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Supreme Court To Hear Arguments On Transgender Rights Today; Rep. Clyburn Urges Biden To Pardon Other Potential Trump Targets; President Yoon Facing Possible Impeachment, Treason Charges. Aired 5:30-6a ET
Aired December 04, 2024 - 05:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[05:30:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
L. WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I was born in a male body, and I am a woman, and that's incredibly uncomfortable for me.
PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT (voiceover): Her parents, Brian and Samantha, had no idea --
SAMANTHA WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I was surprised but I was never -- I was still, like, from the very beginning supportive. Like, OK, this is what's going on with you. We're there for it.
REID (voiceover): -- and debated whether this was all just a phase.
BRIAN WILLIAMS, PLAINTIFF: I asked lots of questions and had lot of pushback. I asked probably a lot of the questions that people are -- who are in opposition of this case are probably asking, you know. Is this a phase? What does this mean?
REID (voiceover): They got her a therapist and eventually started treatments.
L. WILLIAMS: It's been very helpful -- life-changing, even. For some people, it's even been lifesaving.
REID (voiceover): The Tennessee ban forced doctors to stop treating transgender patients like L with treatments that included puberty blockers and hormone therapies.
S. WILLIAMS: It was just purely political. It was let's use these poor kids and these families as a pawn. And, like, we just want to be able to take her to the doctor.
REID (voiceover): Roughly two dozen similar laws have been enacted in recent years in Republican-led states. Now L's case, which was joined by two other families, is before the U.S. Supreme Court.
CHASE STRANGIO, FIRST OPENLY TRANSGENDER ATTORNEY TO ARGUE BEFORE THE SUPREME COURT: When I go before the high court, I'm not going to be thinking about myself as the first transgender lawyer. REID (voiceover): Chase Strangio will make history as the first known
transgender person to argue before the high court on behalf of teens like L.
The other side of this case -- the state of Tennessee -- has gotten support from groups like "Do No Harm" and Dr. Stanley Goldfarb who believes this treatment should not be available to minors.
DR. STANLEY GOLDFARB, FOUNDER, "DO NO HARM": We feel like children just aren't really unable to do this in a way that involves informed consent primarily, and that many of them are just children that are very troubled.
REID (voiceover): We pressed him on why patients like L claim their lives have benefited from this treatment.
GOLDFARB: There is a huge placebo effect. Any time a patient is told, you know, I -- we're going to help you with this medication and you're going to feel better, it's going to be the answer to your problems, there's often an acute response that's positive to it.
REID (voiceover): But L says that explanation belies her experience.
REID: Supporters of this bill say it's too easy. You're saying there's nothing easy about it.
L. WILLIAMS: There isn't anything easy about it.
REID (voiceover): L's parents who have had to travel as far as Ohio to continue her treatment have not ruled out moving to another state if this case does not go their way.
B. WILLIAMS: You have, you know, strong career ties, and a neighborhood that we love, and a house that we love.
S. WILLIAMS: The kids have friends.
B. WILLIAMS: The kids have friends. I don't want to pull them out of school and go to another state. It's just -- I don't know. We shouldn't have to do that.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Our thanks to Paula Reid for that reporting.
And in just a few hours the Supreme Court is going to hear arguments challenging the ban.
Let's bring in CNN legal analyst Joey Jackson. Joey, good morning to you.
So what really will this case hinge on today from a legal perspective?
JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST, CRIMINAL DEFENSE ATTORNEY, FORMER PROSECUTOR (via Webex by Cisco): Yeah, Kasie, good morning. It's going to hinge on the framing of the issue. And what happens is that is an equal protection case, right? It's based upon equal protection under the law and who should be afford equal protection. But not so fast -- maybe it's not. What do I mean?
When you look at equal protection the government certainly can make laws that relate to gender-based classifications. And when you make laws based upon gender it's subject to a heightened level of scrutiny. And what is that heightened level of scrutiny? Whatever the law is has to be substantially related, right, to an important governmental purpose.
Here the issue is whether or not minors should be getting this reaffirming surgery and really, whether or not they're mature enough to get the reaffirming surgery. That, however, relates to minors, right?
And I think they're going to frame the issue if you're on the one side saying that hey, the Supreme Court should not recognize protection here, it's about minors. It's about whether minors are mature enough. It's about whether minors at that point in their life because that's the requisite mental capacity to make a decision that is so long- lasting and impacting on their life.
If, on the other hand, it's about the issue of gender and whether or not you're part of a suspect class and whether or not you should get protection under the law, it's about gender and sex -- not about simply minors.
And so I think the framing of the issue as to whether or not it relates to a gender-based classification and this heightened level of scrutiny that should be applied by the court or simply whether it's about minors and whether they're mature enough -- I think that's going to carry the day.
HUNT: So basically, if you -- it -- the argument is that you would be treated differently under this law in Tennessee depending on your sex, and that would be not allowed under our current system.
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JACKSON: Exactly right, Kasie. If the issue is whether or not this is applicable transgender -- it's based simply upon sex. If it's based upon that then you have to subject it to a very heightened standard of scrutiny. And under that issue it may not pass muster because if you're --
HUNT: Right.
JACKSON: -- talking about creating laws and you're talking about equal protection that's one thing. If you talk about protecting minors and that's the basis for the law that's another. That's subject to a more relaxed standard. Not to get too constitutional law-ish- but that's subject to a standard of hey, if the law rationally related to a legitimate purpose. And I think that's going to be -- the framing of the issue is going to be important. And then let's not forget the politics behind the issue and whether you're a Republican or Democrat in this past election and how gender certainly played, and transgender played into that.
HUNT: For sure.
All right, Joey Jackson for us this morning. Sir, always grateful to have you. Thank you.
All right, let's turn now to this. While many in President Joe Biden's own party have condemned him for issuing a pardon for his son, one ally saying he urged him to do it and should maybe go farther.
South Carolina Congressman Jim Clyburn was a key voice in helping Joe Biden win the Democratic nomination four years ago and now he says he has no problem with the Hunter Biden pardon.
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REP. JAMES CLYBURN (D-SC): I am absolutely OK with it. I don't know how many people urged him to do so, but I did two weeks --
LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF LEGAL ANALYST: You did?
CLYBURN: Yes, I did because I know he was targeted. We all know that but for the fact he is Joe Biden's son he would never have been taken through these gyrations.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Clyburn also tells CNN the president should take -- also take steps to protect others before Trump takes office.
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CLYBURN: Jack Smith's name is on my list. Liz Cheney's name is on my list. I think that they all should be preemptively pardoned because I think there are people who Trump may bring into this government who will go after these people in a serious way and there's no need to subject them to that.
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HUNT: All right, joining us now to discuss, Tiffany Smiley, former Republican candidate of Senate in Washington State. And Maria Cardona, CNN political commentator and a Democratic strategist. Welcome to both of you.
MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Thank you.
TIFFANY SMILEY, VETERANS ADVOCATE, (R) FORMER WASHINGTON SENATE CANDIDATE: Thank you for having us.
HUNT: Thank you so much for being here. So pretty interesting what Clyburn said there, especially about
whether the president should preemptively pardon some of these people that -- let's be real, many -- some of these Republican officials -- Kash Patel has a literal enemies list, for example, in his book.
Tiffany, let me start with you.
SMILEY: Yeah.
HUNT: Is it a good idea?
SMILEY: You know, look, let's be honest. President Trump made comments that he would be willing to pardon -- that he would consider pardoning -- you know, pardoning Hunter Biden. And as mom of three boys, like, everyone can sympathize and understand what President Biden is doing with his son.
But I think it's important to also know that President Biden's Department of Justice tried a backdoor deal to help Hunter Biden, right, while simultaneously going after concerned parents on school boards, going after Catholics and pro-life activists.
So at the end of the day the Democrats have a hole to dig out of and this just made it worse because President Biden lied repeatedly. And the D.C. Democrats need to wake up and realize that the rest of America is in a completely different place on this.
And not only that, President Trump is going to bring -- he wants to bring respect back, truth back into these departments. And what is going on with President Biden and Hunter is a clear case why the American people have lost faith in the system.
HUNT: Maria, do you think -- how do you feel about what President Biden did here and the sweeping nature of it?
CARDONA: I think that his mistake was not pardoning his son. I think anyone who has a heart, who has sympathy, who is a parent can understand that. And I think the majority of Americans understand that. And I believe the majority of Americans, especially those who are parents, would agree with this -- with this decision.
HUNT: It is hard to conceive that if you had this power and you were facing this --
CARDONA: Yes.
HUNT: -- as a parent -- I mean, I --
CARDONA: Absolutely.
HUNT: I take your point there but continue.
CARDONA: Absolutely.
I think his mistake was having been so definitive before -- prior to all of this that he would not do it. Now, I don't think he lied. I think circumstances changed. And I think had the election gone the other way we may not be in this situation.
But when you take a look at the people who Donald Trump is nominating -- and I'm sorry but I find it laughable when you say that Donald Trump wants to bring truth back into the government. That's a guffaw right there. But when you see the people that he is nominating they literally, along with Donald Trump, like you just mentioned, have a list of people that they are focused on revenge against, on retribution.
[05:40:08]
And the fact that Hunter Biden has been this one thing that Republicans have been obsessed with as the way to get to President Biden. And President Biden sees that and he's like you know what, I have this power. I have this once chance to shield my one and only surviving son in my family from the kind of torture these people want and are salivating to go against my son and my family. I'm going to do it.
SMILEY: I'm sorry, there was a political witch hunt out against President Trump and Democrats, in fact, ran on locking Donald Trump up and raised money on putting Donald Trump in jail.
HUNT: Well, chanting "lock someone up" is not -- was original to Trump rallies in 2015, but --
CARDONA: Exactly, but that's not what Democrats did. And he is a 34- times convicted felon and that is not something that Democrats did, that's something that Donald Trump did to himself.
SMILEY: And not only that, weaponized the DOJ against parents in this country, against Catholics like against pro -- that happened. I mean, look at the mandate that the American people just sent out to Donald Trump.
HUNT: Let me ask you about that mandate because I am --
SMILEY: Yeah.
HUNT: -- curious for -- right. There's one thing -- they did win the election, right? They have -- they have a mandate to govern. We have, though, seen there is a pendulum in our politics --
CARDONA: Yes.
SMILEY: Yes.
HUNT: -- and when a party in power overreaches, oftentimes the voters step in and they say no, we don't want to do that.
SMILEY: Right.
HUNT: There is this question about the Department of Justice and whether they're going to look backward at some of these people that the president has listed as his opponents, or whether they're going to look forward. And you've heard Kash Patel say things like, you know, we want the FBI
to focus more on prosecuting criminals, right?
SMILEY: Right.
HUNT: That is certainly something that he could do if he ends up leading the bureau, right, saying we're going to prioritize this instead.
What would you like to see Republicans do? Do you want to see retribution? Do you think that that's productive for voters or not?
SMILEY: I think that's the messaging. What they're going to do is restore trust back in these federal departments for the American people who have seen the mistrust over the last four years. Who have seen it weaponized, politicized, right? They're going to take politics out of it.
And you're exactly right. Kash Patel will say go protect the American people. That's the mandate that was sent down. And that's clear --
HUNT: He's also -- he's also said we need to go after these -- this set of people.
CARDONA: Yes.
HUNT: So that -- I mean, that's my question, right?
CARDONA: Exactly.
SMILEY: I --
HUNT: Which is the best -- what is the best approach in your field?
SMILEY: It's going forward, and that's exactly what we'll do.
I mean, look at Donald Trump. He elected an amazing chief of staff, Susie Wiles, who will help direct and get the right people in office. And, in fact, the majority of Americans -- I think there was a CBS poll -- close to 60 percent of Americans actually approve of Donald Trump's transition and who he's putting -- who he's nominating --
HUNT: Yeah.
SMILEY: -- and the process going forward.
CARDONA: Well, hopefully --
HUNT: Last word.
CARDONA: -- it will be forward looking. But what you -- like you said, Kash Patel and Donald Trump himself are still obsessed with what has gone before. And Donald Trump is somebody who, as we all know, is obsessed with an enemies list. That's something that Kamala Harris talked about all the time. Now, granted, the American people -- from what I understand in the
exit polls, they elected Donald Trump to take care of higher prices. To take care of inflation. Everything that he has talked about since his election has been everything but talking about that.
HUNT: Well, I guess we're about to find out.
Tiffany, Maria, thank you very much, both, for being here.
CARDONA: Thank you, Kasie.
HUNT: I really -- I really appreciate it.
SMILEY: Thanks.
HUNT: All right. Ahead here on CNN THIS MORNING political turmoil gripping South Korea. Can the embattled president remain in power after trying to impose martial law?
Plus, why Warriors' coach Steve Kerr is calling out the refs after a chaotic finish in Denver.
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HUNT: All right, welcome back.
South Korea's embattled president facing calls to resign and a threat of impeachment after attempting to impose martial law.
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YOON SUK YEOL, PRESIDENT OF SOUTH KOREAN (through translator): I declare emergency martial law to defend the Republic of Korea from the danger of North Korean communist forces.
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HUNT: That declaration by President Yoon triggering massive protests in Seoul forcing the embattled president to rescind the order. South Korea's opposition party now threatening to file treason charges if Yoon does not resign.
Let's bring in Col. David Maxwell, retired Army Green Beret and vice president of the Center for Asia Pacific Strategy. Colonel, I'm so grateful to have you on the show this morning. Thank you very much for being here.
Can you help us understand what this turmoil inside a key U.S. ally in the Asia Pacific means?
COL. DAVID MAXWELL (RET.), VICE PRESIDENT, CENTER FOR ASIA PACIFIC STRATEGY, SENIOR FELLOW, GLOBAL PEACE FOUNDATION, U.S. ARMY GREEN BERET, FORMER COMMANDER, MARINE CORPS BASE, QUANTICO (via Webex by Cisco): Yes. First of all, obviously, we don't like to get involved in domestic politics, but this is really a conflict between President Yoon and the opposition Minjoo Party leader Lee Jae-myung.
And President Yoon must have thought that he needed to take this action really to defend himself from the political opposition, which has really been fighting him tooth and nail in the assembly where he does not have a majority.
But South Korea is a global pivotal state as President Yoon has called it. It has become a partner in the arsenal of democracy, and it has global relations both economically and politically. And so the domestic political turmoil really has global implications and, of course, for the South Korean-U.S. alliance in the face of the continuing very real threat from North Korea.
HUNT: So, speaking of North Korea, how does how to approach North Korea factor into the dispute between the president of South Korea and the opposition leader that you mentioned?
MAXWELL: Well, unfortunately, while we focus on the nuclear threat, which is very real and dangerous, we focus on the new relations with Russia and support to Putin's war in Ukraine.
[05:50:00]
But North Korea has actively conducted a political warfare campaign to subvert South Korean society and the South Korean government. It's United Front Department, its 225th Bureau has actively tried to subvert South Korea for the last seven decades.
And so the question is how will Kim Jong Un exploit this for his political and strategic benefit and further exacerbate the internal political conflict, which is to Kim Jong Un's benefit, unfortunately?
HUNT: What are the implications for the Americans who are stationed -- the American troops stationed in South Korea?
MAXWELL: Well, I was -- in the 1980s I was in Korea during the democracy movement, so I witnessed the protests there. I don't think there are great implications. First of all, the majority of U.S. troops are no longer in Seoul and so that was a lightning rod back at the time during the democracy movement in the 1980s.
I think that -- I think really, things have subsided very quickly with the removal of martial law. But I don't expect that this will turn on U.S. troops and have the kind of protests that occurred during the 1980s. Although the relationship between President Yoon and the Biden administration -- you know, there has been strong alliance relations. And there are, of course, some who may take advantage of that. Some who were -- have anti-American sentiment --
HUNT: Yeah.
MAXWELL: -- who may try to exploit that. But I don't think there are big implications for the U.S. presence at the current time.
HUNT: All right, Col. David Maxwell. Very grateful to have you and your expertise with us this morning. Thank you. MAXWELL: Thank you.
HUNT: All right, time now for sports. The College Football Playoff Selection Committee reveals its latest rankings. Plenty though to sort out with the conference championships still to be played this weekend.
Andy Scholes has more on who's in and who's out in the morning's Bleacher Report. Andy, our favorite topic, college football playoffs.
ANDY SCHOLES, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Yeah.
HUNT: Good morning.
SCHOLES: Yeah, good morning, Kasie.
So I'll tell you what, the 10-2 Miami Hurricanes and their fans not very happy this morning. The Playoff Committee putting them behind 9-3 Alabama. And the committee chairman said if you're not playing this weekend you can't jump in the rankings. So that means Miami is not going to be going to the playoffs.
And this is what the playoffs would look like right now. Oregon, Texas, SMU, and Boise State would get byes as highest-rated conference champions.
In the first round, Penn State would host Arizona State. ASU is ranked 15th but the fifth-highest-rated conference champ is guaranteed a spot in the playoffs, so they get in. Tennessee would play at Ohio State. Notre Dame would host Alabama. And Indiana would go to Georgia.
Now we could see movement after the conference championship games this weekend. UNLV, Iowa State, and Clemson are all in win and get in situations. And if Clemson beats SMU in the ACC title game to claim that spot, we could see a situation where SMU still gets in, and that would knock out Alabama.
The final rankings and brackets are going to come out on Sunday.
The NFL, meanwhile, announcing that Texas linebacker Azeez Al-Shaair has been suspended for three games for his hit on Jaguars' quarterback Trevor Lawrence. The league calling his hit unacceptable and said Al- Shaair has shown a continued disregard for players' safety.
Now, Al-Shaair apologized earlier this week saying he didn't see Lawrence slide until it was too late.
Now, Texans' general manager Nick Caserio, meanwhile -- he came out and defended Al-Shaair saying the league is being inconsistent in how they handle these hits. And he also slammed anyone questioning Al- Shaair's character.
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NICK CASERIO, GENERAL MANAGER, HOUSTON TEXANS: For the league to make some of the commentary that they made about lack of sportsmanship, lack of coachability, lack of paying attention to the rules, quite frankly, it's embarrassing. So I think the big thing from our -- and they're talking about a player who has never been suspended, never been ejected. So now we're saying that he's going to be suspended for three games?
The picture that's been painted about Azeez, his intentions, who he is as a person -- I mean, quite frankly, it's bull (bleep).
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SCHOLES: Yeah. Al-Shaair is expected to appeal that three-game suspension. All right, the NBA Cup group play, meanwhile, wrapping up last night. The Nuggets hosting the Warriors. In the closing seconds, Golden State down four off the miss. Christian Brown -- he's going to get the rebound and it looks like he signals for a time out on the floor there, but they didn't have any. And the officials -- they ended up calling a jump ball.
Steve Kerr was livid because a time out would have been a technical and Warriors' ball. Instead, the game would just end after a jump ball. Denver wins 119-115.
And here was Kerr afterwards.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE KERR, HEAD COACH, GOLDEN STATE WARRIORS: Brown called a timeout. He dove on the floor, he rolled over. Everybody saw it except for the three guys we hire to do the games, and that makes me angry, you know. This is a -- like, that's a technical foul. They don't have a timeout left. It's a technical foul, we shoot a free throw, we get the ball. We got a chance to win the game.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[05:55:00]
SCHOLES: Steve Kerr is probably going to hear from the league office about those comments.
But despite that loss the Warriors are moving on to the NBA Cup quarterfinals. Here are your matchups. Warriors are going to play at the Rockets. The Thunder will play the Mavs. In the East, the Knicks host the Hawks, and the Bucks will host the Magic. Semifinals will then be in Las Vegas December 14. The NBA Cup title, the 17th of December.
Kasie, I'm pretty excited. My Rockets have a chance at the NBA Cup.
HUNT: I will back them -- back them up just for you, Andy.
SCHOLES: Appreciate it.
HUNT: That sounds great. Good luck.
SCHOLES: All right. HUNT: All right. Straight ahead here on CNN THIS MORNING a painfully small majority. House Republicans left with little room for dissent in the upcoming Congress. We're going to speak live with Republican Congressman Tim Burchett about how his party can navigate this mandate with the slimmest of margins.
Plus, judgment day. In a matter of hours Pete Hegseth heads back to Capitol Hill as more Republicans raise questions about allegations in his past.
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SEN. CYNTHIA LUMMIS (R-WY): Yes, he does need to address those because this was not something of which we were aware nor was President Trump aware of them.
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