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CNN Tonight

NTSB Says, Southwest And FedEx Jets Came Within 100 Feet Of Collision; Biden To Deliver State Of The Union Address Tomorrow; LeBron James 36 Points Away From NBA All-Time Scoring Record; Lebron James Nears Scoring Milestone; Rep. George Santos Accused Of Sexual Harassment; Beyonce Breaks Record For Most Grammy Wins; Spy Balloon During Trump Presidency. Aired 10-11p ET

Aired February 06, 2023 - 22:00   ET




ALISYN CAMEROTA, CNN ANCHOR: Good evening everyone, thanks for tuning in, I'm Alisyn Camerota. Welcome to CNN TONIGHT. We have a lot to talk about.

We are one night away from what will be the unofficial kickoff of Joe Biden's likely re-election run, also known as his state of the union address. What case will he make to the nation to elect him to a second term? A lot of political types think it's not just what he says, it's how he appears. President Biden would be 82 if he wins re-election. He's already the oldest American president ever. Is that why so many people are still on the fence?

Plus, LeBron James is on his way to breaking the NBA's all-time scoring record. Remember when he was advised to just shut up and dribble? He did not take that advice. Now, he's just 36 points shy of Lakers legend Kareem Abdul-Jabbar's record. We will talk about it.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Is it stressful at all, the chase?

LEBRON JAMES, LOS ANGELES LAKERS: No, because it was never a goal, it was never a journey. The stress so far for me is competing every single day.


CAMEROTA: Also, nerve-racking moments in the sky. First, it was the near-miss at JFK when two planes packed with passengers nearly collided on the runway last month. That was a Delta flight. It had to abort its takeoff, as an American Airlines flight cross the runway right in front of it.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (BLEEP). Delta 1942, cancel takeoff plans. Delta 1942, cancel takeoff plans. UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rejecting.


CAMEROTA: Well, there was another near miss this weekend, a FedEx plane and a Southwest Airline 737 came within 100 feet of each other. Experts say it was the pilot of the FedEx plane, not air traffic controllers, who averted disaster at the last possible moment.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Southwest 708, confirm on a roll.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Southwest, abort. FedEx is on the go.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Turn right when able.



CAMEROTA: Okay. Here in studio with me to talk about all of this, we have CNN's famous John Berman, also Political Commentator S.E. Cupp and cultural critic Kierna Mayo, also joining us as former FAA Safety Inspector David Soucie.

David, I want to start with you. What was that? 100? They came within 100 feet of each other, those two planes. What happened? How does that happen?

DAVID SOUCIE, CNN SAFETY ANALYST: That is so narrowly avoided. I mean, if the FedEx person had not -- if the pilot had not been on the ball like he was, you've got to understand when you're flying in like that and you're getting ready to land, you can't really see anything underneath you. He saw that as he was coming in and aborted his touchdown just at the last few minutes. 100 feet is not long. That airplane itself from ground to tail is only about 60 feet itself. So, 100 feet is not a lot at. This should not have happened.

CAMEROTA: David, I don't get it. How did it happen? I mean, isn't this what air traffic controllers are supposed to be avoiding?

SOUCIE: Yes, they are. And they do have, in most airports, 35 of the largest airports have ground surface device that tells them where the airplanes are and where they're moving and when they're not moving. And this one, this airport, does not have that. So, that would've helped them. But you can't rely on that. You still have to make your decisions.

The only thing I think could have happened here is the air traffic controller as Southwest to takeoff and Southwest took a little longer than normal to actually hit the guns and go. So, that could've caused the timing to be off. But it should never have been that close in the first place. If that airplane hadn't taken -- made the go-around, they would've landed right on top of that airplane, we would've had one of the worst aviation disasters on our hands.

CAMEROTA: John Berman, are you aware that I'm a nervous flier? How have we talked about this?

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: I can't imagine why. Now, look, the way I look at this, all the joy and comfort has been sucked out of flying. I mean, you know, they don't give you leg room, they don't leave on time and --

CAMEROTA: They don't give you peanuts anymore.

BERMAN: No peanuts. The only thing left was to get you there presumably in one piece --


BERMAN: -- most of the time. But now when you see this, and you see what happened a few weeks ago, you're wondering if they are losing the threat even there.



CUPP: Listen, this is very unsettling. I am also a nervous flier. And just the visual of being in a plane knowing that could've just happened. But the good news is it is a really safe time to fly. It's still a very --

CAMEROTA: Well, it used to be. I mean, I used to take part in that, but it does feel as though these incidents we've just seen a few of them in the past few months that are making you nervous.

CUPP: It's true, but facts don't care about your feelings, Alisyn. And it really is.


CUPP: No, I get that because we hear these stories. But just because we're hearing them doesn't make them all that popular. In fact, it's a very safe time to fly. I talk to pilots, I talk to aviation experts. They say it's really hard for planes to crash these days. So, take a little solace. Take a little --

CAMEROTA: That's a hard sell to a nervous flier.

CUPP: I know, I know.

CAMEROTA: I mean, who wants to -- I'm very much so.

KIERNA MAYO, CULTURE CRITIC: Very much so, and you have to do it. Like we live in a world, we have to get around. But these things do not endear any kind of confidence. It makes you feel like I'm putting my life in these people's hands.

CAMEROTA: And you are, by the way. MAYO: And you are. I mean, and granted and everything S.E. I'm sure statistically it's what it's always been. It's far more dangerous to get behind the wheel of a car.

However, the lack of control, like we already realize that we have no control over on a airplane. Can you keep us naive and ignorant? Do we have to know about 100-foot distance? I can throw a ball 100 feet. I can't throw a ball. Like I could've hit that plane out the window, that's ridiculous.

CUPP: But, you know what, I'm worried about as a flier, because I travel a lot too, I'm more worried these days, about my fellow travelers and the freak-outs that we are seeing on TikTok and Instagram. That's --

BERMAN: Well, that's in 100 feet, it's going to take care of them too.

CUPP: Okay. All right, let's not be fatalistic. But like I'm more worried about the people sitting next to me these days, which is awful, an awful thing to fear the passenger next to you.

CAMEROTA: Yes. I don't want to worry about either one of them, and I totally agree with you. But, David, S.E. is right, of course. I mean, air travel is safe. And it's much safer than driving. However, do you think these things are happening? Are there more nervousness lately or was that just my imagination?

SOUCIE: Well, it depends on the scope and what you look at it. If you look back in 2016, there was maybe seven or eight of these that had happened in the entire year. As we move forward, there were years of less and there were years of more. When they happen closely together like this, it does tend to make everybody really nervous.

But you have to realize, the tens of thousands of people that their entire job is trying to make this flight safe for you. And this is tell you how many tiers of safety there are, including the air traffic control monitors that they have. But then again, each of the pilots is looking after the safety of passengers on board.

So, the fact that this was a safe flight tells you that even when things go wrong, there's very many tiers to make sure that something doesn't go deadly wrong. You have to make sure that you understand that to be able to get there and fly and understand how much safety and how many levels of safety there are to prevent these things from happening. And it is -- it can worry you. I understand that.

CAMEROTA: S.E., by the way, facts do care about my feelings. Because here they are right now, I have a full screen of airline issues in just the past month. January 11th, FAA system outage halts domestic air travel. That was also nerve-racking. I don't like it when a whole system goes down, okay?

CUPP: Sure, not a safety issue but okay, I guess.

CAMEROTA: Okay. Coming up, hold your jets. CUPP: Okay, go ahead.

CAMEROTA: January 17th, near collision at JFK airport, we've talked about that. February 3rd, a United plane clips another plane at Newark --

BERMAN: So, that wasn't a near-miss. That was a hit.

CAMEROTA: That was a hit, okay. February 5th, the near-collision that we've been talking about at Austin.

And if that isn't enough for you, S.E., just look -- I wanted to show you the animation that we did of how close they came to each other, okay? So, this is the FedEx plane, trying to land, and this is the Southwest Airlines trying to take off. Watch this, please. Oops. That's what happened right there.

CUPP: Yes, that's terrifying. Yes, that's terrifying. Yes, I have to fly very soon. I am terrified of that happening now. And let's keep playing it over, and over, and over again so that I don't sleep tonight.

CAMEROTA: Okay. No, I won't do that. I won't play -- oh, I guess I will. Here we go.

But, David, I know that you have also talked about how there's no FAA administrator, but doesn't really affect -- does that really affect what's happening on the ground? I mean, does that -- that's a suit in Washington, D.C. Does that really trickle down to what happens on the runway?

SOUCIE: Yes. You know, when you think about these big, broad scope things that might affect things, and in this case, it actually does, because you look at this air surface detection system and it's only and 35 airports. Why is it not in more? And you look at the fact that the systems went down, the air traffic control systems, the NOTAM system that went down.


I really relate that directly to the fact that there has been more interim FAA directors than there have been FAA directors in the last five to ten years. So, it's something to look at.

And here's the reason that this system take a long time to develop. They take six to ten years to go through the life cycle, the development life cycle. And in those times, when you change administrators, the systems don't get the attention they need, they don't get the funding they need, it changes all the time. And so it's hard to get a system completely redone and stay in current. So, they end up putting patches on old systems that were designed back in the 60s and 70s and they keep putting these patches on them to make them safe. They're still safe. But they could be improved, much to be able to handle all the different changes and the complexity.

This is immeasurably complex, as you can imagine. And there are a lot of people trying to make it safe. And, again, it is the safest way to travel. There's no question. Can it be improved and would it be improved by an administrator who is in the seat for more than four years? Absolutely. I've been touting that for many years, as you know, Alisyn.

CAMEROTA: Yes. I don't want to think there's gaffer tape patching together my plane somewhere or even in the system. But I take your point, David. Thank you for being voice of reason with all of this.

All right, stick around everybody. He's our oldest sitting president ever and it looks like Joe Biden wants another four years. Can he convince America in the state of the union address tomorrow on why he should be re-elected?



CAMEROTA: All right. President Biden getting ready for the state address tomorrow night. It's his chance to sell the voters on his second term. So, do voters want to hear about his many accomplishments or will they be focused on how he looks and sounds?

Back with me John Berman, S.E. Cupp and Kierna Mayo. John, what's the answer to that?

BERMAN: I think it's both. Look, I think that it's no secret that Joe Biden is not a young man at this point. And I think largely that's bake into the cake. I think Americans have come to accept they have a much older president of the United States. But every time he does a big public thing like this, I think people are watching.

By and large, every time he's done a big public thing like this, for which there has been planning to teleprompter speech, he has hit that mark in terms of his age. I think the bigger question for him is how does he approach? Does he approach this as a launch for his 2024 presidential campaign? And if so, what is he running on? He has benefited I think largely, politically, for a few years now from instead of telling people what he's for, proving to people who he is not. He has sort of succeeded in opposition to things for years. And I'm curious if he continues to try to hit that mark saying, well, at least I'm not these guys.

CAMEROTA: But, I mean, he also does stand for unity, he talks about that a lot, building bridges, he talks about his accomplishments a lot. I mean, I don't think he only defines himself as not being Trump.

BERMAN: I'm not saying that he only defines himself as not being Trump. I think a lot of his political success has come from that. If you look at the midterms where Democrats did better than I think people expected they would, I think that success came from not being Trump, not being some of the Republicans. I don't think it came from the infrastructure bill and whatever bipartisan omnibus things they got through.

CAMEROTA: True. MAYO: Messaging issues still the Democrats not getting through. I beg to differ. I don't know that mostly people are paying much attention at all to any of the successes. I think they're just stuck on the fact that he's an old man.

CAMEROTA: Why could they do differently?

MAYO: Yes. But, I mean, you do with what you have, right? So, we have Joe Biden, so we go on with Joe Biden. But I think that fervor matters, timing matters. Like we're in an age of media and things have to make sense and they have to click and they have to be pretty and they have to -- all the things. And I just feel -- I'm afraid that Joe Biden, not just because of the age, but because of the messaging, or the lack thereof, that he's just going to have an uphill battle.

CAMEROTA: Yes. I mean, listen, I'm often on the air when Joe Biden is going to make a speech. So, I am a captive audience. I listened to more of Joe Biden's speeches and I think a lot of Americans do. So, it's not lack of messaging. I'm not sure where they're not hitting the mark and why his poll numbers aren't higher because he definitely does messages many times a week about his accomplishments. But I take your point and yours, John, that it's not resonating.

CUPP: Well, a couple of things. I think one of the mistakes he made leading up to the midterms was he didn't completely read the room. He talked about the strong economy and how great the country was doing and his numbers could have been right. But that's just not how a lot of people felt.

And so to feel people's pain was a gift of Clinton's. I'm not sure it's a gift of Biden's. And tomorrow, I would hope that he would acknowledge that people are still feeling pinched at the pump and at the grocery store. He doesn't have to pretend that doesn't exist. I'd lean into it and say, we have got a lot of work to do.

I would also, to John's point, keep making the contrast, because the threat is still inside the House. And I think he would be wise to talk about not the things Republicans are going to do, the stuff they've already done and stuff they want to do more of. I would call out how asinine and crazy and extreme some of the stuff is that Republicans want to do.

And I make the case if I were Joe Biden that I'm rational, common sense, I'm not going to blow the place down, I'm not here for the disruption or the destruction, I'm here to get us on the right track. That might be good enough of a message for a re-launch if that's what tomorrow's partly about.

MAYO: We hope, we hope. I'm afraid the vice president has been a layer.

CAMEROTA: Let's talk about that. And so is that part of what will go into people's calculation for his -- if they're reelected again?

MAYO: Well, listen, I mean, if you think about the coalition, right, the coalition, the reason Biden is there is not because of a bunch of old white men. It's everyone else, right? But if everyone else is invisible in whatever is happening, positive or not, it's a problem for that core coalition that said, yes, we're going to give you a shot.


I hate to say it but representation absolutely matters. Obviously, the vice president is a very busy woman doing a lot of work, hard things that we're never going to know about.

CAMEROTA: And why aren't we knowing about that?

MAYO: That's the question and that's back to my point about messaging, and why don't we see her, why don't we feel her, why doesn't she have a platform in his administration where we can tangibly feel a black woman at work?

CUPP: But can I take a guess, and I don't know the answer. And I don't doubt that she's working hard. I'm that one of the people who's like, she's not doing anything. I think she's working very hard. It feels to me like talking too much about Kamala or putting Kamala Harris up out front is somehow going to make Joe Biden look less capable, look older, look less fresh, less new. And I just think that sucks because she is part of why I voted for him.

I'm a Republican. I voted for Joe Biden because I thought, well, he's not crazy and he was to make America good again. But his vice president mattered. He could have picked people that I would not have voted for. He picked Kamala and I thought, she's smart, she's not too progressive, she's going to fix some problems. Where has she been?

BERMAN: You think they should put her out more, make her more a public face of the administration? Do you think that would be good politics at this point?

CUPP: I want to hear more from her. And I feel like the reason they're not is to protect Joe Biden, and I think I kind of sucks.

MAYO: And I just think that if that is the play, it's a bad play, because it doesn't protect him, it doesn't make him look like a partner. What we wanted in them was a partnership, and so that partnership matters.

CAMEROTA: Do you have a theory on this one?

BERMAN: I don't. I'm not sure it's because of fear of how it will make him look. I get the sense from the reporting that's been out there that they haven't been overwhelmed with joy in some of the things that she has been out in front of, whether it be immigration early on or other things. But, you know, I certainly think it's plausible (ph).

CUPP: Don't you think she can withstand questioning from the press, questioning from members of Congress about where she has been on these issues? Hiding her does her no service.

MAYO: Or him.

BERMAN: The Lester Holt interview, though, early on with her, though. And, again, so, the answer is yes, I think she could do very well from the press, but there is the perception in that big first sit-down interview that she did do, she didn't do as well as they were --

CUPP: She didn't answer honestly and he pushed her on that. That was an appropriate relationship.

CAMEROTA: All right. Well, we shall see how they choose to play it tomorrow night.

Okay. Meanwhile, only 36 more to go, and with the Lakers playing tomorrow, LeBron James could be about to break the all-time scoring for the NBA. As John knows, I'm a sports buff. And so we're going to be talking a lot about this. This is basketball, John. And we're going to talk about his impact on and off the court, next.



CAMEROTA: LeBron James is 36 points away from breaking the NBA all- time scoring record. And tonight, the superstar who's being held as the GOAT is speaking out.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Has it been stressful at all, the chase?

JAMES: No, because it was never a goal, it was never a journey. You know, the stressful part for me is competing every single day to try to bring home the Larry O'Brien Trophy.


CAMEROTA: Now, the Larry O'Brien Trophy, as I can tell you, if you don't know that reference, that he's referencing the NBA championship trophy.

With me now John Berman, also professional tennis player -- professional something -- sportsman, Patrick McEnroe, and -- yes, okay, it's all the same to me, Patrick.

Okay. So, joke over, I don't know that much about sports, but I do know that LeBron James is not -- like beyond mortal. He's -- he's made a difference stock, I know that much, than any other athlete because he's about to do this. This was a record, as you well know, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, he said in nearly 39 years ago in 1984 and back then commentators like yourself thought it would never be broken. And tomorrow night, it's probably going to be broken.

PATRICK MCENROE, FORMER PROFESSIONAL TENNIS PLAYER: Well, he's going to have to get 37 points to break it. And it's been amazing to watch him do what he's done for so many years, LeBron James. And I think his commitment to being the best, to being the guy who he wants the ball in his hands when it matters. But I think what I love the most about him, and, of course, he's always compared to Michael Jordan, if I had one game, John, I think I'm still going with M.J. to get that bucket.

But LeBron has been the ultimate team player, making guys around him better, wanting to be the guy who dishes when he has two, who passes the ball. But he's actually now fourth all-time in assists. This is a guy who's 6'9, who plays power forward, and he has got the fourth more assists. There's all point guards in this group, and there's LeBron James not only going to be the greatest scorer but one of the top assist players.

CAMEROTA: So, why would you take Michael Jordan?

MCENROE: Well, for one game, Jordan was the ultimate in sports terms assassin. He would beat you when he had to. LeBron, in some ways, has almost been two nice sometimes, giving up the ball. That being said, he's won four NBA championships and he's just dominated for now 20 years, which is five more years already than Jordan has been in the league.

CAMEROTA: Okay. So, this could happen on our watch tomorrow night, okay, because he's been averaging 32.2 points per game for the last five games. So, that would put him -- oh no, he needs 36.

MCENROE: So, the next two games are in L.A.

BERMAN: It's not a math thing, though. Luckily, there won't be math.

Look, it's -- here's the thing, LeBron James is a generational talent.


He's on the proverbial Mount Rushmore of basketball players, one of the greats ever. But he himself there I think described what this record means and it's a lot, but not everything. Because in basketball it really is about the championships combined with the greatness.

And Jordan, in addition to being the assassin, has six. Lebron has four. Bill Russell has got 11, you know. So, there are players who've got more rings than he has, and while he is no doubt the greatest player in the game today, you know, if he's trying to be called the greatest ever, I don't think he is necessarily the G.O.A.T. in basketball. I think most people would still say Michael Jordan.

CAMEROTA: Kierna, you've told me you are sports afficionado adjacent. So, please.

MAYO: Indeed. Well, the first thing that I'm thinking of, I just have to push back when you're saying that he's not mortal.


MAYO: Because I think the thing that's very special about him is that he's so human.

CAMEROTA: Well, tell me. Like tell me what makes him so human. MAYO: I mean, he so much more than the game itself. I mean, really,

this is a person who understands the magic of community. This is what we're talking about when we say that kind of team dynamic, that he's always lifting up, right?

CAMEROTA: About everything he's done off the --

MAYO: And so, he does this on the court, he does this off the court and he represents, I think, that what makes him the G.O.A.T., is that his character is aligned with his prowess. And really, to see someone this dedicated and this clear about his identity, and this protective of his black male body. He knows the body that he is in and he respects it and he understands from a political place and really from a personal place how much his representation matters to so many --


MAYO: -- beyond that (inaudible).

MCENROE: He always speaks out on important issues that is so huge and important. But as a former athlete, what I also admire about him is his longevity, his commitment to being in the best possible -- he says that even when he was a teenager he stretched before he went to bed and when he woke up in the morning.

Now, I know this guy could do a little bit more of that for his running regimen, but that's why Lebron is still playing at the highest level at 38.

MAYO: Yeah.

MCENROE: And I think he's going to be able to do it for even a few more years. And let's remember, he went back to Cleveland, remember he left Cleveland, his hometown, Akron, Ohio is his home where he has done so much for the community.

And then he decided to leave Cleveland and go to Miami to win a couple of rings where he won two there and then you know what he said? I'm going back to Cleveland. He went back there and he brought them a championship which they were craving in all sports.

CAMEROTA: Well, it's great to hear all of this and I am excited for tomorrow night. And you guys need to tune in (inaudible).

UNKNOWN: Is this going to be breaking news? Are you guys (inaudible)?

CAMEROTA: Yeah. Obviously (inaudible). I mean, this would be huge breaking news, I think.

MCENROE: Absolutely.

CAMEROTA: Yeah. All right, thank you all. Okay, next, another allegation against Congressman George Santos. We are going to tell you what he's being accused of this time.


CAMEROTA: Well, former prospective staffers is accusing Congressman George Santos of sexual harassment, Derek Myers alleging that Santos touched his groin late last month before inviting him to his home, saying his husband was out of town. Myers says he declined Santos's alleged advance. A few days later, he says Santos questioned him about his past work as a reporter.

Now, Myers was charged last fall with wiretapping after publishing audio recorded by a source in courtroom. The case is ongoing, but journalism advocacy groups have urge prosecutors to drop that charge. Myers says his job offer with the congressman was withdrawn on February 1st although he had already been working with Santos' office voluntarily. Santos responded to the allegations on Capitol Hill today calling them comical.


UNKNOWN: What do you think about Derek Myers and his alleging you (inaudible)?

REP. GEORGE SANTOS (R-NY): It's comical.

UNKNOWN: Do you denied the claim against you?

SANTOS: Of course, I deny the claim against me. Let me make it very clear. Let me make it clear. If there was remote, any part of that that were true, he should've led with that and not beg for a job that we decided to pull from him for being accused of doing exactly what he did to us.

UNKNOWN: And just a follow-up. So, you categorically deny it?

SANTOS: A hundred percent.


CAMEROTA: Back with me, John Berman, Patrick McEnroe and Kierna Mayo. So, Kierna, I mean, another day, another George Santos allegation or story. It's hard to give George Santos the benefit of the doubt with this one. Not that the accuser has offered any evidence, but at this point, why would we believe George Santos?

MAYO: Well, first of all, the irony is that he said more about this than he said about anything since the man has been elected to Congress. We're talking about a very sick puppy, Alisyn. This is not someone who at any point at least from what we can tell in his history has been well. So, I am wondering if at this point his fellow congress folk are bullying him by allowing him to exist in this medium. The fact that he is there to me at this point, what could they do?

CAMEROTA: I mean, as you've heard, Kevin McCarthy and everybody else has said this is up to the voters. They have him for two years.

MAYO: Yeah, but if you are my friend and I were a crazy person like this, I would want you to pull my coat. They're allowing him to exist like this. They are not even fun scripting the man. So, he is giving away his guilt, in this case. It's like he's so pissed that this person told on him it almost seems like he is wearing the truth in his reaction because he hasn't even given us this much reaction to anything.

CAMEROTA: Yeah. Patrick, it's so distracting. I mean, this has nothing to do with laws. It has nothing to do with representing his constituents.


MCENROE: You know what you said when you felt like you are jumping on the sports talk, like I feel like I'm sort of jumping in with you experts on this topic. To me this is -- the word that was used by the congressman, this is comical. I mean, this is -- what are we become in this country that I guess is sort of understood that to a certain extent politicians on both sides of the aisle, you know, they hedge -- they fudge the truth a little bit.

CAMEROTA: (Inaudible) be in a different category.

MCENROE: But that's what I'm saying. This is so --

CAMEROTA: I mean, this is so (inaudible) from a dying dog. He's wanted in Brazil for check forgery. He's being accused of sexual harassment. He has said his mother was in 9/11. He said his grandparents were in the holocaust. This isn't just typical sort of politician.

MCENROE: The gumption -- the gumption that this guy has and he's walking around with the shades on and the look, like he is pulling this whole thing off.


MCENROE: It looks like, I mean, that's -- (inaudible), he's pulled it off.

BERMAN: He's in Congress. And he somehow (inaudible) Kevin McCarthy into thinking that he has nothing he can do, which is wrong by the way. The voters have no say in it now, but the only people who do have a say is Congress. Congress can push him out. They are the ones who decides who sit there at this point.

They could expel him. They have chosen not to. These allegations against him, the new ones, the ethics committee will decide that they'll stand on their own merits, you know. I have no idea what's going on there. However, as you both said, all of you have said, you can't give this guy the benefit of everything because he's lied about almost everything.

CAMEROTA: His finances are also curious. As you guys know, he's being investigated for that. But one thing that has come to light today, is he has -- his campaign spending, and this I actually respect. His campaign spending spent $22,000 in an Italian restaurant. Now, I have tried to spend $22,000 in an Italian restaurant, it's hard to do that.

MCENROE: It's a really good wine.

CAMEROTA: I mean, you have to drink a lot of wine for that. But I mean, he has this like problem with spending, but then he also couldn't pay his rent at times. I mean, he's so all over the map. And as you pointed out, Kierna, when you elect a serial liar to Congress, what do you expect?

MAYO: I mean, we all know this guy from high school, right? Like don't we all have a friend who was like, is that real? Did that really happen? And by senior year we've decided enough with this guy. We are not going to keep listening to this ridiculousness. He is a waste of all of our time really.

CAMEROTA: Here is yet another person who has claimed that George Santos tried to get him to invest in a large Ponzi scheme. Here is Christian Lopez.


CHRISTIAN LOPEZ, CLAIMS GEORGE SANTOS TRIED TO GET HIM TO INVEST IN ALLEGED PONZI SCHEME: We went into this restaurant. It was greeted very, very good, like we were family and I've never stepped foot in there in my life. We had my lawyer and my girlfriend. So, when we go in there, we get treated and we go to the second floor and then it's just a big room with one table, a butler, and George Santos. And then right then and there I was just like, what? Like, this is different. This is nice. Like, wow. I've never been treated this nice before.


CAMEROTA: That's the Italian restaurant where he spent --

BERMAN: With a butler. I just want to know about the butler.

CAMEROTA: You don't have a butler when you go out to dinner?

BERMAN: It's a follow-up. It's a natural follow-up question, the butler.

MCENROE: I mean, it's also bizarre, but you know, again, I'm going to finish with the same point I started with. We deserve this. We've let this happen in our government, in our Congress. We -- I grew up very close to congressional district three where George Santos is from. We've all let this happen. We've put these types of people in Congress and we're reaping their -- what do you want to call (inaudible).

CAMEROTA: When you say he's a little bit further on the continuum, then most politicians --

MCENROE: I'm going to say he is, but you know what we continue to go in that direction, people continue to go down these types of paths and as John just so rightly pointed out, it's not up to the voters in that area. It's up to the other members of Congress. What are they going to do? BERMAN: Yeah. They don't want to wait two more years. Congress needs

to step in and I think that it reflects -- every time he walks through those doors, it reflects on them. It's less about him now in my mind that it is about them.

MAYO: You can vet it more to work at Amazon, McDonald's. Like, literally there are places that you have to go through vetting just to get the job.

CAMEROTA: It's such a great point. And if any of us did half of the things that he did, we would be out of a job.

MCENROE: One of the things.

MAYO: One of the things. One of the things.

CAMEROTA: One of the things. Yes, fair enough. All right, thank you very much panel. Stick around because we need to talk about this. She got the most Grammy wins of all-time, but what does Beyonce have to do to win album of the year? We're going to talk about that next.



JAMES CORDEN, TV PERSONALITY: This is an honor, because we are witnessing history tonight. Breaking the record for the most Grammy wins of all-time, the outstanding, and show your respect. It's "Renaissance." Beyonce.



CAMEROTA: When she stood up, I was like, boy, I really hope it's Beyonce because that's going to be embarrassing if she has to sit down, that she -- I mean, as serious he said like, I'm honored, you know. They started standing up. It was such a great moment. She's now the most awarded artist in the history of the Grammys, 32 wins and that was the moment she made history when "Renaissance" won best dance electronic album.

Back with me is John Berman, Patrick McEnroe, and Kierna Mayo. So Kierna, the general consensus is that she was robbed, okay, of album of the year. And it wasn't the first time. It's the first time that she was robbed. And very interestingly some of the academy voters who make this decision explained in a "Variety" magazine why they didn't vote for her. And by the way, it had nothing to do with the music.


So let me read to you what they said. Here is one who said, "With Beyonce, the fact that every time she does something new it's a big event and everyone is supposed to quake in their shoes, it's a little too portentous -- he said -- portentous." He might mean pretentious. I'm not sure. Another one said, "I also look at who's been there and go, okay,

Adele, Beyonce -- they always win. It's the same people over and over again. So, I went for Lizzo." So, in other words she's too good to win is what they're saying.

MAYO: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She is penalized for being the G.O.A.T. She is actually -- but before we get to the bad part, we got to just celebrate the win. Come on. I mean, Beyonce. First of all, what it takes for anyone, the body of work that you have to have to be -- to get 32 Grammys. Let's just talk about that.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely.

MAYO: The body of work. The woman is only 41 years old. So, 32 Grammys, she is 41 years old. It's pretty unbelievable and it's just a moment for everyone because I think there are so many Beyonce fans globally that have been waiting for her to be nominated in this way, like recognized as the G.O.A.T.

But the robbery, it's real. The Academy, the recording academy has long been known for having some issues, many of them along racial lines. But as we're seeing in this "Variety" article, like who are these guys? Like really, I'd rather someone who is listening to their music every day all day make these kinds of calls than someone who is actually reacting to Beyonce's ability to win all the time, to just simply be great. I just -- I feel --

CAMEROTA: And I just also, because I know that you know a lot about this from the reporting on the family.

MAYO: Yes. Yes. Yes.

CAMEROTA: So, does she feel slighted?

MAYO: You know, I don't know. She didn't call me right after that. I have no idea. She is so graceful that I don't think we would ever know but I do know that she thanked her mother and her father. And to me that was the whole story because you don't become a Beyonce without coming from a very rich place. And when I say rich, I don't mean monetary.

CAMEROTA: Absolutely.

MAYO: I mean, like the culture and the love and the foundation.

CAMEROTA: And the spirituality like in (inaudible).

MAYO: Just all of it, all of it I think is just foundational to the moment.

CAMEROTA: Yeah. Totally agree. I don't know John, I guess I was just surprised to hear the voters admit that she wins too much that's why they weren't going to vote for her.

BERMAN: It sounds like a dumb thing, right? And they admitted it. No, they just spelled it out right there. Look, I have to be honest, I don't fully understand and never have understood all the categories in the Grammys. There is best album, best record, best performance. Which is which? Best song. Which one is it? I just want her to get the one that she wants. Okay? Whichever one of those is the most important to her and want her to have it.

CAMEROTA: Well, I do too. And to that point, maybe it's not so much that award, I don't know because I don't know if it's important to her, but so many people talked about how she was their inspiration and they thanked her. So, let's listen to Lizzo for a moment.


LIZZO, MUSICIAN: Where are you at Beyonce? My eyes are wet. You changed my life. You saying that gospel medley in the way you made me feel I was like, I want to make people feel this with my music. So, thank you so much. You clearly are the artist of our lives. I love you. God bless you all.


CAMEROTA: That's beautiful.

MCENROE: Well, I mean, we started with King James and then there is Queen B, okay. And she's the queen and there is no doubt about it. You heard that from Lizzo. You heard it a couple of years ago when Adele won the album of the year, her record. That's the one she wants, by the way. (Inaudible). Her fans want it, the album or the record of the year.

She should have won it for "Lemonade" and Adele wins it. She should have won it for "Renaissance" because of how she is moving music forward as an artist, all that she is doing, and she didn't win it, but you know what? As you said, she will -- she is so gracious, she is so graceful and she is the queen, and that is just the way it's going to be. And I'll tell you, it was amazing to see her. I mean, she's got, you know, sports are objective, right?

We could be objective. We could talk about Jordan has got six, Lebron has got four. In music and in the arts, there is a little bit of -- it's a subjective event. So, it's hard to say definitively that this album, this artist was the best this year but I think I may be able to say it about Queen B. She deserved it.

CAMEROTA: On that note, that was excellent. We don't have time to talk about Ben Affleck, I'm sorry.

BERMAN: He was so unhappy.

CAMEROTA: He was so miserable.

BERMAN: You know what, he's going to be unhappy that you're not talking about it. It's because he's unhappy all the time now.

CAMEROTA: Well, I don't know if he's unhappy all the time or if he was just too hot and tired.

BERMAN: You mean too hot like Lebron or too hot like (inaudible)?

CAMEROTA: No. If he was just (inaudible).

MCENROE: You're supposed to keep it cool in there, but he knows.

CAMEROTA: I don't know. All right, thank you all. Meanwhile, we do have some new details about that spy balloon that was floating across the United States.


But those details are revealing new questions like has the balloon flown over the U.S. before? Why didn't no one noticed then? Stay with us.


CAMEROTA: Tonight, we have new details about other Chinese spy balloons over the United States in the past, just like the one that was shot out of the sky by fighter jets over the weekend.


UNKNOWN: They just shot it. See the smoke coming from it?



CAMEROTA: CNN got an exclusive look at a U.S. miliary intelligence report from last year that focused on Chinese spy balloon sightings during the Trump administration.