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WH Sends Mixed Messages on How to End Russia-Ukraine War; Justice Department Drops Eric Adams' Case; Mitch McConnell Votes Against Trump Cabinet Picks. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired February 14, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: The White House sending contradictory messages over how to end the war between Russia and Ukraine.

Vice President Vance told the Wall Street Journal that sanctions are possible, so are even U.S. boots on the ground, if the Russian president does not negotiate in good faith. President Trump, however, he's blamed the war on former President Biden and Kyiv's ambition to join NATO.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: The reason the war started, because Biden went out and said that they could join NATO, and he shouldn't have said that.

From day one, long before President Putin, they've said they cannot have Ukraine be in NATO. They said that very strongly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: CNN's Fred Pleitgen joins us now live from Moscow. And, Fred, I wonder how Russia, Russians, are receiving those many comments from President Trump.

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think from President Trump and obviously from J. D. Vance as well, the Russians certainly seem to be indicating they'll stick with what President Trump says. It's quite interesting because today, obviously we saw those comments from J. D. Vance that he made to the Wall Street Journal about the U.S. even possibly putting boots on the ground in Ukraine if Russia does not agree to some sort of peace deal. Well, the spokesman for the Kremlin, he just got off the phone off a conference call with a couple of journalists and he, there, said that these are not comments that the Russians have heard yet and they want clarification about all this from negotiations that could take place soon and, of course, also from the contacts they have within the Trump administration.

In general, though, you do feel a huge degree of optimism here on the ground, Jim. It's hard to overstate how much of that there is here in political Moscow right now. Yesterday, the spokesman for the Kremlin, Dmitry Peskov, came out and said he was impressed and that the Kremlin was impressed by the position that President Trump holds on the whole Ukraine question.

So, they definitely feel that right now they have a good in road with this new administration and especially the head of that new administration, obviously being President Trump. It was interesting because yesterday I was also at a press conference with the foreign minister of Russia, Sergey Lavrov, and he did exactly almost mirror some of the things that President Trump was saying there just now in that soundbite. He blamed the Biden administration for isolating Russia, he said it was a completely unnatural position for Russia to be in, and that now that President Trump was in office that that is the correct way to speak to Russia. Speaking to Russia directly.

The Russians already, by the way, trying to put all of this into action. They already say that they've designated people to take part and to organize any sort of direct meetings between the Russian president and the U.S. president. Last night, the spokesman for the Kremlin was asked about this as well and he said that he believes a meeting in a third country is definitely the first thing that's going to be on the agenda not President Trump visiting Russia, not Vladimir Putin visiting the United States, but a direct meeting in a third country. He says that that could happen within a matter of weeks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Fred Pleitgen, in Moscow, thanks so much. And this just in to CNN, the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, answered a reporter's question about whether he might meet with any Russian leaders at the Munich Security Conference today. Listen to his response.

[06:35:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: I don't want to meet just with Russians just to meet for what? No, we see the order of meetings. As I said, the order is United States, Europe, then Russia to ready to the meet -- be ready to this meeting.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: There Volodymyr Zelenskyy in a position of having to react to a lot of public comments from U.S. officials, sometimes contradictory. You had Pete Hegseth say, no, U.S. military presence in Ukraine in any circumstances. You had the vice president then tell the Wall Street Journal, actually, that might be on the table.

Joining us now, CNN Political and National Security Analyst David Sanger. He's in Munich. And, David, good to have you here this morning. I mean, you watch. This back and forth here, contradiction, inside the Trump administration, at the end of the day, the only position or comment that really matters is President Trump. So, I wonder where you are, who do people believe, and do they see Trump with his positions and statements, even endorsing Russia's rationale for invading Ukraine, as preparing to force Ukraine into a deal it doesn't want? DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST AND WHITE HOUSE AND NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT, NEW YORK TIMES: Well, Jim, I've rarely heard the Europeans so despairing at the conflicting messages that they're hearing from Washington. As you said, what you heard from Pete Hegseth, the new defense secretary, doesn't match up with what we've heard from Vice President Vance, who is also here. It -- Mr. Hegseth himself had to back off of some of his earlier statements.

But what I think the Europeans are fearing the most is that President Trump, for all of his negotiating prowess or what he describes as such, has already given the Russians two of the things they want the most. Basically, a statement that Ukraine will never enter into NATO, if not never -- not any time in, you know, our working lifetimes, Jim. I think that was sort of the sense of where they were.

And I think the second big point that he was making along the way was that the United States was not going to be part of any kind of peacekeeping force, whether it was a tripwire force or actual full peacekeepers along the border of whatever that border is negotiated to be. And so, if you take those two together, those are two of the things Vladimir Putin wants.

The third thing he wants, of course, is for the U.S. to pull back from many of the newly created NATO countries, or what we once called new created.

SCIUTTO: That was going to be my next question, is that beyond any potential concessions or forcing Ukraine into a weak deal for peace there, is a broader concern about U.S. retreat from Europe. And I wonder how Europeans -- how concerned they are about that and what their plan is, right? Because the fact is, this has been on the table for some time. Trump, the candidate, made that quite clear. And he took some moves in his first administration, his last move as president and his first administration was to reduce U.S. military forces in Germany. So, do Europeans have a plan to fill that void?

SANGER: They have a plan, but the time frame for it, Jim, just doesn't work. When you sit down with the Europeans and you say, how quickly are you planning to build your force? How quickly are you planning to add tanks and other armament? It's -- they're talking on 10-year and 20-year scales.

We haven't heard any timetables out of President Trump. But I don't think he's talking about a 10- or 20-year period here. And I think the Europeans basically ignored their opportunities from 2014 forward to get into overdrive here. And now, to some degree it may be a little bit too late for them to catch up.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Can I ask you a question, a bigger picture question? because there's been some concern about this in Asia with America's Asian allies if they calculate that the U.S. won't come to their defense as he -- a previous U.S. president might have, talking about South Korea, Japan, et cetera, do European officials talk about expanding their nuclear arsenals or other countries in Europe adding nuclear weapons to defend themselves against the Russia threat? SANGER: So, far, we have only heard sort of little murmurings about this. It's not like what you hear, Jim, in South Korea, where, you know, you and I have both visited in recent times and of course a majority of the population wants to go do that.

[06:40:00]

I think the problem here is not one of adding nuclear weapons, I think it is trust in the American nuclear umbrella. I don't think that they believe that Donald Trump, at the end of the day, would risk a nuclear confrontation over Europe, the way many of his predecessors claimed they would.

Now, fortunately, we never had to test that proposition, and let's all pray that we never do, but it's certainly going to be a significant issue, especially if the president and President Putin do not find a way to come up with a replacement for New START, the last arms control treaty, which expires I think a year from now, almost exactly this week. And if they don't, then the Russians are going to be free to expand their arsenal and the U.S. free to expand its without limit.

SCIUTTO: Yes, which is an outcome. Well, if you would like to see. David Sanger in Munich, thanks so much.

SANGER: Great to be with you, Jim.

SCIUTTO: And coming up on CNN This Morning, Mayor Eric Adams of New York, in the clear now after the Justice Department dropped his case. Now, however, several federal prosecutors are resigning as a result.

Plus, a bitter rival. Senator Mitch McConnell defying President Trump as he votes against yet another one of his cabinet picks.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: We do have to do something about Mitch McConnell. He's a disaster. We got to get him the hell out. He's a problem, big problem.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[06:45:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You are the only person who has the power to effectively fire Mayor Eric Adams and remove him from this position.

GOV. KATHY HOCHUL (D-NY): The allegations are extremely concerning and serious.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.

HOCHUL: But I cannot, as the governor of this state, have a knee- jerk, politically motivated reaction, like a lot of other people are saying right now. I have to do what's smart, what's right, and I'm consulting with other leaders in government at this time. (END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: The New York governor, Kathy Hochul, they're at least not ruling out removing the New York City Mayor, Eric Adams, after the Justice Department ordered prosecutors to drop corruption charges against him. A move that led multiple resignations at Justice, it raised questions about weaponization of President Trump's DOJ.

The acting U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, Danielle Sassoon, resigned on Thursday, refusing to obey the order from the DOJ to drop the corruption case against Adam. Five other people also quit. According to a memo from the acting attorney general, Adams' persecution was restricting his ability to focus on illegal immigration and violent crime.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEX SPIRO, ATTORNEY FOR MAYOR ERIC ADAMS: Obviously, if you indict the sitting mayor of New York City, who has lots of responsibilities for public safety, that has an impact on his ability to function. And so, sure, when you're weighing the equities of what to do, when you charge a doctor who's dedicated his life to helping people, you weigh the equities. When you charge a school teacher, you weigh the equities. And when you charge a mayor, you weigh the equities. So, of course, that is part of the conversation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: More on that in just a moment. For now, we're 47 minutes past the hour, and here's your morning roundup. TikTok is back on Apple and Google app stores. It comes after President Trump's executive order delaying a ban that was supposed to go into effect if it's parent company in China did not sell the app.

A federal judge has ordered the Trump administration to restart the flow of foreign aid paused by Trump as part of an executive order. The judge said the administration must continue paying any contracts, grants or loans that were in place at the end of the last administration.

Louisiana's Department of Health says it will no longer provide mass vaccination. That announcement comes on the same day that vaccine skeptic RFK Jr. was sworn in as health and human services secretary. The City of New Orleans has its own independent Health Department that does not plan to abide by those state guidelines.

Now, turning to this, the nation has a new head of health and human services, the Senate confirming Robert F. Kennedy to the position largely along party lines. One notable Republican, however, joined Democrats in opposing that nomination. He is the former Senate Majority Leader, Kentucky Senator Mitch McConnell. He has now voted against three of Trump's cabinet picks, more than any other Republican senator, prompting Trump to seemingly question McConnell's, not only his leadership, but he even questioned whether he had polio as a child.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: He's not voting against Bob, he's voting against me, but that's all right. He votes against almost everything now. He's a, you know, very bitter guy. I don't know anything about he had polio. He had polio.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you doubting that he had polio?

TRUMP: I have no idea if he had polio.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: He had polio. That's a fact. CNN's Brian Todd has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): It's happened again, Mitch McConnell so instrumental in getting Donald Trump elected the first time, once a key driver in advancing Trump's agenda has defied the president. The soon to be 83-year-old Republican stalwart voted against the nomination of Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to be health and human services secretary, saying in a statement, quote, "I'm a survivor of childhood polio, a record of trafficking in dangerous conspiracy theories and eroding trust in public health institutions does not entitle Mr. Kennedy to lead these important efforts."

Trump was asked about McConnell's resistance.

TRUMP: I have no idea if he had polio. He voted against Bobby. He votes against almost everything now. He's a, you know, very bitter guy.

TODD (voice-over): McConnell has now voted against three of Trump's most high-profile nominees. Kennedy, Tulsi Gabbard, and Pete Hegseth, the lone Republican in the Senate who's gone against all three.

MICHAEL TACKETT, AUTHOR OF MCCONNELL BIOGRAPHY, "THE PRICE OF POWER": For Mitch McConnell, this is what liberation looks like.

TODD (voice-over): And not just with his votes, McConnell just wrote an op ed in the Louisville Courier Journal saying Kentuckians can't afford Trump's tariffs. Trump brushed off McConnell.

[06:50:00]

TRUMP: Well, I feel sorry for Mitch. He wanted to go to the end, and he wanted to stay leader. He wasn't -- he's not equipped mentally.

TODD (voice-over): For the longtime loyal Republican, a late career change of course. McConnell telling 60 Minutes now that he's no longer his party's Senate leader for the first time in 18 years --

SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): I will be more outspoken about things that I particularly care about than I have been in the past.

TODD (voice-over): Also, what makes McConnell throw care to the wind, analysts believe, his age, his failing health. He fell twice in recent days. He sprained his wrist from a fall back in December, and he sometimes appeared to freeze during press conferences. Add to that the fact that he's not yet announced whether he'll run for re -election in Kentucky next year.

How is his relationship now with Donald Trump?

MCCONNELL: We haven't spoken for quite a while. I was very upset about what happened January 6.

TODD (voice-over): It was that period, a McConnell biographer says, that really turned him against Trump.

TACKETT: I think the final straw was the 2020 election and the decision by President Trump not to accept the results. But the riot itself was the thing that truly turned him away.

TODD (voice-over): At the time, McConnell publicly scolded Trump on the Senate floor.

MCCONNELL: Former President Trump's actions preceded the riot or a disgraceful, disgraceful dereliction of duty.

TODD (voice-over): There was a time when Trump lauded McConnell, especially for getting conservative justices confirmed.

TRUMP: Mitch McConnell has been fantastic. He has been really great.

TODD (voice-over): But since their split over January 6th, Trump has turned on him.

TRUMP: Mitch McConnell is a disgrace.

TODD (voice-over): Analysts say it's Trump who appears to have come out on top.

LEIGH ANN CALDWELL, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, PUCK: There's not a lot of Donald Trump opposition left in the United States Congress. So, maybe Mitch McConnell is a non-entity to the White House at this point,

TODD: Analyst Leigh Ann Caldwell says, even if McConnell does not run again for his Senate seat, the McConnell-Trump feud will loom large in Kentucky in that Senate race next year. She points out that Donald Trump Jr., a key figure in shaping his father's support for congressional candidates, has put the word out that anyone running for office in Kentucky who wants his support needs to stand in firm opposition to Mitch McConnell.

Brian Todd, CNN, Washington.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SCIUTTO: More now on the resignations at the Justice Department. Joining us is Jeffrey Toobin. He has a new book out about the pardon power. Jeffrey, thanks so much for joining this morning. JEFFREY TOOBIN, AUTHOR, "THE PARDON: THE POLITICS OF PRESIDENTIAL MERCY" AND FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Hey, Jim.

SCIUTTO: A question for you. I'm going to read from Sassoon's letter, an eight-page resignation letter. Adams' attorneys repeatedly urged what amounted to a quid pro quo, indicating that Adams would be in a position to assist with the department's priorities only if the indictment were dismissed. I remain baffled by the rushed and superficial process by which this decision was reached.

Based on our understanding of the facts, is she right?

TOOBIN: You know, Jim, I'm a former assistant U.S. attorney and I have covered the Justice Department for a long time. There has never been anything like what the Justice Department did with the Eric Adams' case.

Ms. Sassoon is exactly right. This process whereby a pending case was dismissed not because the evidence was insufficient, not because the prosecutors did something wrong, but because the defendant is of some political use to the president is just something that is a perversion of what the Justice Department is supposed to stand for. And it is completely understandable why there have been resignations and protests.

SCIUTTO: I wonder what the consequences are, because we've already seen this Justice Department, well, drop prosecutions against January 6th rioters. The president, of course, pardoned all of those who were prosecuted, including those who attacked police officers on that day. Do you see any consequences to this or just does the system roll on?

TOOBIN: You know, Jim, I just think this is where we are at this political moment, that the Republican Party is so unified behind Donald Trump there is absolutely anything he can do. Going back to the 2016 campaign when he said he could shoot someone in the middle of 5th Avenue and have his supporters stay with him. I think he's absolutely right. He was right then and he's right now.

But, you know, that doesn't change our obligation to call out something that is just completely outrageous and something that's actually going to very likely hurt New Yorkers because at this moment, Eric Adams is more dependent on Donald Trump than he is on, you know, the people of New York City, and he's still the mayor.

[06:55:00]

SCIUTTO: He and others have claimed that this prosecution started purely because Adams' criticized the immigration policy, stuck his neck out against Joe Biden. Prosecutors say -- well, the investigation began before. We should note there are many members of Adams' administration under investigation for corruption in a number of ways. What are the facts?

TOOBIN: The facts are there is absolutely no evidence to support the idea that this case was some sort of political retribution and the -- there's no evidence that this office, the U.S. Attorney's Office in Manhattan, ever engaged in that kind of behavior regarding anyone connected to Trump.

I mean, it's just a completely made-up justification for this action and for Adams upset. Adams was upset that he was indicted. That's -- most people are upset that they're indicted, but the idea that there was some sort of untoward motive, there's just no evidence for it and lots of evidence against it, including the evidence in the case. I mean, that's why he was indicted.

SCIUTTO: Jeffrey Toobin, thanks so much. The new book, "The Pardon: The Politics of Presidential Mercy," available now. Thanks, Jeffrey.

TOOBIN: Thanks, Jim.

SCIUTTO: Turning back now to Russia's war on Ukraine, the Trump administration's concessions to Russia. Our panel is back with us now. And when you look at this, Brad, entering a negotiation, Trump has already said Ukraine's going to have to give up territory, it will not be a member of NATO, and he's also saying he wants to welcome Russia back into G7, of course it was kicked out because of the invasion. Help me understand why, with allies, Trump begins with maximalist positions.

You think of Canada, 51st state, Denmark, I'm going to take Greenland. Panama, I'm going to take over the Canal. But on this, he makes concessions prior to the negotiation. Is that strong? Is that strong?

BRAD TODD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR AND REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: Well, the question that was asked was should Ukraine return to its pre-2014 borders. That's when Russia invaded Crimea and took it from Ukraine, and Barack Obama did absolutely nothing to stop him. And so, I think that's the original sin in this situation in Ukraine. And both President Biden and President Trump have struggled to put the genie back in the bottle for Obama's failure to stop Russia from taking over Ukraine. I hope he takes a hard line with Russia --

SCIUTTO: Trump is president now who's saying he's willing to allow Russia to keep territory that it invaded, which would be the first time we should note since World War II that a leader -- a country would be allowed to take territory and keep it by force.

BRAD TODD: No, Jim, that's false. Barack Obama let Russia keep Crimea after they invaded Crimea. He did nothing to stop it. That's just a false assertion.

SCIUTTO: Hold on, I've written a lot about that and the -- he did not recognize the annexation. That's the point. That's the difference.

BRAD TODD: He did nothing to stop him. He said he did nothing to stop him.

SCIUTTO: Fair criticism. I'm just --

BRAD TODD: He said --

SCIUTTO: All right.

BRAD TODD: He said he couldn't do it because of Russian identity there.

SCIUTTO: I understand you're not willing to criticize anything President Trump will say, but let me ask you --

BRAD TODD: No, that's not true.

SCIUTTO: -- Hyma, is there a way forward here between the U.S. and Europe, let's set aside Ukraine for a moment, where they maintain this alliance, as we've known it for the last several decades, are we seeing a fundamental change in that relationship?

HYMA MOORE, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO DNC CHAIR JAIME HARRISON AND FORMER REGIONAL COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, BIDEN 2020: Jim, I don't think anyone knows. I think that's part of the problem with President Trump. I think there's a bunch of chaos. I think Vice President Vance has said one thing, the secretary of defense has said another thing, and President Trump has said something else.

And so, I think most people, not just Americans, people around the world, just want to understand what the heck the president wants to do. And so, look, I think things are going to be fundamentally different. I think the president has been very clear that he not only wants to reshape the American government, he wants to reshape the international politics. And so, I think we have to be clear about that.

President Trump is trying to reshape international politics. So, this is not about just doing something for the sake of doing it, he's doing it intentionally, and I think we've got to be clear about that.

SCIUTTO: Alex, you know that, you know, Ukraine used to be a bipartisan issue, you still have a bipartisan group going to the Munich Security Conference, but I wonder, do Republicans on the Hill you speak with say that they will stand upright against a deal that they would perceive as against Ukraine's interests or against Europe's interests, or is the -- are the politics of the town such that, listen, it's largely a done deal?

ALEX THOMPSON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST AND NATIONAL POLITICAL REPORTER, AXIOS: There are definitely some Republicans, including Mitch McConnell, which you talked to earlier, and then others, I think, that would speak out. I mean, you saw Senator Wicker of Mississippi just speak out over at the Munich Conference saying that Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has made a rookie mistake. I think that there are some interests.

That being said, even the ones that are supportive of Ukraine recognize that the politics that Trump tapped into of America First sending money over to Ukraine are unsustainable.

SCIUTTO: Yes, it's a -- and there you go.

[07:00:00]