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Trump Targets College Accreditation Process in New Executive Order; President Trump Targets Colleges in New Executive Orders; High- Ranking Sen. Dick Durbin (D-IL) Announces Retirement. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired April 24, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[06:30:00]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everybody. I'm Audie Cornish, and I want to thank you for joining me on CNN This Morning. It is 33 minutes past the hour, and here's what's happening right now.

President Trump restarts the clock on tariff negotiations on Wednesday. He promised to bring new tariffs on countries that don't make a deal in two to three weeks. Today, Norway's prime minister will meet with the president in the oval to talk about tariffs, trade and much more.

Right now, in Vatican City, mourners are once again paying their respects to Pope Francis, the late pontiff now lying in state for a second day ahead of his funeral on Saturday.

President Trump, once again, looking to tighten federal control over higher ed. A newly signed executive order is now changing the process for how colleges and universities can access billions of dollars in federal student loans and Pell grants. Those grants are a big indirect revenue source for many schools.

And it's not just colleges in the crosshairs of the Trump administration. There's a new executive order this week eliminating what the White House calls, quote, school discipline-based on discriminatory and unlawful equity ideology at public schools.

[06:35:05]

They say the reason is child safety.

The target of the order is a 2014 Obama-era policy, which tried to balance out racial disparities in classroom discipline. President Trump's new order almost directly mirrors a proposal from Project 2025. That's a conservative think tank document that he tried to distance himself from on the campaign trail.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: Like some on the right, severe right, came up with this Project '25, and I don't even know. I mean, some of them, I know who they are.

They're seriously extreme, but I don't know anything about it. I don't want to know anything about it.

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CORNISH: On this topic, they seem to agree the project's authors blamed federal overreach for pushing racial parity over student safety, and then laid out recommended steps to roll back the policy.

Joining me now is David Graham. He's staff writer at The Atlantic. And I wanted to talk to him because he's the author of a new book, it's called The Project, How Project 2025 is Reshaping America.

David, I should just say people can't see in the picture your book is about this then compared to the actual Project 2025 document. And in it, you talk about basically the overlap and how it came to be. One of the things I found most interesting is that it was born out of Trump 1, right, where essentially the authors behind it felt like it wasn't a failure of Trump the first time around. It was sabotage. Can you talk more about that?

DAVID GRAHAM, STAFF WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: Yes. You know, many of them came through the first Trump administration. And they felt like when Trump came into office, he wasn't really prepared for the first a hundred days. He wasn't really prepared with a good staff. And so he had civil servants who were able to block him by sort of working the system, knowing the rules better than they did. And he had political appointees who weren't really on board with Trumpism were kind of just there for themselves, where they were sort of, you know, George W. Bush holdovers. So, they wanted to come in with his staff as much more prepared, and a plan to get a lot more things done in the second four years than they did in the first four years.

CORNISH: Would it have mattered who's the next Republican president?

GRAHAM: You know, they say they were -- they started working on this in 2023 -- or 2022, rather. They say that, you know, it was not intended to be specific to Trump. But it's hard to imagine another president being willing to do these things and driving them through in the same way. And so many of them, you know, are Trump loyalists themselves.

CORNISH: Project 2025 was a huge talking point for Democrats on the campaign trail. People might remember them sort of hauling out this big pretend cartoon-sized copy of it during the Democratic National Convention. Here's kind of like how they would talk about it.

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KENAN THOMPSON, COMEDIAN: Project 2025, you ever seen a document that could kill a small animal and democracy at the same time?

MALLORY MCMORROW, MICHIGAN STATE SENATE: They went ahead and wrote down all the extreme things that Donald Trump wants to do.

REP. JASON CROW (D-CO): Donald Trump's Project 2025 would abandon our troops, abandon our veterans, our allies, and our principles.

MALCOLM KENYATTA, PENNSYLVANIA STATE HOUSE: Usually, Republicans want to abandon books, but now they're trying to shove this down our throat.

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CORNISH: Obviously, voters still went for Donald Trump. And if we look at his cabinet now, there are many contributors to that project who actually have roles in the administration. Why do you think that this didn't breakthrough, so to speak, to voters as a, quote/unquote, concern?

GRAHAM: Yes. I mean, I think there are two things that happened. One is that Democrats talked a lot about specific policies in there, but there's just so much. I mean, you know, the two things you're talking about in education at the beginning here are examples of, you know, just -- it's hard to get into all that detail. But I don't think they talk about the broader scheme to really take over the executive branch and give the president all the power in these methodical ways. They treated it like a wish list.

But even when voters knew about these things, we found that they were -- polling found that they didn't like Project 2025, but they simply just didn't believe that Trump was really going to implement these policies. And, in fact, it's been a really good roadmap to many of the things that he has done.

CORNISH: David Graham, thanks so much for being here with me. And, of course, his book is called The Project How Project 2025 is Reshaping America.

Now, news overnight, crews in Ukraine's capital of Kyiv searching for survivors in the rubble. After a wave of Russian strikes, Ukraine says at least eight people are dead, more than 70 wounded. Meanwhile, President Trump once again going after Ukraine's president saying, quote, we're very close to a deal, but the man with no cards to play should now finally get it done.

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TRUMP: I think we have a deal with Russia. We have to get a deal with Zelenskyy, and I hope that Zelenskyy -- I thought it might be easier to deal with Zelenskyy. So far, it's been harder.

I have no favorites. I don't want to have any favorites. I want to have a deal done.

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[06:40:00]

CORNISH: So, sources say in the peace deal proposed by the U.S., it would recognize Russian control of Crimea, something that Ukraine's president wouldn't get on board with. Joining us for more, CNN's International Diplomatic Editor Nic Robertson. Nic, I have to talk about the timing here, right, right as the U.S. is saying time is running out, you don't have the cards, there is an attack on Ukraine. Can you talk about the context?

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, diplomatic pressure from the United States and military pressure from President Putin. The biggest onslaught on the capital, Kyiv, in, well, pretty much since last summer, a total of 70 missiles fired, 145 drones. Of those missiles, 11 of them were ballistic missiles. And why do I mention those? Because they're the ones that fly up really high, come down really fast. They're really hard for the Ukrainians to stop.

These are not, and I think it's totally important to emphasize this, these are not being fired at troops on the frontline. They're being fired at cities. So, yes, it is -- Putin appears to be trying to create a military and emotional effect on Ukrainians while President Trump is doubling down on Zelenskyy to cross Zelenskyy own red lines, which are Ukraine's red lines, constitutional red lines, and previously had been a red line for the United States as well, not to recognize Russian control over Crimea.

So, I think we get a sense of just how bad the strikes were last night, how much Zelenskyy is feeling. The city has literally cut short a trip to South Africa where he is only just sort of really touched down and arrived to head back to Kyiv. And last night, Zelenskyy was talking about how emotions were running high that really fills this morning to be an understatement.

CORNISH: This peace deal or peace process, fragile at best.

ROBERTSON: It really is. You know, and it's not just Ukraine. I mean, look at this from the European perspective that supports Ukraine and thinks that Ukraine's sovereignty is important. And, of course, Ukraine's sovereignty includes not handing off and rewarding President Putin's aggression with a territorial gain of Crimea, which is important to Russia because that they have very important naval facilities there. That is actually Ukrainian territory.

The United States allies' don't believe in handing that off to Russia. It would, they believe, encourage Putin to attack more again in the future, which they believe would make Europe less safe. So, this isn't just the division we're talking about here, between what President Trump believes it should happen and what Ukraine and President Zelenskyy believes should happen. It's a division, it appears, because we don't have all the details, it appears, between the United States and its biggest military allies and the world's strongest military defense pact. Secretary General for that NATO is in Washington today.

CORNISH: CNN's Nic Robertson in London, thank you so much.

Still to come on CNN this morning, a wildfire spreading across Southern New Jersey. We're also going to have the latest on that fire and more importantly, the efforts to contain it as weather conditions improve. Plus, thank you for quitting. Ahead, why many Democrats are celebrating the retirement of one of the party's longest serving leaders? Work on the group chat after this.

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[06:45:00]

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How much pain can Harvard absorb here?

ALAN GARBER, HARVARD PRESIDENT: We don't know how much we can actually absorb, but what we do know is that we cannot compromise on basic principles, like defense of our First Amendment rights,

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CORNISH: the Trump administration is taking another step to exact control over institutions of higher learning. He signed several new executive orders Wednesday. One involves the financial ties that colleges have with foreign donors, and another targets the process that decides what schools can access in terms of billions of dollars in federal money.

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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want to focus on results. We want to focus on actual fairness. We want to focus on merit, not things like disparate impact theory and the whole sort of diversity, equity, and inclusion cult.

TRUMP: They're allowing people into school, they can't do math. And yet kids who've worked really hard and in number one in their class, in a high school someplace in New Jersey or in Mississippi, they can't get into the best schools. What is that all about?

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CORNISH: Joining me now is CNN Senior Political Analyst Ron Brownstein. So, Ron, good morning, yes. Thank you for coming in here in person.

So, I actually want to play for you something that Alan Garber said. He's the president of Harvard. We've been talking about them so much, but he finally did an interview with NBC. Here's how he talked about what's at stake.

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GARBER: What's a risk is the excellence of higher education in the United States, and in particular, the research mission of many of our universities, which played such a vital role in the U.S. economy and in the health and wellbeing of the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP) CORNISH: Harvard famously has a $53 billion endowment. They can take the hit. But what point are they trying to make here?

RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: You know, it's really striking. President Trump is saying the economic competition with China is so imperative that every American should pay significantly more for pretty much everything they buy every day, toys, clothes, et cetera. And at the same time, he is going after what has been the foundation of our technological strategy really since Sputnik in the 50s.

[06:50:03]

You know, the federal government -- sometimes we've heard from the White House press secretary the argument that universities don't deserve public funding. The public funding for universities for research is not some favor we're doing for the universities. The federal government for more than half a century has been relying on them to deliver a service to the country and the public.

CORNISH: So, you're talking about this pipeline that goes research to the private sector, to the industry, to us.

BROWNSTEIN: Right, yes. I mean, and medical and industries that have built around these research universities, in fact, acting as the sun around which all of these clusters of innovation develop, whether it's biotech in Boston, medical technology in Madison, Valley Silicon.

You know, there are -- if you look at the a hundred counties that generate the most GDP in the country, roughly 45 of them have a research university that is among also the top 100 of federal recipients of federal research grants. That's 1.5 percent of all the counties in the U.S. It's more than a third of our total economic output is generated in those counties. So, when they are targeting these research universities, it's not just kind of a bunch of snooty academics who may pay the cost. It's the parts of the country that are both driving our domestic economic growth and are central to our international economic competitiveness.

CORNISH: One of the reasons why I wanted to talk to you is because you have been looking at it economically and down at the level with the rest of us, right? Because we don't all live near Harvard, some of us just live through near a state college and you know, whatever research or benefits that are conveyed through that. You've also been looking at Medicaid and healthcare and the effects of some potential changes from Republicans who want to roll back Obama-era Medicaid expansions.

I recall from covering Congress that there were actually quite a few states, red states, that ended up taking advantage of this. So, what can you tell us again, what does it mean at the district level in our towns and neighborhoods?

BROWNSTEIN: Yes. Well, first of all, there's a lot of things going on, but I think if you're thinking about what Congress does, this is going to be the legislative fight that has the biggest impact on the 2026 election. The idea that Republicans are going to advance one big bill that is likely to assert, to cut taxes in a way that primarily benefits the affluent and pay for it in part by cutting programs that benefit the middle and working class. That has been a toxic combination in the past.

Medicaid is the biggest pot of money available to them. And what they are zeroing in on is the expansion of Medicaid. The Affordable Care Act allowed states to expand Medicaid eligibility to more --

CORNISH: And states took advantage.

BROWNSTEIN: The states --

CORNISH: Thank you.

BROWNSTEIN: 20 million people are now getting coverage through the Medicaid expansion. But the ten states that never expanded Medicaid, 40 states did, ten states did not. Those ten states are red-leaning states. Those ten states already alone account for 40 percent of all the Republicans in Congress.

So, for Republicans, it may seem like an easy target to go after this expansion, but what I was able to show with data from KFF, which is the think tank on cnn.com, 32 Republican House members represent districts where there are more people receiving care through -- coverage through the Medicaid expansion than nationally. There are 14 where there are at least 80,000 people alone in their district. In Mike Johnson's district in Louisiana, 117,000 people are receiving coverage specifically through the ACA's Medicaid expansion, 6.8 million total in Republican-held districts.

So, there is simply -- you know, they may feel that blue targets are kind of the center of -- blue states or the center of the target here, but there is no way for them to do this without directly affecting the healthcare access of a lot of their own voters. And, by the way, the Medicaid expansion's even more important in rural than urban areas, which are now reliably ruby red.

That is a fight to come. Ron Brownstein, thank you so much for this reporting sooner. I really appreciate it.

It is now 53 minutes past the hour. One more morning roundup, things you need to know to get your day going. Live now, we want to show you St. Peter's Basilica at the Vatican where thousands of Catholics are streaming in to view the body of Pope Francis. The late pontiff is lying in state in the historic church until his funeral on. Saturday,

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CATHERINE CANING, SISTERS OF THE SACRED HEART: We were so lucky to be able to pray near his body and it was really full of emotion.

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CORNISH: The Vatican says over 19,000 people lined up to pay their respects to the pope on Wednesday. And today is Holocaust Remembrance Day. In just a few moments, at the top of the hour, actually 80 Holocaust survivors will walk the nearly two miles from Auschwitz to Birkenau in Poland in observance of the day. They will be joined by ten hostages who are held by Hamas and families of those still in captivity, along with Israel's president.

[06:55:03]

And the wildfire in New Jersey, it spread to more than 20 square miles. Officials say the fire is now at least 50 percent contained. Weather conditions are looking more favorable this morning, and the state's acting governor says that there have been no deaths, thankfully, related to the fire.

FEMA is expected to lose a thousand workers to DOGE cuts just ahead of hurricane season. Sources telling CNN that as much as 20 percent of its staff are expected to take the Trump administration's buyout offer.

Separately, the White House denied Arkansas' request for federal funding following a tornado outbreak that killed more than 40 people across three states. The Trump administration telling Arkansas Republican Governor Sarah Huckabee Sanders that state and local governments could pay for the recovery themselves along with the help of volunteer groups.

And the second ranking Senate Democrat, Illinois Senator Dick Durbin is retiring at the end of next year. His plans triggering questions about who might replace him, both in leadership and his Senate seat. Durbin is 80 years old, and age has become one of the big questions for Democrats.

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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When you had people that are above 90, when you have people that are like mid-80s. Running the show or I don't even think there's a running -- I think they're like just pushing the show at this point, it's like, when do we say as American people, hey, we don't want to pay the salary anymore, like we don't we cannot. You have to go home.

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CORNISH: Group chat is back lalahalder77 just said it, just said it out there,

EVAN MCMORRIS-SANTORO, AUTHOR, NOTUS MORNING NEWSLETTER: Pushing the show.

CORNISH: I just want to --

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: It's changed my entire world.

CORNISH: Okay, so notice, of course, had this scoop about this fight over David Hogg. Before I get to that, I want you to talk about this because there was this element of the former Parkland activist, he now has a role in the party saying, look, I'm going to start leaning in and pushing this thing about new youthful. And I actually -- I remember getting texts from some Democratic operatives that were like, what a jerk. Like they were like mad at him. Tell me why.

HYMA MOORE, FORMER CHIEF OF STAFF TO DNC CHAIR JAIME HARRISON: Two things can be true. And so, look, I don't have a problem with David Hogg, but I do think that, you know, Democrats do need new leadership and the new younger people in the party, but I don't think David Hogg understands that process.

CORNISH: I heard that loud and clear.

MOORE: He's not been around for a long time. He does not understand the Democratic Party. And I'm happy that he's vice chair because I do think that new voices are important. But he's got to be a little bit more cautious in how he's approaching this. Not because the old guard because it's because he doesn't know what he's doing.

CORNISH: Okay. What have you heard when you tried to figure out what was going on?

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: Well, my colleagues, Katherine Swartz and Alice (ph) already scooped this morning actually, that there's going to be a conference call the Democratic conference call today, in which they're going to lay down the law with David Hogg and say to him, yes, look, you either do your project to primary our candidates or you get to be DNC Vice chair, but not both.

CORNISH: Oh, interesting.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO And it's actually quite a fascinating turn because look, this is a huge problem for this party to figure out what to do to get new blood in, right? I mean, you talk about the idea of Dick Durban retiring now in this moment with the Senate mapped the way it is and how it might scramble thing, make it harder for Democrats to keep that -- or to win more seats in that House, right? This is because they hang on people for a really long time, right?

CORNISH: Well, in fairness, it's Bernie Sanders who's drawing crowds. It's Elizabeth Warren who goes out there giving very punchy interviews.

MCMORRIS-SANTORO: But Bernie Sanders is going around with AOC with him too. He's bringing somebody younger --

CORNISH: You think that helps? I feel like he would've drawn that crowd anyway.

MCMORISS-SANTOR: But, I mean, like he's trying to open the door up, right? I mean the question is this is the DNC saying to the younger people, we're closing the door.

CORNISH: All right. Let me --

ERIN MAGUIRE, FORMER COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, NEVER BACK DOWN PAC: I love it so much though. The David Hogg of all of it, and now the Democrats are -- oh my gosh, I love it. It's like housewives out and they're leaking to the press to be like, David, prepare yourself, we're going to yell at you later today. It's like the Joe, the, you know, renouncing Jojo says, it's too little, too late. Like you can't change it now, Democrats. The arsonist is in the house next to the firefighters.

CORNISH: Okay. But here's the thing. I remember sitting in panels where Republicans were just like, Trump, come on, no, Trumpists, come on, no. We got all these people. They're all -- I mean, yes. You were working with DeSantis, right, at one point. So, the idea that you can have as someone who comes out of nowhere, not in the system and is aggressive, like there's a model now

MAGUIRE: There's AOC, right? She came out of nowhere, right? Her ads were about her being a waitress and a bartender, and, yes, she came out of nowhere. There's nothing wrong with fresh blood. That's not the problem. The problem with David Hogg is, and this would be a problem for Republicans too, if we elected a vice chair and their immediate position was, hey, I'm going to primary our members. I saw Ryan's previous talk about it. That's $20 million you're taking away from the party, against the party. It's just -- it doesn't make sense.

I understand wanting fresh blood, but to your point, the caution he needs to take and how he approaches this instead of just trying to blow it all up. This really could backfire.

CORNISH: This is going to be a very interesting moment, you guys.

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We talked about a lot today. Thank you so much. Group chat was lit.

I want to thank you all for waking up with us. I'm Audie Cornish. We've got more news headlines, especially, of course, out of the Vatican.

CNN News Central starts right now.