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CNN This Morning

Intense Rain and Wind for Coastal New England; Gershon Baskin is Interviewed about Hamas Held Hostages; Haley Gaining Ground; Respiratory Viruses Surge. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired December 18, 2023 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:30:02]

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: All right, take a look at this. This is new video this morning. It shows the moment after a car crashed into President Biden's motorcade. This happened last night in Delaware. You can hear a car screeching before hitting another vehicle. The president looking startled as the Secret Service is then seen putting him into an SUV with the first lady. Al of this unfolded as the Biden's were leaving a holiday happy hour with staffers at the president's campaign headquarters. You can tell it was raining heavily in Wilmington. Police say the crash was not intentional.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: Well, speaking of that rain, right now nearly 60 million people from North Carolina to Vermont face a rough morning of heavy rain and strong winds as a powerful storm moves up the East Coast. Just if you're in the New York area, don't go outside.

HARLOW: Yes.

MATTINGLY: At least based on how it was this morning when I came to work.

HARLOW: Yes.

MATTINGLY: Some places from Boston to New York could get up to six inches of rain, creating flooding concerns and travel delays.

HARLOW: Farther south, some places got up to a foot of rain, sending water surging into homes and neighborhoods. In Charleston, South Carolina, flooding hit Florida and North Carolina as well.

Derek Van Dam tracking it all at the Weather Center.

Good morning to you.

Some places could face some tropical storm-like conditions. Is that right?

DEREK VAN DAM, AMS CERTIFIED METEOROLOGIST: Yes, that's what's occurring across many locations along the coastal areas of New England. What you're looking at now is a live camera, this is EarthCam, over the Hudson River into a very socked in New York City skyline. And notice the winds picking up. So, that combination of heavy rain and wind is causing our customers - a number of people without power -- to jump exponentially here within the past few hours. We've been watching that numbers go up and up and up.

Now, we're particularly concerned about an area really along this I-95 corridor, stretching as far south as the Delmarva Peninsula, through New Jersey and into Long Island, including New York City, for the potential of 2 to 3 inches per hour. It is associated with this band of rainfall you can see moving through central New Jersey, kind of fluctuating east and west. That is a training line of thunderstorms -- showers and thunderstorms, I should say, heavy rainfall, that's falling on top of an already saturated environment. So, the potential there to add an additional couple of inches of rain will lead to flooding. All in all, nearly 60 million Americans impacted by flood alerts now. A lot of wind associated with this. Poppy mentioned tropical storm force gusts. Certainly, a possibility along the coast. Look at these impressive rainfall totals. Nearly a foot in South Carolina.

Phil.

MATTINGLY: All right, Derek Van Dam, thank you.

HARLOW: Impressive is one word.

MATTINGLY: That is one word for it.

HARLOW: It is not a nice morning out that's for sure.

MATTINGLY: No. No. I like my - Derek's was the scientific way of putting things. Mine, like, say inside, guys, because it's a little rough outside right now.

HARLOW: Don't go outside.

MATTINGLY: Well, families of hostages kidnapped by Hamas facing new anxiety after the IDF mistakenly killed three of those hostages. Now there are new talks to green light a deal to free the people still being held captive.

HARLOW: And the debate over abortion front and center in the race for the White House. And recent court rulings putting some Republican lawmakers in a tough spot.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): I do agree that there are some states that have overreached. North Carolina got it right.

REP. MARIA SALAZAR (R-FL): Who am I to be questioning the Supreme Court? None of us. Because then we are questioning the whole platform that we're standing on.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[06:36:51]

MATTINGLY: Well, this morning, the pressure, both domestic and international, is growing on Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to get the remaining hostages out of Gaza.

HARLOW: CNN has learned that a meeting took place on Friday in Europe between the director of Israel's Mossad spy agency and the Qatari prime minister as they're trying to restart these hostage negotiations that fell apart two weeks ago.

This meeting came the same day that it was disclosed that the IDF mistakenly killed three Israeli hostages inside of Gaza. And those deaths obviously sparking huge protests, look at that, outside the military headquarters in Tel Aviv, with people demanding more action, immediate action, to try to get those remaining hostages home.

MATTINGLY: A family member of a recently released hostage expressed her concerns for those who remain captive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MAAYAN SIGAL KOREN, FAMILY MEMBERS HELD HOSTAGE: They heard all of the bombing and they were very, very frightened that the bombing will be falling on them, that they will die from the army missiles.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The shelling.

KOREN: Yes. And they really - they told us they don't -- didn't believe that the army really knew where they are because they were shooting very, very close and they heard all the loud noises of that bombing. And I really think that we should do anything to stop the war.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Joining us now is Gershon Baskin, Middle East director of International Communities Organization. He helped negotiate the release of an Israeli hostage in 2011 captured by Hamas.

We appreciate your time, as always.

My primary question at this point is, is this a different moment? Does the tragedy that transpired late last week change the dynamics for the prime minister and his war cabinet?

GERSHON BASKIN, MIDDLE EAST DIRECTOR, INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITIES ORG.: I'm not sure that the prime minister has yet made the decision to put the hostages as a number one priority. It seems that the decision of the government, the prime minister and his defense minister still puts the war effort as the number one priority, but pressure is growing and there is talk for the first time of Israel actually initiating an offer to Hamas. There's another meeting expected between the head of the Mossad, the head of the CIA and the Qatari prime minister this week somewhere in Europe, and hopefully that will produce results toward a new hostage agreement.

HARLOW: Let's talk more about that meeting. So, the fact that they're having a second meeting is obviously progress, but what is Hamas' impetus to get to the table right now, Gershon? Why would they come?

BASKIN: Hamas is - Hamas is demanding a full cessation of the war. It's demanding that Israel redeploy its forces away from this -- main cities and to releases prisoners who have blood on their hands, as the Israeli calls it, or prisoners who have killed Israelis. This is going to be very difficult for the Israelis to say yes to without even knowing who Hamas is willing to release. Hamas is still holding still civilians, young women, between the age of 20 and 30, as well as senior citizens and wounded and sick people, as well as tens of people who are designated by Hamas' soldiers. And it's going to be very difficult for Israel to meet the demands of Hamas.

[06:40:02]

MATTINGLY: Gershon, can you explain the domestic, political calculations right now? There's a lot of talk, I think when you talk to U.S. officials, that the prime minister's view on all of this is playing to his base, is playing to his domestic, political considerations, and that kind of wins above all else right now. Do you think that's an accurate assessment of things?

BASKIN: Right. It seems to many of us, including myself, that the prime minister is putting his own position before the country's position. His own staying in office when he's still facing trial for corruption, and he's directly responsible for what happened on October 7th. Of course, Hamas is the terror organization that attacked Israel, but everything that led up to that attack and to the failures of the Israelis to protect themselves is in the hands of the prime minister. And he's the only person in the Israeli administration who refuses to take direct responsibility.

There is mounting amount of public pressure on Netanyahu to resign. The big question is, should he resign now or after the war is over? It seems to me that when this war is over, he will be facing his day of reckoning with the Israeli public.

HARLOW: Gershon, "The New York Times" this morning is quoting Nahum Barna (ph), who is a name maybe not familiar to many in the west, but you're nodding because he's one of the most well-respected commentators in Israel. And he has been critical of Netanyahu being slow to talk about the deaths of these three Israeli hostages by Israeli forces. And this is what Nahum writes. He called that a war crime, right, because they were waving white flags. And he said, "international law is very clear on the issue." And he said, "we are at war now and our hearts, all of ours, including mine, are with the soldiers, but nothing good can come of blind love."

When you hear criticism like that from someone so respected inside of Israel, what does it tell you?

BASKIN: Well, we're - we're in a crisis. We're in the midst of a war. We have a lot of young soldiers who are fighting a war for the first time. They're - they're in an urban warfare situation where there are lots of booby traps. They're all afraid. And they're very tired. And they responded irresponsibly, illegally, by shooting at people who were surrendering. Even if they were Hamas terrorists who were surrendering, the chief of staff of the Israeli army told the high command yesterday that no one should be shot at when they are surrendering. We should be cautious. We should make sure they're not booby-trapped, but we should definitely not shoot at anyone who's trying to surrender.

And here we have Israeli citizens who were - who were -- freed themselves somehow from where they were being held and trying to get to safety and instead they were killed by the soldiers. Everyone is under a lot of pressure here. This is a really horrible situation. We need to get the hostages home. That has to be the first priority before the war effort. The war can continue afterwards. And the pressure is growing on the government to recognize that they have a moral responsibility to bring these hostages home.

MATTINGLY: Gershon Baskin, we always appreciate your insight. Thank you.

BASKIN: Thank you.

HARLOW: To politics now. A new poll showing Nikki Haley gaining some significant ground in New Hampshire. We'll tell you more about what's behind that rise.

MATTINGLY: And the chairman of the Florida Republican Party censured and stripped of almost all of his authority. The criminal investigation he faces over accusations of rape. That's ahead.

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[06:47:35]

HARLOW: This morning, four weeks until the Iowa caucuses, and new poll numbers shows just how big of a lead Donald Trump has over the rest of the Republican presidential primary field. His lead in Iowa is growing. Look at that polling, 58 percent for Trump. More than 30 points above DeSantis. In New Hampshire, his lead is smaller, though. He's at 44 percent in this new CBS News YouGov poll. Nikki Haley in that poll up quite a bit. She's in second place at 29 percent. Part of that polling done after her endorsement from New Hampshire Governor Chris Sununu.

MATTINGLY: Jamal Simmons, Lee Carter and Shelby Talcott are back with us now.

Shelby, I was -- I want to talk about this New Hampshire poll because yesterday it was like the flickers of hope amongst Republicans who don't want Trump to be their president, which is far more than -

HARLOW: Phil with the fingers.

MATTINGLY: Want to acknowledge it publicly. You see as I'm demonstrating flickers. Take the polling off the screen so I can demonstrate it here.

JAMAL SIMMONS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: (INAUDIBLE).

HARLOW: Yes.

MATTINGLY: That is - that's up 18 points for Nikki Haley since September. And when you go under the hood a little bit, reasonable, likeable, all of the things that maybe, in a New Hampshire electorate, where independents can vote or conservative Democrats might want to vote in the primary as well, you're sitting there looking at it saying, OK, all right, maybe there's a - her pathway that she's laid out is a viable pathway. What do you think?

SHELBY TALCOTT, REPORTER, "SEMAFOR": Yes, I think it -- I think she's still pretty far behind Donald Trump. She's certainly jumped a lot. But what I think it is indicative of is, I think it's a really big warning, a, for Chris Christie, who has been really the only candidate to bank all of his hopes on New Hampshire, and, b, I think it's a problem for Ron DeSantis because even though Ron DeSantis has been so focused on Iowa, his entire argument has been, up until this point, that this is a two-man race between him and Donald Trump and that he's the only viable, non-Trump alternative.

And what this indicates to me is that at least in New Hampshire these Republicans who don't want Trump are coalescing around Nikki Haley and deciding that she's the candidate. So, it makes me wonder if that's going to eventually happen in some of these other early states.

LEE CARTER, STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS EXPERT: So, I'm fascinated by the whole thing because when you look at polling just in the last week, Nikki Haley's -

HARLOW: You're our polling guru.

CARTER: Yes.

SIMMONS: Right.

HARLOW: People should see the numbers on your page.

CARTER: Yes, my - but when I was here last week we were talking about the New Hampshire primary and it was -- she was only at 18. Now she's at 29. That's an 11-point surge. So, I think it - and she hasn't even really - I mean she's been in New Hampshire, but that hasn't been her whole focus. I think -

HARLOW: And I should note, the poll is among likely Republican primary voters.

[06:50:00]

It's not like it's including independents.

CARTER: Exactly right. And so when you look at this you say, OK, well, what more would happen if a Chris Christie were to back out, or if DeSantis were to back out. No, I don't think that that's likely at this point, but if it does, you could have a real race between Trump and Haley. And it could really become interesting.

And if you think back to what happened in 2020, after South Carolina, all the Democrats pulled out except for Joe Biden. Is there a chance that that might happen with the Republican Party, some kind of deal might be brokered?

Nikki Haley has a great chance of winning in the general election. I think that Ron DeSantis promised to beat Trump without the chaos. And who's delivered on that is Nikki Haley, not Ron DeSantis. And so I'm -- I'm fascinated by watching the energy, the momentum. You feel it in her rallies. It's a very, very different Nikki Haley than you saw just a couple months ago.

MATTINGLY: Jamal, I'm going to hand you a large bucket of ice water and give you the opportunity to dump it all over the flicker (ph) - see, this is what I was doing is the flickers.

SIMMONS: Yes.

CARTER: Yes.

MATTINGLY: Do you -- do you think this is real or is this people desperately grasping onto something that's never going to turn out to come to fruition?

SIMMONS: There is no question Nikki Haley is the best performer among the second tier Republicans that are out there, right?

MATTINGLY: Right.

CARTER: You're right.

SIMMONS: She's Elmo. The rest of them are Muppets whose name you don't particularly (ph) know, right? She is the best performer out there.

The question is, though, can she really overcome Donald Trump? Fifteen points is doable. I mean I've seen New Hampshire move. I've seen people, you know, climb very fast in New Hampshire and someone else fall. But Iowa will also matter. And if Donald Trump comes in, if he smokes in Iowa and he comes steaming into New Hampshire, that might quell whatever rebellion is happening in Nikki Haley land or it could inspire all those independents who are now thinking they want to get rid of Donald Trump to turn out and go directly to Nikki Haley to try to stop it. We saw that in - with Hillary Clinton back when Obama ran against her in 2008. Everyone expected Barack Obama to win New Hampshire, and Hillary Clinton ended up taking that.

HARLOW: Shelby, you have really interesting new reporting on Tim Scott's role in all of this.

TALCOTT: Yes, so I was told over the weekend that he -- a bunch of 2024 candidates have been vying for his endorsement. So, Nikki Haley most recently called this past Friday, which is notable because prior to that she had just reached out by text message when he had dropped out of the race last month. Donald Trump is also seeking his endorsement. And Chris Christie is also seeking his endorsement. And so that's really notable to me because on its face Tim Scott, based on how he did, wouldn't be the person you would think all of these 2024 candidates are, you know, particularly interested in getting his endorsement.

But, Tim Scott he had one of the highest favorabilities among the 2024 candidates. People really like him. And I think it's also really interesting because depending on what Tim Scott does, he said in November when he dropped out that he wasn't interested in endorsing in a Republican primary. I am told that he might be interested in endorsing come new year.

Depending on who he endorses, that could really set him up. If he endorses Donald Trump, he will jump to the top tier of options for the vice presidential ticket. If he endorses Nikki Haley, I think it - it - the result is it coalesces the arguments that she is the only non- Trump alternative. And so he could, I think, make an impact in this race in ways that other endorsements have not yet.

CARTER: I also think it could have a big impact in South Carolina, which is going to be the third - you know, that's a really important state. As we saw, Joe Biden didn't show up in New Hampshire and Iowa, but he showed up in South Carolina. If you have a strong showing in South Carolina, it could give some momentum shift there.

SIMMONS: We know, in the before times, before Donald Trump, the Tim Scott message was the message of the Republican Party that was trying to lean forward. The McCain's, sort of George W. Bush party (ph), it was optimistic, it was, you know, America is going to win, we can all do this together. This isn't those -- these aren't those times, right? This is Donald Trump time. And it's negative and it's everybody goes hard at each other and it's no holds barred WWE wrestling.

HARLOW: DTT, Donald Trump time, WWE, all - all before 7:00 a.m.

Thank you, guys. We appreciate it.

MATTINGLY: Thanks, guys.

Well, former House Speaker Kevin McCarthy is waving good-bye to Capitol Hill, but he might not be leaving Washington forever. What he wants if Donald Trump wins the election in 2024.

HARLOW: Congress continues their border security talks and the federal government takes quite a step to curb the surge in migrants along the southern border. We'll tell you what just happened there.

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[06:58:10]

MATTINGLY: Well, if it seems like everybody's sick these days, I'm looking at you, my four children, the bad news, it could get worse. We're already well into winter virus season in the U.S. even before winter officially starts.

HARLOW: That's right, respiratory virus activity is high or increasing in most parts of the country, and the CDC warns the peak is still not even here yet.

Meg Tirrell is at the table with much more on this.

I don't know, I feel like I've given them all the vaccines, I give them orange juice in the morning. Short of my kids wearing masks again, how can we stay healthy?

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes. It's very difficult. I mean hand washing and then also just trying to be good corporate citizens or good citizens of the world and not going to work or school when you're sick, you know, just trying not to spread. But when you're looking at where the levels are highest right now, especially ahead of holiday travel, right now it's in the southern parts of the country, although it is increasing everywhere. You can see the darker colors there across the CDC map.

But we are hearing that Covid wastewater levels in particular - so that's when you're actually picking up the virus in wastewater, and that can be kind of a leading indicator for cases, that -- those are highest in the Midwest right now. I'm looking at both of you guys, midwestern folks.

HARLOW: Well, is the green on the map where it's highest or lowest?

TIRRELL: Is where it's lowest.

HARLOW: Lowest. OK. So -

TIRRELL: But it - yes, exactly.

MATTINGLY: But it's kind of rising?

TIRRELL: But it's kind of rising and -

HARLOW: Yes.

MATTINGLY: So, does it for parents, if they're -- does it make sense to get vaccines now or is it kind of too late in the cycle?

TIRRELL: No, the CDC would tell you, if you haven't gotten a vaccine, you should absolutely still do it. We still haven't reached the peak of these respiratory virus. Flu, in particular, is really on the upswing. Covid is still high. RSV may have reached a peak, but folks in pretty - in the public health world disappointed in how many seniors have gotten the new RSV vaccine for people over 60. Only about 16 to 17 percent. And you can see there, that bar graph we were just showing is flu vacation rates at this time this year, compared with last year, and they are lower. Right there we're showing you emergency department visits where you can actually see, Covid still is the highest but flu is really coming up strong there.

[07:00:01]

HARLOW: What does all this mean for folks that, you know, get so sick they have to go to the emergency room?

TIRRELL: Well, there is a real concern about hospital capacity and ER capacity.