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CNN This Morning
Sotomayor Apologizes for Kavanaugh Comments; Hegseth Recites Fake Bible Quote; Rep. Joe Morelle (D-NY) is Interviewed about the FISA Extension. Aired 6:30-7a ET
Aired April 17, 2026 - 06:30 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[06:30:00]
BOB MCNALLY, INTERNATIONAL ENERGY CONSULTANT: Warranted. Are we really that close? Iran's only leverage over President Trump is grabbing that oil artery and squeezing it hard. And we're not convinced they're ready to give up on that yet. But if this time the optimism is warranted, then, you know, come Fourth of July this summer, Americans may at least see the trend in gasoline prices starting to head down.
AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: OK, fingers crossed.
Bob McNally, thank you so much.
MCNALLY: Thank you.
CORNISH: All right, it's almost half past the hour. I want to give you your morning roundup. Some of the stories that you might have missed.
The acting director of ICE, Todd Lyons, is going to step down from his role this spring. DHS made that announcement yesterday, on the same day that Lyons testified before a House committee about the unprecedented number of deaths in ICE custody. Lyons has been overseeing the White House's mass deportation plan. DHS did not say why he is leaving.
And CNN projects Democrat Analilia Mejia will win the special election in New Jersey's 11th district, allowing Democrats to further narrow the Republican's razor thin majority in the House. Mejia will fill the remainder of the term for the meet -- for the seat that Mikie Sherrill vacated after being elected New Jersey governor back in November.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Stop! Police, stop!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: All right, you see everything on the streets of New York, but this looked more like something out of a western. An NYPD officer on horseback chased down a suspect, a purse thief. The officer and his horse, Kelly, galloped along the sidewalks, under the scaffolding, until eventually catching up with the suspect. All that was missing was a lasso to arrest them. And straight ahead on CNN THIS MORNING, the House punts on a spy
powers program. The short-term extension after a pair of floor defeats.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:36:45]
CORNISH: Good morning, everybody. I'm Audie Cornish. I want to thank you for joining me on CNN THIS MORNING.
It is half past the hour. And here's what's happening right now.
Celebrations in Lebanon where a brand-new ten-day ceasefire is in effect already. The Lebanese army is accusing Israel of multiple violations. But in the meantime, President Trump has invited leaders from Israel and Lebanon to the White House for future talks.
And the former lieutenant governor of Virginia, Justin Fairfax, reportedly killed his wife and then himself. This happened yesterday at their Virginia home. Officials say the couple's teenage children were home when it happened. Their son called 911. That's according to Fairfax County police. The pair were in an ongoing domestic dispute stemming from a, quote, "complicated or messy divorce."
And Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. faced tough questions on Capitol Hill in several hearings this week. On Thursday he pushed again, pushed back on vaccines.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ROBERT F. KENNEDY JR., HHS SECRETARY: Country in the world --
REP. LINDA SANCHEZ (D-CA): Did President Trump approve your decision to end the CDC's pro-vaccine public messaging campaign?
KENNEDY: We've done better at preventing these --
SANCHEZ: That's not answering my question, sir.
KENNEDY: And having (ph) the --
SANCHEZ: That is not answering my question.
KENNEDY: And any country in the world --
SANCHEZ: And I think you don't want to answer the question because I think you know that you are making --
KENNEDY: I want to respond to your misinformation.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: While the secretary answered questions, President Trump named Dr. Erica Schwartz as his choice to become the next director of the CDC. Dr. Schwartz is a public health veteran, serving for 24 years in the U.S. Public Health Service Commission Corps.
And tension mounting on the Supreme Court over its, quote, "shadow docket." This week, Justice Sonia Sotomayor issued a rare apology over comments she made about Justice Brett Kavanaugh and his emergency decision about ICE patrols.
So, it happened at an event at the University of Kansas School of Law. She criticized Kavanaugh's argument that these were just temporary stops. And she says, "this is from a man whose parents were professionals and probably doesn't really know any person who works by the hour."
We're going to talk about this comment and the apology with CNN's legal analyst, Elliot Williams. Going to lawyer up.
ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Let's do it.
CORNISH: So, the lawyers are fighting a bit.
WILLIAMS: They're fighting.
CORNISH: First, remind people what a Kavanaugh stop is, because it's very controversial.
WILLIAMS: Right. Well, the -- a Kavanaugh stop does not exist. That is just a term that advocates have given.
Now, in a concurrence, in an opinion about when migrants can be stopped in the United States, Kavanaugh, Justice Kavanaugh, laid out a number of factors that that can be considered, including language, one's occupation, where they're found, and so on. Many advocates regard it as racial profiling.
CORNISH: Which people led to say it was racial profiling. OK
WILLIAMS: That's what many people said.
Now, Justice Sotomayor, in her comments, had said that ultimately, in effect, how dare Brett Kavanaugh say this. He doesn't even have, you know, hourly workers in his family or whatever else.
Now, this is notable in light of the at least veneer of privacy that the Supreme Court likes to have. They like to say they don't insult each other publicly. They don't out each other publicly. And how dare she have done so in such a manner.
So, it is notable when a Supreme Court justice issues an apology through the Supreme Court's offices own press office to sort of tamp that down.
[06:40:04]
CORNISH: Yes.
What do you make of her dialing back and being like, you know, apology, she shouldn't have said that? NOEL KING, CO-HOST AND EDITORIAL DIRECTOR, "TODAY, EXPLAINED" PODCAST: I like it. I like it.
WILLIAMS: Ha.
KING: It's a good way to be in this world.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
KING: I think she's really sincere.
CORNISH: Yes.
KING: I have always appreciated with the Supreme Court this thing where, like, we keep our business behind closed doors.
WILLIAMS: Yes. Right.
KING: We don't talk smack about each other. I love it. I love it.
CORNISH: Yes. She said, "I made remarks that were inappropriate. I regret my hurtful comments. I have apologized to my colleague."
Do you see this as significant?
TERRY SCHILLING, PRESIDENT, AMERICAN PRINCIPLES PROJECT: Oh, I think it's very important. I agree. We need to get back to some normalcy where we can argue, you know, you know, passionately and disagree --
CORNISH: Disagree, yes.
WILLIAMS: On paper.
SCHILLING: And still love each other and still treat each other as our fellow Americans. It's very important. I think we could do a lot better as a country if we did more of this.
WILLIAMS: Yes. Now, I'd say the counterpoint is that a lot of that with the Supreme Court, I'm not going to say it's a fiction, but they do put on an air of, whether it's superiority or secrecy or whatever else, even down to, you know, cameras not being allowed in there. It's they --
CORNISH: Yes. But I guess, for me, it's more that, they're already taking digs at each other in the argument -- in the opinions.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
KING: Right.
CORNISH: The opinions are very strongly worded these days. So, it's a little like, we know y'all --
KING: But you got to dig.
WILLIAMS: Yes. KING: You got to dig into the opinions.
WILLIAMS: And that's --
CORNISH: You mean you have to read, Noel. And I know that is frustrating for so many people out there.
WILLIAMS: That's been the whole ethos of the Supreme Court for these two centuries --
CORNISH: Yes.
WILLIAMS: Which is that, we fight on paper, not in public remarks. And whether it's right or wrong, that's how they've conducted their business. And that's why this apology coming out the way it did was so notable.
CORNISH: One more thing. The shadow docket.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
CORNISH: Justice Jackson, again, one of those people who writes those lengthy opinions that I was talking about, she was at Yale Law School, and she was talking about this issue of an emergency docket, which a lot of legal watchers have been paying attention to.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
CORNISH: Let me play it for you. It will be our last bit of conversation.
WILLIAMS: Sure.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JUSTICE KETANJI BROWN JACKSON, SUPREME COURT: The Supreme Court's predominantly merits focused analysis has led it to consistently ignore, or at least undervalue, real world harms when resolving stay requests on our emergency docket.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: I'm mostly playing this because I needed a translation. What is she saying? Yes.
WILLIAMS: Yes, so the court is starting to do a lot more of its business on an emergency docket where there isn't the full benefit of argument and briefing and all the time that the Supreme Court takes. Our colleague here, Steve Vladeck, wrote a whole book called "The Shadow Docket" on this -- on this idea.
Now, she used very strong language at one point, calling them scratch paper musings, which, in effect, is not befitting an institution like the Supreme Court. On the one hand, the Supreme Court gets to do its work faster because they're pumping more things out. On the other hand, they're sort of -- they're depriving litigants and the American people of the opportunity to really be heard and really flesh ideas out. So, she's on to something.
CORNISH: Because even though they're emergencies, it doesn't mean they can't be fleshed out more broadly.
WILLIAMS: Exactly.
CORNISH: OK, stay with us. I actually want to bring more people into the conversation. We're going to talk about the cost of the war in Iran. We're going to ask why the chief of the budget hasn't given lawmakers an exact answer. And we've got a Democratic lawmaker, Joe Morelle, who's on Appropriations, he can answer that question.
Plus, this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: I sat there, in church, and I thought, our press are just like these pharisees.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: Preaching from the pulpit in the Pentagon. We're going to talk about whether or not that is alienating part of the Republican base. And later on CNN, alt-pop singer D4vd has been arrested after a teenage girl was found in the trunk of his car.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[06:47:59]
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT AND ANCHOR: Why are you fighting with the pope, and are you worried it's upsetting your Evangelical supporters and Catholic supporters?
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: No, no, I don't -- I have to do what's right. The pope has to understand that -- very simple. I have nothing against the pope. His brother is MAGA all the way. I like his brother, Louis.
COLLINS: But why are you fighting with him then?
TRUMP: I'm not fighting with him.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: President Trump trying to move on from his feud with the pope, but his defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, hasn't exactly got the memo. So, Hegseth is still using God to justify the war with Iran. This week, the secretary went further. He quoted from the Bible. I mean not totally, as people started to double check the quote, and they found it was kind of, maybe taken from Quentin Tarantino's "Pulp Fiction," but we're going to let you decide.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PETE HEGSETH, DEFENSE SECRETARY: And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to capture and destroy my brother.
SAMUEL L. JACKSON, ACTOR, "PULP FICTION": And I will strike down upon thee with great vengeance and furious anger those who attempt to poison and destroy my brothers.
HEGSETH: And you will know my call sign is Sandy One (ph), when I lay my vengeance upon thee.
JACKSON: And you will know my name is the Lord when I lay my vengeance upon thee.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: OK, joining me now, Maggie Haberman, CNN political analyst and White House correspondent for "The New York Times." She's also the author of "Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump."
I wanted to talk to you about this, Maggie, because the internet has been very quick to seize on the Trump White House pope feud into a broader conversation about religion and how the Trump administration uses religion in its dialog with the public about the war.
What do you see in the way they've tried to defend themselves?
MAGGIE HABERMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, it's interesting, Audie, a, aside from the Quentin Tarantino "Pulp Fiction" of it all in terms of that one quote, what I have seen the secretary of defense do, or now renamed secretary of war do is use religion not just to justify the war.
[06:50:06]
We've seen that many, many times. But also to justify essentially attacking the press and saying that the press is doing a bad job for doing its job and raising questions about this war.
CORNISH: Yes.
HABERMAN: This is unlike anything really that we have seen in -- ever in the last -- at least in the last 80 years. And possibly, you know, ever in decades upon decades. And so -- before that.
It is not -- look, there are people -- I don't want to sound as if I am saying that somebody is not sincere in their religious beliefs. There certainly is no reason to say that. However, that doesn't mean that everybody has to then view the war in this country or anywhere else in the world from a religious standpoint.
CORNISH: Yes.
HABERMAN: As a -- as a recognition (ph). And I think that is where it starts to go off the rails.
CORNISH: I want to talk about Pope Leo, because he has not kind of stepped back from the conversation. On Thursday he was in Cameroon, where there is also fighting, and he talked about war in general. I want to play it for you.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
POPE LEO: Woe to those who manipulate religion in the very name of God for their own military, economic or political gain, dragging that which is sacred into darkness and filth.
The masters of war pretend not to know that it takes only a moment to destroy, yet often a lifetime is often not enough to rebuild.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: It's interesting talking about this in the context of how Hegseth is speaking and in the past how -- a few days when J.D. Vance, I think, was saying, you know, the pope should be sort of careful about how he's opining.
Are they struggling a bit with this conversation? Are they struggling with how to answer back the pope's approach?
HABERMAN: Well, I think it's coming from two different directions. Hegseth is very much concerned about the audience of one, of Donald Trump. There's no question that Vice President Vance knows that his political future hinges in part on what Donald Trump does in terms of becoming the nominee, and also just in terms of how the public perceives this administration. It's clearly complicating for Vance, who we know does take Catholicism seriously. He has a book coming out on religion. He's now going to, I have to assume, get asked about this at a number of stops to roll out his book, depending on what he does.
I don't -- I don't see how this is a winning debate, particularly for the vice president, with the pope. I continue to say that I still -- it's quite aligned to say that the pope is weak on crime. But what the pope is responding to, in particular, are President Trump's threats against a civilization. It is not a surprise that the pope is speaking out about that. And it is not all, you know, a social media game. It's a war.
CORNISH: Yes, but I think it has been a surprise to the administration, right, seeing the backlash.
HABERMAN: No question.
CORNISH: Especially on the right.
HABERMAN: No question.
CORNISH: And especially given all of the support he has had from the Evangelical community.
So, Maggie, I hope we can talk to you about this as we -- as you said, if he's got a book coming out, literally about his faith, I don't think this story is going to go away anytime soon.
HABERMAN: Right. Right. I don't think so.
CORNISH: Maggie, thanks so much.
HABERMAN: Thanks, Audie.
CORNISH: Please check out her book. It's called "Regime Change: Inside the Imperial Presidency of Donald Trump." And that is coming out in June.
Now, I want to turn to this.
The House was up late last night trying to pass a long-term extension of a government spy powers program. House Republican leaders thought they had a deal. Twenty Republicans broke ranks and voted against extending this Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. It's also known as FISA. In the end, only a short-term extension passed. And basically, the law allows authorized U.S. officials to gather phone calls and text messages of foreign targets. But in the process of doing that, they also scoop up the data of Americans, and that has many members concerned.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): We want to make sure that we're prioritizing national security, but we also have to be a check on the use of that excuse of national security to invade and to violate the civil rights of everyday Americans.
REP. LAUREN BOEBERT (R-CO: We want these reforms within FISA. We mean what we say. And that's not something that we're going to sidestep.
I'm going to continue to stand up and protect that Fourth Amendment right for all American citizens.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: OK, Congressman Joe Morelle here. He's a Democrat of New York, in the group chat.
And what I did not have in my group chat was an AOC, Lauren Boebert, horseshoe politics clip back-to-back.
Now, I understand why Republicans have generally been having questions about FISA.
[06:55:01]
They are upset about the investigation of Carter Page that Trump talked and railed about, saying that his campaign was being investigated and that that was wrong.
What Democrats -- what's going on there? Because you voted no, am I correct?
REP. JOE MORELLE (D-NY): I voted no on -- to consider the rule.
CORNISH: Yes. MORELLE: But have voted for the extension in the past. I mean, this is
a very important intelligence gathering tool for certain foreign individuals. It does sometimes, as you described, capture American citizens. The question is whether or not you need a judicial warrant to be able to include their information and gather their information. And there's people on all sides who I think are rightly concerned about the overreach of the government intelligence gathering, but also need to recognize that this is an important intelligence tool. The Biden administration, at one point, said it was one of the most important tools, if not the most important tool that they have for gathering information that people might have malign interests against the United States.
CORNISH: But can you understand their concerns, even given how they now view this Trump administration as one that is inclined towards political investigations?
MORELLE: Oh, yes.
CORNISH: I mean there is an overall sense of people being maybe less trustful of the FBI, of intelligence officials, and feeling like the investigations are going to be politically neutral.
MORELLE: Yes, I think on the right they're concerned about the Biden administration. On the left they're concerned about the uses and we feel abuse of the Trump administration.
It is important to note, the president urged people to vote against this bill two years ago and said that he had problems with it and was going to make a different bill when it came to the House. And, obviously, that didn't happen. It was chaos on the floor.
CORNISH: Yes, what -- can I ask you what's going on there? Do you guys like FISA any more or not?
SCHILLING: Oh, we hate it. No, they -- no, honestly.
CORNISH: But I thought you wanted it after 9/11, right? It's like --
SCHILLING: Well, we did. No, but we -- look, we were warned about this, right? We were warned under the Bush administration that this could be used against us.
CORNISH: Overreach.
SCHILLING: And it was, right? I mean, I don't think there's any disagreement that, you know, the -- Obama and his Justice Department used these FISA warrants to spy on what ended up being a winning campaign. And we don't want that for Americans. And --
CORNISH: Well, there's no disagreement that there was an investigation into the Trump campaign when they were concerned about Russia, right? The whole point of getting FISA is to be able to go after foreign targets. Tell me if I'm wrong.
WILLIAMS: True. You know, it's interesting, and it's funny having this conversation right after the conversation we had earlier about Iran, which is another thing that has scrambled American politics, but something I also remember back from when I was a young attorney on Capitol Hill, one issue unites the right and left as well, and that's surveillance.
CORNISH: Yes.
WILLIAMS: You get elements of the right and elements of the left that have never liked it, have never liked -- have always been suspicious about the government having power to look into affairs. And that's why you're seeing some votes like this happening the way they are.
MORELLE: But it is fair to remind people that there have been significant reforms to the original program.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
MORELLE: The number of Americans captured now in this is dramatically lower than it was.
WILLIAMS: Of course.
MORELLE: So -- but, look, I think judicial warrants are one way to help protect American citizens. You go to a judge and you get permission effectively to engage that surveillance of American citizens. But they can only be tied to a foreign person who's of interest. You can't surveil American citizens using this act (ph).
CORNISH: Well, I think you guys have till, what, April 20th to figure it out. So --
MORELLE: April 30th.
CORNISH: Oh, April 30th.
MORELLE: End of the month.
CORNISH: OK. I want to move on to something else, which is the cost of this war. You're on Appropriations. I feel like every time one of the money folks comes up here I got to go, how much is this war and are you going to pay for it?
Let me play this for you to kick it off.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JEFF MERKLEY (D-MA): Would I be in the ballpark to say we've already spent at least $50 billion?
RUSSELL VOUGHT, DIRECTOR, OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET: I wouldn't want to make a characterization of that at this point.
MERKLEY: OK. I would say as the most knowledgeable person in the executive branch on the budget, I would expect you to have pretty good numbers on that. So, I'm a little disappointed in that answer.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
CORNISH: You guys are trying every which way to get out this number, but you have it, right? Isn't it $1 trillion they've asked for, for the defense budget?
MORELLE: Well, including their idea of reconciliation is $1.5 trillion. And, yes, we have asked now for several weeks. And what appears to be the case is, Russell Vought, the head of OMB, is looking at the numbers, apparently from the Defense Department, and reviewing them. I don't know what review he needs to do. That shouldn't be something that he reviews.
But, look, we need this information. As appropriators, where we're being asked right now to look at an appropriation request from the president, which is the highest in American history. It's the highest increase in American history. I think we deserve to know, because the American people deserve to know, how much money this is costing. I think the $50 billion number is consistent with what I told you I think several weeks ago --
CORNISH: Yes.
MORELLE: Where I thought it was about $1 billion a day. And so, think of what we could have done with $50 billion spent on American citizens back home.
CORNISH: Now, since you are visiting the group chat, what's in your group chat?
MORELLE: You know, I have to acknowledge, I'm a die-hard Boston Celtics fan. Have been since I was a little boy.
CORNISH: You are?
WILLIAMS: Oh, my God.
MORELLE: And -- I know, from New York.
CORNISH: You're from New York. Is that allowed (ph)?
WILLIAMS: Wow.
MORELLE: I know. I know. I know. I know. It's -- what can I tell you. But the Celtics play tomorrow night. I'm really excited to get the playoffs underway.
CORNISH: OK.
Well, anyone else who's got a good group chat?
WILLIAMS: You know, you and maybe viewers of the show know that I like talking about trademark. When can someone sue for their likeness? And Pedro Pascal is suing a Chilean company over the making of Pedro Piscal.
[07:00:05] They literally made pisco (ph). And Pedro Pascal is suing them. But it's a big thing in Chile. There's actually Star Wash (ph), a "Star Wars" themed car wash that uses the logo there that they've been sued over.
CORNISH: Yes. So, the vibe (ph).
WILLIAMS: There's Miel Gibson, like from the word honey. It's a honey with "Braveheart" on it and they're suing about that.
So, Chile, not the place for trademark law (ph).
CORNISH: No, not so much. Godspeed to Mr. Pascal.
And I want to thank you guys all for waking up with us. I'm Audie Cornish, and the headlines are next.
