Return to Transcripts main page
CNN This Morning
Families Search for Missing Loved Ones in Syrian Prison; Trump Comments on Syria; Rep. Ryan Zinke (R-MT) is Interviewed about Gabbard and Hegseth; Man Charged in Health Care CEO Killing. Aired 6:30-7a ET
Aired December 10, 2024 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:32:15]
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome back.
As rebel forces take control of Syria, thousands are heading inside the country's most notorious prison. They are desperate to find their loved ones. People who went missing under Bashar al-Assad's regime.
CNN's Clarissa Ward has been on the ground in Damascus, and she took CNN cameras inside.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The stream of families never stops, climbing towards Syria's most notorious Saydnaya Prison, pushed on by reports that thousands of people, imprisoned by the regime of Bashar al-Assad, are still trapped alive in a section underground.
The red section of the prison, they've been trying for days to reach it, Maysoon Abu (ph) tells us.
There's no oxygen because the ventilation went out and so they all may die. For the sake of Allah, help them.
WARD: Is someone from your family in the prison?
WARD (voice over): My three brothers and my son-in-law, she says.
The roads are choked with cars full of people looking for loved ones. As soon as they see our camera, they approach, holding lists of names of those who vanished inside Assad's dungeons, never to be seen again.
We have to get them out before tomorrow, this man says, they don't have food, they don't have water.
WARD: Everybody's just started running. It's not clear if they have managed to get into this part of the prison.
WARD (voice over): My God, my God, a woman prays, my God, as the crowd surges towards the prison. WARD: So, it looks like they think that they have managed to get
access. A lot of celebratory gunfire. People now just flooding in.
WARD (voice over): After the initial jubilation, an agonizing wait for confirmation from the rescue workers. Many here have been waiting for decades. Hope was something they didn't let themselves feel until now.
Rescue workers with Syria's white helmets break through the concrete looking for a way in. No one is certain where this red section is, or if it even exists.
Inside the prison, family members are searching too.
WARD: You can see people everywhere just combing through all the papers and records they can find looking for names, seeing if maybe their loved ones are there.
WARD (voice over): Tens of thousands of Syrians were forcibly disappeared in Saydnaya, lost in the abyss of a prison that was known as a slaughterhouse, industrial scale, arbitrary detention and torture, all to keep one man in power.
[06:35:12]
WARD: They call this the white area of the prison because they say the conditions here are much better than in other areas. But you can see, it's still miserable.
WARD (voice over): In the center of the prison, another frantic rush. Someone thinks they have found a tunnel. They desperately try to get a look inside.
Others look on, helpless. Not knowing is agony. Assad may be gone, but the legacy of his cruelty remains.
WARD: After we returned from our trip to Saydnaya, a group called the Association of Detainees and the missing in Saydnaya said that they do not believe that the red section exists, that they are confident that all of those who were detained in Saydnaya were released on December 8th before 11:00 a.m. And the white helmets, those rescue workers that you saw there, have now confirmed that they have concluded their search.
Clarissa Ward, CNN, Damascus.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HUNT: Just remarkable reporting from our Clarissa Ward.
And this new balance of power in the Middle East has sent the U.S. and other powers scrambling to shore up their interests in Syria as they weigh how to navigate the country's emerging power vacuum and uncertain future.
For Secretary of State Antony Blinken, the American interests in Syria are, quote, "clear and enduring." (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANTONY BLINKEN, SECRETARY OF STATE: We have a strong interest in preventing the reemergence of ISIS.
We have a clear interest in ensuring that whatever weapons of mass destruction or components are left in Syria do not fall into the wrong hands. We have a clear interest in doing what we can to avoid the fragmentation of Syria, mass migrations from Syria, and, of course, the export of terrorism and extremism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right, our panel is back.
And, Brad Todd, I mean, what you are hearing Antony Blinken there say, which is that America has an interest in what happens to this, it contrasts very directly with the language that we heard from President-elect Trump over the weekend, which we can put up on the screen, where he very clearly says that America, "the United States should have nothing to do with it. This is not our fight. Let it play out. Do not get involved."
This is one of those places where the old Republican Party would have viewed it a certain way, would have said it is the - America's responsibility, like it is in our national security interest to be involved in, you know, the ways in which they - we should be involved will be debatable. Is that actually going to happen in Donald Trump's Washington?
BRAD TODD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, I don't think so. I mean I think the George Bush Republican Party is not here when it comes to issues like this. I mean this also is very complicated, to be fair. I mean we have a new government in Syria that's been designated as a terrorist actor by almost everyone who designates terrorists terrorist actors.
HUNT: That we can't even talk to for that reason.
TODD: Right.
HUNT: Right.
TODD: As a result.
But on the other hand, Iran and Russia, who are not our friends, are clearly losing out here and losing a key ally in Assad. So, it's a complicated situation. Trump made very clear that he took on ISIS. And if these elements are going to realign with ISIS, he will take care of them very quickly.
So, I don't think that we're seeing a total isolationist move by him. But he also does not want Joe Biden to get him into a situation that is harder to get out of. And I think that's what you're seeing made clear. KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I think it's - you know, it is easy to say in a Truth Social post, we have no interest here. We're not going to be involved. I think the reality is, as president of the United States, these situations, if you don't go to them, they come to you. And I think, you know, it is going to be a - a difficult challenge for - for example, you know, Donald Trump says he's a stalwart ally of Israel. Well, Israel is going to have interest in whether the United States is helping to stabilize the - stabilize Syria in a way that's beneficial to them.
So, it's, you know, it - I agree with Brad, it is a complicated situation. But it is very, very rarely as simple as just saying, hands off, this is not our problem.
ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: It's made even more complicated by the fact that the U.S. really hasn't had a diplomatic presence in Syria now since 2012. And as you were saying, when you have a rebel group that was designated as a terrorist organization in the Obama administration, will we see a change there now moving forward? The ambassador that made that designation told my colleagues it should be considered at this point to open up channels. In the meantime, the U.S. is going to have to rely on Turkey essentially for any type of communication and diplomatic ties.
EDWARD-ISAAC DOVERE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: But you - you do see, for ten years now, across the Obama, Trump administration, Biden administration, and now the incoming Trump administration, a hesitation about getting involved in a foreign conflict. That Barack Obama knew that ten years ago and that is why the U.S. wasn't more involved at the start of the civil war.
Of course, this is - seems like another one of those places where we hear from a lot of people who are a part of the incoming Trump administration, or allies of it, that he is going to have a different world in front of him than the one that he left in 2021.
[06:40:10]
HUNT: Yes, I'm glad you mentioned. I remember covering Barack Obama on Capitol Hill when he, in theory, had a red line on Syria.
DOVERE: Yes.
HUNT: And Congress had -
DOVERE: And the red line moved over time.
TODD: (INAUDIBLE) Republicans ready to support him too. Tom Cotton and Mike Pompeo were ready to support him, and he backed off.
HUNT: Yes, he did.
All right, straight ahead here on CNN THIS MORNING, Donald Trump's pick for Director of National Intelligence clarifying her stance on Syria, aligning with the president-elect. Congressman Ryan Zinke joins us live next to discuss. And the suspected CEO killer taking the internet by storm.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY KIMMEL, HOST, "JIMMY KIMMEL LIVE": I think we can all agree that no one could have imagined this suspect would have a name as funny as Luigi Mangione. I mean, with a lot of murderers or alleged murderers and you arrest them, you have to use the middle name. Like, we don't need Luigi Wayne Mangione here. It's not necessary.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:45:20]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TULSI GABBARD, DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INTELLIGENCE NOMINEE: I stand in full support and wholeheartedly agree with the statements that President Trump has made over these last few days with regards to the developments in Syria. My own views and experiences have been shaped by my multiple deployments and seeing firsthand the cost of war and the threat of Islamist terrorism.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Donald Trump's pick for Director of National Intelligence, former Democratic congresswoman turned Trump supporter Tulsi Gabbard on offense yesterday on Capitol Hill. She has been meeting with GOP senators this week in preparation for her nomination hearing.
(INAUDIBLE) regime in Syria bringing fresh scrutiny at an inconvenient time for Gabbard, who has already faced criticism for her controversial (INAUDIBLE) Bashar al-Assad and comments that she made defending his rule. Those views, though, yet to phase Senate Republicans.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. LINDSEY GRAHAM (R-SC): We've had policy differences. I know her. I like her. You know, she wanted to stay in the JCPOA. I thought that was a mistake. But, you know, she'll be serving Trump.
SEN. BILL HAGERTY (R-TN): President Trump has hired her for a very specific job. He's in the process of doing that. And she's actually raised questions with respect to the intelligence community I think that need to be asked, that need to be delivered upon. Also, Tulsi represents a broadening of the - of the tent, if you will.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right, joining us now, Congressman Ryan Zinke of Montana. He currently serves on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, is a former Navy SEAL commander, Republican, of course. Congressman, thanks very much for being here.
REP. RYAN ZINKE (R-MT): Great to be with you.
HUNT: So you overlapped in the House with Tulsi Gabbard. You have also been responsible for troops in combat. You know what it means when intelligence officials are making decisions that really affect the lives of the people around you.
Do you think Tulsi Gabbard is the right person for this job, or do you have concerns based on what you understand our interests in this region to be?
ZINKE: Well, you know, I served - we served in the House Armed Services together and no doubt she has talent. What I like about Tulsi is, she has a military background. She's certainly talented. And she understands the dynamics. She also understands President Trump.
President Trump has his own set of ideas. He works - or Tulsi will work at the pleasure of the president. And so, she'll tighten up where we're going as a country and in the administration.
So, I'm confident that she will get confirmed. There's some - there's some issues that we probably disagree on. But, ultimately, she'll be working for the commander in chief. And I think she'll serve well.
HUNT: So, if you were commanding a SEAL team, you'd be comfortable with her as your Director of National Intelligence.
ZINKE: I would. I would. Now, remember, the Director of Intelligence also is a coordinating body. There's a lot of intelligence, both in the field and at the headquarters. So, she's going to have to sort through. And there's a prevailing thought, and I think in - justified in some reasons, that the intelligence agencies themselves have not been totally honest. They are driven with internal objectives and agendas sometimes that are different from the administration. So, she's going to have a task on her hand going through and making sure that our intelligence agencies are true to - to this administration and also true to the public.
HUNT: There were - there's a report from NBC that Democrats and Republicans on the House Foreign Affairs Committee, they were worried about Gabbard coming to a hearing with a Syrian defector, right? They - they wanted the defector to cover his face before she got into the hearing because they were concerned that she may leak his identity to Bashar al-Assad.
What's your reaction to that?
ZINKE: I think it's overrated on this. At the end of the - at the end of the day, you know, she works for the president. And she had some views on - on Ukraine that are - that - on Ukraine, as an example, as it perhaps, you know, Putin's relationship with Ukraine and Putin's relationship with the U.S. can be -- can be improved. Some of it, of course, had to do with - with Ukraine going into NATO. There's a lot of us that - that look at - you know, we're going to need to slow down on this. And the Crimean peninsula.
So, she had some - she articulated some views that maybe were not uniformly popular, but I think they're - they're worthy of debate.
HUNT: So, big picture, the House of Representatives is going to have the narrowest of narrow majorities for Republicans, right, going into the winter and that like the first four months, basically, because Donald Trump's picked a couple of these people to go serve in his administration. They're not going to be in Congress. What's the dynamic right now between House Republicans and President-elect Trump?
[06:50:05]
Is there anything noteworthy about it?
ZINKE: You know what, what's different? The 118th Congress. You know, we stumbled a lot. And I said there was a few that blew up the tracks, if that's a good analogy.
What's different now, when President Trump is the commander in chief, if you disrupt the path and agenda of the House, you, in fact, are blowing up Donald Trump's tracks. And there is a difference. Before you - you could - you could blow up the tracks, you could - you could cause some confusion, you could, perhaps, you know, vote against bills and the House would not proceed forward in our work.
Now it's different because when you're obstructionist with President Trump and his agenda, you - we move from a rebel that sometimes profited from blowing things up to an outlaw of you're, in fact, you know, destroying and disabling and blowing up, you know, Donald Trump's agenda.
HUNT: So what, if anything, do you and your colleagues see coming out of President Trump that tells us - I mean, there are a number of critical issues here, right? Like the government has to get - has to be funded for a certain length of time. Do House Republicans have independent ideas about that or are you just waiting for the president?
ZINKE: You know, in many ways I'm hoping it's well-coordinated. You know the House is a separate body. But I - what's clear is, there's not been a president, certainly in my lifetime, that has had more influence on the internal workings of the House.
If you remember, a lot of House members relied on President Trump's endorsement. And - and President Donald Trump got involved in a lot of these very close races. So, they're beholden to him in a lot of ways, and in their political careers, and they pay attention to Donald Trump. And again, if - if one of these guys gets out of line too far and begins to blow up the agenda and cause havoc within the House, I think Donald Trump will take notice because then we're not getting things done and we're not doing what we said we would do. We said we would get the job done. That means move ahead at a lightning pace, according to, you know, what we can in the House. But again, it's the agenda, the American first agenda. If we fall short of that, the American public is - should be upset. And, you know what, we need to pay attention.
HUNT: Let me ask you about one of President Trump's nominees, Pete Hegseth, also a veteran. He, at one point, pushed on the issue of war crimes. There were some service members who committed - or found to have committed these crimes. And he pushed for that to be wiped away.
Do you have any concerns about that piece of Pete Hegseth's record?
ZINKE: No. You know, what I what - what I appreciate about Pete Hegseth is that he was a combat veteran himself and he understands the dynamic of what's going on in the field. There's a connection between a soldier and a secretary that I think is important.
You know, some of the - some of the comments have been, wait, well, he, you know, he's young. Well, Donald Rumsfeld was young. Certainly McNamara was young. And then there's been a lot of secretaries that haven't had the military experience, as Pete Hegseth. We had Les Aspin, for instance. Perry had no military experience. So, I'm pretty confident that Pete Hegseth will - will bear the burden and the responsibility of being a secretary well and understand the troop level and - and why it's important.
HUNT: Very briefly, sir, on Syria, I know this is something you've worked on in your - on your committees. Donald Trump has said that the U.S. should have no involvement in Syria. Do you agree with that?
ZINKE: Well, there is influences. You have in northern Syria. You have the PPK, the YPG, also terrorist organizations that Turkey has long been in war with, in battle, because they are a terrorist - Marxist Leninist organization. You have Israel now with the Golan Heights seeing a threat along the border. So Israel has moved to secure that area. And in the midst of this, it's almost a throwback to Lawrence of Arabia marching on Damascus, as you have multiple coalition groups with different interests. Most of them are on a terrorist list somewhere.
But what we do know is now Russia and Iran's influence is waning, as - as the influence builds up and you see a government come in of some sort. The U.S. does have an interest in ensuring, number one, it doesn't spill out. And then our allies, particularly Turkey in the north, and Israel in the south, their interests need to be protected as well.
HUNT: All right, Congressman Ryan Zinke, thanks very much for being with us this morning.
ZINKE: My pleasure.
HUNT: I appreciate it very much. Nice to see you.
All right, 54 minutes past the hour. Here's your morning roundup.
We're going to go live to Malibu, California, where the Franklin Fire has tripled in size overnight. The blaze forcing mandatory evacuations and threatening structures.
[06:55:01]
It is burning close to Pepperdine University. The school says the worst of the fire is past the campus now. The Santa Ana winds, coupled with dry air and low humidity fueling the flames.
A Manhattan jury finds former Marine Daniel Penny not guilty of criminally negligent homicide in the subway choking death of Jordan Neely last year. Neely, who struggled with homelessness, was acting erratically on the train when Penny confronted him. Penny also faced a more serious second-degree manslaughter charge, but that was dismissed after jurors twice told the judge they were deadlocked on the count.
New video of Jay-z on the red carpet with his family last night, as he asks a judge to reveal the identity of his rape accuser, or throw out the case. An alleged victim known only as Jane Doe claims he raped her alongside Sean "Diddy" Combs 24 years ago when she was 13 years old. Jay-z denies the allegation.
All right, let's turn now to this story.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The biggest problem right now is I want to believe that he didn't mean to just fizzle out in the middle of a McDonald's.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Menendez brothers, move over. Luigi is about to take the girls by storm.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Look at the photos they used when this man got picked up. Not the 14 pack. He's GTL.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: The man accused of killing United Healthcare's CEO going viral. Images of Luigi Mangione seem to captivate the attention of online masses. The Manhattan killing also uncovering a deep dissatisfaction with the United States healthcare industry. The incident sparking outrage online over health insurance policies.
Pennsylvania Governor Josh Shapiro pushing back against some of the hateful rhetoric after the murder suspect's arrest.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOV. JOSH SHAPIRO (D-PA): Violence can never be used to address political differences or to address a substantive difference, or to try and prove some ideological point. That is not what we do in a civilized society. That was true in Butler. It was true in New York City.
The suspect here, who shot at that CEO and killed that CEO, is a coward, not a hero.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right, our panel has returned. Zolan, clearly people are - you know, the things that they're willing
to say on the internet often feel extraordinarily distressing. But that said, there also is clearly very deep anger in the American public about this.
What do you make of what Josh Shapiro said there and what we've learned about our country?
KANNO-YOUNGS: Sure. I think, you know, we - we didn't need this period to know that on the internet, under sort of the guise or shield of anonymity, you know, people don't exactly show their best selves, you know.
You know, this - this has sort of exposed a deep, deep seeded anger in the country towards the healthcare industry. But as public officials, you know, have said here, you know, still you have to use this moment to condemn a violent act like this.
That being said, you know, I do think that it has shown that anger is existing. There is a little bit of risk, though, when you see sort of all these memes and this attempt at humor at times and sort of putting this person up as a folk hero, of also lionizing somebody that just did commit a violent act in a killing. That's something I used to cover, the NYPD in crime, and would talk to people that study some of these incidents, and they would - this is why they were worried about the internet when these things happen, the attempt of putting these people on a platform and almost lionizing them in a way.
DOVERE: But you see this is - I mean, just the cover of "The New York Post" today, the contrast of Daniel Penny and Mangione. I mean these are, one, to "The Post" readership is a hero, and the other one is terrible. It does seem like we should be able to have a - I mean, I have a general anti-murder policy myself.
HUNT: Obviously. Thou shalt not kill, right.
DOVERE: Right.
HUNT: Very basic.
BEDINGFIELD: There's also just a - the reaction online is also just such a reinforcement of how much esthetics, attractiveness. I mean -
DOVERE: Yes.
BEDINGFIELD: Like the shallowness of the American people. The American people who are online we'll say is very much on display here.
Part of - yes, there's absolutely a bubbling anger about the inequity in the country writ large and in the healthcare system, no question. But so much of, you know, the clips we were watching at the top of this segment are driven by the fact that this is - this is an attractive person.
HUNT: You know, we've got to drop the banner to show why.
BEDINGFIELD: And - and it's - it is deeply troubling that we are celebrating this - this person who's committed cold blooded murder -
TODD: Yes.
BEDINGFIELD: Because, you know, he clearly went to the gym.
TODD: But, you know, one takeaway, though, is the health insurance industry, the health insurance industry is the one industry in America that seeks to not deliver its product.
[07:00:01]
That's the business model.
HUNT: Yes.
TODD: So, I think they have to watch out with this - with the sentiment that's coming.
HUNT: Well, I think the hard part is that literally - I mean, they're all private. So, I'm not asking people to tell the stories. But I imagine everyone at this table probably has a story about fighting with these companies and how that impacted their lives.
All right, thank you guys very much for joining us. Thanks to all of you for being with us as well. I'm Kasie Hunt. Don't go anywhere. "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts right now.
