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House Paralyzed as Jordan & Scalise Jump Into Speaker Race; Biden Administration to Build Stretch of Border Wall in South Texas; New York Attorney General to Trump: 'I Will Not Be Bullied'; Senator's Wife Killed Pedestrian in Crash Listed in Indictment. Aired 6-6:30a ET

Aired October 05, 2023 - 06:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:00:30]

POPPY HARLOW: Good morning, everyone. So glad you are with us. Hope you had a good evening. Got a lot of big news to get to this morning.

Let's start with "Five Things to Know" for this Thursday, October 5.

The Biden administration gets ready to build a border wall. That's right. The Biden administration getting ready to build a border wall, waiving 26 federal laws to do so in South Texas. The homeland security secretary says there is a, quote, "acute and immediate need."

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: And the fight for House speaker is heating up as new questions arise about what, if anything, should happen to the eight rebel Republicans who voted to oust Kevin McCarthy.

Also, Senator Bob Menendez' wife killed a pedestrian in a 2018 car crash. We have new video of the incident referenced in the federal indictment against the couple.

HARLOW: And Commander Biden has bit more people than previously known. One person even had to be hospitalized.

MATTINGLY: And Simon Biles leads Team USA into the record books. They won gold with their seventh consecutive team title at the world championships.

CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.

Good morning, everyone. We are back from Washington. We did not figure out who the next speaker is going to be, which isn't a lack of reporting. It's because no one in the House knows who the next speaker is going to be either.

HARLOW: That's right.

MATTINGLY: Paralysis is a pretty fair word at this point.

HARLOW: Yes. MATTINGLY: But the battle to become the next speaker very well under way as the House is still trying to figure out what, if anything, they can actually do with just weeks left to prevent a government shutdown.

Top Republicans Jim Jordan and Steve Scalise have officially jumped into the race. And we're keeping a close watch to see if anybody else hops in anytime soon.

Whoever the House Republican Party picks, it could have huge implications, from Ukraine aid to the looming shutdown. The future speaker will face the same exact dilemmas that doomed Kevin McCarthy and plunged the House into chaos.

The candidates have some tough questions to answer. Will they work with Democrats to prevent a shutdown next month, or will they dig in for battle? Will they support more aid for Ukraine? It's been a major sticking point for Republican hard-liners.

HARLOW: Also, will they change that rule that allowed that small handful of Republicans to oust McCarthy? And will they punish the eight Republican rebels who voted to do so?

Congresswoman Nancy Mace says she's already facing harsh backlash and retribution. She talked about serious threats to her fundraising for voting out McCarthy. Last night on CNN, she had this message for speaker candidates.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. NANCY MACE (R-SC): The eight of us that voted this way, I mean, if you want to have the gavel, if you want to move forward united, you're going to need our votes. And I think if we look backward and punish people based on their principles, that's only going to further divide our conference.

We have a lot of work to do. We promised the American people we would deliver results, and we need to do that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: CNN Congressional correspondent Lauren Fox is live on Capitol Hill.

All right. We have two candidates. They're kind of the two premier candidates within the conference. I didn't get a sense yesterday that anyone was anywhere close to 218, the votes needed to actually become speaker. Where do things stand?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Phil. The answer that I'm getting from talking to sources and members who are still getting calls from these candidates is that nobody has 218 right now, and that is part of the problem. That is part of the challenge that these two men who have entered the race are going to have to deal with.

The reality is, the same problems Kevin McCarthy had ware going to befall the next speaker, as well.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FOX (voice-over): Anger and raw nerves plaguing the House GOP after the historic vote to oust former Speaker Kevin McCarthy.

REP. DUSTY JOHNSON (R-SD): I'm not surprised. Tensions and tempers have been running pretty high for the last nine months.

FOX (voice-over): Allies of McCarthy are seeking retribution from the eight Republican rebels who voted against him.

REP. GARRET GRAVES (D-LA): I think it was done for narcissistic, for selfish reasons, for fund-raising reasons.

FOX (voice-over): They delivered a not-so-veiled threat to cease all fund-raising for Republican Representative Nancy Mace ahead of the vote. In return, Mace says she's fund-raising off her decision to sink McCarthy.

MACE: I'm taking it from all sides right now. And because of the threats that I've been receiving over the last couple of weeks, it finally reached a point last night where I was, like, You know what? I'm going let people that need -- know that I need help.

[06:05:07]

FOX (voice-over): Now, some are even threatening to try and have them removed from the Republican conference.

REP. DAVID JOYCE (R-OH): I don't see how they can really be part of a conference when they stand on the -- they come on the inside, listen to what's going on, and then go outside and lob bombs in the middle.

REP. KEN BUCK (R-CO), VOTED TO OUST SPEAKER MCCARTHY: The very people who are blaming the eight who voted against Kevin McCarthy are the same people who have held up this process so that we don't get to the point where we pass a budget, pass appropriations bills, and deal with the -- the huge spending.

FOX (voice-over): McCarthy, too, is seeking revenge against Democrats for not throwing him a lifeline during the vote.

Two Republican sources tell CNN he was behind the move to kick former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi and former Majority Leader Steny Hoyer out of their unofficial office spaces near the House floor.

REP. JIM MCGOVERN (D-MA): Rather than, you know, being petty and silly, you know, and throwing Nancy Pelosi out of her office, I mean, how does that contribute to civility up here?

FOX (voice-over): Even though Republicans are bitterly divided, the race to elect the next speaker is in full swing.

Two leading contenders for the role are emerging, including House Republican majority leader Steve Scalise and Representative Jim Jordan.

Scalise was shot in 2017 at a baseball practice ahead of a Congressional charity game that left him in critical condition. In August, Scalise revealed he was diagnosed with blood cancer.

REP. CHIP ROY (R-TX): Leader Scalise, he's a good friend. I've had great conversations with him, Jim, Kevin, other people. We're -- we're working hard. We're going to unite.

FOX (voice-over): House Judiciary Committee Jim Jordan was one of the co-founders of the conservative Freedom Caucus and is a close ally of former President Trump.

REP. JIM JORDAN (R-OH): I think we're a conserve center-right party. I think I'm the guy who can help unite that.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FOX: And the interim speaker, the guy holding who is the job right now, Patrick McHenry, I'm told he has been meeting with members from all corners of the Republican conference over the last 24 hours, trying to figure out the best way to have the speaker's race, the best way for Republicans to emerge from that race united at a time when all the focus has been on the GOP disarray -- Phil, Poppy.

MATTINGLY: All right. Lauren Fox. Busy days ahead. Thank you.

HARLOW: Also new this morning, a headline you might not have expected. The Biden administration is waiving 26 federal laws in order to build a border wall in South Texas.

This is a move that was used frequently by the Trump White House, as that administration built 52 miles of new border barriers and repaired about 450 miles of it.

Vut a reminder. Here's what then-candidate Biden said about a border wall in 2020.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: There will not be another foot of wall constructed on my administration.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That was then. This is now, and the homeland security secretary says there is a "acute and immediate need to construct physical barriers near the border to prevent unlawful entries."

This is happening in Starr County, where there have been nearly a quarter of a million illegal entries this fiscal year, according to government data.

MATTINGLY: This move comes as we're getting a fresh look at the realities on the border. New video from outside El Paso shows migrants running and cheering as they cross the border, in spite of increased security.

Of course, New York City Mayor Eric Adams is now on the ground in Mexico. He says he's trying to understand the origins of the crisis as hundreds of migrants are being bused daily to his city.

Let's get straight to CNN's Priscilla Alvarez. She's live at the White House for us.

Priscilla, what prompted this move, which seems to be diametrically opposed to where candidate Biden was?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: This really boils down to money that Congress has appropriated for border barriers. And that is what the homeland security secretary says in this notice.

They have to use these 2019 funds for that purpose, and they're going to focus it on an area that is highly trafficked, and that is an area of the Rio Grande valley sector where as you mention there have been nearly 300,000 encounters dating back to last October through August.

Now, they are also going to waive 26 laws to do this. That is something that the Trump administration also did. It's a way that the administration will be able to build these in an expedited manner.

And the U.S. Customs and Border Protection had previously announced last month they were going to do something along these lines, and that they would seek public input. That it would be up to 20 miles of new border barrier system. And that it would include, in addition to those border barriers light poles, lighting, gates, cameras.

But of course, this is something that Democrats have repeatedly said is not necessary. In fact, Congressman Henry Cuellar said a border wall is a 14th century solution to a 21st century problem, going on to say it will not bolster border security in Starr County.

[06:10:01]

And when you talk to administration officials, they'll also say they want to focus, instead, on border security technology, versus the barriers themselves.

But in this case, they're also in a position where they have to use these funds for what they were initially intended.

And of course, Phil and Poppy, as we have covered, there is an uptick of border crossings on the U.S.-Mexico border. This is of concern to officials that I have been speaking with.

And this week, Secretary of State Antony Blinken, Homeland Security Mayorkas, and Attorney General Merrick Garland are in Mexico for annual security talks, where migration is expected to come up.

HARLOW: Yes. It just shows the focus, the fact that a Democratic administration is waiving things like the Clean Air Act, the Safe Drinking Water Act, the Endangered Species Act, and using money appropriated during the Trump administration to do this, shows sort of the level of the crisis.

Priscilla, before you go, can you talk about what Biden is saying, the president, while the House is speakerless? There is a big push on what does this mean for Ukraine funding?

ALVAREZ: We heard directly from the president yesterday, where he conceded that he is worried. But he also made the point that there is support for Ukraine among Republicans and Democrats.

Now, of course, as we're seeing this leader race unfold, we're also getting a sense of who would support this type of aid package. For example, Jim Jordan has announced that he's going to run for speaker, but has also said clearly that he would oppose Ukraine aid.

So the president is really trying to make the point that this is still a priority. It is important. It is something that will be talked about with his national security team today, and that he will eventually be making a speech on. It is not expected this week, but it just underscores that this is still very important to the White House.

We should also know that the president convened a call with allies this week to reassure them that the U.S. Still supports Ukraine in all of this. So this is still an unfolding story, and officials are keenly aware they could run out of funding and that the House speaker that is chosen is going to play a big role in getting more of it.

HARLOW: Of course. Priscilla Alvarez, thank you for the reporting on both fronts.

MATTINGLY: There's more trouble for President Biden's dog Commander. The White House says he's involved in more biting incidents than previously reported. We're going to have brand-new CNN reporting ahead.

HARLOW: And new revelations about the wife of Senator Bob Menendez, who is facing already federal bribery charges. A prosecutor is now zeroing in on a 2018 incident where she killed a pedestrian with her car. The newly-released surveillance video, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:16:05]

HARLOW: An update now on that mass shooting at Morgan State. The manhunt for the suspect has intensified overnight.

Baltimore Police releasing new surveillance video taken near Tuesday's shooting scene that injured five people, four of them students.

This all happened during homecoming week. Police have not said who these four people are or why they are wanted, but they did release a statement.

Quote, "Detectives need your help identifying these individuals that were seen in the area." Officials say that four victims do remain in stable condition in the

hospital. One has been released. Classes canceled for the rest of the week. All homecoming activities including the football game also canceled or postponed. We'll keep you posted.

MATTINGLY: Later in New York, Donald Trump is not expected to appear at his New York fraud trial today after spending the first three days in court. He actually flew back to Florida yesterday, but not before he once again attacked the judge and New York attorney general Letitia James. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The judge already knows what he's going to do. He's a Democrat judge. I'm stuck here, because I have a corrupt attorney general that communicates with the DOJ in Washington to keep me nice and busy.

You borrow money, you pay it back, and you get sued by a political animal.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: The attorney general of New York, Letitia James, responded to that this way.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LETITIA JAMES, NEW YORK ATTORNEY GENERAL: What they were, were comments that unfortunately fomented violence; comments that you would describe as race baiting; comments, unfortunately, that appeals to the bottom of our humanity. And I will not sit idly by and allow anyone to subvert the law. And lastly, I will not be bullied.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Joining us now, CNN legal analyst, criminal defense attorney Joey Jackson; CNN anchor and senior political analyst, John Avlon; CNN political commentator and host of PBS's "Firing Line," Margaret Hoover.

Just to the -- to the law of it. This is different than the sanctions put on Trump, because of the warning from the judge about the attack on his clerk. But is there anything breaking the law here about what Trump is doing? It certainly doesn't help his chances legally, does it?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: So you would think, in a case where a judge is the ultimate determinator, right, of not only the factual issues, because remember, there are remaining claims, but also what's going to happen to you. What's a receiver of your business going to look like to dissolve your assets? What is the issue as it relates to the penalties and fines going to be? Right? Those are significant. Will you have your business license?

So you would think in that context, that you would really behave yourself or not be so inflammatory, but I guess he can't help it.

Now, as it relates to, certainly, the gag order, it's not a technical violation, because the gag order related, of course, to the clerk. But it's just not to decorum.

The interesting thing to me, Poppy and Phil, is whether this judge uses that in the case itself. What do I mean?

The case is about the facts and the circumstances in that courtroom. But if you have a particular person in a case who's a defendant who's not really, you know, obeying judicial rules and orders -- technically, he did. Again, it's not the clerk.

But what does this say about how you comport yourself on the business perspective and how, if you're not respecting judicial rules, you respect the rules relating to financial statements and other things.

So whether the judge influenced -- is influenced that way is something I'm looking to see, ultimately as he make his decision.

HARLOW: That's interesting.

MATTINGLY: Margaret, I think it was interesting that the attorney general fired back yesterday. She spoke before the trial started, had been there. And there's the amazing picture of her kind of sitting behind the former president, looking at him in the courtroom. We hadn't heard a lot from her or her team, other than what we'd heard in court.

That changed yesterday. How much of this is not just a civil case, not just what we're seeing in the courtroom, but also now a very outside P.R., almost political fight going on?

MARGARET HOOVER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: You know, I think she's been incredibly measured as an attorney general. I mean, she has been the subject of so many of his social media blasts.

[06:20:07]

You recall, it's almost commonplace now for Donald Trump -- I mean, it's been commonplace since he emerged on the escalator in 2015 for him to go after the judicial system and call, and name leaders in the judicial system, judges, in particular, presiding over his cases as racists.

OK. So as long as they're not white men, they are racists. And you know -- so -- I actually think this is less about P.R. But I'm glad she finally said something and called out to it.

I think what's -- what's really potent is how unhinged Donald Trump is about this. It almost seems that he is more unhappy about the loss -- the potential loss of his businesses in New York than he is about 91 federal -- federal charges.

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST/ANCHOR: Sure. Yes. HOOVER: John, on that point, though, just looking at this -- some

quotes from her, when she was running for attorney general, about Trump. And she did campaign on calling him a, quote, "illegitimate president." She said "unscrupulous president." These were in 2018.

But does any of that change the picture here?

AVLON: It's not a good look in the rearview mirror of history, and it's one reason why people running for positions like attorney general should stay out of the red meat of politics on the extreme edge.

That said, this is now about where the rubber meets the road with regard to the law. This is about equal justice under law. This is about accountability, something Trump has been traditionally resistant to.

And it's hitting him in the wallet, which is what really gets his attention, potentially.

Trump's always --- he's not about decorum. He's about -- he's about playing to the court of public opinion and trying to play the refs. What's significant here is it's not going to work. It's not even a jury trial. It's all about the judge.

HOOVER: The P.R. aspect is almost unnecessary. We're not trying to persuade anyone here except the judge. So this really sort of is out of the court of opinion now. This is in the courts. And the courts are doing their thing.

MATTINGLY: It's amazing to try and -- the person you need to persuade, to just attack him repeatedly, over and over again, with, like, visceral rage.

I want to move on, because the -- we've been talking for the last couple weeks about indictment of Senator Bob Menendez and his wife Nadine.

CNN has obtained this video -- I want to show some of it -- from the police in New Jersey that appears to show Nadine Menendez hitting and killing a pedestrian in 2018.

We should note some viewers may find this video disturbing.

According to the police report, Menendez hit and killed a pedestrian, was not at fault for the crash. Menendez' lawyer told "The New York Times" the car crash was a tragic accident, unrelated to her current charges.

This was hinted at inside the indictment. And this was also, I think, the reason why they got a new car, which -- which is mentioned in the indictment, which she texts her husband about.

HARLOW: A gift.

MATTINGLY: A gift.

HARLOW: Car.

MATTINGLY: A gift car. This is extraordinary. Is this -- do you -- when you watch this video, when you saw this play out, what do you see?

JACKSON: So what happens is, it's just separating the two. Right?

What the defense will say, in terms of the indictment, because that's relevant now. She has to, Ms. Menendez, in addition to the other co- defendants, the senator, right, they have to fight this indictment. So how does this past thing play into that?

We know as it relates to her conduct there, right, in terms of the hit-and-run. You can make judgments with respect to, did she do the right thing? Should she have been charged? Should she have been analyzed for blood or alcohol, or anything else? You can make all those arguments.

Defense will say that, look, she was not charged. The police made a determination that she should be let go. The reality was, there's no criminality.

Now, how it plays in here is big time. What are they going to do? What they're going to say in the federal case is they're going to say, You know what? This provides a motivation to why you needed that Mercedes, to why you engaged to conspiracy, to why you were bribing.

And in addition, final point, no one likes a person if you look at that tape who does not as much as they can to help. And when the jury learns about what she did, her inaction, that kind of enflames them. So this is a kind of prosecutorial tactic the defense will try to keep out. If it gets in, it's going to be problematic.

HARLOW: Charges against her. What about for the senator?

AVLON: Well, I mean, this is all about how it relates to his pattern of alleged bribery.

I mean, you know, the problem here is that, you know, who gets gifted a brand-new Mercedes after they kill a person, even accidentally? And what's the -- what does that person expect to get for the gift of a brand-new Mercedes? It's shady. It just is.

HARLOW: Everyone, stick around. We've got a lot more to get to, ahead.

MATTINGLY: "The New York Times" is reporting that the special counsel is asking about Rudy Giuliani's drinking habits. We're going to tell you how it plays into the legal battle and how Giuliani is responding.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: When the hell was I drinking? I was working 24 hours a day. It's a big damn lie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[06:28:21]

STEVE BANNON, FORMER TRUMP ADVISOR/LIVESTREAM SHOW HOST: Any of the candidates stood up today and tried to defend McCarthy in the moment of truth, to me they're all open for primaries, and they all should be primaried. No excuse. I don't care if you're in leadership or not. You've got to make decisions here.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: That is Steve Bannon, the former advisor to President Trump, who now streams live. It said -- you missed the word "War" behind him. It said "War Room," from -- from his basement for four hours every weekday.

He helped build momentum among hard-right Republicans that led to the demise of Kevin McCarthy as House speaker.

MATTINGLY: "The New York Times" reports that, quote, "For weeks Mr. Bannon has been strategizing with Congressman Matt Gaetz on a bid to take down Mr. McCarthy, offering himself up as a sounding board as Mr. Gaetz plotted his moves. 'Kaboom,' Mr. Bannon texted a reporter on Monday night, minutes after Mr. Gaetz filed his long-dangled motion to oust the speaker."

I want to bring our panel back. And the John, I want to start with you. Because I was grinning at the start of this, because this is the most Bannon thing in the history of Bannon things, and there was almost no chance that he wasn't somewhere in this process.

AVLON: Uh-huh.

MATTINGLY: But even though it was only eight Republicans, he still manages to have a significant voice, pull, and amount of muscle inside the House Republican conference.

AVLON: Yes. It's because Bannon is, to some extent, a dirty trickster for Donald Trump. He's someone who, the worse it gets, the better it gets, from his perspective. Someone who wants to see it all burn down. If he can't control it, he wants to undermine it, and that's what Steve Bannon does.

So, you know, just like before January 6th, went on the same, you know, podcast or streaming, he was saying things are going to be quite extraordinarily different. WE still don't know exactly what he meant by that. Seemed to have some foreknowledge.

In this case, he seemed to have some foreknowledge that Gaetz was going to try to take down Trump [SIC] and had been behind it.

[06:30:00]