Return to Transcripts main page

CNN This Morning

Trump's Doral G20 Choice Drew Past Outrage; Author John Hechinger is Interviewed about Fraternities; Obama to Rally with Abdul El-Sayed; People Use Chatbots for Voting. Aired 6:30-7a ET

Aired October 06, 2026 - 06:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:33:48]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN ANCHOR: So, is the president redrawing the lines when it comes to what's ethical for a sitting president? He's now revisiting an old idea, using his own properties to do government business. A new article from "The New York Times" points out how Trump, in 2019, first floated the idea of hosting a G7 Summit at his Doral Club in Miami. He then faced a flurry of criticism from many in his own party. He had Senator Lisa Murkowski flatly saying no when asked if she liked the plan. You had other Republicans who were opposing Trump for the 2020 nomination, calling it corrupt. Moderate House Republicans told Trump it was a bad idea as he faced impeachment.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. ADAM KINZINGER (R-IL) (October 18, 2019): I don't know if it's a direct violation, but it's -- I don't understand why, at this moment, they had to do that. I mean, do it in D.C. Do it in Miami at a different resort, whatever it is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: About two days after announcing it, the president backed down and he scrapped the plans all together.

Here we are, in a second term, seven years later, and those plans are back. The G20 Summit is set to happen at Doral in December. Hardly any protests being raised by members of his own party this time around.

And the group chat is back.

So, on one level, I think I can understand why we hear less criticism.

[06:35:03]

We played a clip of a Republican who is no longer in office, right? Like anyone who ever said anything bad about this kind of thing is gone. But what else do you think is the reason why he is less concerned about perception of corruption?

CHUCK ROCHA, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I think because you don't have to seek re-election. I think because the Supreme Court said that he is invincible and you -- has no accountability. And I also think it's really important for folks to know, in the regular government business, my firm makes -- takes government money from congressmen when they want to communicate with their staff or with their voters. It's called franking money. And before I can run an ad or a piece of mail to the constituents using your tax dollars, a whole slew of lawyers at Capitol Hill, Democrat or Republican, have to approve that to make sure that there's no politicking whatsoever in that piece of mail and that it's just government information.

CORNISH: Yes.

ROCHA: All that goes out the window when it's the president.

CORNISH: And he's just running ads paid for -- though recently I think the White House actually announced that he would begin paying for his own political ads going forward. No other detail on that.

You know, the other thing is, when he sat down for a two-hour interview with "The New York Times" back in January, he said, look, I got no credit for imposing limits on my own family, for example, in their business deals. And he was then asked, quote, "so why are you doing the deals?" And he told reporters, "because I found out nobody cared."

FRANCHESCA CHAMBERS, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, "USA TODAY": When it comes to the G20, I think there will be more focus on this as we get closer. I mean, it's not until December. But I -- but do like --

CORNISH: Why? Do you really think that?

CHAMBERS: I meant the G20 writ large. Writ large.

CORNISH: That's what I mean, who would raise it?

CHAMBERS: But I think to the point raised by Peter in "The New York Times," I was at that Doral summit in March that was held at the president's resort. It was not just Latin American leaders he held there. It was the House issues conference for the Republican Party that was also held there that same holiday weekend, or same weekend, I guess. And so, he has been having more of these events at his personal properties. It hasn't gone, I think, as much notice as there was in the first term.

There's a number of things that are happening. There's a lot of flood the zone with so many different things that are happening all of the time. I think it's hard to zero in on any one thing that's taking place.

CORNISH: Yes.

CHAMBERS: And this goes back to what we were discussing earlier in the show about how Democrats, if they take the House of Representatives, one of the things that will be facing them, as they say that they'll be looking into these, you know, investigations and potential impeachment of President Trump and cabinet members and all these people is that there is also seen by strategists as a risk to overfocus potentially on a bunch of investigations and then not get things done on affordability --

CORNISH: Yes, because you end up being like, who gave you these crypto donations?

CHAMBERS: On affordability after promising to get things done on affordability.

CORNISH: What is -- yes.

CHAMBERS: And so they have to weigh that with, you know, the push from inside the party.

CORNISH: But let me jump in here because there are so many different things people can look at and say, is that ethical? Is that corrupt? Is that legal? And if Democrats spend all their time trying to parse between the three things on so many things, and especially on so many of these special government employees, right, people he has brought on to do things.

ASHLEY DAVIS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE OFFICIAL UNDER PRESIDENT GEORGE W. BUSH: I mean, what's going to happen to him at -- what's going to happen to him? He's also doing all of this right out in the open. I mean this is the problem with the criticism of Hunter Biden is that he was -- like, you can say that Hunter Biden and the Trump sons are doing the same thing in regards to some of their business deals.

CORNISH: Yes, the orders of magnitude. But, yes.

DAVIS: Yes, but the sons are just kind of like, yep, we're investing in this, we're investing in that. So, there's, like, no gotcha there, which is kind of part of the story.

CORNISH: Yes, there won't be gotcha.

Also, I should mention one last thing. The number of federal agencies that are watchdogs that have been gutted since 2025, you've had 21 inspectors general fired or removed, more than two dozen FBI agents removed who would be looking into things like corruption. Office of Government Ethics, staffing cuts. And the Justice Department's Public Integrity Section has been stripped of power.

Next on CNN THIS MORNING, Cornell and Penn State put America's fraternities back in the spotlight and for all the wrong reasons. We're going to talk to an author who spent years investigating fraternities about what's wrong inside Greek culture.

Plus, more voters are turning to A.I. for help in making sense of the midterms. We're going to talk about how that's going to go.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[06:43:29]

CORNISH: First on CNN, faculty members at Cornell University are preparing for a vote of no confidence against the administration there over the handling of the 2024 alleged gang rape on campus. The resolution was submitted to the university faculty committee Monday and will be reviewed and put on the agenda when the committee meets next week.

On Monday, anger on campus boiled over. Hundreds of students and faculty members staged a protest demanding for change at the university.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And I think it's really a wakeup call that they need to change because the student body is not going to let Cornell continue to be a school like this.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: When someone comes forward with a story like Jane Doe did, it should be taken with the seriousness that it's being taken with now.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We stand with Jane Doe, but also we stand with taking more measures to prevent this from happening in the future.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: The reckoning is not stopping with just Cornell. It has some asking if it's time to ban frats altogether.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You can tell me it's about philanthropy and brotherhood. And, yes, that does happen in fraternities. But that's not why people are joining frats.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: At some point you need to understand, when an institution has become too corrupt, such as the fraternity system, when it has become a breeding ground for hate, for sexual violence, for corruption, it needs to be done away with.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: Joining me now is John Hechinger, senior editor at "Bloomberg News," but he's also the author of a book called "True Gentlemen: The Broken Pledge of America's Fraternities."

I'm really glad you're here. You have studied one fraternity in particular, but I think it's given you an understanding of the relationship between universities and frats.

[06:45:08]

Even though they've been on campus forever, why is it so difficult to get rid of one?

JOHN HECHINGER, AUTHOR, "TRUE GENTLEMEN: THE BROKEN PLEDGE OF AMERICA'S FRATERNITIES: Well, fraternities are really sort of baked into the fabric of college life. There are -- they own billions of dollars in real estate. They're often as important to people's experience as any academic department. And they remain very popular. About a quarter of a million men are members of fraternities. And their alumni are quite powerful. They hold positions in government offices and titans of industry. And so, when colleges try to crack down on them, there's often a big pushback. And it's often quite successful.

CORNISH: Is that why we see, for instance, when it comes to Cornell, you were writing that Chi Phi's punishment could be just an interim suspension. You saw that as an open door to them coming back.

HECHINGER: That's right. I mean, if you see what Cornell's president said over the weekend in his video address, and if you look on their website, Cornell still basically endorses fraternities. They say they need to have changes in culture, but they see fraternities -- like most universities, they see fraternities as partners, and they sort of advertise Greek culture. And many people come and try to join it. And they often don't sort of put out, you know, information about what's really happening behind closed doors about what the research shows.

And, you know, when it -- when you -- when it comes to sexual assault, for instance, what I found is that the research shows that one and a half -- that women who go to fraternity parties run one and a half times the risk of what's called incapacitated sexual assault, which is what's alleged at Cornell. And sorority members run three times the risk of rape. And it's worth pointing out that Jane Doe was a member of a -- of a sorority, the Delta Delta Delta.

So, you know, women find that they're not as -- as safe at -- when they're in Greek life as women on campus. Cornell's own research shows that more than half of women affiliated with Greek life said they experienced sexual assault. And it's this kind of information that's really creating great outrage right now that you saw in the video on campus.

CORNISH: The other story that I was seeing in the last couple of weeks was that Penn State, allegations of a cocaine ring which involved drawing in pledges to do the work of actually cutting and producing the cocaine. One of the things you write is that "most national fraternity organizations tend to provide little direct oversight of chapters which are governed independently on each campus." And I'm wondering about, like, who is in charge? Is it the chapter only? Is it the national organization, the university that's scared to take action? I don't under -- are you just in the international waters of law enforcement here as soon as you step into the door of a fraternity house?

HECHINGER: I mean, that's such a good question. The national fraternities will sort of authorize a chapter, and they'll provide sort of broad guidance. But part of the tradition of fraternities is what they call self-governance. That the men in the chapter house are in charge. And the national organizations kind of leave it to the universities to regulate. And the universities often find that they -- it's -- they're difficult to regulate. They can -- they can try to shut down the fraternity. They can even kick the fraternity off campus. And that's what's obviously happened in, you know, in many cases, in some of the worst cases, they're shut down. But if they do it for too long, the fraternities then go underground. And the problem is that if the fraternity then continues to operate, they have absolutely no regulatory power. And even if they say later that, well, we, you know, this was an unauthorized fraternities, if their students are involved, it's still going to reflect poorly on the university and they'll still be held responsible.

So, the fraternity -- the colleges are really in a real bind. They really -- they either -- if they authorize them and they behave badly, then, you know, it's what happens. You see what happens at Cornell. And if they don't, then they lose all power.

CORNISH: I'm out of time, but I have to ask this one other question, because I like to follow the money. Who is insuring this? Like, if this is a system of poor oversight on campus, civil lawsuits after the fact, I'm unclear financially who is carrying the bag here?

HECHINGER: Well, there are only a handful of insurers that will take the risk of insuring fraternities, which I found are -- they're sort of rated with waste dumps in terms of their risk.

[06:50:00]

And what fraternities have found, the national fraternities have found that they will protect themselves with their insurance policies. And if something bad happens, like there's underage drinking that leads to a death or there's a sexual assault, they'll say that, well, you know, our policy was violated and the individual students will then be -- will be liable. So, the students that -- the fraternity -- the policies protect the national. They don't protect the men. The men find themselves on their own. Their parents, their parents' homeowners insurance policy will then kick in and they'll find themselves facing years of civil litigation, as we're seeing in Cornell. So, there's kind of a -- everyone is kind of protecting themselves. And really no one is protecting the students from this kind of misbehavior.

CORNISH: John, thank you so much. I really appreciate your time.

If you want to know more, his book is called "True Gentlemen: The Broken Pledge of America's Fraternities."

Now, I want to turn to this on the campaign trail. You've got Barack Obama stepping off the sidelines, trying to repair some fractures in the battleground of Michigan. So, in a few weeks, he's actually going to headline a Detroit rally alongside progressive Senate nominee Abdul El-Sayed. With Senate control on the line and early voting kicking off that same time, Democrats basically have to lean on a big hitter to rally the base.

Guys, the reason why I wanted to talk about this is because there has been a lot of conversation about how El-Sayed and, frankly, some DSA members in general, how they perform with older black voters. Michigan has become a test of this. And to give an example of the way he's trying to kind of reach across these divisions, here's Abdul El-Sayed in August.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ABDUL EL-SAYED (D), MICHIGAN SENATE CANDIDATE: I am Arab. I'm also African. My family immigrated to this country from Egypt. I'm proud of my African heritage. And when people try to divide us based on identity or ethnicity, sometimes we miss the nuances that make us whole and that make us human.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: So, I'm not saying he has no black support, but obviously there's some issues in Michigan he's trying to deal with.

ROCHA: There's a reason why this is the first state that really -- Obama's really went to do a stand up, and that's because of what you described. If I take people back to the primary, it's important to know that he lost the African American vote pretty handily in the primaries. So the --

CORNISH: The other Democrat in this. Yes.

ROCHA: And there's a difference between getting 70 percent of the African American vote and 95 percent. And that's where Abdul is right now.

CORNISH: Yes.

ROCHA: He needs to get his number up.

CORNISH: Did you know you -- I had this stat.

ROCHA: I did not know. I'm just a really good political strategist.

CORNISH: So, support for Michigan Democratic Senate candidate Abdul El-Sayed. I guess you do know things.

ROCHA: Yes, I do.

CORNISH: Black voters at 76 percent. Close, as you said.

ROCHA: Whoo, bingo (ph).

CORNISH: Other non-white voters, which I think is going to encompass a good amount of the Arab and Arab Muslim community in the area --

ROCHA: Arab American. Yes.

CORNISH: Sixty percent. and white voters, just 47 percent.

ROCHA: Do presidents matter -- do former presidents matter?

ROCHA: Only if they're black and named Obama in this case.

CORNISH: Well, that's kind of the argument around Trump, right? Do presidents matter at all?

DAVIS: No. Right. Y es. CORNISH: And maybe the answer is in the era of nationalized politics at every level it does.

DAVIS: But are people like, oh -- I mean, I say this about celebrities too. Like it's the whole thing. Like, just because Taylor Swift likes you, I'm not going to vote for you because of that.

CHAMBERS: But heading into an open presidential election where there'll be an open contest, I mean, former President Barack Obama continues to be, you know, the biggest name, highest Democrat, and his wife, Michelle Obama, that you can -- that you can possibly get out there on the campaign trail. And recall, Audie, that when he had that phone call with Abdul El-Sayed, we --

CORNISH: Oh, yes.

CHAMBERS: We talked about this, about how that could prove to be a time. But then Obama gets out on the trail for him because that's kind of the pattern we've seen when he spoke to Mamdani and then appeared with Mamdani afterwards, and now you're seeing that here with El- Sayed.

CORNISH: Are we seeing Obama in Texas? You got a hat?

ROCHA: I don't know if he'd go to Texas. But I have noticed when he starts walking out on stage, he's got this John Wayne walk now when he walks out on stage and I like it a lot.

DAVIS: That's because he's getting older maybe.

CORNISH: There are limits.

ROCHA: I walk like that and that's because my giddy up. I've got a hitch in my giddy up.

CORNISH: I don't know what any of those words mean.

ROCHA: Anyway.

CORNISH: But it's also interesting because there's multiple toss up races, right? There could be any number of places he could be helpful.

ROCHA: It's not just about his appearance to -- Ashley's point's exactly right. It's more about the clips and about the press and the talk and the chatter. That's what you need is that excitement. That's why he's there.

DAVIS: And I'm not criticizing -- I mean good for him for going because he -- I mean it's not a criticism at all.

ROCHA: What person doesn't make --

CORNISH: Yes.

DAVIS: But I just don't know what that -- if it changes. And I don't know that -- CORNISH: Here's my guess. It's in our next segment. And it is awareness because there are some people who basically are going into their chats and they're opening their claws and they're tippity- tapping, asking who they should vote for.

So, a new article in NPR saying that people are asking ChatGPT to help them figure out the midterms for themselves.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I went on to ChatGPT and I said, ChatGPT, I'm filling out my ballot. Ask me whatever questions. You know, ask me ten questions that's going to help me understand better who I should vote for.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: After I started telling it who I voted for, it started learning a little bit more about what was important to me, because I would tell it why I chose to vote for that person.

[06:55:05]

As I moved through my ballot, it got easier and easier for ChatGPT to make a solid recommendation for me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CORNISH: All right, so that's how they're using it. What do you think?

ROCHA: I think it's trying to take my job and I am anti this whole episode of this thing right now.

CORNISH: It's OK. We can put a hat on it.

ROCHA: I don't --

CORNISH: What are you thinking?

CHAMBERS: About -- I mean about the A.I.? I mean --

CORNISH: Well, maybe because the White House has frequently talked about bias in A.I. Elon Musk talked about Grok as some sort of counterbalance to what he saw as --

ROCHA: Woke internet.

CORNISH: Woke internet. So, there is this perception on the right that tech companies and the way tech works is inherently woke and you need to change it. And I think that goes against people's idea of thinking, if I go into the chatbot, it's going to give me an objective response.

CHAMBERS: So, what we've seen from the White House is this morally binding document that they had. Tech leaders --

CORNISH: Morally binding, yes.

CHAMBERS: Tech leaders sign. And they're going to self-police themselves. We'll see what Congress ends up doing on the issue of A.I., potentially, in the next Congress. You know, there's been a push to regulate A.I. better. We'll see if that comes up in the lame duck. Maybe it'll come up next year.

CORNISH: I'll show you guys just "Washington Post" actually tried to look at the political bias of some of these apps. We're going to put it up there. A lot of blue. Some red, as you can see. I mentioned Grok. So, there is already a question about whether or not you are getting kind of an objective response, which people are going to say the same about journalists, but I feel like they have different expectations of the A.I.

DAVIS: But if that's how you're going to get your information and you feel, if you put things into the feed that you care about, and here's the candidate that cares about it. But I mean, listen, I downloaded Muse, the new -- oh, it's the new Meta little guy.

CORNISH: The Meta -- yes.

DAVIS: And he's adorable. And I've named him Pepper. And I tell Pepper that --

ROCHA: He's your new assistant. This --

CORNISH: Hi, Pepper. Is this like having a Tamagotchi?

DAVIS: Well, I, like, tell him good night.

CORNISH: But one that could take over the world?

DAVIS: I'm like, night, Pepper.

CORNISH: Yes.

DAVIS: Like, my husband's like, you got a problem.

CORNISH: Oh, OK.

ROCHA: Absolutely.

DAVIS: But he's adorable.

CORNISH: So, we know what's in your group chat, it's your Muse Tamagotchi.

DAVIS: It's really my pumpkin. I --

CORNISH: Do we have a picture of your pumpkin?

DAVIS: Well, not my pumpkin, but the world's largest pumpkin, because I had to -- I thought we were going to show it because that was the whole point. But it was the counter to your big bear.

ROCHA: Oh, you have a big pumpkin. That's nothing to the big bear.

DAVIS: Yes. It was, like, won the pumpkin award. ROCHA: Backpack won the bear contest.

CORNISH: It's fat season. OK.

ROCHA: I sent it to Audie because I was so happy. Anyway, that's not my group chat.

CORNISH: Yes.

DAVIS: You sent it to me too.

CORNISH: Chuck, what about you?

ROCHA: So, I want to connect two things. We've been talking a lot about the Latino vote as we get close to the midterms. And we've been talking about A.I. data centers. And come to find out, these A.I. data centers, before they got all sexy, when they moved into white people neighborhoods, were sitting in the middle of the barrio. And Latinos are very anti this. And so, this is another reason you see this surge of connecting the A.I. data centers and the Latino vote.

CORNISH: Yes. We talked about this in terms of the power outages that happened near black communities over the summer, they were frequently near, I'm not saying, you know, correlation is causation, but they were near almost like super power data centers.

ROCHA: And it's another reason for renewables as well. This is -- all of this stuff merges together of all these people being angry and -- have a lot of anxiety around these data centers.

DAVIS: You can't take energy off the grid anymore. So, I -- we need to -- this is a longer conversation about it.

CORNISH: Yes, the conversation.

ROCHA: I'm right about it, just to be clear.

DAVIS: Yes, you're right (ph).

CORNISH: OK. Well, early in the week. What's in your group chat?

CHAMBERS: I know, I felt like I ended it on a very serious note last week --

CORNISH: No, no, we -- it's only Tuesday, girl. I still have to do it wording (ph).

CHAMBERS: So, no, I came with something -- so I came with -- yes, I came with something a little lighter hearted.

CORNISH: OK, lighter for Francesca. What is this?

CHAMBERS: No. No, no, no, no, no, I did. I have a lighter hearted one.

So, have you all been watching Ted Lasso this season? The season four? CORNISH: Oh, yes.

CHAMBERS: Yes. Yes. OK.

ROCHA: Don't spoil it but I haven't seen it.

CHAMBERS: Well, have you not seen this season or have you never seen it?

ROCHA: I've seen all of it except this season.

CHAMBERS: OK.

CORNISH: Well, we can tell you the basic premise.

CHAMBERS: Yes, I'm not going to -- I'm not going to spoil it for anybody because they just had the season finale last week. So, I'm absolutely --

DAVIS: Oh, I didn't realize that.

CHAMBERS: Yes, yes, so I'm not going to spoil it for anyone. But it hasn't been renewed yet as far as I know for season five. If anybody knows about that, let me know.

CORNISH: OK, people, we're losing focus.

CHAMBERS: OK.

CORNISH: So, basically, the season this time, it's a women's team.

CHAMBERS: Yes. It's a women's -- it's a women's soccer team. He comes back to coach a women's soccer team. The reason I'm so personally invested in this is because Jason Sudeikis is from the same area as me in Kansas. And the first episode of the season, without spoiling it for anyone, is based in Kansas City. And so, this season, then he comes back, obviously, over to England to coach this women's team.

You were saying, what is -- what is -- why do we care about this? It's been a feel good comedy that started during the pandemic. Then, you know, it ended.

CORNISH: Yes.

CHAMBERS: And then Jason Sudeikis brought it back now. And it's --

CORNISH: I thought people would criticize it for being woke and then somehow it was -- like, it --

DAVIS: No, it --

CHAMBERS: Actually, when it debuted, the season four, this latest season, it debuted with very, you know, high viewership on Apple TV.

CORNISH: Yes. I mean just as good.

CHAMBERS: People have been very into it. So, we'll see if it gets a season five. I'm into it. I'm into it.

DAVIS: You mean woke because of --

CORNISH: I just thought as soon as there were women, some people would be like, it's not the same thing. But it's pretty much fine.

DAVIS: Oh. Yes, I watch it. I don't like watching (INAUDIBLE). But, yes.

CORNISH: Before we let you -- I found your pumpkin.

[07:00:02]

ROCHA: Oh, my God.

DAVIS: Oh, where is the pumpkin?

ROCHA: Here we go.

DAVIS: Oh, my God, it's huge.

ROCHA: No, there is no pumpkin.

CORNISH: Yes, there it is. It's a very big pumpkin.

ROCHA: Oh, look, he's not as big as the bear.

DAVIS: He went --

ROCHA: The bear was bigger.

DAVIS: But the pumpkin win -- this guy, this grandfather wins every year. Oh, But I do have a serious group chat. There is going to be a run for minority leader in Republican -- on the Republican side if we lose the House.

ROCHA: Oh, that -- OK, Ashley, that's boring.

CORNISH: OK. I'm sorry. I'm sorry we've run out of time. I'm Audie Cornish. "CNN NEWS CENTRAL" is next.