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"He Was In Charge": Bondi Pins Epstein File Release On Blanche; L.A. Sheriff: ICE Enforcement Not Expected At World Cup Matches. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired June 05, 2026 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[06:33:19]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche will face a Senate confirmation hearing before he can officially take over as leader of the Justice Department. Did his former boss just make that a lot harder?

The House Oversight Committee just released a transcript of Pam Bondi's closed-door interview with lawmakers last week, and she was asked repeatedly about how the Justice Department handled the release of the Epstein files. And Bondi was quick to point out Blanche as the man in charge, telling lawmakers, quote, "He was in charge of the process and the entire release of the Epstein files."

The Group Chat is back.

The reason why I wanted to talk about this is because characterizing what's on paper, right, we can't see it on video, is that is gold for political types.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is.

CORNISH: We actually had a former Trump advisor on CNN last night and she thinks that this laid the groundwork for a tougher time in the confirmation process. I want to get your opinion after you hear.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CAROLINE SUNSHINE, DEPUTY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, TRUMP'S 2024 CAMPAIGN: She used her time in that closed-door session where she was sworn under oath in front of Congress as the former attorney general and as Todd Blanche's former boss to say, he ran the whole process, and he was in charge of the whole release, and the Dow's at 50,000, right? And so she's now laid the groundwork for that to be a confirmation where Democrats can essentially have a lay-up and say, "There's no way I could vote for this guy."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: I don't think it's just Democrats. I think the issues that Todd Blanche's name is on right now are the Epstein files or just all things around it, the weaponization fund, and the prosecutions of opponents of the president that many of which are not popular with the public.

[06:35:01]

He's attached to those things. There are at least --

CORNISH: Meaning it doesn't matter if she leaned in on it.

WILLIAMS: It doesn't matter if she leaned on it.

There are probably eight senators who are either up for reelection or in their screw it YOLO phase. I'm doing whatever I want or just tough votes that Republicans need the votes of and they can't afford to lose a lot of them. The idea that this is just about Democrats, no, Republicans have a tough vote on you.

CORNISH: Yeah, and to your point, Thom Tillis, who may be part of that, the BOLO YOLO, I call it, also "Wall Street Journal", wounded bear caucus, says it's not an automatic yes vote in the committee. And he wants Blanche's answer to a whole other issue, January 6th.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. THOM TILLIS (R-NC): The key for Todd or anybody going through Judiciary Committee is being pretty tight on January the 6th. They better not have said for one minute that the people that -- that beat up police officers like these right down here were righteous people. You come even close to saying that you don't have a chair of getting my vote in judiciary.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Now I have to say Chuck Grassley is saying look, I actually think it's going to be fine. What are you guys hearing in your reporting? What do you see compared to what Elliott saying?

CARINE HAJJAR, WASHINGTON POST EDITORIAL BOARD MEMBER: In terms of Blanche, I mean, I do think they're going to be complicated questions. And not only you have some Republicans who like Tillis who are bringing up Jan 6, who have been talking about the Weaponization Fund.

But again, Epstein has become a problem, not just it's not just a tool for Democrats to say, look at this botched rollout that happened under the Trump DOJ. But a lot of Republicans have been really upset about this, too. And I hear from Republican voters who are frustrated with how --

CORNISH: There's like an Epstein voter, so to speak. I think they're a person who for which this is a litmus test on transparency, the thing ruling class. Yeah.

NOEL KING, CO-HOST & EDITORIAL DIRECTOR, "TODAY, EXPLAINED" PODCAST: You need to be as far away from Epstein as you possibly can be. And Pam Bondi just shoved them into --

CORNISH: No, not true, OK?

Pam Bondi was online on social media saying, not true. This is all caps. Okay, just so you know.

Take a look, Noel. She said, I praise acting A.G. Blanche's management of this Herculean task. I said his ethics are beyond reproach and that he is an incredible attorney general.

So she's taking issue --

HAJJAR: But let's zoom out here.

CORNISH: She didn't even let me get it out. You're new here, okay? But you're just, you're not buying it.

HAJJAR: Well -- again, this is a creation. Republicans created this problem for themselves. They created it by talking about Epstein and making promises they couldn't keep on the campaign trail. A.G. Bondi at the time talked about a client list. And then you have a lot of voters who are really interested in seeing all these things. And then you have a botched rollout and that erodes trust. And that's going to be a problem for a lot of the people. They're going to be hearing from their constituents and then voting in these confirmation hearings.

CORNISH: Yeah, and as long as Ghislaine Maxwell is like sitting in a comfier position, it feels like that constituency is not going to be appeased by the person who put there now being in charge.

WILLIAMS: Absolutely. And I would also say two things can be true. She can be praising his management and ethics and also throwing him under the bus on a matter that is incredibly popular or unpopular with a bipartisan selection of Americans. People are not happy on the right or left.

The only small little bit of what I will give Pam Bondi is that within the Justice Department, the deputy attorney general, which he was at the time, is the office that would do something like this.

CORNISH: Exactly.

WILLIAMS: It's the office that runs the department and would be overseeing a major investigation like that. Now, that said, look, if it were a terrorist attack or an assassination on the president, you don't get to say, oh, the other guy was doing it. At a certain point, you have to own what's happening in the building. But yeah, she's right. On practice, he's the guy that would have overseen something like this.

CORNISH: And transcripts are tough, like you said.

All right, you guys, I want to turn to one other thing, because when it comes to A.I., there's actually some lawyers getting in trouble because there are courts around the country beginning to challenge or even discipline attorneys for using fake case law that was made-up or hallucinated by artificial intelligence. Now, according to "Reuters", A.I. hallucinations caused disruptions in

at least seven court cases in the last two years. One large national law firm even sent an urgent e-mail to every one of its attorneys warning artificial intelligence can invent fake case law and using made-up information in a court filing could get you fired. That's right. It's time to lawyer up with CNN legal analysts, Elliot Williams.

All right, say more.

WILLIAMS: A.I. touches every aspect of our lives. We can, you know, we talked about it earlier in the program with respect to data centers and so on, but it affects the legal profession. And every industry, including lawyers, is figuring out how to make it work.

Now, a few lawyers in the Ninth Circuit in California got themselves in quite a bit of trouble getting sanctioned and barred from the court for six months for fabricating entire briefs with A.I. And when we use the term hallucinations, it's A.I. in effect making up facts making up information and A.I. made-up or at least fabricated the names of cases that these lawyers were citing which come on, that's the bare minimum that someone.

CORNISH: OK, I'm going to -- well, first of all I actually know a little bit about this story because I remember it was back in a few years ago --

WILLIAMS: Yeah.

CORNISH: -- Michael Cohen, who's turned on Trump, in some of his cases, he used Google Bard, right? And that was sort of a ha-ha funny thing at the time in that headline. But now when I look at lawyer surveys by "Reuters", this one was just last fall, 63 percent of lawyers are using it for work.

And I'm not surprised because the whole point of legal stuff is like there's a wall of books behind you and one of them has a clue to winning your case. It's all about information retrieval.

WILLIAMS: We need to ask everyone systemically in America needs to ask the question when we say use it for work, what does that mean?

CORNISH: Yeah, but it like makes sense for lawyers.

WILLIAMS: It makes sense for most things. So first is document review, the idea that many young associates make a lot of money having to go through documents and pull every time you see the word investment or bank. Well, A.I. can do that like that in a matter of moments.

Now, when you start getting into the world of what are the cases I ought to be citing and either fabricating or just pulling information that you as a lawyer have not read, that's a problem. It's a problem for you, for your clients, but also your license. You are putting your name on something and swearing to something that you don't know to be true.

CORNISH: The other thing I've been hearing is that people are overwhelming the courts because now they can file their stuff on their own because they have the A.I., right? You can just be like, oh, help me head of And now the courts are deluge with these like very extensively written complaints that someone has to go through.

WILLIAMS: Yeah, one of the greatest things about our legal system is that there's a very low bar for getting in and we almost invite people to represent themselves either if they can't afford an attorney or if they choose to proceed without one. I think what's happening now is that someone can write a 500-page brief with lots of citations. I did. It can be done.

You can literally type in, please make this 499.4 pages long inside this thing --

CORNISH: And now we know some of it might be wrong. So you literally have filed something massive to an overwhelmed court where there's probably a fake case in there.

WILLIAMS: Right. And so, you know, again, I don't have the answers as to what what's ethical or not in any industry. It's for everybody to decide. But, you know, just think when you do a regular Google search, even not as a lawyer, A.I. comes up at the top.

Now, are you citing to that thing or checking the site on your own? This is really a check for all, who are swearing to be ethical and transparent in court, but for everybody to look at what is this thing that I am asserting are my words, and it's just something that society needs to get a handle on before, you know, the robot overlords take us all over.

CORNISH: See, Elliot, I thought you would be the one segment where I would not be discussing A.I.

WILLIAMS: No, we have to. We have to.

CORNISH: You really messed it up for me.

Next on CNN THIS MORNING, we're going to be talking about the World Cup. There's been another snag for L.A. just one week ahead of the games. California Representative Sydney Kamlager-Dove joins us to talk about all things World Cup.

And in the meantime, my friend Ari Shapiro on engagement party in our podcast episode drops this morning. Check it out.

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[06:47:39]

CORNISH: We are less than a week out from the first matches of the World Cup, and we're learning what role immigration officials will play, maybe.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ROBERT LUNA, LOS ANGELES COUNTY SHERIFF: There will be federal agents. There are agencies represented here who have spoken because it's going to take all of us to make sure that the all the venues are scoped and unscoped events are secure. But in regards to civil immigration enforcement, they told us that specifically would not be occurring at any of the games. Any of that subject to change.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Subject to change. That's kind of an important detail at the end. It's not exactly easing fears.

At SoFi Stadium near L.A., 2,000 hospitality workers are ready to go on strike, and ICE is one of the reasons.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

YOLANDA FIERRO, WORKER AT SOFI STADIUM: The main concern, first of all, is the ICE issue being on the grounds. Myself and my coworkers are a little bit scared for coming to work because I do have a lot of employees that are here on working visas from different countries. They're in fear of if I get snatched up by ICE, who's going to take care of my family?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So joining the group chat, Democratic Congresswoman Sydney Kamlager-Dove of California.

I know you've talked a lot about the World Cup, prices of tickets, things like that, we'll get to that. But can you talk about this comment from the L.A. sheriff and whether or not this eased fears? Because it's sounding like, certainly to those workers, they're still worried.

REP. SYDNEY KAMLAGER-DOVE (D-CA): So last night I was reading some articles and you see pictures of all of these teams. They're deplaning and they seem very excited to get ready to participate at these games. And then you hear our sheriff say, well, we're going to do as much as we can to make sure folks are safe, but we kind of don't know if ICE is going to show up.

And Los Angeles is still recovering from the ICE raids. We're recovering from our senator being, you know, jammed to the ground. We're recovering from young children running for cover in MacArthur Park.

CORNISH: But there's new leadership at ICE and at Homeland Security. Are you not able to have a conversation? Have you not heard from them about what the plans are for an event of this scale?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Well, remember, ICE and CBP were putting ads on Facebook saying we will be at the World Cup. We will be watching you.

[06:50:01] And we haven't gotten any clear direction from Homeland Security about ICE's role in any of these World Cups. And we do know that this administration is still in their feelings about Los Angeles as a blue city standing up to Donald Trump. At the end of the day, we should be celebrating these teams and celebrating this sport and not worried if our workers and fans are going to be snatched up and deported.

CORNISH: The other thing fans are complaining about are ticket prices. I know you've also raised this, but I want to play for the audience, maybe for those who don't have tickets yet, what people are worried about. Here's one fan talking about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JACK CLARK, CO-FOUNDER, ANTHROPIC: A lot of these games and these prices are beginning to rebound. For example, Brazil versus Morocco is up $100. Argentina, Austria is up $80. Portugal, Uzbekistan is up $75.

Am I saying that every ticket's going to skyrocket? No. Some matches could even still get cheaper. But the idea that every World Cup ticket is guaranteed to drop before the kickoff isn't supported by the data that we're seeing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: I know you and I think something like 60 other Congress members actually wrote a letter to FIFA about this. Have you heard back? What is it that you hope they would do?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Well, I think these ticket prices are, in technical terms, a hot mess for fans and for cities. We sent a letter, we haven't heard back from FIFA, but the issue is dynamic pricing.

The other issue is you buy a ticket, you don't know where that seat is going to be, you're spending over $1,000, and finally you get the seat and you're behind a post and you can't see anything.

We want to know why ticket prices are changing so dramatically from city to city. I want to know why cities aren't getting any financial support from the World Cup to actually put on the games because World Cup is getting everything -- concessions, merchandise, parking tickets. I mean, Infantino is taking the entire bag and we have gotten no information and in fact when we asked, then they raised tickets more. So what is going on with that?

CORNISH: Okay, I have that same exact question, but for a different topic. The vote in California.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Yeah.

CORNISH: Several panelists this week have been like, why does this take so long? I know that there are sort of state rules about being able to cast that vote right up until election day by mail, which means some are going to arrive later. But at a certain point, it feels as though it's absurd. Other blue states are able to get their counts in. KAMLAGER-DOVE: Well, we're a big state. We're a big state. We count every vote. It does take time. We have, I think, 58 counties.

We are close to being done. I think they're about 600,000 votes left to be counted.

CORNISH: Oh, is that all? Do you have somewhere to go now?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: We have like 35 million people in this state. And we want to be accurate. Yes, it does take a little long, but I would rather my vote be counted than have it be snatched up by a sheriff like Chad Bianco who's trying to suppress the vote. So --

CORNISH: It will be this argument about suppressing the vote versus Trump sort of allegations and. Republican claims that, look, maybe this means there's cheating going on. The longer it goes, doesn't it open you up to speculation?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: No, I don't think so. I mean, obviously, the California, we're continuing to work through challenges, but I have complete trust in our secretary of state. I've actually been to the L.A. County Registrar. I have toured the facility. I see how they count, how meticulous they are. I have complete confidence in our system.

CORNISH: Okay. Our panel may jump in a bit, but I just wanted to ask you one other thing. I saw this moment. You're always good for an image in hearings, I think. Okay?

And in this one, you had this back and forth with the Secretary of State Marco Rubio. And you were also talking about issues of transparency in the administration. I'm going to try and play a good section of it so people can see what happened.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Oh, dear.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMLAGER-DOVE: We're talking pardons for sale. We're talking about no-bid contracts to those on Trump's family and friends plan. We're talking about a $1.8 billion slush fund.

And I think that's corruption. The American people think that's corruption. They want to know if you think that's corruption.

MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE: Okay. Number two, this goes right to the point of transparency. You're absolutely wrong about the way the money flows. It's pretty straightforward, and I'll share it.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: So I'm going to have to reclaim my time again, because the question about corruption --

RUBIO: They get to ask questions you don't get to answer? Why is she leaving? I'm going to answer her questions.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I will -- RUBIO: Oh, she's -- OK, I got it. Well, thank you for coming.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Why'd you leave?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: I left because I had another hearing and Secretary Rubio, who used to be a senator, knows that. So my time was up. I couldn't get any more time. I had to go to my next committee.

[06:55:00]

What you really saw was a secretary who was filibustering and upset because I was asking him for receipts. Five months ago, Donald, what you really saw was a secretary who was filibustering and upset because I was asking him for receipts. Five months ago, Donald Trump's administration commandeered Venezuelan oil, and we have had zero transparency into that money. The companies --

CORNISH: They're supposed to go through the Treasury and things like that, right?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Right. There's supposed to be an audit we haven't seen it. There are companies that have gotten these confidential licenses. Who are they? One of them was investigated for bribery by the DOJ. There was an employee at one of them that gave Trump $6 million for his campaign. And we want to know. We want to see those receipts. And I was asking him about that, and he was filibustering, and he was obviously triggered.

KING: Do you think voters really do care about corruption? Because I feel like this is really an outstanding question. What is going on in this administration, if you're following it carefully, is unbelievable.

And yet, you don't really hear very much about it from people who are not constantly watching the news, constantly thinking about what the administration is doing. And I wonder, is it a winning issue to say corruption, corruption, corruption, or does it become exhausting?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: It is exhausting, and my constituents believe that this is the most corrupt administration in American history. They were outraged by this $1.8 billion slush fund that could be going to January 6ers.

You have pardons for sale. You have no bid contracts going to people that are on Trump's family and friends plan. You have attorney generals and FBI secretaries that seem to be working for Donald Trump rather than the American people.

And the American people say, hey, this guy just took away my health care. The gas prices are going up and he's getting an arch and he's getting a ballroom.

(CROSSTALK)

CORNISH: You can hear the narrative sort of how it comes together. Yeah.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: And now you have -- we don't even know how much money is being siphoned from the sale of this Venezuelan oil and we can't see into it.

CORNISH: All right, welcome back to the Group Chat as well.

What is going on in your group chats?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Pete Hegseth. So there is this video that came out and he was supposed to be exercising with the Marines and it looked like he was about to get cut from a chorus line.

CORNISH: Well, what's been interesting about seeing the Pete Hegseth exercise videos is that people have reset them to other kinds of music. And you mentioned chorus line, it's happened in other things. To the point, very briefly, military recruitment is up. They have met their goals.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Okay, good for them. But I will also tell you that the Women's Caucus was trying to honor women veterans.

CORNISH: Yes.

KAMLAGER-DOVE: And it got shut down because of Pete Hegseth, because of DEI. So we can no longer celebrate women of color. We cannot celebrate women who are in the military. And that should shock and outrage everyone who wants to make sure that the most qualified, the most competent --

CORNISH: Never mind the firings that people have been --

KAMLAGER-DOVE: Exactly, or celebrated.

CORNISH: Carine, can you tell me, "Washington Post" editorial board -- can you tell me what is in your group chat?

HAJJAR: Well, what's in my group chat is something I think everyone can agree on, which is my dogs are adorable at home.

CORNISH: I thought you were going to say "Summer House", which has been the most consistent group chat. Okay, animals. Let's do it.

HAJJAR: On the left is our new family dog Luna, who is Rocky on the right's niece and My dad found out today, and this is what was in the group chat, or he found out this week, that she's been biting off the sprinkler heads in our yard. She's obsessed with water.

So they bought her another little sprinkler to keep her busy, but she's caused some damage.

CORNISH: I don't know about this headline, loves water. was on metal appliances.

HAJJAR: Kind of destructive but -- CORNISH: Elliot, for you?

WILLIAMS: Keeping it as serious as that. So, you know, the NBA Finals game two tonight, but Elmo from Sesame Street weighed in, hoping that both teams had fun. And as a New York fan myself, this sticks me a little bit. Elmo hopes some of these teams as well. Knicks, that last message, Elmo didn't mean to spur you.

But it gets worse. New York fans are shredding Elmo, one of them saying, this is not the time for sportsmanship, Elmo. These streets aren't Sesame.

CORNISH: What?

WILLIAMS: I hope Elmo -- I hope Elmo gets priced out and has to move to New Jersey. And don't you dare forget your roots, you red little F.

CORNISH: Oh my God.

WILLIAMS: This is worse than going after the Pope. This is worse than going after the Pope.

So again, Knicks fan, not Knicks fan. It's still New York, but New York's going to New York, you know?

CORNISH: So they're taking stuff for surfacing that important reporting.

OK, Noel, last word to you.

KING: My group chat is should I go see the movie "Backrooms", which is supposed to be terrible.

CORNISH: No, I'm going to see it today. Yeah.

KING: Okay, you tell me.

CORNISH: Well, because from the YouTube meme to YouTube to Hollywood pipeline, you know about this, about studios, they'd be worried because if kids are making the films on their own, what can they say yes or no to? Are you going to see any of these horror films?

KAMLAGER-DOVE: No. I live horror every day in the Congress.

(LAUGHTER)

CORNISH: That's the back room of the House of Representatives is what you're saying.

Okay, thanks to our group chat. Thank you, Congresswoman, for being here. We truly appreciate it.

I'm Audie Cornish and stay with us because the headlines are next.