people.

HARLOW: But shouldn't, Congressman, the American people expect more than what little children do in the playground? D'ESPOSITO: What I'm trying to say is that over the last 48 hours, we've had a real opportunity to talk to one another to explain to each other how we represent our districts, what matters to us and get to a consensus. And I think yesterday we had a conference meeting that lasted a few hours long, we all spoke and talked about things that mattered most to us. And I think today is a new day on Capitol Hill, and I think that we're going to move forward.

HARLOW: Fair enough, it's a new day, the sun is up. You got nine days left. What came out of that conference is this proposal by McCarthy which, by the way, is going nowhere in the Senate, but I want to know if you support it, that is spending levels, keep the government open for 30 days at $1.47 trillion spending levels, nothing for Ukraine in there. You support that, you'd be a yes on that?

D'ESPOSITO: Well, there's a couple proposals and one more that we're going to discuss this morning. The bipartisan group to Problem Solvers Caucus came up with a plan to really meet the numbers of the Fiscal Responsibility Act as well as include funding in there that the president asked for for Ukraine, but while including checks and balances, which I think is super important. We don't -- many of us don't mind supporting our allies, but we want to make sure that we know where the funding is going, what it's being used for, and that's included in this plan.

So, I'm hoping that this morning more conversations are had we can you know take the people who are using or committing policy warfare and make sure that we move things forward and today, again, is a new day and I think that we are going to make progress.

HARLOW: Okay. Well, that's good news. Can I ask you just one point that your former Republican colleague in Congress, Adam Kinzinger, said on CNN last night, and I want to know -- you've been a supporter, you know, more funding for Ukraine. He said, quote, my concern is the moderate wing of the party, which I think you would be part of, is seeming to capitulate on the issue of Ukraine funding.

[07:10:03]

That's something I don't understand. I don't know why they're doing that. They have to start playing hardball against the freedom club. Do you agree, time for hardball?

D'ESPOSITO: I do think -- I think that it is time for hardball. But I think that there are a couple of ways to play hardball. And I think by having real conversations, by letting them know exactly how we feel, what matters to our districts and what we're going to stand for, like we've done over the last 48 hours, we're beginning to play hardball. And I think that, like I said, we're going to move things forward today.

HARLOW: All right. So, I do want to -- obviously, you represent part of New York. I want to ask you about the migrant crisis that has so been impacting New York, particularly right here where I am in New York City, more than 100,000 migrants arriving here. You know what Mayor Adams has said about that. I mean, he's even said that this crisis could destroy the city, critical of the Biden administration for not giving more aid for them to deal with this.

Overnight, the Biden administration did do something on this front, and that is giving this temporary protected status to almost 500,000 more Venezuelan migrants in the U.S. That's going to allow them to build work here more quickly and allow them and shield them from being deported.

Here's how the governor of New York, Kathy Hochul, explained it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. KATHY HOCHUL (D-NY): You have to be certain that you're not going to take -- support of policy that's going to draw more people, because places like New York really are at capacity.

I thank the president for having a limit. This is for people who came before July 31st. So, it's not an enticement for more to come after.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Do you believe that balance was achieved? Was this a good move, in your mind, by the Biden administration?

D'ESPOSITO: No, I don't think it was a good move. And I think individuals like Kathy Hochul are so far disconnected from reality. She's just trying to pander to the president while understanding that the voters of New York, even those in New York City, which is a predominantly Democratic community, are sick and tired of it.

And we had a hearing yesterday in Homeland Security. It's estimated that this year, New York City is going to spend $4 billion, with B, on housing migrants and we're looking at 2024.

HARLOW: No, I hear you, Congressman. I hear you. And I'm not asking you -- this is certainly not a panacea. But what I'm asking you is, is this one step in the right direction for some of those migrants coming to the city to be able to work, et cetera? You wholesale think this shouldn't have happened?

D'ESPOSITO: I do. I think that the individuals that are coming to the city right now do have the ability to work, and we don't need more and more. I rarely agree with the governor, but we are at capacity. And like the mayor of the city of New York said, who welcomed, the sanctuary city, but had no plan in place, this could destroy New York City.

HARLOW: Okay. Congressman, we hope the new day bodes well for funding the government. Thank you very much for joining us.

D'ESPOSITO: Be well.

HARLOW: Be well.

MATTINGLY: Well, alarm bells this morning, maybe ringing for Ron DeSantis' campaign and the crucial early primary state of New Hampshire, a new CNN poll shows him slipping behind his GOP rivals. Plus --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: And what happens if Donald Trump comes back? We saw the --

AL GORE, FORMER U.S. VICE PRESIDENT: I'm not even going to speculate on that.

AMANPOUR: On climate, or somebody like him with those views?

GORE: I don't like to speculate on that for the same reason I don't like to watch horror movies.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Pretty clear there, Christiane Amampour interviewing former Vice President Al Gore and getting his take on Donald Trump potentially winning again.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:15:00]

HARLOW: That is one beautiful sunrise in Miami this morning, but things not looking so sunny for Governor Ron DeSantis and his White House hopes. In this race, Ron DeSantis' campaign appears to be on life support, at least in the state of New Hampshire. Look at this new CNN poll. DeSantis has plummeted to fifth place. He has shed 13 points since July, down 32 since the beginning of the year. Donald Trump still leading the field, he has 39 percent of support among likely Republican voters.

Much more on this what I find it to be a totally fascinating poll, some really good for some folks and some really not good for people like Ron DeSantis. What's going on in New Hampshire?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: I mean, yes, I think you had hit it exactly right.

If you're Donald Trump, you love this result, right? What a surprise, Donald Trump still well ahead in the Republican race at 39 percent. If you're Vivek Ramaswamy, you'll love this result. He's up eight points since July. If you're Nikki Haley, you'll love this result. She's up seven points since July. If you're Chris Christie, you'll love this poll because you're up five points. Ron DeSantis, you hate this poll because you're down 13 points since July and now we have a clown car essentially for second place. There's Ramaswamy, Haley, Christie and DeSantis all basically tied for second place with Donald Trump well ahead.

But, really, as you were pointing out, Poppy, a big story in this poll is Ron DeSantis' fall. Look at how much -- this has just been a considerable drop for him since January. We see this -- look, in January, he is at 42. April 22, June 23 and now in September, he's at just 10 percent of the vote. He literally has less than a quarter of the share of the Republican primary vote at this point than he did at the beginning of the year when he led Donald Trump.

HARLOW: Talking about Trump, yes, he has a lead. It's a little more slim now, I mean, still 39 points, but where it was. And what I found interesting when you dig into Phil's favorite part, the crosstabs, (INAUDIBLE), he's at the desk.

ENTEN: He's somewhere.

HARLOW: The crosstabs, it also talks about how open some of these voters are to other people, meaning their mind isn't necessarily locked.

ENTEN: Yes. You know, if you were going to pick one place in my mind where I think Donald Trump may, in fact, lose a primary, it is the state of New Hampshire. Why is that? Take a look at the polling in New Hampshire and compare that to the other states and also nationally. And what we see is, nationally, Donald Trump is at 57 percent, South Carolina, 46 percent, Iowa, 46 percent, New Hampshire at 39 percent. It's, in fact, his weakest state and it's also the state where the alternative seemed to be switching around, and that is because the Trump vote is locked in, but the fact is the other voters are far more likely to switch around there, perhaps waiting for an alternative.

And let me throw you a historical example of a time in which we had --

HARLOW: Like you always do so well.

ENTEN: I try to do it so well. Go all the way back to 1999. What did we see at this point? We saw a George W. Bush with a 30-point lead over Dole and a 32-point lead over John McCain. Who won that primary? It was John McCain by 19 points.

[07:20:02]

So, the fact is Granite state voters like to throw some curveballs, and at this point, Bush looks like Trump, we will see if McCain ends up --

HARLOW: Same point in the primary?

ENTEN: Same point in the primary in September of '99.

HARLOW: That's really intereating.

ENTEN: It's not over until it's over.

HARLOW: Thank you very much.

ENTEN: Thank you.

HARLOW: Hey, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Hey, Poppy. Over here, crosstabs, right there, in the heart. I appreciate it. Well, from the campaign trail to the Capitol, a very combative hearing. House Republicans grilled Attorney General Merrick Garland in what could be a preview of President Biden's upcoming impeachment inquiry. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): The fix is in. Even with the face-saving indictment last week of Hunter Biden, everyone knows the fix is in.

MERRICK GARLAND, ATTORNEY GENERAL: I'm going to say again, I'm going to say again and again, if necessary, I did not interfere with, did not investigate, did not do determinations --

REP. DAN BISHOP (R-NC): Those are statements in response to other questions. Everybody in the country now knows who's paying attention to this, that the Justice Department permitted statute of limitations to expire.

JORDAN: Who decided? The White House decided.

GARLAND: Mr. Weiss --

JORDAN: They serve at the pleasure of the president, right?

GARLAND: Mr. Weiss was --

JORDAN: Joe Biden decided to keep David Weiss as U.S. Attorney. You weren't sworn in until March.

REP. MATT GAETZ (R-FL): Doesn't it look weird that he's become this immediate success in the art world as his dad as president of the United States? Isn't that odd?

GARLAND: I'm not going to comment about any specific --

GAETZ: Not going to comment, not going to investigate. So --

REP. THOMAS MASSIE (R-KY): we are the committee that is responsible for your creation, for your existence of your department. You cannot continue to give us these answers. Aren't you, in fact, in contempt of Congress when you refuse to answer?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Let's dig in on what was a very testy hearing, as it was expected to be. CNN Senior Legal Analyst Elie Honig is with us.

The fiery exchanges kind of -- we'll put them aside and actually what happened that was tangible. I want to start not with Hunter Biden, but actually with the indictments of Donald Trump, Special Counsel Jack Smith. What did we learn?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Yes. So, the attorney general was emphatic. Joe Biden, he testified, had nothing, whatsoever, to do with the indictments of Donald Trump or with any criminal indictment under DOJ's purview.

Let's take a quick listen to what Merrick Garland said on that count.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARLAND: I reaffirm today, I am not the president's lawyer. I will add, I am not Congress' prosecutor.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HONIG: Yes, I am not the president's lawyer. This is an age-old value of DOJ under administrations of both parties going back generations.

Now, here are the facts. Of course, the president appoints the attorney general, who was then confirmed by the Senate, 70 to 30, by the way, in Merrick Garland's case, with substantial Republican support.

Merrick Garland, then appointed about a year-and-a-half after he became attorney general, appointed Jack Smith as special counsel. Merrick Garland made clear there is that historical wall of separation between the president and DOJ. Garland even said the decision to charge Donald Trump was not even mine. That was Jack Smith. So, there's another wall of separation here. No evidence whatsoever to indicate any involvement by Joe Biden in those indictments of Donald Trump.

MATTINGLY: So that's one key piece. The second obviously is very telegraphed, the focus on Hunter Biden, the investigation and the indictment of Hunter Biden as well. What did we learn though? Is there anything new that stood out to you?

HONIG: So, Merrick Garland struggled with this. I think there is more questions than answers provided yesterday about the Hunter Biden prosecution. The one thing Merrick Garland did stress was that the person running this case is David Weiss, who was a U.S. attorney and has now become a special counsel. As Merrick Garland stressed several times, he was nominated by Donald Trump and Merrick Garland stressed that I, Merrick Garland, the attorney general, have not had direct involvement in this case. This has been the purview of David Weiss.

Let's take a quick listen to how Merrick Garland described that in his testimony.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GARLAND: I have intentionally not involved myself in the facts of the case, not because I'm trying to get out of responsibility but because I'm trying to pursue my responsibility.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HONIG: So, Garland made clear this was not my decision, but there are certain questions, important questions that remain. Why was David Weiss made special counsel five years into the investigation? What necessitated that? And why was DOJ willing to go into court about two months ago and take a plea to a misdemeanor for probation? That clearly has changed now. Those questions linger, Jim Jordan will continue to press them.

MATTINGLY: All of this happening as the impeachment inquiry ramps up. First hearing is expected to be next week. Is there anything in this hearing that lays the groundwork for what Republicans may pursue?

HONIG: I think this was a preview of what we're going to see next week. Speaker McCarthy, Jim Jordan, they're going to have a lot of questions for DOJ. DOJ traditionally will not disclose evidence about ongoing cases. What they can do is issue a subpoena. DOJ is going to defy that.

If DOJ defies that, watch for the House to try to hold DOJ, maybe the attorney general, in contempt. But, ultimately, Phil, that's a symbolic gesture. Because if there's a contempt finding by Congress, guess where it goes for prosecution? Right back here, they're not going to prosecute their own attorney general.

MATTINGLY: It sounds very familiar to last impeachment, or sorry, the first impeachment of former President Trump, where we saw this entire dynamic play out.

[07:25:04]

HONIG: But Bill Barr was held in contempt, of course, not charged. Eric Holder was held in contempt, of course, not charged. We may see it again.

MATTINGLY: Yes, that's a great point. Elie Honig, thank you. Poppy?

HARLOW: Thank you both very much.

Meantime, Russia bombarding Kiev just before Ukraine's president heads to Capitol Hill, trying to convince Republicans for more aid. Christiane Amanpour at the table, next.

MATTINGLY: And new this morning, there appears to be real optimism toward ending the months-long writer strike. The latest on those late night negotiations, that's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTINGLY: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy will be in Washington today trying to secure continued U.S. military assistance.

Now, a little more than a year ago, Zelenskyy addressed a joint session of Congress and was met with loud applause from both sides of the aisle followed by several rounds of funding from Congress and the White House. But now our speaker Kevin McCarthy has not invited Zelenskyy to address a joint session, though, the two will meet behind closed doors.

Here is what McCarthy said this week about Zelenskyy versus what he said in March of last year.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[07:30:00]

REP. KEVIN MCCARTHY (R-CA): This is an unwarranted war that they did not ask for, but they're willing to defend the right of freedom.