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CNN This Morning

Biden, Trump To Face-Off In CNN Debate Next Month; 4 Dead, Nearly 200 Arrested As Protests Rage; Slovakia's PM Robert Fico Hospitalized After Being Shot. Aired 5-5:30a ET

Aired May 16, 2024 - 05:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[05:00:38]

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: It's Thursday, May 16th.

Right now on CNN THIS MORNING:

It's on. Joe Biden and Donald Trump signing off on two debates. The first one next month, right here on CNN.

Plus, Trump's lawyers planning a new strategy with Michael Cohen. The former fixer back on the stand this morning in the hush money trial.

And two partners with a pledge. Vladimir Putin and Xi Jinping together in Beijing vowing to deepen their ties. What does this mean for the West?

(MUSIC)

HUNT: All right, 5:00 a.m. here in Washington. A live look at Capitol Hill on this Thursday morning. We're almost there.

Good morning, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. It's wonderful to have you with us.

Joe Biden and Donald Trump will be face-to-face next month for the first presidential debate of this election cycle, the two presumptive nominees have accepted debate invitations from CNN and ABC.

CNN's set to take place first. It's going to be June 27, in Atlanta. Both candidates have been engaged in this escalating feud. It came to a head yesterday when Biden posted this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Donald Trump lost two debates to me in 2020. And since then, he hadn't shown up for debate. Now, he's acting like he wants to debate me again.

Well, make my day, pal. I'll even do it twice. So let's pick the dates, Donald. I heard you're free on Wednesdays.

(END VIDEO CLIP) HUNT: Shortly thereafter, this was posted, Trump responding on social media saying this, quote, I am ready and willing to debate crooked Joe Biden at the two proposed times in June and September. Just tell me when, I'll be there. Let's get ready to rumble.

Joining me now is national race and politics reporter for "The Associated Press", Matt Brown.

Matt, good morning. Thank you so much for being here.

So this is what Mark McKinnon wrote in "The Atlantic" about this. Quote: I view the challenge throwdown as a strategic master stroke for Biden. Sure, a debate could ensure his defeat if the president's unable to rise to the oratorical occasion.

But I think that there's a strong argument. It's the only way he can win the election, and most importantly, it shows confidence. I know from experience, the most important asset of presidential candidate can have is the perception of strength and the worst thing they can have as a perception of weakness which is what Biden was dealing with until this morning.

It does also seem to potentially acknowledge that they needed this, the Biden campaign needed this, that they were, but they are. And national polling -- we've got some new Fox News polling out this morning as well that shows Biden has been behind.

What -- what do you -- how do you think this is going to impact the race?

MATT BROWN, NATIONAL RACE AND POLITICS REPORTER, THE ASSOCIATED PRESS: Well, I think that this shows that the Biden campaign is -- and the Democratic Party really in general are entirely on Biden here, and there's not really seeing any significant downsides to debating Trump at this point.

I think one of the striking things that we saw yesterday is that both Donald Trump and Joe Biden believed that they can highlight the strongest negative about their rival candidate in debates like this. And I think that that's something that they're going to be really stressing in what's going to be the most the earliest debate in a general election presidential election that were going to have seen in years.

HUNT: It really is a major shift in that the timing is so much earlier, right? It's going to be in June and one of the arguments is, of course, that many Americans now are making their decisions earlier in the process, right? That it would be too late.

But, of course, the part of the reason why the Biden team was reluctant to do it the way the commission wanted to do it is because the moderators in some cases, we saw in 2020, there was less control of the stage and it led to moments like this one where Joe Biden and Donald Trump went, went back and forth and part of this new format is that they're going to be able to cut off the microphones.

Watch this moment from 2020.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(CROSSTALK)

BIDEN: Make sure you in fact, let people know --

(CROSSTALK)

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT & 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He doesn't want to answer the question.

BIDEN: I'm not going to answer the question because -- because --

(CROSSTALK)

BIDEN: Will you shut up, man?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Will you shut up, man?

So part of this is they weren't happy with how the commission was handling things.

[05:05:01]

They want to set the rules themselves, right?

BROWN: Right. I think two of the things that we're talking about here are just fundamental changes to American democracy. We're looking at the demise of the committee on presidential debates in many ways and how the changes of how Americans are getting their information and want to see their presidential candidates debate.

And at the same time, we're also seeing changes in, as you said, early voting. I mean, by September, a lot of Americans are going to have the ability to cast their ballots in this election, which means that what's going to happen in the election, say in October, I mean, an October surprise might not even matter that if millions of people have already voted.

So, for Joe Biden's campaign, who needs every single vote they can to rebuild that coalition that elected him to the White House, they're very determined to change his perception as early as possible.

On the flip side, Donald Trump's campaign is saying that they want every opportunity to be able to highlight what they perceive as Joe Biden's weaknesses and that's why there are asking for more than just two debates. They want to be able to say that they've already saw that they've accepted a debate on Fox, for instance, because they want every opportunity they can to have Donald Trump, their candidate out there.

HUNT: Right. And, of course, part of this McKinnon alluded to the strength and weakness thing, and that often comes up with voters in terms of the age of the president at mostly, but we should note there are only three years apart, Donald Trump and Joe Biden. This led Mitt Romney to make this crack.

Watch.

Do we have that Romney SOT? Okay.

Sorry about that. Anyway, it's the Muppets. We have the Muppets? I know we had the Muppets because he was talking about the Muppets.

Let's -- let's just look at this. This is what Romney said. Hey, this debate is going to look like this.

Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARACTER: It looks like two ancient old guys sitting in a theater box watching television.

CHARACTER: That's crazy. No one would watch junk like that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(LAUGHTER)

HUNT: So, Romney, I suppose. Okay, lets, lets watch Romney able to where were going to play in the other order. But I think they found the SOT. Let's play -- let's watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. MITT ROMNEY (R-UT): The image that comes to mind is those two old guys on the Muppets, you know, that sat in the back --

HOST: Statler and Waldorf, yes.

ROMNEY: Statler and Waldorf, all right. That's what comes to mind. But I actually think there'll be a huge audience for these debates.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So in seriousness, I mean, this is -- these are seminal moments in our collective political history.

We don't have a lot of opportunities to do that. And it is going to be striking, I think as well that it really reminded me going back and watching those clips. Oh, this is a rematch. And that is a really remarkable thing.

BROWN: Yeah, I think that the thing that the American -- the American people are frustrated about in this election is that its a rematch, but I also think that that's going to highlight the salience of what these two men stand for in this election. I mean, while we can make jokes about how these are two old men who were just going to be yelling at each other in a lot of ways, this is really an election that is going to be about some of the most substantive policy differences that we've seen in two presidential candidates in decades.

I think that that's going to be something that these debates are going to highlight more than Americans I think are at the moment really at wherever -- really appreciated thus far.

HUNT: All right. Matt Brown for us, starting us off this morning. Matt, thank you, very grateful to have you.

All right. Just ahead here, the decision made half a world away that triggered riots on a Pacific Island. We'll dig into this and why it's important.

Plus, Senator Bob Menendez's legal team throws shade on his wife during his corruption trial.

And another foot chase on Capitol Hill by our own Manu Raju. The time that is with the congressman, Texas congressman indicted on bribery charges. We'll show you that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:12:47]

HUNT: Welcome back.

So, days of violent protests have been raging in New Caledonia. That's a French territory in the Pacific Islands. And four people are now dead with nearly 200 arrested. Protesters clashed with the military and police again Wednesday, setting fire to cars and buildings as gunfire erupted in the streets.

So, all of this has come after the French government proposed constitutional changes that would give more French residents the right to vote, independence groups accused France of trying to consolidate power in the region as Paris has declared a state of emergency, sending 500 more police reinforcements to the area.

CNN's international anchor Max Foster joins us now, live from London with more about this.

Max, good morning to you.

This really does feel like a bit of a colonial throwback. What is the story with the French are doing here? I don't want to say I thought we were passed this as the world generally, but that was kind of my initial reaction to it. What is really going on?

MAX FOSTER, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Well, they're all remnants of these empires all over the place. So there are lots of islands still belonging effectively to France as there are other places belonging to the UK and Portugal. And it's becoming more and more contentious as you can imagine.

So, you know, there's too broadly, you know, this is a very simple way I'm looking at it, but you have see it was island taken over by France. You have French residents there, many of them regard themselves as local. Then you have the indigenous community who are largely pro-independence. They want to effectively get the island.

So they're the two sides of this argument. And then Emmanuel Macron announced that there are French residents who are living there who will be given a vote in local elections because there is some autonomy there, and that infuriated a lot of people you're seeing on the screen right now, these protesters who basically say it will dilute the pressure for the island is a vote for independence.

They say it's a tactic for France to keep hold of the island. So it's gone down really badly.

[05:15:01]

HUNT: There have been votes it sounds like in recent years to secede from France, but those have been voted down. I'm curious why and how that played out.

FOSTER: Well, the French will tell you its just a numbers game. So more people have voted to keep the status quo. There are, of course, advantages to it in terms of economics. You know, they're supported and defended by France. So there are lots of people I think they're making a very sort of practical decision about how would I be better off under local government or the one that I know, which is big and powerful, even though it's a very long way away.

HUNT: And how much of Macron's focus on this has to do with the geopolitics and trying to maintain French influence in the Indo- Pacific?

FOSTER: So he's built up this whole strategy that he wants to build influence in the Indo-Pacific because of the threat from China. And that also ties up with U.S. So it becomes part of this bigger, powerful alliance.

He needs, you know, these islands arguably to have that influence can station troops there, for example. And also just have influenced there, but it's backfiring to some extent with certain parts of the community. His solution was to say, we want to speak to the local independence campaigners and invited them to Paris to do that, which obviously doesn't match their vibe. They think you should go to them.

HUNT: For sure.

All right. Max Foster for us in London, Max, really appreciate having you talking about everything under the sun, shall we say --

FOSTER: Thank you.

HUNT: -- on our show, I really appreciate it.

All right. Coming up next here, Slovakia's prime minister is out of surgery after he was shot five times by a would-be assassins. We'll bring you the latest on that.

Plus, the Trump legal team looking for that gotcha moment from Michael Cohen when he returns to the stand for more cross-examination.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[05:21:14]

HUNT: A stunning assassination attempt in broad daylight on Slovakia's Prime Minister Robert Fico.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

HUNT: Wow, officials say he was shot five times, a politically motivated attempt on his life. His security team rushed him to the hospital and he is expected to survive, but he remains in serious condition.

The alleged gunman is also in custody, somewhat incredibly, no one else was injured in the attack. Fico is a Kremlin sympathizer who won a third term after criticizing western support for Ukraine.

CNN's Clare Sebastian joins us now, live from London.

Clare, we do know that Fico's expected to survive, but what can you tell us about his condition today.

CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, we've got an update, Kasie, a couple of hours ago, the defense minister of Slovakia saying that the doctors worked on him all night to stabilize him. There are still some measures being undertaken to improve his health, that's after a surgery that according to the hospital director, lasted some five hours and involve two teams, a team of trauma doctors and team of surgeons.

A deputy prime minister also filled in some details on Wednesday saying that he was shot in the stomach and the joints.

So these are really serious injuries I think, you know, he's now in ICU and presumably will stay there for a while. And this is being treated in Slovakia as an assassination attempt. We know that special meeting of the government security council and the government itself is taking place as we speak.

So, there are, of course, questions about the political motivation here and here's another top Slovak official talking about what happened. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ZUZANA CAPUTOVA, PRESIDENT OF SLOVAKIA (through translator): I am shocked. We are all shocked by the terrible and malicious attack on Prime Minister Robert Fico, something serious has happened that we can't even realize yet. A physical attack on the prime minister is primarily an attack on a person, but it is also an attack on democracy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: What else do we know about the dynamics -- of the political dynamics here?

SEBASTIAN: Yeah, this is a really important part of the context, Kasie. Robert Fico is a veteran in Slovakian politics, this is the third time he's been prime minister. He's really been prime minister off and on since 2006. So a total of at ten-plus years.

He is a man who despite the fact that Slovakia, only 31 years old as an independent country, has spent two decades of that time in the EU and in NATO. He has been shifting the country away from those sort of pro-Western policies, as we said, he is a Kremlin sympathizer. He's stopped government aid for Ukraine, even suggested they should give up territory.

So this is a country that is just gone through a major political about-turn.

HUNT: All right. Clare Sebastian, for us live in London. Clare, thanks very much for that.

All right. Twenty-three minutes past the hour. Here's your morning roundup.

Lawyers for Senator Bob Menendez trying to shift the blame for his alleged corruption on to his wife. In opening statements that his bribery trial on Wednesday, the defense claimed Nadine Menendez kept her husband in the dark on financial matters.

Severe storms, raising the risk of dangerous flooding from and the already soaked South. Heavy rain is forecast for today and tomorrow and it could trigger flash flooding think from eastern Texas through Louisiana and into western Mississippi. So watch out for that.

And Caitlin Clark's professional debut drawing a lot purchased WNBA audience in two decades, meeting the NHL playoffs head-to-head, the season opener between the Indiana Fever and the Connecticut Sun drew an average of 2.1 million viewers on Tuesday night. You love to see it.

All right, coming up next here, historically early, no live audience.

[05:25:02]

How next month's presidential debate is breaking norms?

Plus, CNN's on the fly interview with indicted Democratic Congressman Henry Cuellar.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HUNT: All right, welcome back. Just before 5:30 here on the East Coast. A live look at Capitol Hills, 2:30 out West.

Good morning, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. It's wonderful to have you with us.

A foot chase on Capitol Hill, of course, caught live on camera. That's the point.

[05:30:00]