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CNN This Morning

Haley, DeSantis Step Up Attacks on Donald Trump; Christie Defends His White House Bid after Sununu Criticism; House Republicans Prepare Impeachment Process for Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas; Former President Trump Appeals Maine Secretary of State's Decision to Remove Him from Republican Presidential Primary Ballot. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired January 03, 2024 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEJANDRO MAYORKAS, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: The magnitude of the problem and why we have said now for about three decades that our broken immigration system is in desperate need of legislative reform. So we are focused on solutions, and we hope that they will return to Washington and focus on the solutions as well.

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PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: Today House Speaker Mike Johnson heading to the southern border, putting pressure on the White House over immigration at the same moment House Republicans will forge ahead with steps to impeachment who you just heard right there, Secretary of Homeland Security Alejandro Mayorkas.

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Also this morning, former President Trump appeals the decision that kicked him off the Maine ballot for engaging in insurrection. He claims the process was, quote, infected by bias, as President Biden prepares to do what Trump's primary competitors won't, attack him over January 6th.

MATTINGLY: And new fears this morning of a wider conflict in the Middle East after a senior Hamas leader was killed in an attack in the Lebanese capital Beirut. The leader of Hezbollah will speak for the first time since that attack at 11:00 a.m. eastern.

This hour of CNN starts right now.

And good morning, everyone. Audie Cornish is here with us. Poppy is off. And we start with the breaking news this morning. The House Homeland Security Committee will formally begin impeachment proceedings against DHS Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas. We asked him about this moments ago. You'll hear that in a moment.

And it comes as Republican House Speaker Mike Johnson is traveling to Eagle Pass, Texas, today along with a GOP delegation in an attempt to highlight the surge in migrant crossings along the southern border. The White House in response is accusing congressional Republicans of blocking President Biden's proposed aid package that would appropriate billions of dollars for the U.S. southern border, Israel, and Ukraine, and Taiwan, blasting the House speaker for quote, hamstringing border security in the name of extreme partisan demands. Biden himself weighing in on this last night when he returned to the White House.

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JOE BIDEN, (D) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We've got to do something. They ought to give me the money I need to protect the border.

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CORNISH: CNN has obtained preliminary Homeland Security statistics that say more than 225,000 migrants were detained for unlawful crossing at the U.S. southern border just last month. That's the highest monthly total recorded in more than 20 years. Despite that number, the Biden administration is highlighting a drop in crossings this week. Officials do caution that migration ebbs and flows.

Meanwhile, tomorrow Customs and Border Protection is reopening four border crossings along the southern border.

We're going to have team coverage. Lauren Fox is in Washington, D.C. CNN's Ed Lavandera is live at the border in Eagle Pass, Texas. And Ed, we've talked about the ebbs and flows, but this has been a dramatic drop. Why do they think that is?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, there could be a number of reasons for it. But as we have seen over months and years, there are ebbs and flows to migration through the U.S. southern border. So sometimes it's a little bit more difficult to explain. We spoke with the head of one migrant shelter on the other side of the border from where we are in Eagle Pass yesterday afternoon, and they described to us that there are a number of checkpoints that have been set up in northern Mexico that is -- that have about much more robust in recent days and weeks, and perhaps that has something to do with controlling the number of migrants reaching the northern border right up to Texas where we are.

Of course, Eagle Pass has been one of the focal points along the U.S. southern border where we have seen mass migration over the last year. This is an area that just a few weeks ago right on the edge of the Rio Grande, this massive area here has been used as a field processing area for the thousands of migrants that have been crossing here, leading many lawmakers and local officials here to describe it as a crisis that was getting out of control.

And this comes on a day that we expect to see the Speaker of the House and a large contingency of House Republicans getting a tour of this area and meeting with state officials who have been very critical of the Biden administration for the way it has handled the migration crisis since they took office. But the Biden administration also hitting back at the speaker, saying that this visit is hamstringing and crippling the negotiations that have been ongoing there in Washington on a border security bill. But we expect to see this massive contingency of Republican lawmakers here in Eagle Pass in just a few hours.

MATTINGLY: Lauren, that brings up a fascinating contrast. You have very tight-lipped, very closed door, intensive negotiations in the Senate. You have House Republicans doing a very public viewing of the border. And at the same time, as you have been reporting, now launching in earnest the impeachment effort against Homeland Security Secretary Alejandro Mayorkas. He was just on. I asked him about that. This is what he said. Take a listen.

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ALEJANDRO MAYORKAS, HOMELAND SECURITY SECRETARY: I come to the office every morning, and I am surrounded by incredibly talented and dedicated people.

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And it is extraordinarily motivating to see the work they do, to witness firsthand their selflessness, their talent, their tireless dedication. Many sacrifice a tremendous amount. That's what I think about. And I am incredibly proud to work alongside them and to support them in advancing the mission of the Department of Homeland Security on behalf of the American people under President Biden's leadership. That's what I think about every day, and I am incredibly proud of coming to work every day and leaving the office, as late as it might be, having done the work with such extraordinary people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Lauren, you were pointing out when we were talking very early this morning about these issues that he has been so intensively engaged in the bipartisan talks that have been going on. We have no commitment whether House Republicans would move on any deal that's reached in the Senate. What does this impeachment do for what's happening right now on Capitol Hill?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I think it's an incredibly complicated dynamic, Phil. And it was interesting because you actually pushed Mayorkas on whether or not this impeachment effort from the House Republicans would actually have an impact on his ability to get a deal in those border negotiations. He said that he really hoped it wouldn't. But it's really hard to imagine how these two things can stay so separate given the fact that he is so involved in these border talks. He is in most of these meetings that we are staking out on Capitol Hill, and it is kind of unusual for a cabinet secretary to be so engaged in a conversation about policy. He says he is really there to just help guide the conversation, to provide technical support from him and his team.

But it does show you that even if Senate negotiators were able to find a deal, and they still have a lot to work to do, it is hard to imagine how House Republicans would move forward with it in their own chamber. House Speaker Johnson, given the dynamics of the Homeland Security Committee, how he would move forward and put that bill on the floor. And then that that leads to other questions about if you can't get a

border deal, if you can't get more funding for borer, then how are you going to pass Ukraine aid and Israel aid which have become wrapped up in those border talk negotiations? So it's such a complicated dynamic right now, and it is such a moment where so many issues are really coming to a head at one moment, and all on a topic, border security, that has bedeviled Congress for decades.

MATTINGLY: That was what I was just going to say. This is not an issue that you need to make more complicated based on the last two plus decades. And yet here we are. Ed Lavandera, Lauren Fox, big day ahead for both of you. Thank you.

CORNISH: Now Donald Trump is fighting in court to get back on the ballot in Maine. In his appeal, Trump's lawyers insist he did not engage in an insurrection on January 6th. They accuse Maine's secretary of state, a Democrat, of making a biased decision to disqualify him.

MATTINGLY: This all comes as new polling shows fewer and fewer GOP voters think Trump is responsible for the Capitol riot. A "Washington Post" poll finds that only 14 percent of Republicans now believe Trump bears a, quote, great deal or good amount of responsibility.

Joining us now to discuss all the legal issues, senior legal analyst Elie Honig and David Schoen, Donald Trump's defense lawyer during his second impeachment trial over his alleged involvement in January 6th.

David, I want to start with you. When you read through, as I assume you did, because you always do, the appeal that was filed, Elie made the point earlier. There are several different arguments that they are making. What did you see as the most effective in terms of how this is going to play out?

DAVID SCHOEN, TRUMP'S DEFENSE LAWYER DURING SECOND IMPEACHMENT TRIAL: First of all, I have to tell you, I am a little bit scared because I saw Elie Honig beating up George Conway the other night, and I don't want any part of that. I think that the -- you dominated him.

CORNISH: We think you can handle it.

SCHOEN: Thank you. I think that the primary part of the beginning of their complaint, it's a pretty bare bones complaint to get the process started, to get the appeal going, the Maine superior court, is one of bias. I don't know where that's going to go in the case. I do think the secretary made some inappropriate comments that seemed to indicate prejudgment in the case. But quite frankly, there's always a political bias in ballot access issues. Justice O'Connor wrote about it in one of the landmark ballot access cases, Clingman versus Beaver in 2005. You are dealing with members of a political party who have a certain agenda.

But I think the primary substantive issues here are going to be the same ones in Colorado. The textual issue, is "president" included in Section 3 of the 14th Amendment, does there have to be enabling federal legislation or is it self-executing? That's Griffin's case. And I think there is going to be discussion. You saw in the complaint about whether this arose to the level of insurrection.

I think the important issues there, quite frankly, rather than the substantive one, is if that's federal legislation that enables Section 3 because it is a federal criminal charge of insurrection, then are we using this process to circumvent all the safeguards that we would have if he really were charged with insurrection?

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He never was. They certainly considered it. He has never been charged with criminal insurrection. And if he had been, we have a burden of proof that they would have to make. It's compulsory process, right of confrontation, jury trial right. I don't think we want to use this amendment in this case to circumvent those safeguards. I think politically it ought to be a nonstarter, and I think the Colorado case will be reversed, and that will deal with Maine.

The last thing I want to say about Maine is it's troubling to have a non-lawyer like the Secretary Bellows deciding these complicated issues that legal scholars are differing over.

ELIE HONIG, SENIOR CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, I think the main thing to know about the 14th Amendment is there is so much we don't know. And if you look at Donald Trump's brief yesterday, he smartly, not unfairly, tries to take advantage of that. And so what he does is he leans into the procedural uncertainty that we have that David just talked about. We don't know. Is this up to Congress? The amendment itself says, Section 5 says Congress shall pass legislation, shall have the power to pass legislation to enforce this.

So do we have to wait for Congress to do that? The only legislation they've passed is that criminal law. Or are we going to leave it to the states? And then if we leave it to the states, are there procedures good enough? Do they protect due process. And if we just look at Colorado and Maine, we are seeing all sorts of variation in the way states are enforcing this. They are doing these mini-hearings with minimal levels of due process, question whether it's enough.

But I think what Trump's team is doing is they've recognize correctly this is unknown terrain, and we're going to take advantage of the uncertainty to argue we were not given a fair shake. And I think overall it's a fairly effective argument.

CORNISH: David, can you talk -- go ahead.

SCHOEN: Can I -- I'm sorry. I just want to add one thing to what Elie says. He is absolutely right on this question of do we leave it to the states. The United States Supreme Court spoke about this in the context of a presidential election in the landmark case Anderson versus Celebrezze in 1983. And they clearly said states have a lesser interest in presidential elections both because of the chaos they can cause by having differing decisions and because it's something to be decided by coalescence of voters in all of the states. We don't want one state to have an undue impact based on something like this. Sorry.

CORNISH: David, I just wanted to ask you one more thing, which is that fundamentally all of these arguments that the former president is making would have any effect if he was victorious, expand the powers of the executive and make that figure more powerful or immune or whatever. Do you think that that's wise? Do you think that that's something that I think even Republicans would want in the long term?

SCHOEN: First of all, I think it's great question. But I do think the mechanism we have to deal with this is the impeachment process. And while it's true, that is also a political process, that's the way our government is set up. We have checks and balances. I think that that's the check on the president's power when it comes to things that the president would say were official acts of office, and we use the text of this language. We don't loosely use or easily use an amendment to the Constitution to disenfranchise voters.

HONIG: Audie, I think your question goes to the other big issue right now, which is Donald Trump, he just filed a brief around midnight last night, is claiming immunity. He is not claiming that he can get away with anything because he was president throughout the entire four years. That's a little bit misconstrued. What he is saying what I was doing when I was contesting the election was within the scope of the presidency. I think that's a losing argument on the facts when you look at what Trump actually did. But his argument is what you do within the job is protected. I don't think this will fall within the job. But that's a very important issue as to presidential powers as well.

MATTINGLY: Elie Honig, David Schoen, thanks, guys. We appreciate it.

HONIG: Thank you.

CORNISH: Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis taking shots at Trump on the campaign trail, but they are refusing to hit him on January 6th. We are live following the campaigns.

MATTINGLY: And Chris Christie is firing back after New Hampshire Governor Chris Sununu said he should drop out of the 2024 race. Governor Sununu joins us next to respond.

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MATTINGLY: Well today, Nikki Haley will be rallying voters across New Hampshire as we head into the final stretch before the primaries there, the Iowa caucuses coming up in 12 days as well. She is sharpening her attacks on the frontrunner, Donald Trump, but she is still pulling some punches when it comes to January 6th; the same goes for Ron DeSantis.

Here is how he answered when he was asked about his tepid attacks on Trump.

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TERRY FITZGERALD, LE MARS, IOWA: Why do you protect Trump? What are you scared of? And we had a few questions like this basically: Are you scared of Trump? Is that why you don't criticize him more? How do you address it?

GOV. RON DESANTIS (R-FL), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, Terry, I take issue with that. I mean, I have rendered very sharp contrast between Donald Trump and myself with respect to policy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: CNN's Eva McKend is live for us in Portsmouth, New Hampshire with more.

Eva, it was striking in reading the logs of the townhalls and the meetings that they're having in the course of the last couple of days, they're sharpening their attacks, both DeSantis and Haley on Trump not going all the way in, but it's clear that there's a shift.

EVAN MCKEND, CNN NATIONAL POLITICS CORRESPONDENT: They are, Phil. You can hear it on the campaign trail.

You know, typically Nikki Haley will tell her supporters at this townhall that they came out to see her, to hear her view of the country, and what she plans to offer and not hear her go after her opponents.

But now, she is changing her tune a bit, going after former President Donald Trump directly and that is because an associated PAC of his has an ad that is playing heavily here going after her for her past positions on the gas tax.

Well, she wants to clear that up, so she is now responding to this directly. Take a listen to how this sounds on the trail.

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NIKKI HALEY (R), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE:` I've noticed that President Trump has given me some attention, and I appreciate that because that means he sees what we're seeing, but in his commercials and in his temper tantrums, every single thing that he said has been a lie.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MCKEND: So new this morning, we're learning that her campaign announced that they raised $24 million in the latest quarter so some good news for them and perhaps an illustration that she is continuing to capture quite a bit of momentum especially as others have exited the field.

She will have three stops today in Kingston, Londonderry, and Milford, so she'll continue to crisscross the state with Governor Sununu.

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He sort of acts as the warm up for her in these various stops. Last night, he told New Hampshire voters that this was really crunch time, Phil. Governor DeSantis out on the trail as well. He will make several stops

in Iowa. Vivek Ramaswamy, Asa Hutchinson in Iowa, too, Chris Christie, he will be here in New Hampshire, the end of the week -- Phil.

MATTINGLY: Eva McKend, another big impressive number for Nikki Haley on the fundraising side. Appreciate it. Thank you.

CORNISH: Now pushing back against New Hampshire Governor Chris Sununu's suggestion that his campaign has no path forward, Sununu, who is backing Nikki Haley said yesterday that Christie "has kind of hit his limit." And Christie responded last night on CNN.

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CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Since Chris started to work for Nikki Haley and become an employee of Nikki Haley, it is not the same Chris Sununu anymore.

Chris Sununu, as you'll recall, was one of the most vocal Donald Trump critics in this country.

This is a guy who has said Donald Trump is unfit, all things that his candidate is unwilling to say. The shame of this is that Chris has now abandoned his principles in order to try to, you know, get himself some political favor inside of his own state.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Governor, welcome to the program. Sorry to start with a friend who is bashing you, but I do want you to answer because honestly, it sounds personal.

GOV. CHRIS SUNUNU (R-NH): No, no, it's -- look, Chris is a good guy. He's a smart guy. He's working hard. I get it, he is frustrated.

And, you know, I kind of -- you have to remind all of these candidates when -- Chris knows, when he got into the race, it was a long shot, for all of them, it really was. Everyone knew we had to consolidate around one candidate.

Chris has done a very good job speaking the truth on Trump as a lot of us have. And I think there's an opportunity, and we're not saying hey, Chris, go -- you know, get out of the race and disappear.

I think a lot of folks are understanding, Chris has an opportunity to be kind of the hero here. Not just bow out gracefully, but help consolidate this race, help do the right thing, help deliver Trump that loss in New Hampshire that we all know is very possible. We just don't want his five or six percent, which isn't really going to go much higher than that to be the difference maker and allow Trump to win knowing that those voters can, should, and I think will consolidate around Nikki Haley.

So Nikki has the momentum. Her numbers are surging. She is over 30 percent in almost all the polls right now. No one thought she could even get this close, and she is the only one working it. I mean, this morning, we were right there in Portsmouth. I mean, 7:00

AM, she is out there with me meeting with fishermen talking about their issues and the overregulation, and how this affects their families and their ability to drive economic success here in New Hampshire.

She is doing the coffee shops. She is doing the townhalls. She is doing retail politics the way it is supposed to be done, and that is why the numbers are moving.

Chris has done a great job, but again, he's kind of hit that limit. It's not going to go any higher, and now it's just a time to consolidate.

CORNISH: Governor, I want to talk about this momentum because it's also included increased funding and support from donors, and now she's starting to receive criticism for that.

Ron DeSantis told his supporters this week, Donald Trump is running on his issues. Nikki Haley is running on her donors' issues. And he has previously said: "Nikki will cave to those big donors when it counts."

Can you speak to voters who have concerns about say, the Koch brothers, right? That's a billion dollar kind of industrialist, political supporters who have backed her now.

SUNUNU: So it's a criticism that she is actually garnering a lot of momentum, the fundraising, the donor base -- everybody is coming in to support Nikki Haley. Donors that any of those candidates would kill to have, frankly. They're kind of coming out of the sidelines. They were waiting for this to become a one-on-one race to see who it was, and it is.

I think Ron has run a good race. I think Chris has run a good race. Nikki is the one that has really surged here. She is the one that has made it a one-on-one race, that's why the donors are coming out.

So nobody cares about any of that type of criticism. All of those guys would love to have the support that Nikki is garnering. Again, they've all run good races. We'll see what happens out in Iowa, but right here in New Hampshire, we know that Nikki has a shot to beat Trump and really hit the reset button on this entire campaign for the whole country.

CORNISH: Still ahead of all those candidates and her is the former president, and people do have concerns about that.

SUNUNU: Barely.

CORNISH: Especially concerns about how they're attacking each other. Here's Jeff Angelo, he is a conservative radio host moving to Iowa for a minute, who has interviewed most of the field on his show, and I want you to hear what he told CNN.

I'll just read it for you now. Sorry. He said: "All they've done is eat into each other's momentum is and Trump is unscathed. They've spent almost all their time throwing punches at each other and they're touching Trump with a feather. It's the exact same problem as 2016."

Do you think that Nikki Haley should shift her strategy?

SUNUNU: No. No, her strategy is -- of all the candidates, even with Trump, she is the only one with momentum, right?

Trump is unscathed. He is sitting at barely over 40 percent of support. He is a former president.

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He's a former president, right? The standard bearer of the party, and he can't even get 50 percent of his own party support in a primary and by state. So no, he is very much beat.

CORNISH: So, does this mean that Nikki Haley has --

SUNUNU: He should be running away with this thing with 80 percent.

CORNISH: So what would be a good showing for New Hampshire to you, right? Is second good enough? Or does she have to win to show she's viable?

SUNUNU: No, look, nobody -- put it this way. Trump has to win. He's the only one that has to win, because he's the only one where the expectation has been built, that it's -- that he is absolutely going to win, so a second place is fine. It just wants to -- we want it to be a one-on-one race before Super Tuesday and it's already pretty much a one-on-one race and we're not even into Iowa yet.

So if and when Nikki Haley comes out with a win, that's a shocker, a political shocker that shows that we have viability, and I always talk about the psychology of choice.

With having 15 candidates in the race, a lot of folks say yes, we'll just go with Trump. But now it's down to one-on-one Now it's that psychology of an A versus B, a candidate like Trump who flies in, does a rally, and flies the heck out or a candidate like Nikki Haley, who is a governor, who listens, who is retail politicking the right way, who's bringing folks in, who's building coalitions, who's actually been on the frontlines on a lot of this stuff.

She's doing it the right way and that's why her numbers are moving so much. Trump is sitting here in New Hampshire barely over 40 percent, that's why her delivering a win would be a shocker to everybody, but it's very doable.

She's the only one with momentum and it what everyone is hoping for, as we galvanize these other candidates around her. It's going to be awesome.

CORNISH: Well, Governor Chris Sununu, thanks for bringing this energy.

SUNUNU: You bet. CORNISH: And Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis will take questions

directly from Iowa voters in back-to-back events. The CNN Republican Presidential Town Halls moderated by Kaitlan Collins and Erin Burnett air live tomorrow night starting at nine Eastern.

MATTINGLY: A newly released audio from inside the passenger plane that went up in flames in Japan has just been released, the final moments before the crash, it is ahead.

CORNISH: And a US official is confirming that Israel carried out a strike in Lebanon that killed one of Hamas' senior leaders. The concerns now being raised about the conflict expanding in the Middle East.

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