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Rep. Debbie Dingell (D-MI) is Interviewed about a Government Shutdown; Michael Smerconish is Interviewed about Biden and a Possible Shutdown; Biden's Last Push for EV Agenda. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired December 20, 2024 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[06:32:39]

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STEPHEN COLBERT, HOST, THE LATE SHOW WITH STEPHEN COLBERT": Republicans rejected a three month stopgap funding extension, which means unless they come up with a deal tonight, the government will shut down at midnight, which would be terrible. We need the government. Who else is not going to tell us anything about the drones?

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KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: The prospect of a government shutdown looking more likely this morning after a Trump-backed funding bill failed last night, with nearly all Democrats and 38 Republicans voting against it. "Politico" reporting Speaker Mike Johnson was spotted in a tense conversation with the Republicans who opposed the legislation, writing he was, quote, "clearly agitated, using his arms to make his points and running his hands through his hair during the lively exchange." In front of the cameras, though, the blame was not directed at them.

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REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Very disappointing to us that all but two Democrats voted against aid to farmers and ranchers, against disaster relief, against all these bipartisan measures.

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENT-ELECT: The Democrats just voted to shut down the government, even though we had a clean CR, because they didn't want to give the president negotiating leverage during his first term - or during the first year of his new term. And, number two, because they would rather shut down the government and fight for global censorship bull (EXPLETIVE DELETED). They've asked for a shutdown, and I think that's exactly what they're going to get.

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HUNT: All right, joining us now, Democratic Congresswoman Debbie Dingell of Michigan. She's the chair of the Democratic Policy and Communications Committee. Congresswoman, wonderful to have you on the show.

REP. DEBBIE DINGELL (D-MI): Thank you.

HUNT: So, the bottom line here, what is the path forward and are Democrats willing to continue to say no to these proposals, or do you think there's some risk in getting some blame from the American people if there's a government shutdown?

DINGELL: Well, I think we're going to have to communicate very directly, Kasie, about what is and is not happening. Republicans don't want to take the blame for this, but they are the exact people that we have to blame for this.

There were weeks and months of negotiations on where to get to this bipartisan CR deal. There was agreement. Every - all four corners. All four corners. Let's be really clear, agree - four corners, for those that are listening, are the leaders, Republican leaders and Democratic leaders of the House and Senate agreed to the deal.

I gets - rank - our leader came in, said, we got to do this.

[06:35:02]

There were things people didn't want in it. Compromise is not a dirty word. President Musk woke up on Wednesday morning and saw some things in there, like he was going to - some things he wants to do in China that were going to raise questions. So, his business in China was going to be challenged.

And there were other issues, and there were more than - there were multiple tweets by Musk on Wednesday and threatening members, said they would be primaried if they supported. I don't think unelected billionaires should be allowed to threaten elected. That's not the democratic process. And suddenly we didn't have a deal.

And there were a lot of things that weren't in what we were voting for last night that were important. So, I think every Democrat I know wants to fund the government. He did - Speaker Johnson didn't have 38 of his own members support that bill. I don't know what their plan c is. I know Democrats want to fund the government. There are really important things we need to get done, but we can't be rolled (ph) by somebody just because of threats. Our job is to protect the people that elected us.

HUNT: Congresswoman, is the House speaker, Mike Johnson, engaging at all with Hakeem Jeffries, with Democratic leaders right now?

DINGELL: I think there - I know that Hakeem - that they have had good relationships. They try to talk. He respects him. I don't believe there's been a lot of discussion between Democrats and Republicans in the last 48 hours.

HUNT: If Donald Trump were to come to Washington, as some Republican - we heard from Senator Kevin Cramer saying, to fix this, Donald Trump needs to come to Washington and talk to people face to face. Do you think if that happened, Republicans could get something across the line?

DINGELL: I don't know. I think that President Trump is certainly persuasive. I think there have been a - I don't like a formal - government threats, you know, a government run by threats. If he came and explained to people, although I think a number of the Freedom Caucus members have some pretty strong feelings about why they voted no.

But I think people should talk. I think getting everybody - everybody at the table, I do - as I've said before, compromise is not a dirty word. People have different perspectives. You can try to figure it out.

But I don't think making sure a billionaire can invest in China and cutting children's cancer and our farmers have so many things they're worried about -

HUNT: Yes.

DINGELL: And children (ph), veterans, seniors, there's a lot of issues we need - those people shouldn't be hurt in the process of helping billionaires.

HUNT: Where is President Biden in all this? He is still actually president.

DINGELL: I know that he's been very engaged. I myself talked to the White House multiple times yesterday. Thursday was the anniversary of his first wife's death. So, he did go to Delaware and went to mass, a ritual I respect. But he's very much present watching this.

I think right now it's time to see the Republicans, that they're the ones that wanted to blow up the deal. They're the ones - so you're all paying attention to president Musk, and soon to be President Trump again.

HUNT: Yes.

To follow up on what - how President Biden is sort of exiting the stage. His sort of posture towards what's happening is remarkable in its kind of change from what we saw during the campaign.

I want to show you - this is something that he said when he gave that major speech about democracy in Pennsylvania back on January 5th, and then what we heard from him yesterday. Let's watch this.

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JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (January 5, 2024): Trump's assault on democracy isn't just part of his past. It's what he's promising for the future. He's being straightforward. He's not hiding the ball.

BIDEN (December 19, 2024): The fact that he doesn't abide by the rules of the democracy we've established is not my concern. My job is to make a transition workable and available. (END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: It's quite a shift in tone.

DINGELL: Well, one was a campaign mode where he was warning people what was going to happen. I think on the minds of many Democrats is what happened during the January 6th, four years ago. There was not a peaceful transition of government the way that I hope will happen this time. The people spoke on Election Day.

Donald Trump's doing many of the things that he said that he would do. I think all of us are committed to protecting our democracy. We are not going to be threatened by billionaires. But what our responsibility is, is to have an orderly transition of government. And those of us who are elected, no matter what our party, have a responsibility to fight hard for the issues that matter to our people - the people that elected us to protect them, reach across the aisle and try to work with them, but not let people hurt seniors or veterans or children. And that's what you're seeing now, an orderly transition, which is what our democracy is.

HUNT: Do you think that President Biden, in his waning days here, should offer some pardon related protections to members of the January 6th Committee, considering what Trump has had to say about that in the last week?

[06:40:10]

DINGELL: I have spoken with many members of the January 6th Committee, and they - I haven't talked to them in the last 48 hours. But last week were, we haven't done anything wrong. So, pardon implies that we've done something wrong.

I very much worry about the threats I've heard directed towards Liz Cheney in the past week, and I hope our country remains a democracy and people aren't threatened for trying to be responsible public servants.

HUNT: All right, Congresswoman Debbie Dingell, always grateful to have you.

DINGELL: Thank you.

HUNT: Happy holidays. Merry Christmas.

DINGELL: Happy holidays.

HUNT: Good luck. If you get to celebrate it anyway.

All right, coming up, after the break on CNN THIS MORNING, it's electric. Donald Trump's plans to roll back the Biden administration's electric vehicle policy, and the last ditch effort to stop that from happening.

Plus, in his final days in office, President Biden notably absent from the spotlight. Even with that possible government shutdown looming just hours away. Michael Smerconish here to discuss.

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REP. MIKE LAWLER (R-NY): Nobody's asking where Joe Biden is or what Joe Biden thinks, and he's the sitting president of the United States. Doesn't that say something right now?

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[06:45:32]

HUNT: All right, let's turn now to this.

During the chaos that unfolded yesterday on Capitol Hill, there was a key voice that seemed MIA.

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REP. MIKE LAWLER (R-NY): Nobody's asking where Joe Biden is or what Joe Biden thinks, and he's the sitting president of the United States. Doesn't that say something right now?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: President Biden, in his waning days in office, has been staying out of the spotlight, even as shutdown negotiations spiral as Donald Trump and Elon Musk take the reins. His apathy toward Trump in this moment seemed to be summed up in this remark.

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JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The fact that he doesn't abide by the rules of the democracy we've established is not my concern. My job is to make a transition workable and available.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Not my concern. It does sound a little different from what we heard from the president on the campaign trail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (January 5, 2024): He's willing to sacrifice our democracy.

BIDEN (March 9, 2024): I'm not making these quotes up. When he says he wants to be a dictator, I believe him.

BIDEN (May 9, 2024): We've got to win. Democracy is at stake.

BIDEN (September 29, 2024): Theres an extremist movement that does not share the basic beliefs in our democracy. The MAGA movement.

BIDEN (May 19, 2024): Well, that's my commitment to you, to show you democracy, democracy, democracy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right, it's Friday. Means it's time for Michael Smerconish, CNN political commentator, host of CNN's "SMERCONISH." Michael, always wonderful to see you.

MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you, Kasie. Merry Christmas and happy holidays if I don't see you again between now and the big days next week. Thank you so much for all the appearances this year as well.

HUNT: We've loved having you. Merry Christmas, happy holidays to you as well.

As we sort of outlined there, one person who seems to be on already maybe heading out on vacation is President Biden. I mean you heard the tone there. You haven't seen very much of him out on, you know, out in public here. Instead, the focus really on the president-elect, even though he's not president yet. What do you make of it all?

SMERCONISH: Well, that and couple it with the fact that just within the last 48 hours you've had these two really significant stories, one from "The Wall Street Journal," a four person byline, the other from "The New York Times" on the front page of yesterday's print edition, talking about the frailties that he has exhibited the entire time that he's been in office, including this line on the front page of "The Times" yesterday. "It's hard to imagine that he seriously thought that he could do the world's most stressful job for another four years."

Now, I should point out that there's no bombshell. There's no one anecdote, at least to my eye, in "The Times" or in "The Wall Street Journal," where you read it and you say, my God, why didn't someone say something then? But, collectively, they tell the story of, frankly, an 82-year-old exhibiting the frailties of an 82-year-old.

But I think that it is a reflective moment for all of us, including the media, to say, why are the stories appearing now? And how much of this, frankly, could have been written before now? And what would have happened if the debate moment hadn't occurred he'd stayed in and he'd won the election? Like, where would we be today? A little painful, a little uncomfortable, especially to raise at the end of his term and during the holidays, but I think it's a worthy conversation.

HUNT: Michael, what do you think - and how do you think voters take in this, you know, what we're learning now here, and - and how angry do you think they feel about seemingly being deceived during this period?

SMERCONISH: So, anecdotally, based on the telephone callers to my program, both yesterday, and I'll cover this subject again today given "The Wall Street Journal" reporting. And if I look at the comments that are appended to each of this - these stories, there is a lot of I told you so maybe from partizans and a lot of people who voiced the complaint that the media was in the know and covered for him because of their dislike of Donald Trump. They were willing to look the other way hoping that Biden, in whatever capacity he might be, would nevertheless beat Donald Trump. That's a perception held, not by all, but by a significant number, I think, of Americans.

HUNT: Well, and you saw it really in the polling as well that, you know, people really didn't think he was up to it, well before we saw him take that debate stage in Atlanta.

Michael, while I have you, I do really want to ask you about what we're seeing going on, on Capitol Hill, particularly the dynamic between Donald Trump and Elon Musk here.

[06:50:06]

Because we covered this yesterday. You know, watching those tweets come out from Musk as they were trying to pass this on The Hill on Wednesday reminded me very strongly of what used to happen when Donald Trump was in office the first time around, And it would send things, you know, skidding out on Capitol Hill all the time.

Except this time the person who caused that to happen, it wasn't Donald Trump, it was Elon Musk. And Trump came in kind of late and said, yes, actually, I do agree with this. Now, Speaker Johnson was waiting for him before formally pulling the bill, but the ship had already sailed by the time Trump weighed in. How do you think that's going to impact the Trump-Musk dynamic, if at all?

SMERCONISH: I don't get this. Donald Trump has been on cruise control, right? He wins a majority of the vote. Both houses of Congress. Tech titans are coming to kiss the ring in Mar-A-Lago. World leaders are seeking to curry favor. He goes to France to be with Macron. Like, why this unforced error at the end of the year when things are looking so rosy for him and people, I think, are largely willing to give him a fresh slate for a second term. And to be so at odds with what had been sort of a core principle of conservatism in Republican politics, which is, control the spending. And now he's on the side of seeking to do what? Raise the debt ceiling. For what purpose? The only thing, and I'm not expert in these matters - the only thing that I can imagine is because they want to ease the ability for a tax cut on his watch, and they need the debt ceiling gone in order to make that a reality. I can't do better with any other speculation.

HUNT: Briefly, who do you think takes the blame if the government shuts down over the holidays? Republicans? Democrats?

SMERCONISH: It's going to remind me of - of the - the bipartisan effort for border control, where Trump torpedoed it and then everybody pointed fingers at one another. But if this deal doesn't go through, I don't know how you come to any conclusion other than it was the Republicans, including Trump and Elon Musk, who thwarted it. That would be my conclusion.

HUNT: All right, Michael Smerconish, always grateful to have you. As you said, Merry Christmas. Happy holidays. Can't wait to see you in the new year.

For our viewers, remember, tune in to "SMERCONISH" tomorrow morning, 9:00 a.m. Eastern, right here on CNN. All right, 51 minutes past the hour. Here is your morning roundup. A

spectacle in New York. Suspected CEO killer, 26-year-old Luigi Mangione back in New York. He arrived surrounded by officers with bulletproof vests and automatic weapons. Even the mayor, Eric Adams, showed up. They were all escorting him in handcuffs to federal court. Mangione facing a slew of new federal charges. If found guilty, he could face the death penalty.

Malaysia has agreed in principle to restart its search for the wreckage of Flight MH370. Remember this? The Malaysia Airlines flight was carrying 227 passengers and 12 crew members when it vanished more than ten years ago. In the years since then, debris from the plane has washed up on the east coast of Africa and on islands in the Indian Ocean.

Former MLB slugger Sammy Sosa welcomed back by the Chicago Cubs after apparently acknowledging he used performance enhancing drugs during a career that featured more than 600 homers. Sosa releasing this statement, quote, "there were times I did whatever I could to recover from injuries in an effort to keep my strength up to perform over 162 games. I never broke any laws, but in hindsight, I made mistakes and I apologize. Remarkable.

Briefly, I want to go back to Mangione, Meghan Hays, because you just had some interesting insight that I kind of wanted to share, which is that that helipad where he landed, the president often lands there. So, you've seen how they can handle that. They didn't have to make him do this walk.

MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING: No, they frequently bring the cars closer and you don't have to do that walk. They don't make the president walk. I don't know that's the exact same pier that the president lands on, but they - those - they are with - able to withstand cars moving, so they did not have to make - and from what my experience with the president, they don't - they don't need to do this long walk. And also they want the pictures. You can see the - the public affairs person from the police department right there taking photos.

HUNT: Yes, so that's a police department camera watching this all play out.

HAYS: Yes.

HUNT: Just - it was remarkable.

HAYS: Many of them.

HUNT: Stunning, yesterday. So many people.

All right, let's turn now to something that President Biden is trying to protect ahead of Donald Trump's inauguration.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: This sucker's quick. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How does it feel?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: How's it drive?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: If you've ever test driven an EV, they are very quick off the line.

Biden making a last-minute push to secure his electric vehicle agenda by greenlighting California's electric vehicle mandate in the hopes that the state's market power will spur EV production before Trump gets into office. Trump has said he'll roll back Biden's EV policies. You might remember, he made headlines this summer with this, let's say, a confusing way of explaining why.

[06:55:05]

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DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENT-ELECT (June 9, 2024): They want us to make all electric boats.

What would happen if the boat sank from its weight and you're in the boat and you have this tremendously powerful battery. And the battery's now underwater. And there's a shark that's approximately ten yards over there.

Do I get electrocuted if the boat is sinking, water goes over the battery, the boat is sinking? Do I stay on top of the boat and get electrocuted, or do I jump over by the shark?

You know what I'd do if there was a shark? Or you get electrocuted? I'll take electrocution every single time. I'm not getting near the shark. So, we're going to end that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: I Mean, who knew Donald Trump was afraid of sharks? I didn't know.

JONAH GOLDBERG, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Oh, it's a big thing. He hates sharks.

HUNT: So this EV situation, I - Jonah, this - California has a history of setting standards for cars in America because the market is so big. Things like seatbelts and other rules often originate there. Now Biden is trying to save this.

Is it going to work? And I'm also interested in the, you know, tension between Trump and Musk on electric vehicles as well.

GOLDBERG: Yes, I mean, I think this is a microcosm of - the Musk-Trump part is a microcosm of these coalitional tensions and fault lines within the sort of Trump orbit that are really hard to sort of figure how they're going to play out. I hope this fails. I mean, I don't care about the shark stuff, but

like, I'm against industrial policy by the federal government. And the only thing I'm more against is industrial policy by the state of California imposing something on the entire country. And it is going to be interesting to see where - what kind of carve-out Musk gets, not just for the EV stuff and the subsidies for EVs, but also for a lot of the China stuff because he needs China in a huge way, and the rest of the party is very hawkish on China. And I just don't know how it's going to play out.

ALEX THOMPSON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Which is the one thing I wanted to add about what Joe Biden has done. Most things that Joe Biden is doing right now can very easily be reversed at this late point in the presidency. But, you know, he probably had the most ambitious EV agenda of any president ever. But they've come up short in some very significant ways. They were going to make all these charging stations all across America. They've only had a handful actually been produced. And it's almost certain that Donald Trump is not going to build any more.

MATT GORMAN, FORMER TIM SCOTT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN SENIOR ADVISER AND REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Key word is mandate. That's the key word. I mean I remember traveling with Tim Scott and going to Iowa. People are against electric vehicles as a competition. What they are against is being told they need to hit certain mandates. And that's where the rub is among our party and I think the general populace is -

THOMPSON: You saw Democrats run away from EVs at the very end of this last campaign.

GORMAN: Yes.

THOMPSON: Elissa Slotkin in Michigan ran ads basically saying, I'm not going to do mandates.

GOLDBERG: Well, that's very hard to take from the ethanol state, I'll just say.

HUNT: In Iowa, yes.

I mean it's interesting, Meghan Hays, "The New York Times" ran this headline last month, "automakers to Trump: please require us to sell electric vehicles." It's a little counterintuitive, but "three of the nation's largest automakers Ford, General Motors, Stellantis, are strategizing with other car manufacturers on how to make a delicate request, don't scrap the federal regulations that compel the industry to sell them. In fact, most automakers don't love the more stringent rules that Mr. Biden put in place. But they have already invested billions in a transition to electric vehicles, and they fear that if Mr. Trump made an abrupt change, as he has promised, they could be undercut by automakers who sell cheaper gas-powered cars."

HAYS: Yes, absolutely. I mean there is a lot - when we were there and you saw the president went to different - to GM and to Ford to - to see some of these factories. And they have now turned them over to make EV cars, and they have already invested all the money to change over these factories and to train their workers to now make electric - or to make EVs. So, I think that they will lose out on a big investment that they put forth based on this money that came out of IRA.

HUNT: All right, on this holiday Friday, I'm going to leave you with this. It's a bird. It's a plane. No, it's Superman.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Krypton, home. Take me home.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Yes, the man of steel and his dog Krypto making a comeback in a new movie from director James Gunn. A brand-new teaser trailer giving us our first look at David Corenswet donning the super suit. And we get a glimpse of Rachel Brosnahan as intrepid reporter Lois Lane. Since the trailer's debut Thursday, it's already been viewed more than 21 million times. Also, a familiar sound returns, a reimagining of the iconic theme from the first Superman movie starring Christopher Reeve.

The movie is set to hit theaters next July. It will be distributed by Warner Bros. Pictures, which, like CNN, is owned by Warner Brothers Discovery.

All right, who's the favorite Superman?

GORMAN: George Reeves, the original, 1950s.

HUNT: Yes. Meghan.

[07:00:00]

HAYS: I have not seen any of them, so I don't know. I know you guys are all shocked and surprised here.

HUNT: Meghan Hashtag fail.

Alex.

THOMPSON: Henry Cavill. I think the, you know, Christopher Reeves turning back time really just soured me because that was -

GOLDBERG: It was very bad.

THOMPSON: Yes.

HUNT: What about you?

GOLDBERG: Dan Aykroyd from the "Saturday Night Live" skit, what if Superman had been born in Germany? Da Oberman.

HUNT: We got to clip and save that.

I have to go with Christopher Reeve. I'm sorry. I - it's just, like, I found it to be iconic. There was that also documentary about him and his life that came out this year. So, good fun.

Thanks to our panel. Happy holidays. Merry Christmas. Thanks to all of you for joining us as well. I hope you enjoy your holiday season.

I'm Kasie Hunt. Don't go anywhere. "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" starts right now.