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Supreme Court To Hear Trump's Immunity Claim In April; Today: House To Vote On Extending Government Funding; McConnell To Step Down As Republican Leader In November. Aired 5:30-6a ET

Aired February 29, 2024 - 05:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[05:30:00]

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: The Supreme Court agreed to decide whether Trump can claim immunity in special counsel Jack Smith's election subversion case -- claims that Trump has been more than happy to speak about.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: If a president doesn't have immunity he really doesn't have a presidency. Presidential immunity is imperative. It's going to be very, very important. There is nothing more important to a presidency than immunity because they have to be free to make decisions without saying oh, if I do this or if I do that, as soon as I get out of office we're going to be indicted.

You have to have guaranteed immunity for a president. Otherwise, a president is not going to be able to function.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. The court is going to hear arguments the week of April 22. Put that down on your calendar.

Joining me now to discuss is former January 6 investigative counsel Marcus Childress. Marcus, it's great to have you here --

MARCUS CHILDRESS, FORMER JANUARY 6 INVESTIGATIVE COUNSEL: Thank you.

HUNT: -- this morning to help us kind of understand this.

Now, there are legal -- there are legal questions. There's many political ramifications. And then there's the historic unprecedented nature of the charge itself. Because we're not just talking about -- and I know you really know this cold because you helped craft it inside the January 6 report. They're not just deciding if a president is immune for -- you know, he shoplifted while he was President of the United States.

CHILDRESS: Right.

HUNT: This -- the question here is much weightier than that.

CHILDRESS: Right. HUNT: I mean, help us understand what exactly it is that Trump is claiming he can have immunity -- he should have immunity from.

CHILDRESS: That's exactly right. So it really comes down to official acts. And so, the question the Supreme Court actually grants cert for is to whether and to what extent a former president enjoys immunity for official acts in office.

And if you look at the special counsel's indictment, if you look at the D.C. Circuit opinion, or January 6 report, we're really talking about acts outside of the presidency. So, from the campaign, whether it be to call Georgia and look for 11,000 votes, or to do a fake electors scheme -- things of that nature which don't really fall under the purview or arguably, under the purview of the presidency.

And so, former President Trump is saying that enjoys immunity for all conduct as a president. And I think that a real distinguishing factor is going to be what is an official conduct of the president and what is not.

HUNT: Were you surprised at all that the Supreme Court decided to hear this case? I mean, there was kind of a line of thinking that they would just deny. Cert is kind of --

CHILDRESS: Right.

HUNT: -- the phrase that you'd use. But basically, they would say look, we're going to let the D.C. Circuit opinion that he is not immune stand -- and they decided not to do that.

CHILDRESS: Right.

Well, there was precedent for the -- for the Supreme Court to not take the case, right? So Trump v. Thompson -- in our case, they didn't grant cert to review our subpoena of former President Trump's records.

I wasn't surprised. Like, this is a fundamental question that deserves to be answered. We need to know to what extent does a president or a former president's actions enjoy immunity. I think this is a question that's never been answered by the Supreme Court. And so, the clarity from the court will be much needed.

I think the fact that the special counsel asked for this in December and it was just granted now at the end of February, beginning of March -- that's where the questions start to come in and where there might be some analysis of, like, could we have gotten here sooner rather than where we are now.

HUNT: Because the reality is this likely delays any trial in this case until around Labor Day, which is the height of the November election.

CHILDRESS: Yeah.

HUNT: What's your view of -- I mean, should the Justice Department have accelerated this indictment? I mean, they did -- you know, it took them several years --

CHILDRESS: Right.

HUNT: I mean, obviously, the committee investigation also extended over the course of that period of time. But, I mean, can you help us understand, like, why the timing was the way it was in terms of when Jack Smith decided to indict?

CHILDRESS: Well, whenever you're going to bring charges of this nature you have to be tight in your investigation, and it takes a long time. And so, I'm not going to critique the timing from the Department of Justice at all. These are pretty complicated charges, especially from a former president.

I think the timing part -- it's going to be interesting to see how it plays out. I think the Department is just going to push forward with the case even if they get a ruling at the end of June, beginning of July.

And Judge Chutkan has already said that she's not going to allow the political campaign side to impact her decision-making in this trial. Like, she -- I think she analogized it as all my defendants have jobs, right? And so, we could possibly be seeing trial start at the end of August or beginning of September timeframe and going through the election. And it will be interesting to see how that plays out with evidence coming out as we get to the election.

HUNT: Very intense.

And very briefly, the Justice Department's, sort of, policy to not interfere in elections --

CHILDRESS: Um-hum.

HUNT: -- which basically means they don't want to indict --

CHILDRESS: Correct.

HUNT: -- very close to an election --

CHILDRESS: Right.

HUNT: -- do you think that applies to a trial?

CHILDRESS: So it's -- we're in a matter of first impression, right, so we'll see. But I think there's one thing that you can notice is that it's the defendant who has been delaying here, right? It's not like the Department of Justice delayed and then decided to indict right before the election. It's the defendant who has been delaying. So I think we're in a different posture where if you do go to trial in August, you can say it was the defendant's own doing in pursuing these appeals and delaying so long.

HUNT: Very, very interesting.

Marcus Childress, thanks very much for joining us. CHILDRESS: Thank you.

HUNT: I really appreciate your perspective.

All right, let's go now to Capitol Hill because it does look like a partial government shutdown has been averted -- tell me if you've heard this before -- for now.

Republican House Speaker Mike Johnson confirmed to reporters that a vote on a continuing resolution to avert the shutdown is going to take place today. He also downplayed the fact that he is again putting a short-term resolution on the House floor.

[05:35:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): This is just a process C.R. to allow us to honor our 72-hour rule -- our 72-hour rule, and that's why we came to this point. And this is for the process to allow us to honor rules and not jam people with a large piece of legislation they haven't had a chance to review. So I think (INAUDIBLE.)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. Today's vote extends funding for six agencies to Friday, March 8 -- so we're literally punting this a week -- OK. It would extend the deadline for other agencies that were up against March 8 deadlines to March 22. OK, so they've got a couple more weeks.

Joining me now to discuss, Republican strategist Rina Shah, and congressional reporter for The Hill, Mychael Schnell. Ladies, thank you so much for joining us this morning.

Mychael, I was -- I was talking to one of your compatriots in the Hill press corps yesterday morning about Speaker Mike Johnson and how -- this was Andrew Desiderio from Punchbowl. He basically argued that people are criticizing Mike Johnson behind the scenes for not being able to make a decision.

And when I read this and think OK, we're going to kick the can -- I mean, at least previously, when I would cover these things and be standing in the scrums like you are now -- like, the can would get kicked six months down the road, right? Now we're kicking it like one week at a time.

I assume this is going to go forward today but, like, how do we solve the bigger problem here?

MYCHAEL SCHNELL, CONGRESSIONAL REPORTER, THE HILL: Yeah. So, Johnson, this entire time, has been under pressure by his right flank to move these single-subject appropriations bills. That's what we've been hearing for the past few months since he's under the gun right now to finish that job. That's why we're seeing this short-term spending bill because he wants to just buy them a little more time to get the job done on those bills, and then they can launch into FY 2025 negotiations.

Lawmakers have been very eager to note that we are still trying to figure out fiscal '24 legislation five months into the year, right?

HUNT: Right.

SCHNELL: This is something that's unnatural. You don't typically see it come this far ahead. But again, Mike Johnson is under pressure from his right flank to push for these conservative policy wins and these single-subject appropriations bills. He experienced the ouster of his predecessor for -- because of Republicans were not happy with how he dealt with government spending.

HUNT: Um-hum.

SCHNELL: So now he's really trying to see if he can appease them as far as he can.

HUNT: Yeah. But I have to say, Rina -- like, this has become normal, right --

RINA SHAH, REPUBLIC STRATEGIST: Um-hum.

HUNT: -- the C.R. to C.R. to C.R. This government by crisis.

I mean, do you think that they can actually do what Mychael is talking about considering -- I mean, Johnson has, like, the most narrow majority I have covered in the years that I have been --

SHAH: That's right.

HUNT: -- doing this. I mean, his job is hard for many reasons.

SHAH: Right. And so, the edict he has is get it done with ramming things through, and that's just not how we operate. So I think buying time like this, though it's a very limited window of time -- he's got to go back to these -- the chaos caucus. They're still -- that's what they are -- Gaetz and company. They ousted his predecessor for the very same reasons and they're not going to be happy with anything. So the idea right now is he's got to hold steady until November, and that's just common knowledge.

But going bigger and larger about sort of what these bills mean -- talking about the heaviness -- the things that are on the line if something fails tonight -- there's four bills that really make today's potential shutdown very dangerous. Again, this has been normalized and that's what I'm most worried about.

You've got a lot of people on the Hill right now on the Republican side that don't want to pull the levers of government because they want to shame Democrats, right? That's just obvious.

But the speaker has got to make sure that we get these agencies funded and we don't put, again, the federal government in peril, which is not part and parcel with how politics is.

HUNT: Yeah. And also -- yeah -- continual -- I mean, how many times have we had this conversation, Mychael?

SCHNELL: This is the fourth -- this is the fourth time we've done it --

HUNT: The fourth with me?

SCHNELL: -- just in the past six months. This is the fourth time we're (INAUDIBLE).

HUNT: Cool, OK. That's where we are.

All right, I'm going to talk to both of them, too, about we've got this other massive headline on Capitol Hill. It really is the end of an era in Washington. Mitch McConnell, Senate minority leader, announcing Wednesday he's going to step down as the Republican Senate leader. He's going to do it in November.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): Father Time remains undefeated. I'm no longer the young man sitting in the back hoping colleagues would remember my name. It's time for the next generation of leadership.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Wow. Many Senate Republicans, even -- especially those who have been critical of McConnell -- they see this announcement as a chance for a fresh start -- watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RON JOHNSON (R-WI): And I think there is a great deal of respect shown to him inside the lunch. It's the end of an era but I --

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: But you've been -- you've been sharply critical of him.

R. JOHNSON: You know, I appreciate the fact that he's announced it now to give our conference the time to really sit down and decide what our mission needs to be. What are our goals?

SEN. JOSH HAWLEY (R-MO): I'm looking for somebody who is going to bring fresh vision and who wants to put working people at the -- I mean, this party wants to be a majority party but they don't want to do anything that actually helps the majority.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: That, of course, the indefatigable Manu Raju speaking there to Sen. Ron Johnson.

I mean, Mychael, it is seismic -- this change -- but I also think it had gotten to the point where it was -- it was feeling inevitable.

SCHNELL: Um-hum.

HUNT: Not only was -- and McConnell acknowledged that --

SCHNELL: Yeah.

[05:40:00]

HUNT: -- his quote was basically Father Time. You can't -- that never changes. He knows that he's kind of at the end of where he is in his career. He achieved the goal of being --

SCHNELL: Um-hum.

HUNT: -- the longest-serving Senate leader in history.

And honestly, his party is leaving him. I mean, he, after January 6, had this hard break with Donald Trump. And he has watched colleague after colleague after colleague go kind of, honestly, crawling back, and he has yet to do it.

What did you see unfold yesterday?

SCHNELL: Two things, and my colleague explained this I think in a really succinct way. It was shocking but unsurprising. Shocking because Mitch McConnell is a fixture of the Senate. He's been there since the 1980s. He's been in leadership for 16 years, passing Mansfield as the longest-serving Senate leader in February. So to not -- to think about Mitch McConnell not in leadership is a really shocking idea.

But unsurprising for two -- for two reasons. His age, which he acknowledged. He just turned 82. He's had some public health struggles, including those two freeze-ups last year and that concussion after he suffered a fall.

But the second thing is that the Republican Party is moving away from his ideology of conservatism and of Republicanism. You're seeing more of the MAGA movement and America First. We've seen that particularly with the debate on Capitol Hill over Ukraine aid -- something that he recognized in this speech, saying I have flaws but recognizing politics is not one of them and I recognize --

HUNT: Right. I loved that quote.

SCHNELL: Right -- and I recognize --

HUNT: Yeah.

SCHNELL: -- that the politics in my party is moving away from me. He is openly recognizing that.

Last year we saw the first-ever challenge to his speakership. Rick Scott mounting that unsuccessful challenge -- only 10 votes. But still, the fact that it was there sort of had those rumblings of hey, there is a new perspective here and it may not be one that McConnell holds.

So ultimately, he's going to step down from leadership. We'll see who succeeds him -- if it's, sort of, one of the MAGA-inspired lawmakers or one of the three Johns who is more likely to do it. Two of them who are closely aligned with McConnell.

But at the end of the day, shocking but really unsurprising.

HUNT: Yeah.

Rina -- I mean, the reality, too, is that the Senate -- and I know you worked in the House and you've been with McConnell in private settings. But we've also seen the House have a much quicker sort of slide towards Donald Trump than the Senate.

But it is happening in the Senate and I think it really helps explain the timing of this. I mean, November is actually kind of an odd time to step down because while, yes, the election is in November, the Congress goes until the end of the year, right? So it seems very clear to me that this is very much about the presidential election.

SHAH: Well, I think it's mixed here and I think we shouldn't be so quick to jump to conclusions about this being entirely about Trump. I think he's realized his own mortality. He recently lost his sister-in- law very tragically. And I think, again, the health scares have also factored in.

But also, every time he goes back to Kentucky it gets a little tougher for him. I'm from next door, West Virginia, and I have seen him in settings in Kentucky, which have been really contentious. That's not something he's used to. That's not easy for an octogenarian to deal with -- people coming at you angrily and really raging against you -- you being that icon of everything that's failing for them. And that's what he's had to contend with.

So he leaves with a solid legacy, but I wouldn't be so sure that things will change as much. He's really -- I hate to use this word but he's groomed the next generation. John Thune has been around him, like, my goodness -- as if they were brothers or a son if you will. I was kind of hoping he would choose somebody like Joni Ernst to have a little bit more visible. She's been around.

But again, I think a likely successor is John Thune. But again, Thune came out endorsing Trump, which is a good thing. But he's also got problems, like Cornyn, where he was backing that $95 billion foreign aid package, and that's not popular with Trumpworld as we know.

HUNT: These are the three Johns on the screen that we think are likely successors here. But I have to say, none of them -- I mean, Barrasso probably is the one with the sort of profile that fits Trump while also being part of the outgoing administration. The other two -- potentially, I could see them facing some issues. We'll see.

All right. Mychael Schnell, Rina Shah, thank you both very much.

SCHNELL: Thanks.

HUNT: All right. The Supreme Court is going to hear Donald Trump's claim of absolute immunity. How big a win is this for the former president? Pretty big, I've got to say.

Plus, the new all-time leading scorer in women's college basketball history. I love her.

(COMMERCIAL)

[05:48:20

HUNT: Welcome back.

The Supreme Court agreeing to hear the former president's claim of absolute immunity from criminal prosecution further delaying the federal election subversion case. One source tells CNN Trump's team views the court's decision as a win for now. The Supreme Court will hear the arguments the week of April 22.

CNN's Alayna Treene joins me now. She covers Trump for us. Alayna, thanks so much for being here.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Of course.

HUNT: So help us understand -- I mean, clearly, it sounds like the Trump team thinks that this is a win for them. Why, and what have you heard from your sources?

TREENE: They do -- and, of course, a win for now I think is the important thing no note because who knows how this will ultimately play out?

But it's a win because it helps them in their ultimate goal of trying to delay this trial. That's really their biggest push here with all of the cases that he's facing. They want to delay them as long as possible and ultimately -- I mean, if they have their way, until after the 2024 election. And this helps at least punt it to the summer if not beyond.

And from my conversations with them, they really look at this as they genuinely believe that this is a sign of interfering in the election if they have this trial right before the November election. And part of it, too, is if this is pushed even closer to Election Day. They do believe it will help, at least, in their arguments with voters that they view this as election interference. They think that will play up Donald Trump's argument and help him at least on the political side of it even if it's not helping on the legal side.

HUNT: Yeah.

So let's play this out. I mean, basically, we've got arguments in April.

TREENE: Um-hum.

HUNT: The Supreme Court term -- they take a summer break --

TREENE: Right.

HUNT: -- right? So typically, we get the toughest cases at the end of June --

TREENE: Um-hum.

HUNT: -- right? I can't even imagine how tense those days are going to be when often the most contentious one is the very last one --

[05:50:00]

TREENE: Right.

HUNT: -- that they decide.

So that, potentially, puts a trial heading into August -- late summer -- Labor Day.

TREENE: Um-hum.

HUNT: That is really kind of when the electorate is actually engaged.

I definitely buy the political argument in terms of the primary. He's been able to very successfully --

TREENE: Right.

HUNT: -- make it, right?

Is there any thinking that, like, putting these legal problems on display right as Independent voters have to decide what they're going to do is potentially bad for him because it seems like it could be?

TREENE: Oh, absolutely. I mean, obviously, they don't say that publicly but, of course --

HUNT: Right.

TREENE: -- there's that concern behind the scenes.

I mean, there's a couple of things that they're concerned about. One is juggling all of the different cases at the same time while he's trying to launch -- or potentially launch a general election campaign. It's -- you know, they very much expect him to be the Republican nominee.

The other part of it is the financial aspect. This is going to cost a lot of money and we know that Donald Trump's team is already feeling the financial strain of all of his legal bills. That's only going to get worse with a trial, so they're going to have a money issue.

And then the other thing is the substance of this case. I mean, they still do not know how this is going to play out with general election voters. Their hope and their belief is that it will continue helping particularly, obviously, among Republicans to boost him --

HUNT: Right.

TREENE: -- but they're not sure if that will actually be the case with general election voters. And they still haven't solved that problem.

HUNT: Right. Fascinating.

All right. So let's change gears a little bit because the other big story we have unfolding today is these dueling visits to the border.

TREENE: Yeah.

HUNT: President Biden and President Trump both going there on the same day.

TREENE: (INAUDIBLE).

HUNT: Right. Like, how does --

TREENE: Like, reality television but it's actually real.

HUNT: Yeah, right -- split-screen, right? I mean, it does remind -- yes, well. Reality TV president flashing back to Donald Trump planning in New Hampshire in a helicopter.

Either way, now this going to be -- in fact, I was with Trump on the border when he went back in -- it must have been 2015.

TREENE: Um-hum.

HUNT: And it was a similar, kind of, like a mass media event.

What do they make of the fact that Biden is going to go on the same day? I mean, what was their reaction when you just, like, called them and said, like, hey, did you see that the president is going the same day as Trump is?

TREENE: They were definitely surprised. They had been planning this for some time. Obviously, you don't just have a former president go to the border and not have the security preparations and everything else that goes with it.

And they are arguing, of course -- how much should we put stock in this -- that the former president -- or, excuse me, that President Joe Biden is chasing him to the border? We've heard Donald Trump use that rhetoric in interviews that the only reason he's going is because he knows Donald Trump is going. Of course, the White House argues that's just not true.

It is very -- if it is just a coincidence, a very weird coincidence that it's the same day.

But look -- I mean --

HUNT: Very rare that those kinds of coincidences occur in politics but I agree, let's let it.

TREENE: Exactly.

HUNT: Maybe. TREENE: But I will argue -- I mean, you were talking about being there in 2015.

HUNT: Yeah.

TREENE: This is the same exact rhetoric that Donald Trump used. The fearmongering, the playing on the fears of people about the border. The type of people who come over the border. You're going to hear him today in his remarks -- Donald Trump -- talk about crimes that immigrants crossing the border are committing, really playing on those fears. The exact same type of things we heard that helped propel him into the White House in 2016. That's what you're going to hear from him.

And it will be interesting. I mean, he's going to be meeting with Texas National Guard. He's going to tour parts of the border, including Shelby Park, which is something they've closed down actually.

HUNT: Right.

TREENE: It's right by the Rio Grande.

He'll do an interview with Fox News. I'm sure you can expect some of the things he'll be telling Sean Hannity later today.

But this is their key argument as well. I mean, Donald Trump really believes that immigration is one of Joe Biden and Democrats' biggest --

HUNT: He's right about that.

TREENE: -- vulnerabilities. And --

HUNT: Yeah.

TREENE: -- as much spotlight they can put on the issue by some of the showmanship -- by going to the border --

HUNT: Um-hum.

TREENE: -- it serves his campaign.

HUNT: Right. It's kind of why it's interesting to me that the White House has decided. It's almost like the more they're talking about this the bigger of a losing issue. But on the other hand, he can't ignore it.

Alayna Treene. Alayna, thanks very much for being with us.

TREENE: Yeah.

HUNT: I hope you'll come back soon.

All right, time now for sports.

Iowa star Caitlin Clark adds another career record to her resume -- the most points by any women's college basketball player ever.

Andy Scholes has this morning's Bleacher Report. Andy, good morning.

ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Good morning, Kasie.

The season of milestones just continuing last night for Caitlin Clark. She's now got one regular season game left this Sunday -- just 18 points away from becoming college basketball's all-time leading scorer, men's or women's.

But Clark was in Minnesota last night and she had it all going. She hit a low-go three early on and then moments later, she would do it again. And then in the fourth quarter, Clark hitting her eighth three of the game.

And with it, right here, she passes Kansas' Lynette Woodard for the most points in major women's college basketball history. Woodard played for the Jayhawks from '77 to '81 when women's sports was governed by the AIAW. The NCAA took over women's sports in 1981 but didn't carry over player stats. But many still recognized Woodard as the true record-holder, but now it's Clark.

She finished with 33 points, 12 assists, and 10 rebounds in Iowa's 48- point win over Minnesota.

And afterward, Clark said she's able to do what she does because of the foundation laid by Woodard.

[05:55:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAITLIN CLARK, IOWA GUARD: I wouldn't have the opportunity to be able to do what I'm doing every single night if it wasn't for people like her. And obviously, there are so many great players across the board. So I'm just really thankful and grateful to have those people that have come before me.

But I think it just shows title nine is not that long ago. Fifty years is not that long ago. And I think it just still shows the room that we have to improve and where women's sports is going is a really great place.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: All right. So up next for Clark is Pete Maravich's all-time scoring record in college basketball. Clark is going to need 18 points at home Sunday on Senior Day against second-ranked Ohio State. It's going to be a great game.

Now, Pistol Pete's record at LSU has always been very highly regarded, especially considering he did it in only three seasons with no three- point line.

All right, LeBron James, meanwhile, orchestrating the largest fourth- quarter comeback of his 21-year career last night. So the Lakers were down 21 points early in the fourth to the Clippers before just storming back. LeBron scoring 19 of his 34 points in the final period, including making five threes. He singlehandedly outscored the Clippers in the fourth quarter.

And LeBron came up with a big defensive play in the final seconds forcing Kawhi Leonard into a really tough shot.

The Lakers win 116-112. And LeBron challenging Yogi Berra afterwards saying it ain't over till it's over.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEBRON JAMES, FORWARD, LOS ANGELES LAKERS: The main thing -- the main thing is to keep executing. The game is not ever over until it's double zeros that you see up there. So we just kept fighting and kept getting defensive stops and made some shots.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCHOLES: Kasie, amazing. LeBron, 39 years old -- year 21 -- and still able to do what he's doing out there on the court.

HUNT: Always make me feel like I've done nothing with my life at 38.

Andy, thank you very much for that. I'll see you tomorrow.

And coming up next hour here, the big surprise from an Illinois judge. Donald Trump's next move after getting booted off the state's ballot.

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