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CNN This Morning

Harris Challenges Trump to Second Debate; Biden Facing More Pressure to Ease Weapon Restrictions on Ukraine; Polaris Dawn's Historic Spacewalk; SpaceX's First Civilian Spacewalk. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired September 12, 2024 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Last night, Fox News offered -- sent letters to your campaign and her campaign offering three dates of debates moderated by Martha and Bret. One is October 9th in Arizona.

DONALD TRUMP, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Well, I wouldn't want to have Martha and Bret. I'd love to have somebody else other than Martha and Bret. I'd love to have frankly Sean or Jesse or Laura.

JIMMY KIMMEL, HOST, JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE!: Or Kid Rock or Kanye or Kim Jong-Un would be very good. A lot of very fine people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: It is still unclear whether we will see a second presidential debate between Kamala Harris and Donald Trump. It seems that the first debate did provide the vice president with a boost in favorability ratings among independent viewers. Some undecided voters, however, told CNN after the debate they still want more answers from the candidates before they make up their minds.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Clarity was one of the things that, you know, we had mentioned that we wanted, that we were looking for. In this debate, we just didn't see that. We didn't find that. So, we're looking for more information, more facts, things like that to help us decide.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I think we need to hear more interviews. I think debates just don't cut it. I just want to know where they actually stand on things and not just hear pretty sound clips.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. Joining me now to discuss is longtime pollster Frank Luntz. Frank, so grateful to have you back on the program. I am very interested to hear kind of how you first took in the debate. I saw, you know, what you had said on another network, basically acknowledging you don't think Donald Trump did himself any favors, but I also want to know whether or not you think it matters.

FRANK LUNTZ, POLLSTER AND COMMUNICATION STRATEGIST: It absolutely matters, and you're going to see it in the polling, it'll take a few days for it to register, and not only does it matter, we're talking about democracy. We're talking about the future of the country. It's not just an election.

And I recognize there's so many people say this is the most important election in their lifetime. Well, it also matters in history. Arguably, this is going to have a huge impact on who we are and what we're about as Americans.

She won the debate. Let me emphasize that because I'm getting criticized and viewers should know if you go online, you can see that I suggested that maybe Harris do a little less of the visualization of how she felt. That it was undercutting her message because to the voters that we talked to, they thought it was inauthentic. They thought she was acting.

Now, I want to emphasize, they believe she won the debate. They believe that she presented better than Donald Trump. But I'm a language guy. I'm a visual guy. I'm a debate coach. And I'd say to her, tone it down.

In Donald Trump's case, I'm getting beat up by those voters because I don't think there's going to be another debate. And I think that his performance came so far off the mark. And again, I recognize that people who say that it was three against one, that the hosts of the -- the moderators of the debate kept fact checking him and not doing the same to Harris. That aside, and that's the context, he did not focus on inflation. He did not focus on solutions. He spent way more time talking about what had happened in the past, and not enough time talking about the future.

Net, it was not a great night. It was not a great debate. But Kamala Harris clearly was won the encounter and you will see some benefit to her in the polls that follow.

HUNT: So, Frank, I will say -- I want to push a little bit on Harris and kind of how she responded. You're not the only person, I heard from people as the debate was unfolding, who were wondering whether the way she was making facial expressions was effective.

[06:35:00]

I asked, you know, my dozens of sources that I'm in touch with every election night, is this something that we should be comparing to the way Obama looked in the split screen with Mitt Romney in their first debate, where he similar -- not similarly necessarily, but the way that his demeanor was coming across was something was ultimately seen as a negative.

I have to say the overwhelming response I received back was that actually what she was doing -- and I heard this from both Republicans and Democrats, was very effective in terms of sending a message about who she was in terms of continuing to get under Trump's skin, which it seems like literally laughing at him, seems to have that impact.

And I will say, considering the way communications and media has changed in recent years, the thing that I see all over my social media feeds are her faces in this instance. So, I'm curious if you think that there's something to that, because I will also say, you know, people who -- one of the criticisms would be OK, well, a woman doing this would get more criticism than a man, for example.

LUNTZ: Yes, but the question is, does it add to the impact of what you say or does it detract? Does it help with the messaging? And most importantly, voters want someone who's going to look them straight in the eye, say what they mean what they say, and do what they say. And anything that cheapens that hurts the communication process.

I am emphasizing that they feel she won the debate. I've seen polling two to one, even three to one that says she's won. Trump produced his own polls to show that he won. I wonder the people they were talking to. Does it add or does it detract as it caused you to focus on something you shouldn't be?

And I don't react myself. I listen to what voters tell me. And in listening to that, that's why I've raised it. And I have to be able to do that as an objective observer. And I just want to emphasize, I'm getting beat up on the Trump people because they said that his comment about people eating pets or stealing pets and then eating them, illegal immigrants, that I'm making too much of that. Well, no, because voters are making a lot of that, and that has become part of the commentary.

It's our job on networks like yours to look you straight in the eye, even taking abuse from partisans on either side, and tell you the truth. And the truth is, she could have lowered the intensity of the face and raised the intensity of the rhetoric. That said, she won. And I don't know how to communicate that any more clearly than that.

HUNT: All right. Fair enough. Frank, very briefly, unfortunately we're very short on time. I wanted to play a little bit of this focus group you did with West Point Cadets, just because I think it's a really interesting group of people to talk to, especially as we are looking at the way both of these candidates are talking about America. Trump presents America as a nation in decline. Clearly, the Democrats tried to regain some footing around embracing patriotism with the way that they did the convention. What did you hear from those cadets who really do, obviously, represent the best of our country?

LUNTZ: They're not political. They're not partisan. They're the best of the country because they support the constitution, and they emphasize that. Their responsibility is to that document and to defend that document and to defend the country. And when we talk about the importance of safety and security, they're the living, breathing embodiment of it.

So, when we talk about sending troops to foreign countries, it's them. And that's why I'm trying to bring this focus group to as many people as possible, because I want them to personalize, individualize, and most importantly, humanize the people who defend this country. HUNT: All right. Frank Luntz, very grateful to have you. I hope you'll come back soon.

LUNTZ: Thank you.

HUNT: All right. Still ahead here on CNN This Morning, we're continuing to follow history in space. In just moments, the SpaceX crew about to open the hatch and step out into space.

Plus, we're going to be joined live by Congressman Ryan Zinke as the Biden administration debates another critical moment in the war in Ukraine.

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[06:40:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Will you lift restrictions on the use of long-range weapons by Ukraine?

JOE BIDEN, U.S. PRESIDENT: We're working that out right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: President Biden facing more pressure to ease restrictions on Ukrainian use of U.S. provided long-range weapons systems and allow Kyiv to strike targets deep inside Russia. While two U.S. officials later told CNN they appreciate -- they anticipate no change in policy from the administration on strike restrictions at the moment, a number of senior lawmakers are urging the administration to make a change.

A group of key House Republicans writing to the president this week, quote, "Similar to the Biden-Harris administration's shameful delay in approving our allies' transfer of F-16 jets to Ukraine, the administration is once again stopping our forward leaning-allies from helping Ukraine win."

And joining me now is Republican Congressman Ryan Zinke of Montana. He's a former Navy SEAL commander, a member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee. Congressman, good morning. Thank you for being here.

REP. RYAN ZINKE (R-MT): Good morning. And great to be with you.

HUNT: So, sir, you have opposed Ukraine aid in instances in the past. Do you support giving Zelenskyy more ability to strike with U.S. weaponry?

ZINKE: Well, let's be clear, Putin is a war criminal and I'm not pro- Russian in this instance, but what's the plan? You know, I'm a former, you know, SEAL Team Six commander, and I had -- I've been on a lot of missions in my life. I've never been on an operation without clearly defined objectives and a plan. So, we're $180 billion plus in Ukraine, and what's the plan? What's the objectives? What's the end state? You know, as we tiptoe towards a nuclear disaster, giving more and more weapons, longer range, more sophisticated weapons without a plan, I think that should be a concern, first of all.

[06:45:00]

HUNT: What did -- in the instance of the Kursk incursion that Vladimir Zelenskyy -- President Zelenskyy has made, that earned praise from the CIA for being part of an effective plan. Do you see it that way?

ZINKE: Well, what's the end state? Is the end state the Crimean Peninsula? I mean, there have been 14 wars fought over history over the Crimean Peninsula. Is it -- you know, are we going to deny access to Russia to the Black Sea? You know, what's the end state? You know, you can't reward aggressive behavior, and Russia's a problem. And now, you have, you know, larger issues.

It also looks at Ukraine in the context of what's happened in the rest of the world and what's happening in the Middle East, what's happening in Taiwan. As you know, our military is stretched. We cannot fight four different wars. Our military is only configured to actually fight one at a time and holding the other.

We're looking down the barrel of four possible major regional conflicts that should be a concern for us all. And without having a plan and objectives in Ukraine, I think it adds to that fire

HUNT: Congressman, let me ask you about Afghanistan. Obviously, the -- there was a report out laying blame at President Biden's feet, also it mentioned Jake Sullivan, the national security adviser. Do you think Kamala Harris played a critical role in our withdrawal from Afghanistan or did she not, based on her position?

ZINKE: Well, you know, last person in the room, you know, what does that entail? Certainly, she agreed with it. But Afghanistan was a failure at a colossal level. And it had repercussions. Not only did we lose 13, we could have lost thousands. And remember, we were consolidating against the advice of military commanders, of our allies.

HUNT: Do you think President Trump mishandled the deal with the Taliban that got us to that point?

ZINKE: I think President Trump -- well, I know President Trump wanted to end the endless wars. But it was conditional. And the synopsis, and I think the final assessment of the Afghanistan, is we were lied to. It didn't involve the Doha agreements. It was around a date, a date certain, regardless of conditions.

Remember Kabul, there were better places to defend. You had Bagram, you had Kandahar. Certainly, that we could have projected force. But it could have been -- I can tell you, it could have been much worse than 13. It could have been that every ally and every citizen, which there were thousands we didn't know about, could have been killed.

At the same time, remember, the Taliban were stoning to death female pilots we trained and hanging interpreters out of our helicopters at the same time. They certainly had the capacity to go much further.

HUNT: All right. I'm not sure about the details there. But unfortunately, I have to say thank you. I do appreciate your time today because we have some breaking news unfolding here that I really want to get to, because happening right now, history in space, the Polaris Dawn crew, look at that, they're opening the hatch of the Dragon capsule. They're about to expose themselves and everything in their cabin to the vacuum of space. And then, two of those crew members will be leaving the capsule on a first ever civilian spacewalk.

We're going to get back now to Kristin Fisher, CNN defense -- space and defense correspondent. We also have Miles O'Brien, CNN aviation analyst. Kristin. Let me just start with you to bring us up to speed on what we are seeing right now.

KRISTIN FISHER, CNN SPACE AND DEFENSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kasie, we are just seconds away from the moment, right, like the moment of this mission. Jared Isaacman, the cruise commander, has his hands on the hatch of the Dragon spacecraft orbiting the Earth, and he is just pulling it a little bit to pop the seal, essentially. And then, mission specialist Sarah Gillis is going to press a button and the hatch is going to open.

And, Kasie, can you imagine what that moment must feel like for these four civilian astronauts? They have just become the world's first private astronaut spacewalkers. It is the largest spacewalk ever conducted in terms of numbers. And right now, that SpaceX spacesuit is being tested for the very first time in the vacuum of space. And even though the hatch hasn't been opened, they are still, right now, the spacecraft inside is at the same pressure as the vacuum of space outside, which is why they need that spacesuit to protect them.

So, Kasie, and just to kind of give our viewers a sense of what you're looking at there, that is Mission Control for SpaceX on the left-hand side of your screen, based in Hawthorne, California. A reminder that this is not NASA, this is a private company doing this.

[06:50:00]

HUNT: Really interesting. And, Miles O'Brien, I mean, on that point, I mean, you have seen and covered so much history, space, aviation history over the past few decades. Can you help us understand a little bit about how we got here, that a private company is doing this now and where we're going?

MILES O'BRIEN, CNN AVIATION ANALYST: Yes. It was a purposeful effort on the part of NASA to try to get out of the business of directly owning an operating spacecraft to get in and out of low Earth orbit This goes back a couple of decades now. And of course, SpaceX has led the charge in -- first, delivering cargo to the International Space Station, developing the Dragon capsule, which the crew is on right now. And then, eventually, putting crews inside.

And now, this is the 14th crewed mission of a SpaceX Dragon capsule. And it has been an extremely successful program, you know. And in contrast, Boeing, the blue-chip aerospace enterprise, which 10 years ago had a similar contract left to them from NASA, has had nothing but trouble building its Starliner capsules.

So, SpaceX has proven that this new way of operating, this commercialization of space, this idea of a fixed price contract --

HUNT: Hey, hold on, Miles, one second. I want to talk about the pictures that we're seeing, because we just saw a lot of applause from mission control. And now, it looks like the hatch is wide open. Exposing -- again, there are four astronauts inside this capsule, four civilian -- perhaps I'm -- Kristin, correct me if I'm using the incorrect terminology for what we're calling these civilian spacewalkers. But this is, of course, the first time that these suits of use, as you've said, have been exposed to the vacuum of space.

And Kristin, can you talk a little bit about the suits? Because the NASA ones are now 40 years old. These are brand-new. And I don't know if we should listen in maybe to these astronauts for just one second too, if they are talking about what they're seeing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That structure you see, there is --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) for egress.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: SpaceX copies are with you and your helmet camera.

HUNT: That's a helmet camera review, we're looking at it. We're going to keep listening in.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That structure we see is the spacewalker. This is Jared now egressing through the forward hatch of Dragon Resilience. These are the first views of the first ever commercial spacewalk.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And at the bottom of the mobility is progressing.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I have a feeling the crowd is about to go wild.

HUNT: Wow.

JARED ISAACMAN, SPACEX ASTRONAUT: SpaceX, back at home, we all have a lot of work to do, but from here, work sure looks like a perfect world.

All right. SpaceX (INAUDIBLE) I'm going to step into Test Matrix One. Single handed mobility demonstration.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Commander Jared Isaacman now emerging from --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Copy. (INAUDIBLE) Test Matrix One, watching from (INAUDIBLE).

ISAACMAN: Up, down, left, and right are a three. Hitch and roll are three. Yaw is a two. Switching. Single handed operations are fine, static, and with dynamic disturbance. Switching to left hand. Up, down, left, and right are threes, maybe a two. Pitch is a four. Roll is a two. Yaw is a two.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: So, these are the suit mobility checks that Jared is performing.

ISAACMAN: Single handed operation is dynamic, and with disturbance are all adequate. Test Matrix One complete. HUD check, 5.3 PSI, 48 percent RH, 33 decimal 9 Celsius.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: SpaceX copies. Test Matrix One and HUD readout.

[06:55:00]

ISAACMAN: (INAUDIBLE) check. (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Good.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: 41 good.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: 43 good.

ISAACMAN: And stepping into your vertical translation. We're going to start with the horizontal bars. All right. We're going to transition over to vertical.

HUNT: Keep watching this together. Kristin Fisher, am I correct in saying that we are seeing the billionaire Jared Isaacman here as the first person -- the first commercial spacewalk yet underway? Tell us what we're looking at.

FISHER: Yes. So, that is the Polaris Dawn mission commander, Jared Isaacman. And I'm sure many of you are wondering, what on Earth is he doing out there? What does all of this mean? What he's doing is he's taking the suit through a series of mobility checks. He's moving all of his joints. and limbs and seeing how this spacecraft -- spacesuit feels and moves in the vacuum of space. And that's really the whole purpose of this spacewalk, right?

Like this crew wants to take the lessons that are learned from this spacewalk, bring it back to the SpaceX engineers on the ground and say, hey, this is what worked, this is what didn't work. And then SpaceX engineers can get to work on making those changes, because someday these are the spacesuits that SpaceX wants to use when humans first land on Mars.

But, you know, just what a moment for the commander, Jared Isaacman, here, because, you know, he first flew to space, Kasie, three years ago, as the commander of Inspiration 4, and the whole purpose of that mission was to, as the name says, inspire people and let people know that, you know, you don't have to be a NASA government professional astronaut to go to space anymore.

He had three crewmates that were just average people, very cool, but average people going to space. He landed from that mission, went to SpaceX's Elon Musk, and the two of them came up with this plan. He said, I don't want to just inspire with this mission, I want to do a real test and development program. I want to help SpaceX advance their technical objectives. How can I help?

And so, he has partially funded this mission and is trying to advance SpaceX's human spaceflight. And the thing they need now are spacesuits, and they need to be able to develop them faster and more cheaply than NASA has been able to over the last 40 years. Kasie. So, that's what's happening now.

Look at these images. That's Jared Isaacman. And then, coming up next is going to be Sarah Gillis, a SpaceX employee and SpaceX's lead astronaut trainer.

HUNT: Kristin, do we call them astronauts? What do we call them?

FISHER: You can call them astronauts now. They are private astronauts or civilian astronauts. That's the right term. But, hey, when you're doing a spacewalk, you're an astronaut.

HUNT: That seems entirely fair. Kristin, I know you've got to run. You're going to be on the top of the next hour. I really want to thank you for all of your contributions.

And, Miles O'Brien, let's just stick with what we're seeing here as we head toward the top of the hour. Again, the first civilian astronaut spacewalk. We are seeing all these pictures coming in live from SpaceX. And Kristin was talking a little bit about this. But the goal here is to go much farther than just Earth orbit here with these suits. I mean, isn't this about the moon and eventually Mars?

O'BRIEN: Yes, what you're seeing is, you know, one small step, if you'll excuse that phrase. But what we're talking about here --

HUNT: Never have to apologize for that.

O'BRIEN: is -- you know, eventually, the vision is rather grandiose. Imagine armadas of spacecraft going to Mars. That's the SpaceX vision. In order to really execute that plan, you need to have human beings protected inside suits.

Right now, there are about, I think, a little more than a dozen extra vehicular mobility units. That's NASA's space suit for spacewalks that exists, and they're $15 million a copy. And NASA's had a very difficult time developing a new generation for its Artemis program. So, in parallel here, SpaceX is working on its own spacesuit for spacewalks.

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