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Connect the World
Biden, Merkel, Johnson, Macron All Speaking Today to Make the Case for Multilateral Engagement; Committing to COVAX & The Paris Accord, Reaching Out to Iran, Attending the G7, Biden Showing "America is Back"; Robinhood CEO Apologizes for Trading Problems; U.K. Ambassador to the U.N. Speaks to CNN. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired February 19, 2021 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[10:00:23]
ANNOUNCER: Live from CNN Abu Dhabi, this is CONNECT THE WORLD with Becky Anderson.
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN ANCHOR: This hour, we're connecting the world trying to connect itself. Hello and welcome to the program. Thank you for joining
us.
We begin with a complicated and perhaps even slightly vague phrase and idea -- re-engaging Western multilateralism, the political framework to all that
simply colossal.
The world's most powerful leaders in London, in D.C., Paris, Brussels and elsewhere are right now getting together to try to do just that at the G7,
and at the Munich Security Conference. They are there talking about working together more closely.
And why? Well, because of problems that face us are truly global -- climate change, terrorism and, of course, the pandemic.
Joining COVAX, rejoining the Paris accord, attending the G7 and the Munich Security Conference and offering to sit down with Iran -- Joe Biden doing
all of that right now. You could translate that as America is back.
Indeed that is how President Biden has described his position. He's just been on a call with G7 leaders where he focused on an invisible enemy, the
coronavirus pandemic.
He was expected to pledge $4 billion for global push to get vaccines to poorer countries. Well, half of that contingent on donations by other
nations is what we've got. The pandemic has killed more than 2.4 million people around the world.
This hour, Mr. Biden is tackling other global challenges as well at a Munich security summit. That, of course, is virtual. All of this seen as a
purposeful break with his predecessor who pushed the America first message.
And perhaps the biggest break so far, the Biden administration has offered to return to negotiations with Iran on the international nuclear deal which
the U.S. abandoned in 2018. Iran's foreign minister responding by calling - - again calling on the U.S. to lift sanctions imposed by Donald Trump.
A lot to take in there. Jeremy Diamond has a front row seat to this shift in tone through his reporting from the White House for you. And Nic
Robertson watching this all play out overseas in London. He is our international diplomatic editor.
Jeremy, let's start with you. What are you expecting to hear from the president today?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, what you're going to see is a stark contrast from what we've seen over the last four years.
You're going to see President Biden addressing that contrast and the changes that he intends to make to American foreign policy by bringing back
American leadership, reinvigorating American alliances and recommitting to those alliances and the power of those alliances to confront America's
adversaries such as China and Russia.
Two years ago, then-private citizen Joe Biden addressed the Munich security conference as a former vice president. Amidst Donald Trump's presidency,
his America first policies and his isolationist moves. And Joe Biden at the time vowed, we will be back.
A senior administration official now telling us, previewing this speech to the Munich Security Conference that two years later, today, president Biden
will affirm that America is indeed back, speaking about American leadership and those alliances.
You're also going to see President Biden really offer his most extensive remarks to date on foreign policy, fleshing out his policy towards China.
As I was just saying, this view the U.S. should stand with other countries to confront China, not go it alone as President Trump did for four years.
And you'll also see him address areas like climate change, nuclear proliferation, as well as those Iran nuclear negotiations which the U.S. is
now saying they are willing to re-engage in at least on a multilateral basis with the P5 plus 1.
ANDERSON: Jeremy Diamond is at the White House. Thank you.
Nic, this is -- this is a lot to take in. And there's an awful lot of talking, a lot of jaw drawing going on. And the mode almost a bit like
Bretton Woods in all a single day.
You could argue, though, that there is not an awful lot new per se here. Put this into perspective, if you will.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yeah. President Biden's been talking about, you know, being a force for good in the world.
That he was going to open up and promote the case of democracies and work diplomatically with allies.
So, some of this we've heard. I think, you know, let's take what's happening at the G7. Okay. So these Western nations that are there because
that's what they are. They are the world's leading economic democracy. So it's not Russia and not China.
And then looking over their shoulders at China and Russia right now and seeing China and Russia handing out vaccines to poorer nations. Now, the
WHO, which the World Health Organization, that President Trump pulled out of, President Biden has put the United States back into, has a COVAX
mechanism to get vaccines to poorer nations.
So what is the G7 doing? It is focusing on how to ramp up what these rich nations, the secretary-general just a few days ago said, you know, 75
percent of the vaccines going into people's arms, just in the ten richest - - essentially ten richest nations.
So we're hearing from President Biden that he's going to give $4 billion to COVAX to support that. Some of it will be conditional. We'll hear from the
French President Macron who said that he believes that Europe should be giving, you know, vaccines to those poorer nations. He's talking about a
huge country giving maybe 4 percent or 5 percent vaccines to those poorer nations.
And if you look at the case of the U.K., for example, U.K. has 420 million doses on order and a population of 66 million. So you can see the surplus.
Until last weekend, the narrative in Europe was, we'll fix ourselves. We want to help everyone else. That narrative has changed today. And that's
what we're going to see.
Ursula von der Leyen, the European commission president, has just announced doubling of the E.U. funds going to COVAX. Germany, we understand, is
ramping theirs up by another $1.1 billion. So, a lot of effort going in that direction. That's the narrative coming today.
So, when you say what's changed, I think behind the scenes we've heard the good language, but today, we're seeing, I think we're seeing a recognition
of this world order and these nations need to do more to keep their place in this world order. They want to have and they're stepping up to do that.
ANDERSON: I was struck by a line from the French president. The same leader, of course, who labeled NATO brain dead, now telling the "Financial
Times" that the enemy of multilateralism, as we speak, is slowness and ineffectiveness. An interesting line as we report on that rich club
agreeing to send more vaccines to less developed countries but only 4 percent or 5 percent of doses needed. Slow and somewhat less effective than
we might hope for.
ROBERTSON: Yeah, you know, I think you get the sense here, and this isn't to be critical, but when you listen to the language today, everyone
stepping up with more money and we must do better and coming up with our ideas, and it's almost a club competing to do this.
But these nations have all been in a way, and they would admit to it, sort of guilty to look to their own first. They need to. They're democracies.
They get voted in by their populations. If they don't look after their populations, they won't get voted in again.
The autocracies like Russia and China don't have to worry about that.
But, you know, you have Macron saying that we need to hurry up and be faster.
Boris Johnson is going to say the same thing today. He's going to say, look, it took us 300 days to get this new vaccine up and running.
Fantastic, great.
That was a world first, used to take five years or more. We've all heard that. Johnson is going to say we need to be doing it in 100 days.
So, I think we're going to have the leaders, sort of, pushing themselves, competing with themselves, with the same message to do better.
So, yes, we can look at it and say, well, one minute you are complaining about this and now, you're sort of seeming to forget that angle. We're in a
slightly different place with the pandemic, and I think that's a reality. And there is a global geopolitical, geostrategic new reality that none of
these leaders would have expected a year ago to be in. And it's brought a different sense of what they need to do. And they need to be fairer to the
world.
ANDERSON: Yeah. I am just reminded that we -- that we heard a big statement out of G20. What was it late October, early November saying we
must do more. Now we are, what, nearly halfway through or more than halfway through February and we're still hearing the same thing.
So, look, we will hold these leaders to account and continue to report on what is said and what is done. Thank you, Nic.
In just a few minutes, we'll go beyond the diplomatic language and get real on the most pressing issues, especially who gets these vaccines and when.
That's what the British ambassador to the United Nations, Barbara Woodward, has lived in a number of the world's hot spots. We'll ask her what needs to
change and who needs the most help.
And at the top of the hour, incredible insight into the hunt for coronavirus mutations and how the disease could affect our lives for years
and years to come.
[10:10:07]
I'll speak with the director of the U.K.'s COVID-19 genomics consortium. Two really important guests to get a lot of perspective on. So, do stay
with us for that.
Well, just after the show yesterday, the head of NATO told me he strongly welcomes America's about-face on support for the democratic alliance. After
four years of tension and disdain from Donald Trump, Jens Stoltenberg told me about the importance of this new American outlook.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JENS STOLTENBERG, NATO SECRETARY GENERAL: There is no way to hide that over the last four years we had some difficult discussions and situations
within NATO. At the same time, I think now we all have to look to the future. And we strongly welcome the message from the United States to
rebuild alliances to strengthen NATO and European allies are ready to do exactly that.
And we are now working on concrete proposals on how to make sure that we do work together, North America and Europe, because we are facing so many
challenges. The rise of China and more assertive Russia, terrorism, cyber, we cannot deal with them alone. We have to be together, 30 allies in NATO.
ANDERSON: I just wonder, former President Trump has lost the megaphone he once had, but he isn't suddenly a fringe political figure. He won nearly 75
million votes, and he has shown that he still has a firm grip on the Republican Party.
Do you have some sense of trepidation about jumping back into business as usual with this sort of reset with the states when there could be another
Trump-like era in the near future?
STOLTENBERG: So NATO is an alliance of 30 democracies from both sides of the Atlantic with different political leaders, different political programs
for different governments. But the strength of this alliance is that despite its differences, we have always been able to unite around a core
cause to protect each other. That's been the cause over the last four years, because there's a strong bipartisan support to NATO in the United
States.
I saw that myself when I had the honor of addressing a joint session of the U.S. Congress. They all expressed strong support to NATO because strong
NATO is good for Europe but it's also good for the United States of America to have 29 friends and allies working with the United States.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: I also spoke to Jens Stoltenberg about the way NATO and the West view China. He says as the country continues to grow in its role as a
global superpower, it is creating economic opportunities, but there are big concerns internationally about Beijing's human rights record, including
allegations of brutal treatment against the Uighurs and other ethnic minority groups.
Well, shocking allegations of gang rape are emerging from detention centers in China's Xinjiang region. The U.S. government accuses China of the mass
internment of up to 2 million members of the Muslim ethnic minority groups in that region in recent years, part of a policy the U.S. State Department
amounts to genocide.
Well, Beijing denies disclaiming the camps are actually vocational training centers aimed at creating jobs and stamping out Islamist extremism. A
warning, the following report has language that may be disturbing for some of you.
CNN's Ivan Watson reports.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
(CRYING)
IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The traumatized survivor of a nine-month nightmare, Tursunay Ziyawudun, a
refugee from China's Xinjiang region, describes the torture and rape she endured after detention in an internment camp.
How is your health today after your experience in the camps?
TURSUNAY ZIYAWUDUN, FORMER XINJIANG CAMP DETAINEE (through translator): I was in a lot of pain and suffered bleeding. After I arrived in the U.S., I
had to undergo surgery and my uterus was removed. I suffered a lot of damage.
WATSON: Tursunay is an ethnic Uighur. In March 2018, she says police in Xinjiang detained her at a so-called vocational training center for women.
ZIYAWUDUN: Because I live in Kazakhstan for five years, they wanted me to confess if I was influenced by American propaganda and foreign
organizations.
WATSON: During one interrogation, Tursunay says guards beat and kicked her until she blacked out. In the camp, Tursunay says authorities began
forcibly implanting female detainees with contraceptives IUDs.
[16:50:04]
After a botched procedure led to bleeding, she says she was taken into a room.
ZIYAWUDUN: There were three guards, they inserted a stun baton inside of me and twisted and shocked me it. I passed out.
WATSON: On a separate occasion, she says guards wearing masks once again took her from her cell.
ZIYAWUDUN: In the next room, I heard another girl crying and screaming. I saw about five men going into that room. I thought they were torturing her.
But then, I was gang-raped. After that, I realized what they also did to her.
WATSON: Tursunay first revealed these claims in an interview with the BBC.
The Chinese government did not answer our questions about the women named in this report, but Beijing did vehemently deny any human rights abuses in
Xinjiang.
WENG WANBIN, CHINESE MINISTRY OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS: There has never been such a thing as systemic sexual abuse and mistreatment against women. China
is a country ruled by law.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Why you are here?
WATSON: There's strict state censorship in Xinjiang and police followed and harassed CNN journalists when last they last visited.
Tursunay claims she was held at a facility outside the city of Ghulja. CNN has also obtained rare testimony from another woman who says she worked in
a camp near the city of Urumqi.
QELBINUR SIDIK, FORMER TEACHER IN XINJIANG CAMP (through translator): The women had their hair shaved off. They wore gray uniforms with orange vests
and printed numbers on them.
WATSON: For 28 years, Qelbinur Sidik worked as an elementary school teacher. In 2017, she says she was ordered to teach mandarin at an
internment camp holding thousands of women.
Speaking from relative safety in the Netherlands, Qelbinur says on her first day of work in the camp, she witnessed a disturbing sight.
SIDIK: Two soldiers were carrying a Uighur girl out on a stretcher. There was no spark of life on her face. Later, a female police officer told me
the girl died on her way to the hospital due to heavy bleeding.
WATSON: Although Qelbinur did not know the cause of the women's death, she says later, that same female police officer told her male guards routinely
gang-raped detainees at the camp. The officer also told her --
SIDIK: When they drank at night, policemen told each other how they raped and tortured girls.
WATSON: In previous reporting on China's mass internment policy in Xinjiang, CNN heard testimony from Gulbahar Jalilova, a citizen of
Kazakhstan, who alleges that she endured sexual assault from a guard during prolonged detention in Xinjiang.
CNN cannot independently verify the accounts of these women. China has attacked their credibility, calling these women actors playing victims from
Xinjiang.
The Chinese government says no women are abused in the camps. What do you say to the Chinese government?
ZIYAWUDUN: I'm a 43-year-old woman. Do you think this is something I am proud of sharing with the whole world? I would tell them that I'm not
afraid of them anymore, because they already killed my soul.
WATSON: She hopes her brave decision to speak out will encourage others to do the same.
Ivan Watson, CNN, Hong Kong.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:20:24]
ANDERSON: Well, it started out as a remarkable story of the little guy beating the billionaires. But the U.S. Congress is now looking into how
smaller investors lost out during the roller coaster ride of GameStop stock. And some investors made fortunes almost overnight while others took
huge losses. You'll remember us reporting on this a couple of weeks ago. Each side has its own take on what happened and what new restrictions to be
put in place.
One of the major topics of Thursday's congressional hearing was the free- trading app Robinhood which came under fire for stopping visitors from buying the stock during the height of the frenzy. Its CEO said the company
simply did not have enough money to cover those purchase orders.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VLAD TENEV, CEO, ROBINHOOD MARKETS: I'm sorry for what happened. I apologize. And I'm not going to say that Robinhood did everything perfect
and that we haven't made mistakes in the past, but what I commit to is making sure that we improve from this. We learn from it. And we don't make
the same mistakes in the future.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Well, joining me now is someone who was part of those hearings. New York Congressman Richie Torres. He said Robinhood rigged the game
against its own customers.
So, good to have you with us.
If they simply ran out of money, is it really fair to say the game is rigged or does what you've just heard actually change your judgment?
REP. RITCHIE TORRES (D-NY): There's a sense in which Robinhood is guilty of deceptive advertising. The stated mission of Robinhood is the
democratization of finance for all. How can you claim to be democratizing finance when you're restricting trading. It's clear that Robinhood is too
undercapitalized to ensure that we tell investors can trade freely even in terms of high trading volume and volatility.
ANDERSON: So, are investors owed their money back?
TORRES: You know, that's a hard question to answer. You know, Robinhood did have to comply with depositing requirements from the clearinghouse.
So, for me, more important than the particular circumstances of the GameStop short squeeze are the larger policy questions about payment for
order flow and the gamification of online trading and execution quality. That's where the focus of Congress is going to be.
You know, GameStop's short squeeze was the greatest outpouring of populism in the history of the American stock market. It certainly has been a jolt
to the system but our purpose here in the United States Congress is to look beyond the sensational David versus Goliath narrative and explore the
deeper policy questions that have been raised by the GameStop short squeeze.
ANDERSON: That's a very measured and quite frankly, I have to say, sensible approach.
You have said it is wrong to rewrite the rules in the middle of the game and it's wrong to shut down the game simply because you disapprove of the
outcome. And Robinhood should be held accountable for essentially rigging the game against its own customers. They did an enormous amount of
financial damage to an enormous number of investors.
As a member of the Financial Services Committee then, what are you calling for at this point?
TORRES: Well, at a minimum, there needs to be greater transparency. We have to ensure the stock market is accountable to transparent for and
protective of retail investors. On the surface, online trading is free. It has no commissions. And even though there's no visible price at the front
end of the transaction, there's certainly a hidden cost to retail investors at the back end of the transaction.
And retail investors have a right to know what that hidden cost is. And retail investors should have more information necessary for determining
which brokerage firm and which trading firm offers them the best price and the best execution. And currently, that information is available to the big
institutional investors, but it's fundamentally unavailable to small retail investors. And we have to level the playing field.
ANDERSON: And that's really important, isn't it because you call for greater transparency. You don't want to see this market rigged going
forward. And yet the argument, of course, is that these big hedge funds, these big shorting funds are effectively rigging the market at this point.
[10:25:04]
And there isn't an awful lot of transparency. Perhaps you could argue with the big guys in the market. So I guess what I'm asking at this point is,
you know, where is the line between sort of blowing up the way that these financial markets work and ensuring that, because it sounds as if you
certainly agree with the notion in principle that markets should be more democratized.
How do we ensure going forward you get that balance right?
TORRES: Well, I want to be clear that we're in no rush to regulate for the sake of regulating, right? Our objective is to study and scrutinize the
plumbing of the stock market and at the heart of scrutiny is payment order flow.
My concern about payment for order flow is that it creates a perverse incentive for brokerage firm like Robinhood to send retail customer orders
not to the trading firms that offer the best execution to retail investors, but rather to the trading firms that offered the highest payment to
Robinhood.
There seems to me a conflict between what is in the best interest of retail investors and what is in the best interest of brokers. That's a conflict of
interest we have to address.
And that concern is not theoretical. You know, the SEC found that Robinhood misled its customers about how it makes its money and both FINRA and SEC
have found that Robinhood failed to ensure the best execution for retail investors, depriving those investors of $34 million which led to a $65
million civil penalty from the SEC.
So, there are legitimate concerns here about conflict of interests that have to be scrutinized in greater detail, and we're going to be hard at
work.
ANDERSON: This will not be something that concludes, of course, tomorrow. This is a sort of long-term game. But we will -- we will continue to watch
--
(CROSSTALK)
ANDERSON: Sure. I understand. I understand.
The point -- the important thing about doing this story is, as we close this out, sir, is that this is not just a sort of domestic American issue.
This was a -- this was a stock that was being traded all over the world.
And it's so important when you take a story like this that we remember this is a very connective story. You know, this is -- there are no borders.
There are no barriers to entry on this one.
So what happens in the states may be indicative of what needs to happen going forward around the world. But who knows? We'll watch it. Thank you,
sir.
Well, getting COVID vaccines to everyone in the world, there is strong support for that at the virtual G7 meeting.
Up next, we'll ask the British ambassador to the U.N. about that. Barbara Woodward weighs in on a big day for global diplomacy.
And he fled the cold and found himself in a firestorm. The story of the senator whose vacation turned into a political problem. That in just a
moment.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:30:35]
ANDERSON: This is no ordinary Friday. The new U.S. president declaring diplomacy is back, or at least his version of it. All the same it's playing
a starring role this hour as the world's most powerful leaders discuss the world's biggest topics, the Paris Climate Accord, Iran, of course, COVID-
19.
The British prime minister hosting today's virtual G7 meeting.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BORIS JOHNSON, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: Around the world, make sure everybody gets the vaccines that they need so that the whole world can come
through this pandemic together. And I know that several colleagues have already announced that idea. And we in the U.K. strongly, strongly support
it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: The U.S. President Biden pledging billions of dollars for a global push to get vaccines to poorer countries. And the U.K. says more
than 160 million people are at risk of being excluded from vaccinations because they live in countries engulfed by conflict and stability.
That's just one of the issues I want to cover with my next guest. The British ambassador to the U.N., Barbara Woodward, who currently holds the
rotating presidency of the Security Council.
And what a month, Barbara, to be holding that position. It couldn't be busier. Let's start with vaccines. I've just said that the U.K. is
concerned 160 million are at risk of being excluded from vaccines because they live in countries engulfed in conflict and stability, including, for
example, Yemen, Syria, Ethiopia, and, of course, many more.
I spoke to the U.N. High Commissioner for Refugees, a man you know well, Filippo Grandi just yesterday. Have a listen to what he told me.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
FILIPPO GRANDI, U.N. HIGH COMMISSIONER FOR REFUGEES: The first order of business here is to ensure that in every country vaccination campaigns for
the coronavirus include all those that are on the move. Now the response we got from most countries is that they will include them, which is great. But
then some of these countries, many of these countries remember, of those 80 million, 90 percent are in poor countries or in lower middle income
countries. So, these countries will not have the means even for their own immunization campaign.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Barbara, I totally understand, and I'm sure my viewers will applaud the spirit in which these narratives are doing the rounds. We just
heard from the British prime minister. We know that the U.S. is much more engaged or just engaged as opposed to its disengagement during the Trump
era.
But I have to ask. What's the mechanism here? This is a lot of talk. I want to talk about how we walk at this point through this.
BARBARA WOODWARD, U.K. AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.: Well, good morning, Becky. And thank you for inviting me.
And absolutely. Our challenge is to get from talk to walk in three areas.
The first is funding. The COVAX facility has already raised a lot of money, but we'll see out of the G7 Summit where we welcome President Biden to his
first multilateral engagement, we'll see out of that the funding for access to coronavirus tools accelerator. That will be the money that's used to
develop new vaccines against new strains, probably more than doubling to $7 billion from the G7.
And the Prime Minister Johnson will be calling for cutting by one-third to 100 days the time it takes to develop the vaccines.
Then we need to address manufacturing capacity, and that's where there's been a bit of a blockage. And we'll see now a real acceleration in
manufacturing capacity. And then we move on to the logistics of delivery, which is what Filippo Grandi was talking about, to, as the secretary-
general said yesterday, 130 countries which have, as yet, no vaccine. And then that last mile challenge as you referenced earlier of 160 million
people in conflict zones, in refugee camps who need to be vaccinated.
We were calling earlier this week for local cease-fires to allow us to get into those last mile communities. We've done it before in Afghanistan in
2001. We had a two-day pause, cease-fire where we vaccinated 5.7 million children.
[10:35:03]
So you really can do this, but we need to get the pieces in place. And that's what our Security Council discussion was about earlier this week.
ANDERSON: And I have to press you on this. Are you absolutely sure that this can stay front and center when we consider just in the E.U., for
example, the unmitigated disaster that is the vaccine rollout there?
You know, we talk a lot about vaccine nationalism on this show. We have also, from the outset of this pandemic talked about the need for a
mechanism like COVAX. But a vaccine nationalism, this -- you know, we need to help ourselves before we help other people, it's still ultimately the
story in town, isn't it?
WOODWARD: I agree. It's been a challenge. And you've seen -- we heard the secretary-general earlier speaking out about the importance of multilateral
cooperation. We're working on that here at the U.N. during our Security Council presidency this month. That's what our event was about.
The G7 is addressing the same thing today, chaired by Prime Minister Johnson in London. And the General Assembly have been looking at the
question, the E.U.
So a lot of multilateral cooperation is going on to support the WHO and COVAX to deliver the vaccines that they need, that we need to get out.
ANDERSON: Ambassador, thank you. I spoke to the NATO Secretary-General Jens Stoltenberg just yesterday. And just have a listen to what he told me.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STOLTENBERG: We have to address the threats and the challenges coming from many different directions. And, of course, for decades, the Soviet Union
was the main focus for NATO. Then after the end of Cold War, we have been forced -- we have to face a much more complex security environment,
including the rise of China.
So we need to address Russia but also deal with the rise of China. The main message is that regardless of what kind of threat or challenge we face, we
are much safer when we stand together. Together, NATO represents 50 percent of the world's GDP, 50 percent of the world's military might.
So as long as North America and Europe stand together in NATO, we're able to deal with all these challenges. Anything that divides us will weaken us.
Anything that unites us will strengthen us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Jens Stoltenberg talking about the importance for the states and Europe to stick together. Of course, the U.K. no longer in the E.U., but
front and center when it comes to NATO.
You served as the U.K.'s ambassador to China from 2015 to 2020. So, there's nobody better whose brain we should pick on this.
How do you believe the West should be handling the challenges of a rising China?
WOODWARD: So, Becky, I think there are two sets of challenges here. The first are the ones that Jens Stoltenberg was talking, about dealing with
USSR and now Russia and the rise of China.
But also, alongside that, we have seen, I think, that a lot of the challenges we have to deal with are multinational. We were just talking
about COVID. We can talk about climate change. We can talk about pandemics, nuclear proliferation or weapons proliferation.
Our challenges now are transnational. And that goes back to the point that Jens Stoltenberg made so eloquently, that we are strong when we stand
together.
So what I found working with China was there were plenty of areas we could cooperate. We could cooperate on climate change, on health, on development,
tackling pandemics. But there were areas where it was much more difficult to cooperate, and I would say that human rights was one of those.
And so we had across the spectrum, a strong, I think, relationship with China that was very resilient. But embraced both the fact that we were
cooperating in some areas but competing in others.
And that's a pattern we saw during the Cold War. Even at the height of the cold war, it was possible for the United States and the USSR to cooperate,
to defeat smallpox while competing on almost every level in the security sphere.
ANDERSON: Ambassador, let's be quite frank. The West has a different approach to China when it comes to Myanmar, a situation that has been
ongoing now for weeks. This standoff between the military and the protesters.
What do you believe needs to happen next at this point?
WOODWARD: Well, I think the first thing to say about Myanmar is how sorry we were to hear of the death of Mya Thwe Thwe Khaing, the peaceful
protester bystander who was killed during a peaceful protest. And we really want to see the protection of the right to protest -- to protest --
peaceful protest.
But what we want to see happen next, we were clear, we have the whole of the United Nations Security Council behind a press statement on the 4th of
February -- very clear that we want to see an end to the coup, the release of prisoners, the return to democracy, the return to civil society,
humanitarian relief, freedom of the press. So, those are all the things that we need to see happen next.
We very much hope that the U.N. special envoy, Christine Burgener, will be able to go to Myanmar to find out what is really happening on the ground.
We hope she'll be able to speak to Aung San Suu Kyi to establish her safety and hear from her as well.
So I think our expectations are very clear. Now, of course, we have had, since our statement, one from the G7 as well and discussion in the Human
Rights Council and we stand ready to reconvene the Security Council should that be a good next step.
But I know, as you referenced, ASEAN are also working on trying to reverse the coup as well. So it's important, I think, that all these things are
drawn together.
ANDERSON: We'll come back and talk to you about the issue of Myanmar. Of course, China and Russia shielding the military there back at the beginning
of the Rohingya crisis. So, it will be interesting to see just how aligned members are as we move forward.
But we spoke to the U.N. special envoy to Myanmar just earlier on in the week, and we do hope that she gets on the ground, as you, do as soon as
possible. We should get more information then.
It's been a pleasure. Thank you. It's a first to have you on the show. I hope it's not the last time. Let's stay in touch. Thank you very much
indeed.
Barbara Woodward there, the U.K.'s ambassador to the U.N.
We're going to take a break. Back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANDERSON: This weekend, city rivals AC Milan and Inter Milan are dueling for the top spot in Serie A. A recent incident between their star strikers
depicted here in a mural outside the San Siro Stadium. The stakes couldn't be higher this time.
Don Riddell is in the house.
Right, Don?
DON RIDDELL, WORLD SPORT: Yeah, you're absolutely. They are very much going head-to-head as you can see in that mural which will have done
absolutely nothing to low are the temperature ahead of this game.
That was Lukaku and Ibrahimovic in a recent Italian top match. This is in Serie A. They are top of the table, Inter have just gone of there, one
point ahead of AC Milan.
Both teams having their best seasons in years.
[10:45:00]
So, this is going to be absolutely brilliant, we hope. It should be.
ANDERSON: Yeah, brilliant for the football rather than anything else we hope.
Don's back with "WORLD SPORT" after this.
We'll be back at the top of the hour.
(WORLD SPORT)
RIDDELL: Becky, I could have talked to Sarah for hours. I love her story. She's just an incredible person.
ANDERSON: Brilliant. And you know, I have normally, by the time we speak, read your articles because they're brilliant. But I haven't read that one.
After this show I'll go away and read it. It will be my bedtime reading tonight because it will be late by the time I finish this show.
Always a pleasure, Don. Thank you. Thank you for that interview. Fantastic.
All right. This is CONNECT THE WORLD. We'll be back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
END
