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Mariupol Evacuees Arrive in Zaporizhzhya; Leak Reveals SCOTUS Could Overturn Abortion Rights. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired May 03, 2022 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.
ELENI GIOKOS, CNN ANCHOR (voice-over): I'm Eleni Giokos in Abu Dhabi and we start with breaking news. The long awaited arrival in Zaporizhzhya of a
civilian convoy from Mariupol.
These are live pictures coming through from Zaporizhzhya right now of the evacuees that have arrived from Mariupol. Ukraine's deputy prime minister
says the convoy was carrying 106 people, who managed to get out of the Azovstal plant over the weekend.
It was slow going, as the convoy had to travel through Russian controlled territory. While they have arrived safely, tens of thousands remain trapped
in Mariupol. Nick Paton Walsh is in Zaporizhzhya.
Nick, you are on the ground right now witnessing the arrival of the evacuees from the Azovstal plant. They have endured incredible sacrifices
for weeks now. Tell us about what you are hearing.
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: You know, what you are seeing carry, some of the 106 people who are coming off these buses
here to welcome from the United Nations, from the police, the media as well.
And we are told 106 arrived and they arrived on five separate buses. And to scenes in which some of them have a chance to say a little bit about what
they've been enduring. In fact some still seeing for the first time in months sunlight after a two-day journey.
And the tales, the possessions they are carrying, one woman in her 70s with her head torch still around her neck, carrying a plastic bag of possessions
that she lived with for weeks underground.
But her concern when asked where she goes now was, "I know nobody here. My life was in Mariupol."
And here, you can see more people still coming off of the buses here, carrying with them, most of them from Azovstal, stories of what they
endured for weeks underground. Azovstal, a place of refuge because of how heavily the fight had been at the steel plant.
And still here slowly, one by one, coming off. Some of them clearly having -- have access to very little in terms of utilities at all in the past.
Smiles of relief here.
(Speaking foreign language).
WALSH: I'm just trying not to move through the tents arranged by the Ukrainian government, to receive them here, begin to provide some kind of
assistance for them to find a new life here outside of Mariupol.
And the numbers here comparatively small, I should say. We know there are 100,000 of civilians still inside of Mariupol. But the fate of the 106 was
so important because they had been trapped under what was increasingly the rubble of the Azovstal steel plant.
And because hope was the mechanism used to get them out of Mariupol, could become something more frequently used to get some of those thousands out as
well here. But scenes of jubilation --
GIOKOS: Nick, I see children. I see children as well.
WALSH: -- what people have endured.
GIOKOS: -- I see children --
WALSH: -- absolutely --
GIOKOS: -- and I know that --
WALSH: -- (INAUDIBLE).
GIOKOS: Yes. You also saw a baby earlier from what we understand. They were featured in one of your stories that made it out safely.
WALSH: Yes, that's right. Yes. There had been some video posted by Ukrainian government officials, which shows a six-month old boy, Sviatoslav
(ph), who had turned 6 months in fact the day before he had emerged from under Azovstal.
We just saw him over there with his mother. Reunited, I think possibly with their father. Certainly a family member with whom they had an intense
moment of reunification.
But slowly here, stories of people who endured such intense suffering in Mariupol. And then the intensity of life under Azovstal here, coming out
very slowly as they try to move on into tents over there, trying to have a moment of pause after what appears to have been an agonizing two-day
GIOKOS: Nick, you know we have been talking a couple of days now. We know how delicate this evacuation process actually was, how difficult, so many
delays, riddled with absolute challenges. And, of course, the uncertainty as well.
Do we have an understanding of how long it actually took for the evacuation process?
WALSH: Yes, two days. I think -- and I cannot speak for everybody on these buses because we think 106 or so out of Azovstal seem to have come
together. But at the same time, they may be a part of two separate days' worth of evacuations from Azovstal. Certainly I think, these people have
been on the road for two days.
That's what an official here looking after them had said. Give everybody space, let them rest, let them get water. And some may have been on the
road for longer. But the importance of this mechanism here is that it was arranged by the United Nations and the Red Cross. It is something that
occurred and it seems with a sense of Moscow. It does appear to have been a torturous journey from Russian held territory through checkpoints and
they're coming all the way here to Ukrainian held territory.
It's hope that mechanism could be repeated in the days ahead to get more people out as the bombardments and, certainly, an intense risk of disease
continues inside Mariupol. Eleni.
GIOKOS: Nick, you have rightly reminded the viewers that there are tens of thousands of people still trapped in Mariupol and Azovstal steel plant, of
course, such an important story that we have been covering.
And I guess the question now is, how many more people need to leave?
Do you think from your understanding, that all 106 have arrived?
Is this a number that we are anticipating?
Are there more people that should be coming through from the plant?
WALSH: Yes, certainly there are hundreds still to be within Azovstal. We don't have a precise number, 100, 200 have been suggested. Some of those
will be women and children. Some of those will also appear to -- that there are some wounded Ukrainian soldiers still in there.
It is unclear if those military injured are a part of any mechanism that may be used here. At this point, it is not appear to be the case. But the
people emerging on these buses are obviously the most severely at need, the ones who endured those weeks in the darkness.
And I'm just pointing out, still blinking. One woman in her 70s, when she came out, at seeing this kind of sunlight, just said it was, frankly, hard
to see at this stage.
GIOKOS: Yes, Nick, I saw an emotional response from one of the women that you spoke to. She was saying, I don't know where to go now. I don't know
what my life holds from here on. I am seeing behind you the Red Cross. I see people on the ground trying to assist with what they can.
Do we have any understanding of where the people are going to be staying in Zaporizhzhya right now and being assisted there before they move on to
another city, do we know about what route they will be taking and how they're being assisted in understanding where to from here?
WALSH: Yes, Ukraine has a substantial resettlement program for those trying to flee from here. And these people will become a part of that. The
United Nations, UNICEF are here and the Red Cross as well. And we do know there's obviously, a mechanism established here.
A tent over there, where they'll begin to get their aid. We see buses prepared to take them off elsewhere. So clearly, there will be mechanisms
in place to ensure they have someone to go as they move on.
But as of now, I think there's just a sense of relief coupled with trying to digest the extraordinary barbarity they have been seeing over the past
GIOKOS: Yes, I can only imagine. And for you as well, to witness this. You've spoken to so many of these people. They have been enormously
impacted. You've seen unprecedented sacrifices that have been made.
I guess the question now is -- what kind of information will we get out of the experience in Azovstal?
It's a big concern about the soldiers and what is their fate?
And, of course, importantly, continuing the conversations to keep these evacuation efforts going, both sides deciding on when and how that will
WALSH: Yes, look. This has been an entire exercise, an operation where trust has been utterly lacking. And frankly, from the Russian military,
many more you would expect to allow civilians in this number out through a humanitarian corridor. That has been absent.
The fact that these 106, not the only ones to get out. We have seen slowly over the past days, a number of people coming here of their own auspices,
on their own steam just to get themselves out. But their journey has been torturous through Russian checkpoints, multiple numbers of those.
WALSH: Up toward Donetsk (ph), which is what we've seen up there. We've seen actually some people emerging from here. The last big Russian held
town, people today saying they have been shelling around that.
And here the buses now are beginning to move on and people slowly telling their stories. But a scene of certainly relief for those who have got out.
But also to, this kind of a shock, frankly, that they have been through these two months underground.
And here we have another bus about to move off.
GIOKOS: Tell me how many buses you have seen arrive.
Are they going to be going back to pick up more evacuees?
Do we have an idea of the logistics here, Nick?
WALSH: Five at the moment today. We knew this first wave was going to be small. There had been hopes that it might possibly have more individuals on
it, if they possibly joined up with civilians on the way, providing a broader corridor --
Hey, man, in a second.
-- Abroad on a potential --
Marcus, you have a moment or ... ?
-- the potential to possibly get more individuals out as that corridor moves. They might be able to join up and use that passage to get themselves
So I was trying to see if somebody would come and talk to us on camera here. But there doesn't appear to have happened in this specific incident
because it does seem the Russians have been more complex in terms of who they have allowed out.
I must say the hope of this being a huge movement of humanity out of Mariupol, collecting those on the way with a sort of escort guarantee that
the U.N. and the Red Cross were able to provide.
But that hasn't happened and I think the small number of people that we have seen emerge here -- and I know these, seeing people, their great
expectation for and hopes to mark the beginning of something. It's still a small number, 106, compared to the tens of thousands still trapped in
The beginning of something certainly but also the complexity of this, I think tells you a lot about how easy it will be moving forward, to get the
volume out that needs assistance.
GIOKOS: Yes. Nick, I will leave you. I know that you need to speak to some of the evacuees. It's important to get these stories. We appreciate you
bringing us this important information as it happens.
This is what we have seen coming through life from Zaporizhzhya, these are the evacuees from the Azovstal steel plant. We will be coming back to you,
Nick, in just a short while as the story develops.
And this, of course, is the face of resilience. The images that we are seeing of these evacuees that have been trapped in the plant for around two
All right so, now to an unprecedented preview of a Supreme Court ruling sending shockwaves across the U.S. Abortion rights advocates are up in arms
after "Politico" published what it calls a draft version of a Supreme Court opinion that could overturn Roe v. Wade.
That is the case that affirmed women's rights to an abortion in 1973. CNN has not independently confirmed the document but "Politico" says, it is
confident of its authenticity. My colleague, John Berman, talked to one of the "Politico" reporters behind that bombshell report.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSH GERSTEIN, SENIOR LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT, "POLITICO": It is stunning when you first do so. It's surprising, I think, to see it in this
format that looks a lot like a final Supreme Court opinion.
But I do think, John, if you step back and you think about the decades-long effort by conservatives and conservative legal activists to build up their
numbers on the court, you think about the fact that former president Donald Trump managed to get three nominations and confirmations of very
conservative justices to the Supreme Court, in part because of maneuvers by senator Mitch McConnell and others.
In that sense, maybe it's not that surprising. You could say this has been a long day coming, despite the way words strike you when you first read it.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: It is the culmination of efforts as you say, decades in the making and accelerated in new ways over the last several
years. And the impact is very, very real.
Some estimates -- we can put up a map, I think, so people can see -- this would, if this draft opinion becomes the real opinion, this means that
these states you are seeing in red there would almost immediately outlaw or severely restrict abortion rights. And the ones in yellow can potentially
do the same.
So it would have a very large impact. Josh, before we get much further on this, just let's make clear exactly what you obtained and the significance
of the fact that you have this draft opinion.
What is a draft opinion?
GERSTEIN: So when the Supreme Court hears arguments in a case, usually within one, two or three days after that, they have a closed door private
conference, only the nine justices inside that conference room, a very secretive room at the Supreme Court. And each of them basically lays out
their position on each case.
GERSTEIN: And at that point, there's an effort to sign a majority opinion. Typically, the majority opinion is assigned by chief justice John Roberts
or whoever the chief justice at the time is if he is in the majority. And if not it's the most senior of the other justices who is in the majority.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Well, the U.S. president is sounding off on this report. Joe Biden issued a statement just about half an hour ago, saying, "Be cautious. We do
not know whether this draft is genuine or whether it reflects the final decision of the court."
And then goes on to say, "I believe that a woman's right to choose is fundamental. Roe has been the law of the land for almost 50 years. And
basic fairness and the stability of our law demand that it not be overturned."
Mr. Biden also called an advocate of abortion rights to choose like-minded officials at the ballot box this November.
CNN justice correspondent Jessica Schneider joins us now live from the U.S. Supreme Court.
A 98-page draft opinion: I guess if this is ratified, if it does go ahead, this could be a seismic shift in women's rights.
JESSICA SCHNEIDER, CNN JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: It absolutely could be a monumental and consequential decision, Eleni. If it actually is issued --
of course we have been saying that this is just a draft opinion. It was drafted and circulated on February 10th.
So a lot of time has passed between then and now. It is also possible that even though "Politico" reports, justice Alito has the backing of four other
conservative justices to make this a 5-4 majority, it's quite possible that the justices could eventually change their votes.
We are still about eight weeks out from the end of the term. We were not expecting any abortion ruling to come before the end of June. That's
typically when the court issues its most consequential decisions.
Now we have this draft opinion. We have not heard any word from the Supreme Court itself. I contacted a spokesperson last, night. They said a simple
and strict, "No comment."
We had a camera outside the court -- outside the home of chief justice John Roberts this morning. He was asked what he thought about the leak, if he
would move to investigate the leak. He stayed silent. So we have not heard anything from the court.
But in, fact this draft opinion would eliminate the constitutional right to get an abortion, something this country has had for nearly 50 years, since
Roe v. Wade was decided in 1973.
If this would actually become the majority opinion that gets issued, that would be overturned. We are already seeing the repercussions of this all
over the United States. If Roe v. Wade is overturned, estimates are that about half the states would move to immediately ban abortion.
Many of these states have trigger laws in effect which say that if Roe v. Wade is overturned, then abortion would immediately be banned.
We've also seen a flurry of Republican-led states in recent weeks and months move to enact legislation, that either severely restricts or all-out
bans abortion, Eleni. So we are already seeing the Republicans in this country reading the tea leaves here, passing laws that they believe will
stand up once the Supreme Court issues a decision.
It remains to be seen but it would be seismic if the Supreme Court were to continue on this path and overrule Roe v. Wade.
GIOKOS: An unprecedented piece of information there. We still don't what know the outcome will be, Jessica Schneider, thank you so much.
To help us understand implications of this decision, I am now joined by CNN legal analyst, Areva Martin.
Areva, really good to see you. You have said this decision in Roe v. Wade is, and I quote, "not the end but rather the beginning of the elimination
of many rights and freedoms that women enjoy in the Constitution."
But I want you to talk to me about the immediate implications of this potential ruling.
AREVA MARTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, the immediate implications are going to be devastating for literally millions of women across the United States.
We just heard from the correspondent about these trigger laws. Half of the states in the United States have these laws, which immediately go into
effect once Roe v. Wade is overturned, which makes abortion illegal in about 50 percent of the states in the United States.
That means women of color, poor women, women without resources and means that live in those states would have to travel, would have to find the
resources to leave their state and to go to another state to exercise their freedoms over their bodies, their freedom over their own reproductive
And that as we know can be devastating. When you think about this draft opinion, too, it's also very galling because over 50 percent of the
residents, the citizens and the voters in the United States support women's rights to choose their own decisions, make their own decisions over their
MARTIN: But yet five justices on the Supreme Court, three of whom, when confirmed said to the Senate confirmation members, that they would respect
Roe v. Wade as precedent, now that those five justices to make their decision about women's rights is really appalling.
GIOKOS: And it's interesting, you say that you know people in the United States support women's rights. In that draft opinion paper that we saw, it
mentions that, actually, the justices do not need to take into consideration what Americans feel but rather what is right.
And some of them -- it's really ambiguous in terms of what some of these justices think. They think that it should be overturned, that this
precedent that was created about 50 years ago was founded on the wrong basis, on the wrong legal basis and it's actually not the law of the land.
What do you make of some of that messaging in the draft opinion paper?
MARTIN: I think that's more rhetoric than it is statements rooted in the Constitution. We know that there are many rights that we enjoy in the
United States that are not specifically mentioned in the Constitution. And that is kind of the foundation of this opinion, is that the word "abortion"
is not listed, it's not identified, it's not stated in the Constitution.
But if you follow that line of argument to its logical conclusion, the rights to privacy, for example, would not be guaranteed under the United
States Constitution. So the justices are -- I think what we see is them following a particular ideology that has been articulated by conservatives
in this country for many decades.
We didn't just get here yesterday. We didn't get here four years ago with Donald Trump. But this is kind of a long and very methodical plan on the
part of Republicans to roll back the rights of women. And I believe those rights are not just the rights of women but the rights of Americans.
GIOKOS: Areva Martin, thank you so very much. Great to have you on and I'm sure that we will be talking about this at length over the next few weeks.
Now on the date we thought Vladimir Putin might declare victory. He could in fact declare war instead. Plus speaking softly, and carry a large
Javelin -- President Biden's words -- putting the spotlight on the thousands of American made missiles sent to Ukraine.
Today he paid a symbolic visit to the factory where they are made.
GIOKOS: And welcome back, a recap of our breaking news.
The long awaited arrival in Zaporizhzhya of a civilian convoy from Mariupol, these are pictures that we saw live actually. They're coming
through live, I'm being told. These are arrivals, evacuees from the Azovstal steel plant in to Zaporizhzhya.
GIOKOS: This has been two days in the making of evacuees, desperately trying to get out. A huge effort by the Red Cross and other international
NGOs to get people out, 106 people, from what we understand have arrived. And we have, of course, people on the ground that are currently speaking to
some of the evacuees.
The stories are emotional and, also harrying. People stuck in that steel plant for two months. And Ukraine's deputy prime minister says the convoy
was carrying 106 people who managed to get out of the Azov steel plant over the weekend. In just a few hours U.S. President Joe Biden will visit a
factory that makes Javelin anti-tank missiles, the weapon that has proven critical in Ukraine's defense against Russia.
Already, the U.S. has delivered over 5,000 Javelins to Ukraine from American stockpiles. And the U.S. Defense Secretary says Ukrainian
officials have at times asked for 500 a day.
And during his stop at the facility, Mr. Biden is expected to call on Congress to quickly pass a new $33 billion dollar aid package that would,
among other things, help the U.S. replenish its own weapons stockpiles.
John Harwood is at the White House, with more on President Biden's visit.
John, great to see you. Much of the security aid that is being sent to Ukraine, including the Javelin missiles, has come from a drawdown, as in
existing Pentagon stocks.
Will that continue?
JOHN HARWOOD, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and, you know, this plant that the president is visiting today can make about 2,100 Javelin
missiles a year. The United States has already drawn down its own stockpile, shipping over 5,000 Javelins to Ukraine. That is going to
It's very clear that both the United States and NATO have gone all in on standing with Ukraine, as this war settles into a grinding conflict in the
east and the south with Russia poised, perhaps with this declaration of war we have been talking about for the last 24 hours or so, with a much
increased number of troops and continued bombardment, trying to claim more territory and trying to identify more parts of Ukraine as independent
through sham elections.
So the United States is supporting Ukraine. The president will demonstrate that support by going to Alabama. He's also showing the American people
their own stake in this conflict, showing that the Americans are participating through the manufacture of these weapons.
It also has ramifications for the United States' economy because of the jobs that are created at plants of this kind. But the president is going to
underscore the depth of the American commitment with the trip today.
GIOKOS: All right, John Harwood, thank you so much for that update.
We are going to a short break, more CONNECT THE WORLD right after this. Stay with CNN.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): This is CNN breaking news.
GIOKOS: You are watching CONNECT THE WORLD.
Stories of survival and terror now in Ukraine. Some Mariupol evacuees have been recounting the horrors of the Russian bombardment of the Azovstal
steel plant. They've been trapped there for more than two months.
Some upbeat news coming in, civilians evacuated from the steel plant in Mariupol have arrived in Zaporizhzhya. CNN's team witnessed emotional
scenes earlier and, at the same time, U.S. and other Western officials are sounding the alerts about this coming Monday.
And that's because they think a formal declaration of war by Vladimir Putin is looming as soon as May 9th. That day is known as victory day in Russia,
commemorating its defeat of the Nazis in 1945.
Now a formal declaration would enable the full mobilization of Russia's reserve forces. Russian president Vladimir Putin could move to formally
declare war on Ukraine as soon as May 9th and that's according to U.S. and Western officials, who say that would allow for the full mobilization of
Russia's reserve forces, as they try to conquer Eastern and southern Ukraine.
As we've mentioned, it's a victory day. May 9th is important for Russia. It commemorates Russia's defeat of the Nazis.
Katie Bo Lillis now joins us in Washington.
Katie Bo, really good to see you. Vladimir Putin has had sort of nostalgia about the past, specifically, important moments in history. For everyone
else, this has been a war but it's semantics, clearly, for Vladimir Putin, moving from what it would be now, what he calls a special military
operation, to a potential war.
Would it have real ramifications on the ground?
KATIE BO LILLIS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: It certainly could. Now it's important to understand that U.S. and Western officials aren't making a specific
prediction here. They are saying that this is one possibility of what could happen on May 9th, not that they have hard intelligence that yes,
absolutely, on May 9th, Russian president Vladimir Putin is going to make this announcement.
Officials have long suspected that he might try to use the symbolic day of May 9th to announce some kind of propaganda victory to perhaps say, oh,
look, I've achieved our war aims and even potentially use that as an offramp to the conflict.
Now officials increasingly believe that, in fact, he may move to escalate on May 9th by announcing a formal declaration of war on Ukraine.
Now what would this mean practically?
There is two sort of implications here that I think Putin might expect or hope to get out of such announcement.
One of them is just the rally around the flag effort. It's his opportunity to kind of get the Russian population prepared for some long-term costs of
this conflict, whether it's from the economic sanctions and the bite that those are beginning to have, that have been directed on Russia by the West.
Or whether it is preparing the population for the loss of their sons, of their brothers, of their fathers headed off to war.
The other practical implication here, again, if this does happen as some believe it now might, what Putin might expect to get out of this is the
declaration, is the possibility that he could get more manpower for his conflict in Ukraine.
Remember, the Russians have lost an enormous number of troops in this conflict. U.S. and Western officials estimate as many as 10,000 Russian
troops have been lost in the first stage of Putin's war. That's a lot of soldiers.
Russia now has to try to backfill that, so this declaration could usher in draft conscriptions and mass mobilization of reserve forces, which would be
an important thing.
GIOKOS: All right, thank you very much.
We would like to go back to our breaking news story. We have people and evacuees arriving from the Azovstal steel plant from Mariupol into
Zaporizhzhya. It's been a two-day effort to get the evacuees to where you are, Nick Paton Walsh.
We've been hearing from you some of the emotional stories and experiences.
What have you learned since we last spoke?
WALSH: There is a clear outpouring of relief amongst people here. And when we first saw part of the 106 evacuees from Azovstal coming off the buses,
we did meet (INAUDIBLE) they're being helped over there now, a woman in her 70s called Olga (ph).
WALSH: And just catching up with her inside here, where people are, as you can see, being given food, a chance to sit down after two days, possibly
longer, in some cases, talking to Olga, it was clear that the two people with her, Vladimir (ph) and Victoria (ph), acquaintances from their
experience trapped in Azovstal, they talked about how there had been food, there had been not that many injured people trapped under there with them.
But the sheer terror, frankly, you're seeing some relief there in some of the younger people emerging who've seen the terror of the explosions
overhead constantly, at the -- so hard for them -- Olga (ph), who is 70, was deeply concerned, because she had injured her leg and was concerned for
(INAUDIBLE) for herself in the coming weeks.
People here are now going to have to start their lives again from scratch, because they fled their home city of Mariupol. And we've seen over the past
two months how it's been destroyed, emerging, only, some of them recognizable by video put around by the Ukraine government, of them
emerging from the rubble. They emerged to see the damage that had been done, having not been aware of the extent of that because they were
underground for quite so long.
But this first convoy of 106 emerging through -- (INAUDIBLE) -- here, deeply important because of the hopes in it, that that mechanism fostered
by the United Nations and Red Cross.
You could see in their distinctive blue moving around here, assisting people, they're hoping that mechanism might be able to get some of the
100,000 or so civilians still thought to be inside Mariupol out -- and out at a larger volume.
But while the people we've spoken to here talk of a relatively benign Russian presence at multiple checkpoints they've passed through, probably
because they were with the United Nations and Red Cross, there are, of course, (INAUDIBLE) fears that this took, just to get this 106 out, two
days, it seems.
There may have been technicalities that are now being resolved but there had been a hope that this 106, as they move, brought other civilians trying
to flee along with them and grown into a larger number. That did not happen.
Instead, we got five buses, no civilian cars accompanying them, arriving out here. So certainly, scenes here of relief but also, people from the
town, that was peaceful, living in disbelief. Just three months ago and now in ruins, with their lives that have to be rebuilt.
GIOKOS: Nick, I can't help but notice, children waving at you and the camera and then eating. I could feel there's some sort of relief. And just
thinking about how the children and the most vulnerable, that were stuck in the steel plant with very little resources, very little food and water and
no sunlight, such an incredibly harrowing experience for these evacuees. And to think there are more that have been left behind.
WALSH: Yes. We you don't know the precise number of those who are yet to get out, we think it may be in the hundreds. Certainly, one of the women I
spoke to said there was 17 children she was aware of under Azovstal.
But these are numbers incompletes. The woman in her 70s, we spoke to, it's clear she was wearing a head torch to find herself some light, it was
hanging around her neck. But you can see here, families experiencing the normality of sitting at the table and just drinking a cup of coffee or tea
for the first time in quite a while, clear relief.
GIOKOS: Emotional scenes there. Nick, thank you so much for bringing us the story. Much appreciated.
We're going to a short break and we'll be right back after this. Stay with us.