Return to Transcripts main page

Connect the World

Vladimir Putin Hosts Second Day of Russia-Africa Summit; South Africa-Russia Relationship Under Scrutiny; General Abdourahamane Tiani Claims He's New Leader Of Niger; Interview With Denmark's Global Climate Minister Dan Jorgensen About Climate Change; New Charges Filed In Classified Documents Case; Many Afghans Still Waiting For Visas Promised By U.S. Aired 10-10:45a ET

Aired July 28, 2023 - 10:00   ET



ELENI GIOKOS, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: I'm Eleni Giokos live from Abu Dhabi, and this is CONNECT THE WORLD.

Coming up this hour, Russian-African diplomacy on full display in St. Petersburg. Niger's coup general speaks out, blaming the country for its

deteriorating security situation. The special counsel has brought additional charges against former U.S. president Donald Trump in the case

alleging mishandling of classified documents. And Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu speaks to CNN after a chaotic week in Israel.

Welcome to the show. And we start in St. Petersburg where Russian President Putin is pointing fingers at enemies and making promises to allies. It is

the second day of this Russia-Africa summit and his war in Ukraine is in the spotlight. A short time ago, Mr. Putin said that a peace plan proposed

by African leaders to end the war would be discussed in the coming hours. Meantime, as global food prices skyrocket, Putin also spent Friday shaking

off blame, saying it is the West that has made, quote, "one mistake after another."

We have our correspondents across this for you. Our Nic Robinson, our international diplomatic editor in London standing by as well as CNN

international correspondent David McKenzie in Johannesburg.

Welcome to both of you.

Nic, I want to start with you. A lot on the agenda including that peace plan for Putin and Putin deflecting the impact on food and energy rising

prices not being a result of the war, of his own war. Take us through the top lines here.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes. What is said is that this is a case of the U.S. and the European Union not planning for the

change in use or the transition in use of fossil fuels and leading, therefore, to print money which is what he said that they did during COVID,

and that he said that has forced up global food prices and fuel prices.

It's the inability of Russia to sell its oil and gas to Europe and to some of the nations as well that's contributed to that. But Putin very clearly

blaming it on the West as he was doing yesterday, accusing the West of hypocrisy and being the reason why Russia can't export its grain around the


These are pictures that he hopes are going to resonate with these African leaders there. We've heard as well from some of those leaders from Mali,

from Central African Republic, presidents of both those countries praising their relationships with Russia and saying that they have been beneficial

to their countries. These of course are countries that the Wagner Group led by Yevgeny Prigozhin, that mercenary boss, has been at the forefront of the

Kremlin's agenda in those countries, fostering relationships there.

So, look, there are certainly people within that audience who have come, leaders, and Cyril Ramaphosa, the president South Africa, among them as

well, who have been praising the relationship with Russia on that peace plan. This is a peace plan that calls for both sides to de-escalate

tensions. Laudable in anyone's eyes to try to find a way to calm the conflict and to end the conflict.

But it doesn't seem to address neither Russia's position as the invader of Ukraine nor Ukraine's position that Russia needs to get out of Ukraine

before, you know, you can have substantial peace talks. So that's something that Putin says is important and will get discussed. It's not quite clear

if it actually meets Russia's needs either because he doesn't seem to be in the mood for de-escalation at the moment and he invaded in the first place.

GIOKOS: Very good point.

David McKenzie is standing by for us as well. These strategic meetings held, some with individual leaders, African leaders. I was just looking at

what President Ramaphosa, president of South Africa, said that he welcomes deepened and increased economic relations with Russia. Perhaps one of the

most strategic partners, David, for Putin.

DAVID MCKENZIE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It is, and certainly South Africa has angered Western diplomats for some time now for

its stance, its stated stances obviously of nonalignment. But actions have been different or seen differently across the world, particularly in

Washington, London, and capitals of Europe.

So Ramaphosa spoke to the session earlier today in St. Petersburg. He did say that there were deep ties between South Africa and in particular the

former Soviet Union.


But ideological ties only means so much, and we try to follow the money.


UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Abstentions 32.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): South Africa's policy on paper is nonalignment on the Ukraine war. But its actions have deeply angered Western powers.

Consistently refusing to condemn Russia's invasion of Ukraine at the U.N. General Assembly. In February, hosting naval war games with Russia and

China on the anniversary of the start of the war. A powerful propaganda moment for Putin.

And the U.S. ambassador publicly rebuked the government and the ruling ANC, claiming there was intelligence showing weapons and ammunition loaded on a

sanctioned cargo ship bound for Russia in December. It's now a subject of a government inquiry.

REUBEN E. BRIGETY II, U.S. AMBASSADOR TO SOUTH AFRICA: The observable gap between the rhetoric and the reality of a government's professed policy of

nonalignment and neutrality.

MCKENZIE: The question is, why? We've traveled to the remote Kalahari. In this desert soil, a highly lucrative manganese belt used in making steel

and the United Manganese of Kalahari mines or UMK. First revealed by nonprofit investigators at AmaBhungane, UMK has deep financial ties to this

man, Viktor Vekselberg, a Russian oligarch linked to Vladimir Putin and to South Africa.

Here he is in 2006 in Cape Town. The U.S. Treasury sanctioned Vekselberg in 2018 and again in 2022 for supporting Putin's invasion of Ukraine. Last

year, Spanish authorities and the FBI seized his $19 million super yacht Tango. Despite the sanctions, Vekselberg still holds an important interest

in UMK, according to business records held in Cyprus.

Another significant player, holding company Chancellor House, for years channeling funds to the ruling African National Congress. According to

publicly available declarations, since 2021, UMK and Chancellor House combined have contributed at least $2.9 million to the financially

struggling ANC.

(On-camera): This is a highly lucrative operation and anti-corruption activists say that these alleged linkages pose serious questions. Is South

Africa's policy towards Russia on the world stage influenced by money?

Is it possible that foreign policy also has a link to corruption or at the very least to conflict of interest?

KARAM SINGH, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, CORRUPTION WATCH: I think this is an increasing concern that we now are more lied to than ever before that there

could be foreign money from a Russian origin that comes into South Africa that flows into different political coffers. And I think that could

absolutely have an impact upon, you know, how South Africa takes positions on certain policies.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): Substantial investment, preferential trade policies, and critical foreign aid from the U.S. and European Union are crucial to

South Africa, the world's most unequal country. Dwarfing Russia's contribution in both trade and aid.

STEVEN GRUZD, RUSIA-AFRICA ANALYST, SAIIA: I think South Africa is playing a dangerous game here. And indeed sometimes politicians are putting the

political party, the ANC, before the needs of the citizens because it just doesn't make sense to be so closely associated with Russia when the stakes

are so high and there's so much at risk.

MCKENZIE: And what does that risk mean for South Africa?

GRUZD: So it risks investment, it risks trade, it risks jobs, it risks economic growth. It risks the currency. It risks isolation from the West. I

think there's a lot at stake here.

MCKENZIE (voice-over): A lot at stake for a country that has much to lose.


MCKENZIE: We reached out to the parties involved. Chancellor House, UMK and Renova Group, the Vekselberg-owned group in Russia all denied any

wrongdoing, any undue influence on the ANC or any sanctions violations. They said party donations are transparent, legal and without preconditions.

The ANC for their part, Eleni, didn't agree to a sit-down interview or provide a statement based on the allegations in this report -- Eleni.

GIOKOS: Very insightful piece there, David. Thank you so much.

David McKenzie in Johannesburg and Nic Robertson in London, thank you both.

And stay with us because next hour on CONNECT THE WORLD we'll be joined by a U.S. State Department official who's been watching the developments at

the Russia-Africa summit and he'll tell us about disinformation surrounding the Black Sea grain initiative and Russia's attempts to remain relevant in


Now the Africa summit with Russia is happening against the backdrop of a coup in Niger.


General Abdourahamane Tiani claims he's now the new leader of the West African nation following Wednesday's coup according to state television.

However, a senior official to President Mohamed Bazoum claims there are disagreements among the leaders of that coup and that Mr. Bazoum has no

intention of resigning.

It has been two days since the president was detained by members of his presidential guard with the backing of Niger's military. It is believed

he's still being held inside his residence. Multiple world leaders have condemned the actions of the coup leaders and have called for Mr. Bazoum's

immediate released.

For more on this we've got Larry Madowo joining us from Nairobi, Kenya.

Abdourahamane, the general who led this coup, declaring himself the new leader, he also spoke interestingly about the security situation being a

key factor in this coup. Take us through the latest here -- Larry.

LARRY MADOWO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. Abdourahamane Tiani is the leader of the presidential guard, that's the important and I'll get to it

in a second. But he says he had to take this decision because of the deteriorating security situation and to prevent a bloodbath in the country.

He's been critical, for instance, of the Niger government's decision not to cooperate with Mali and Burkina Faso, its neighbors who also face their

Islamist insurgency in the Sahel region.

And he is the leader of the presidential guard. This is the specialized unit of soldiers that were detaining President Mohamed Bazoum on Wednesday

and then on the night of Wednesday declared that they had taken the government, removed President Bazoum and shut down the borders, suspended

the constitution, shut down aerial and land borders, and essentially suspended every single thing that works in a functioning democracy.

He was appointed by the previous president of Niger and was retained by President Bazoum, and this is his explanation for why he decided to

overthrow his boss.


GEN. ABDOURAHAMANE TIANI, NIGER'S DECLARED NEW HEAD OF STATE (through translator): The action of the CNSP is motivated by the desire to preserve

our beloved country. On the one hand, because of the security degradation of our country and this without the deposed authorities giving a glimpse of

a real way out of the crisis. Secondly, because of the poor economic and social governance.


MADOWO: So that's his explanation. But a senior source loyal to President Mohamed Bazoum says this has no implication on the leadership of Niger,

that President Bazoum has no intention to resign, and claims that there's some disagreement among these coup leaders over who exactly is in charge.

And they're afraid of possible sanctions from the regional body ECOWAS, the West African -- the Economic Community of West African States.

But this coup at least in the public telling and in the pro-military quarters we've seen is a rejection of Francafrique, this French influence

in West and Central Africa. You see for instance President Emmanuel Macron saying he's spoken to President Bazoum. He rejects this takeover and he's

praising President Bazoum as a democratically elected president and a courageous man.

But the people on the streets do not want France involved in the affairs in Niger. They don't want the 2,500 French troops in Niger and in neighboring

Chad. They do not want any French influence in that country. That is why, for instance, you saw the burning of the French flag and some of them

raising Russian flags that said done with France, seemingly opening up themselves up to some kind of cooperation with Russia.

This creates an opportunity for Russia to expand its influence in the country and in the region. The Wagner Group is already active in

neighboring Mali, in the Central African Republic not too far from there. And if a vacuum exists, then that is a good shoe in for somebody like

Russia to take advantage of that vacuum that would be created -- Eleni.

GIOKOS: Fascinating. Larry Madowo, great to have you on the story, thank you.

Well, Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is now trying to clarify some comments made in Thursday's interview with CNN's Wolf Blitzer about

his country's Supreme Court. His office releasing a statement today saying, "Israeli governments always respect the court's decisions and that the

court is always considered itself subject to basic laws to which it attributes the status of a constitution."

This after Wolf asked Mr. Netanyahu point blank if he would abide by a Supreme Court ruling striking down the controversial Reasonableness Law

that's seen as a check on the court's own powers. Here's what he said.


BENJAMIN NETANYAHU, ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: Well, look, we'll go into uncharted territory, and I really would like to believe that they won't do

that. And the reason is that, first of all, we're all subject to the rule of law. The prime minister is subject to the rule of law, the Knesset, our

parliament, is subject to the rule of law. The judges are subject to the law. Everybody is subject to the law.

Now the closest thing we have to constitution are basic laws. That's what we're dealing with.


And what you're talking about is a situation, a potential situation where in American terms the United States Supreme Court would take a

constitutional amendment and say that it's unconstitutional. That's the kind of spiral that you're talking about and I hope we don't get to that.

WOLF BLITZER, CNN ANCHOR: I want you to listen to what the former Israeli prime minister Ehud Olmert had to say during an interview here on CNN.

Listen to this.

EHUD OLMERT, FORMER ISRAELI PRIME MINISTER: Iran wants to help Israel, then the president of the United States has to say publicly, explicitly,

officially that America is reassessing its relations with the state of Israel on all matters. On economic matters, on foreign aid, on everything.

BLITZER: That's pretty incredible when you think about it. Former Israeli prime minister, and I've covered Israel for many years, saying something

like that. What's your reaction to what Prime Minister Olmert said?

NETANYAHU: Well, it may explain why Prime Minister Olmert was booted out by the electorate, why he had 6 percent support. That's why. Because you're

quite right, a prime minister of Israel does not say that. He doesn't call on other nations to -- and especially our great friend, the United States,

to turn its back to Israel.

Israel is a democratic country. It has an internal debate. You have an internal debate in the United States right now about the powers of the

Supreme Court, about whether it's abusing its power. You should curtail it. I'm not going to enter into that debate. Does that make the American

democracy not a democracy? Does that make that debate unworthy? Does that make that issue a symbol of the fact that you're moving to some

dictatorship? Of course not.

So this is a bitter politician who failed and was rejected by the voters coming back and saying, oh, well, I'm going to get mine back. Sorry, that's

not the right way to act. You're quite right, it is an amazing spectacle and I think it just tells you who these people are.


GIOKOS: Prime Minister Netanyahu says he'll likely reinstate a government minister whose appointment the Supreme Court deemed unreasonable earlier

this year.

Well, scorching heat waves and deadly wildfires across northern hemisphere. Up next, we'll ask the Danish climate minister how the G20 working group is

getting to grips with fossil fuels as the world endures its hottest month ever. And nearly two years since the last U.S. troops left Afghanistan,

some an unresolved issues are being addressed in rare meetings this week.


GIOKOS: Now the harsh reality of historic heat. The U.N. a chief warning in his words the era of global boiling has arrived as July shapes up to be the

world's hottest month on record. That is adding new urgency to September's G20 meeting.


Last year's gathering trumpeted collective efforts to limit the rise in global temperatures. And right now, the G20's climate working group is

meeting under India's G20 Presidency in Chennai and they're talking goals and action but a lot of these high-end meetings often involve private jets

for some of the top names making the global rounds. And I've seen it for myself. Which begs the question. Could these gatherings be a kind of

extreme theater about extreme weather?

My next guest, Denmark's global climate minister, is already working with the leaders of the COP28 gathering set for November here in the UAE. Dan

Jorgensen is also an adviser on the G20's climate goals. He joins us now live from Chennai in India.

So great to have you with us. We couldn't be meeting at a more important time. Look, we've seen the meetings that happened in China with -- not too

long ago. There seems to be consensus on what the problems are, how urgent the situation is, but I want to know if you've walked away with clear

commitments and goals in terms of action that match what we are seeing on the climate's emergency.

Is the urgency of the discussions you're having matching the urgency that we're seeing on the ground?


recorded in history and really, as the secretary general of the United Nations has put it, this is code red for humanity. We are in a climate

catastrophe, a climate crisis, and that really should urge all countries to step up.

We need to dramatically reduce our CO2 emissions, our greenhouse gas emissions, and actually, the good news is that we know how to do it. We

need to deploy more renewables, more energy efficiency. And this can be done. So I would very much on behalf of my own country --

GIOKOS: We know how to do it, but we're not doing it. But we know how to do it and we're not seeing the big emitters doing it.

JORGENSEN: Yes, I know, you say we because -- and that is not entirely correct. Some countries are. In all modesty my own country, we are doing

what we can which means that we will reduce our emissions by 70 percent before 2030. Now this is something that we do to show the way. And also of

course, we hope to be able to deliver some of the solutions that other countries can use.

GIOKOS: But, Minister, we need to get the big emitters to get on board. And I wanted to talk about the nuances of the language that plague the

negotiations because that's what actually happens that results in terms of action.


GIOKOS: The big conundrum, phase out versus phase down of fossil fuels. Hey, that's been up in the air. Do you think that we're going to find

consensus on what that is? Because the sciences have told us in the last few weeks, in no -- in very simple terms, we have to stop burning fossil



GIOKOS: We have no choice.

JORGENSEN: Certainly. We need to stop burning fossil fuels. What does that mean? That means no more new coal power plants. It means no more new oil

drilling. And it means that we need to find alternatives. The alternatives are there, but we need to deploy them at a much faster rate.

Now am I optimistic? Well, I would say that I had hope that this G20 meeting would have produced some more tangible results. Having said that, I

do think that there is a moment, and as you said earlier, nobody longer really argues that this is a real problem, that we need to deal with now.

The next step is then of course to then make the countries also take the consequence of that. And at the COP28 meeting later this year in Dubai,

this is exactly what I hope will be the result.

GIOKOS: Minister, I have to say, I feel disillusioned because I keep hearing we know what the problems are, we just misstep implementation.

Hoping it will change by COP28.


GIOKOS: Look, you're not part of the G20, but you're obviously there. You're part of this working group. I want to ask you clearly, which

countries are undermining efforts?

JORGENSEN: Well, it's clear that there are some countries that are major oil producers that don't really at least yet see themselves in a future

way, they don't produce oil. There are also others that actually acknowledge that we need to move away from oil and into more renewables but

that are not doing it yet.

Now one thing that I would say because I do understand when you say that you're disillusioned, so am I sometimes, but there are progress. One thing

is for instance that we're now discussing in real terms to make a global energy efficiency target and a global renewable target. If this happens --

it's been proposed by the European Union, it's been proposed by the UAE presidency. If that happens that will be some real tangible results that

will also help drive the market.

Because, remember, this is primarily I would argue something for decision- makers, politicians to do something about, but it's also something that we need to make sure includes the market because if we don't have the

companies, if we don't have the investors, then we won't reach our targets.


GIOKOS: Yes. But then the argument is there aren't enough bankable projects. You know, I come from a continent that is still developing, the

African continent. There are huge developmental and industrialization needs. The argument is that, you know, they have the right to burn their

own fossil fuels and they're not the biggest emitter.

Developing economies are saying there is hypocrisy. If you look at the numbers, there is absolutely hypocrisy.


GIOKOS: Is one solution putting a price on carbon? You emit, you burn more, you pay.

JORGENSEN: Well, certainly putting a price on carbon is a good idea. This is what we've done in the European Union. Other countries around the planet

have done similar actions. But I think we cannot wait for those elaborate schemes to work if they're not even adopted yet in many countries. So we

need action now.

And I would actually agree with those developing countries saying that there's a bit of hypocrisy from many developed countries because it is

possible for developed countries to help more. Really it needs to be what we call a common differentiated responsibility. This is the term used in

the Paris agreement.

It means that yes, all countries on the planet has a responsibility. It's a common one. But some countries have a bigger responsibility than others.

And that's the developed world, the richest countries.

GIOKOS: Minister --

JORGENSEN: We need to deliver more financing.

GIOKOS: We've almost run out of time. But -- Minister, we've almost run out of time but I have to, before I say goodbye, there was the burning of the

Quran in Copenhagen. Saudi Arabia and Egypt both summoning charge d'affaires from Denmark. Could you give me a sense, first of all your

response, and then how does this impact relations with these two nations?

JORGENSEN: Well, we certainly condemn what has been happening in front of the embassies. These actions by individuals that we criticize and that we

by no means support, and we are in dialogue with the embassies of the countries that you mentioned in Copenhagen.

GIOKOS: Minister, really good to see you. I hope next time I see you we'll talk about tangible commitments and goals on climate change. We appreciate

your time. Thank you, sir, for joining us.

We'll take a look at this new drone video of the world's largest permafrost crater. The Batagaika crater in Russia's far east is one kilometer long.

The crater scientifically known as a mega slump was formed in the 1960s due to deforestation. This caused the permafrost underground to melt and the

land started sinking. Scientists are concerned that melting permafrost will warm the planet. That is because the soil contains an enormous amount of

organic carbon that will be released into the atmosphere.


NIKITA TANANAYEV, LEAD RESEARCHER, MELINKOV PERMAFROST INSTITUTE: It will be gradually released in contact with the atmosphere. It will can be

consumed by materials leading to higher methane emissions and CO2 emissions. Speeding the greenhouse effect. Feeding the greenhouse effect.

So this will lead to more and more climate warming in the following years.


GIOKOS: Well, more than half of Russia's land mass consists of permafrost and scientists say that the country warming at least 2.5 times that than

the rest of the world.

Well, still ahead, the agonizing wait for Afghans who have been promised U.S. visas two years on living, they're living limbo or they're in hiding.

And Donald Trump's legal problems get even deeper as prosecutors bring more charges against the former president.

Stay with CNN.



GIOKOS: Now to new major developments surrounding Donald Trump. The former U.S. president is facing more charges in the classified documents case and

prosecutors have charged a third person, an employee at Trump's Mar-a-Lago resort, with lying to the FBI about moving boxes of documents.

This all coming as Mr. Trump faces a possible indictment in a separate case over his role in the aftermath of the 2020 election.

CNN's Evan Perez joins us now from Washington.

Evan, what are the prosecutors alleging with the new charges in this documents case which has been plaguing the former president for quite some


EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: That's right. It's three new charges against the former president. And sort of the -- frankly the more

shocking one is one laid out by prosecutors accusing the former president of working with two of his employees at the Mar-a-Lago estate in Palm

Beach, Florida, to try to delete surveillance footage after the Trump Organization had received a subpoena from prosecutors asking -- seeking

that security footage.

One of the reasons why they were doing that is because they suspected, they had information to believe that there were still more documents that were

missing, that the former president was holding on to, and that there was an effort to conceal those boxes of documents including classified documents.

And I'll read you just a part of what the prosecutors laid out in this new indictments. It says that one of his new codefendant whose name is Carlos

De Oliveira, he's the head of maintenance at Mar-a-Lago. De Oliveira asked a Trump employee how many days the server retain footage. This is referring

to the server that contained the surveillance footage. And the Trump employee responded that he believed there was approximately 45 days.

They go on to describe the interaction, and they said De Oliveira then insisted to Trump employee number four that the boss wanted the server

deleted and then asked, what are we going to do? De Oliveira is charged as part of this indictment now. He is expected to appear in a federal court in

the Southern District of Florida next week.

The former president is also charged with retaining an additional document. There were 31 documents listed in the indictment in the initial stage. This

new indictment now lists a 32nd document. And this is a document that the former president has alleged to have been waving around during a meeting in

July of 2021 where he was talking about a battle plan for an attack on Iran.

Prosecutors say that this is one of the documents now that he was retaining and they have a recording of that meeting where he describes holding it. So

this of course adds to the very serious charges that the former president is now facing -- Eleni.

GIOKOS: All right. Evan Perez, great to have you on. Thank you.

Well, rare meetings are happening in Kazakhstan and Qatar this week between U.S. officials and Taliban representatives. The U.S. State Department says

that talks are covering critical interest in Afghanistan including humanitarian issues. A Taliban spokesperson lists ending sanctions and

unfreezing bank reserves as the priorities.


It has been nearly two years since the U.S.-backed Afghan government crumbled leaving the Taliban to take over. Around 90,000 Afghans have

resettled in the U.S. since that time. But hundreds of others have been living in limbo or for some they've been waiting for very long time and

waiting for a better life. And it seemed out to be a very unhappy ending.

Nick Paton Walsh brings us the story of their struggles.


NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR (voice-over): It was the end of America's longest war. The worst of days. As Kabul fell to

the Taliban and its airport became the last chance for salvation. The United States pledged those who helped it would have a new life in America.

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Those who helped us are not going to be left behind.

WALSH: But nearly two years later, not only have some Afghans who've been officially told they should get visas to America still waiting in

neighboring Pakistan, some have waited so long CNN can reveal they've been deported back to Afghanistan. Sent back by Pakistani police to the Taliban

they fled.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: They stopped and told us so we give you 24 hours deadline. We should not see you in Pakistan land.

WALSH: CNN spoke to two Afghans who are now back in hiding in Kabul, had paperwork confirming they were being processed for a U.S. so-called Afghan

P2 visas.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: This is very, very dangerous and it is very tough. You know that -- how many people have been killed, and have been tortured, have

been disappeared. They will punish me. They will put me in jail. Maybe they will kill me. I'm sure they will. Still, we believe that the USA will help

us. We believe. We didn't lose our hope still.

WALSH: Another said he hadn't even told close family of his return to Kabul or deportation.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They did not hand us over to the Afghan border forces. They just released us on the border and told us to go back to Afghanistan.

Also, they did not give us any deportation document. It was me, my four kids and my wife who got deported together.

WALSH: For some, desperation means it is already too late. This is where one of two Afghan men waiting for U.S. visas took their own lives in the

past two months. Throwing himself from the sixth floor here, according to activists.

Hundreds of Afghans have been deported from Pakistan in recent months, say human rights groups, no distinction, apparently made for those with a

promise of a U.S. visa.

Last week, Afghans in Pakistan waiting for U.S. visas, staged a protest. CNN spoke to several who complained of police harassment and fear greatly

deportation to Afghanistan. One described how the Taliban had beaten him senseless in Kabul before he fled. But that he now fears the Pakistani

police's harassment.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: They were asking for a visa. There were a lot of policemen. They came into the house without clear information. And they

took me out of home. And they were just putting me in the van. My kids, they were very much harassed. They were crying and they were asking for


WALSH: He described how he once saved his American colleagues during a protest and had letters denoting his service.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Of course I'm disappointed because the way that I served the Americans in Afghanistan and, you know, I was expecting them to welcome

me there sooner. It seems like I have no future at all.

WALSH: The U.S. State Department told CNN the Biden administration, quote, "continues to demonstrate its commitment to the brave Afghans who worked

with the U.S." But added their processing capacity in Pakistan remains limited but they are actively working to expand it, and they urged

Afghanistan's neighbors to, quote, "keep their borders open and uphold their obligations when it comes to asylum seekers."

Pakistan's Foreign Ministry declined to comment.

Another family were also harassed by Pakistani police. The father briefly jailed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a very bad situation for me and for my family. I think it's a bad dream.

WALSH: His wife broke down.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Save us from Pakistan. I can't come back to Afghanistan. Coming back to Afghanistan is a big risk. And here we are

dying every moment. Staying in Pakistan is a gradual death.

WALSH: Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, London.



GIOKOS: A tough battle and dramatic comeback at the Women's World Cup in the New Zealand. We'll have highlights right after this short break.


GIOKOS: A tough battle and dramatic comeback at the Woman's World Cup in New Zealand. Argentina faced off against South Africa down two-nil in just

the first few moments of the second half. Argentina fought back with a dramatic goal, eventually earning a draw.

What does this mean for Group G? It was painful for me, Amanda, I have to say. I'm allowed to say that, yes?


GIOKOS: I'm all for Banyana Banyana doing well.

DAVIES: Absolutely. And their coach Desiree Ellis is left, you know, really ruing her side's missed opportunities because South Africa did have the

better of the early stages but it was very much a game of two hearts. You could see the disappointment from the South Africans missing out on

claiming their first ever World Cup.

Well, the same, though, to be said for Argentina. Both sides, though, getting a valuable point but really very much giving the advantage to

Sweden and Italy, the two other sides in that group who played their second match going head-to-head tomorrow. That was in fact a brilliant game of

football, though. Also an interesting result for England. Two wins out of two. But what's the opposite of a silver lining? A dark cloud with an

injury to one of their big named players. And that's what we're talking about in a couple of minutes.

GIOKOS: Looking forward to the update, Amanda. We'll see you after the break. I will be back at the top of the hour. See you soon.