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Trump Campaign Blames Iran for Hacking; Pennsylvania Voters Reflect on Revamped Presidential Race; Doris Kearns Goodwin is Interviewed about VP Picks; Trump Thinks Harris is Getting Free Ride. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired August 13, 2024 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[06:34:39]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I know Putin. I know President Xi. I know Kim Jong-un of North Korea. I know every one of them. And let me tell you, people will say, oh, this is terrible, he said - I'm not saying anything good or bad. They're at the top of their game. They're tough, they're smart, they're vicious, and they're going to protect their country. Whether they love their country, they probably do, it's just a different form of love, but they're going to protect their country.

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[06:35:03]

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: That was Donald Trump last night sharing his view of some of the world's most dangerous dictators. That was with Elon Musk on X.

Any of those leaders, of course, could be trying to interfere with the U.S. election. The former president's team is blaming Iran for hacking their campaign in June. According to multiple sources, the hackers compromised the personal email account of longtime Trump operative Roger Stone, stealing sensitive documents from the campaign.

A source telling CNN overnight that in June the FBI briefed the then Biden-Harris campaign on Iranian efforts to hack them as well.

Let's bring in CNN political commentator, former Trump defense Secretary, Mark Esper.

Mr. Secretary, thank you so much for being here.

MARK ESPER, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Good morning, Kasie.

HUNT: Can you talk to us a little bit about this hacking attempt? I mean, we know that it was successful in the case of the Trump situation. It seems as though it was not in the case of Biden-Harris. But clearly there are adversaries out there who are trying to influence our elections. Do you buy this explanation that it was the Iranians? What are you looking for here?

ESPER: Yes, look, I think its very possible that it is the Iranians, if you step back a little bit, we look at over the years, multiple briefings, for example, by the intelligence community to Congress where they said there's been foreign state attempts to either, a, interfere, or, b, influence U.S. elections. And it's more often the latter, how they try and influence, cause social discord, et cetera, in our elections.

And the principal players have been Russia, number one. This year, secondly, Iran. And then a distant third, China. And then there are others. North Korea is in there. A lot of other countries trying to sow discord or influence our elections.

It's completely feasible that it is Iran behind this. Iran does not want Trump to get back into office. They had a very bad experience with him during that time. Of course, it was the ending of the nuclear accord. And then finally, at the end of the administration, the killing of Qasem Soleimani.

So, they do not want Trump back in office, that's for sure. So, it's - it could be - it could be him. But we, again, know that others are trying to sow discord as well.

HUNT: So, I take your point on Iran. If you look across the map at other potential nefarious actors in this, I mean there's, obviously, been a lot of conversations about the Russians and their potential involvement. There almost seems to be an inclination toward Trump from the Russians.

Do you think that still holds? I mean, how do you look at them and some of the other dictators that Trump praised there last night with Elon Musk?

ESPER: Yes, the Russians are probably the biggest player out there. They have the largest operation. It's more - more agile, more adept than the Iranians are. And they have been trying to sow discord going all the way back to elections, right? So, you know, it's - it gets a little bit less clear, but one might argue that, yes, they'd be more inclined to have, for sure, Trump in office because Trump has said that he was - does not support Ukraine, that he has challenged NATO and other things. So, one might say that they favor him more than the other.

Xi Jinping and China, again, a little bit more unclear, although Trump has promised to levy across the board tariffs and upwards of a 65 percent tariff on Chinese goods coming into the country.

So again, these are probably the three principal actors. North Korea is in there as well. And all these are trying to, again, not interfere as much - it's very hard to interfere in the United States elections - but influence them by sowing discord through misinformation, disinformation, just stirring things up is what they're aiming to do. HUNT: Sir, while I have you, I also want to ask you about what's going on in Israel also with Iran because we've been sort of waiting with bated breath for a response to the killing of the Hamas political leader, and it still has not come and we did learn that Hamas is going to go back to the negotiating table around a ceasefire and a hostage deal in Gaza, as we're still waiting here and we've sent a nuclear submarine to the region. Of course, very rare that we would announce that we are doing that. Why do you think it has stretched this long? And what are you looking for next?

ESPER: Yes, I'm a little surprised it's lasted this long as well. Iran likes to strike back within a matter of days. I'm still convinced they will strike back at some point. So, it's not a question of whether, it's more of when and how.

But clearly what's happening here too is, you had these negotiations, number one. Number two, we know Iran and Hezbollah do not want a wider regional war. And I suspect that Iran is trying to figure out, what is the right tactic to respond to the killing of Ismail Haniyeh in late July in Tehran. How do they respond so that they maintain their credibility with their proxies and also retaliate against the embarrassment?

I think we've all believed that it will be a massive type of drone and missile attack.

[06:40:03]

But again, that risks a wider war. There's been some reporting that maybe they will try to pursue an intelligence operation, would mean - which means maybe they try to kill an Israeli official somewhere outside of the region or attack an embassy or something like that. But I think it now, at this point, pivots on these upcoming talks in two days on Thursday between Hamas and Israel. And can they get a deal? Can they, being really Hamas, get a deal that satisfies the demands of, at this point in time, the new both military leader of - I'm sorry, the new leader of Gaza and the new political leader who replaced Haniyeh, which is Yahya Sinwar, who's very tough. He's a hardened warrior who wants to keep this fight going on. So - but he's close to Iran.

HUNT: Yes.

ESPER: So, will he wanted to pursue this, or will he try and strike a deal? And, of course, the question is, does Bibi Netanyahu want to strike a deal as well?

HUNT: Right. All right.

Former Defense Secretary Mark Esper for us this morning. Sir, very grateful for your time. Thank you so much.

ESPER: Thanks, Kasie.

HUNT: All right, let's turn back now to the presidential race. The road to 1600 Pennsylvania will more than likely - in fact, it definitely goes through Pennsylvania. It is a must-win state. A critical piece of the blue wall if you're a Democrat.

CNN's John King went to talk to suburban voters there to see how the really historic events of the last few weeks have impacted what they're thinking about.

Here's a little taste of what he learned.

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MICHAEL PESCE, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: I'm not excited about voting for Kamala Harris, but it's better than the alternative.

JOAN LONDON, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: Senator Vance, are you going to tell Ann Coulter or Condoleezza Rice or Elizabeth Dole they're miserable cat ladies? I don't - I don't think so.

CAROL CARTY, PENNSYLVANIA VOTER: When Biden was on the ticket, I was going to vote for Trump. But now it's - it's - it's a harder call. Just because I am not a fan of Donald Trump.

And what are your goals for this job if you get the job? And that's what I want to hear from Kamala Harris.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So, first of all, interesting that she pronounced Kamala's name the way Donald Trump pronounce Kamala's name, which is incorrectly Kamala.

Anyway, Brad Todd, can you - I always love hearing directly from these voters. I'm actually from the suburban Philadelphia area. It's a place I know really well. I know you're working on this Senate raised there. I mean, what do you know? What have you learned about how the switch at the top of the Democratic ticket has changed the state of play there?

BRAD TODD, PARTNER, ONMESSAGE INC.: I think actually Kamala Harris is a weaker candidate than Joe Biden was in Pennsylvania. You know, Joe Biden always bragged about being Pennsylvania's third senator. He was from Scranton. Being from Wilmington, Delaware, he was always on TV in Philadelphia. He visited there all the time as president. I think she's actually worse. I think president -

HUNT: Well, I take your point, if it's a younger Joe Biden, but the difference between Joe Biden, as voters were seeing him, and Kamala Harris, I mean, I - I don't - I don't know. I don't quite buy it.

TODD: There's a group of older voters that Biden persistently held onto that he wasn't holding onto in other states though. And it was just due to pure familiarity.

HUNT: That's interesting. Yes.

TODD: I think, though, Donald Trump does have to prosecute the campaign in Pennsylvania. And it comes down to farming, fracking and crime. You know, Philadelphia's the most dangerous major city in the country. There are 330,000 people in Pennsylvania whose jobs depend on fracking. He has to go after those issues and paint her as an extremist on those issues to win.

KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It is true that Biden was able to do better with white working-class voters, the more rural white voters in Pennsylvania than other Democrats have. That's certainly true. And he, a Brad said, he certainly had that connection.

But he also ultimately won Pennsylvania, in part with margins in Philadelphia, with margins with voters of color, black voters in Philly. And, obviously, I think Kamala Harris has a message that thus far we see as resonating as we watch - as we see some of this polling over the last week, just in the, you know, Siena poll, you see black voters starting to come home in - in some of these swing states where, you know, Biden had been struggling. So, you know, I think there's definitely a path for her here to rebuild that winning coalition.

But, no question, Pennsylvania is going to be absolutely huge. I would expect to see her there are lots making the case. And - and it is going to - it's absolutely going to be probably decisive at the end of the day.

: You know one more thing is, Pennsylvania is moving rights slowly. It has been moving right for 20 years. The registration difference between Republicans and Democrats is down to almost 300,000 people. It was 600,000 four years ago in the last race. The states creeping ever rightward. So, it's a little tougher hill for Kamala Harris to climb (ph).

BEDINGFIELD: But - but -

HUNT: Yes, I mean, when Romney was running it was kind of a pipe dream for (INAUDIBLE).

BEDINGFIELD: But it's also - but as you listen to these voters, right, they don't view Donald Trump as an acceptable standard bearer of conservatism. I mean that's - that's the big issue, right?

LAURA BARRON-LOPEZ, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes. I think that's the thing. I think a lot of the - you know, these more double haters or middle of the road voters who maybe weren't totally sold on Biden are now moving over to Kamala Harris because they see someone that's younger. They didn't like the fact that it was the same two candidates running against each other. We heard that time and time again whenever I sat in on focus groups or talked to voters. And now they see something different. And they also like the VP candidate that she picked. So, that's something that is opening up some voters for her.

She's also bringing home the base in a way that Biden wasn't.

[06:45:01]

And so that could very well boost her, as you mentioned, the voters in Philadelphia, in a state like Pennsylvania.

TODD: Yes. HUNT: I mean the most interesting thing I heard in that voter mash was the woman who said, well, I don't like Trump, but obviously I was going to vote for him if it was against Biden, right. That she, Kamala Harris, has an opening with those people that Biden - that's closed - that was closed to Joe Biden.

All right, more to come here on CNN THIS MORNING.

Can a vice presidential candidate make or break a presidential ticket? We're going to talk with presidential historian Doris Kearns Goodwin.

Plus, Donald Trump spent much of his time talking to Elon Musk, bashing his opponent. But there was one comment about "Time" magazine's latest cover that caught some people off guard.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Kamala wouldn't have this conversation. She can't because she's not smart.

ELON MUSK, CEO, X: No.

TRUMP: You know, she's not a smart person. And Biden, we don't even have to talk about it. I mean, he couldn't have this conversation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

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[06:50:11]

HUNT: All right, 49 minutes past the hour. Here's your morning roundup.

Donald Trump demanding $100 million in damages from the Department of Justice for the FBI's Mar-a-Lago documents search Trump's team claims the search was inappropriate and hurt Trump's reputation. The search was approved by a federal judge after months of negotiations with Trump's legal team.

A New York judge ruling against Robert F. Kennedy Jr.'s attempts to get on the ballot in that state. In a ruling Monday, the judge found RFK Jr. used a sham New York address on a ballot access petition. The independent presidential nominee lives in California. Kennedy's campaign plans to appeal the ruling.

Arizona will have the chance to vote on abortion access this November. The proposed constitutional amendment would establish a fundamental right to abortion up to 22 to 24 weeks viability. The state currently has a 15 week limit.

All right, turning back now to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) JOHN F. KENNEDY, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: I come today with a Texan and a son of Massachusetts running on the ticket of the oldest party, but in a sense the youngest party. We ask your help in this campaign.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: That was JFK in 1960. The only time in history where most people agree that a vice presidential pick mattered enough to propel a president to the White House.

Next week, Minnesota Governor Tim Walz will make his major national debut at the convention as Kamala Harris' VP pick. And his first solo campaign event is today. While both Walz and Trump's VP pick, J.D. Vance, have been generating plenty of headlines, historians dispute how influential these VP picks actually are. When they do make a difference, it is sometimes when they do harm.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SARAH PALIN (R), FORMER VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: You know, they say the difference between a hockey mom and a pit bull, lipstick.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right, joining me now is presidential historian Doris Kearns Goodwin. She is the author of "The New York Times" bestseller, "An Unfinished Love Story: A Personal History of the 60s."

Doris, I am so grateful to have you here. Thank you so much for being here.

How does history typically view these vice presidential selections? Obviously, some of them go on to become president, and that historically makes a big difference. But again, we kind of had to go back to 1960 to find an example where it really mattered.

DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN, PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: You know, you're so right, Kasie. I mean most of history, I think they were viewed as non- important. I mean John Adams - good old John Adams said it was the most insignificant office in the history of man. But it becomes significant, just as you suggest. That's not a great resume for a vice president, right, but 15 of the 45, 46 presidents have become president, either by the resignation or the - or the death, or they win the election in their own right. So, that's almost one third. So that makes it really important.

But in the old days, when the political bosses were choosing the candidates and the vice presidents, because we didn't and have the primary system, they really were just choosing them to balance the ticket so the candidate they wanted for the nomination for the president would have somebody that he needed to win another state.

So, for example, when Rutherford B. Hayes from Ohio was chosen as the nominee, they chose William Wheeler of New York to balance him. And he said, I'm ashamed to say, I don't even know who William Wheeler is. So, that just showed how insignificant it seemed to be in that kind. And then when Teddy Roosevelt was made to be vice president, because they wanted him out of New York, because he was too progressive in New York, and he felt he couldn't turn it down because he would look like he was too snobby, he hated every minute of it. He said, I'm so bored, I'm going back to law school. I need something meaningful to do.

And even old Lyndon Johnson felt it was the most miserable time of his life, that he had been such a powerful majority leader and now he was shriveling up day by day.

It was really not until good old Carter brought Mondale in and gave him an office in the West Wing. As you can imagine, Kasie, that matters everything. You're in the West Wing. You're right in the center of power. You can hobnob with the people there. You're not over in the executive office building. And then that changed and Mondale became an important vice president. Gore was an important vice president. Cheney was an important vice president. And now I suspect that it's not only that Walz might help her win, but that he's going to be a person who will have real responsibilities once he gets in there.

HUNT: Well, I was going to say, with both Biden and Harris, we have two people that understand kind of the challenge - the unique challenges and frustrations of that job, as you just outlined. I mean how do you think that impacts things?

GOODWIN: I think it probably made a big difference for Kamala Harris because whatever frustrations or pleasure she had in the vice presidency, she knew that she was right there and she knows what the role is, what she hopes it was for herself, and she can make it such, I think, for Tim Walz.

[06:55:04]

And I think she realized she wanted somebody she could work with.

The presidency's a huge function. We wonder why it is that all the presidents get gray by the end. They look much older than they were in the beginning. It's such an impossible job. If you have somebody who can really be your partner, I know the first rule is win, choose the guy or the woman who's going to help you win. And that's true, if you don't win, then what's the point of having -

HUNT: If you don't win, you can't govern.

GOODWIN: Then you can't have some great partner there that you can be happy with day-by-day. And I think in a certain sense what Walz was able to do was, it's not so much that he's bringing the blue state of Minnesota, but those rural counties in those small towns from which he comes, they're all over the Midwest.

And so if he can really appeal to them as a football coach and a - and somebody who was a high school teacher and a social studies teacher after - after all, good old history comes in there, and then he was a military veteran, he's got a different - he's not an eastern elite kind of person. In fact, neither one of them are ivy league people. And that somehow we've had that for such a long period of time that maybe people will feel this is more of a - of a ticket that has a working class background to it. And that's the people that they need to win over.

HUNT: Yes, especially, quite frankly, in places like western Pennsylvania, which is going to be the whole ballgame.

Doris Kearns Goodwin, I'm so grateful to have you. Thank you so much for being with us this morning. I hope you'll come back soon.

GOODWIN: I would gladly so. Thank you, Kasie.

HUNT: All right, see you soon.

All right, let's turn now to this, more from Donald Trump's conversation with Elon Musk. At one point Trump decided to weigh in on this, "Time" magazine's recent feature, and specifically the cover artwork that pictured his opponent, Kamala Harris.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: She is terrible. She's terrible. But she's getting a free ride.

ELON MUSK, CEO, X: Yes. Yes.

TRUMP: I saw of a picture of her on "Time" magazine today. She looks like the most beautiful actress ever to live. I - it was a drawing.

MUSK: Yes.

TRUMP: And, actually, she looked very much like a great first lady, Melania. She looked - she looked -

MUSK: Yes.

TRUMP: Didn't look - she didn't look like Kamala, that's right. But, of course, she's a beautiful woman, so we'll leave it at that, right?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: OK, that's another pronunciation of her name, Camila.

Guys, what - like, what - there it is. This is Kamala Harris, beautifully drawn on the cover of "Time" magazine.

BARRON-LOPEZ: It looks like her.

HUNT: It looks like Kamala Harris.

BEDINGFIELD: Yes.

HUNT: Does it look like Melania Trump, Brad?

TODD: I think he was trying to say they were both beautiful. HUNT: Uh-huh.

TODD: And he's wasting time though. But I - he does have a fair point that Vice President Harris is getting the greatest media honeymoon ever known to presidential politics. And I think that was his core complaint there with that cover.

BEDINGFIELD: I - I mean look, I'm not - like I'm afraid to try to psychoanalyze what Donald Trump is doing here. Who knows? I don't know. I mean I think he - it does kind of seem like he was trying to say it was like an overly flattering drawing of her. I don't know.

But one thing it is not going to do is help him win suburban voters, swing voters. I mean he's, to Brad's point here, there are only so many days left in this election -

TODD: Yes.

BEDINGFIELD: And he's spending them, you know, sort of rambling nonsense rather than making a case. So, if that's what he wants to do -

HUNT: Well, we know he's obsessed with "Time" magazine as well from that (INAUDIBLE).

BEDINGFIELD: That is true. That is true.

BARRON-LOPEZ: You asked earlier, Kasie, like, why they weren't prepared. I think one thing was that they - Republicans that I talked to expected Democrats to fight - to have a big fight about who the person to replace Biden would be. And they did not think that people would coalesce around Harris as much as they did. And so you're seeing that he's just struggling with trying to find his footing against her because they didn't expect to be facing someone who had all of the support of the party behind her.

HUNT: All right, on that note, let's turn to this. I'll leave you with this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEYONCE: This ain't Texas, Ain't no held'em. So lay your cards down, down, down, down.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Beyonce, just one of the many names breaking through on former President Obama's annual summer playlist. The 44th president dropped his list this week, listing 44 songs, naturally. Another name on the lineup, Charli XCX.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHARLIE XCX: Yeah, 360. When you're in the mirror, do you like what you see?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: You could argue both of those names are also on the playlist of current Democratic Presidential Nominee Kamala Harris. Harris getting basically an endorsement from Charli XCX when the popstar tweeted out, "Kamala is brat." She also made Beyonce's song "Freedom" a centerpiece of her campaign, going back to her first appearance at the campaign headquarters in Delaware.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEYONCE: I break chains all by myself. Won't let my freedom rot in hell. Hey!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Also, of course, has his own unique playlist as well.

The music, you know, I mean I like Obama's lists, right? He does music. He does books every year. I usually try to go through and find one or the other to look at. You guys have any reading recommendations for the summer or a song?

[07:00:01]

I mean, maybe let's not do playlist, let's do books. Anyone read anything good lately?

TODD: I'm reading Cormac McCarthy's "The Passenger."

HUNT: Oh, that's a good one.

TODD: A really good book.

HUNT: I read "The Ministry of Time" on Obama's list. I have to say, I wouldn't - I - it wasn't my favorite. But -

BEDINGFIELD: Yes. I read "The Bee Sting" and it was captivating.

HUNT: All right.

BEDINGFIELD: Captivating. Not comforting, but captivating.

HUNT: All right. Sounds good.

Thanks to our panel. Thanks to all of you for joining us. I'm Kasie Hunt. Don't go anywhere. CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.