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Police Officer Assaulted on January 6th: 'I Don't Understand' Trump's Pardons; Trump Launches Immigration Executive Orders; New Wildfires Erupt in California. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired January 23, 2025 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: It's Thursday, January 23. Right now on CNN THIS MORNING.
[05:59:18]
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: They were treated like the worst criminals in history.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Not backing down. President Trump defending his sweeping pardons of January 6th rioters.
Plus --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TOM HOMAN, TRUMP'S BORDER CZAR: We're concentrating on the worst first.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Immigration transformation. A flurry of executive orders from the West Wing. Today, new policies will be tested in court.
And later --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Is it that important for China to be -- to be spying on young people?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Brushing aside concerns. President Trump downplaying the threat of TikTok after giving the app a reprieve.
And this --
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's a completely different beast.
(END VIDEO CLIP) HUNT: A fast-moving fire. A new blaze in Southern California exploding in size. Calmer conditions could help crews get the upper hand.
All right. It is 6 a.m. here on the East Coast. A live look at the Washington Monument on this Thursday morning. Still chilly here in D.C.
Good morning, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. It's wonderful to have you with us.
President Trump giving his first Oval Office interview, defending his decision to grant clemency to more than 1,500 people convicted of or facing charges related to January 6th.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: They were treated like the worst criminals in history. And you know what they were there for? They were protesting the vote, because they knew the election was rigged; and they were protesting the vote. And that -- you should be allowed to protest a vote. Most of the people were absolutely innocent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Some of the rioters may get more than just a pardon. Two sources telling CNN the Trump administration is considering inviting some of the convicts who received pardons to the White House for a meeting with the president.
And now federal judges overseeing some of the January 6th cases, making it clear they disagree with Trump's characterization of that day.
In an order granting the Justice Department's request to close an alleged rioter's ongoing case, Judge Tanya Chutkan, who presided over Trump's election subversion case, writing that the dismissal, quote, "cannot whitewash the blood, feces, and terror that the mob left in its wake, and it cannot repair the jagged breach in America's sacred tradition of peacefully transitioning power."
Judge Chutkan later adding, quote, "The historical record established by those proceedings must stand, unmoved by political winds, as a testament and as a warning," end quote.
The tone from those who saw their cases dismissed, their sentences commuted, or their convictions pardoned, strikingly different.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
EDWARD JACOB LANG, CLEARED OF JANUARY 6TH CHARGES: We stood up against a stolen election. We will be vindicated in the pages of history as patriots and freedom fighters. It is no longer the age where we have to hide in America. We are back. The patriots. We don't have to crawl in the back corners of Facebook and Instagram being censored. We've got X. We've got Trump. We've got Musk. We've got the dream team. We're back. (END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: "We've got Trump. We've got Musk. We're back."
That was Edward Jacob Lang. He faced numerous charges for his alleged actions on January 6th, including assaulting police officers with a baseball bat and a riot shield. President Trump granted him a full pardon.
The sudden release of a wave of people convicted of or charged with violent felonies, leading the Justice Department to notify officers who testified against their attackers at January 6th trials.
Aquilino Gonell, a former staff sergeant with the Capitol Police, he posted these screengrabs to social media, writing quote, "Each email and call log is a different rioter who assaulted me."
President Trump's mass pardons also bringing renewed anguish for law enforcement officials who were injured defending the Capitol on that day.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OFFICER DANIEL HODGES, D.C. METROPOLITAN POLICE: Owww!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: That's D.C. Metropolitan Police Officer Daniel Hodges. Rioters pinned him against a door, ripping off his gas mask as they assaulted him, resulting in a concussion.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HODGES: I was beaten, crushed, kicked, punched, surrounded. Someone reached underneath my visor, tried to gouge out my eye.
And all these people were just pardoned by Donald Trump, who says that they were the real victims, that they were the patriots. I don't understand.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Joining us now to discuss: Michael Warren, senior editor for "The Dispatch"; Molly Ball, senior political correspondent for "The Wall Street Journal"; Kendra Barkoff, former press secretary for Joe Biden when he was vice president; and Matt Gorman, former senior adviser to Tim Scott's presidential campaign.
Welcome to all of you.
Mike Warren, watching -- it is so hard to watch that, to watch that police officer, who was trying to defend the lives of everybody inside that building that day, talk about what has happened to him.
He's obviously not the only one. He was standing there with other members of various police forces, who all converged to talk about this.
Michael Fanone, another D.C. Metro Police officer, has said he feels betrayed by his country.
This is, again, a Republican president who did this, and that -- that sort of contrast, and a president who is claiming that he is in favor of law and order.
MICHAEL WARREN, SENIOR EDITOR, "THE DISPATCH": Yes. And look, I think there is still a residual sense that this ought to be sort of politically difficult for somebody to issue these pardons.
And in fact, just last week, J.D. Vance, the incoming vice president, said, of course -- "obviously," I think was the word he used -- the violent criminals, people who were convicted of violent crimes, will not be pardoned. Well, that's just been swept aside.
[06:05:10]
And I think it's just a reminder that that pardon power that the president has is absolute. There's no -- there's no debating it. And it really matters who the president is, who is issuing those pardons.
By the way, this -- this reporting that CNN has that he's considering bringing some of these defendants and convicted criminals to the White House, sounds to me like somebody within the administration trying to get a bad idea out there so that it's eventually killed.
I would be very surprised to see those -- those folks coming to the White House on Monday. But I don't know. You never know.
HUNT: Why would they want to drag this out? Molly.
MOLLY BALL, SENIOR POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, "THE WALL STREET JOURNAL": I would not be surprised. I mean, I think what we have seen is that Donald Trump's determination to rewrite the history of what happened on January 6th is continuing. And in some ways complete.
You know, he believes that he has a mandate to do this. And it's certainly something he talked about over and over in the campaign.
Now, a lot of even Republicans are quite uncomfortable with this and uncomfortable with, you know, having Stewart Rhodes walking around buildings in the Capitol yesterday.
But this is, again, something that -- that Trump feels he was elected to do. And it's -- and one of his top priorities. So --
HUNT: One of -- Matt, one of the things that -- that Donald Trump did do on the campaign trail repeatedly was play an anthem. And I just want to kind of bring it back into the conversation, because to Molly's point, this is something he promised over and over and over again. He's now making good at it -- on it. Let's watch that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ladies and gentlemen, please rise for the horribly and unfairly treated January 6th hostages.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (SINGING): And our flag was still there --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (SINGING): And our flag was still there --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (SINGING): And our flag was still there --
TRUMP: One nation, under God.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: So that, of course, from March of 2024. And he talked a little bit about this in the interview with Hannity last night -- last night. Let's watch that.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: This was a political hoax. And you know what? Those people -- and I'm not saying in every single case, but there was a lot of patriotism with those people.
You know, they did a recording and, you know, they asked me if I'd do the voiceover, and I did. It was the No. 1 selling song -- No. 1 on Billboard, No. 1 on everything, on everything for so long. People get it. They wanted to see those people.
SEAN HANNITY, FOX NEWS HOST: They're the people --
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: So, Matt Gorman, clearly, there are some people that wanted to see that, but it doesn't seem like the majority of Americans would want this.
MATT GORMAN, FORMER SENIOR ADVISOR TO TIM SCOTT'S PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN: No, look, I don't -- I don't -- to Molly's point and Mike's point, elongating this sort of thing is -- I don't think is very helpful.
I think it was very clear that he wanted to do this. He didn't hide the ball on this, like you saw with some of Biden's pardons. He was very clear, like you knew this was going to happen one of -- within the first week at the latest.
Elongating this, I don't think is helpful. At the same time, I don't think there is a political price to be paid by the pardons itself. We'll see if this bleeds into a multi-week story, whether that happens.
But I think one of the consistent themes is both Republicans, those in the party that want to defend this or, I think, on the left that really want to push January 6th as a major electoral issue, it hasn't found salience. And we'll see if that changes. It hasn't so far. There's no evidence to see that it's going to change so far.
But again, to the point, if this becomes into two weeks of the Trump presidency, we'll see.
KENDRA BARKOFF, FORMER PRESS SECRETARY FOR VICE PRESIDENT BIDEN: I do think this is a political loser of an issue for Donald Trump overall.
You saw in the interview last night with Hannity, Donald Trump was talking about January 6th. Hannity tried to change the subject to talk about the economy. That's why people voted for Donald Trump to begin with, was to, you know, lower gas prices, lower prices of eggs and milk.
Hannity tried to change the subject multiple times to talk about the economy, and Trump kept bringing it back around to January 6th.
So, I think Trump, as long as he wants to keep, you know, talking about January 6th, it's going to completely screw up exactly why people, in theory, voted for him as president.
HUNT: Yes. I will say, Molly, like we've -- there's a ton to talk about. Donald Trump's, you know, put out an absolute avalanche of executive orders, these pardons, these policy things.
Prices don't seem to be one of the things that -- I mean, we're even having a conversation about here, because you can't really find it.
BALL: Well, I mean, he even said on -- on inauguration day that he wasn't as interested in the economy as he was in immigration. And I think that's when this becomes politically damaging, is it would be one thing if this was pull off the Band-Aid and move on.
But he's not moving on. He's relitigating it over and over and over again, and he's obsessed with it.
And you see this with the Republicans on the Hill as well, on the one hand, saying, let's not live in the past. And then appointing a new committee to reinvestigate all of this stuff.
So, do they want to move on or don't they?
And I think if people do start to get the impression that, yes, he was elected to lower the price of groceries and housing, but instead he's focused on making sure that people who assaulted police are let out of jail.
[06:10:13]
That's when it starts to become, I think, a political problem.
WARREN: And the clock is ticking, as well. I mean, you can hear from even Trump allies, people like Steve Bannon are -- are very eager to get things going on the Trump agenda on Capitol Hill.
And those midterm elections of 2026, we don't know how they're going to turn out. Democrats could win. Republicans could maintain control. But the clock is ticking on trying to get anything done.
The longer that he's sort of consumed by the retribution stuff, which again, he -- he said he was going to do it when he was elected. So, it shouldn't be a surprise to us.
But Donald Trump is somebody who a lot of voters sort of pour their own idea of what they want Donald Trump to be. There are a loud, large number of voters who wanted the retribution, but a lot of voters were voting on the economy. A lot of voters were voting on sort of cultural issues that didn't really have to do with January 6th.
The clock is ticking on Donald Trump's presidency, and he doesn't have another term to run for. So, he's got to get stuff done.
HUNT: Yes. Kendra, one of the reasons, it seems like, Democrats may be so demoralized is that the fact that all of this happened on January 6th, and Trump still was reelected, with no longer over 50 percent, but a plurality. Won -- won the popular vote.
How do you think, for Democrats, should they be leaving this in the past from a political perspective? Or is this something in the midterm elections, are we going to see ads about how, you know, Donald Trump freed cop beaters?
BARKOFF: Look, I think we saw that there was a big single-voter issue this election. People wanted lower prices across the board.
And so, I think Democrats need to focus on making sure that those things happen. And I don't think we should relitigate the past. I don't think we should be talking about these issues, because I do think, when Donald Trump is talking about it, he's not talking about anything else.
And so, I do think, to your point, the midterms are coming up. Two years is not that far away from now. They should be talking about the economy.
HUNT: All right. We have a lot more to talk about today. But I do just want to take one moment as we wrap up this conversation to think about the police officers who, on that day, were violently assaulted.
Their lives were changed forever. They were defending other people. And this, for them, they describe it as an incredible blow.
So, let's -- as we go to break, just -- just watch Officer Hodges one more time.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HODGES: I was beaten, crushed, kicked, punched, surrounded. Someone reached underneath my visor, tried to gouge out my eye.
And all these people were just pardoned by Donald Trump, who says that they were the real victims, that they were the patriots. I don't understand.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROB BONTA, ATTORNEY GENERAL, CALIFORNIA: No court in this country -- has never interpreted the Birthright Citizenship Clause to mean what the president seeks it to mean, and what he's trying to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: That was Attorney General Rob Bonta of California, one of the two dozen states and cities who are suing the administration over President Donald Trump's move to end birthright citizenship in the U.S.
This morning, a federal judge in Seattle will hear arguments challenging the order. It is one of multiple lawsuits attempting to stop President Trump from enacting one of his signature immigration plans.
It's a constitutional question that could end up before the U.S. Supreme Court.
It has, of course, been less than a week since President Trump returned to the Oval Office. He's already issued sweeping immigration plans. He was asked about that in his first Oval Office interview with FOX News yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Who would ask for open borders with people pouring in, some of whom -- I won't get into it, but you can look at them and you can say, could be trouble, could be trouble. There are people coming in.
HANNITY: There are people with gang tattoos on.
TRUMP: There are people coming in with tattoos all over their face. Their entire face is covered with tattoos.
HANNITY: That identifies them as --
TRUMP: Typically, you know, he's not going to be the head of the local bank.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Kendra Barkoff, I will say this is something people in the in the country, especially when they talk about criminals, people favor deporting them, right? By overwhelming majorities. An A.P. poll showed 80 -- 83 percent support deporting undocumented immigrants with a violent criminal conviction.
Sixty-nine percent support deporting legal status immigrants with a violent criminal conviction.
Do you see a world where some of what the president is doing here oversteps in a way that is going to be politically problematic for him? Or is it Democrats who are in a tough spot here, needing to perhaps readjust how they've talked about this issue? BARKOFF: Look, I think it's really interesting that, in 2024, February
of 2024, Trump tanked the bipartisan immigration bill, because he wanted it as a talking point. He sees the political nature of what this is.
I think we can all up here agree that our -- our immigration system is broken. But doing it in a piecemeal approach and doing it in the way that they're trying to do it with E.O.'s here and with bills there, I just don't think it's going to accomplish the greater good of what the larger problem is.
There are real problems with our immigration system and with some of these folks, you know, committing crimes. But the piecemeal approach I just don't think is going to -- is going to be the way to do it.
[06:20:04]
HUNT: It's certainly going to get covered, though, Matt, in a way that, you know -- people are going to perceive that Donald Trump is -- is tackling this problem.
GORMAN: Yes. He is. I mean, look, the Overton window on this has shifted dramatically in just the last two years, right? Like this isn't 2013 anymore where you're going to have a Gang of Eight come together and do this thing that's over the course of ten years. And there's legal statute.
No, I mean, I think the Biden years really personified, with the problem with the border, that drastic action needed to be taken. And you're doing it.
I think -- I think Democrats make a mistake when they try and portray kind of these actions as if its SEAL Team 6 kicking in the door to St. Patrick's Cathedral and handcuffing 80-year-old grandmothers. It sets the expectation bar so high.
And when you have the first kind of ICE raids coming out of Boston, that clearly these are not 80-year-old grandmothers in wheelchairs here, it really, I think it sets expectations way off from reality.
BARKOFF: But I do think that this is a Donald Trump P.R. stunt in the way that he did these E.O.'s. I don't think that he is doing these for the purposes that is going to really make a difference.
BALL: Well, I think the question is how far are they going to go? Right? I mean, they did 300 on the first day, and at that rate, it will only take 98 years to get to all 11 million. I did the math. Right?
So -- and that's basically the pace that the Biden administration was on. So, is this sort of a big show, and they're focusing on the least controversial deportees, the violent criminals?
Or, are they going to, to Matt's point, actually try to get the entire undocumented population, which is likely to be much less popular? Are they going to try to pursue this, you know, birthright citizenship
thing and start kicking newborn babies out of the country who previously would have had legal status? That's probably going to be a lot less popular.
So, I think, with a lot of the promises Donald Trump has made, the question is how far is he going to go? And will the public stay on his side if he goes all the way?
WARREN: Yes, I'm sort of -- I look at all of these different immigration pieces separately. And I do agree: a lot of the E.O.'s, the 14th Amendment stuff, it's -- it's press release. It's glorified press release. He can't just do that.
And of course, we're seeing the legal challenges, which we should have expected.
I do think the -- the raids, the increased number of officials who are able to process this, these deportations, it' s going to be popular. It's what he was elected to do.
I think Donald Trump has a good ear and a good sense for when things might go too far. Tom Homan has already essentially said he's not really interested in going into churches and schools.
I think that is at the point where the Donald Trump immigration, you know, policy is -- Donald Trump is going to be able, I think, to recognize that might be a little bit too far and pull back.
I think -- I feel like it's going to be less than promised, but exactly what Americans actually kind of want in immigration enforcement.
HUNT: All right. Coming up next here on CNN THIS MORNING, fire and ice. The weather extremes. Two new fires burning in California. The East Coast, waiting for warmer temperatures.
Plus, Elon Musk putting a damper on President Trump's big A.I. plan.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:27:25]
HUNT: All right. Welcome back.
We've got extreme weather conditions from coast to coast. In the Southeast, all that melting ice and snow could refreeze, leading to dangerous road conditions. It is still very cold in the South.
And in California, with two new fires prompting evacuations. The latest fire started just hours after crews started getting the Hughes Fire at least a little bit contained.
Let's get to our meteorologist, Allison Chinchar, with more on this. Allison, good morning.
ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: And good morning.
Yes, the fire that you can see behind me from this highway off in the distance here. This is the one that is just Northwest of downtown Los Angeles near Sherman Oaks, California.
Again, as you mentioned, we have several fires that we are keeping an eye on right now, five in total, and they range various portions of Southern California, some a little bit with higher containment than others.
The red-flag warning is in effect not just for today, but this continues into early Friday morning. Some of these gusts up around 55 to 65 miles per hour on the Northern side; and a little bit farther South, could gust as high as 70 miles per hour.
Now, again, the concern here is just how dry it has been in this area: 260 consecutive days with less than a 10th of an inch of rain. It's the longest stretch they've had in Los Angeles on record.
Now there is a bit of good news, and that is, there is finally a chance of some rain in the forecast that would begin this weekend and continue through the early portion of next week.
The concern here is all of those areas that have been on fire, the burn scar areas, those often could lead to mudslide potential when you get very heavy rain. So, something to keep an eye on.
Elsewhere across the U.S., the big story here is just the bitter cold. Right now, well below freezing even far South: Atlanta; Charleston; Jacksonville, Florida; New Orleans all looking at those current temperatures below the freezing mark.
And it's expected to continue to stay cold, especially in the mornings here over the next several days. So even this morning, you've still got all of these areas dealing with those extreme cold advisories.
But there is light at the end of the tunnel, Kasie. A lot of these places will warm up by the weekend.
HUNT: OK. We could use a little bit of that here in Washington. Allison Chinchar, thanks very much for that.
All right. Still ahead here on CNN THIS MORNING, the Trump administration asking federal workers to snitch on their coworkers in a rollback of diversity, equity and inclusion programs.
We are joined by Birmingham Mayor Randall Woodfin to discuss the rapid changes being rolled out by the new president.
Plus, billionaire beef. Elon Musk openly trashing one of President Trump's tech policies.
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