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CNN This Morning
Zelenskyy: I Will Not Accept Decisions Between The U.S. And Russia About Ukraine; U.S.-Russia Talks To End War In Ukraine Begin Tuesday In Riyadh; Trump Appears To Channel Napoleon In "X" Post; Secy. Rubio Arrives In Saudi Arabia For Peace Talks. Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired February 17, 2025 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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[06:00:31]
MANU RAJU, CNN HOST: It's Monday, February 17th, right now on CNN This Morning.
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MARCO RUBIO, UNITED STATES SECRETARY OF STATE: This war's been going on for a while.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Right.
RUBIO: It's difficult, it's complicated, it's been bloody.
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RAJU: Peace talks. U.S. Secretary of State landing in Saudi Arabia to begin negotiations with Russia. But notably absent, Ukraine. Plus --
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DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We'll appeal. But appeals take a long time.
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RAJU: Appealing to the highest court. President Trump taking his first case of his second term to the Supreme Court. Asking them to let him fire a top government watchdog. And this --
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is really an infection that is spreading though amongst poultry, wild birds and cattle.
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RAJU: Fighting bird flu as another human case pops up. A vaccine receives conditional approval. And then later, an eyebrow-raising assertion. President Trump alluding that laws don't apply to him if he, quote, "saves his country".
6:00 a.m. here on the East Coast. And here's a live look at Paris where today, European leaders are gathering for an emergency summit on Ukraine. As the U.S. prepares for talks with Russia.
Good morning, everyone. I'm Manu Raju in for Kasie Hunt. It's wonderful to have you with us.
We begin with the Trump administration which is moving quickly to bring an end to Russia's war on Ukraine. Secretary of State Marco Rubio, Special Envoy Steve Witkoff and National Security Adviser Mike Waltz touching down overnight in Riyadh. Now talks between U.S. and Russia are set to begin Tuesday with no place at the table for Ukraine, at least not yet.
Still, President Trump seems confident Russian President Vladimir Putin is ready to cut a deal.
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TRUMP: I think he wants to stop fighting. I see that. We spoke long and hard. Steve Witkoff was with him for a very extended period, like about three hours. I think he wants to stop fighting.
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RAJU: Now, according to the Kremlin, Russia's Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov will also travel to Riyadh for talks with U.S. officials about, quote, "restoring the entire complex of Russia-U.S. relations". Now, the Trump administration says a dual track of negotiations will be held in Ukraine this week. President Volodymyr Zelenskyy insisting he won't allow an agreement to be imposed on his country.
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PRES. VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINE: So, I will never accept any decisions between the United States and Russia about Ukraine. Never. And our people, never.
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RAJU: All right, joining us this morning to discuss CNN Politics Senior Reporter Stephen Collinson, Meghan Hays, former Biden White House Director for Message Planning, and Matt Gorman, former Senior Adviser to GOP Senator Tim Scott's presidential campaign.
Good morning to you all.
MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING: Good morning.
MATT GORMAN, FORMER TIM SCOTT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN SENIOR ADVISER: Good morning.
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Good morning.
RAJU: Happy President's Day.
Matt, first to you, what do you think the rationale is of not including Ukraine in these talks with Russia when Ukraine is saying, you know, we're not going to agree to anything that we're not a part of?
GORMAN: Not the first meeting, but the way I took it more than anything else is the U.S. really asserting authority in this whole process, right? Instead of getting everybody in a room and letting it be a little bit chaotic, they're really, honestly, almost what cops do when they have a thing between two parties.
They separate them, talk to them individually. I think they're getting the baseline negotiations before they enter into if there is to be something where they all come together. I feel like they're, first of all, they're trying to assert authority, separate them, and then go into further talks.
RAJU: Do you see it that way?
HAYS: No, I mean, this could all end. Putin invaded a sovereign country. So this could all end if Putin just came back into his own country and stopped the war. I mean, he started this, so I don't see it that way. I also don't know why the U.S. would not involve Ukraine or Europe. There are a lot of countries here at play.
There is, you know, over 50 allies that have been supporting Ukraine through this whole process. So I don't see it that way. I do -- I mean, hopefully this works and hopefully this is his strategy, but I do think it is a little bit naive and a little bit arrogant to not include Ukraine in this.
RAJU: And it's causing some real alarm among European officials. This is why they're having this emergency meeting. They were at this Munich security conference over the weekend. I want to just read from your excellent piece on CNN.com about the concessions that Trump has made.
So you write, "Vladimir Putin is riding high ahead of critical U.S.- Russia talks Tuesday in Saudi Arabia and ending the Ukraine war. Trump's administration has ended the Russian president's international isolation, shattered Western unity on the conflict and cast doubt on how far the U.S. would go to defend Europe, signaling a stunning shift toward Putin and away from America's traditional allies".
[06:05:08]
COLLINSON: I think what's causing so much concern, not just in Europe, but among quite a few people on the Hill, in both parties, is the idea that the U.S. is starting this by seeking to find out what's acceptable to the invader rather than what is acceptable in terms of terms of a final peace deal to the country that was invaded. So the emphasis seems a little off here.
Now, if the president, by offering these concessions to Russia, bringing them back into the international fold, is able to unlock this and move towards a durable peace, which ends the war and means it doesn't start up again in five years, then that would be a worthwhile investment of capital.
The problem is, last week in Europe, all the U.S. officials were saying opposite and often contradictory things. There isn't really a plan. It seems to be the plan is for the president to sit down with Putin and try and work something out between them. And if that's the case, it's not going to be a durable peace.
The problem the Europeans have is that they haven't spent enough money on their defense for decades, so they've put themselves in this slightly weaker position. They didn't really prepare for the return of a more isolationist U.S. president. So you've got two different dynamics going on at the same time.
RAJU: How do you explain, as the Republican here, about the evolution of the GOP's handling of Russia and NATO, too, to some extent? And are you concerned about a potential shattering of the NATO alliance?
GORMAN: The latter, no. But, look, you had -- NATO has been urged by presidents of both parties, going back 30 years, to Bush, Obama. Biden hedged a little bit. I think that, to Stephen's point, they need to do more to secure their own defense in Europe. I mean, that's absolutely.
But, you know, you talk about kind of that evolution of the Republican Party. This isn't a recent thing, right? To go a little bit historical on you, you saw the murmurs of this with Pat Buchanan and George Bush in 1992 in the GOP primary. That obviously went to 2000 when his son ran, talking about not wanting to nation-build.
He had it reprieved for about 10 years. He had 9/11, really gave, I think, the GOP license to want to expand a little bit on that. But in 2013, we all remember very well, Manu, you were covering, too, when Rand Paul became the hot new commodity in the Republican Party. And that started shrinking.
And so, in a way, you see the Republican Party kind of returning to what you saw back in 1992 in some respects, where they always kind of were itching to go. And Stephen makes a great point, right? Europe cannot be spending demilitarization, de-industrialization, and expand the welfare state and then expect enough money to actually protect itself. They have been subservient in this role because they've allowed themselves to be and reliant far too much on expecting the U.S. to always be there.
HAYS: Right. I just -- I don't want to lose the plot here that we are talking about the United States negotiating with Russia. And I agree with you that this is about Donald Trump wanting to sit down with Putin. And that is it. That is -- if he cared about figuring this out, he would sit down with both of them.
And I -- the NATO conversation, I think, is a good one and a smart one to have. I just think it is separate of these negotiations.
RAJU: Yes. All right, there's a lot that's unfold. My panel, of course, will be back.
And coming up on CNN This Morning, a cryptic tweet. President Trump implies that any action he saves to, quote, "save the country" won't violate the law.
Plus, the doubling in size of measles, an outbreak spreading in Texas. And part reunion, part reflection. Saturday Night Live looks back at 50 years, live from New York.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I thought we were hosting together.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Oh, do you have your passport on you?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No. ICE, get him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No! No! I'll cooperate. Don't take me. I'll name names. Mike Myers, Jim Carrey, Catherine O'Hara (ph).
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He who saves a nation violates no law.
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RAJU: That was from the 1970 movie "Waterloo", about French emperor and military leader Napol Bonaparte. And now President Donald Trump, well, he kind of seems to be echoing that line. Pinned at the Trump of -- top of Trump's X account is this cryptic post, "He who saves his country does not violate any law".
Now it comes as he's spent the first few weeks of his second term seemingly attempting to reshape the inner workings of the federal government and testing the scope as of executive authority. His efforts have not gone without some pushback. His agenda facing a number of legal challenges.
But as CNN's Chief Supreme Court Analyst Joan Biskupic writes, "Vice President JD Vance, Elon Musk and others in the Trump administration are openly challenging the centuries-old power of the nation's judiciary, foreshadowing a possible constitutional breakdown of American government".
And over the weekend, Minnesota Democratic Senator Amy Klobuchar was asked about this.
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DANA BASH, CNN ANCHOR: Are we in a --
SEN. AMY KLOBUCHAR (D), MINNESOTA: So --
BASH: -- constitutional crisis? KLOBUCHAR: Go ahead. We're not quite there yet because ultimately, when the final court order is made, the Trump administration is going to have to decide. And this isn't just at the top. These are lower level people as well. Are they going to face contempt charges? In the past, in the last administration, they did follow the court orders. If they don't, the court has inherent powers to find them in contempt, which, of course, could mean going to jail.
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RAJU: All right, my excellent panel is back. So what is your reactions? Look, you could dismiss it as just a thing that Trump says, but then they posted it to the -- pinned it to the top of his Truth Social account, his X account, the White House reposted it. This is the message that he wants to send.
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COLLINSON: Right. I guess it was movie night at Mar-a-Lago this weekend. But it does seem strange just coming out of nowhere, but I think it does reflect what the president has told us about his view that presidential power is almost absolute. He said that right back in his first time when he started talking about how he has an Article 2.
That Supreme Court ruling granting him substantial immunity that arose out of one of his legal cases, I think, reinforced this view. What the White House seems to be trying to do is bypass the lower courts to try and go straight to the Supreme Court because so much of their agenda now is caught up in local court challenges that will take time.
And they're pretty frustrated, and I think the president is frustrated, about what's happening. So they're going to try it on and see what the Supreme Court does.
RAJU: Why do you think Trump posted this?
GORMAN: For two things. We're a nation of laws, not men. And so I think he did this to kind of get the media buzzing --
HAYS: Yes.
GORMAN: -- and throw it out there and get the chum in the water a little bit. And, look, I think, due respect to Joan, openly challenging court cases is perfectly fine, whether Elon Musk or Matt Gorman or Meghan Hays. Like, that's what this country was founded on.
And I think a lot of respect, too, to the Democrats like, they need a new line. Constitutional crisis. They've been doing this the last five years. It's the boy that cried wolf. No one buys this stuff anymore.
So if they want to go down the constitutional crisis road, God bless them. People aren't going to buy it. But that was a lot kind of in that little scenario.
HAYS: I agree with you. I think that until there is an actual constitutional crisis -- GORMAN: They're wishing for one, it seems like, please.
HAYS: Right. And it seems like, you know, this is the way it goes. You appeal things to the Supreme Court.
GORMAN: Yes.
HAYS: And then if -- he then -- if they lose and he then violates them, then we have a constitutional crisis, then we can start talking about that. But I think that the wishing and the hoping of it --
GORMAN: There really are, yes.
HAYS: -- it's a very interesting thing.
GORMAN: So should Democrats ignore this?
HAYS: I don't think we should ignore it. I think that Democrats should do what they are doing, and that is challenging these things in court and letting this play out. That is why we have three co-equal branches of government. This is how you are supposed to legislate.
He is trying to do things that is his agenda. The Democrats don't like it. They can challenge it in court. A lot of things are illegal that he is doing. But the courts need to rule.
RAJU: All right. Yes, indeed.
Well, more to digest and more to come on CNN This Morning, including America's top diplomat has landed in Saudi Arabia as he prepares for peace talks with Russia, so far without Ukraine.
Plus, President Trump turning to the Supreme Court to help him fire a government watchdog protected by Congress.
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[06:21:56]
RAJU: Secretary of State Marco Rubio arriving in Saudi Arabia overnight for the first round of talks between the U.S. and Russia to end the fighting in Ukraine. Now, no representatives from Ukraine or the European Union are expected to travel to Saudi Arabia for the talks. Even as Secretary Rubio acknowledges the high stakes for both parties in an eventual peace deal.
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RUBIO: It will not be easy to end the conflict. There are other parties at stake that have opinions on this as well. The European Union has sanctions as well. The Ukrainians are obviously fighting this war. It's their country and they're on the front lines.
So one meeting isn't going to solve it. But I want to reiterate, the president made clear he wants to end this war. And if opportunities present themselves to further that, we're going to take them. (END VIDEOCLIP)
RAJU: All right, CNN's Fred Pleitgen joins us live from Moscow. So, Fred, what do we know about how the Kremlin is approaching these talks in Saudi Arabia and what they're hoping to get from the U.S. at the negotiating table?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there, Manu. Well, it's actually quite interesting to hear what the Russians have been saying because they seem to have a very different or at least a somewhat different take on things than what we heard there from the Secretary of State. Well, we've heard from President Trump as well.
The U.S., of course, is first and foremost talking about ending the war in Ukraine. But when you look at the Russian readouts of some of the phone calls that have happened between Russian and U.S. officials, but also what the Russians, for instance, said today in the form of the Kremlin spokesman, it seems as though they are after a much wider reset of relations between Russia and the United States.
If you read any of their press releases, ending the war in Ukraine will be one issue. But, for instance, sanctions relief will be something that's very high up on the agenda as well as increased economic relations also. So those are the things that the Kremlin is looking for, and it's certainly something where they believe that it's something that they might be able to achieve in the not-too-distant future.
So right now, as the Kremlin delegation this evening, they say, is going to make its way to Riyadh for those talks, they say that they really want to achieve more than that. I think the first thing on the agenda for the Kremlin, though, is trying to get a face-to-face meeting between President Trump and Russian President Vladimir Putin going as fast as possible.
They believe that they can achieve that very quickly. The Kremlin in the past has been speaking about several weeks making that possible, but for them, they believe that this could be the beginning of a very different set of relations between the U.S. and Russia. And especially sanctions relief, of course, Manu, is something that the Russians definitely are after. Manu?
RAJU: And, Fred, President Trump has already commented several times about the fighting in Ukraine since his phone call with President Putin last week. He repeatedly blamed the conflict on former President Biden and Ukraine's ambitions to join NATO.
Some have said these comments amount to concessions that Trump is making to Putin before those talks formally begin. But could those comments have a real impact on the peace talks set to begin this week?
PLEITGEN: Well, they certainly could. I mean, one of the things that we are hearing from the Russians is that they definitely believe that they are in a good place to get a favorable resolution, if you will, of the Ukraine war, and to get to some sort of agreement on terms favorable for themselves.
[06:25:05]
I just came out of a press conference, actually, with the Russian Foreign Minister, and I asked him what concessions the Russians would be willing to make as far as territory is concerned. And he, at length, told me about all the issues that the Russians have had with what the West has been doing vis-a-vis Ukraine in the past.
Some of the things would be to say that the Ukrainians, the Russians believe, didn't hold up their end of the bargain. But the crux of everything appeared to have been that the Russians right now are not thinking of making much in the way of territorial compromises themselves.
So that is certainly something that could be a big issue in negotiations, especially as the Trump administration, the Russians certainly feel, have essentially rolled out the red carpet for the Russians. It's very difficult to describe, Manu, the amount of optimism right now here on the ground in political Moscow.
They believe that they are going to be back on the international scene in the not-too-distant future. And they certainly believe that in the Trump administration, they have an administration that is very much open to restoring Russian relations with the United States.
RAJU: Fred Pleitgen, live on the ground from Moscow, with a fresh reaction from top Russian officials. Thank you so much for that report.
And coming up for us, a measles outbreak in rural Texas reaches nearly 50 cases. What health officials there are now warning about.
Plus, Donald Trump making the first appeal to this presidency to the highest court in the land.
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PAM BONDI, ATTORNEY GENERAL: We will go to the United States Supreme Court and get clarification and get a ruling because we have outrageous, overzealous, unconstitutional judges trying to control federal spending.
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