Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

New Evidence in Serial Killings; Trump Lawyers Want Biden-Era Records; Sen. Michael Bennet (D-CO) is Interviewed about Ukraine Funding. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired January 17, 2024 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): And the burlap bindings match Rex Heuermann and his wife's advanced DNA profile. And a hair found on Amber Costello's body matches Heuermann's daughter, Victoria, evidence Heuermann's attorney is already taking issue with.

MICHAEL BROWN, ATTORNEY FOR REX HEUERMANN: All along we have been told that the evidence is unsuitable for nuclear DNA testing. This morning was the first time, and this is 13 plus years, that miraculously nuclear DNA testing and results have come forward.

GINGRAS (voice over): Police say burner phones and computer activity also show communications with some of the victims. A credit card statement found in the storage locker and cell phone records further confirm Heuermann's family was out of town when the murders took place, which allowed, quote, "unfettered time to execute his plans for each victim," the indictment reads.

RAY TIERNEY, SUFFOLK COUNTY DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The grand jury investigation of the so-called Gilgo Four is over.

GINGRAS (voice over): A step forward for family members continuing to seek justice.

MELISSA CANN, MELISSA BRAINARD-BARNES' SISTER: These victims had families. They were human beings with aspirations and hope for a better future for themselves.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

GINGRAS (on camera): And that is Maureen Brainard-Barnes' younger sister. You might remember, more than a decade ago after her sister went missing, she received a call on her sister's cell phone. And on the other line was the killer taunting her. You can imagine the trauma that they have been living with, saying that finally there is a little bit of justice here, guys.

Rex Heuermann is expected back in court next month.

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Brynn Gingras for us. Thank you. Well, long-time Trump ally Roger Stone under fire for allegedly

threatening to assassinate two Democratic lawmakers. Who he targeted in a new recording.

POPPY HARLOW, CNN ANCHOR: Also, new video show Iran-backed militants marching on a seized ship in the Red Sea as the U.S. issue a new warning to merchants.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:35:45]

MATTINGLY: All right, now we're awaiting Donald Trump who's about to leave for court in the E. Jean Carroll defamation case before the case resumes in about less than an hour at this point.

And this morning Donald Trump's lawyers are trying to pull off a courtroom power grab in another case and use Biden-era White House records to build Trump's legal defense in the Mar-a-Lago classified documents case.

Now, Trump's team wants access to records from the National Security Council and the White House Counsel's Office. The legal filing accused special council Jack Smith and his federal prosecutors of, quote, "partisan election interference" for not providing them evidence Trump could use in the case.

HARLOW: So, prosecutors are arguing Trump mishandled sensitive and classified documents, illegally took them from the White House, stored them in places that include a ballroom and a bathroom at Mar-a-Lago, then defied subpoenas to turn over those records.

Our senior crime and justice reporter Katelyn Polantz is here in the flesh.

It's great to have you up here in New York with us.

Explain the legal filing and also why Trump's team wants Biden's stuff.

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Yes. So, this is a very typical thing to happen before any trial where the defense team says we want more evidence. We want to look at more things to build our case.

HARLOW: Sure.

POLANTZ: So, what Trump's team is doing now is they're trying to build that case. What they want to do and what is -- they're showing through asking for all kinds of documents right now around the federal government in this classified case is they want to be able to try and find some level of political coordination or communication between not just the Justice Department and their decision making, but other places.

So, they're asking for a really unusual amount of documents because it's - it's everybody. It's the intelligence community. It's the White House Counsel's Office, the Biden White House, the National Security Council. They also want to see interactions between the Fulton County D.A., that's prosecuting Trump, and the White House, the Secret Service, the Archives. They want the judge in this case to tell the prosecutors, go across the administration, the Biden administration, and make everybody give over their records around this classified documents case.

Whether that's going to actually happen is a big question. It's going to be up to the judge. The special counsel's office is certainly going to be pushing back for it. But Trump is making a very big ask here, which they're able to do in the way that you prepare for a trial, but nobody asks for this amount of stuff. I mean even Scooter Libby, who got to delve into some of this thing -- these things, he was asking for stuff from like the vice president's office, not the White House Counsel itself or the National Security Council.

MATTINGLY: Yes.

HARLOW: Everything.

POLANTZ: Yes.

MATTINGLY: Left out the Department of Transportation. That's very sad for them.

Can we take a step back, though, on a serious note. The other legal cases that the president -- the former president is dealing with right now, where - where do they - what are you watching? Where do they stand?

POLANTZ: Oh, I'm watching everything, Phil.

MATTINGLY: I know you are. That's why I'm asking.

POLANTZ: But the big one right now this week is we're watching to see what these three judges on the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals are going to do in the January 6th federal criminal case. Specifically, they heard this last week and now we're watching specifically to see what each of these people is going to vote for.

And just yesterday we got a little inkling of where their heads may be at right now. Judge Karen Henderson joined with three other conservative appointed judges on the D.C. Circuit in a totally different case to write a statement saying they want there to be a lot of deference by special counsel's offices that are pursuing a case like this against someone like Donald Trump, a former president. There should be a lot of deference around the executive branch, around the presidency.

Judge Pan has already written on this topic and has not said that. She's all for allowing criminal prosecutors to do what they're going to do. So, a big question of how they'll split on what happens with this presidential immunity question. A huge thing for Trump when his case will go forward to trial and also the presidency.

And then separately the 14th Amendment cases.

HARLOW: Right.

POLANTZ: This is the question of whether Trump can be on the ballot. There's a lot of action even expected this week. So, we have Illinois and we have Massachusetts, if I can find it, right here. They are both going to be meeting. The state boards are going to be meeting in those states an discussing whether Trump can be on the ballot. That's happening this week.

And then we're also today expecting a court in Maine to do something because they have a deadline. They have to come up with some sort of decision in the appeals process.

[08:40:01]

But none of that really matters ultimately until we get to this place of the Supreme Court. So, every state is going to figure out what they're going to do. And then on February 8th, that's the big date of Supreme Court oral arguments on the 14th Amendment. They will potentially set the law of the land in all of this.

HARLOW: Also the date of Nevada.

POLANTZ: Yes, indeed.

HARLOW: It's amazing the collision here.

Just finally, what about how all of these lawsuits play into one another?

POLANTZ: Yes. There's a ton. So, all of those are -- there's criminal cases, there's 14th Amendment cases, a lot of things. But then also there's other lawsuits where things that have been bubbling in the courts for a very long time are happening now. So, the New York AG civil fraud trial against Trump, his companies, that's over. We're just waiting for a decision there.

HARLOW: Right.

POLANTZ: E. Jean Carroll's defamation lawsuit, the second trial, we just saw it, he's going over to court right now. So, that jury is going to be hearing that case through the end of the week, potentially into next week, and then potentially bringing back a decision. These are both about money. Very, very important for the Trump world and businesses.

But then, separately, the January 6th lawsuits, they're still cooking. They're still in the system and there are situations in those cases that it's going to take a long time for people to get records, but a lot of those people that are suing Donald Trump and others are going to start being able to collect records the same way that the House committee was able to subpoena people and ask for interviews and criminal prosecution (INAUDIBLE).

MATTINGLY: Right. And we were just showing pictures of E. Jean Carroll walking into court. Just underscoring that all of this is happening at once. I think -- does your still -- office still have like a string plot of like all the 550 -

HARLOW: Stop giving away her secrets. I know you -

MATTINGLY: You think I'm kidding. No, I'm not giving her a hard time.

POLANTZ: I might - I might have a dry erase board that has a lot of numbers - case numbers.

MATTINGLY: It's - it's brilliant. That's why I would walk into her office in D.C.

Katelyn Polantz, thank you, my friend.

HARLOW: Grateful for your brain on all of this.

Here are "5 Things" to know for you this morning.

New video, look at this, it shows Houthi militants marching on the deck of a ship in the Red Sea last year. It comes as the U.S. warns ships to avoid the region until further notice because of the attacks and it plans to redesignate the group a terrorist entity.

MATTINGLY: The FBI and Capitol Police are investigating Trump ally Roger Stone for allegedly threatening to assassinate Democratic Congressman Eric Swalwell and Jerry Nadler. The comments were made on a tape the website Medite (ph) first obtained. CNN has not independently verified that tape.

HARLOW: There are new questions this morning about the 911 call made requesting an ambulance to Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin's home on New Year's Day. In the call, the aide asks that the emergency service be, quote, discreet. A review is underway.

MATTINGLY: A plea deal for the gunman who killed five people at an LGBTQ night club in Colorado Springs. Twenty-three-year-old Anderson Lee Aldrich will plead guilty to 74 counts of federal hate crimes and gun charges. Aldrich is expected to receive multiple life sentences but will not face the death penalty.

HARLOW: And today NTSB chief Jennifer Homendy and the FAA will brief lawmakers about the door plug that blew off of that Alaska Airlines Boeing 737 Max 9 plane. The closed-door hearing will be followed by an open hearing. That's tomorrow on Capitol Hill.

MATTINGLY: We'll have more on these stories all day long on CNN and cnn.com. And don't forget to download the "5 Things" podcast wherever you get your podcasts.

HARLOW: Ukraine's president warns the world that Vladimir Putin embodies war, but American aid remains stalled. A senator who is one of Ukraine's biggest supporters joins us next with a reality check on where these negotiations actually stand.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) [08:47:38]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PRES. VOLODYMYR ZELENSKY, UKRAINE: If anyone thinks this is only about us, this is only about Ukraine, they are fundamentally mistaken.

Putin embodies war and he will not change. He will not change. We must change.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: That's Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy at the World Economic Forum in Davos warning the world what could happen if Russia wins in its war against Ukraine. Later today President Biden will host the top four congressional leaders at the White House to discuss his funding request for Ukraine, Israel, and the border.

The president's supplemental spending bill has been held up for weeks by Republicans who are demanding changes to border policy and immigration policy. White House sources telling CNN Biden will stress the urgent need for Congress to moving quickly to approve additional funding for Ukraine and plans to both walk through the impact that U.S. aid has had on Ukraine's battle against Russia and also warn about the quote -- cost in action. The White House repeatedly warned that the administration has exhausted its presidential drawdown authority funding (ph).

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN KIRBY, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL SPOKESMAN: Our last security assistance package was authorized on the 27th of December. We meant it when we said it at the time that that was the last one for which we had replenishment authority.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Joining us now is Democratic Senator Michael Bennet of Colorado. He's been one of the biggest backers of Ukraine on Capitol Hill. He's a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee.

Senator, I appreciate your time this morning.

You have sought and received commitments from leadership over the course of the last several weeks, months even, related to Ukraine. It is still held up right now in large part because of immigration negotiations. Do you have any sense that this is something that can move in the near term?

SEN. MICHAEL BENNET (D-CO): I think it's something that has to move in the near term, Phil. We're close to a deal I think on immigration. We've got to get a broad bipartisan support here in the Senate. But we can't fail here.

CNN has an incredible report today that I saw about the importance of the Bradley fighting vehicle in this fight. Ukraine has succeeded in ways that nobody could have imagined over the last two years. They've done everything the world could have asked them to do. Their battle is not just a battle for Ukraine, it's a battle for democracy.

[08:50:01]

We cannot fail. We -- this is not one of those moments, Phil, when we can fail, blame the other party, and go home and say it's going to be OK. Democracy's on the line. The Western world, I would say, is on the line and we've got to get this done.

MATTINGLY: Fail and blame the other party -- to be frank. And you and I have spoken about this a lot over the years -- is what Congress does quite well at this point in time.

I think what I'm stuck on right now is, why is this different, particularly when the fulcrum here is immigration, which you know as well as anybody, you've spent so much time on this issue, just simply has never reached an outcome in the last two decades.

BENNET: Well, I think this may be a moment where we're out of excuses and we actually have to do the work. I mean, on the immigration question, there are 10,000 people a day coming to the southern border of the United States, many of whom are being smuggled there by transnational gangs. I think people in this place have finally woken up and realized that we can't put the immigration policies of this country in the hands of transnational gangs. That we have to fix it. And we might want someone else to fix it, but there is no one else to fix it. It's going to have to be Democrats and Republicans working together to do that.

And on Ukraine, I think it's the same kind of thing where people look around and say, isn't there someone else to carry on this fight against tyranny, and the answer is, no. And things are only going to get worse if we don't continue to support Zelenskyy and the brave people of Ukraine, Putin is going to be able to have his will in Ukraine and other places. That's going to drive the price of food and the price of fuel up for people all over the world. And I would say just as important to that, it's going to raise a real question in the minds of dictators all over the planet about what the United States' commitment to democracy is.

So, you're right, you and I have spent a lot of time over the years talking about how broken our democracy is. This is an opportunity to show the world that democracy still works, that this country can still lead, and that we have an important role to play, which we do.

MATTINGLY: There's a lot of discussion about what House Republicans will do if there is an agreement reached on immigration. But I'm interested, do you feel like the - where Democrats are on the policy, the willingness to make deals on specific issues, has shifted dramatically over the course of the last several months because of the issues at the border you're talking about?

BENNET: Yes, I think it has shifted dramatically and it should have shifted dramatically because of what's happened at the border. And when you see, you know, the -- no national immigration policy and

people like the mayor of Denver, you know, Mike Johnston, who is trying to contend with the homelessness crisis that existed in Denver and the fact that there are now migrants that are showing up every single day from the southern border, by the way, not their fault, all they're doing is trying to seek opportunity. But it - but it is -- again, it's not their fault that we've got a broken immigration system.

MATTINGLY: Right.

BENNET: It's Congress' fault. And I think we see that. And the administration's fault, to some extent. I think we see that recognition. And the most important thing we can do for the House is have a broad, bipartisan bill pass the Senate that's serious and that shows that we're going to contend with this set of issues on behalf of the American people.

MATTINGLY: I want to ask you before I let you go, the child tax credit, you have been one of its biggest supporters, biggest boosters, biggest backers. The expanded version that was in the American rescue plan. There is an agreement on a $70 plus billion tax deal. It won't go as far as the ARP, but it would expand the tax credit. It has been criticized by Rosa DeLauro, a leader in the House on this issue. She said, "Millions of children will be left in preventable poverty because of a policy choice, all while giant corporations who do not pay any taxes get a massive tax break."

I know you agree on the policy with Rosa DeLauro.

BENNET: Yes.

MATTINGLY: But that message, what's your message to her about this deal going forward?

BENNET: Well, first of all, Rosa's - I mean her criticism is well taken. Our goal in this country should -- we're in the richest country in the world -- should be to end childhood poverty. We proved in 2021 that we could cut childhood poverty in half. We made the most significant change in domestic tax policy in decades. And it worked. It did what we said it was going to do.

Now we have a more modest approach. It's all we could get to in a bipartisan agreement. But it's going to make a difference for 16 million kids. It will lift another almost half a million kids out of poverty, 200,000 kids in Colorado are going to benefit.

MATTINGLY: Right.

BENNET: And a lot of parents in this country that are making $12,000 or $13,000 or $14,000 a year that have two kids are going to see their credit go from less than $2,000 to over $3,600. It's going to make a lot of difference with groceries and with gas and with rent.

So, my heart is with Rosa, but I think we're going to make some progress here. We'll come back in 2025 and do the rest. [08:55:02]

MATTINGLY: Senator Michael Bennet. Always appreciate your time, sir, thank you.

BENNET: Thanks. Thank you for having me.

HARLOW: Well, help from high above. The rescue mission to save hikers stranded in a winter storm. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HARLOW: Now to our "Morning Moment."

Four college students rescued at the right moment. They were camping east of Lexington, Kentucky, when a winter storm stranded them in the Red River Gorge.

[09:00:01]

They had slept there but woke up to find the area just covered in snow. The students realized it was not safe to climb down. They called for help.

MATTINGLY: Search teams couldn't reach them on foot. That's when a helicopter swooped - landing on top of the rock.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Anytime we have to hike in to rescue somebody it's difficult. But when it's 15 degrees outside and snowing, it just - it ups the ante a lot more.

I'm assuming after all this they've probably learned a very valuable lesson in preparedness during camping in winter months.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Thankfully all four students were rescued successfully.

HARLOW: Yes. Thanks to the first responders there.

This just in, Trump's motorcade has left Trump Tower here in New York City for the courthouse where he will be in the courtroom for E. Jean Carroll's continuing defamation case.

"CNN NEWS CENTRAL" picks up now.