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DOGE Claims Billions in Savings; Trump Reverses Stance toward Ukraine; McConnell Announces Retirement. Aired 6:30-7a ET
Aired February 21, 2025 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[06:30:00]
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: President Trump.
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EMMANUEL MACRON, FRENCH PRESIDENT: What I'm going to do, is I'm going to tell him basically, you cannot be weak in the face of President Putin.
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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
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ELON MUSK, SENIOR ADVISER TO PRESIDENT TRUMP: This is the chainsaw for bureaucracy. Chainsaw!
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HUNT: Yes, really happened. The Department of Government Efficiency slashing its way through the federal workforce. The Trump administration and Elon Musk, they insist that they're only firing low performing employees serving in non-critical roles, or recent hires who have probationary status.
[06:35:03]
Just this week, those firings reached the IRS, the national parks, NASA and the Department of Defense.
However, interviews with more than a dozen recently laid off federal workers, plus documents obtained by CNN, paints a much different picture.
Still, that hasn't stopped Elon Musk from touting DOJ's apparent successes in slashing government expenditures.
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ELON MUSK, SENIOR ADVISER TO PRESIDENT TRUMP: People ask me, what's the most surprising thing that you've encountered when you go to D.C.? You know, when you're in D.C. And I said, well, the most surprising thing is the scale of the expenditures and actually how easy it is to - with a - just - just when you add caring and competence, where it was absent before, you can actually save billions of dollars, sometimes in this - in an hour.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.
MUSK: Like - it's - it's - it's wild.
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HUNT: So, CNN's Tom Foreman dug into exactly what DOGE has cut.
Watch.
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DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: And also, could you mention some of -
TOM FOREMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice over): The White House is rolling out its wall of receipts on the DOGE website, claiming an estimated 55 billion taxpayer dollars rescued through fraud detection, workforce reductions, regulatory savings and more.
TRUMP: Not like a little bit. Billions. Tens of billions of dollars.
It could be close to $1 trillion that we're going to find.
FOREMAN (voice over): But hold on. A closer look shows big problems.
For example, DOGE claimed axing a single immigration and customs contract saved $8 billion. Turns out that contract was worth a maximum of $8 million. And that was just a theoretical ceiling for the deal. Less than half that amount was actually slated to be spent. DOGE corrected that error, but a CNN review of the more than 1,100 contracts listed on the DOGE site found about two-thirds made similar inflated claims.
And while this alleged outrage dug up by DOGE grabbed headlines -
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: There was about to be 50 million taxpayer dollars that went out the door to fund condoms in Gaza. That is a preposterous waste of taxpayer money.
FOREMAN (voice over): That proved to be dead wrong, as DOGE boss Elon Musk admitted.
ELON MUSK, SENIOR ADVISER TO PRESIDENT TRUMP: Some of the things that I say will be incorrect, and should be corrected.
FOREMAN (voice over): Still, even with the receipts not all adding up, DOGE keeps filing reports of alleged widespread waste in aid to foreign countries, deals tied to diversity programs, and millions of dead people collecting Social Security.
MUSK: And we've got people in there that are 150 years old. FOREMAN (voice over): Analysts say that most likely reflects DOJ's
misunderstanding of Social Security data, and a former federal official calls the notion laughably false.
MARTIN O'MALLEY, FORMER SOCIAL SECURITY ADMINISTRATION COMMISSIONER: He has no idea what he's talking about. There is - there is not like a zombie apocalypse of people, you know, cadavers running around with Social Security checks coming out of their pockets.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HUNT: All right, our thanks to Tom Foreman for that report.
Our panel is back.
So, these cuts have been pretty indiscriminate in many ways, to the point they've had to kind of put people back, Brad, including, like, the people that work on our - protecting our nuclear weapons and other things.
I think one thing that people have failed to perhaps grasp is the - or talk about is the humanity of the situation. And certainly Elon Musk, the way he talks about it, doesn't necessarily account for the fact that all these people that he's talking about, these - these job cuts are actual people.
I want to play two things, actually. Jesse Watters, the Fox News host, how he has been talking about the people who have been impacted by this. And then we'll watch something else. He apparently had a little bit of an epiphany. Let's - let's first play how he has been talking about people impacted by DOGE.
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JESSE WATTERS, FOX NEWS HOST: Thousands of bureaucrats woke up today to a big, you're fired!
DOGE is dishing out spankings like daddy daycare.
It's like going to your grandparents' house, throwing out their VCR and their stacks of tapes, just downloading Netflix for them. Here, grandpa, you just hit this button here and press select.
Even the holiday weekend couldn't slow DOGE down. There was a huge exodus over at the National Archives. Persnickety librarians were getting DOGE-ed silly. The Dewey Decimal System is next.
DOGE is a blessing from the heavens above.
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HUNT: The librarians got DOGE-ed.
Here's what happened when Mr. Watters learned that somebody that is close to him was affected.
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JESSE WATTERS, FOX NEWS HOST: He just found out he's probably going to get laid off. He's going to get DOGE-ed. And he texted me and he said, Jesse, you know, this isn't good. I'm - I'm upset. This is really sad.
And this guy's not a DEI consultant. This guy is not a climate consultant. You know, this guy is a veteran.
We just need to be a little bit less callous with the way, Harold, we talk about DOGE-ing people.
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[06:40:03]
HUNT: An interesting lesson that he learned.
Alex Thompson, this is - this is just the thing I keep coming back to. And they're not just people here in Washington, D.C. They are people across the country.
ALEX THOMPSON, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, and Elon Musk made it very clear in the clip you showed earlier that he is bringing a chainsaw, not a scalpel, to this. They are not doing considerate ways of firing. I mean I've talked to many, you know, people that work in the federal government over the last two weeks that basically talk about people in tears constantly and people basically feeling that years of work they're doing is being just thrown out the door, or - and people just also live in apprehension that they're not going to have a job, or they're going to get a late night email saying, like, your services are no longer needed.
So, certainly you can - I think there is - the political effect, we don't know, but you can definitely see that the way they've gone about this has caused a lot of frustration.
HUNT: Brad, again, I don't think - I certainly think that the American public is willing to say, we want our government to be efficient. We want it to be more efficient. We understand that there are things that should be cut. But again, these are human beings. And these cuts are not just here in the DMV (ph). I mean they are across the country. There's - I talked to one woman whose daughter works for a small and - non-profit in Kansas City, Missouri, working on homelessness. They don't think they're going to get their grants. They're probably going to have to fire everyone. There was that park ranger in Iowa who, you know, we all saw on social media, who basically - I mean, this is not - this is not just here, it is across the country. And these are, again, real people.
BRAD TODD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Government policy has cost people their jobs for a long time. I'm from a place in east Tennessee that was a hosiery (ph) mill town. And NAFTA, a government policy, put basically everybody who worked at those mills out of business. The government itself is the only industry, perhaps, that has not been affected by downsizing, layoffs, efficiency cuts over the last 20 years. This is just the world catching up with government. And certainly there are human stories there, but it's also revealing
the fact that some of the - a lot of the things we do in government don't make a lot of sense. And maybe we've been doing too much of some things. Maybe we've used too many people to do certain functions. And I think by and large the taxpayers, who are also affected by this, they see the waste that's happened. I think most people, as taxpayers, are glad to see some efficiency.
MEGHAN HAYS, FORMER BIDEN WHITE HOUSE DIRECTOR OF MESSAGE PLANNING AND DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: So -
HUNT: Very quickly.
HAYS: So, two things. When we cut taxes at a federal level for some of these programs like homelessness, that just translates to the state level and their state taxes are going to go up. And also the political aspect of this, those calls that Jesse Watters is getting, members of Congress are going to start getting those. And that's going to impact them for the midterms and for '28. Donald Trump might not have to pay the repercussions, but I really do think Congress is going to pay the repercussions because their constituents are not going to be happy about a lot of these cuts and a lot of these job losses.
TODD: We'll see.
HUNT: All right, straight ahead here on CNN THIS MORNING, in just one month President Trump has dramatically shifted how the U.S. approaches foreign policy. Michael Smerconish joins us next to discuss that and more.
Plus, the end of an era. After four decades in the Senate, Mitch McConnell announcing he will not seek re-election.
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SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): So lest any of our colleagues still doubt my intentions for the remainder of my term, I have some unfinished business to attend to.
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[06:47:17]
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REPORTER: Do you view Ukraine as an equal member of this peace process?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's an interesting question. I think they have to make peace.
They've been saying that for a long time, that Ukraine cannot go into NATO. And - and I'm - and I'm OK with that.
REPORTER: Do you trust President Putin?
TRUMP: I believe that - yes, I believe that he would like to see something happen. I trust him on this subject.
Oh, well, we weren't invited. Well, you've been there for three years. You should have ended it three years. You should have never started it. You could have made a deal.
A dictator without elections. Zelenskyy better move fast or he's not going to have a country left.
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HUNT: Donald Trump's verbal attacks on Ukraine's leadership now setting the stage for a rapid reversal of U.S. policy toward that country as it tries to defend itself against the Russian invasion. It was just a little over two years ago that Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy was invited by then Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi, to address a joint session of Congress just days before Christmas. He brought a Ukrainian flag that had been signed by soldiers on the front lines with this message to U.S. lawmakers.
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VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT: It gives me good reason to share with you our first - first joint victory. We defeated Russia in the battle for minds of the world.
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HUNT: Now, of course, Zelenskyy finds himself at odds with President Trump and leaders in a Republican-controlled Washington. As President Trump demands rights to Ukraine's natural resources, his allies are throwing cold water on the idea of any future aid to Ukraine.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you see another funding bill for the war in Ukraine?
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): Look, I - there's no appetite for that. What do you think? I -- no. Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We got our answer there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right, joining us now - it's Friday - to discuss, CNN political commentator Michael Smerconish, the host of "SMERCONISH."
Michael, always wonderful to have you on the program. Thank you so much for being here.
MICHAEL SMERCONISH, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Thank you, Kasie. Great to see you again. HUNT: So, let's talk a little bit about this, what's going on here
with, you know, we've been holding up the cover of today's "New York Post," which we know Trump reads we think probably every day. He certainly looks at it. It says, "this is a dictator, President Trump," with a picture of Putin.
The - "Axios" this morning is reporting that how Zelenskyy has handled the public back and forth with President Trump has made Trump so angry that he's thought about pulling all aid, all military aid to Ukraine.
What are the realities here, in your view? How significant is this as a shift in, you know, America's situation as what we have always called - we've always called the president, the leader of the free world.
[06:50:02]
SMERCONISH: You know, I too thought that this repudiation by "The New York Post" was so significant that at Wawa (ph) this morning I bought my own copy because I wanted to see exactly what kind of a spanking "The Post" was going to -
HUNT: Great minds.
SMERCONISH: Right - was going to give Trump.
Here's something else that occurs to me. One of the changes in Trump 2.0 is that populist Andrew Jackson, his portrait has been removed or replaced or swapped out in the Oval Office for Ronald Reagan, which is interesting to me because I cut my teeth as a Reagan Republican in the 1980s. I still revere Ronald Reagan. You don't hear Ronald Reagan's name invoked in this incarnation of the GOP the way that you had in the recent past. So, I like that. That's a good thing.
Ronald Reagan is rolling over in his grave at what Donald Trump is doing vis a vis Putin. How far we have come from, "Mr. Gorbachev, tear down that wall." I remember the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan in 1979. I remember the support that Reagan gave the so-called freedom fighters in Afghanistan in the '80s. This is so far removed from that. I don't understand it. It's a policy of appeasement. And to put it in lay terms, we have thrown - this administration has thrown Zelenskyy under the bus. I don't know that Ukraine would still be standing but for Volodymyr Zelenskyy.
HUNT: I remember the early days of the war and the sort of assumption that he was going to simply be rolled by the Russians in the beginning there and the way that he sort of stepped up as a leader was really remarkable.
I mean, Michael, how do you explain the way that President Trump is approaching this? Is it just admiration for the level of control that Putin is able to exert over his society? Is it just admiration for that? I mean, what is it?
SMERCONISH: It's hard not to look at the dynamics and say that that Putin is what Trump aspires to be in terms of the strongman image. Look, if in the end it had to be - if, in the end, it had to be that - that Russia is going to maintain some of the spoils of war, I can get it. But what I don't get is the spanking that Zelenskyy is getting, the degrading way in which he's being referred to, as a dictator by President Trump, or blamed - blamed for - they never should have started it. You just played the clip again. I don't know, I'm flabbergasted. I just - I just don't understand. It's as if there's an effort to humiliate him. And it's just unnecessary.
HUNT: Yes, briefly, Michael, I also want to get your take on - let's just take a brief look at what Elon Musk did yesterday at CPAC.
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ELON MUSK, SENIOR WHITE HOUSE ADVISER: This is the chainsaw for bureaucracy. Chainsaw!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: He said he was living the meme. Obviously, there's some support from Americans for, you know, adding efficiencies to government. Do you think the chainsaw is the wrong instrument to be going after the federal government with?
SMERCONISH: You know, I have the same comment and reaction that I do relative to Russia and Ukraine, which is, OK, maybe this is where it needs to end. But the process - I mean is the process really necessary? I don't think we've taken a serious look at the size of our debt since Simpson-Bowles in the Obama years. I like the idea that there is, you know, this type of a review taking place. But the methodology that they're using, I question. In the same way that I question the methodology that they're using to get to the end of the road with Ukraine and Russia.
HUNT: All right, Michael Smerconish, it has been such a treat to have you every Friday here on CTM. This is actually going to be my last broadcast here. I'm really excited - I think you're going to be on hopefully the very first show that we're going to have at 4:00 p.m. So, I'm really excited to see you there.
SMERCONISH: I wish you all good things. You deserve it. Thank you.
HUNT: Thank you. I'll see you soon.
And of course, don't forget, tune in to "SMERCONISH." It's tomorrow morning, 9:00 a.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.
All right, let's turn now to this story.
A major announcement from former Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Dee Huddleston (ph), thank you very much. Come on.
We can't find Dee. Maybe we ought to let him make speeches and switch to Mitch for senator.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: That's a throwback. He's been in office for four decades. The 83-year-old Kentucky Republican now announcing he will not run for re- election next year. In 2020, McConnell won his seventh consecutive term. But during his tenure, he clashed at times with President Trump. In recent times - that's an understatement. In recent weeks, McConnell voted against more of Trump's nominees than any other Republican.
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SEN. MITCH MCCONNELL (R-KY): I'm a survivor of childhood polio from before vaccines, before vaccines eradicated that disease here in our country and around the world now.
[06:55:06]
So, I've been a lifelong champion of vaccinations.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: He's not voting against Bobby. He's voting against me. But that's all right.
He votes against almost everything now. He's a, you know, very bitter guy.
I don't know anything about he had polio. He had polio.
REPORTER: Are you doubting that he had polio?
TRUMP: I have no idea if he had polio.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: The man had polio.
McConnell's retirement will also mean an open Senate seat in 2026.
Brad Todd, you're very close to many Senate Republicans. Mitch McConnell came to Washington the year that I was born. Full disclosure. And his stepping down, you know, there have been a series of things that have happened during the Trump time here in Washington that have felt like, you know, end points or, taken together, the end of one version of the Republican Party and the beginning of another one.
I mean John McCain's funeral was perhaps the most noteworthy of these for me. But McConnell's retirement is another one. But what does that mean about where the Republican Party came from and where it's going?
TODD: Well, first off, I think Republicans owe McConnell a great debt of gratitude for what he did on the judiciary. Conservatives, we care a lot about the Supreme Court, and we care a lot about the lower courts. Nobody has put that care into action more than Mitch McConnell. We have three Supreme Court justices appointed by Donald Trump thanks
to Mitch McConnell in large part. On campaign finance and free speech, McConnell has been a total champion, and we owe him a debt of gratitude on that.
However, his cooperation with Chuck Schumer over the years eventually - which he saw as a way to preserve the institution of the Senate eroded some of the trust he had among conservatives. And so, it's - I think that you will probably see a lot less cheering on his departure than you might otherwise have because of the accomplishments he had on the judiciary. He deserves some cheering as he goes out the door.
But the changes in the Republican Party, a lot are because of confrontation. He's of the old school of compromise and conciliation and not of confrontation. And we now have a party that confrontation is number one on the agenda.
HUNT: Alex, how do you govern if all you do is oppose each other, right? I mean, like, that's - like our system is quite literally built to work when, you know, I mean, Republicans have needed government - or Democrats to keep government open and running all the way along here.
THOMPSON: Well, McConnell's view has long been that the government will only - basically you have - that's why he's always protected the filibuster, even when Trump -
HUNT: Yes.
THOMPSON: Donald Trump wanted him not to, is because he only believes that you should only be able to move forward when there is at least a fragile consensus between two parties.
HUNT: Fair enough.
All right, I am going to leave you with this one last time.
Today is my last day here on CNN THIS MORNING. I am going to move to the afternoon. I'm going to be hosting my new show, "THE ARENA." It's going to be on at 4:00 p.m. Eastern.
But before we leave, I do want to take a moment to look back at some of the memorable moments that we've had over the past year here on this show.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: We are f-ed. That reaction from a Democratic source after watching President Biden's performance in last night's CNN debate.
It sounds like you're actually open to the idea that it might be the right decision for him to step aside.
REP. MIKE QUIGLEY (D-IL): I think what I'm stressing is it has to be his decision. But we have to be honest with ourselves that it wasn't just a horrible night. KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: So much of, you know, the
clips we were watching at the top of the segment are driven by the fact that this is - this is an attractive person.
HUNT: No, we've got to drop the banner to show why.
BEDINGFIELD: And - and -
HUNT: Welcome to all of you. So grateful to have you here.
Bakari, you OK?
BAKARI SELLERS, CNN COMMENTATOR: Yes, I'm -
ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: (INAUDIBLE).
BEDINGFIELD: Caffeine. Caffeine. Caffeine.
SELLERS: I don't - I don't know where I am or what I'm doing, but I'm - I'm apparently here.
HUNT: Just a little concerned.
SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: No, you're wrong, Bakari.
SELLERS: You're wrong. And you're wrong. Everybody's screwing this up this morning.
HUNT: Can we put this shirt button -
WILLIAMS: I know, gee -
HUNT: Thanks.
SELLERS: First - first of all, I am making a statement.
WILLIAMS: It's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot.
JENNINGS: Hang on. Hang on. Let me just - let me get my Bakari on.
SELLERS: All right.
JENNINGS: Here we go, Bakari.
HUNT: Oh, my God. Scott!
WILLIAMS: No, no, no, no. No, no.
HUNT: Thank God you can barely see that on camera.
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Wow! (EXPLETIVE DELETED). Wow.
HUNT: Here he was in Brazil earlier this week. The first sitting president to visit the Amazon, seeming to wander into the jungle.
TRUMP: And those beautiful arms came and they hugged it like you would hug your little beautiful baby.
HUNT: OK. Joining us now to discuss is astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson. He is the author -
MATT GORMAN, FORMER TIM SCOTT PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN SENIOR ADVISER AND REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: If NORAD could track Santa down to the (INAUDIBLE) city, how can they not find these damn drones?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: We've had a lot of really wonderful times here on the show. Hopefully Bakari will button his shirt if he comes on at 4:00 p.m. Bakari, looking at you.
I do want to take a second though, there are so many people - my favorite thing about television is that it is a team sport. You cannot do it with - there are literally dozens of people who work on this, D.C., Atlanta, New York, across the country. I want to take a moment to thank all of them.
[07:00:01]
Our tech crews, our booking folks, the makeup artists that help everybody look their best every day. It really does take so much, and I'm so grateful.
They, of course, are going to be continuing to work on what you will see here with my colleague Audie Cornish, who will be here at 6:00 a.m. doing CNN THIS MORNING. And I do really hope that you will join me at 4:00 p.m. Eastern Time every day for "THE ARENA."
Thanks to all of you for joining us. To our - my panel, thank you all guys for being here on my last show. It's been wonderful to have you be part of all of it.
ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Thank you to you.
TODD: Yes, thanks for having us.
HUNT: Thank you. I hope I'll see you at 4:00 as well.
I'm Kasie Hunt. Don't go anywhere. CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.
