Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

Donald Trump to Attend Court in New York Concerning Damages in Defamation Lawsuit; Polling Shows Donald Trump's Legal Issues Are Not a Concern for Majority of Republican Voters; Deputy Campaign Manager for Gov. Ron DeSantis's Presidential Campaign Interviewed on Possible Path Forward to Republican Presidential Nomination; Today: DHS Deadline for Texas to Restore Border Access; Suspected Long Island Serial Killer Charged with Fourth Murder. Aired 8-8:30a ET

Aired January 17, 2024 - 08:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:00:00]

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: So there's some people who seem to respond better to lifestyle changes and others who don't. And I think what the challenge is for a lot of doctors, especially obesity medicine doctors, is trying to figure out which class of people, class of patient they're actually dealing with. These medications, again, I think people are very bullish on them because of the extreme weight loss and how many people they can potentially benefit very, very quickly.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: All right, I learned that BMI was for Belgian soldiers in the 1800s.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Yes. Who knew? I knew.

MATTINGLY: There was a lot of focus in my childhood on physicals based on that, which is interesting to find out. Dr. Sanjay Gupta, thank you, as always, my friend. You have to listen to this episode of "Chasing Life" right now wherever you get your podcasts.

And CNN THIS MORNING continues right now.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: We now have our eyes on a very special place. You know what that place is? New Hampshire.

(APPLAUSE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Eventually New Hampshire, but Donald Trump is going to be here in New York in a courtroom again today. He's choosing to go off the campaign trail and into a different sort of campaign trail, if you will, in the courtroom. He is facing the writer, journalist, accusing him of defaming her and lying about sexually abusing her. Why today could be a pivotal moment in that trial. MATTINGLY: And Ron DeSantis has a campaign centered around Trump's

legal problems could cost Republicans the White House. The DeSantis deputy campaign manager joins us live to discuss why they still see a path to victory despite Trump's 30-point win in Iowa.

HARLOW: And the standoff over a blocked section of the border ramping up in Texas. The deadline looming today as one group urges some Americans to rise up and stop the, quote, invasion, those are their words. We'll get into it.

This hour of CNN THIS MORNING starts now.

Good morning, everyone. Glad you're with us. It is the top of the hour. I'm Poppy Harlow with Phil Mattingly in New York. This morning, Donald Trump's legal problems colliding with his presidential campaign. For the second day in a row, he will be in court for his defamation trial right here in New York City before he heads to New Hampshire for a campaign rally.

MATTINGLY: Today E. Jean Carroll will be taking the stand as the jury weighs how much Trump owes her in damages for repeatedly calling her a liar and denying he sexually assaulted her. Trump doesn't actually need to be there. He's choosing to attend just days before the crucial New Hampshire primary. Tonight after court, he will be holding a dueling campaign rally in the granite state at the same time as Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis is ramping up his ground operations as polls show him in a distant third place in the state. At his rally in New Hampshire last night, Trump suggested the criminal indictments against him have actually helped him in the presidential race.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: We won in the history of Iowa, nobody has ever come close to getting the kind of numbers I got. If I didn't get indicted all these times and if they didn't unfairly go after, I would have won, but it would have been much closer, I tell you. I don't know if I would have made the trade. I might have just liked the position we're in right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HARLOW: Ron DeSantis for his part is making the case that Republicans will lose in November if Donald Trump is the nominee and his legal problems dominate the election. Here is what DeSantis told our Wolf Blitzer during a town hall on CNN last night.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. RON DESANTIS, (R-FL) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If Donald Trump is the nominee, the election will revolve around all these legal issues, his trials, perhaps convictions if he goes to trial and loses there, and about things like January 6th. We're going to lose if that's the decision that voters are making based on that. We don't want it to be a referendum on those issues.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HARLOW: Kara Scannell joins us live outside the courthouse in Manhattan. He went yesterday. There were no cameras in his courtroom. That's why people didn't see him. What happens today in this case? He's going to be there again.

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Good morning, Phil and Poppy. So this morning Donald Trump is expected to be back in court where he will be sitting face to face with E. Jean Carroll. She is expected to take the stand today and testify on her behalf. This case, the judge said, is not going to be a do over, so it's not going to get into the sexual assault allegations. But it is about defamation, and that is how E. Jean Carroll suffered from Trump's statements in 2019, denying that he had raped her in a department store in New York in the mid- 1990s, saying that she wasn't his type and then implying that she made this story up to sell a book.

So Carroll is expected to testify about the harm that she felt from that. Her lawyers yesterday saying that she is scared, that she received threats from a number of Trump supporters echoing the statements that he was making publicly. And they say that the former president hasn't stopped even after that jury delivered the verdict last year and that this is still having an impact. So that is going to be what Carroll's testimony will mainly focus on today.

[08:05:01]

But Trump's attorneys will have a chance to cross examine her. And their point here, their argument, his defense, is that it's not -- Trump shouldn't be held accountable for mean tweets, and that Carroll actually benefitted by career opportunities that came after she went public with her allegations. Of course, this will be ultimately up to the jury to decide, and this trial is only expected to last a few days.

MATTINGLY: Given that tight timeline, Kara, what do we know about the jury, the people that are making up this jury?

SCANNELL: Yes, so this jury is made up of seven men and two women. They range in age from the mid-20s to about 60 years old, and they're made up of New Yorkers, some from the city, from Manhattan, from the Bronx, others from the neighboring counties. And it's a mix of professionals and retired folks. There's a person on the jury who is a retired New York City transit worker. There's several people in the medical industrial. There's a publicist on this jury. And there's also some individuals that are not actually born in the U.S. but have become citizens. There's a woman from Germany and a man from Ireland.

So a real mix of representation of New York, and they will be the ones deciding this. Interestingly, the trial last year, the jury was six men and three women, so this is a fairly close makeup that is very similar with seven men and two women this time around.

MATTINGLY: Kara Scannell live for us, thank you.

HARLOW: And while former President Trump might be in court this morning, he is still celebrating quite a victory in Iowa. It is the kind of momentum he will no doubt try to capitalize on in New Hampshire next week and, of course, beyond. It signals Trump's grip on the Republican Party is very tight. Just how tight has that gotten? CNN's senior data reporter Harry Enten with us with more. How much? How do you measure this in numbers?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR POLITICS WRITER AND ANALYST: You know it was so interesting to me. We had those entrants' polls from Iowa, and everyone is like oh, my goodness gracious, look at what voters think out there in Iowa. And I just went and I said, wait a minute, the preelection polls have shown this the entire time.

And we'll just start off with a very simple thing. Was Biden's 2020 win legitimate? And what we've seen here, this is in 2021, just 39 percent of Republicans said yes, 58 percent said no. This number has been trending in Trump's direction, right, but by late 2023 it was 31 percent, 67 percent, the vast majority of Republicans believe that Biden's win was not legitimate. This was not surprising to see in the entrants' polls.

HARLOW: In Iowa.

ENTEN: In Iowa. But this was national, right. So what we saw in Iowa holds nationally.

And the same thing held true on this particular question. There was this question, OK, if Trump is convicted, would you still vote for him? And the vast majority of Republicans in Iowa said yes. That was not surprising to me either because take a look at this poll question we asked a few months ago. If true the charges against Trump regarding January 6th are not relevant to his fitness for the presidency? Again, the vast majority of Republicans say yes. You would think first off, OK, maybe if the charges weren't true they wouldn't matter, right? But if they are true, if they are true, the vast majority of Republicans say they don't matter.

And look at this percentage, right. We have this sort of three-pronged question. This response should disqualify him from the presidency, just 13 percent of Republicans say yes, if the charges are true. That's what I keep trying to put in here.

HARLOW: Right. And so then, elected officials, that's another question in terms of what they think. Many of them point to their constituents as the reasoning for why they hold whatever position on this.

ENTEN: Yes. And there's this whole question, OK, why won't the GOP establishment stop Donald Trump, right? Maybe it's because they like Donald Trump and they agree with their constituents. So endorsements from governors and members of Congress, Donald Trump, look at this, Poppy, 108. Look at where Ron DeSantis is. He's at just seven.

HARLOW: Haley is at two.

ENTEN: Haley is at two. Chris Sununu is one of the two folks who are members of Congress or governors who have endorsed her. So he is winning on this score as well. Compare this to what we saw back in 2016, endorsements from governors and members of Congress who are at this point in the primary process, Trump had zero. He had zero. His first endorsement didn't come until February 24th. Now he's at 108. The fact is, Poppy, it's not just the voters who are behind him, it's also the GOP establishment as well. They have -- he has bent them to his will.

HARLOW: Your point about maybe it's because they like what they see. Here he was untested and didn't know what kind of president he would be. Here he's tested.

ENTEN: He's tested. He's done what they wanted him to do.

HARLOW: Harry, thank you very much.

ENTEN: Thank you.

HARLOW: Phil?

MATTINGLY: It certainly appears Donald Trump is in position to once again potentially runway with the Republican nomination, but Ron DeSantis, despite coming in a distant second place in Iowa, sees an opening in Trump's legal problems.

Joining us is DeSantis deputy campaign manager David Polyansky. David, we appreciate your time this morning. I want to start there because the governor made -- it was a fascinating town hall last night with our colleague Wolf Blitzer, but this point that if, given Trump's legal issues, the number of charges, the number of indictments that are outstanding, that's what ends up in the general election, it will become a referendum on that, and Republicans will lose.

[08:10:09]

Do you think Republican voters want this to be a referendum on that? Because it seems like it at this point.

DAVID POLYANSKY, DESANTIS DEPUTY CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Well, first, thanks for having me, phil. I appreciate the opportunity to be here. And what I would say is, I'd echo what Governor DeSantis said last night. And I remind you he's here in New Hampshire today, he was in South Carolina as well out talking to voters and even out talking to Wolf Blitzer. And what he has relayed in Iowa, South Carolina, yesterday morning in New Hampshire, all through last night and into today is he feels Donald Trump's running on his issues, meaning these issues that we're talking about that led your news cast today.

He also feels Nikki Haley is running for her donors' issues, and we can get to that, that would be a lot of fun. But Ron DeSantis is the only one out taking questions from voters, talking to the press, and talking about the issues that ultimately matter most, not just to Republican voters, but to voters all across this country. That's the economy, that's immigration, school choice, the things that are top of mind that are going to ultimately decide the 2024 battle not just for the GOP nomination, but who controls the White House are going to be based on those issues. And any minute we as a party are spending talking about anything other is a wasted moment and a wasted opportunity and decreases our chances of doing just that.

MATTINGLY: When you kind of look ahead, not just in the next five or six days with New Hampshire, but more broadly than that, you guys were talking before Iowa. This is a long game. This is a lengthy process going forward. What is your pathway? I think that's what a lot of people are trying to figure out at this moment in time.

POLYANSKY: Sure. Look, it's pretty straightforward. It is a hard, this is a hard business. Donald Trump is not only the former president, he's a two-time GOP nominee. That was his third Iowa caucus. I'll repeat, his third Iowa caucus. This is not an easy process. It was not for the faint of heart. You have got to be willing to roll up your sleeves, or roll them down in places like Iowa and New Hampshire where it's really cold and snowy, and get to work and block out the noise. And that's just what we did.

We told everybody we needed to get a top two position out of Iowa to accomplish what we wanted, and we did that. Even after Nikki Haley spent a record amount, the most amount of money in this race, not only, you know, out of all three contenders, but more importantly, leveling $25 million of that towards Ron DeSantis in negative false ads. We got our ticket out. We went to South Carolina first yesterday morning to lay the marker that we are in this for the long haul and we expect to run a very aggressive campaign all across the palmetto state, and then we came here last night and spent some time with voters in New Hampshire, spent some time with Wolf on the stage, and we'll be back out at it today.

And what I'd say our expectations are pretty straightforward. We're going to grind in every state for delegates. We will do it here in New Hampshire, we're going to go to Nevada where Nikki Haley is not even competing for delegates. We're going to go to South Carolina and do it, and on February 25th, the day that Nikki Haley ends up having to drop out of the race after she gets wholly blown out in her home state, it will once again be a two-person race as we predicted all along.

MATTINGLY: I think the question right now is you guys haven't been on air, neither you nor your super PAC in New Hampshire since November. You haven't been up on air in South Carolina since July. The way the caucus structure works in Nevada, I think there's a lot questions about where your path is there. South Carolina, I think, polling-wise aren't there. New Hampshire, your campaign has acknowledged, isn't necessarily your best state. How are you going to survive until after South Carolina at this point?

POLYANSKY: We're going to grind it out. I think Governor DeSantis and, frankly, our whole campaign apparatus has shown we're just better as underdogs. We're better as the grind it out campaign and candidate. And frankly, since the summer, the mainstream media has written our pre-bituaries over and over and over again, and we've proved them wrong. Nobody in the summer thought Ron DeSantis was going to even be on the ballot the other night in Iowa, and not only was he, he was the second choice of Iowa caucus goers even after he's taken over $46 million in negative ads from both Haley and Trump. You've just got to stay patient. You've got to stay in the game.

You're got to find your opportunities and opportunities to punch, pivot. And ultimately when you get a two-person race and Donald Trump across the entire country, not just one state on Super Tuesday, you're going to get a real chance to make some gains and show some wins and show some successes that are going to be meaningful.

Anybody who thought this was going to be easy to defeat the former incumbent president of the United States was fooling themselves. This is a hard business, and we are in it for the long haul, though.

MATTINGLY: We'll be watching every step of the day. David Polyansky, we appreciate your time this morning. Thank you.

POLYANSKY: Thank you, Phil.

[08:15:00]

HARLOW: Ahead, the standoff is intensifying between the federal government and the state of Texas over a strip of land along the US- Mexico border and now, one group of people is calling for a stop the "invasion." We have a live report on the ground.

MATTINGLY: And Trump's legal team makes a sweeping request in the classified documents case. Why they want to pry into records from the Biden White House. We'll explain, next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTINGLY: Well today, a shutdown over the border looms between the federal government and the state of Texas. The Department of Homeland Security says the state must restore access to a portion of the border where a woman and two children drowned last week.

Federal agents say they were blocked from the area, something Texas denies.

HARLOW: And this comes as the top four lawmakers in Congress head to the White House to meet with President Biden about funding for border security.

Our Rosa Flores has been following this very closely. She joins us live again this morning in Eagle Pass, Texas.

Rosa, today is deadline day for Texas. Does it look like they will comply with this order from the Biden administration?

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Poppy, it does not look like Texas is standing down.

Let me show you. This is Shelby Park. You can see that the gates are still here. The Texas military vehicles are still here, and so are members of the Texas National Guard. You don't see them right now only because it's 24 degrees out here, so they're staying warm inside.

But I want you to look beyond this gate because this is Shelby Park. You'll see that the state of Texas has more fencing staged, more equipment. Beyond those vehicles that you're taking a look at that's where the Rio Grande is.

This is the general area where that woman and her two children drowned.

[08:20:06]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES (voice over): The battle between Texas and the Biden administration over border security has intensified in Eagle Pass after a migrant mother and her two children drowned last weekend trying to cross the Rio Grande.

Congressman Henry Cuellar says Texas is responsible.

REP. HENRY CUELLAR (D-TX): The state should have never kicked out the Border Patrol from doing their job at that particular area. They probably would have caught this at the moment that it was happening.

FLORES (voice over): The Texas Military Department took command and control of a public park last week surprising some local officials.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We are not in agreement with this operation.

FLORES (voice over): And US Border Patrol was denied access, not just to the park, but to 2.5 miles of river and to a critical staging area used to manage migrant surges.

Cuellar says Border Patrol's key surveillance equipment was removed, which could have detected migrants in the and potentially could have saved lives.

CUELLAR: I've never seen the state say federal government, you don't have the right to enforce immigration law. I have never seen this type of politics before.

FLORES (voice over): This border feud now hangs on the scales of the US Supreme court. The Biden administration asked the court to intervene saying Texas denied Border Patrol access and made it impossible for agents to potentially give aid to the three migrants who drowned.

The Texas Military Department pushed back saying federal agents asked for access to the river after the three drownings had occurred and that soldiers searched the river and no migrants were observed.

CNN reached out to Governor Greg Abbott's office for comment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The time has come.

FLORES (voice over): The standoff has the United Patriot Party inviting patriots from around the country to go to Eagle Pass starting Saturday to stop what they call an "invasion."

FLORES (on camera): What's your message to the all of patriots that want to come to this area?

EDDIE MORALES (D), TEXAS STATE REPRESENTATIVE: Don't come.

FLORES (voice over): Texas state representative, Eddie Morales says the so-called patriots are misinformed and instead of coming to Eagle Pass, they should camp outside Congress.

MORALES: The Republicans control the House of Representatives right now. If they were truly interested in solving this issue, they would fast track a border immigration and border security bill by tomorrow.

FLORES (voice over): The Department of Homeland Security has sent the Texas attorney general a cease and desist letter giving the state a deadline of today for the restoration of Border Patrol's access and removal of the border barriers.

As for one Eagle Pass resident who voted for Abbott and saw the sudden Texas takeover of the park --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Governor Abbott, please be transparent. Don't be secretive. We can handle the truth, but we can't handle non- transparency.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

FLORES (on camera): Now, Phil and Poppy, here is the irony of this Texas takeover of the park that you see behind me.

You see the fencing and you see the military personnel. This is not stopping illegal immigration.

According to a law enforcement source, what smugglers are doing is they are simply moving migrants further up river and that's how they're entering into the United States illegally -- Phil and Poppy.

HARLOW: A huge day today, deadline, we will see what happens, what Texas does and where the Supreme Court goes.

Rosa, thanks very much for your continued reporting on this.

MATTINGLY: Well, happening right now, Donald Trump is about to leave Trump Tower for court in the E. Jean Carroll defamation case before the case resumes in a little over an hour. We will keep you posted as that all plays out.

HARLOW: Also, the suspected serial killer on Long Island facing a new murder charge. How prosecutors say a single strand of hair and a Monster energy drink helped them crack this case.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:27:30]

HARLOW: This morning, the new murder charge against the suspected Long Island serial killer hinges on a single strand of hair. Rex Heuermann has pleaded not guilty to the charge yesterday that he

killed a fourth woman, Maureen Brainard-Barnes and dumped her remains near Gilgo Beach.

MATTINGLY: The prosecutors revealed how DNA from a Monster energy drink from Heuermann's daughter helped link him to one of the murders.

CNN's Brynn Gingras joins us now.

Brynn, tell us more about the evidence that led to this charge.

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Poppy and Phil, evidence like a computer that investigators say Heuermann may have been chatting with one of the victims on and then tried to wipe the data.

But listen, it's that DNA evidence you guys were just talking about that the district attorney calls cutting edge, where they were able to take hairs that were found on the bodies of these victims and matched them to items like water bottles that investigators say Heuermann's wife was using or that Monster energy drink that investigators say Heuermann's daughter was drinking on a train before throwing it out.

It's evidence like that they say helped clinch the finale of the killings of the Gilgo Four.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICOLETTE BRAINARD-BARNES, MAUREEN BRAINARD-BARNES' DAUGHTER: I was only seven years old when my mother was murdered.

GINGRAS (voice over): Nicolette Brainard-Barnes speaking publicly for the first time after facing in court the man accused of killing her mother, Maureen.

BRAINARD-BARNES: I remember she read to me every night and now I can no longer remember the sound of her voice. I wish she was here today, but she was taken from us.

GINGRAS (voice over): Rex Heuermann charged with killing Maureen Brainard-Barnes, a 25-year-old woman who vanished in 2007 and is believed to be the Gilgo Beach killer's first victim.

Heuermann is now accused in the murders of all four women who were found within a quarter mile of each other along the same stretch of parkway on Long Island and infamously became known as the Gilgo Four.

He has pleaded not guilty.

RAY TIERNEY, SUFFOLK COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: This indictment marks a change in the investigation.

GINGRAS (voice over): A hair found on a belt used to bind Barnes matches the DNA profile of Heuermann's now estranged wife, Asa Ellerup.

The discovery made using advanced nuclear DNA analysis. TIERNEY: We believe these DNA results are significant. Nuclear DNA

has illustrated as much more discriminate.

GINGRAS (voice over): In the 23-page updated indictment, prosecutors lay out more evidence they say ties the 60-year-old architect to the killings of the four women authorities say were sex workers.

Hairs found on Megan Waterman's body and the burlap bindings match Rex Heuermann and his wife's advanced DNA profile and a hair found on Amber Costello's body matches Heuermann's daughter, Victoria.

Evidence Heuermann's attorney is already taking issue with.

MICHAEL BROWN, ATTORNEY FOR REX HEUERMANN: All along, we have been told that the evidence is unsuitable for nuclear DNA testing. This morning was the first time, and this is 13-plus years, that miraculously nuclear DNA testing and results have come forward.

GINGRAS (voice over): Police say burner phones and computer activity also show communications with some of the victims. A credit card statement found in a storage locker and cell phone records further confirm Heuermann's family was out of town when the murders took place which allowed "unfettered time to execute his plans for each victim," the indictment reads.

TIERNEY: The grand jury investigation of the so-called Gilgo Four is over.

GINGRAS (voice over): A step forward for family members continuing to seek justice.

[08:30:58]