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CNN This Morning

"The Detroit News" Reports It Has Possession of Audio of Former President Trump Attempting to Convince Officials in Michigan to Not Certify Joe Biden's Victory in 2020; Republican Presidential Candidates Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley React to News of Donald Trump's Not Being Allowed on Colorado Ballot; Former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani Files for Bankruptcy; Prague Police Release Bodycam Video of Shooting Response; Record Travel as Millions Head Home for the Holidays; NYT Investigates: Just How Rich Was the McCallister Family in "Home Alone." Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired December 22, 2023 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[08:00:03]

CRAIG MAUGER, STATE POLITICS REPORTER, "THE DETROIT NEWS": There is a whistleblower that possesses the audio of these recordings. And the timing of the release and the ultimate decision on whether to release these recordings publicly is up to that person. There are investigators at multiple levels looking into the pressure and the effort by Donald Trump and his supporters to overturn the election in Michigan, and this -- these recordings seem to fit with a lot of other information that we have already.

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POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. It is the top of the hour. And you have heard the phone call where then President Trump pressured election officials in Georgia to reverse the outcome of the 2020 election. Now "The Detroit News" says there is a recording of Trump urging officials in Michigan to do the same.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: And the Supreme Court has some big decisions that could have a major impact on the 2024 race. They could very soon decide if they will take up whether Trump has immunity in the election subversion case, and if he gets to stay on the Colorado ballot. And now Trump's team may be going to the high court to delay a defamation case in New York.

HARLOW: And if you are getting ready to head home for the holidays, you are not alone. AAA expecting a record number of travelers this weekend.

This hour of CNN THIS MORNING starts now.

Another tape emerged of Donald Trump personally pressuring election officials to block Joe Biden's victory in 2020, this time in the state of Michigan. "The Detroit News" this morning reporting there is a recorded phone call of Trump urging two Republican election officials in Wayne County not to certify their county's results. Wayne County, of course, is home to Detroit, a Democratic stronghold. Now, Trump reportedly called them right after this meeting a couple of weeks ago after the election where those same two officials initially voted to block the certification before backing down.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: All opposed say nay.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nay.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Nay.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There is no reason under the sun for us to not certify this election. This is reckless and irresponsible actions by this board.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now, in the phone call after that meeting, "The Detroit News" reports Trump told the officials, quote, "We've got to fight for our country. We can't let these people take our country away from us." Those officials ended up refusing to sign the official certification, and they admitted that Trump called them. Here is how one of the officials described the call a few days later.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He thanked me for my service, asked me how I was doing. There was a genuine concern for my safety with what he heard, the threats that were coming in.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Are you saying the president's call had no influence on you recanting your vote?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Absolutely.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: CNN has not heard the recording, but it could be crucial evidence for Special Counsel Jack Smith as he pursues felony charges against Trump for trying to overturn his election loss.

Let's bring in CNN's Marshall Cohen who has led our coverage on all of this, was our expert on everything Colorado related a couple of days ago as well. Marshall, we lean on you for the details and backstory. One of the things we're trying to figure out right now is does Jack Smith have this tape, and if he does, what could he do with it? What's your sense of things?

MARSHALL COHEN, CNN REPORTER: If he doesn't have it, he definitely wants to get it. It could be a huge piece of additional evidence for the Trump federal election subversion trial which is scheduled to go to trial in March, although, of course, we will see if that actually holds up. A critical piece of evidence because it fits into a pattern of Donald Trump pressuring election officials across the country to violate their oaths and block the certification of the results in key states. That's exactly what he wanted to happen in Michigan, and according to these tapes, which CNN has not obtained, but "The Detroit Sews" has, and they published some key excerpts.

I will read them now. The stuff is pretty damning, Phil. The first quote is from President Trump, and he says, "We can't let these people take our country away from us. Everyone knows Detroit is crooked as hell." Those were the election canvassers in Detroit, trying to convince them not to certify the results.

Also on that call, the chairwoman of the Republican National Committee, Ronna McDaniel. It was her and the president. McDaniel said, "Do not sign it," referring to the certification papers. "Do not sign it. We will get you attorneys." And then Trump said, "We'll take care of that." Guys, why do you need attorneys if you are not doing anything wrong? That's an incredibly staggering point right there.

And then the last thing from the call. According to "The Detroit News," Trump said, "How could anybody sign something when you have more votes than people?" OK. That's a false claim. That's a debunked lie. More votes than people because of alleged dead voters casting ballots in Detroit, it didn't happen. It was a lie.

[08:05:00]

So Trump tried to use the lies to convince these officials to block the certification of the results. They tried to rescind their votes. They couldn't do it. The results were certified, and Joe Biden's victory was upheld in the critical state of Michigan.

HARLOW: Wow. It just shows how close to the line things could get. What about how Ronna McDaniel, still, by the way, the RNC chair, is responding?

COHEN: Yes. So McDaniel said that all she wanted to do was get an audit of the results before certification just to check everything before certifying. And I'll read for you a response from the Trump campaign. They are pushing back pretty hard. The spokesman for the Trump campaign said that "All of President Trump's actions were in furtherance of his duty as president of the United States to faithfully take care of the laws and ensure election integrity." But guys, that doesn't really hold up. Trying to ensure election integrity, election integrity is not overturning an election.

HARLOW: Exactly right. Marshall Cohen, thank you. It's amazing you even have to say that, but thank you very much for the reporting.

MATTINGLY: An important point you wouldn't think you would have to make over and over and over again, and yet here we are.

And all eyes are now on the Supreme Court today waiting on huge decisions with enormous political implications. Special Counsel Jack Smith again asking the court to decide immediately if Donald Trump has presidential immunity from alleged crimes committed while he was in office. And we are also waiting to see if Trump asks the high court to overturn an historic decision by the Colorado Supreme Court removing him from the ballot based on the 14th Amendment's insurrectionists ban. Trump posting on Truth Social Thursday, "I'm not an insurrectionist." Cool.

CNN's Alayna Treene joins us now - sorry -- joins us now. I think one of the things, as all of this continues to play out, the reality remains that there is a Republican primary that is ongoing and there are votes that will be cast in just a couple of weeks, and yet this is what continues to rise the forefront because these are huge issues. How are the rivals of the frontrunner, Donald Trump, responding here?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: The last thing they want to be talking about right now in the final days before the January 15th Iowa caucuses is Donald Trump, and yet that is the position they have found themselves in yet again in light of the recent legal issues that Donald Trump is facing this week.

Now, I think Florida Governor Ron DeSantis made a very interesting point during an interview with CBS News yesterday. He argued that if he could change one thing about the 2024 race, it would be the indictments against Donald Trump. He is arguing that the indictments have distorted the dynamics of the primary.

We also heard from Nikki Haley, also in Iowa yesterday. She said to voters that she does not think that Donald Trump becoming president would be good for the country. Take a listen to what both of them had to say.

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GOV. RON DESANTIS, (R) FLORIDA: I wish Trump hadn't been indicted on any of this stuff. It distorted the primary.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's helped him, is that what you are saying?

DESANTIS: It's both that. But then it also, it's just crowded out, I think, so much other stuff, and it sucked out a lot of oxygen.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to support you. I also want to hear from you that you also think there is a danger here.

NIKKI HALEY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I don't think it's good for the country for Donald Trump to become president again.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: Now, a few interesting points there. One is, I think there is no question what Ron DeSantis was saying is wrong. I mean, I think the indictments, we have seen time and time again have boosted Donald Trump, they have changed the primary. I am not sure if it would change Donald Trump's status as the current Republican frontrunner for the Republican nomination, but they have definitely helped him in his campaign.

Now, another thing that she's candidates have been pointing to is they are making it an electability argument against Donald Trump. They're arguing to voters, do you really want a candidate who comes with all of this drama and all of this baggage? And I think it's a salient point. We saw in 2020, one the key reasons Donald Trump lost to Joe Biden in that election is because there was this Trump fatigue. So many people were tired of the rhetoric that Donald Trump was using. They criticized him on the campaign trail.

And now it's hard to see how Republican primary voters are receiving that argument, if they are receptive to it. Donald Trump is clearly still leading heavily in the polls and has pretty infallible support with those Republican voters.

MATTINGLY: All right, Alayna Treene, thank you.

And joining us to discuss, CNN political commentator Alyssa Farah Griffin and CNN senior political analyst John Avlon. And I want to start where Alayna ended. Is the argument having any effect?

ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it is. So this is -- I am surprised that I'm saying this. We have a real GOP primary right now. Nikki Haley is number two in Iowa, New Hampshire, and South Carolina. There is statistically a nonzero chance that by spring of this year the possibility of Donald Trump being president will be decided and will be done. Nikki Haley could pull this off. There is a path.

Now, I say all that with he does have a massive lead. He is heavily favored in Iowa. The motion that is still in his favor very much, but she is picking up steam. And I think that while that may have sounded to someone like me who is very against Donald Trump, my former boss, her comments sounded a bit stronger than she said before.

[08:10:06]

Just simply saying that it's not good for the country for him to be president, she's got this delicate dance, as does DeSantis, but there is a chance for this to actually have movement with people who are just so fatigued by him.

HARLOW: Let's talk a little bit more about that delicate. Here is sort of the longer version, including the voter question that prompted Nikki Haley to say that in Iowa.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want to support you. I also want to hear from you that you also think there is a danger here, because this is not good for our country, and it's not good for the church. And I want to be able to support someone who agrees with that.

NIKKI HALEY, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I wouldn't be running if I didn't think that he is not the right person at the right time. I have said multiple times, I don't think it's good for the country for Donald Trump to become president again. I've made that very clear.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HARLOW: Is that the dance she has to keep doing though to try to win in a place like Iowa, she can't say what that voter wanted, which is he is a danger?

JOHN AVLON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: It's a process of persuasion. She is trying to connect with him. And you heard the applause in that room. I think it's evidence even in Iowa where he has his most commanding lead that there is a degree of Trump fatigue. And the strongest argument you can make, and polls bear this out from "The Des Moines Register," is electability, right. Ultimately, it's about who can win elections. And Nikki Haley has consistently been far and away the person who has the biggest lead over Joe Biden head-to-head because she doesn't have Donald Trump's baggage.

And all the indictments, I think it's DeSantis trying to deflect blame a little bit for a campaign that has blown through over $200 million without a ton to show for it right now. Nikki Haley is gaining. She has established herself as an alternative. And the arguments are going to be electability and just constant chaos. How much does the Republican Party want to saddle themselves as well as the country with this much baggage that's bad for our democracy.

GRIFFIN: And if I may.

MATTINGLY: Yes. No, please.

GRIFFIN: Keep in mind, if there were a scenario, and obviously Governor Christie has not signaled that he is going to step out and endorse, but if he did, it would put Nikki Haley within the margin of error of Donald Trump in New Hampshire if he were to come out and endorse here. I think you're going to hear growing calls from Republicans who want an alternative to Trump to say put your money where your mouth is, you are running to stop Trump. Now is the time to unite behind the alternative that can actually beat him.

MATTINGLY: Point of clarity here. A nonzero chance is like 0.001 percent? So that was a very clever --

(LAUGHTER)

AVLON: Understatement.

MATTINGLY: Very savvy. She is the professional comms person for a reason.

GRIFFIN: Listen, I take what I can get.

MATTINGLY: But no. It's very true. And I know I have a lot of alliance with you. We have been talking about what happened in Michigan, the tapes.

AVLON: Yes.

MATTINGLY: And I have made this point a couple times this morning, but I really think it's important to mark it. People just kind of gloss over. So much was happening there. They say, oh, yes, there is a tape. And of course, we've heard tapes. We've heard this type of stuff before. This is completely insane. And it's also something that the election workers denied happened on the record and then forgot or didn't remember anything. It's very clear what happened in the timeline here, and it just seems to feed directly into what the special prosecutor is looking at.

AVLON: Because that's the fact pattern. That's what was happening. There was an unprecedented effort by the president of the United States from the White House to try to influence and intimidate the people into overturning the election. And you are going to free with Marshall's point, the invocation of the lawyer, we will get you an attorney, is an admission that, what we are asking isn't on the up and up. It's inconsistent with your oath. And you might be scared to keep Donald Trump in power, but we will protect you.

GRIFFIN: Keep in mind, by the way, how unprecedented this was. This happened on November 17. Three days later was the infamous meeting where he then called in state representatives from Michigan. What he was seeking to do is if he could get this precedent of having it not certified in Michigan, a key battleground state, they thought there would be a ripple effect that could just stop the other results, Pennsylvania and so on, from being certified. It shows that our democracy was hanging by a thread on the backs of canvassers. These are not senior government officials. These are just people carrying out the work of the government.

HARLOW: Before we go, Rudy Giuliani has now filed for bankruptcy. America's mayor has filed for bankruptcy and is standing by these destructive lies.

AVLON: It is such a fall from grace. It's unimaginable as someone who worked for him when he was mayor that Rudy, who 20 years ago was one of the most respected people on the planet, not just in the United States, would 20 years later have destroyed his reputation in the service of Donald Trump's lies, ruined his reputation and ability to practice law, and declared bankruptcy. It is a tragedy. It is a self- inflicted tragedy.

And I do hope that the totality of his career is remembered, because he did great good in certain positions. Not without controversy, but he was effective as a U.S. attorney, he was effective as mayor, certainly on 9/11. But this last chapter has blown it all away. And for what? His belief that the law is a search for truth completely undercut. His personal financial independence destroyed, all in the service of a lie and someone else's demagogy. It's a tragedy.

MATTINGLY: Is indeed. John Avlon, Alyssa, thanks, guys, appreciate it.

It might be the most wonderful time of year, but it's also one of the busiest. What you can expect if you are traveling home for the holidays this weekend.

[08:15:00]

HARLOW: And it is a question I know you've been dying for an answer to, people have been talking about this for 33 years, just how rich were the McCallisters from "Home Alone," right?

"The New York Times" crunched the numbers and we've got it for you.

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PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: New bodycam video shows police in Prague responding to the deadliest peacetime attack in the modern Czech history.

You can see officers searching through the university corridors and evacuating people from the buildings, 14 people were killed in the attack, 25 others were injured.

As the violence broke out, students began locking themselves in classrooms. Some even hid on the ledge of a building to escape the attack, you can see it right there, it is a jarring picture.

CNN's Melissa Bell joins us now.

Melissa, what more are we learning about the shooter here?

MELISSA BELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, that bodycam footage really providing a chilling insight into what so many of those students and those first responders were really faced with during that rampage by this 24-year-old Philosophy student who went on the attack yesterday at the Charles University.

It was a frantic few minutes, of course, as the police tried not just to get in and try and prevent him from killing anyone else, but just tried to carry out that triage amongst the young people, many of them students, of course, who were by then lying on their classroom floors.

Now, we have got a better idea also this morning of exactly what the sequence of events was, Phil. We understand that this young man left his home where the body of his father was found. It is believed by Czech police that he killed his father before heading to his university.

[08:20:05]

Now, the police had been tipped off that he was planning to kill himself, that he was armed. They had evacuated the building in which he was meant to have a 2:00 PM lecture yesterday afternoon. It is in fact in another part of the campus that he acted, so that evacuation didn't prevent anything at all.

There had been some questions until this morning as well about whether he'd been eliminated by the police after the attack, during the attack, or whether he'd taken his own life. Police have now announced that it was in fact a suicide, and I think in one of the most chilling comments we've had from the police this morning, they said, look, when you see how much weaponry he had, the kind of ammunition he had, it really was the quick intervention of the police that meant that lives were saved.

And yet, Phil and Poppy, it is at 14 people who were killed yesterday in that attack, most of them students just a few days before Christmas, preparing to go off for their Christmas holidays, a couple of them staff members, but really a chilling killing that is the first that has ever taken place in a school or college in the Czech Republic's history -- Phil and Poppy.

MATTINGLY: Melissa Bell, thank you.

HARLOW: Now, the holiday travel certainly kicking into overdrive today as millions of people fly or drive to their destination. So far, pretty calm in New York's LaGuardia Airport, as you can see, the big storm is swirling in Southern California, it could impact anyone heading to LA or San Diego or Phoenix.

Pete Muntean live from Reagan National just outside the nation's capital.

Good morning, Pete, how does it look?

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: So far, so smooth, Poppy.

In fact, this is the standard security line behind me at the Terminal 2 North Checkpoint here at Reagan National Airport. Only seven to 10 minutes to get through the line right now.

I want you to look at the line earlier though, the rush was huge here at 7:00 AM. The TSA says yesterday was actually bigger than initially forecast. They thought two-and-a-half million people would pass through security at America's airports, it was closer to 2.64 million people, and today will be even bigger. We're talking about 2.7 million people at airports nationwide today, 44,000 flights.

The good news is that things are mostly okay at airports across the country, only about 50 cancellations, 500 delays. The FAA is warning of some ground stops today in LA and Phoenix because of that weather you mentioned.

Also, some delays in places like Texas and Minneapolis because of low cloud ceilings. But the big days are ahead and there is some concern about weather over the weekend and into next week, and that does have Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg a bit worried though industry says, some of the days are going to be really big, Tuesday to Friday, and he says it is imperative for passengers to pay attention to the weather.

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PETE BUTTIGIEG, US DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: I would say, we know that weather is coming our way. It is why you want to make sure that you're keeping in touch with your airline.

The big thing that we can control though, that airlines need to control is how resilient the system is to that weather.

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MUNTEAN: A hundred and fifteen million people in total traveling 50 miles or more according to AAA over the next few days. A hundred and eleven million people driving, and there is an interesting phenomenon because of the timing of the holiday. Because Christmas falls on a Monday, the best times to travel are Saturday and Sunday. The worst times to travel though, are really when you get into next week. That is one you could see a confluence of normal traffic of folks not taking off the full week and folks traveling for the holiday.

The good news is, the price of gas is down. The average is $3.12 a gallon, that's down from where we were a month ago although up a little bit from where we were a year ago.

HARLOW: All right, Pete Muntean, wishing for smooth travels for everyone. Thank you, friend.

MATTINGLY: Well, it is one of the greatest Christmas movies ever, surpassed perhaps only by "Die Hard."

"Home Alone" had kids wondering if they could fend off two burglars like Kevin did, and it had parents wondering how could the McCallisters afford that house and a holiday trip to France, the whole family. We're going to break down just how rich they were, next.

HARLOW: And if you've ever wondered just how expensive seven swans singing or 12 drummers drumming would be now, we got to cover the cost of the 12 Days of Christmas, next. Look at that.

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[08:28:20]

["HOME ALONE" VIDEO CLIP PLAYS]

PETER MCCALLISTER, FICTIONAL CHARACTER: Everything here is booked.

KATE MCCALLISTER, FICTIONAL CHARACTER: There's nothing to Chicago?

PETER MCCALLISTER: There's nothing to Chicago, New York, Nashville. You name it. Everything's gone.

KATE MCCALLISTER: What about a private plane?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: A private plane from Paris to Chicago would be out of the budget for well, almost everyone, but Kate McAllister in "Home Alone" seemed ready and willing to bear the cost to try to get home to see Kevin, her son, of course.

Fans of the Christmas classic, "Home Alone" have wondered just how much money did the McCallisters actually have?

Well, you're lucky. "The New York Times" crunched the numbers with the economists and they got some answers. And of course, Phil is it magic wall to break it all down? Not poor.

MATTINGLY: Not poor. No. Let's be honest, this is the most pressing question of the holiday season. I don't think there's any question about it: Just how much money did the McCallister family have?

This, folks, is why great reporting matters and this is with a huge hat tip to "The New York Times" for a really great story.

Let's start though with the family home. The McCallisters lived in a wealthy Chicago suburb, a home that even by 1990 standard would have only been affordable by Chicago's one percent.

Zillow's current estimated value for this property, an eye-popping $2.4 million, which as "The Times" points out is probably the best clue to the family's net worth, which brings two words to mind, silver tuna.

("HOME ALONE" VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

HARRY LIME, FICTIONAL CHARACTER: And that's the one, Marv, and that's the silver tuna.

MARV MURCHINS, FICTIONAL CHARACTER: It's very G.

HARRY LIME: Very G, huh? It's loaded. It's got lots of top flake goods -- stereos, VCRs --

MARV MURCHINS: Toys.

HARRY LIME: Probably looking at some very fine jewelry, possible cash hoard, and marketable securities. Who knows?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: So, "The Times" asked economists at Chicago's Federal Reserve how much would the McCallisters have to be earning to actually live in a home like that? And that's where we get the answer.

Their answer working under the assumption the family spent no more than the recommended 30 percent of their income on housing, they'd have to bring in roughly $300,000.00 in 1990 or close to $700,000.00 in 2022, and in today's market, they would actually have to be making more than that to be able to afford that home, but obviously, there is a critical question here: Where did the money actually come from?

[08:30:35]