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CNN This Morning
Trump Puts Religion Front and Center in His Campaign; White House Furious Over Death of Aid Workers; California Billionaire Backs Trump's Bond. Aired 6:30-7a ET
Aired April 03, 2024 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[06:31:21]
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CROWD: Let's go Trump.
MICHAEL C. BENDER, "NEW YORK TIMES": One of the more striking ways we see this impassioned loyalty from Trump fans is at the end of his rallies, where there's a sudden shift in tone, where it goes from very high energy into almost a solemn church like atmosphere.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Let's go Trump.
BENDER: The net effect here is Trump has turned the Republican Party into something resembling the church of Trump.
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KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Church, of Trump. A news story in "The New York Times" showcasing how many Trump rallies are looking less like campaign events, at least at the end, and more like a church service. "Times" reporter Michael Bender, you saw him there, writes this of the atmospheric, quote, "soft, reflective music fills the venue as a hush falls over the crowd. Mr. Trump's tone turns reverent and somber, prompting some supporters to bow their heads or close their eyes. Others raise open palms in the air or murmur as if in prayer. In this moment, Mr. Trump's audience is his congregation, and the former president their pastor as he delivers a roughly 15-minute finale that evokes an evangelical altar call, the emotional tradition that concludes some Christian services in which attendees come forward to commit to their savior."
My panel is back. I'm going to set aside - I'm going to - hasn't - let's set aside the golden calf for a moment, Matt Gorman, but it - this is something that we are seeing increasingly on the campaign trail, but also just kind of in our zeitgeist in the way that the former president is reaching out to Christian voters.
Tim Alberta tackled this in "The Kingdom and the Power and the Glory."
What do you see here in these crowds, in the way that Trump is doing this? It is actually different from what he did in 2020 and 2016.
MATT GORMAN, FORMER TIM SCOTT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN SENIOR ADVISER AND REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: It's a little bit different. You're right.
I mean, look, a lot of what Bender described does resonate a little bit spending a lot of time, especially out in Iowa, in other areas. Like, that's very normal what you'd see in these sorts of events where they're the evangelical audiences. It really is.
I think number two is, one thing we're not talking about - look, I've sat on this set many times and talk about how on a lot of issues Republicans are on defense on social issues and when it comes to abortion in the like, but there are issues where we feel on offense. You know, when Trump says Election Day is going to be a day of Christian visibility, when we talk about trans issues and sex changes for minors and women's sports, those are issues and social issues where we feel like we are playing offense on. And I think there is a little bit of walking with a forward foot on some of these things. You're going to be hearing a lot more about those sorts of social issues in the months to come and maybe less about abortion.
HUNT: I'm going to play that in a second, but I think my question for you is, why is it that people view Trump as a seemingly - or treat him like a seemingly Christ-like figure when I mean the Bible specifically says like you're not supposed to do that?
GORMAN: I think that - I think it's a little bit different. It personifies itself differently with Trump than others. But I do think though -
HUNT: Because you worked for another candidate -
GORMAN: I worked -
HUNT: Tim Scott, a very promising Republican.
GORMAN: Yes.
HUNT: I mean he is not treated this way. Most politicians -
GORMAN: I wish he was. But, I mean, I might not be here. I might not be here.
HUNT: I can't find any other politician that are treated this way.
GORMAN: But I will say this though, in a - in a secular sort of way, not in an evangelical directly away, you saw Obama treated like this. He -
HUNT: No.
GORMAN: It was - yes, absolutely. Absolutely. There was a sort of - people - not an - not an evangelical, religious way.
HUNT: Wait, we need a shot of Karen's face. Sorry. GORMAN: But, look, I will say this, when you are president of your party and you're a leader of your party, there is among a base where it is a social - it is a secular deification in a way. It is. Yes.
KAREN FINNEY, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Look, I think, as you pointed out, Tim talks about at great length in his book -
[06:35:03]
HUNT: Tim Alberta, yes.
FINNEY: Tim Alberta, this fusion that has happened in the evangelical movement to the point that at his father's own funeral he was getting attacked for things he'd written about Trump, right, this fusion. And what you're seeing, I think Trump understands, and this is where I do think it's similar to 2016. In 2016 he understood that there was a cadre of voters who were afraid of a changing America. And he understood that by demonizing an othering black and brown people and immigrants, right, that that was a way to galvanize that base.
This time I think what he understands is that his popularity in the evangelical movement, right, they would say, he's not perfect, but he's fighting for us, right? And so that's why he - they're willing to accept - a lot of us would say, well, but he's had divorces and all these things, how o they -
HUNT: Sure. Sure.
FINNEY: But I think they understand, they think he's fighting for them. And it's become part of identity. And I think he's understood that.
So other - the second thing I would say is, what's frightening about it is, as we've seen, the - he is also using very violent rhetoric. And it makes many people feel less safe. He - he's also using, again, he's perverting the words of God and Jesus. Jesus did not pretate (ph). He did not preach, you know divisiveness.
HUNT: Well, he has said in the past that has favorite Bible verse is an eye for an eye, which is firmly in the Old Testament, not the New.
FINNEY: Right. Correct.
HUNT: So, I want to show you what - to Matt's earlier point, he did talk, Donald Trump yesterday, about Trans Visibility Day and Easter Sunday coinciding this year, not every year, but this year.
Watch.
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DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: And what the hell was Biden thinking when he declared Easter Sunday to be Trans Visibility Day? Such total disrespect to Christians. And November 5th is going to be called something else. You know what it's going to be called? Christian visibility day, when Christians turn out in numbers that nobody has ever seen before. Let's call it Christian visibility day.
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HUNT: OK, so wait a second, these guys are arguing while we're watching -
FINNEY: Sorry.
GORMAN: Sorry, sorry, sorry.
HUNT: No, do it on TV now.
FINNEY: And you can see that they were - that - in the Iowa caucus we did see that that - the ad that we've played here before, that was likening the birth of Trump to the birth of Jesus, right, where he literally compared it -
HUNT: Right.
FINNEY: There have been evangelicals who have said, OK, that's too far. And Tim Alberta in his book talks about how some in the evangelical movement have had - are uncomfortable with this fusion and perversion of the teachings.
HUNT: Matt, do you agree?
GORMAN: No, because, look, like I -
FINNEY: Of course not. You're a Republican. Why would you agree with me?
GORMAN: Look, I - no, no of course not. But like - but I think the added (ph) Republican primary, where there's a trust among Republicans is a little different. When you get to a general election, that - that choice will fuse. I don't think you're going to see Biden evangelical votes in Iowa suddenly gaining steam here. Look, he's not going to -
FINNEY: Yes, but I think they could not vote for him.
GORMAN: He's not going to lose - he's not going to lose any votes off that. You know, I think it's - that's a winning (INAUDIBLE).
HUNT: You don't think he's going to lose any votes off -
GORMAN: Absolutely not. Absolutely not, as a winning - and press that advantage if you're Trump.
FINNEY: So you think suburban women - let's go back to them -
GORMAN: Yes.
FINNEY: Are comfortable with Donald Trump comparing -
GORMAN: Those -
FINNEY: No, no, no, let me finish. GORMAN: Yes.
FINNEY: Are comfortable with him - literally saying, I'm your god. I don't think so. Please show me those voters.
GORMAN: I want to meet - so those are suburban women who all of a sudden see that - that one thing, like, you know what, now I'm turned off. They - after almost a decade of this, that's going to break it?
FINNEY: No, it's not just that.
GORMAN: Yes.
FINNEY: What that shows is someone who will do anything to win, who has no boundaries, who has no sense of decency, who has no sense of what's appropriate, what's not appropriate. He will do anything to win. If it means comparing himself to God, that's what he'll do.
And I do think that falls into a narrative that we started to see, particularly amongst suburban women, in South Carolina, by the way. These were Rick - these were Tim Scott voters who said, I'm not comfortable with that. They literally would bring him up in focus groups that I did.
GORMAN: Yes.
FINNEY: And they would say, we're not comfortable with the meanness, we're not comfortable with the nastiness, we're not comfortable with the way he's idolized.
GORMAN: Yes, sure. Again, we - I think we've been having the same conversation for a decade. Like, again, we talk about meanness. This is the same sort of thing that Hillary Clinton talked about. I just suddenly wonder that, you know, suddenly, in the year 2024, after Donald Trump's been on the - for - this for a decade that people are going to wake up and be like, you know what, now he's too mean. You know what, I was going to vote for him, but, you know what, that one thing, no. This thing is big. That - that -
FINNEY: That's not what I'm saying, though. You're not even taking on my central argument. But that's OK.
GORMAN: But that - that's my point. But, like, again -
FINNEY: But that's - OK, so you're not refuting my point though.
GORMAN: But, again, I think what you're - what I heard is that suddenly suburban housewives -
FINNEY: No.
GORMAN: In your words, are going to wake -
FINNEY: That's not what I said.
GORMAN: Are going to say that - that. That's not the case. FINNEY: What I said is that is that kind of language, that kind of behavior is yet another thing that people say that goes too far, that's too much, I'm not comfortable with that in the White House with his finger on the - on the trigger for the nuclear codes.
HUNT: I mean, look, I'm really enjoying this back-and-forth between the two of you, so Toulouse and I are just over here chilling.
[06:40:01]
But I do - I will say, Karen, I mean - I - when you look at the imagery that these people wear and the things that they do at these political rallies -
FINNEY: Yes.
HUNT: I mean in some ways it favors what Matt is saying here, that there are so many people that - that - the way that Trump is treated is just totally different than other political candidates.
I don't know if I take your point about - I get people got - were very excited about Obama -
FINNEY: No.
HUNT: But it was secular and political. Like -
FINNEY: It was hopeful. It was less about grievance and retribution and it - but it was - with Obama it was hopeful because what it - hold on - because of what people felt - I know you'd love to interrupt me - but of what people felt like and said about the country -
HUNT: No, no, like, we're all good. Everyone's good.
FINNEY: That maybe we had moved to a place where this was possible. I think what you see in Trump though is more of a grievance narrative and more - and I think that - that's any -
HUNT: Well, that's definitely objectively true that it's grievance versus - I mean hope and change is not the same as what we had there.
FINNEY: Yes, and I think it shows, frankly, a fracture within the Republican Party within the evangelical movement about what's - with Trump.
HUNT: Yes.
Quick last word.
GORMAN: Really quick. When you can be presence - of popular presence of parties - of parties always have a certain cult of personality around them. Always. It's always - it manifests itself differently. Republicans who talk about Ronald Reagan. Like, let's not act like this suddenly - the Trump this, like, oh, my gosh, why are people in our base suddenly like (INAUDIBLE) in a different way? HUNT: Yes, but the shoot - you know, his - I could shoot people on Fifth Avenue and my base would still be with me. There is something about him -
GORMAN: There - there - yes, that - that is a different - totally different presentation of it. I agree with that.
HUNT: That is different from Reagan and Obama and -
GORMAN: Yes. I agree with that.
HUNT: So, anyway, we're trying to dig into that.
All right, I have a feeling we're going to have this conversation a lot from - between now and November.
Coming up next here, Taiwan reels from the most powerful quake to hit the island in 25 years.
Plus, the board battle that could shape the future of Disney.
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[06:45:57]
HUNT: Welcome back.
The death of seven aid workers with Jose Andres' World Central Kitchen has sparked fury inside the White House. President Biden, in a statement, said he was outraged and heartbroken by their deaths and implored Israel to do more to protect aid workers bringing much-needed food and assistance into Gaza.
Joining us now is CNN's White House correspondent Arlette Saenz.
Arlette, good morning to you.
The president also says that Israel needs to do more to protect civilians. What else are we learning and how high are emotions running on this?
ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kasie, the statement from the president really amounts to the sharpest - some of this sharpest language he's used throughout this entire conflict to criticize Israel's approach in Gaza. A senior administration official told CNN that the death of these Central Kitchen workers really raised the frustration level among President Biden and his top advisers to whole new levels. That was evidenced in the very first words that President Biden used in his statement yesterday, saying, "I am outraged." A word that he has rarely used in this conflict.
The president also warned Israel that they have not done enough to protect civilians in Gaza. He added, quote, "this conflict has been one of the worst in recent memories in terms of how many aid workers have been killed. This is a major reason why distributing humanitarian aid in Gaza has been so difficult because Israel has not done enough to protect aid workers trying to deliver desperately needed help to civilians. Incidents like yesterdays simply should not happen."
The White House also noted President Biden spoke by phone with the World Central Kitchen founder Jose Andres, a celebrity chef based here in Washington, D.C., to express his condolences for the lives lost, including one dual U.S. Canadian citizen.
But this episode really lays bare the tension points between President Biden and Israel at a time when the administration has increasingly warned Israel that they need to take greater care to protect civilians in their operations and also get more humanitarian aid into the enclave. One big question though is how this might impact the president's approach when he is thinking about how to handle Israel amid this conflict, at a time when he's also facing domestic pressures on that front here at home.
HUNT: Yes. All right, Arlette Saenz for us at the White House.
Arlette, thanks very much.
I want to bring our panel back and we are also joined by the great David Sanger.
David, the - overnight last night there was an op-ed in "The New York Times," your newspaper, from Jose Andres, who has been pretty careful in how he has spoken about this conflict, while, of course, being very, very committed to the actual humanitarian mission with World Central Kitchen. This is what he says. Quote, "we know Israelis. Israelis, in their heart of hearts, know that food is not a weapon of war. Israel is better than the way this war is being waged. It is better than blocking food and medicine to civilians. It is better than killing aid workers who had coordinated their movements with the Israel Defense Forces."
There's a lot of nuance in that right there. What do you hear in it and how significant is all of this?
DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: But he's finally giving voice, I think, to what he's been saying privately. I've spoken with them, and others have. The remarkable thing here is that what he put together by himself, with his organization, was the best thing they had going for the Israelis to show that there was food moving into Gaza. The Israelis should have been, or could have been, sending convoys to protect the movement of that food. You know, instead, they get involved in what I'm sure was accidental. I don't think anybody deliberately wanted to target this group.
But the president's outrage comes from the fact that this has simply not been a priority for Prime Minister Netanyahu. And I think the president is realizing, belatedly, that he's in a spot that right now - he politically is in a spot that is untenable at both sides.
[06:50:04]
He's got Democrats, and particularly progresses, but a pretty large number of Democrats saying that he has embraced Netanyahu far too much and has been too slow to separate. He's had a hardcore group that thinks that now he is walking away from Israel when, in fact, he's just trying to walk away from Netanyahu. And he just can't break himself out of the box.
HUNT: Toluse, we heard from John Kirby on all of this a little bit earlier. I want to show you what he had to say.
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JOHN KIRBY, NATIONAL SECURITY COUNCIL COORDINATOR FOR STRATEGIC COMMUNICATIONS: This isn't the first one. There are issues of deconfliction that clearly need to be fleshed out and improved.
Our expectation is, and we've made this clear to them, that they'll come clean about what they've learned. They'll be fully transparent. And if people need to be held accountable, that they'll be held accountable.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: I can almost see in the way Kirby is there how intense the feelings are around this.
To David's point about the White House being squeezed from both sides, I mean, how do they thread this needle, especially with, you know, I think coverage of this, what happened with these World Central Kitchen folks is still continuing to snowball. I mean we're not at the end of the story.
TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, WHITE HOUSE BUREAU CHIEF, "THE WASHINGTON POST": Yes, Jose Andres is someone who is well-known in Washington, D.C., and this attack, this strike on these aid workers has resonated in a way that other incidents have not resonated, even though there have been more than 200 aid workers killed over the course of this war, and thousands of civilians killed. The fact that this is an effort to provide food for people who are starving, who are struggling, it's really resonated across the aisle. And I think that's part of the reason the White House feels the pressure to put more pressure on Prime Minister Netanyahu, who, for the most part has not been publicly responsive to the pressure.
But what we saw from the Israelis last night, including a videotape statement where they said they were sorry, where they said they were going to do an investigation. It's clear that they are feeling the pressure from the U.S., from the west, and from the White House that they're going to have to change to get any kind of continued support from the (INAUDIBLE).
HUNT: Yes, that IDF video, very remarkable.
David, you speak with these leaders privately. Obviously, you report on them extensively, publicly. What is your sense of the level of influence that President Biden has at this moment with Benjamin Netanyahu. Is it - and how does it compare to the influence that he had at the beginning of this conflict?
SANGER: Well, I actually think he had more and has been declining. You know, when he first went to Israel, he embraced them. He - he said that we were all - the world was with him. And after October 7th, the world was by enlarge with them, with some exceptions.
He had one word of warning at that time, Kasie. You remember he said, we overreacted after 9/11 and did things we came to regret. And now the Israelis have walked right down the path, I think, in Biden's mind, that he feared that they - that they would.
His influence has been pretty low, but it is interesting to think that a few weeks ago Prime Minister Netanyahu said they would go into Rafah before Ramadan if there was no agreement on releasing hostages. Well, there is no agreement. They are not now in Rafah.
HUNT: Yes.
SANGER: There was a long and tense meeting, two-and-a-half hours with Jake Sullivan, the national security advisor, Secretary of State Blinken, and their Israeli counterparts about the Rafah plan. And from everything we hear about it, the U.S. pushed back hard and said, it could be months before you could evacuated civilians out of there. The Israeli still don't believe that.
HUNT: All right, David Sanger.
David, thank you very much for your time this morning.
SANGER: Great to be with you.
HUNT: Always great to have you. I hope you come back.
All right, 53 minutes past the hour. Here's your morning roundup.
At least nine people are dead and more than 100 others trapped after a 7.4 magnitude earthquake rocked Taiwan's east coast. It is the strongest earthquake to hit the country in 25 years.
Today, a federal appeals court will hear arguments from Texas against the injunction that's blocking the state's controversial immigration law. The measure allows police to arrest anyone who they suspect is in the country illegally.
Today, Disney's future will be decided in a high-stakes board vote. The billionaire Nelson Peltz is running for a board position. And if he's successful, it could mean an early departure for chief executive Bob Iger. One to watch.
House Republicans introducing a bill to rename Washington, D.C.'s Dulles Airport after former President Trump. It is currently named for John Foster Dulles, a former secretary of state who fought against communism, among other things.
Would they give it - would they retitle it DJT if they did that?
GORMAN: Probably.
HUNT: Instead of IAD? GORMAN: Probably.
FINNEY: Uh-huh.
HUNT: Hmm. I wonder if that would cause more or less confusion between DCA and (INAUDIBLE)? Less confusion with Dallas, I guess.
All right, now let's turn to the man who loaned Donald Trump the $175 million bond in his New York civil fraud case and how exactly this deal came to be.
[06:55:03]
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JIMMY KIMMEL, HOST, "JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE": This is the man with the good sense to loan a lot of money to Donald Trump. You can - there he is, the next owner of Mar-a-Lago, billionaire Don Hankey, also known as the king of the subprime car loans. Don Hankey, he sells loans to people with less than exceptional credit. "Forbes" said his company repossessed about 250 cars a day. Our former president got a loan from a repo man.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Donald Trump paid a very rich subprime auto finance an all cash collateral to keep New York authorities from seizing his assets. Hankey told CNN he is a Trump supporter and that he was the one to initiate a deal with Trump.
Matt Gorman, did this man make a sound investment?
GORMAN: I think he did, but here's - here's why - here's what I mean by that. His name's on CNN. We're talking about this person. His picture was just shown up. He's on Jimmy Kimmel. He's not talking to us. He's, a, talking to the president. So, if he's re-elected, I can guarantee you, who's going to take his called in the Oval Office. This guy.
Number two, he has great apparently advertising for his business. He's - his play was not to us, it was to a very specific audience. And I think it's a little - yes.
OLORUNNIPA: It's - it's just not clear he'll be able to - to reposes whatever Trump has. And he's used to repossessing cars.
But I think it's clear that he is playing a political game in addition to the business game of, you know, whether or not it's a wise investment. And that's a lot of what we see with President Trump's associates. People that are making calculations politically and seeing what they could get in the off chance that Trump wins.
FINNEY: Yes, 100 percent. He is betting that if Trump wins, he can just pick which cabinet seat he wants, but he probably wasn't looking at the fact that 20,000 to 30,000 people in Wisconsin, the margin of victory in 2020, actually voted for Nikki Trump or someone - I mean, I'm sorry, Nikki Haley. Oh, well, it happens. It's 6 a.m.
HUNT: It happens. It's early.
FINNEY: Right. Or, you know, or someone else. And, you know, but again, he's hedging his bet, right? And clearly he's got the dough to do it.
HUNT: Matt, I mean, there is kind of this general sense to about the - if, in fact, Trump is re-elected -
GORMAN: Yes.
HUNT: The universe of people that's going to come to Washington with him. I mean we've heard that like Paul Manafort might be back in the fold. Corey Lewandowski a question mark. There's subprime - king of the subprime car loan, who I guess maybe an ambassadorship? I mean it - there's also conversations about the fact that the Trump team needs a lot of money and that they are calculating, making calculations about who might be brought in based on the donor that they could bring in.
GORMAN: Absolutely (ph).
HUNT: What is the impact on governance, quite frankly, because, I mean, I think there are a lot of people who feel like, well, there were some adults in the room in the first Trump administration, and those adults are largely going to be absent.
GORMAN: I think two things. Just real quick on the money front. It kind of goes back to what we talked about initially with bloodbath and stuff. You cannot underestimate how Trump talks is also a reflective need of how much he needs low dollar and online fundraising. So, he's going to say things and do things in a way to try and get attention, bringing in low dollar money, as well as the high-dollar money. That's number one.
But you're right, number two, with the start in 2017 you saw a lot of RNC hands come in. Sean Spicer, Reince Priebus, and even at lower levels in the communications staff and the like. That won't be the case this time. So, you're going to have a lot of folks who were holdover from the end of the Trump term, but also other folks from, you know, these kind of third-party organizations, say heritage and others, who, in a way, have been preparing for this for a year or two now and I think a lot of times they felt it took a year or so to understand the machinations and the mechanisms of government. That won't be the case this time. For better or worse.
HUNT: Better or worse.
FINNEY: Worse, which is frightening. I mean we just saw this week that one of the top priorities in this plan, 2025, is to roll back civil rights laws, which I find, again, as a person of color, as a woman, I find that terrifying. And just - and their whole rationale around why. And I do think that will give moderates and independents pause on whether or not they really want to support Donald Trump again. And this cast of characters, trust me, there will be an ad, you know, sort of the island of misfit toys type of ads that will kind of give a sense of the car salesman for one running our country.
HUNT: Well, I will say that many of the people who came to Washington with Trump, they left with lawyers. So -
FINNEY: Yes.
GORMAN: Oh, yes.
HUNT: We shall see.
All right, I will leave you with this.
The Home of Bratwurst and Octoberfest could soon be home to 20,000 elephants? Botswana wants to deport the elephants to Germany. It comes after Germany proposed banning the import of hunting trophies, like tusks from elements - elephants. Germany is one of the largest importers of hunting trophies in the European Union.
But the president of Botswana says that his country faces an overpopulation of elephants. They are destroying crops and villages. They are trampling people. And Botswana says that trophy hunting helps control the population.
[07:00:02]
This does sound like it would likely be a bluff. However, Botswana already sent 8,000 elephants to neighboring Angola. Germany says they have not contacted them about this elephant showdown.
So, OK, elephants to neighboring Angola is one thing, but like what are we - are we flying the elephants? How are we deporting -
FINNEY: Now we're deporting elephants? Like, come on.
HUNT: Operation Dumbo Drop?
GORMAN: (INAUDIBLE) Disney movie. That was a great movie. That was a great movie.
FINNEY: Oh, it was so heartbreaking.
HUNT: Oh, my gosh.
All right, with that, thanks to our panel. Thanks to you for joining us. I'm Kasie Hunt. Don't go anywhere. CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.
