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CNN This Morning

Medical Examiners Believe Hackman Likely Died On February 18; Nearly 20M People Under Threat As Storms Sweep Across Gulf Coast; President Trump Promising New Tariffs On Canadian Dairy Next Week; Democrats, Republicans Deal With Unsettled Voters At Town Halls; South Korea's Embattled President Yoon Freed From Detention; Trump Says He Sent A Letter To Iran This Week Urging Nuclear Deal; Volatile Week On Wall Street As Major Indexes Show Massive Gyrations; Proposed Missouri Bill Offers Bounty For Tips On Undocumented Immigrants. Aired 7-8a ET

Aired March 08, 2025 - 07:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everyone. Welcome to CNN this morning. It is Saturday, March 8th, 2025. I'm Omar Jimenez. Victor Blackwell has the day off.

A lot to get to, including new details from investigators in New Mexico. We now know what killed Gene Hackman and his wife and just how far apart they died.

President Trump has a message for Canada as he threatens America's neighbors to the north with more tariffs saying, "Enjoy it while you can."

And a Missouri lawmaker wants to pay $1,000 for tips that lead to the arrests of undocumented immigrants. Wait until you hear what he tells me.

ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: And storms have developed overnight, including severe thunderstorms around the Dallas Metro Area. We'll detail what other cities are in the path of these severe thunderstorms coming up.

JIMENEZ: Now, we're going to start with new overnight. The New Mexico medical examiner ruling out foul play in the deaths of actor Gene Hackman and his wife, Betsy Arakawa. Now, officials say both Hackman and Arakawa died of natural causes. Investigators though say Hackman likely died of complications from heart disease. They say his pacemaker last recorded his heartbeat on February 18th. As for his wife, Betsy Arakawa, officials believe she likely died on February 11th from Hantavirus, a rare infectious disease.

CNN Correspondent Veronica Miracle has more from Santa Fe, New Mexico.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A mystery that captured the world's attention now appears to be a terrible tragedy. Oscar winner Gene Hackman in ailing health and suffering from Alzheimer's was likely with his wife's body for days after she suddenly died of an infectious disease.

DR. HEATHER JARRELL, CHIEF MEDICAL INVESTIGATOR, NEW MEXICO: The cause of death for Miss Betsy Hackman aged 65 years is Hantavirus Pulmonary Syndrome. The manner of death is natural.

MIRACLE (voice-over): Humans can get the rare Hantavirus disease from contact with rodents and it's transmitted to people through their feces or urine. Investigators say she died suddenly likely a week before her husband.

JARRELL: Was he aware that Miss Hackman had died? And I think that question is difficult to answer, but I can tell you that he was in an advanced state of Alzheimer's and it's quite possible that he was not aware that she was deceased. The cause of death for Mr. Gene Hackman aged 95 years is hypertensive and atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease with Alzheimer's disease as a significant contributory factor.

MIRACLE (voice-over): Hackman's pacemaker data showed he likely died on February 18th, according to investigators. Betsy was last seen on surveillance video at a local CVS and grocery store on February 11th. While they don't know her exact time of death, they believe she died that day.

Officials say Hantavirus is a serious disease, but rare. The Santa Fe County Fire Chief isn't aware of the last case they've had in the county.

DR. ERIN PHIPPS, NEW MEXICO STATE VETERINARIAN: Hantavirus pulmonary syndrome is a rare disease caused by Hantaviruses, but a small number of human infections are found every year in New Mexico. 42 percent of these infections here in New Mexico were fatal.

MIRACLE (voice-over): On February 26th, the couple were discovered dead by maintenance workers. Officials did not find any signs of forced entry, but considered the circumstances suspicious enough to warrant a thorough investigation. The 95-year-old actor was found on the ground in a mudroom according to a search warrant. Arakawa-Hackman was found on the ground inside a bathroom next to an open prescription pill bottle with pills scattered.

One of the couple's three dogs was found dead in a locked crate near Arakawa's body. The dog had recently visited the vet before Betsy died.

[07:05:01]

ADAN MENDOZA, SHERIFF, SANTA FE COUNTY: There was a procedure that was done with the -- with the dog, which may explain why the dog was in a crate at the residence.

MIRACLE (voice-over): Officials are still waiting for the exact cause of death for the dog, but they can say it didn't die of Hantavirus as dogs can't get the disease. They believe the dog may have died from starvation.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MIRACLE (on camera): Betsy was 30 years younger than Gene and appeared to be his caretaker. So when she died, it appears that there was no one to care for him. The medical examiner said he had no food in his stomach when he died. In terms of the investigation, they say it is still open, but slowly coming to a close. They are winding down some loose ends, reviewing some cell phone data, the necropsy of the dog that died. They're also going to be releasing body camera footage in the coming days of the deputies who responded to the scene. Omar?

JIMENEZ: Veronica Miracle, I really appreciate it.

Joining me now to talk about all of this is Dr. Ziv Cohen, Clinical Assistant Professor of Psychiatry at Weill Cornell Medical College at Cornell University, founder of Principium Psychiatry, and Forensic and Criminal Psychiatrist. Good morning. Thanks for being here.

So, I just want to start with, look, officials say Arakawa died about a week before Hackman, and we knew Hackman was dealing with Alzheimer's, but can you just bring us into why he may not have called 911 or anyone to report his wife's death? What would have been the dynamic there?

And I don't believe we can hear you right now. So, we're going to try and work on that audio and potentially get you back here in just a few moments. But obviously, going through regarding this press conference, there were a lot of details that were laid out, of course, in this death. And so, we're going to try and get him back in a little bit.

But in the meantime, we are going to move on to a few other stories happening right now, including police in Canada that are searching for three male suspects following a shooting at a pub in Toronto.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PAUL MACINTIRE, SUPERINTENDENT, TORONTO POLICE ORGANIZED CRIME UNIT: Three males enter the pub just before 10:40. One male was armed with what appears to be an assault rifle. The other two males were armed with handguns. And they walked into the bar. They produced their guns, and they opened fire indiscriminately on the people sitting inside the restaurant, inside the bar.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: Now, officials say at least 12 people are injured. Six people sustained gunshot wounds. Four others have non life threatening injuries. The victims range in age from 20s to mid 50s. Now, the Toronto -- Toronto's mayor said all necessary resources are being deployed following the shooting. She wrote on social media, "I am deeply troubled to hear reports of a shooting at a pub in Scarborough. My thoughts are with the victims and their families. We're going to bring you more details as they become available.

But also, we're following a lot of stories, including weather. But I do believe we've got our previous guest, Dr. Ziv Cohen back now to talk more about the details we've gotten out of the Gene Hackman death.

And just before we lost your audio, I believe we've got you back. You know, Hackman had been dealing with Alzheimer's. And I think some people might look at this and say, well, if his wife had been dead for a week, why did he not call 9-1-1 or report his wife's death to anyone? Can you just bring us into dynamics of what would have been happening for someone dealing with Alzheimer's during this particular episode?

DR. ZIV COHEN, CLINICAL ASSISTANT PROFESSOR OF PSYCHIATRY, WEILL CORNELL MEDICAL COLLEGE, CORNELL UNIVERSITY: Sure. So, you know, from what the medical examiner's reporting, he had really Advanced Alzheimer's. And patients in that type of situation, they really often lose awareness of their environment. They lose what we call executive function, which means that they're not able to make routine judgments about their self-care, their safety. It sounds like he was really dependent on his wife.

And so sadly, when she expired, he essentially was helpless at home. I think it raises systemic questions about his overall care. Someone that impaired should not really be dependent on just one caregiver. So, it raises questions of why were there not other caregivers that were coming to the home to assist his wife, to check in on them both. She was already in her 60s and she herself would have been in a more immunocompromised situation. So, I think they were living in a quite vulnerable state being so isolated on that estate.

JIMENEZ: And look, for his wife, Betsy Arakawa, the CDC -- according to the CDC, Hantavirus Pulmonary Syndrome symptoms could be mistaken for the flu or other respiratory diseases. I mean, how likely is it that she had no idea the severity of her illness as she likely functioned as a caretaker in large part for her husband?

COHEN: Yes. And I think that's what makes this case so tragic is that the symptoms probably came on insidiously, but then very quickly. So, before she really realized what was going on, she was essentially disabled in terms of being able to reach out for help. And again, I think that raises the question about their overall isolation Also, they're living in a place where neighbors are not able to easily access them.

Were there family members that were instructed to check in on them regularly? I think when you have an elderly couple living so isolated, you would want people calling in and checking in on them at least every couple of days. And if they're not able to reach them to then be able to immediately call for help.

So, I think that it sounds like Gene Hackman was isolated and helpless for about a week before he finally expires. I think that was -- that was a tragic aspect of this case.

[07:10:40]

JIMENEZ: And you know, you touched on it a little bit sort of the importance of having a network of care taking as opposed to just one person in particular. How much of a difference do you think that would have made in -- I mean, this is already a tragic case, but how much of a difference would a network of care do you believe would have made in a situation like this?

COHEN: I think it would have made a big difference. Look, I think that Mr. Hackman, we know, was quite elderly. He was 95 and he had advanced Alzheimer's. To me, the more tragic aspect here is actually Betsy, that I think that she was taking on too much to be the sole caregiver when she herself was entering late life.

And I think if she had had a support network around her and they hadn't been so isolated, perhaps she would have been taken to the hospital and given supportive care much sooner. And perhaps she would have survived the Hantavirus.

And by the same token, if they had had a network of care, he wouldn't have been left alone that last week of his life. And perhaps he would also still be alive. So, I think that they were living in a very vulnerable overall living situation. And that unfortunately, the Hantavirus really upended all of their expectations.

JIMENEZ: A lot of tragic details still coming out about this case. Dr. Ziv Cohen, I really appreciate you being here. Thanks for the time and perspective.

COHEN: Good to be here.

JIMENEZ: All right, we're also following fires that remain a critical danger in Texas with more strong dry winds on the forecast and severe storms along the Gulf Coast have nearly 20 million people across Dallas to Tallahassee being threatened.

CNN Meteorologist Allison Chinchar is with me now. So, Allison, look, fire conditions don't seem to be letting up this weekend in Texas. What are we seeing?

CHINCHAR: Right. So, you're still going to have that threat for today. It's shifted a little bit farther south and a little bit farther east, but it's still there. And then east of that, you have the potential for strong to severe thunderstorms. And we're already seeing some of those thunderstorms begin. It's all due to this low pressure system right down here sitting along the Gulf Coast.

To the west of it, you have those gusty winds, but no moisture to go along with it. To the east side, you have the gusty winds and then you also have the potential for strong to severe thunderstorms. So, here's a look at where the fire threat is going to be for today. This does include cities like San Antonio, Del Rio, several areas through here due to those incredibly low humidities, 10 to 20 percent, and the very gusty winds that could be up around 55 to 65 miles per hour.

Now we also talked about some of those strong to severe thunderstorms. You've got several severe thunderstorm warnings in place in and around the Dallas Fort Worth area, but this is all part of the broader system as a whole. So, you can see Texas, Oklahoma, but also some of these areas down here along the Gulf Coast.

So Louisiana, Florida, also looking at the potential for some of those strong to severe thunderstorms. More of these are going to develop as we go through the afternoon. So, while we do still have some in place right now, you're going to see more through the afternoon, and especially into the evening hours, the farther you shift a little bit to the east.

The main threat here is actually going to be damaging winds and the potential for hail, but we can't rule out the potential for a tornado for any of these areas. Here you can see as we go through the afternoon, you just watch that system as a whole just kind of blow up in size. And that's going to be the case for Texas, Oklahoma, Louisiana, Arkansas. But then also here along the southern edge, you've also got some of those strong to severe thunderstorms.

The concern here, especially along the Florida panhandle. A lot of those storms are just going to sit there. So, that's also going to bring in a component of flooding to some of those areas in Florida as well.

JIMENEZ: Lots to keep track of. Allison Chinchar, I really appreciate it as always.

All right. Coming up for us, we're following a lot of stories, including three reversals in a week. Trump's tariff chaos is sending markets tumbling and even top Republicans are losing patience. Could this be a breaking point? We'll talk about it coming up.

And Russian strikes leave at least 23 dead, dozens more wounded this morning. Crews are searching for survivors.

Plus, a controversial Missouri bill could offer a thousand dollars to turn in undocumented immigrants. Critics are calling it a bounty. I spoke with one woman concerned about her parents and the community that she works with every day.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:15:00]

JIMENEZ: Welcome back, everyone. If you're just waking up, hopefully you're getting a view of this beautiful that we're seeing out of St. Louis right now. It is a great Saturday morning, even though we're going to lose an hour of sleep tonight. I'll talk about it later. Not too happy about it. Whatever.

But we've got a lot of news going on today, including the latest shot fired in President Donald Trump's tariff battle. He's telling Canada, "Enjoy it while you can." Now, in a Truth Social post last night, he said Canada is cheating American farmers with its tariffs on dairy products. When -- as soon as next week, he could put a matching dairy tariff in place for Canada as other tariffs are currently paused."

With me now as Michigan Democratic Representative Debbie Dingell. Thank you for being here this morning. All right, this tariff back and forth is getting a little tough to track at this point. But obviously, agriculture and auto, two major industries for your state, how much could these tariffs affect your state economy? What are you watching here?

[07:20:26]

REP. DEBBIE DINGELL (D-MI): Well, first of all, let me tell you that I am someone that does believe that tariffs are a tool in the toolbox and I am not anti-tariff. And I have worked with the President when he got elected the first time and would do that again. But what we're watching right now is just total chaos and uncertainty and it's not helping anybody.

Everybody knows that businesses and farmers need certainty. And quite frankly, I also think it's time for us to stop treating Canada and Mexico alike because they are two different countries. And I live in the border with Canada. They are a good ally.

But our auto industry is just having their head whipped back and forth. They need time to make inventory adjustments, manufacturing, and production changes. Tariffs should be part of a policy that brings manufacturing back to this country, brings supply chains back to this country. There are countries we really need to be using it against. What we're watching right now is just a whipsaw game and it's not healthy for anybody.

JIMENEZ: And you know, you pair that alongside with the federal cuts we have seen likely -- mostly led by DOGE, but of course encouraged by members of the Trump Administration as well. Federal cuts across a number of departments along with what we're seeing at the tariffs. What are you seeing at the state level as far as the effects of some of these federal cuts?

DINGELL: Well, 42% of Michigan's budget is the federal cuts. I mean, it's not the federal cuts, it's the federal budget. But people don't understand -- too many people don't understand, programs that they have every day that they take for granted. From airline safety and air traffic controllers, to doctors and nurses in VA hospitals, the people that are helping our farmers, those programs have been desperately cut.

We have -- we do have bird flu in Michigan. That work has stopped. Things have been taken down from the sites. But yesterday I did a roundtable with all of the different government departments that had cuts or had employees fired in the Michigan area in the last three weeks. Some of those reports were pretty devastating as to the kind of work that's not going to be done, the mass confusion and the uncertainty.

JIMENEZ: And I know you also hosted what I believe is a pretty packed town hall meeting Thursday night. Obviously, we've seen a lot of frustration at Republican town halls at points, but as I understand you all also were dealing with some frustrated voters overall. What did you hear from them? What were some of their primary concerns?

DINGELL: So I had two town halls in Thursday night. I don't recommend it again. I had a telephone town hall, 11,000 people and I left. And quite frankly, I had two overflow rooms. There were more than 1,000 people. Now, my people are -- look, I took nothing -- people were intense. They were -- some wanted to yell, but not necessarily at me. And I did it with my state legislators and we stayed for three hours.

But they don't think these are normal times. They want to see people doing something. They're worried about their democracy. What are we going to do to protect our democracy? These aren't normal times. Normal tactics don't work. There were just a lot of people that care deeply, deeply about our democracy and what they're seeing happening and the values that we have and what are we going to do to protect them.

JIMENEZ: And you know, some of those frustrations, yes, we've seen outplay from voters, but also from among many of your colleagues, but one in particular, of course, Congressman Al Green protested the President's congressional address, then got censured. You weren't among the 10 Democrats that voted for that censure. Why not?

DINGELL: Look, we were representative body. Each of us is different. We are all trying to come together and figure out what the right thing to do. I respect his right of free speech. I also think that there is inconsistent enforcement of the rules in the House. And I think that's part of the frustration that you saw bubble up.

I am somebody that believes in civility. I don't like the way that we are censoring everybody too much in the last few years. And I don't know how we're going to do it because these aren't normal times. I want to work across the aisle when I can, but I've got to protect the people in my district, my state and my country too. People are struggling what is the right thing to do in these times.

JIMENEZ: And I should mention for our viewers, Congressman Al Green will be on CNN in the noon hour with Fredricka Whitfield. But for now, Congresswoman Debbie Dingle, I appreciate you being here in your Michigan Green. Thanks for taking the time.

[07:25:08]

DINGELL: Irish, St. Patrick. I'm blue.

JIMENEZ: Oh, yes. There we go. There we go. Michigan State, I guess. Yes, you're a go blue. I put you as a Michigan State person. That's on me. That's on me. Good to see you.

All right, just ahead, South Korean President Yoon Suk Yeol who is indicted on insurrection charges and impeached by lawmakers, has just been released from detention after a court canceled his arrest warrant. So, what's next in the case?

And Russian attacks claim the lives of at least 23 people with many more injured. Rescue teams are racing against time to find survivors.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:30:13]

JIMENEZ: Welcome back.

This morning, South Korea's embattled president walked out of jail, ending his two-month stay in detention.

President Yoon Suk Yeol's release came after a Seoul court canceled his arrest warrant yesterday, though, he's not off the hook, yet. He still faces charges of leading an insurrection after he declared martial law in December.

CNN's Mike Valerio joins us now. So, Mike, I mean, this all comes back to martial law. Can you just connect the dots for us? There's been a lot of upheaval with South Korea here.

MIKE VALERIO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Omar. And we're going to do it in a minute in 15 seconds. So, buckle up.

This is exactly what you were just saying. This is an effort to hold South Korea's embattled president criminally responsible, Omar, for declaring martial law back in early December.

He did that, to refresh everybody's memory, because he was facing a logjam in this country's legislature, nothing was going his way, so his idea of fixing that problem was to call in the military and to ban political activity from happening at the legislature altogether.

That was overturned in a very bizarre six hours. So, he faces criminal charges over that effort. Now, a judge here in Seoul said, late Friday afternoon, you know, there were problems with his arrest warrant. The charges were filed too late, and the investigators who are central to this effort, they may not have jurisdiction over that charge of leading an insurrection.

So, that's why he is out of jail. This is a big boon, a big measure of support for his supporters, who are in the conservative spectrum of the political equation.

But Omar, just buckle up. You know, everybody watching at home back in the United States. We could be without this president in the next few days. South Korea's top court is ruling whether or not to kick him out of office or to keep him in office. So, a lot going on here, lot of political upheaval in this key U.S. ally, Omar.

JIMENEZ: We will see Mike Valerio's minute report. Thanks so much, man.

All right. Elsewhere this morning, Russia launched another wave of deadly strikes across Ukraine, killing at least 23 people, in this latest attack follows yesterday's deadly assault. And comes as President Donald Trump sends conflicting signals, warning of possible sanctions against Russia, while also suggesting Vladimir Putin's actions are justified.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Do you, Mr. President, think that Vladimir Putin is taking advantage of the U.S. pause right now on intelligence and military aid to Ukraine?

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No -- I actually think he is doing what anybody else would do. I think he's -- I think he wants to get it stopped and settled. And I think he's hitting him harder than he is been hitting him. And I think probably anybody in that position would be doing that right now.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

JIMENEZ: Meanwhile, president -- Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelenskyy is planning to meet with President Trump's team next week in Saudi Arabia for negotiations to end the war.

Joining us now, CNN, political and national security analyst David Sanger. Good to see you, David.

I mean, I guess broadly, why does President Trump at this stage believe Russia may be easier to negotiate with -- than Ukraine?

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL AND NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, thanks for having me on Oscar. And I think the answer to your question is a pretty basic one.

He is still trying to bring the Ukrainians to heal after that meeting that blow up a little more than a week ago. And that answer that he gave you about Russia, I thought was kind of remarkable. What he basically said, these were attacks on civilians that were taking place, seems to have killed and injured more than 20.

And rather than condemn attacks on civilians, he said he is doing what anyone would do in this situation, which is to say, try to gain back as much land as he could prior to what looks to be a negotiation underway.

But remember, the threats that he made of sanctions against the Russians were pretty empty. We are sanctioning the Russians for just about everything now, since the war started three years ago. He threatened to put tariffs on their goods. There are almost no goods that the United States brings in from Russia.

JIMENEZ: That will be interesting to see how any of both the public comments affect coming up talks in, in Saudi Arabia between these sides.

I want to switch gears for a moment, because Trump also said he sent a letter to Iran, urging a nuclear deal. What else do we know about this letter? How is Iran responding?

SANGER: Well, this is really fascinating. It parallels something that the president did in the first term, where he actually, at one point, tried to talked to the Iranian president.

[07:35:04] So, viewed one way, the Iranians have since President Trump pulled out of the nuclear deal in 2018, dramatically increased their production of nuclear fuel. They are right up to the edge of being able to go off and make a bomb, but they haven't done that, that step.

So, he has written a letter that's basically said, hey, we're down to very little time here. Your choice is between a negotiated end of this and a military end of this.

He did not say, we believe we haven't seen the letter yet, whether or not that military action would be taken by Israel, by the United States, by some combination of the two.

The Iranian response is going to be really fascinating to watch, because a few weeks ago, the supreme leader, Ayatollah Khamenei, said that he would not engage with the United States, while it has Iran under what President Trump calls maximum sanctions.

But his president, the elected president who was elected last year to try to bring the economy back, has said I would engage in those conversations, but can't, because the supreme leader won't let us.

So, there's a fight on inside Iran about how to resolve this.

JIMENEZ: Yes.

SANGER: And a moment the Iranians are pretty exposed because the Israelis have taken out almost all their air defenses.

JIMENEZ: Yes, their capabilities, no doubt, much different than the outlook would have been even two years ago.

David Sanger, really appreciate the time and perspective.

SANGER: Great to be with you.

JIMENEZ: And still to come, the first jobs report of Trump's second term is here. There were solid gains, but deep federal cuts and rising layoffs are raising big questions. We'll talk about it coming up.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:41:40]

JIMENEZ: All right. It's been a wild ride this week in financial markets. The S&P 500 posted its worst week in six months, unemployment and a report on February job cuts, along with tariff uncertainty, rattled investors.

I want to bring in Rana Foroohar, CNN global economic analyst and Financial Times' global business columnist and associate editor.

So, look, the Challenger, Gray, Christmas, February jobs cut report showed a 103 percent increase in job cuts since February of last year. That's the highest February job loss total since 16 years ago during the Great Recession. Yesterday, we learned the economy added 151,000 jobs last month, only slightly lower than expected.

Can you just put these numbers into context for us?

RANA FOROOHAR, CNN GLOBAL ECONOMIC ANALYST: Yes, sure.

Let me start with a historical fact. You know, if you discount the quick downturn and upturn during COVID, that COVID blip, we're about six years overdue for a recession by historical standards.

So, to me, a slowdown was not unexpected. It doesn't matter who is in the White House. I would have been watching for a slowdown at this point.

But I got to say, Omar, the president smooths. You know, the up and down tariffs, back and forth. You know, some of the geopolitical turmoil that we're seeing, this doesn't help.

I'm talking to a lot of businesses that are saying, we are very much in a wait and see mode. I think investors are feeling the same. You know, money managers are thinking, oh my gosh, is the fundamental U.S. market story changing.

And then, there are other things that are happening. You know, you saw a few weeks ago, the downturn in U.S., tech stocks, after the Chinese A.I. company DeepSeek came out and seemed to be able to do a lot of what the big tech companies could do much more cheaply.

So, there are a lot of things happening right now. It's a -- it's going to be a tricky time.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, on that front, I mean, look, we are looking at the -- at the job cut numbers. Do you think that any of the DOGE related firings and layoffs -- I mean, are those even reflected at this point or not yet? How might we see that show up in the coming months?

FOROOHAR: Yes, that's a really interesting question. You know, Apollo, there's a private equity firm Apollo that put out a note recently, actually kind of raising this question, could these DOGE job cuts actually, you know, tip the economy? Could it -- could they -- could they add a tailwind to a slowdown that's already coming and potentially push us into recession?

I don't think that's happened yet. I mean, we're talking about cuts in the thousands, not in the millions. There is about 10 million federal workers out there.

If you started to see those numbers creep up into the hundreds of thousands in the millions, yes, absolutely, I would be -- I would be concerned, no question.

JIMENEZ: And you know, speaking of DOGE and Elon Musk who, of course, he's been heavily involved in your Financial Times' op-ed, seems to argue that Tesla's plummeting stock price, down more than 40 percent after post-election high, is reflective of more of a general decline of the U.S. electric vehicle market compared to China.

And more broadly, a drop in exceptionally strong U.S. tech stocks, which have driven a lot of the gains the last several quarters.

Can you just explain sort of your outlook on that front?

FOROOHAR: Yes, for sure. So, Tesla is facing a lot of competition from a company called BYD in China. That's a -- that's a company that has been working for years to produce very cheap electric vehicles.

[07:45:05]

They are doing a great job. Their market share has been rising. Their sales numbers are rising, whereas, this past year, Tesla had the first year on year sales drop.

This is compounded by the fact that Elon Musk has, you know, really hurt himself and his company in key markets.

JIMENEZ: Yes.

FOROOHAR: You know, the notion that he did what looked like a -- you know, a Nazi salute, did not go down well in Europe. You saw sales in Germany plummeting by 60 percent.

You know, the fact that some of what he's doing with DOGE, some of the really extreme political comments (INAUDIBLE) in the California market.

(CROSSTALK)

JIMENEZ: So, essentially, some of his actions -- sorry to jump in. Essentially, some of his actions might compound with some of the larger trends that we have seen.

Rana, I have to leave it there, unfortunately, but really appreciate your time and expertise. Thanks for being here.

FOROOHAR: Thank you.

JIMENEZ: All right. Just ahead, a proposed Missouri law could reward people for reporting undocumented immigrants. I spoke with a woman who fears for her family and her community. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[07:50:26]

JIMENEZ: As more states crack down on immigration, a bill before the Missouri State Senate wants to take it a step further. The proposal would offer people a thousand-dollar cash rewards for tips that lead to the arrest of undocumented immigrants.

The plan is sparking fear in the immigrant community there. Here is some of my latest reporting from Missouri.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ASHLEY CHAVARRIA, DAUGHTER OF UNDOCUMENTED IMMIGRANTS: You had to write a whole sentence.

JIMENEZ (voice over): Ashley Chavarria was born in the United States. She is an American citizen. Her parents are undocumented.

CHAVARRIA: That would probably never be able to repay them everything they have done for me.

JIMENEZ (voice over): She now lives near Jefferson City, Missouri, where she works with a Hispanic social service agency, often with the undocumented community in the area.

JIMENEZ: You've seen what's in this bill that they are trying to pass?

CHAVARRIA: Yes.

JIMENEZ: What was your reaction when you saw it?

CHAVARRIA: I feel like it's really hateful. It's actually, you know, going to put more fear into people and turn people against each other.

JIMENEZ (voice over): The bill in question is Missouri Senate Bill 72. Among what it would do, develop a statewide system, including a tip line to report undocumented immigrants, give a thousand-dollars to anyone who makes a tip that leads to an arrest, and create a certified bounty hunter program, where licensed bond agents can apply for the purpose of finding and detaining undocumented immigrants in the state after obtaining warrants.

JIMENEZ: How does it feel knowing there are people that want your parents out?

CHAVARRIA: They need to touch their heart and see who they actually pushing out.

They've been here for years, 30 -- over 30 years. They have put so much work into the economy here. I've never seen my parents asking for a handout.

JIMENEZ (voice over): Minutes away from her home is the state capitol building, where we went to find the senator who introduced the bill and learn why.

STATE SEN. DAVID GREGORY (R-MO): You know, I'm hearing things like, oh, this place is a bounty on people. No, it doesn't.

Just because we're dispatching bounty hunters after a warrant has been issued, is not a bounty, it's actually a reward system through a hotline.

JIMENEZ: It could create a situation where someone is confronting another person, because they believe that person is undocumented.

GREGORY: We have tip lines, thousands of tip lines across the entire country right now. Can they be abused? Yes. Do I think they'll be abused? Minimally, if at all.

When I'm hearing other types of harassment, concerns are things like normal, everyday citizens walking up and saying, hey, you, show me your papers. OK, that's illegal.

JIMENEZ (voice over): Another aspect of the bill, calls for life imprisonment without eligibility for probation or parole when undocumented immigrants are arrested.

GREGORY: This is life unless you're A, picked up through custody of ICE, or B, determined not to be dangerous.

JIMENEZ: Are you confident that it wouldn't lead to people staying in prison or jails longer than they need to?

GREGORY: There is some really good points brought up about, hey, life without the ability to parole, maybe we have the ability to parole, maybe we do a little bit less than life, and I'm open to that, because, again, at the end of the day, this is about catching dangerous, dangerous criminals, and holding them until our federal government does their job and deports them.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is not right.

JIMENEZ (voice over): The public comment on the bill went mostly like this.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It would incentivize discrimination.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These are people who came here simply to make a better life for their family.

JIMENEZ: When it was put forward in committee, there were a lot of people that spoke out against it. There is just one person, though, who spoke out for it.

RABBI ZE'VE SMASON, SUPPORTS LEGISLATION: I'm a rabbi. I'm not a policeman.

JIMENEZ: This rabbi.

SMASON: I admire individuals who undergo the difficulties and the challenges of becoming naturalized citizens by coming in, as I said, before the front door, I don't have sympathy for individuals who skip the line. That's not to say that at other areas of their lives, they are not good people.

JIMENEZ: Legally, Javad Khazaeli is expecting mistakes if this passes.

JAVAD KHAZAELI, IMMIGRATION AND CIVIL RIGHTS ATTORNEY: I spent the first 10 years of my career as ICE prosecutor. If they pushed this forward, we're just going to sue them, and we're going to win on things like this. Because they are going to start arresting people that they have no right to arrest. They are going to start detaining people that they have no right to detain.

JIMENEZ: Even the prospect of this bill is making some in and even close to the undocumented community nervous for what could come next.

CHAVARRIA: It did cost a lot of fear in these families. They think that once they step foot outside, they are going to be targeted.

JIMENEZ (voice over): To her, the stakes with this bill are people like her parents.

CHAVARRIA: Wait 20 minutes.

JIMENEZ: And with her kids, she sometimes struggles to explain this moment in a. American politics.

[07:55:02]

CHAVARRIA: They tell me that there -- the kids in school are, you know, they will scream, Trump, Trump, Trump, and you know, I tell them like, what? That's OK. It doesn't mean anything bad, but I do try to let them know, just to always be proud of who they are.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

JIMENEZ (on camera): Now, Ashley's family tells us her parents have work permits and are currently in the process of trying to legalize their status.

And then on the bill itself, the question is, will this pass? Well, the senator is definitely confident in its success. He told us, even if, the final language is tweaked.

But I should also note, we spoke to the State House speakers camp, which, of course, this would need to pass the House as well. The Speaker says he has not seen any enthusiasm for any "bounty hunter bill," as he described it. There was a similar bill put forward in Mississippi, that one was killed.

Meanwhile, the new CNN Original Series "TWITTER: BREAKING THE BIRD", brings you inside the story of a scrappy startup that shattered every rule, ignited a social revolution, and changed history. Don't miss "TWITTER: BREAKING THE BIRD" premier Sunday at 10:00 only on CNN. We'll be right back.

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