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CNN This Morning

Holly Baltz is Interviewed about the Epstein Documents; State Capitols Evacuated Ater Threat; Fears over Escalated Israel-Hamas War; Death Toll Rises in Japan. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired January 04, 2024 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Ms. Maxwell, the person who was and what her - what her demeanor was like when she was questioned during this deposition.

What did you see in those notes?

HOLLY BALTZ, INVESTIGATIONS EDITOR, "THE PALM BEACH POST": Yes, I saw some very interesting exchanges between Sigrid McCawley, she's an attorney who's represented many of the victims in many cases, and Maxwell. There was one exchange in which McCawley asked Maxwell, did you ever tell anyone that you recruited girls in order to take pressure off yourself? And Maxwell retorted, you don't ask me questions like that.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: Do you - listen, we expect more documents to be released. This is just the first tranche. What are you looking for? What do you think may come into the public domain over the course of the coming days?

BALTZ: You know, my suspicion is we may not get a whole lot of new names. The judge in - when she was justifying releasing the names often said that the does (ph) had been widely reported already.

But, the details. You know, like the new things about Clinton and Trump. It really, so far, paints a picture of what the girls and young women were experiencing. And it was quite horrific.

CORNISH: And we should mention that the names of victims were also released in this. Can you talk about why?

BALTZ: Well, again, I think it was because the judge felt like they had been widely reported already. Sjoberg (ph) had spoken with "The Daily Mail," and there were some others. But there were also minor victims that she said will remain sealed.

CORNISH: Holly Baltz, thanks so much for talking about these documents with us.

BALTZ: Thank you.

CORNISH: Multiple states on edge this morning after a mass email bomb threat was sent to government offices or officials in at least 23 states yesterday. According to a copy of the email obtained by CNN, it claimed explosives were placed inside, quote, your state capitol, with no specific state named. The threat forced several states to briefly close and evacuate their state capitols, while others conducted searches without evacuations. No states reported finding anything threatening in their buildings.

MATTINGLY: Now, in a statement, the FBI called the threats a hoax that puts, quote, "innocent people at risk." And said that while it was continuing to gather information, there was no indication of a specific or credible threat.

Joining us now to discuss all this, CNN's senior law enforcement analyst and former FBI director Andrew McCabe.

Andy, appreciate your time this morning.

Most of the capitols evacuated for kind of a brief amount of time. It would seem on its face to be minimal disruptions. But the actual effect of this, when something like this happens, can you explain to people who maybe just see that and think, you know, move on?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Sure. You know, Phil, the point of these sort of mass threats, and hoax threats, is really to disrupt, to harass the targets, and ultimately to create fear and terror on some level. And they all accomplished that. As you said, some places react more strongly than others. But really in every one of these instance, law enforcement doesn't have the luxury of reading this email and instantly, you know, just going with the likely result and dismissing it as a hoax. They have got to take some procedures, some precautions to at least confirm that they aren't dealing with a real threat here.

It's easier in a situation like this, when it's a mass mailing that's identical, it's been received by over, you know, 23, 24 different statehouses around the country. It's kind of even easier to lean this that direction of saying this is a likely hoax. But you always have to take threat reporting seriously. I think the - the locations that evacuated their courthouses temporarily, conducted logical checks did the right thing, but that takes an enormous amount of time and resources and really distracts those responders from other duties.

CORNISH: At the same time I'm sort of familiar with ransomware attacks that's affected many cities, hospitals, et cetera. But with this type of threat, is this something that we're seeing more frequently?

MCCABE: You know, Audie, we've been seeing these sort of internet- based threats for quite some time. You'll remember back in 2017 there was a young man who was a dual U.S./Israeli citizen, was actually arrested in Israel for sending out what authorities believe were somewhere in the neighborhood of 2,000 different threats online. And he was doing it for a variety of reasons. He was trying to profit from them by charging folks fees on the dark web to submit threats to schools. But he was also alleged to have significant mental health issues.

[08:35:02] So, the range of possible motives for these things are broad.

When you see them directed at political institutions or judicial institutions, I think it's reasonable to suspect that the person or people behind them are somehow motivated by some sort of politically tinged ideology or grievance or anger. But again, we won't know that until they find, if they find, the person who's been behind these threats that we saw yesterday.

MATTINGLY: Yes, it -- what's fascinating to me is, to your point, not a when necessary, could be an if as well. Is there anything law enforcement can do to get in front of these, to combat it on the front end as opposed to trying to search in the aftermath?

MCCABE: Really tough to do that, Phil. It's hard to predict where the next one's going to drop. But, to me, the most important element in this, and that was certainly my feeling when I was overseeing these matters at the FBI, coordination is the key. So, to have each location, each target location that receives a communication like this immediately report it to their local FBI bi office or their local Joint Terrorism Task Force is super important. That way at least you have one national entity that understands the total threat picture, where all these things are landing, and can do the kind of really considered research and intelligence collection that might lead to identifying and locating the offender. And that's really the only way to turn these things off, to make sure that folks get investigated and prosecuted if there's a case there.

CORNISH: And I want to switch it up and bring to you some video that I think has sort of brought a lot of amusement on the internet, but it's actually an image of a defendant violently attacking a Las Vegas judge in a courtroom. This is Judge Mary Kay Holthus, who was in the middle of sentencing Deobra Redden for attempted battery.

When you - when you see something like this, what are your concerns?

MCCABE: Yes, well, Audie, well there's - there's, of course, nothing funny about the video to anyone who's ever worked in a courtroom, either as a law enforcement officer or a part of the judicial branch. And I think part of that is because we know that there are literally thousands of people who receive judgments they did not want or sentences around the country, in federal, state, and local courthouses every single day. And there's really no way to accurately determine which one of those people is going to snap, like this man did, and talk matters into his own hands and commit some sort of act of violence.

So, it's impossible to protect completely against that threat. You know, you have -- our judicial system is already bogged down by a lack of resources and they are required to maintain an environment that respectful and protects the rights of the defendants. But really at any moment something like this can happen. And so it's quite a risk and it creates extreme anxiety for people who work in these environments.

And I should also say, you know, that I don't have hard data on this, but it does seems like the current wave of discourse and criticism and attacks of the judiciary, of our legal institutions, of our law enforcement institutions, has led to an erosion of trust in those institutions. And you have to think that that adds to this problem, creates an environment in where almost more permissive to strike out against members of law enforcement and members of the court.

So, I think we're definitely in a time of elevated risk to people who work in that system that we all depend upon for justice.

MATTINGLY: It's an important point.

Andy McCabe, we appreciate your time this morning. Thank you.

MCCABE: Thanks.

CORNISH: And this just in, a new digital ad from Chris Christie in which he says he made a mistaken endorsing Donald Trump in 2016.

Watch this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When I decided to endorse Donald Trump for president, I did it because he was winning. And I did it because I thought I could make him a better candidate and a better president.

Well, I was wrong. I made a mistake. And now we're confronted with the very same choice again. Donald Trump is ahead in the polls. And so everyone says, anyone who's behind him should drop out and we should make our choice Donald Trump versus Joe Biden. Well, Joe Biden has had the wrong policies and Donald Trump will sell the soul of this country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now, of course, Christie has so far rejected calls by some Republicans for him to drop out of the race and consolidate support behind another non-Trump candidate.

We tracks (ph).

CORNISH: This is an atonement tour that has gone on for some time here with Chris Christie.

MATTINGLY: Months.

CORNISH: Yes, very striking.

[08:40:01]

MATTINGLY: Yes, I remember the day that he declared for Trump and stunned his campaign staff back in 2016 when he did it.

CORNISH: Right.

Well, we'll see if it works with voters.

MATTINGLY: Absolutely.

CORNISH: New information on the deadly blast in Iran, including who the U.S. believes was involved, as fears that the Israel/Hamas conflict could expand to a wider war.

MATTINGLY: And we're following more news out of the Middle East where a pro-Iran militia based in - or was struck in Baghdad, killing a top commander and another fighter. The latest details on that. That's ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTINGLY: We are following breaking news on a story we've been following throughout the morning. A U.S. official now tells CNN the U.S. targeted a member of an Iranian proxy group with, quote, "U.S. blood on his hands" in a strike in Baghdad. The target was a member of the Harakat al-Nujaba. The official said an Iranian proxy group operating in Iraq and Syria, and the U.S. had been watching him for some time before the strike, according to the official.

Meantime, Iran's president is warning Israel it will pay a heavy price after deadly explosions yesterday near the burial site of slain Iranian military commander Qassem Soleimani.

[08:45:03]

Now, a senior U.S. official has said - telling reporters, the blast, quote, "looks like a terrorist attack." The State Department also shooting down rumors that the U.S. or Israel were involved.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEW MILLER, SPOKESPERSON, U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE: The United States was not involved in any way and any suggestion to the contrary is ridiculous. And, number two, we have no reason to believe that Israel was involved.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Now, the U.S. has also joined 11 countries in condemning Houthi attacks against commercial and merchant vessels in the Red Sea, warning against further attacks in a strongly worded statement, saying, quote, "let our message now be clear, we call for the immediate end of these illegal attacks and release of unlawful detained vessels and crews."

Joining us now is former Israeli ambassador to the United Nations, Danny Danon, and CNN political and national security analyst David Sanger.

Welcome to the program.

David, I want to start with you and with the news we just heard, because I was going to start this discussion by asking what the U.S. can do to kind of de-escalate things, how it can deal with the tensions. What's your reaction to this reporting?

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, clearly, Audie, the U.S. has decided to step up a bit the pressure on these Iranian proxy groups. And if you just think about the past 24 hours, there was this warning to the Houthis, who are armed completely by the Iranians, in the Red Sea. They're the ones who have been doing the attacks on much of the cargo that has been running through the Red Sea. And a senior administration official told us yesterday this would be the final warning to the Houthis, suggesting that strikes could follow after that, although they were non-specific.

And then to have this strike inside Iraq is particularly fascinating because President Biden has been very hesitant to do strikes in Iraq for fear of destabilizing the Iraqi government. But it's gotten increasingly difficult because that government is made up, in part, of Iranian proxies.

CORNISH: Ambassador, I want to turn to you because you posted on X congratulating the IDF for its strike against a Hamas leader who was assassinated in Lebanon. And, you know, at the time a senior U.S. official actually confirmed to CNN that Israel was behind the strike, and yet Israel's not taking responsibility. Can you help us understand what's happening here?

DANNY DANON, FORMER ISRAELI AMBASSADOR TO THE UNITED STATES: Audie, they are very clear, we are determined to hunt down every terrorist who took part in the massacre on October 7th. We haven't forgotten what happened. The brutal killing, the raping of girls and women, kidnapping. And we will knock (ph) down not only (INAUDIBLE), but also (INAUDIBLE) terrorists who are hiding in different countries. We are determined to do the job, to finish with (INAUDIBLE) Hamas, and they cannot find shelter anywhere in the world. (INAUDIBLE) -

CORNISH: Then why not take credit for that?

DANON: (INAUDIBLE) -

CORNISH: Can you help us understand, why not take credit for that?

DANON: But I am saying - I am saying it very clearly, every terrorist who took part, including those who invaded our communities, the (INAUDIBLE), and also those who helped to finance it, or to support it, they will pay the price.

And, yes, the state of Israel will hunt them down. That's what we will do. We will not allow it to continue (INAUDIBLE) attacks like the one that happened here on October 7th. The days when Jews will (INAUDIBLE) and there will no response (INAUDIBLE). Today we have a state, we have the power and we will retaliate against those terrorists.

CORNISH: Now, I also want to ask about the relationship between -- with the U.S., because the U.S. has been pushing hard, you know, against two members of Benjamin Netanyahu's cabinet over comments they made about resettling Palestinians outside of Gaza. Israel's national security and finance ministers both pushing for that. And the U.S. State Department spokesman, Matt Miller, has called for those statements to stop, saying that they actually don't reflect the policy of the Israeli government. Does this public dispute within Netanyahu's government and the U.S. kind of undermine the messaging here?

DANON: Well, (INAUDIBLE) we have an up and down with (ph) the U.S. administration and we welcome the visit of Secretary Blinken to the region in -- next week he will come again.

You know, the issue of voluntary evacuations of refugees from Gaza (INAUDIBLE) by the Israeli government. There's no discussion or decision. But I think the legitimate discussions, people in Gaza want to move out, and our countries are willing to -- to allow them and to apply -- allow them to apply for asylum there. I don't think anyone should stop it. Like any other refugee that wants to move or to move to another country.

[08:50:05]

But there is no official decision of the government in Israel about this issue.

CORNISH: So, clearly, this is about forced migration.

But I want to turn to you, David Sanger, and ask what you're hearing from the White House in terms of trying to, if not keep these things contained, deescalate.

SANGER: Well, it's a very hard line to go run, Audie, in part because on the one hand the pressure on the U.S. military is to establish or re-establish some deterrents. And you're not going to do that if you are clearly -- if you're only playing defense in the Red Sea. If you are not going back after the sources of the attacks on U.S. forces in Iraq or in Syria. You can't just be spending your time intercepting weapons. And yet, at the same time, President Biden is trying to make sure that he does this in a selective enough way that he does not open up new fronts in the war.

And it's not at all clear to us that they're going to get this right. I mean it's a really tough balancing act. And you're dealing with a bunch of independent actors. They all have one commonality, which is that Iran has been feeding them arms, feeding them intelligence and so forth. But we don't have evidence that the Iranians are necessarily calling the shots here. And that's what's making this so difficult. It's such an array of different players in the Mideast at such a volatile moment.

CORNISH: David Sanger, Ambassador Danon, thank you so much for speaking with us.

MATTINGLY: Well, the death toll in Japan has now risen to 84 as rescuers continue to search for survivors from a deadly earthquake on Monday. Our crews are on the ground in the city that was hit the hardest hit, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:55:52] CORNISH: The death toll rising to 84 after a 7.5 magnitude earthquake devastated Japan's west coast on Monday. Rescuers are racing against time in the search for survivors, as many people are thought to be trapped under their collapsed homes.

MATTINGLY: Thousands more residents are still without power and water, and hundreds of others are cut off from help due to landslides and blocked roads.

CNN's Hanako Montgomery has been live in some of the hardest hit areas from this earthquake.

Hanako, what have you seen? What are people telling you?

HANAKO MONTGOMERY, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Phil, when you walk through this town, it's practically silent. There are no locals around anymore. And this quiet is only interrupted when rescue operators are trying to pull people out from under the rubble or emergency earthquake alarms are going off. It's very desolate in this town. And this is what we saw.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MONTGOMERY (voice over): Once an idyllic sea-side town, in just minutes, parts of Wajima reduced to rubble. The life Kyoko built, gone in an instant.

KYOKO IZUMI, LIQUOR SHOP OWNER (through translator): It's hell. I've never seen anything like this. it's my first time experiencing something like this

MONTGOMERY (voice over): With phone lines down, Kyoko can only hope her friends are alive, as she recons with her new reality.

IZUMI (through translator): The aftershocks are really scary. They happen multiple times throughout the night. Last night was really intense.

MONTGOMERY: What happened last night? (Speaking in foreign language).

IZUMI (through translator): Last night I think there were two magnitude five aftershocks and it felt like the entire ground was getting pushed up beneath me.

MONTGOMERY (voice over): Some in Kyoko's hometown remain stuck under their collapsed homes.

MONTGOMERY: Just behind me, dozens of police officers are trying to pull a woman they believe is stuck under the rubble of her house. The police are from Ichia (ph), a prefecture over 300 kilometers away, which just goes to show the scale of rescue operations in Ishikawa prefecture.

MONTGOMERY (voice over): Racing against time, emergency personnel work into the night. The constant aftershocks and fires hamper rescue operations, making it take days. Dozens still missing in Ishikawa prefecture. Entire communities cut off by landslides, fallen trees and broken roads.

MONTGOMERY: This is just one of the many roads that have been completely destroyed in Wajima City, making it nearly impossible for aid to get in.

MONTGOMERY (voice over): For us the journey to Wajima took all day, as we navigated these roadblocks alongside the dozens of fire and aide trucks on their way, while bypassing fallen debris.

But what little help does get through is far from enough. Water, food and blankets are in short supply. Essential goods Japan says must get to survivors.

At evacuation centers, reports of people dying according to city hall officials.

FUMIO KISHIDA, JAPANESE PRIME MINISTER (through translator): The situation is terribly challenging. But until those 72 hours crucial for saving lives pass, we must do our utmost to save and rescue as many people as possible with everything we have on the ground.

MONTGOMERY (voice over): But the full scale of devastation still unknown. Those who had the means to flee their hometowns have gone, while others try to find remnants of their lives scattered among the rubble.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MONTGOMERY (on camera): And, Phil, I can't stress to you enough how little these people had. Some of the survivors we spoke to at these centers only had a bottle of water each day for sustenance. By the time we got there last night, there were no mats or blankets left, so we slept in our car. But that is absolutely nothing compared to locals because they don't even have a home to return to, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Yes, it's a horrifying situation. Really important piece. Hanako Montgomery, thank you very much.

CORNISH: We also want to remind you that Ron DeSantis and Nikki Haley take questions -

MATTINGLY: Oh, you'll be watching.

CORNISH: Directly from Iowa voters in back-to-back events.

[09:00:03]

The CNN Republican presidential town halls moderated by Kaitlan Collins and Erin Burnett air live tonight starting at 9:00 Eastern.

MATTINGLY: I am excited to watch that.

CORNISH: I am too.

MATTINGLY: You know why? Because I think those are really important moments that create moments but also it's about time for people to vote.

CORNISH: Yes, and the focus on the voters is where it's at.

MATTINGLY: Absolutely.

CORNISH: "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts now.

MATTINGLY: See you tomorrow.