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Ken Gray is Interviewed about the Firefighter Ambush in Idaho; Musk Rips Trump-Backed Agenda; Chuck Freilich is Interviewed about Iran; Alyse Adamson is Interviewed about the Combs Trial; Tillis Not Seeking Re-election. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired June 30, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[06:30:00]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Dead, more than five hours later.

And it all began when the sheriff's office received a call about a brush fire on Canfield Mountain. They now believe that the suspect set the fire on purpose to lure fire crews there.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SHERIFF BOB NORRIS, KOOTENAI COUNTY, IDAHO: We do believe that the -- that the suspect started the fire. And we do believe that it was an ambush, and it was intentional. And, yes, we -- we do believe that he started it and it was totally intentional what he did.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Investigators say the fire, which is now contained, still burning, was approaching the suspect's body when they found him dead. And they were then forced to move the body. They believe he acted alone.

Joining me now to discuss, former FBI Special Agent Ken Gray.

Ken, thanks for being with us this morning. And I want to start with the sheriff saying that they believe he was a lone gunman. Investigators are now going to be looking into his background. What do you think they'll be looking for?

KEN GRAY, FORMER FBI SPECIAL AGENT: Good morning, Audie. Glad to be with you.

So, the tactical aspect of this case is over. Now they are moving over into the investigation phase and evidence collection phase. And when they are looking to see who he is, what he's about to try to build a complete picture of who the shooter was.

CORNISH: We mentioned earlier that they had to remove the suspect's body. I want you to take a listen to a little bit more from the sheriff on that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) SHERIFF BOB NORRIS, KOOTENAI COUNTY, IDAHO:: We scooped up that body. And as far as the preservation of the scene, you know, it's not perfect in this particular situation, but it's something that had to be done. So, you have to evaluate each particular circumstance. And this time -- at this time we felt like, since the fire was approaching, we needed to scoop up that body.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Should there be any concerns about that? You could hear the sheriff sounding -- kind of explaining, look, this is why we had to do it.

GRAY: Well, extraordinary situations require extraordinary means. And if the body had been left in place and the fire had moved to the -- totally moved into that area, any evidence that was there would have been burned up. So, moving the body was a good move in this case.

Additionally, since the shooter is dead, there's not going to be a prosecution of the shooter. And so, preservation of evidence is very important, but it is not the most important thing in this case. I think probably the right move at this point. But nonetheless, were this to go to trial, that would be an issue.

CORNISH: All right, Ken Gray, thank you so much for speaking with us.

GRAY: Thank you.

CORNISH: I want to turn back now to the president's spending bill because there's yet another issue holding it up. Over the weekend, Senate Republicans added a provision that would place a new tax on wind and solar farms. It also scales back federal support for renewable energy projects.

It's a move drawing fresh criticism from former first buddy and Trump senior adviser Elon Musk. So, in a post on X Musk called the bill "utterly insane and destructive," saying "it gives handouts to industries of the past."

The back and forth isn't exactly new, because if you remember when both Trump and Musk were going at it over just a few weeks ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Look, Elon and I had a great relationship. I don't know if we will anymore. I was surprised because you were here. Everybody in this room practically was here as we had a wonderful sendoff. He said wonderful things about me. You couldn't have nicer.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: And the group chat is back.

The reason why I was playing that tape is because back then Musk sort of -- Trump sort of implied that Musk was maybe mad that his -- his industries weren't benefiting.

ZOLAN KANNO-YOUNGS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "NEW YORK TIMES": Right.

CORNISH: And then we see this comment referring to industries of the past.

Can you talk about who else might be upset at this? Who might -- what other lawmakers might see this as a problem?

KANNO-YOUNGS: Yes. I -- I remember writing shortly after Trump came into office, there was a group of House Republicans that sent a letter to the incoming Trump administration. It was basically like, look, we heard what you said about these tax credits that would, you know, basically support clean energy. And we heard you say that you're going to unwind them wholesale, right? But there were some Republicans that were like, this isn't just about the climate and the environment. This is about manufacturing jobs. And now we got to go back to our voters and talk about why this company that previously was going to invest in our county might not because there's this uncertainty around these tax credits, right?

CORNISH: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: So, it wasn't really just about the environment for some Republicans. You're seeing them also now nervous about having to go back and explain why this money, these jobs might not be there. (INAUDIBLE).

CORNISH: Yes, it was interesting. I was looking at a map where there were schools that were doing solar installations.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Yes.

[06:35:01]

CORNISH: That -- and it's -- it's not just like an East Coast thing and California or something like that. I mean you look at these states where schools have been in the midst of doing these projects or planning to.

Noel, what do you see in this attempt?

NOEL KING, CO-HOST AND EDITORIAL DIRECTOR, "TODAY, EXPLAINED" PODCAST: This is a very weird economic move, right? Elon Musk, say what you will about him, he really does care about the future of energy and the future in many ways, right? And he's making a really fair point. The -- this bill appears to be prizing old forms of energy over this new green revolution, which everybody (ph) exists, whether they want it or not.

Clean energy is a big business. And it was interesting to read in "The Times" this morning, the president of the Chamber of Commerce coming out and saying, look, taxing energy is just -- it's not something we should be doing.

CORNISH: But I remember when Trump was in the White House with like coal workers behind him,

KING: Yes.

CORNISH: I mean, is this another kind of like, your base, who you're catering to, versus where you put your money?

STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN POLITICS SENIOR REPORTER: Well, I also remember Trump's campaign speeches when he meanders into this routine about how windmills are killing birds and everything else.

CORNISH: It's weave. It's a weave, Stephen Collinson, OK.

COLLINSON: Yes. OK. So -- but I think you're right that this is ideological rather than economic.

CORNISH: Yes.

COLLINSON: The problem with it is, is whatever you think about climate change, whether humanity is contributing to it, the green energy revolution is taking place in terms of industry. And this is going to really set back the U.S. against competitors in Europe and especially China.

There's one, I think, provision of this amendment, which says that taxes will rise on green energy projects -- products unless they get rid of all the components that are made in China.

CORNISH: Yes.

COLLINSON: I mean if you introduce that across the economy, and that would be absurd. So, I think this shows how it's discriminating here against this (INAUDIBLE).

KANNO-YOUNGS: And we talk about squaring with the base too, just again. These -- most of the funding from these tax credits went to red states, right?

CORNISH: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: So, there's kind of the squaring it with the base on the ideological sense. But when it comes to the money and the jobs, a lot of this was actually benefiting his supporters.

CORNISH: And then, so we'll be keeping an eye on certain lawmakers too who care a lot about energy. Alaska's Lisa Murkowski, Jerry Moran of Kansas and others.

You guys, thanks for talking about this. We've got a lot more to get to in this half hour.

I want to shift gears to the corruption trial of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. It turns out he has a pretty influential supporter in President Trump.

A hearing in this long running case against Netanyahu was scheduled for this week. It was delayed again shortly after Trump took to Truth Social, calling for Israeli prosecutors to "let Bibi go." And it's all raising questions about whether political pressure, both foreign and domestic, could be at play in Israeli -- in Israel's judicial process.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BILL CLINTON, FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT: Mr. Netanyahu has long wanted to fight Iran because that way he can stay in office forever and ever. I mean he's been there most of the last 20 years. But I think we should be trying to defuse it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: And following Israel's strikes on Iran, Netanyahu is said to be focusing his efforts on the release of the remaining hostages in Gaza. So, how much of the prime minister's focus is on governing versus surviving both legally and politically?

Joining us now for more on this is former Israeli Deputy National Security Advisor Chuck Freilich.

Chuck, welcome to the program.

CHUCK FREILICH, PROFESSOR, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY: Thank you.

CORNISH: First, I -- I want to go back to something, which is that we heard from the IAEA chief over the weekend because there's been some back and forth over whether Israel and U.S. accomplish their objectives with those recent military strikes. I want you to take a listen.

Ah, no worries. So, we don't have that, but there's this debate we've been having in the U.S. about how much damage there was. How is this actually playing out in Israel? Do people see this as a 12-day war, or do they see it as more to accomplish?

FREILICH: Well, this isn't the end of the story. That's clear. The Iranian nuclear program has not been completely destroyed. But I do think, based on the information that I have, that a great deal was accomplished. The three primary nuclear sites that the U.S. attacked were either fully put out of operation, at least two of them, and the third one, Fordow, probably. So, I think this was quite successful. And, of course, Israel hit these and other targets as well.

The only -- or the -- the critical question now is whether Iran has secret enrichment and conversion facilities to convert the uranium gas back into a hard metal to make the actual bomb core. Now, is it possible that they do? Yes. No one knows for sure. But I think what we saw in this war was that Iran is so deeply penetrated by both American and Israeli intelligence that the likelihood is quite low.

[06:40:07]

And if that's the case, then we have probably gained, not a knockout blow, but a few year postponement.

CORNISH: Has the success of this military mission made Netanyahu untouchable in a way? We hear that this hearing for this corruption trial has been delayed. You have Trump weighing in. We know he's very popular in Israel. Can you talk about how the dynamic may or may not have changed for Netanyahu?

FREILICH: Well, there's no doubt that this strengthens his position politically. This is something that he has really made his life work for the last 20 or more years. And he correctly deserves credit in the same way that I, for example, and others demanded that he be held to account for the catastrophic failure of October 7th. He deserves credit for a very successful operation here.

The electoral question is how many votes will be shifted from the pro- Netanyahu camp, the coalition, and how many -- how many will come from the center and from those people in the right-wing part of the coalition? I think we've -- what we've seen from the polls already is that from within the right wing there is a clear movement towards him. But the number of votes that will swing from the center, which is what he needs to really be able to come back, so far at least the number is very small.

CORNISH: We've heard from some people that there's the potential for him to call, let's say, a snap election. Earlier we played that clip of Bill Clinton basically saying that Netanyahu wants to be in power for as long as possible. Are any -- any of those things looking more and more plausible in the next few months?

FREILICH: Well, he may decide to call snap elections if the polls show that it's to his advantage. Otherwise, he still has -- the elections must be held by November 2026. And of course, he can move them up if he thinks it's to his advantage.

I think we have to differentiate here between two very important things. One is, there is no doubt that Netanyahu wants to stay in power forever. He is a politician. He wants to be re-elected. And he particularly wants to be re-elected because he believes that he can use the office of prime minister to potentially derail a -- the trial completely and at least get a plea bargain or something like that out of it.

But at the same time, there is a second truth, a strategic truth, which was that Iran was very close to the ability to break out to a bomb. Theres's intelligence that's been gathered in the last few minutes -- months showing that they renewed the capability to break out rapidly. They were also trying to ramp up from something like 2,500 ballistic missiles today, to close to 9,000 within a period of two to three years. So, Israel had overwhelming reasons for wanting to do this now.

CORNISH: That's Chuck Freilich, former Israeli deputy national security advisor.

Thank you for being with us.

FREILICH: Thank you.

CORNISH: Straight ahead on CNN THIS MORNING, they've heard from nearly three dozen witnesses. Now the jury is about to begin deliberating the fate of Sean Diddy Combs.

Plus Alligator Alcatraz. Why so many people are protesting plans to build an immigrant detention center in the Florida everglades.

And we'll have more from the group chat after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:48:06]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Marc, how do you feel?

COMBS' ATTORNEY: Let's go, let's go.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Sean "Diddy" Combs' attorney ready to go.

We are now just hours away from deliberations in the trial of the rap mogul. After hearing from 34 witnesses over a span of six weeks, it will now be up to the jury to decide Combs' fate. On Friday, the jury heard from the defense one final time in a four-hour closing argument that was, at times, almost mocking the evidence against their client, arguing, quote, "boxes of Astroglide, taken off the streets, woo! I feel better already," lead defense attorney Marc Agnifilo said. Adding that "the streets of America are safe from the Astroglide."

Prosecutors, however, got the last word, the final rebuttal to lay out their sprawling RICO case, and they ended with this, quote, "the defendant is not a god. He's a person. And in this courtroom, he stands equal before the law. Overwhelming evidence proves his guilt. It's time to hold him accountable and find him guilty."

So, joining us now to discuss, Alyse Adamson, former federal prosecutor.

Alyse, welcome back, after many weeks of talking about this.

ALYSE ADAMSON, HOST, "AT-LYSE YOU HEARD IT HERE" PODCAST: Yes.

CORNISH: First, can we go back to the mocking and the sarcasm? I have to assume they felt that after watching the jury for all this weeks, something like that would fly. Can you talk about the thinking there?

ADAMSON: Yes, no, I agree with you. You have to read your jury. And Marc Agnifilo is a very experienced attorney. So, he knew what he was doing.

I think what he was trying to do there was just inject this feeling of unseriousness. Like, what are we doing here? Like, what --

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: What are we talking about? Sex trafficking or RICO. Your -- your evidence is Astroglide. It's trying to undermine all of the government's case. Just like the --

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: The idea that this is some serious racketeering conspiracy. I think it might backfire, Audie, because this is also a case about sexual violence. And even if the jury might have agreed with some of the defense points, we -- there's no question that Cassie Ventura and Jane were victimized here.

[06:50:03]

So, I understand what he was doing. Not sure how it landed.

CORNISH: Meanwhile, the prosecution, in a way, has leaned into seriousness, right? They've taken away the charges that were just attempted arson or attempted kidnaping. What have they done instead?

ADAMSON: That's right. And I think that is so key to understand. There was a lot of reporting last week that the government had dropped charges. They didn't.

In a RICO conspiracy, the jury must find two predicate racketeering acts. That just means the jury needs to find that Sean Combs and his enterprise committed to underlying crimes. The government had charged a ton of crimes here. I think ten. Call those completed substantive crimes. But it also charged their attempted version, which is the lesser included offenses. So, kidnaping, for instance. They charge kidnaping. Remember, Capricorn Clark taken from her apartment at gunpoint. They also charged attempted kidnaping. So, what the government decided to do was take the attempted crimes off the table because it's kind of confusing to explain to a jury.

CORNISH: To the jury, yes.

ADAMSON: Like, they kidnaped, but they also attempted to kidnap. So, they wanted to streamline it. And so it would make it easier for the jury to deliberate on the important stuff, which is those completed offenses that the government believes that they proved.

CORNISH: So, that leads me to the judicial instructions. People may recall from their TV watching that this is when the judge turns and says, here's what you've got to think about. How critical is that? And are you expecting anything in particular from this judge?

ADAMSON: So, the jury instructions are so key. They are a very critical part of a trial, and they're a part of a trial that doesn't get as much airtime, right? It's not as sexy as like the big, opening statements.

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: But it's important because what the judge is going to do today is explain to the jury what the law is. What is the legal standard? What are the charges that have been brought in this case? Obviously, the defense and the prosecution have framed that up. But only the judge can actually tell the jury. And finally, what the government must have established beyond a

reasonable doubt to find Combs guilty. And if you remember, there was an hour's long charging conference last Wednesday. That's when both sides were hashing out what the judge was going to tell the jury the law was. Legal interpretations changed. That's why we have case law. And how the law is interpreted could be more favorable to one side or the other. So, both sides wanted to convince the judge, no, no, no, you got to see it my way.

CORNISH: Yes.

ADAMSON: So, coercion, for instance, that's going to be very important for the judge to explain.

And then sex trafficking. What they are going to -- what the judge is going to instruct the jury is that they don't even need to have completed it. It's just that Combs was intending to traffic Cassie. And that is very key when it comes to that 2016 incident that was caught on video at the Intercontinental Hotel. And when the jury -- when the judge explains that to the jury, they might be more inclined to convict on those facts, understanding that it didn't have to be completed.

CORNISH: This is a lot resting on this jury.

ADAMSON: A ton. A ton. I mean, there's so much evidence. Seven weeks. And there are questions. And so, it is very hard to read the tea leaves. I know everybody wants predictions, but it's very difficult to do that.

CORNISH: What's -- yes. I don't try and predict what the jury --

ADAMSON: No, never.

CORNISH: Not on a case like this.

Alyse Adamson, former federal prosecutor. She's host of the "At-lyse You Heard It" podcast. Check that out.

OK, it is now 52 minutes past the hour. Here's your morning roundup.

Canada is now backing down on its threat to tax digital services in the U.S., like online companies. This comes after President Trump threatened to cancel trade talks with our neighbor to the north, calling the tax egregious. Trump and Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney have agreed to resume negotiations with hopes of signing a deal by July 21st.

And today several witnesses in the Bryan Kohberger murder trial will appear for a hearing. A Pennsylvania judge is set to decide whether their testimony stands up, and if they should be compelled to travel to Idaho for the trial starting in August. It's unclear how they fit into the case. Kohberger is accused of fatally stabbing four Idaho students last year.

And the immigration detention facility dubbed "Alligator Alcatraz" set to open tomorrow. Over the weekend, protesters lined up near the construction site, arguing the facility is a threat to the endangered species in Everglades National Park. President Trump is actually expected at the opening.

And Senator Thom Tillis took a stand and then took his medicine. The North Carolina Republican announcing he will not seek re-election next year, one day after publicly declaring his opposition to President Trump's sweeping agenda bill.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): It is inescapable that this bill, in its current form, will betray the very promise that Donald J. Trump made in the Oval Office or in the cabinet room when I was there with Finance, where he said, we can go after waste, fraud and abuse on any programs.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Senator Tillis says he is very concerned about the bill's cuts to Medicaid and the impact that will have on his constituents.

[06:55:00]

President Trump calling Tillis' decision not to seek re-election "great news."

The group chat is back.

I believe the president has also talked about people going against this bill as a betrayal, which is pretty strong language. But it's -- I was just talking to Senator Lisa Murkowski last year -- last week. She's a Republican from Alaska. And I asked her what it means to go against the president in these moments.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. LISA MURKOWSKI (R-AK): Maybe there are people who are willing to be that voice in the middle, even if it means that, you know, you're -- you're -- you're roadkill in the middle. That's what happens when you stand in the middle of the road.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: It felt like Tillis was playing that out a bit.

KING: He is in a position that feels absolutely deranged to me, where he really does seem to be concerned about what Medicaid cuts are going to do for the people who voted for him and for Donald Trump. And I think he's not seeing a way around that. There is no fix here other than to vote no and, as you said, take his medicine.

CORNISH: And hit the exits, which I, kind of over the years, probably the last decade, we've seen this purge of people who -- it's not even the middle anymore. It's just, if you can't handle the heat of Trump. KANNO-YOUNGS: Or if you show any hint of dissent against Trump, then

there might not be room for you in this current version of the Republican Party. You have to fall in line here. And here you see a senator saying that he's pretty much had enough of that.

CORNISH: Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: And that it won't be a means to any kind of bipartisan work.

CORNISH: I think Tillis responded, "thanks for the retirement wishes, Mr. President. Looking forward to working with you on a successful 2026."

And I thought that was interesting, him just kind of like giving up the goat (ph). Someone said that his tie was a YOLO BOLO. I can't unhear that.

COLLINSON: You know, this feels like it was a slow boil and suddenly the lid has just blown off. There's been some occasions where Tillis has been prepared to criticize the president, and he's fallen back in line. He's not one of the sort of Liz Cheney Republicans --

CORNISH: Right.

COLLINSON: Who went and sought confrontation from the president.

CORNISH: Or even a Murkowski, who people are always like, are you going to vote for this? Are you going to vote for this?

COLLINSON: Right. Yes. And she has her own particular political constituency in Alaska, which is quite unique to her.

I think the question here is going to be interesting is what this means for the midterms and that seat.

CORNISH: Yes. So, we should say, there's a lot of people already lined up, potential candidates for that seat, including Pat Harrigan, who I believe might be a Navy SEAL. He's a Republican. And then also former Governor Roy Cooper, a Democrat.

COLLINSON: Yes. And potentially even Lara Trump, the president's daughter-in-law, might be in the frame for that one. We just came off a governor's race where the Republicans chose Lieutenant Governor Robinson, who was a very Trumpy, quite problematic candidate, and they lost that race. The question is, does Tillis' movement here, does that reflect the critical bloc of thinking in North Carolina that could really reshape this this -- this Senate race, or is it just a -- a personal thing?

CORNISH: Yes.

COLLINSON: But it's going to be very close. I think the Democrats especially think, if they can get Roy Cooper, who has a history of winning Republican independent votes there, to run, they -- they'll think this is a, you know, in a very difficult year, this actually might be a winner. We'll see.

CORNISH: North Carolina is always an interesting state to watch in these elections.

Because it's Monday and because it's the summer, this is usually where some new -- news editor says, like, ah, it will be a slow week, thus cursing the week for the rest of us because then there's a lot of news. So, I want to ask you guys what you are looking ahead to in our last few minutes.

Noel, let's start with you. What are you keeping an eye on?

KING: I mean, it was a last week story, but it's also a this week story. Zohran Mamdani winning in New York and what that means for the Democrats. This guy is everywhere. And he is charismatic on camera. He is still --

CORNISH: He is. I have to show "The New York Post" on this.

KING: "The New York Post" is melting down.

CORNISH: "Zohran so far away." It's -- yes.

KING: So, I'm going to -- I'm going to keep my eyes fixed on him for a couple more days. Through this week, I think.

CORNISH: Yes. OK.

KANNO-YOUNGS: We published an investigation today that's a follow up on this investigative series we've been doing on the Trump administration's embrace of President Bukele and El Salvador. What we found is that in order for Trump to deport those around 200 Venezuelans to a terrorism prison in El Salvador, that the Trump administration had to throw in a sweetener, and that's actually agreeing to hand over high-ranking MS-13 gang members that were already in U.S. custody, already had been investigated, to Bukele. Both administrations say these people will face justice. However, investigators have told us, hey, this actually undermines U.S. law enforcement efforts and kind of cracks through --

CORNISH: Right. We went through the whole process with them. Yes.

KANNO-YOUNGS: Right, we went through this process. It kind of cracks through this image of a law and order president looking to see the fallout of that relationship.

CORNISH: Stephen, last minute to you.

COLLINSON: I'm looking to see what more seeps out about these attacks on Iran, whether there is an honest assessment inside the administration of the intelligence. We're seeing outside indications, perhaps from the IAEA and some other indicators that perhaps they weren't as successful as the president said.

[07:00:05] Is the administration now going to make policy based on what actually they find out what happens, or is this going to be skewed because the president has so much invested in them being a massive success and the nuclear program being obliterated?

CORNISH: Yes, it's funny. I'm -- I'm going to be watching both Trump and Netanyahu and the supreme leader of this triptych (ph).

COLLINSON: Right.

CORNISH: Who comes out? What do they say? I think there's more conversation there.

Thank you to the group chat. We talked about a lot today. Appreciate you guys.

I'm Audie Cornish, and CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.