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Epstein Bill Headed to Trump's Desk; Businesses Close, Students Miss School Amid Immigration Raid Fears; Air Traffic Controllers Shortage: Can A.I. Help? Aired 6-6:30a ET
Aired November 19, 2025 - 06:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[06:00:10] . AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: The Epstein files bill will soon be in the
hands of the president. So, what will he do? CNN THIS MORNING starts right now.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Alone, yes, we are afraid. But together, we are feared.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: I'm going to talk to two Epstein survivors about this moment of vindication and what they want to see next.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They were in a war zone. Not in a neighborhood where families were shopping and working.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Businesses closed, students not showing up to school, communities in fear. Immigration raids ramping up in North Carolina.
And we now know where immigration officials are headed next. And it's got support from that state's governor.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is a tremendous victory, not for the Democratic Party, but for the democratic process.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: The big, beautiful map scrapped. I'm going to talk to a Texas Democrat about what's next in the redistricting fight.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEAN DUFFY, U.S. TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: We're about 3,000 air traffic controllers short right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: So, is A.I. the solution for the air traffic controller shortage? Or is the human touch irreplaceable?
It's 6 a.m. here on the East Coast. This is a live look at New York City, where you're going to be seeing flurries earlier this morning. 'Tis the season.
Good morning, everybody. It's Wednesday, November 19. Thank you for waking up with me. I'm Audie Cornish, and here is where we begin.
Because after months of political infighting and a flip-flop by President Trump, a triumph for the survivors of Jeffrey Epstein's abuse. The bill to release the Epstein files heads to the president's desk.
The House and the Senate moved at warp speed Tuesday to pass it. Just one lawmaker, Republican Congressman Clay Higgins of Louisiana, voted no. That's across both chambers.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: The Senate has passed the bill under unanimous consent.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: And survivors were together for a vigil, waiting to hear the result of the vote. And it quickly turned into a celebration.
One of the survivors, a Trump voter, says they deserve to be in the room with the president for today's signing.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JENA-LISA JONES, JEFFREY EPSTEIN SURVIVOR: He owes us an apology, for sure, and I think that would be one way of showing some remorse for this drawn-out process that didn't need to be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: So, once the bill becomes law, survivors are preparing to make sure that their final goal is achieved.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DANIELLE BENSKY, JEFFREY EPSTEIN SURVIVOR: The finish line is -- that it's all of it coming out. It's just making sure that every single piece, every single document, sees the light of day. And we have -- we have the files.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Today in the group chat, Jasmine Wright, White House correspondent for "NOTUS"; Chuck Rocha, Democratic strategist and former senior adviser to Bernie Sanders' presidential campaigns; and Dustin Olson, pollster for American Pulse Research and Polling. He's also the host of "Political Trade Secrets" podcast.
Welcome to the chat, Dustin.
DUSTIN OLSON, POLLSTER, AMERICAN PULSE RESEARCH AND POLLING: Great to be here.
CORNISH: OK. I want to start with Jasmine first. I heard, in that clip, some survivors saying, we should be in that room. We should get an apology. It was a little bit of a list. Is the White House going to be offering any of those things?
JASMINE WRIGHT, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "NOTUS": Well, it's unclear at this point. I mean, this is something that folks have been asking President Trump to do, including on both sides of the party. Basically, have Epstein survivors, victims come into the White House and basically try to embrace the issue.
And we know that until, basically, Sunday night, he kind of rejected the idea. The White House says that the president will sign the bill as soon as it comes over from the Congress and the Senate [SIC].
CORNISH: Will it be a big public signing?
WRIGHT: And it's -- right now, it's not on the schedule.
CORNISH: OK.
WRIGHT: Who knows what type of fanfare they're going to give it, or whether or not they're just trying to move past it.
I think two things are going to be happening in the White House, though. Obviously, you're going to want to see the president do what he says he wants Republicans to do, which is stop focusing on Epstein and get back to issues that concern him, like affordability.
But then you're also going to see the White House really kind of try to twist a knife against Democrats when it comes to the Epstein issue. Obviously, if more files were to be released, which is kind of a question mark, even though this legislation has gone through all of what it needs to go through --
CORNISH: Right. Like, the president has said these are the names you should look at. And that list is usually Democrats.
WRIGHT: Right. He's saying -- he's saying, you guys are looking at the wrong place. You should be looking at Democrats.
CORNISH: This is where I want to bring in Dustin and Chuck. Dustin first, just because -- polling. And this seems to be finally the issue where Trump did not have a political win.
Right up until the last minute, he lobbied against this. And then you had Marjorie Taylor Greene, right, in front of the cameras, taking the praise. What was different about this issue?
OLSON: Well, it's interesting you say that, because he's also the one who started the whole process. He called for the -- you know, all the disclosure at the beginning of this term. And it's interesting how it's ended up where it's ended up.
But ultimately, the American people, in polling over the summer, 72 percent of people said that they understood this issue. Two-thirds of people said that they wanted Congress to force this.
CORNISH: And Republicans, too?
OLSON: Republicans, too. Majorities of both parties actually believe that this has been something that powerful elites are behind; keeping a conspiracy.
But we are looking at two decades of -- of very powerful people trying to keep this under wraps. And four years of the Biden administration sitting on this. And now this is -- this is where we're at.
CORNISH: Well, I mean --
OLSON: And it's going to be interesting.
CORNISH: -- the victims have also talked about the multiple administrations. But here's how the sitting president is responding to questions about this.
He was asked -- I think it was on Air Force One. I want to play for you how he responded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. President, why wait for Congress to release the Epstein files? Why not just do it now?
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: It's not the question that I mind. It's your attitude. I think you are a terrible reporter. It's the way you ask these questions.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Sir, is there something incriminating in the file sir. Is there --
TRUMP: Quiet. Quiet, piggy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CHUCK ROCHA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: Yes. I mean, I had saw that. I didn't really think I heard what I heard. And I think this is kind of where we're at today in American politics.
And I know that a lot of political consultants are to blame, because we do a lot of ads that talk about a lot of divisive stuff.
But I think Jasmine brought up the point that was the most important here. He wants this to go away so bad. You can tell he's irritated. You can tell he's a little chippy, as we would say in football.
He wants to talk about things that are on his playing field. He wants to talk about immigration, which I know we'll talk about later.
He does not want to talk about this, because to your point, Audie, about polls, just a week ago, we had a real poll with real voters, and they are mad. And they showed that they were mad. And Democrats overperformed everywhere. And it's about affordability.
And he wants to go back to talking about that, because every time he turns around, some reporters look at him saying, Epstein this, Epstein that, and you see those ridiculous remarks that he would make.
CORNISH: Does it help that there are women, and he's snapping at them?
ROCHA: I don't think it helps, but --
OLSON: No, of course not. So, this is the -- this is what's going to happen with this. It's a big complex issue. It's like anything like that. People are going to draw whatever stories that they want out of this, which is why I think he doesn't like it.
And most people would like to focus on things that matter to the country, like affordability.
CORNISH: Yes.
OLSON: Or immigration or any of these things. And this is something that is sensational, and it will take up all the oxygen, which means that real things can't get done.
CORNISH: All right. Well, some people are going to say these are real things. We're actually going to have two survivors on later today to talk about this.
But I do want you guys to stick around, because we want to talk about something else on CNN THIS MORNING.
South Carolina ready to do what no state has done before when it comes to abortion access. But now, there's a hangup.
Plus, Iran is ready to restart nuclear talks, but with one condition.
And federal agents crack down in North Carolina as hundreds of people snatched off the streets. And it's caught the attention of the pope.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
POPE LEO XIV, LEADER OF CATHOLIC CHURCH: But when people are living good lives -- and many of them for ten, 15, 20 years -- to treat them in a -- in a way that is extremely disrespectful, to say the least. And there's been some violence, unfortunately.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:13:20]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We want justice. You say how!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want justice. You say how!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want justice. You say how!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We want justice. You say how!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: ICE out of Raleigh now!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ICE out of Raleigh now!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ICE out of Raleigh now!
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: ICE out of Raleigh now!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Immigration officials in North Carolina spotted in more cities. And the people of the state want them out. Protesters taking to the streets as more than 200 arrests are made in Charlotte.
Mom-and-pop shops shutting their doors out of precaution. More than 30,000 students in the Charlotte area kept home from school on Monday.
The Mecklenburg County Board of Commissioners passed a resolution last night, affirming constitutional protections for immigrant communities.
Now, while the move is mostly symbolic, it is aimed at helping calm some of the fears.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): I feel fear just for being Latina. And I asked one of them why they had deceived us. They had told us they were going to look for criminals, but they are not looking for criminals.
They are only following the profile we have: that we are Latinos, Hispanics. They are pursuing us. We are like at war in this city.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: I want to take this to the group chat for a couple of reasons.
One, the recent Supreme Court ruling says that agents are allowed to question people based on how they look, the language they speak. Kavanaugh saying, look, it's typically brief. Those individuals go free, right, after they make it clear that they're U.S. citizens.
How is this playing out in reality to you? When you see someone with a quote like that, or just what you're seeing in these cities.
ROCHA: The terror is real. And we were just talking about Virginia and New Jersey. And I bring it back there, and we'll connect it. Because we knocked on 100,000 Latino doors in Passaic, New Jersey. You saw the big swing in that vote from Trump back to Mikie Sherrill.
[06:15:03]
And when we were talking to Latinos at the door, they were, A, angry that the prices hasn't [SIC] come down like -- like Trump had talked about.
But at the center of everything was this anxiety in an immigrant community about these ICE agents that are masked, that are there, that are picking up law-abiding citizens. Their neighbors, their friends.
They were like, sure, we were all about getting bad people out of our country. Deport all the criminals, but not our neighbors.
Then you see, in North Carolina, the fastest growing state in the country of Latino population over the last 25 years. And you also look at this state where it's probably got the most vulnerable Senate race coming up in the next midterm elections. That's less than a year from now.
CORNISH: Yes. That's one of the reasons why I wanted to talk about it, Dustin. It's a purple state. We did actually see a meaningful swing in New Jersey in the exact coalition of voters. Some Latino voters. That Republicans said, look. Look what we can do. We can make gains here.
And those gains look eroded. What do you see in a state like North Carolina, where the political question's really live?
OLSON: Well, on New Jersey, it might seem strange to some people, but that's largely because Donald Trump wasn't on the ballot, and he seems to be the one who is able to win over those voters.
Looking at national polling from the November Harvard/Harris poll, it might be surprising to some folks. It's actually surprising to me. Fifty-four percent still say that they would like to see all of those immigrants who are here illegally to be deported, and --
CORNISH: Here illegally.
OLSON: Here illegally, yes.
CORNISH: So, when people are picked up who are legally here, do those images, social media videos resonate?
OLSON: When I'm talking about, like, you see the media coverage, obviously, it can -- it can inspire fear for folks. And I get that.
But this has been the issue that ultimately -- 2024, the economy, the lawfare, the -- the assassination attempts, of course, had an impact on that election, but it largely turned on the immigration issue, and it continues.
CORNISH: And so, you think you're still good? You don't see red flags yet? OLSON: I don't personally.
CORNISH: Yes.
OLSON: But I also -- I'm just telling you what the public opinion is.
CORNISH: So, to your point about the media, I want to play for you what Pope Leo had to say, because, you know, they can put these videos out without us. Here he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
POPE LEO: We have to look for ways of treating people humanely, treating people with the dignity that they have.
But when people are living good lives -- and many of them for ten, 15, 20 years -- to treat them in -- in a way that is extremely disrespectful, to say the least. And there's been some violence, unfortunately.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: This has been also followed up by bishops, who put out a video also agreeing with the pope.
I know that DHS is proud of what they are doing. They talk about, I think, 527,000 have been removed under the Trump administration's leadership. This is following up on a promise.
Do they see any red flags from the last election? Like, help me understand their approach.
WRIGHT: Well, I think the White House is actually really supportive of what DHS is doing. I think to your point, yes, there are a lot of polls that show that the American voter is relatively still supportive of this idea of we need to be deporting people who are in this country.
What they aren't supportive, though, in polls and anecdotally that I've heard from folks across the political spectrum, of these really harsh videos that look like they're just kind of pulling people off the street. And so, I think that there is a risk there for the White House.
But, you know, Donald Trump himself has said not enough of that is happening in various different interviews. And so, I think you're going to see them continue to push.
Obviously, Greg Bovino being in North Carolina and potentially --
CORNISH: The Customs and Border Patrol chief who a lot of questions were raised about his use of force in Chicago.
WRIGHT: In Chicago. But he's really been elevated at a really kind of accelerated scale by DHS and by the White House to be in these positions and to kind of lead the front in these new Democratic cities, which should be mentioned.
CORNISH: Right.
ROCHA: It's really important to say here that our immigration system as a whole has been broken since 9/11. It's almost been impossible to come here, quote unquote, "legally."
So, a lot of people have come to this country and have followed all the rules, except maybe crossing the border --
CORNISH: Yes.
ROCHA: -- and they contribute $28 billion to Social Security.
CORNISH: I mean -- I mean, we should make it clear.
ROCHA: Every year.
CORNISH: A lot of the rules are different now, right? And if --
ROCHA: If you're -- if you're giving money to Social Security, you're working and paying Social Security taxes.
WRIGHT: But I think from the White House's perspective, what they're saying is that what you see in the -- in the streets and on the videos is not a huge problem to them now.
CORNISH: OK. We'll see. Those are your videos they're talking about. Well see if there's more of them.
After the break on CNN THIS MORNING, the redistricting wars take a turn. Why a judge says the Texas map is illegal.
Plus, is A.I. the only thing that could solve the air traffic controller shortage?
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[06:23:57]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DUFFY: We're about 3,000 air traffic controller short right now now. Now, we do have enough controllers to control the airspace.
So, we need more air traffic controllers to come in to this. This profession.
The longest government shutdown in U.S. History, did not just disrupt travel plans for millions of Americans. It also put a spotlight on an air traffic controller shortage that's been plaguing fliers for years.
(BERGIN VIDEO CLIP)
NICK DANIELS, PRESIDENT, NATIONAL AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLLERS ASSOCIATION: Controllers are resigning every day now because of the prolonged nature of the shutdown. We hadn't seen that before.
We only have 10,800 certified controllers. We're 3,800 short of what we actually need, of 14,633.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: It's going to take months, maybe even years to get enough air traffic controllers trained to fill that void. Which begs the question: can artificial intelligence help?
So, I'm going to talk about that now with Lisa Eadicicco. She's the tech editor with CNN business.
Lisa, good morning. Thanks for being with us.
LISA EADICICCO, TECH EDITOR, CNN BUSINESS: Of course. Thanks for having me.
CORNISH: So first, I just want to ask you about the shortage itself.
Secretary Duffy has sort of expanded on why he thinks there's a shortage, and he looks back to the Obama years and basically the pipeline of air traffic controllers. Here's what he had to say.
[06:25:16]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DUFFY: So, if you look back to the Obama years, there were some DEI principles that were brought into air traffic control. They were new.
We brought in more -- more people into the academy, but less people passed through the academy and became trained.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Can you help us understand the shortage? If this is the thing that's causing it, or money, or what's going on?
EADICICCO: I think it's likely a combination of all of those factors. I think shortage like this are complex. It's hard to pin down one exact reason, but this is something that seems to be ongoing for a long time.
And it's something that aviation experts that I've spoken with have -- have cited as being an issue for a long time.
So, it's hard to pin down that exact reason. But it is something that seems to be ongoing and that the government shutdown has exasperated.
CORNISH: So A.I. is used in so many aspects of like supply chains and corporations. How precisely would it be used in an air tower?
EADICICCO: So, the thing about A.I. and its use in aviation and in this particular role, is that it's really more of an assistant, rather than helping to take over parts of the job. And that's because the safety risks that come with making a mistake are enormous.
And there are certain parts of air traffic control that we really just don't know if A.I. Is going to be very good at yet. For example, the job requires a lot of communication, a lot of really quick decision making, and those are things that we know humans are better at and that humans are trained to do right now.
For example, if an air traffic controller is, here's another controller panicking or here's a pilot panicking, they know that they might need to intervene or bring in help. We just don't know if A.I. is going to be able to pick up on those cues in the same way.
But there are things that can be useful for anything that involves crunching large amounts of data, for example, and mapping out trajectories.
For example, I think analyzing weather patterns and trying to project where there's going to be turbulence can -- can be really helpful. That's one use case that's being looked at, as well as managing gates at airports and seeing what the traffic is like at different gates. I think those are the types of things that we're seeing A.I. be useful for.
But again, that's not really taking over the human elements of the job. That's just kind of supplementing staff with more data that they can use to maybe make decisions quicker and more efficiently.
CORNISH: What does the union think of this? How are the workers responding?
EADICICCO: So, I think this is something that -- the use of A.I. in this field is relatively new. It's -- you know, in a field like air traffic control, nothing happens quickly. These types of things can take years because there's so much testing that's involved. So, this isn't something that that happens overnight.
But I do think the use of A.I. in a lot of jobs right now is something that people likely feel strongly about, because there's been a lot of concern brought up over the past year about the role that A.I. is going to play in the future of work.
So, I don't know if there's any particular reactions to that right now, but it's definitely something that I think everyone will be keeping an eye on moving forward, for sure.
CORNISH: OK, Lisa Eadicicco, thanks so much.
EADICICCO: Thank you.
CORNISH: And straight ahead on CNN THIS MORNING, the bill to release the Epstein files headed to the president's desk. I'm going to talk to two survivors of Jeffrey Epstein's abuse. That's coming up next.
Plus, a new city for the president's immigration crackdown. And this time, the governor is welcoming federal agents with open arms.
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