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Trump Backs Release of Epstein Files. Marjorie Taylor Greene Apologizes; U.S. to Designate Venezuelan Cartel as Terrorist; Mark Jerrell is Interviewed about CBP in North Carolina. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired November 17, 2025 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:30:31]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Good morning, everybody. I'm Audie Cornish. I want to thank you for joining me on CNN THIS MORNING. It's half past the hour. And here's what's happening right now.

Operation Charlotte's Web. Customs and Border Patrol agents arrest more than 80 people on the first day of the crackdown in North Carolina. The governor there says officials are targeting people of color and arresting them in churches and stores.

And the U.S. ramping up its military presence in the Caribbean. The USS Gerald R. Ford, the world's largest aircraft carrier, arrived on Sunday. The U.S. conducted its 21st strike on an alleged drug boat in the region on Saturday.

And the Reverend Jesse Jackson remains hospitalized this morning. A source close to his family tells CNN, the civil rights leader is receiving care to manage his blood pressure. He was hospitalized late last week. His condition has improved over the weekend.

And in a reversal, the president now urging Republicans to vote for a release of the Epstein files. Trump took to Truth Social on Sunday night, saying there's nothing to hide and it's time to move on from this Democrat hoax. House Speaker Mike Johnson already scheduled a vote for Tuesday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): So, it will be on the floor again next week. I suspect there'll be lots of votes. That -- we'll just get this done.

President Trump has clean hands. He's not worried about it. I talk to him all the time. He has nothing to do with this.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The president's reversal comes amid growing support from House Republicans who will vote to release the Epstein files.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) REP. THOMAS MASSIE (R-KY): I think we could have a deluge of Republicans. There could be 100 or more. I'm hoping to get a veto proof majority on this legislation when it comes up for a vote. And, you know, the president's been saying this is a hoax. He's been saying that for months. Well, he's just now decided to investigate a hoax if it's a hoax.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: That as the president says he's also asking the Justice Department to look into Epstein's ties to high profile Democratic Party figures.

Group chat is back.

Sara, the reason why we're calling this a reversal is because just last week the president was actively lobbying, bringing people into the Situation Room. People are, like, please don't vote for this. They do anyway. So, what do you make of the shift in talking points over the weekend?

SARA FISCHER, CNN SENIOR MEDIA ANALYST: I mean it could be that an ally of his is mentioned in these files. And so, for all this time leading up to it, he was trying to protect them. And now he's realizing that politically, the House might vote in favor of releasing these files. And so, it's no advantage to him to be trying to keep them hidden.

I also think, like, at this point, we have seen a bunch of files get released. I think 20,000 files worth of emails and correspondence between Epstein and some of his people. And we know a little bit more about what types of people are implicated, how -- to what extent Trump is implicated. So, he might feel more comfortable.

But my take on this is, this has been a fissure within the Republican Party for such a long time. Marjorie Taylor Greene versus President Trump, that was rooted in the Epstein files. And I think he's ready to move past that. And getting these files out of the way might be the way to do it.

CORNISH: Was it also some of the reaction to last week's lobbying? I don't know if, you guys, what you think, if you have these Republicans that are, like, why are you making a big deal out of this unless you have something to hide?

FRANCESCA CHAMBERS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "USA TODAY": Well, that was Marjorie Taylor Green's argument, right, is, if it's true that if the Democrats had found something in there they would have released it before the last election, as the president has been saying, then why are you making such a big deal out of it?

You played the Mike Johnson clip. He also said during that interview that, at this point, they just want to take a weapon, as he -- as he put, out of Democrats' hands.

CORNISH: Johnson was so resigned on this issue. Like, it's a total kind of Charlie Brown sigh from him every time someone brings this up because it's happening and he's just like, OK, folks.

CHAMBERS: But, politically -- I was just saying, but politically at this point he's saying, all right, it's happening, so let's just get this over with.

CORNISH: But then why invite more investigation by saying you're going to go after high profile Democratic figures? Why not just drop it all together?

GARRETT GRAFF, AUTHOR, "THE DEVIL REACHED TOWARD THE SKY": Well, I don't think that's really his choice. But I think this was Trump reading the political tea leaves that they have tried to bury this subject, as Sara said, for months at this point, not gotten anywhere, have actually lost ground. And I think this is Donald Trump reading the tea leaves and saying he was going to lose potentially dozens, if not scores, if not 100 Republican votes tomorrow on the floor.

CORNISH: Yes.

GRAFF: And saying, I don't want to be on the wrong side of an issue I'm already going to lose.

CORNISH: And then for the people who, you're kind of like, does anyone really care about this? There is actually a fair amount of polling over the last couple of months about how people are thinking.

[06:35:03]

At least back in the summer people were asked, I think this was CBS News/YouGov, just should DOJ release them, 89 percent. I didn't even know 89 percent of people like cared that much. But you're right, maybe the reaction over the last couple days shifted something.

FISCHER: So -- what's so fascinating, this was, in some ways, sort of a policy issue, especially on the conservative right, they care so much about things like pedophilia, that was rooted from the QAnon conspiracy back in the day, that originally people cared about this for that policy reason. What's shifted is now it's a political thing. Now it's, we'll out bad Democrats in these files. Trump, if you have nothing to hide, let's use it as an opportunity to go after Democrats. That's why I think you've seen so much of this tide turn.

CORNISH: OK, one last thing. The people who are talking to this as a kind of political win. We heard from Congressman Ro Khanna, who was responding to this idea that, like, maybe it's fine for Trump. Here is he -- here's him on that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. RO KHANNA (D-CA): If you gave me a choice, I'd rather the president reverse course. I'd rather he release all these files. Someone was saying that his numbers would go up. I don't care if he gets the political win. There is a group of rich and powerful men who abused young girls. It's the one thing this country agrees was horrible. I don't think we've had a scandal like this in this country. And what we're asking for is justice for those survivors. (END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Can Democrats do much more with this?

CHAMBERS: Well, they're going to on Tuesday. I mean they're going to have the Epstein survivors in Washington, D.C., on the same day that we now know that Mike Johnson is planning to have this vote.

Now, notably, Ro Khanna didn't have his, I guess, didn't have as high of a whip count, I think, as Thomas Massie did. He said he expected, you know, maybe somewhere in the 40s in terms of how many Republicans would turn on this issue and vote -- and vote with them.

CORNISH: Yes.

CHAMBERS: But still, they're planning to make this a big, big issue on Tuesday.

CORNISH: OK, people can hold -- people are going to see more of that tomorrow. So, I know we're going to be talking about that.

I want to ask you about one more thing related to Congress, which is Marjorie Taylor Greene. She's been going through a big political reinvention this year. She, obviously, was a former Trump loyalist, and now she's leaning into this high-profile breakup with the president. And speaking exclusively with CNN's Dana Bash, she did something extraordinary, for a politician at least, she apologized.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): I would like to say humbly, I'm sorry for taking part in the toxic politics. It's very bad for our country. I am committed, and I've been working on this a lot lately, to put down the knives in politics. I really just want to see people be kind to one another.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Greene says she's been facing threats because of attacks by President Trump. He withdrew his endorsement of her late last week.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Marjorie traitor Greene. I don't think her life is in danger. I don't think -- frankly, I don't think anybody cares about her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: All right, taking this to the group chat.

So, first of all, just to understand how she kind of entered politics, why we'd be calling this a rebrand. Just some of the past headlines from, say, 2018, where she was someone who spread conspiracy theories, frankly, about Sandy Hook, about other shootings, the Las Vegas shooting. And then, of course, an anti-Semitic trope about wildfires on secret Jewish space lasers. She's asked -- been asked to talk about this since and has sort of, I don't know what, said that she was taken in or a victim of misinformation. How is this rebrand going?

FISCHER: Not super well. If you make your entire political career off of having knives out for people and conspiracies, and now it's all about having empathy and tissues, people don't respond well to that --

CORNISH: Did you just say empathy and tissues?

FISCHER: That's what it seems like, right?

CORNISH: OK.

FISCHER: She's going on Dana Bash's show. She's apologizing in a soft tone. This is not a soft tone type of person.

I think that people look at her and think, OK, your political future in Georgia might not be going the way that you think it's going to go. We were talking earlier about polling against that possible Senate run.

CORNISH: Yes.

FISCHER: So, she's trying to rebrand herself. The challenge is, it's still Trump's party. And once Trump turns --

CORNISH: Well, but, see, this is a question people are raising, which is --

GRAFF: Yes, it --

CORNISH: Oh, go ahead.

GRAFF: I was just going to say, I think that this is, to me, what is the interesting part of this is, I think this is the most opportunistic of the opportunists in American politics, sensing that the opportunities have changed. That we are starting to see --

CORNISH: Meaning that Trump has some weakness within his base?

GRAFF: That Donald Trump is at historic lows with independents. He's at historic lows with swing voters. He is going to be out of office in a couple of years at this point, one way or another. And I think, to me, this is an interesting window into the fracturing that we are going to see of this sui generis Trump coalition as it begins to imagine what's next.

CORNISH: Yes.

GRAFF: And I think Marjorie Taylor Greene is not setting herself up for anything like the Senate or a governorship.

[06:40:01]

She is setting herself up to be the leader after Trump. CORNISH: Because the question always has to be, what happens after

Trump, if there's an after Trump? And here's what she had to say about what she perceives as the president's priorities lately that she's raising questions about.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): Keeping him on nonstop tours around the world and nonstop meetings with foreign country's leaders is not America first. It's just not, I think domestic policy should be the most important issue that the president and the Republican controlled House and Senate are working on. And that showed up in the election on Tuesday.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: I remember the last couple days on the right, the real anger about money going to I think it was Argentina, right? Like $50 billion out of nowhere to help out a leader --

CHAMBERS: Twenty, but --

CORNISH: Oh, sorry, 20, yes.

CHAMBERS: Yes, swap one. But, anyway, continue. Continue.

CORNISH: No, please do. Please do correct me, $20 billion. But it's like not going to Americans, and that's their problem.

Can you talk about this America first aspect of it and like how the White House is responding to it?

CHAMBERS: Well, the president, when he was actually gargling with reporters on Air Force One when he was heading to Palm Beach over the weekend, responded specifically to her comments and said, the -- what I've been doing with foreign policy and this agenda, I've been making new alliances, I've been stopping wars, I've been bringing all this tariff money, which, by the way, we're going to try and send these rebate checks to Americans for it. And if I hadn't been able to go abroad and do all these things recently, sit down with China, we wouldn't have had this rare earths deal. And you can debate (AUDIO GAP) those things achieved or accomplished. But that was essentially what the president's argument was in response to Marjorie Taylor Greene.

Going back to what we were talking about, about her political future. The president also says that there are people who are dialing them up, who are ready to jump in the race, and that he could potentially endorse. What I will be curious to see is, you know, who they might try to recruit if he says that that's what they're going to do, right, is primary her, who they might try to recruit to primary her, and how much would the president want to get involved in this.

CORNISH: Yes, that would be a real test.

CHAMBERS: And he's done that in the past, right? CORNISH: Yes.

CHAMBERS: I mean he tried to do that with Massie before, and it didn't work out. But it has worked in other cases when the president's allies got involved against Liz Cheney.

CORNISH: OK, you guys might want to catch some of the conversation. You might have just stepped in. But, guess what? We're a podcast too. Scan the QR code now to find it. CNN THIS MORNING is available anywhere you get your podcasts.

And coming up next, a new terror designation and a warship arrives, just as President Trump says he's made his mind up on Venezuela.

Plus, this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't know when I'm going to open back, but I need to protect my customers.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Businesses closing up shop. People afraid to leave their homes. I'm going to talk to a Charlotte leader next about the White House's immigration crackdown in his city.

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[06:47:11]

CORNISH: So, as the Trump administration waging war on cartels with continued attacks on drug boats in the Caribbean, it's designating one Venezuelan drug cartel as a foreign terrorist organization. The State Department says cartel de los Solos is led by Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro himself and blames it for trafficking drugs into the United States and Europe. President Trump suggests the terror designation would allow the U.S. to target certain assets and infrastructure in the country.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It allows us to do that. But we haven't said we're going to do that. And we may be discussing -- we may be having some discussions with Maduro. And we'll see how that turns out. But they would like -- they would like to talk.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Over the weekend, the U.S. military carried out its 21st strike on alleged drug trafficking boats, killing at least three people.

Group chat is back.

Franchesca, can I just talk very briefly to you about the White House saying that they might want to have talks? I mean, if you're Maduro, you don't have a lot of choices here. They've sent like a massive carrier there. What's the goal?

CHAMBERS: I mean, but that could be part of the goal, right, is by sending the aircraft carrier the USS Gerald Ford, by putting, you know, putting this military buildup essentially in the Caribbean, by all these strikes, is you get them to a point where maybe they want to negotiate.

At the same time, the president had said on Friday night that he had an idea in his mind of what he was going to do, but that he wasn't totally sure yet, you know, wasn't sure if he was going to act on it. And then last night, talking about this. So, it really could be that this is a very fluid situation. One that (INAUDIBLE).

CORNISH: Let me play for you more of what the president had to say because someone said, hey, don't you need to go to Congress to have a potential military action in Venezuela? And here's how he responded.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I said, go to Congress and let them know, we're not letting drugs come through Mexico, we're not letting them come through Venezuela, and let Congress know about it. We don't have to get their approval. But I think letting them know is good. The only thing I don't want them to do is leak information that's very important and confidential and may put our military at risk.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: A lot to unpack there. I'm focusing on the, we don't need approval. But, Garrett, what do you hear?

GRAFF: Yes. And I think this goes back to where these strikes started, which is, by sort of almost any definition of international war and law enforcement operations. These strikes have been illegal all the way through. The Justice Department has crafted this very strange memo sort of telling the military that they will not be prosecuted for participating in these missions. But, you know, if I'm a member of the military in that hierarchy, like, that's not -- that's raising as many questions as it's answering for me.

[06:50:04]

CORNISH: And though we know for fact, one of them left the job.

GRAFF: Yes, you know --

CORNISH: So, we know somebody had concerns.

And also the thing I'm going to be listening for is, if there is cartels, usually when there's drug busts, et cetera, the government likes to make a big deal about it. And yet with this, they show us nothing. GRAFF: Well, not only that, but we are actually losing intelligence

that we would have gotten before these strikes started. You know, we --

CORNISH: By getting -- by interviewing those you capture on a boat rather than just killing them.

GRAFF: Exactly. We know how to find these boats. The Coast Guard does it every day. The Customs and Border Protection does it every day with their air and marine operations units. And the fact that we are now sort of knowing less about what is happening, because one of the things that is very interesting in this, Britain is pulling back on sharing intelligence with the United States because they are concerned about the international illegality of these raids.

CORNISH: Yes.

OK, you guys, I think we actually have a guest that I want to turn to briefly. We're going to come back to this.

I want to talk more about that Operation Charlotte's Web. Border Patrol agents arriving in Charlotte over the weekend.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. JOSH STEIN (D-NC): North Carolina, I know this is a stressful moment, but, please, stay peaceful. And if you see something wrong, record it and report it to local law enforcement.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Governor Josh Stein urging the people of North Carolina to document encounters with Border Patrol. Now, at least 81 people were arrested in Charlotte on Saturday. That was in just five hours.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (Speaking in foreign language).

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Citizens are taking the governor's advice, recording, for example, this video of federal agents smashing the car window of a Honduran immigrant who was in the country legally, for example. They had a Real I.D.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't feel that they belong here. I hope that they leave soon. And, yes, I definitely think that when people are recording, when there are people out here watching, it makes a difference.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Want to bring in Mark Jerrell. He's the commissioner and chair of the Mecklenburg County Commission.

Thanks so much for being here. Good morning.

MARK JERRELL, COMMISSIONER AND CHAIR, MECKLENBURG COUNTY COMMISSION: Good morning. Thank you for having me.

CORNISH: So, we know some early statements came out over the weekend. It sounds like you guys sort of knew that this was coming. But what do you make now that it's actually playing out? What's your reaction to that big raid on Saturday?

JERRELL: Yes. Well, I'll tell you what. In our community, there's a lot of fear right now. There's a lot of tension. It's tense. It's having a real negative impact. And it's really because, Audie, it's the lack of information. There's no coordination, collaboration or communication. And so it's stoking a lot of fear in our community.

CORNISH: What's your response to the argument from the administration that, like, look, these communities, especially with Democratic leaning leaders, they're not wanting to cooperate. And, in fact, they're making the job of ICE and CBP more difficult.

JERRELL: Yes. Well, there's no evidence that a community like ours in Mecklenburg County that we don't want to cooperate with federal officials. I think -- I could think of a whole host of issues that we want to cooperate on. And we need communication. We need answers for our residents. Right now we have more questions than answers. And that's not a good space to be in.

CORNISH: Looking at what happened in Chicago, that was Operation Midway Blitz, 97 percent of the people who were taken into custody in those raids did not necessarily have criminal records. And I'm wondering what you are -- what you've learned from a place like Chicago about how to deal with this scale of operation in your city.

JERRELL: Well, I think what we've seen in other communities, that there is a high level of profiling that appears to take place. We are trying to take best practices. We're trying to inform and educate our residents so that they know how to engage. We are asking people to stay out of harm's way. Safety is paramount. But we're going to continue to ask for -- get -- try to get answers to our questions.

CORNISH: People are also being asked to document. What's the goal there and what are your concerns?

JERRELL: Well, I think the primary concern is for people to stay out of harm's way. Again, when we're asking -- or when they're being asked to document, you know, it's to record a level of evidence so that people can see the interactions. You just referenced, we had a resident who is here legally and had their window broken out.

[06:55:02]

I mean why were they stopped? I mean what, you know, what is this that allows folks just to be detained on the street, essentially profiled? This is not the way we operate in this community. Other communities across the country, that's not the way they operate. And so this is just really disconcerting at this point.

CORNISH: The DHS assistant secretary, Tricia McLaughlin, has said that Americans should be, quote, "able to live without fear of violent criminal illegal aliens hurting them, their families, or their neighbors." And that she said, "we're surging DHS law enforcement to Charlotte to ensure Americans are safe and public safety threats removed."

Is that your reality on the ground in your county?

JERRELL: Well, it doesn't appear to be the reality. I think the data is not showing that they're removing violent criminals. Frankly, out of the 80 individuals we believe that have been some sort -- in some way arrested, we don't know what their records are. We, you know, we don't know who they are. Again, there's no coordination. There's no communication. No level of collaboration. And so, you know, how -- how can we know that -- that that is essentially true.

CORNISH: Last thing. I've done a lot of reporting in North Carolina. Theres a lot of kind of faith voters. And I'm curious about your reaction to the actions happening at a church.

JERRELL: Well, I think what you see, the actions at that church is heartbreaking. There was an incident outside of my church yesterday. And so, it is heartbreaking. To your point, you know, this is an overwhelming community of faith. And so -- but the one thing that I can say about Mecklenburg County and our residents is that these are the times that we know that we're going to stick together and come together. And what you've seen is our community really coming together in the ways that I am really proud of. We are standing up for those who are marginalized, those who are disconnected, those who are being adversely impacted. And so we're going to continue to do that. That's what Mecklenburg County and Charlotte, that's what we do. And we'll continue to do that.

CORNISH: OK, that's Commissioner Mark Jerrell.

Thanks so much for your time.

JERRELL: Thank you.

CORNISH: We were talking during the break about the idea of this being a purple state or a swing state, that this is not just attacking kind of whatever random Democrat is there. And what do you think the politics of that could be?

FISCHER: Well, I think Donald Trump is laying the groundwork for what's going to happen in the next midterm election. I think you also have the situation in North Carolina specifically where it reflects Virginia in a lot of ways, right? Virginia is a purple state that we just saw go overwhelmingly blue. Not just the government, but also the attorney general there. And so, he sees that, I believe, as a signal of what could be to come for the map in 2028 -- or 2026. CORNISH: What about you?

GRAFF: Yes.

CORNISH: I know you keep a close eye on how ICE is behaving and sort of where these operations are.

GRAFF: To me, it's really notable that this -- he's doing this in a purple state where there's an incredibly important Senate race for the Republicans next year with Thom Tillis' retirement. And I think that what we have seen is that the -- these CBP raids, Gregory Bovino (ph), sort of frontier cavalry moving across the country are enormously polarizing and very much turn locals against the government, turn the government and sort of make it the sorts of protests. And I think that this is going to do enormous political harm to Republicans on the ground in North Carolina.

CORNISH: All right, you guys, we got a big week ahead. We talked earlier about the vote on the Epstein files.

Francesca, can I get from you what's in your group chat? What are people talking about?

CHAMBERS: I think, like many Americans, we are talking about how those flights are returning to normal today. The Transportation Services Administration is saying that yesterday. So, the FAA says they're going back to normal, guys.

CORNISH: All right. OK. No more airport misery, we hope.

Garrett.

GRAFF: As a historian, I could not be more excited about Ken Burns' "American Revolution" debuting last night.

CORNISH: I knew you were going to say that.

GRAFF: It's great to see Americans excited about history. It's great to see this as sort of a big cultural moment as we face so much challenge in our modern politics to go back and think about why America is the way that it is and why we got started in the first place.

CORNISH: And also interesting because the kind of grant programs, humanities programs that are sort of defunded under President Trump, Burns is a giant of the field, so to speak.

FISCHER: Yes. And my group chat, we're thinking a little bit about some of that defunding. The president and Republicans have defunded a lot of public media. They've taken a lot of action against the media.

One thing I'm looking at this week is potentially Donald Trump suing the BBC. He threatened to do so last week following revelation that they had doctored -- sort of doctored or edited his speech in a certain way.

[07:00:06]

If he were to actually sue them, this would be the third news organization that a sitting president has sued. That's unprecedented.

CORNISH: Yes. All right, thank you. Thank you guys so much for talking with us. We talked about a lot. I want to thank you for spending time with us. The headlines are next.