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CNN Tonight
New Jobs Push; Health Care Fight; Kennedy's Replacement; Troop Surge; Severe Weather in the Midwest; Excess TARP Funds
Aired December 08, 2009 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tonight, the president's new plan to get Americans back to work. Billions in leftover bank bailout money is the key.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: A new foundation for lasting economic growth.
YELLIN: Republicans are outraged.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The idea of taking this money and spending it is repulsive.
YELLIN: Does anyone have a fix for 10 percent unemployment?
From the climate change conference in Copenhagen, word that this decade is on track to be the warmest on record.
And you're behind on your mortgage? You pick up the phone and you hear this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I want my money and I want it now.
YELLIN: Did calls like that literally hound a Florida man to death?
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN TONIGHT live from New York. Here now, Jessica Yellin.
YELLIN: Economists have declared the recession over. But the vast majority of Americans say, no way. Not with the unemployment rate still at 10 percent. With that level of national pessimism, President Obama today announced his new plan to bring jobs to Main Street. It's a combination of tax breaks for businesses, rebates for consumers, for weatherizing their homes and spending billions more on infrastructure.
The president says the nation can afford it because the financial system bailout did not cost as much as expected. But Republicans in Congress, as you might expect, they aren't buying it. Dan Lothian reports tonight from the White House.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE) DAN LOTHIAN, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just in time for the holidays, the White House is re-gifting, looking to tap unused bailout funds to increase lending to small businesses and tax credits to encourage them to hire, although that would require congressional approval.
OBAMA: And given the challenges of accelerating the pace of hiring in the private sector, these targeted initiatives are right and they are needed.
LOTHIAN: Laying out his plan at the Brookings Institution, the president also called for more infrastructure investment to create jobs modernizing highways, railways, bridges, seaports and a new proposal to give Americans rebates for making their homes more energy efficient. But Republican critics are already picking the president's proposal apart, especially on using TARP money to create more jobs.
REP. JOHN BOEHNER (R-OH), MINORITY LEADER: This makes me so angry. I was there, all right. I know all about TARP. First, it was never intended that all of this money would ever have to be spent, but any money that wasn't spent was to go to the deficit. And the idea of taking this money and spending it is repulsive.
LOTHIAN: But the Obama administration sees more spending as a way to lift the economy and create more jobs.
OBAMA: Those who claim we have to choose between paying down our deficits on the one hand and investing in job creation and economic growth on the other, this is a false choice.
LOTHIAN: It's false, says the president's top economic adviser, because employed Americans are an asset.
CHRISTINA ROMER, WHITE HOUSE COUNCIL OF ECONOMIC ADVISERS: We know that putting people back to work is the -- one of the crucial things you can do to help the deficit because when people are working again, they're paying taxes again.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LOTHIAN: The administration is really trying to strike a balance here between creating those jobs and paying down the deficit. That's something they say they'll focus on. In fact, a senior administration official saying that they hope to use between tens of billions of dollars, perhaps as much as $100 billion for deficit reduction from the TARP fund -- Jessica.
YELLIN: Dan, look, a new jobs program is essentially a stimulus by another name.
LOTHIAN: (INAUDIBLE)
YELLIN: So are they suggesting at the White House that the first stimulus just didn't work?
LOTHIAN: They're not. And in fact, that has been the criticism. They're saying that the first stimulus has worked, it has created jobs. It has sparked economic growth. And they say when you look at the economy it's at a much better place now than it was a year ago. But what they hope is that through these proposals that it would really accelerate the recovery effort because there's still a lot of Americans out there who are out of work.
YELLIN: So many Americans, thank you, Dan Lothian, at the White House.
Tonight abortion opponents have lost one battle in the debate over health reform. The Senate has rejected an amendment that would have tightened restrictions on federal funding for abortions. Democrat Ben Nelson of Nebraska was one of the senators who backed the amendment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SENATOR BEN NELSON (D), NEBRASKA: The amendment does not take sides on abortion. It's about the use of taxpayer money. The question before us is whether public funds for the first time in more than three decades should cover elective abortions.
SEN. HARRY REID (D-NV), MAJORITY LEADER: This is a health care bill. It's not an abortion bill. We can't afford to miss the big picture. It's bigger than any one issue. Neither this amendment nor any other should be something that overshadows the entire bill, overwhelm the entire process.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YELLIN: And it's day nine of Senate debate on health care. And now Dana Bash joins us live. Dana, you've been following this minute- by-minute. This vote may be over, but the issue of abortion certainly isn't.
DANA BASH, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Not even close, Jessica. Abortion definitely still threatens to derail the whole health care bill. And in the short term certainly complicate things for passing health care in the Senate. Why? Because Ben Nelson, who was a sponsor of this abortion amendment, which failed, he has said in the past that he would vote no on health care unless it passed.
Now, obviously, people who have been following this know that Democrats are in a spot where they have 60 senators who align themselves with the Democrats, so they need every single Democrat to vote yes, for the most part, in order to pass health care. Well if they lose Ben Nelson, then that could put in jeopardy this health care bill. Nelson told our Ted Barrett (ph) just a few minutes ago maybe this isn't such a bright line for him, so maybe they can overcome that obstacle in the Senate.
But long term, Jessica, they still have an issue with the House because in the House that health care bill passed with the tough restriction, so melding those two is going to be incredibly hard because anti-abortion Democrats in the House, they've proven that they can block health care without those restrictions, so still a very tough job to get this done, to get health care to the Senate -- to the president's desk because of abortion.
YELLIN: And Dana, abortion is only one of the deal-breaker issues here, another issue that divides Democrats, of course, is the public option, we've all heard so much about it, so negotiations continue on that. What is the latest with the public option?
BASH: Well, big picture, Democrats in the Senate have -- liberals and moderates have pretty much come to the conclusion publicly that they can't pass a public option in the Senate health care bill. So these -- there have been five Democrats -- excuse me -- five moderates and five liberals, 10 Democrats altogether and I can put them up on the screen for you, they've been negotiating. In fact they're negotiating as we speak, marathon talks to try to find an alternative to a public option.
Let me put up on the screen for you some of the ideas they're talking about instead of a public option. First, not for profit private insurance plans and those would be run by a government agency, by the Office of Personnel Management. That would appeal to conservatives who don't want anything government run -- government funded, I should say. On the liberal side, what they're looking for instead of a public option is to expand Medicare to allow people 55 and older to buy into it.
They say that would expand health care coverage and there's something else they're talking about and that is having more reforms for the insurance company. These are some things that they are discussing. Again, they're meeting right now. We were told earlier that they were hoping to have a deal on this by tonight, but it's unclear if that's going to happen.
And I'll just give you one quick example. They were also talking about expanding Medicaid. Well we're told that that is probably out because moderate Democrats in that meeting, they have said it's just too costly, too much of government involvement. That just gives you a sense of how different the philosophies are among Democrats, people in the very same party on this issue.
YELLIN: All right, Dana, thank you so much. Impressive you can bring us so much detail. We know these talks are being held in secret. Thank you.
BASH: Thank you.
YELLIN: And on now to national health care, which was Senator Ted Kennedy's lifelong dream -- today voters in Massachusetts, they went to the polls in a special primary election where turnout had been low. It is the first step toward choosing a replacement for Ted Kennedy, who died last summer of a brain tumor. Our senior political correspondent Candy Crowley reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN SR. POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The primary campaign for the Senate seat of a very big name has gotten very little attention, but it's game day. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm totally excited. I love Election Day.
CROWLEY: The Massachusetts special primary election for the U.S. Senate features the co-founder of a youth service program, the Massachusetts attorney general...
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I feel very confident. We're going to get our voters out.
CROWLEY: A U.S. congressman.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My job is to get more votes than the other guy. It's not this secret way to do things.
CROWLEY: And the co-owner of the Boston Celtics.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We need jobs. We need health care and that's really why I'm running.
CROWLEY: Over the past three months four Democrats had debated the hot issues of the day disagreeing mostly around the margins of the health care debate but largely this is seen as a struggle between non- household names to put on the mantel of a giant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ted Kennedy taught me lots of different things.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I worked with Senator Kennedy and Hatch on the (INAUDIBLE) Act.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We've got to change the way we pay for health care. Senator Kennedy knew that.
CROWLEY: There are two candidates running in the Republican primary, State Senator Scott Brown (ph) and attorney Jack Robinson (ph). State Republicans insist with the passing of Kennedy and the issues, the time is right for a Republican to win this seat. Strange things do happen in politics, but whoever wins the Republican nod is a long shot in the general election next month. They are fighting among other things the echo of history.
STEPHEN PAGLIUCA, DEMOCRATIC SENATE CANDIDATE: I'll fight for universal health care and I'll fight for the legacy of Ted Kennedy.
CROWLEY (on camera): The Republican nominee will also face some formidable stats. It's been more than 30 years since Massachusetts elected a Republican senator and Ted Kennedy's seat has been Democratic since his older brother John F. Kennedy won it 56 years ago.
Candy Crowley, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
YELLIN: As the climate change conference continues in Copenhagen, we'll look at whether green industries can really generate millions of jobs for Americans.
And America's two top officials in Afghanistan go before Congress to defend the Obama surge.
Also, the so-called White House party crashers say, guess what, they'll plead the Fifth if Congress forces them to testify.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
YELLIN: Defense Secretary Robert Gates today made an unannounced visit to Afghanistan. The secretary held a joint news conference with Afghan President Hamid Karzai. Gates said the U.S. remains committed to Afghanistan. He said the first of 30,000 additional troops will begin arriving in Afghanistan over the next few days. President Karzai, who is under pressure to clean up a corrupt government, said reforms are already under way. He also said Afghanistan will need international assistance for up to 15 or 20 more years.
Well the deployment of those 30,000 troops was clearly on the minds of two of the president's advisers today. General Stanley McChrystal, the top U.S. military commander in Afghanistan and Ambassador Karl Eikenberry (ph) were both on Capitol Hill answering questions on the U.S. role in Afghanistan. Jill Dougherty has our report.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN FOREIGN AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Two key players running the war in Afghanistan. A few months ago, they appeared to differ on more troops. Now they're marching together.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Ambassador Karl Eikenberry (ph), an old friend.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And friend of many years.
DOUGHERTY: And saluting President Obama's strategy.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The mission is not only important, it is also achievable. We can and will accomplish this mission.
DOUGHERTY: Members of Congress itching to question General Stanley McChrystal on President Obama's target of July 2011 to begin withdrawal. McChrystal says it's not a deadline.
GEN. STANLEY MCCHRYSTAL, U.S. COMMANDER IN AFGHANISTAN: And by the following summer of July 2011, I think the progress will be unequivocally clear to the Afghan people. And when it's unequivocally clear to them that will be a critical decisive point.
DOUGHERTY: But McChrystal says he'll do what the president wants.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It is a solid decision the president has made and I operate under the assumption that we will begin to decrease our forces beginning in July of 2011.
DOUGHERTY: The general appears to go further than his president, repeatedly talking about winning, defeating the Taliban by making them irrelevant.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Preventing the Taliban from being an existential threat to the government of Afghanistan and thus to the Afghan people. So rather than wipe out every Taliban member, what we need to do is lower their capacity.
DOUGHERTY: Ambassador Karl Eikenberry (ph) brushes off reports that he wasn't on board.
SEN. JOHN MCCAIN (R), ARIZONA: Several cables that you sent back that were classified secret and yet were revealed to the media that indicated you had strong reservations about surge, those reservations been resolved in your mind?
KARL EIKENBERRY, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO AFGHANISTAN: Senator, 100 percent with the refinement of the mission, with the clarification on the ways that we're going to move forward and the resources allocated against this, absolutely.
DOUGHERTY: And sharp questions about Afghan President Hamid Karzai.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We know that it's been completely and totally corrupt.
DOUGHERTY: But despite misgivings Eikenberry expressed to President Obama in private. He now says...
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: President Karzai in his inauguration address he did talk about efforts to go after corruption.
DOUGHERTY (on camera): In a striking moment General McChrystal said he did not make a recommendation to the president on the 2011 date for beginning the withdrawal of forces, the keystone of President Obama's strategy. But he says I'm comfortable with the entire plan.
Jill Dougherty, CNN, Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
YELLIN: And coming up, the president's push for green jobs, but are green jobs quality jobs? We'll speak with two experts on the issue.
Also, those White House party crashers -- guess what, they say they'll take the Fifth if forced to appear before Congress.
And a powerful winter storm pummels the Midwest and threatens the East Coast -- those stories and much more next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK) YELLIN: Those so-called White House party crashers they're going to take the Fifth, they say if they have to testify before Congress -- that's the word today from their lawyer in a letter to the House Homeland Security Committee. The letter says Michaele and Tareq Salahi (ph) will exercise their constitutional right against self- incrimination if called. The committee is expected to vote tomorrow to subpoena the aspiring reality TV stars.
You'll recall two weeks ago tonight the two showed up at a White House state dinner and got through security even though they were not on the guest list. The House committee is investigating the security breach, as is the Secret Service, but so far no charges have been filed against anyone.
And turning now from political storms to winter storms, the nation's weather -- deep snow, strong winds and freezing temperatures are blowing across the country tonight. Parts of the Midwest are now under a blizzard warning with officials cautioning people to stay home. Jacqui Jeras has the very latest for us from the CNN Weather Center -- Jacqui.
JACQUI JERAS, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Jessica, just incredible conditions expected tonight in terms of that winter weather across the upper Midwest. You know so far throughout the day today, the snow hasn't been that brutal but by tonight the wind's really kicking in. This is a huge storm. Look at how much of the screen -- it really takes up about half of the United States. And you can see snow in the north, rain in the east and severe weather here along the Gulf Coast.
We even have tornado warnings that we've been dealing with. The heaviest snow at this hour is right along the I-80 corridor and down to the south of there. Snow is coming down so heavy, maybe an inch or two per hour. Take a look at these pictures from Des Moines, Iowa, earlier today where the snow has been coming down for the most part pretty light. It's had between five and six inches so far. Winds at this hour gusting to 26 miles per hour, watch them to increase to maybe even 50 miles per hour.
And you know Iowa big, wide, open flat plain, so that snow is not only is going to create the whiteout conditions with the wind but we're going to see some really amazing drifts that go along with it. So you have travel not advised there. And take a look at some of the airports, too. We've got big time problems at Chicago O'Hare (ph), not to mention many flights which have already been canceled, Atlanta with the rain over an hour here, Minneapolis more than two hours delays, Charlotte getting in on the action as well as Midway and Tetaboro (ph).
If you do have flights in this area make sure you do call ahead because chances are they're going to be delayed if not canceled altogether. Now snowfall totals for this entire storm expected to reach a foot easily most likely right along the Des Moines area to the north here up towards Minneapolis and on to parts of Wisconsin. This will continue throughout much of the day tomorrow and the storm system is going to continue to track on off to the east. As it does that, believe it or not, we could see some further intensification. And there you can see our area of low pressure. And it's going to push towards the Great Lakes. Winds will be very strong. The Ohio River Valley, by the way, tomorrow could see wind gusts beyond 50 miles per hour, real concern about the potential for some power outages here.
The warm sector of the front, notice this, up and down the Eastern Seaboard here, we're going to be seeing rain and so heavy, several inches can be expected. We've got some flood watches, which have already been issued in advance of the storm, which includes you into New York City. Now, once the storm pushes off the seaboard, we're going to be seeing those cold, frigid conditions begin to push on in.
The lake-effect snow machines, which have been really nonexistent all year, are finally going to kick in. Wind chills are going to be reaching dangerous levels in the upper Midwest in particular. This is what you're going to wake up to tomorrow morning. Look at that, 20's, teens below zero. And the worst of it will likely be on Thursday morning where we could see some 30's, even 40's below zero, so that will take your skin maybe 10 minutes to freeze in conditions like this, so a very brutal winter storm. We're just really ramping this up in terms of the worst of the winter weather with it in the Midwest -- Jessica.
YELLIN: Brutal really is the word for it. It's just terrible. But it's actually creating some good conditions for some folks over in Hawaii, isn't it?
JERAS: Yes, believe it or not, it's all kind of interrelated. We've had a number of storms in the Pacific Basin and these storms create really large swells because the winds blow over the water. Take a look at these pictures of these waves that have gone all the way down to Hawaii. Look at that.
There have been reports of 40 to 45-footers. And it's actually a very dangerous thing because they're concerned about coastal flooding, that some homes could be washed away, in addition to some of the roadways getting flooded. But this is fantastic news for the surfers, for the seventh time in the last 24 years they started this surf competition, the Eddy Icau (ph) Surf Competition.
You have got to be invited to it because you have got to be a professional in order to handle conditions like this. But they officially started this competition out there today, so a lot of people hanging 10 and having some fun with some dangerous waves.
YELLIN: Well I'm glad someone is benefiting. Thank you, Jacqui -- Jacqui Jeras.
And still ahead tonight, what to do with the leftover financial system bailout money? President Obama says it should go to create jobs on Main Street, but critics say it should pay down the deficit.
And imagine getting a call like this from a bill collector. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: "You haven't heard the last of me and if it takes me a year or takes me two, believe me, I will find you."
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YELLIN: A Florida woman takes a debt collector to court claiming calls like that led to her husband's death.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN TONIGHT live from New York. Here again, Jessica Yellin.
YELLIN: President Obama today outlined a new proposal to put unemployed Americans back to work. He wants to use unspent bailout money to create jobs. But as Ines Ferre reports, not everyone thinks that's such a good idea.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
INES FERRE, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just over a year ago Treasury Secretary Paulson and President Bush announced the Troubled Asset Relief Program or TARP. Created to save the banking industry from collapse, there's been nothing but controversy over the $700 billion program, designed to buy up toxic assets from failing banks.
OBAMA: There's rarely been a less loved or more necessary emergency program than TARP, which as galling as the assistance to banks may have been, indisputably helped prevent a collapse of the entire financial system.
FERRE: Unemployment is at 10.2 percent. More than two million families have lost their homes to foreclosure since the start of this crisis. A new CNN poll shows 84 percent of Americans think the economy is in a recession. Treasury Secretary Geithner says there will be $200 billion unspent when the TARP program expires at the end of this month. Democrats are pushing to use at least some of that money for job creation programs. But acting on voters' anger over the bailouts and sky high deficits, some Republican senators are saying not so fast.
SEN. JOHN THUNE (R), SOUTH DAKOTA: They shouldn't be recycled, re-spent, reused and allowing TARP to become what is essentially a political slush fund to be used for whatever the administration decides to use it for.
FERRE: TARP money not spent would automatically go towards reducing the deficit at the end of the year, unless Congress changes that. Where the money ends up going is likely to generate a political fist fight in Washington.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
FERRE: And despite the $200 billion feeding frenzy, there's still no consensus among experts or policymakers about how to prevent financial institutions from taking the risks that forced the bailout in the first place -- Jessica.
YELLIN: And now they'll be an ongoing fight about how to use the bailout money next. Thank you so much.
Well, the white house plan is just the latest controversy over T.A.R.P. the Congressional oversight committee is about to release a December report, a detailed review of T.A.R.P. to date. Elizabeth Warren is the chair of the T.A.R.P. Congressional oversight committee and joins me now from Washington.
Elizabeth, so good to see you again. The bailout, we know, was unpopular, as the president acknowledged today. But I remember a year ago, the prognosticators were warning of economic calamity. People certainly are hurting today, more than 60 million unemployed. But a second great Congressional didn't happen. So could we argue that the bailout actually worked?
ELIZABETH WARREN, CHAIR, TARP CONGRESSIONAL OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE: Absolutely. One of the things that we conclude in our report, which will be out tomorrow, is that the bailout was part of a larger, strong government response that probably kept this economy from tumbling over the abyss. So in that sense, we have to admit T.A.R.P. did its job. Now, T.A.R.P. was also supposed to do a lot of other things and we should also evaluate along those metrics. But for the number one thing, that is stop the crisis and stop that feeling that it's all tumbling into depression, it did it.
YELLIN: All right. Let's talk about some of the other things. It was supposed to unfreeze credit and make sure credit was flowing. It was supposed to help keep jobs and businesses from laying off employees. It was supposed to help homeowners in some way through a trickle-down effect to keep their homes. How well has it scored on some of those measures?
WARREN: Not well. And that's the bottom line for this report. And we're going to go through each one of those. But you've really hit the key ones. I would only add to it, it was also supposed to help the banks clean up their balance sheets, to put them in a position where they would be more stable over time. And, in fact, remember, it was named the troubled assets relief program. The money has not been used for that. But T.A.R.P. also came with one other piece. That is, it has now created an implicit guarantee, so that we have the notion that if the largest financial institutions, the ones now called too big to fail, get into trouble again, that the American taxpayer will be forced to come to the rescue. So T.A.R.P. did some really good things, but it has really created a different economic environment.
YELLIN: I want to come back to too big to fail in a moment about but let me stick with T.A.R.P. and some of the issues it failed on. You've been an outspoken critic of some of the ways it was monitored, the way -- the lack of transparency. What do you think is the fundamental problem here? Do you think that the officials in the treasury department are too close to Wall Street? WARREN: You know, it -- the T.A.R.P. program has had the problem from the beginning that it has been really, really good at shoveling hundreds of billions of dollars into the largest financial institutions. Man, it managed to cut through the paperwork and do that on, you know, two pages in the space of hours that it could make that happen. For homeowners in financial distress, people facing foreclosure, we're a year into this and right now we're just seeing the tiniest little trickle of help go to homeowners. On the jobs front, we've watched the jobs get worse and worse as small businesses have been unable to get credit. So it really is fair to describe this program as saying, the part that put lots of money into really big financial institutions, boy, did they figure out how to make that work in a hurry. And all the rest of it, no one could ever quite seem to get it off the ground.
YELLIN: You can give me a simple yes or no on this. Would Wall Street bonuses be as big as they are this year if it weren't for T.A.R.P.?
WARREN: No.
YELLIN: So let's talk about the positive, what we could do next, what could change? There is financial regulation moving through Congress right now. I know you're a big advocate for one element in all of that, to change this too big to fail concept. Is it possible for government to end too big to fail? Or is that sort of un-American? Should we not be telling banks how they can run their own business?
WARREN: No. In fact, I think it's just the other way. The American economy, a capitalist economy, a free economy runs on the principle that if you really mess it up, you will be held responsible. You know, every family in America, every business in America, every small bank in America, everyone except the largest financial institutions have to pay the consequences if they get out there and take big risks and end up having a bad business plan, a bad outcome, messing it up.
YELLIN: So have you saying the government should break up big banks?
WARREN: No. What I'm saying is we need to find a way that we can credibly say, believably say to every financial institution, the same as we do to every other business and every other family -- if you mess it up bad enough, you, too, can be liquidated. In order to do that, we can use a combination of what's called resolution authority. I'm of the old school. I call it bankruptcy. And regulation to try to prevent that from happening in the first place. But this is the bill that's now trying to work its way through Congress. Until we get that bill in place, we live in a world where these largest financial institutions can take all the risks they want and you and I are going to be on the hook to pay for it if they mess it up.
YELLIN: Finally there's an idea of creating a new agency designed only to protect consumers, to eliminate credit card tricks and traps, make sure your bank is honest with you. The opponents of this say it's really a back doorway for government to control big business, tell them what kind of credit cards we can or can't get and it would limit innovation. Is this an anti-business measure?
WARREN: No. This is a pro-family measure. What this is really about is saying, we have a credit card market and other consumer market now that's just plain broken. You can't compare credit cards anymore and tell what the real cost is. You can't compare mortgages and tell what the real cost is. This says we're going to have simple product that people can make direct apples to apples comparisons. And when they do that, they will know exactly what costs they're taking on. They will know what risks they're taking on. And if they can make choices in the marketplace, then the market starts to work for them. We think costs are going to go down and consumer choice ultimately is going to go up. You know, there is nothing that we touch, taste, feel or smell that doesn't have underlying it some basic safety regulations except for consumer credit. That's the area where you can be tricked and you can be trapped by your credit card company, by your mortgage company, by a payday lender and you won't know until after they've already taken the money from you. We can't live in that world anymore. It doesn't work for families. It doesn't work for our economy.
YELLIN: Elizabeth Warren, we'll look forward to reading your report tomorrow. I know there's some news in there. Thank you for joining us.
All right. Still ahead, where are green jobs? They are supposed to stimulate our economy. We'll be joined by two experts with very different points of view.
And debt collectors harassing homeowners, how some collectors in Florida went too far. We'll have a special report.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
YELLIN: Thousands of police and first respond he recalls attended a funeral service in Washington today for four police officers killed last month. About 2,000 police and fire vehicles joined the procession to the Tacoma Dome for the service. Tacoma officials say 20,000 police officers and firefighters from around the country and Canada attended the service. The officers were gunned down by an ex-convict with a long criminal record at a coffee shop November 29th. The suspect, Maurice Clemmons, was out on bail at the time of the murders. Clemmons was shot and killed by a police officer two days after those shootings.
Ohio today became the first state to use a single-drug method for executions. Most lethal injections executions contain a mix of three drugs, but the single-drug method supposedly is less painful. A convicted killer was executed under the new method this morning. Ohio had changed the one-drug lethal injection after a failed attempt of putting a different inmate to death in September.
And for millions of Americans facing foreclosure, getting a call from a collection agency can be very stressful. Each year, thousands of harassment complaints are filed against debt collectors. As John Zarrella tells us, one Florida woman is suing a collection agency saying those harassing calls went too far. (BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Here's how debt collectors are supposed to treat you on the phone.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I wanted to inform you and I am obligated to inform you this is an attempt to collect a debt.
ZARRELLA: This is how they're not.
Diane McLeod says the call is one of hundreds her husband got before he died of heart failure. How many phone calls a day would you get?
DIANE MCLEOD, WIDOW: Six, seven. There might have been more.
ZARRELLA: McLeod is now suing Green Tree Servicing LLC with using harassing tactics that broke Florida law and she claims led to her husband's death.
MCLEOD: The stress just built up with him. He had trouble sleeping. Not eating well. The stress was getting worse and worse for him.
ZARRELLA: The company's general counsel told CNN, quote, "The collection activity did not lead to his death. The claim is meritless. We deny that the content, the number or the timing of the calls had anything to do with him dying in 2005." After a heart attack and continuing heart problems, Stanley McLeod went on disability in 2002. The McLeod's fell behind about three months on their mortgage payments. The calls began. This one after explaining to the collector he had been life lighted to the hospital. Scare tactics, charges McLeod's attorney, Billy Howard.
BILLY HOWARD, CONSUMER ATTORNEY: That's how these mafia-like tactics result in so much money, people are scared.
ZARRELLA: Howard says this is not an isolated incident. He's got hundreds of cases involving other clients. Now, how would you feel if you got a call like this -- or this one?
ANNA INGLETT, PHG RECOVERY SERVICES: We want them gone. We want all of them gone.
ZARRELLA: Anna Inglett runs a debt collection agency. She says collectors breaking the law should be prosecuted.
INGLETT: Sometimes the industry is penalized for a few bad apples. We try very hard here at our firm. We absolutely make sure that we're in compliance.
ZARRELLA: With the recession, the number of people in debt has gone up and so have the number of complaints against debt collection agencies. According to the federal trade commission, between January and June of this year, they received 45,000 complaints. That's up more than 20 percent over the same period last year. But the FTC has only one case pending. Referring most complaints to the states for legal action to protect consumers. Attorneys say if you get harassing messages dorks what Stanley McLeod did. Save the tapes.
John Zarrella, CNN, Tampa.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
YELLIN: Unbelievable story.
Up next, green jobs. Are they a myth or a reality? We'll ask two experts where the green jobs are and if they really can stimulate the economy.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
YELLIN: There's new evidence tonight that global warming is not slowing down despite recent fluctuations in temperatures according to a report released on the second day of the climate change conference in Copenhagen. As the debate rages on, there is much talk about whether the so-called green jobs can put millions of Americans back to work. Joining me now for more on these so-called green jobs are Daniel Weiss, senior fellow and director of climate strategy at the Center for American Progress and Fred Smith. He's president at the Competitive Enterprise Institute. Thank you so much for joining us tonight.
Let's start with you, Dan. 16 million Americans out of work, a major stimulus bill already out there and money being poured into the economy. We heard all this talk about green jobs, saving the economy during the campaign. Where are those jobs?
DANIEL WEISS, CENTER FOR AMERICAN PROGRESS: Well, first, thank you for having me. It's important to note that over the last ten years, before the Bush recession began, that there were 800,000 clean energy jobs in America and the rate of growth was twice as fast as regular jobs. Then the recession hit. Now we're going to be investing a lot of money as part of the recovery plan, but a lot of that money hasn't gone out the door yet because they want to make sure it's going to be well spent. So it's taking a little longer than people would have liked. Nonetheless we expect there to be thousands of jobs created as part of this recovery efforts investing in wind, solar, energy efficiency, which will also save people money. So we think that those jobs will become apparent once the money gets spent. Less than 10 percent has been spent so far.
YELLIN: There's a lot money that's been promised but yet to get out there in the economy. But, Fred, let me ask you. You have been a doubter all along. This does sound very promising. It's on almost do well while we do good. Get people jobs and improve the environment. How can you possibly be opposed to this?
FRED SMITH, COMPETITIVE ENTERPRISE INSTITUTE: Well, promises are wonderful. Realities are something else. Remember, those early jobs were shovel-ready jobs right out the door. Now we see they're much slower. Other nations have tried this green jobs program. Spain is the leader of those programs in Europe. They've spent fortunes on creating green jobs. One of the professors at the John Carlos University in Spain did the analysis and found out jobs were created. For every one job were created for every one job created, two plus jobs, 2.2 jobs were lost. We haven unemployment rate of 10.2. That's a tragedy. In Spain, it's 19 percent. If we work hard, we can have the 19 percent that Spain has by wasting money on make-work jobs and failing to free the private sector up to create real wealth-creating jobs.
YELLIN: You can also argue that the computer destroyed jobs, but also created new jobs in a new economy. Let me ask you, Dan, can you describe -- let's get specific, what are some of the new economy jobs that you could foresee America moving into in a green economy?
WEISS: That's a great question, Jessica. First of all, the jobs are not, you know, people with lab coats and beakers. These clean energy jobs will be a lot like the jobs we have today in manufacturing, in construction, in service. But what they'll be doing is doing things that will be involved in manufacturing or installing new clean energy technologies. For example, a closed down Maytag plant that used to make washing machines in Iowa is now making parts for wind turbines. A closed steel plant outside of Pittsburgh is now making super efficient windows that are much more energy efficient. Those are the clean energy jobs of the future. And we need to invest in them, because certainly our economic competitors like china and other countries are. As President Obama has said, the question isn't whether or not there's going to be a clean energy economy. It's whether we're going to have those jobs created here or by inaction, we're going to have them created in other nations.
YELLIN: Let's listen to one of the president's proposals. He is outlining something that's being called cash for caulkers. He described it today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OBAMA: I'm calling on Congress to provide a new program for consumers who retrofit their homes to become more energy efficient, which we knows creates jobs, saves money for families, and reduces the pollution that threatens our environment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
YELLIN: They say this program, the supporters, that it could create or save 600,000 to 850,000 jobs over two years. Fred, what do you think of cash for caulkers?
SMITH: Well, we had for cash for clunkers.
YELLIN: It worked! It helped stimulate the economy.
SMITH: It moved car sales from one time to another. It didn't help increase sales. What we're doing is trying to improve the productivity of the United States economy. We've heard about wind power. We have to have backup power. Two power units. If every American home was required to have a gas stove and an electric stove, there would be times that would be equipment and it would massively increase the cost of our economy into bureaucracy areas that the president seems to prefer. Bureaucracies don't create jobs. Government programs can make make-work, but they don't make the productivity jobs. We may very well find ousts in trouble in America, but it's going to happen because of what we see in America, but if these kind of programs continue, these programs will be in China, not the United States.
YELLIN: Dan, I feel like you're itching to respond to that so have at it.
WEISS: What this so-called cash for caulkers program does is create an economic incentive and provide some capital for people to help make their homes much more energy efficient. That means not only will they save energy and create jobs, they'll also reduce pollution. And they'll save money. The way it will work, it will help people who work at companies like Home Depot or Lowe's or other companies that sell home improvement materials. It will also help people in the contract industry by creating more demand. And there's been horrible unemployment in the construction industry. So this program is designed to get people back to work, help make our homes more efficient, and save consumers money. It's win, win, win.
YELLIN: Look, Fred, if some of these green jobs programs, at the very least, help save America on their energy bills and employ people for the short time, where's the harm in that?
SMITH: We don't have to employ people to tell us to change, to fix the holes in our windows, to tighten up the drafts in our room, to energy less when it becomes more expensive. These are jobs that are redundant, in any rationale society. It's only if you believe that the Americans are a bunch of children who the Dans and the bureaucrats have to lead by the nose to understand their own self-interest. If these are self-interested jobs, and there are areas, obviously, where we should be saving energy, but we don't need government to tell us how to do that. We're smart enough to cut our own lights. We don't need bureaucrats. That's not work, that's make-work.
YELLIN: So, Dan, are you a small child or a bureaucrat become.
WEISS: Well, Fred, not everyone's capable of hanging their own windows or installing new insulation in their home or caulking seals or, you know, replacing a door. Not everyone is capable of doing that. What this would do is help provide them with money so that they can hire someone to do that, putting people to work and saving them money in the long run. And that --
YELLIN: Dan, that money's not free. That money's not free. We've already got a deficit. Let's use the money we have recovered from this badly thought-through T.A.R.P. program and use it to reduce the deficit and a leave a future for our children.
WEISS: Once you start employing more people, it will cut the deficit because there'll be more tax revenue.
YELLIN: This is a debate that will continue to rage and we'll continue to cover it. Thank you for joining us. Thank you Daniel Weis and Fred Smith.
All right. Tune into CNN tomorrow morning beginning at 6:00 a.m. for an exclusive interview with former Vice President Al Gore. I'm sure he'll be addressing some of these issues. Send your questions to ireport.com. He'll answer your questions and give us his take on the global warming controversy, as well as the climate change summit. That's tomorrow morning on "AMERICAN MORNING" starting at 6:00 a.m.
And coming up at the top of the hour, a Campbell Brown special, "Global Warming: Trick or Truth?"
What do you have, Campbell?
CAMPBELL BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: Well Jessica we are taking you around the world tonight to try to get some answers on global warming. Scientists from across the globe say urgent action is needed right now, but this hacked e-mail scandal has skeptics saying, not so fast. Who is really telling the truth, who has their facts all wrong? We'll get into that.
And we have the very latest details in a massive airport security breach. The TSA posts its screening secrets online for everybody, including potential terrorists, to see. We'll find out how in the world this could happen. Jessica?
YELLIN: I want to watch that. We'll tune in. Thank you, Campbell.
And here's something you have not seen in a while, the old AOL/Time Warner logo. And guess what, this has the last time you'll see it. Time Warner and AOL will officially split tomorrow. This ends what has been called one of the worst business mergers in business history. The two companies merged in 2001 in an attempt to create the world's largest, most diversified media company. However, investors lost about $200 billion when the internet bubble collapsed. Time Warner is the parent company of CNN.
And still ahead, heroic pilot, Captain Sully, is turning to eBay to raise money for two schools in California. We'll tell you what he's selling. That's up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
YELLIN: Pilot and hero Captain Chesley "Sully" Sullenberger is once again helping others. Captain Sully, who miraculously landed a US Airways jetliner in the Hudson River in January is auctioning off his hat and a personally written note on eBay. The proceeds will go to two high schools in east Oakland, California. The current bid is more than $4,000.
And finally tonight, Capitol Hill is getting into the holiday spirit. House speaker Nancy Pelosi lit the capital Christmas tree tonight. The tree, an 85-foot blue spruce, came all the way from Arizona where schoolchildren made the more than 6,000 ornaments.
Thanks for being with us tonight. Please join us tomorrow night. Next coming up is a Campbell Brown special, "Global Warming Trick or Truth?"
