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Israel Claims Hamas Equipment Found in Hospital; U.N. Rights Chief Says Independent International Investigation Needed; Staff Remain in Al- Shifa Hospital Despite Siege; Biden Says Talks with Xi "Constructive and Productive"; Egyptian Doctors Hope to Treat Babies from Al-Shifa; Jordan Condemns Israel's "Storming" of Al-Shifa Hospital; New U.K. Foreign Secretary on First Official Visit to Ukraine; Justin Trudeau Dines in Restaurant with Pro-Palestinian Protest Outside. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired November 16, 2023 - 10:00:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST (voice-over): Welcome back. You are watching the second hour of CONNECT THE WORLD, with me, Becky Anderson, 7 pm here in Abu
Dhabi. It is 5 pm in Gaza, where, this hour, fighting is ongoing, more than a day after the Israeli military launched a raid on the enclave's largest
And a war of information and words heating up. Israel justifying its raid on Al-Shifa Hospital, with claims of a proverbial smoking gun, saying its
troops found, quote, "military equipment used by Hamas" inside.
Hamas calls that a lie. While the IDF presents some of the evidence in a video, what we have not seen yet is solid proof that Hamas was using the
complex as a command and control node or center, as Israel has insisted.
Israeli officials say more information is and will be forthcoming. CNN has no access to the area around Al-Shifa and cannot verify claims from either
side. But the U.S. backs Israeli intelligence on a Hamas military apparatus existing there. President Joe Biden accuses Hamas of committing a war
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE BIDEN (D), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You have a circumstance where the first war crime is being committed by Hamas by having their
headquarters, their military, hidden under a hospital. And that's a fact. That's what's happened.
Israel did not go in with large number of troops, did not raid, did not rush anything down (ph). They have gone in and they have gone in with their
soldiers carrying weapons and guns. They were told -- told, let me be precise. We discussed the need for them to be incredibly careful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Joe Biden.
Last night, the United Nations Security Council voted to call for a series of humanitarian pauses in Gaza. Israel branded the vote as "disconnected
from reality and meaningless;" 12 council members supported the resolution while the U.S., U.K. and Russia, abstained. The U.S. ambassador to the U.N.
explained why the U.S. abstained.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LINDA THOMAS-GREENFIELD, AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.: Ultimately, the United States could not vote yes on attacks that did not condemn Hamas or reaffirm
the right of all member states to protect their citizens from terrorist attacks.
Although the United States is deeply disappointed by what is not in this text, we support many of the important provisions this council has adopted.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: The U.S. is looking increasingly isolated on the world stage. As Israel faces increasing pressure to provide concrete evidence of Hamas'
alleged command center at Gaza's largest hospital, international condemnation is only growing.
A short time, ago I spoke with the U.N. High Commissioner for Human Rights. Volker Turk. Here is what he said needs to happen next.
VOLKER TURK, U.N. HIGH COMMISSIONER OF HUMAN RIGHTS: We need to look into this with -- by having access. We cannot rely on one or the other party
when it comes to this. This is precisely why you need an independent, international investigation because we have different narratives.
And as I said, international (INAUDIBLE). You cannot use civilian, especially hospitals, for any military purposes but you can also not attack
a hospital in the absence of clear evidence, that there are issues.
In any case, you have to especially protect hospitals, medical facilities and medical personnel, as well as, in particular, the wounded and the
injured. And you need to provide services for them. That is absolutely clear.
ANDERSON: So you support an international investigation into whether Al- Shifa Hospital has been used by Hamas.
What would that look like?
TURK: Well, I think we need to, first of all, be able to go. We need to have access to the information. That is what we normally do in situations
around the world. And, for that, you need, you need access.
ANDERSON: Have you been in touch with the Israelis?
Where are we at this point?
TURK: I have asked -- and that was part of the reasons why I went to the region -- I've asked everyone to give us access, including Israel,
including to Gaza and the West Bank. And it is very important for me to be able to do this, including for my team to be able to do this type of work.
Obviously, we need guarantees for that. I'm still waiting for the answer.
ANDERSON: You have been in region and President Biden claims Hamas is committing war crimes.
Have you seen evidence of war crimes at this point?
TURK: Well, we have seen a huge issue around international humanitarian law and great breaches of international humanitarian law. What Hamas did,
the horrific killings of civilians, the fact that they took hostages are clear violations of the law.
The fact that we have seen a collective punishment by Israel of Gaza by cutting off supplies of medical necessities, of food, of electricity, of
water is also very, very serious matter of international humanitarian law. In fact, we consider it a crime, as Hamas was acting criminally by taking
hostages and killing civilians.
So indeed, there are issues that we all have to look into because they are very serious. And they require answers. And they require accountability.
ANDERSON: How long do you believe it will take to get some answers, to get an investigation completed during what is a conflict, that certainly
Israelis say could go on for a very long time?
TURK: It is clear that, during an active conflict situation, you cannot investigate. Let's be very clear about this. One should not think that you
can immediately go there while the bombs are falling or while military options take place.
We actually need the time and the evidence to be able to do that. As you know, the ICC is looking into it. My office is continuing to document,
monitor and report on the situation, from what we can actually put together.
But at some stage, it will be important to have access to all of these locations, to have access to the evidence and to be able to construct what
has been happening. But what it means, also, we need to insist on standards of law, international humanitarian law and international human rights law.
And that really must be the guidance in whatever each of the parties are doing when they continue conducting hostilities.
The United Nations Security Council has in the past 24 hours passed a resolution calling for urgent and multiple humanitarian pauses, a
resolution that specifically highlights the suffering of children.
Just how significant is this resolution?
This is the first passed by the UNSC since this conflict began.
TURK: So this Security Council resolution it is a very important first step. As you said, it focuses, in particular, on the specific
responsibilities for children because we've seen how children have suffered.
I mean, we're talking about, according to the Gaza minister of health, over 4,600 children killed. I saw children, Palestinian children, in (INAUDIBLE)
hospital in Egypt, who had been evacuated with serious injuries that, frankly, the doctors told me they had never seen before.
So it is clear, that children in particular suffer. So the Security Council resolution put a particular emphasis on this and reminded everyone, that
there are specific obligations for children. It encapsulates what humanitarian assistance has to be done in a circumstance like this. So I
hope it will be implemented very swiftly.
ANDERSON: Is this the bare minimum, at this point?
TURK: It is a first step. We obviously need more. We need the release of the hostages. We need the fighting to end so there's also the humanitarian
assistance can come in as this resolution says.
But we need to expand it, also that a solution can be found that gets us out of this logic of war and conflict, that looks at the occupation, that
looks at the two state solution, that finally implements all the recommendations, that frankly, the U.N., my own office has been making for
years and decades.
TURK: Now is the time to actually find the space to implement it.
ANDERSON: That is Volker Turk, speaking to me earlier.
Jordan is accusing Israel of violating international law with its raid on Al-Shifa. Later this hour, I'll speak to the Jordanian foreign minister,
get his reaction to what is happening on the ground and the overall situation in Gaza.
While the soldiers search Al-Shifa Hospital, doctors are still trying to save patients' lives. That was a monumental struggle, even before the IDF
moved in. CNN's Nada Bashir joins us now from Jerusalem.
We are hearing, Nada, that Israel is warning residents in parts of southern Gaza to evacuate at this point. Before we talk about that, let's talk about
what we understand to be going on at Al-Shifa Hospital and, perhaps, what we don't know at this point.
NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, Becky, it is extremely difficult to get on the ground information out of Al-Shifa and northern
Gaza at this point in time. Because communications have been cut off in parts of northern Gaza.
It has proven extremely difficult to speak with doctors within Al-Shifa Hospital, as well as journalists on the ground, getting slow information
and video coming out. Of course, there is a huge amount of concern over the safety and security of hundreds of patients and medical staff inside the
As we heard yesterday from doctors within Al-Shifa during that raid, which is said to be ongoing, the sounds of heavy fighting on the outskirts of the
hospital complex, one journalist on the ground describing the walls of the hospital shaking from the shelling.
Of course, CNN is not on the ground; we cannot independently verify these reports. But by all accounts, the messages that we've been hearing from
doctors, medical officials, is that the situation that Al-Shifa is facing right now is hugely dire and is deteriorating by the hour.
We know of course, Al-Shifa is one of the last majority hospitals in Gaza, which are now technically in operation. They are struggling to provide the
care that is so desperately needed for patients in the hospital, because of a lack of fuel, supplies, a lack of electricity and oxygen, as well as
crucially, a lack of medicine.
As we saw yesterday, this raid, now by the Israeli military, has only made the situation more difficult, more challenging and more dangerous for
medical staff inside the hospital. Take a look.
BASHIR (voice-over): Weeks of bombardment had already left Gaza as large as hospital and what has been described as a catastrophic situation.
Doctors at Al-Shifa working under impossible circumstances caring for hundreds of patients as Israel's military incursion moves inside the
DR. MOHAMMAD ZAQOUT, DIRECTOR GENERAL OF HOSPITAL IN GAZA (through translator): The occupation soldiers are still on the ground floor. They
are searching employees, civilians, even the injured and patients. Some were stripped and placed in dehumanizing and miserable conditions.
BASHIR (voice-over): Israel's raid on Shifa has been described as precise and targeted, focused, they say on claims of a Hamas command center beneath
the hospital. But it is civilians including medical staff and patients that have been caught in the center this unrelenting battle.
AHMED EL MOKHALLALATI, SENIOR PLASTIC SURGEON, AL-SHIFA HOSPITAL: We can't look through the windows and doors. We didn't know what's happening. Tanks
are moving within the hospital. You can hear continuous shooting. You can't hear it now. But again, it's a totally scary situation.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What are the sounds, doctor?
I am hearing sounds.
MOKHALLALATI: It's continuous shooting from the tanks.
BASHIR (voice-over): Israeli defense officials say soldiers found concrete evidence that Hamas used Al-Shifa Hospital as what they have described as a
terror headquarters. But no further details were provided on the nature of this evidence.
Both Hamas and health care officials have long denied a military presence within Al-Shifa. CNN cannot verify either science claims. The IDF has not
specified which area of the large hospital complex they operated in.
And with over 1,000 patients and medical staff still inside, many have expressed alarm over the civilian impact of the Israeli military operation.
MARTIN GRIFFITHS, U.N. EMERGENCY RELIEF COORDINATOR: Our concern on the humanitarian side is for the welfare of the patients of that hospital,
which is of course, in great peril at the moment, we have no fuel to run it. The babies have no incubators, newly born, some are dead already. We
can't move them out. It's too dangerous.
BASHIR (voice-over): On Wednesday, the Israeli military said their troops had delivered incubators and medical supplies to the Al-Shifa hospital. CNN
cannot independently verify this claim has not been able to reach the hospital for confirmation.
However, the director general of Gaza's hospitals has warned that babies at Al-Shifa are in severe danger as conditions in the hospital deteriorate
BASHIR (voice-over): -- adding that there is no place to move dozens of incubators outside of the hospital under current circumstances.
But even as Israel tightens its grip on Al-Shifa, now said to be under the complete control of the Israeli military, according to Hamas, doctors say
they will continue to do whatever they can to save the lives of those wounded in this devastating war.
BASHIR: Look, Becky, there are huge concerns over the situation facing patients inside the hospital who cannot evacuate. As you saw, there many
doctors, medical officials saying that they need specialized medical evacuations for many of these patients.
The situation outside the hospital is not safe, not secure enough to begin to think about moving these patients in what has essentially become a
battleground on the Al-Shifa complex. Becky.
ANDERSON: Nada, we are hearing that Israel is now warning residents in parts of southern Gaza to evacuate. They were, of course, encouraged to --
demanded by Israel to evacuate from north to the south.
What more do we now know about evacuation orders in southern Gaza?
BASHIR: Well, Becky, in early weeks of this war, we saw leaflets being dropped on northern Gaza, warning civilians, telling them that they needed
to move southwards for their safety. This area would be safe from bombardment.
Although, important to underscore, it has not been over the last few weeks. Now we hear reports that leaflets have been falling on neighborhoods around
the Khan Younis area of southern Gaza, telling civilians to move to known shelters.
This is a huge point of concern. It does suggest that we may begin to see ground incursions headed toward southern Gaza. We heard last week from
Israel's defense minister, suggesting that Israel would look to move further southwards, that this war could last months.
As we know, according to U.N. figures, there are some 1.5 million Palestinians that have now been internally displaced, the vast majority of
them moving southwards, hoping that this will remain a safe space as designated by the Israeli Defense Forces.
We know of course, airstrikes and bombardment have continued across southern Gaza. This isn't a totally safe space. Hospitals in southern Gaza
are overrun and overwhelmed. We know, of course, that hundreds of thousands of Palestinians are now taking shelter in U.N. run schools and other
facilities across southern Gaza.
So the suggestion or indication that we may begin to see ground incursions in addition to the ongoing airstrikes in southern Gaza have certainly
raised alarm bells. CNN has not been able to independently verify the details around these reported leaflets.
We are not on the ground but we have spoken to humanitarian workers, who have suggested that this may well be in fact verified by their teams on the
But this will certainly be a huge concern for civilians and U.N. agencies, particularly, as you heard there, following that resolution passed by the
U.N. Security Council, calling for extended pauses in order to allow for humanitarian relief to actually get into the Gaza Strip.
This warning, if it has indeed called for civilians, if it is indeed signaling a ground incursion, will essentially stand against any suggestion
of a window for humanitarian relief to get in.
As we know, for some 1.5 million people, displaced, in a warning to the U.N. that there is nowhere safe left in Gaza, this is only going to make
the situation much, much worse.
ANDERSON: Nada, appreciate, it thank you.
Still to come, the U.S. and Chinese leaders meet with the stated goal of trying to damp down tensions. We'll tell you what they accomplished and the
notable differences that remain. That is up next.
ANDERSON: Constructive and productive, that's the assessment of U.S. President Joe Biden after his meeting with the Chinese president, Xi
Jinping, in California. During four hours of talks, they agreed to restore military communications between their countries and take steps to curb the
flow of fentanyl from China.
Both leaders emerged from the meeting reporting progress. But later, President Biden angered China's foreign ministry when answering a question
about Mr. Xi by CNN's MJ Lee. Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Mr. President, after today, would you still refer to Mr. Xi as a dictator?
This is a term you used earlier this year.
BIDEN: Well, look he is. I mean, he's a dictator in the sense that he is the guy who runs a country that is a Communist country, that is based on a
form of government that is totally different than ours.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Marc Stewart back with us this hour from Beijing.
That comment, notwithstanding, what is the reaction in China to the Biden- Xi meeting, Marc?
MARC STEWART, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Overall, Becky, very positive. I should point out that that phrase that the president used is so
troublesome here. Right now our signal that is viewed in China is actually blocked out to the audience in China that watches us.
That is a phrase, let me just talk about that for a moment. This is a phrase that the government does not like, calling it "extremely erroneous,"
in fact. Despite all of the positive attention that this meeting is getting, it did draw the attention during a briefing today, the ministry of
foreign affairs briefing here in Beijing.
Let's just take a quick listen to the spokesperson.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAO NING, SPOKESPERSON, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY (through translator): This kind of speech is extremely wrong and it's irresponsible, political
manipulation. China firmly opposes it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STEWART: All right, so a very Swift response. And I'm feeling here that this is not something that Beijing wants to dwell on because there is
success to report from this meeting. Among the words, China's calling this positive and comprehensive.
We have been receiving -- we've been noticing a lot of favorable coverage, especially CCTV, with the same broadcaster, about the moments when
President Biden and President Xi walked through the grounds of where the discussion was taking place.
They walked to the car; President Biden said goodbye. President Xi obviously dealing with a number of domestic issues, including high youth
unemployment, a slow-growing economy. There is a housing crisis.
But he is getting praise from state media, which, of course, is a direct reflection of the government.
But he is getting praise for making it clear to the United States, in this reporting here from China, that he made it clear to President Biden that
you should not be getting involved in the way China does business, the way that China conducts itself around the world. So overall, a very positive
There was also a dinner last night with business leaders, including Apple's Tim Cook, with Tesla's Elon Musk. And president Xi was there. He talked to
the crowd and he made it very clear that China is open. He definitely wants foreign investments.
So he continued those feelings of goodwill. So at least from what state media, although a bit slanted, is saying, Becky, the response that has been
positive. And very amicable to the U.S.
ANDERSON: Yes. I think it's so important that we're reporting that. That sort of business narrative, what is happening behind the political
headlines is really revealing in how a relationship is progressing.
ANDERSON: And certainly with regard, that sort of business to business level engagement, it certainly does look more positive. Marc, Biden says
the two countries resumed military to military contact. Just have a listen to what he said specifically.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
XI (through translator): It is the reaching out to each other by our peoples that has time and again brought China-U.S. relations from a low ebb
back onto the right track. I am convinced that, once open, the door of U.S.-China relations cannot be shut again.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: We talked about the business perspective and the kind of politics and rhetoric that we've heard.
How important is this military communication, Marc?
STEWART: Becky, it is very important and for two reasons. One, it is going to eliminate any ambiguity between the United States and China where each
side stands. When we talk about this military to military communication, you could say that it refers to the lines that cannot be crossed.
China has had some run-ins with U.S. surveillance aircraft over the South China Sea, over the Taiwan Strait, that is really problematic for them. And
now that these lines of communication are open, these barriers, these red lines are almost -- they're going to be very set.
But the second reason why this is important is that, if you have this communication, things hopefully will not go backward. I'm thinking about
the issue with the time it was a suspected spy balloon but the United States shot down a Chinese balloon over U.S. airspace.
We spent many hours talking about that. Well, the problem with that is that, after that incident happened, there was no communication. If lines of
communication were already established when that happened, it would have been a chance for China to talk to U.S. officials behind the scenes before
it escalated into something greater.
So while these phrases about open communication sometimes get trivialized, it is really important that these governments be able to pick up the phone
in the best of times and even in perilous and challenging times.
ANDERSON: I'm reminded that, even during the height of the Cold War, there was communication between the old USSR and the States, of course.
Marc, great have you in Beijing. Thank you very much indeed.
Still to come, a regional outcry over Israel's offensive in Gaza. Jordan's foreign minister joins me next on the show, stay with us.
ANDERSON: Welcome back. You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD with me, Becky Anderson.
The man leading the United Nations' humanitarian efforts says the carnage in Gaza cannot be allowed to continue. Speaking after Israeli forces raided
the Al-Shifa Hospital, Martin Griffiths said an entire population has been deprived of the basic means of survival. That includes the survival of
The Gaza health ministry released this video of premature newborns at the Al-Shifa Hospital on Monday. Egypt, one of the countries offering medical
assistance, CNN's Eleni Giokos spoke to the country's health minister, joining us now from Cairo.
What has health minister been telling you?
ELENI GIOKOS, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Well, it is a race against time to help these most delicate and precious souls born into the harshest
environments to a place of safety, where they can receive care.
And that would be here, in Egypt. The Egyptian health minister on Tuesday said they were expecting 36 babies but they now say that number might
change. And they fear the worst, Becky. This is the reality, that they need oxygen, they need incubators, they need electricity.
And the move down to the Rafah border crossing is a very difficult trip. It is filled with so many risks. And that is just one of the big points, how
do they get the Rafah border. Once they are across the border, Egyptians tell me that they have ambulances with incubators and with ventilators on
hand, ready to move them to get them across.
But up to this point, we have not been able to speak to the injured Palestinians that have moved from Gaza into Egypt for medical assistance.
But we have exclusive access to one of the hospitals here in Cairo.
We spent today with the Egyptian health minister, we spoke to some of the people that have experienced what war is like and lost so much and are
dealing with trauma.
GIOKOS (voice-over): In a command center in Cairo, Egyptian authorities working against the clock. Egypt's health minister on call to receive some
of the most vulnerable patients.
He's expecting over 30 neonatal babies to enter Egypt. New to the world but caught in the crossfire as the IDF begins its raid inside Al-Shifa
DR. KHALED ABDEL GHAFFAR, EQYPTIAN HEALTH MINISTER: Time is important and every single minute that we're not getting them in, the incidence or the
chances of losing their life is very high.
GIOKOS: Since November 1st, injured Palestinians have crossed through the rougher border into Egypt, the only lifeline to leave Gaza.
GHAFFAR: We dedicated 37 hospitals with more than 11,000 beds for that purpose and more than 1,700 ICU units together with incubators for kids and
other facilities for renal dialysis and so on.
GIOKOS: Would you say that the number of injured Palestinians that are in Egypt right now in the hundreds?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Approaching more than 200.
GIOKOS: In an exclusive, Minister Kafr (ph) takes us to visit patients.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is the champ. This is Abu Rahman (ph).
GIOKOS (voice-over): Here, at the National Medical Institute in Cairo, finally safe but haunted by what brought them here. Guilt, heartbreak,
Mohammed Wadiya (ph) blames himself for his children's injuries. He says he listened to the IDF's warning and moved south from the north, only to be
part of an airstrike in Khan Younis on October 16th.
He went to buy food and when he got back, everything was gone, he tells me. His son, Abu Rahman (ph), just 9 years old and fighting through seven war
injuries, his 14-year-old sister beside him. Both had shrapnel in their tiny bodies and broken bones.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: For me, I'm an orthopedic consultant and other team is plastic.
GIOKOS (voice-over): They say no physical wounds can compare to the mental scars.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you imagine a child, you have a child, he's scared. He should be scared from a cat or dog, dark. So when you find that scared
from losing his family, it's really shocking.
GIOKOS: Did you get a warning?
Did someone tell you to evacuate?
GIOKOS (voice-over): He tells me no, no warning. On his knowledge of Hamas in his building, he says, no.
We meet the next family and they recalled their strike. Two pm, 31st of October, Jabalya camp. Elhan Magad (ph) was praying when her husband, Rami
Mahmoud (ph), went out to get food. And when he returned, his house, gone. He found Elhan (ph) by seeing one finger sticking out from the rubble. She
survived but two of her children did not.
The 15-year-old daughter called a friend before she died, predicting something would happen to her.
Rami (ph) shows me a video of his son. He got a haircut three days before the strike. They tell me he wanted to look good if he died.
For all the survivors we met, one wish binds them all, to return home to Gaza.
GIOKOS: As you can see, Becky, really devastating individual stories. And I go back to those two major strikes, the one at Jabalya camp on October
31st. We covered that extensively. It was really confronting to meet people who were able to flee to the other side because they could receive medical
And hearing their experience firsthand and the memories of what they call a nightmare, and the other one, the 16th of October in Khan Younis, where
that family was telling me they listened to the IDF warning and they moved south, to only a few days later lose so many family members.
But luckily there survived and are now sitting in Egypt. For all of, them they are thinking about how they can return home to Gaza, what will be left
and what remains of their family.
We also experienced the urgency from the health ministry here in Egypt. And just how many resources they're requiring. They're willing to receive up to
50 people per day but they're not getting those numbers, because to get people out of Gaza into Egypt is a logistical nightmare.
ANDERSON: Eleni Giokos on the ground in Cairo.
Eleni, thank. You
We continue to hear searing words of condemnation against Israel's actions in Gaza, particularly from this region, in Turkiye, Recep Tayyip Erdogan
calling Israel a terrorist state.
Qatar, which has been crucial to diplomatic efforts during this conflict, not least in mediation to get the hostages released, describing the raid on
Al-Shifa Hospital as a war crime.
And Jordan's foreign ministry issuing a statement, saying Israel's, quote, "storming of Al-Shifa is a violation of international humanitarian law
under the Geneva Convention." Jordan's foreign minister Ayman Safadi joining me now.
Good to have, you. Both Israel and the U.S. have claimed that a Hamas command node under Al-Shifa Hospital. There does seem to be an
underwhelming amount of evidence to that degree.
What is your reaction?
AYMAN SAFADI, JORDANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: Good, evening Becky. I mean first of, all that is an Israeli claim that has yet to be verified by any
independent international entity.
Obviously, what they claim to be evident that they showed is just ridiculous. It's an insult to intelligence, to say what they showed is
representative of a military command center.
So when it comes to what Israel did in Al-Shifa Hospital, we have the facts. The facts, you can see them, everybody can see them, people denied
access to medical care. Children are off incubators, mothers crying, because they cannot provide painkillers to their children.
This is a war crime. And this one of many other war crimes that Israel continues to commit in Gaza, unfortunately, to the silence of any effective
action by the world.
So yes, so we condemn that as many as we condemn the attack that is often the injury of the (INAUDIBLE) of our medical staff who have been in Gaza
providing the medical care to Palestinians. Israel can claim there was a tunnel under Al-Shifa and it has not proved that yet, of course.
But to (INAUDIBLE) Jordanian military hospital, which still besieged, by the way, as Israel has not gone within 50 meters of the hospital's
entrance, allowing nobody to move; 250 Palestinians were (INAUDIBLE) after the attack on (INAUDIBLE) hospital who cannot move.
SAFADI: Our own medical staff cannot reach the supply store to get food and medicine and Israel is saying this is self-defense. I think there is no
room for mincing of the word anymore.
This is not self-defense, this is raw, ugly vengeance and the world has a responsibility to stop it. Even more than (INAUDIBLE) killed, most of them,
67 percent women and children, is enough. It has to stop.
ANDERSON: Foreign minister, seven Jordanian field hospital staff in Gaza were injured.
How are they doing?
SAFADI: Their injuries are under control; they are in stable condition. But again, as I said there are 250 Palestinians who have no shelter. There
are about 12 bodies who were killed, Palestinians who were killed. And there is no room and means to bury them.
And Israel's still besieging this hospital because it stands all around it. Becky, (INAUDIBLE) we got calls today from the foreign ministry, that from
the stance of 400 people who have taken shelter in the Latin monastery in Gaza about 4 kilometers away from our hospital, they're leaving with us.
One doctor called Mahad Saba (ph), who is from Romania, saying his mother does not have access to water. She is among 400 people who have taken
shelter in that church.
Now are you telling me there are military tunnels under this church?
Those people cannot move. They asked if they can move to our hospital but the Israeli army is shooting at anybody that moves within the vicinity. So
again, this has gone beyond what anybody can stay silent against. Any other country who has done would be under sanctions by now.
So why not against Israel?
Is it above the law?
ANDERSON: U.S. President Joe Biden has told the Israelis it would be a mistake for them to occupy Gaza. Just have a listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BIDEN: I can't tell you how long it's going to last. What I can tell you, I don't think (INAUDIBLE) until there's a two-state solution. I made it
clear to the Israelis, I think it's a big mistake for them to think they're going to occupy Gaza and maintain Gaza.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: North Gaza has been effectively hollowed out; millions of Palestinians displaced in southern Gaza. Today, a leaflet dropped by
Israeli forces, asking those in the south to evacuate.
I have to ask you, what does Gaza look like tomorrow and the day after?
SAFADI: This is the issue: 1.65 million Palestinians have been pushed out of the north to the south. Now Israel is attacking the south. So it's
simply telling people we're not going to kill you in the north; we're going to kill you in the south.
That is not acceptable, that is beyond what the world should tolerate. Again, it's (INAUDIBLE) the world to capture beyond words. Israel must be
held accountable for what it's doing.
Israel's killing people, killing innocent people, destroying 61 percent of all Gaza's medical infrastructure, which has been destroyed. Any
underground facilities where hundreds of thousands of Palestinians are taking shelter, there's one shower to every 700 people.
So you can imagine, with bodies not buried, the kind of health catastrophes we're going to have going forward. And let me say, beyond killing those
innocent people, Israel has killed any embrace of peace in the region.
It is jeopardizing all its peaceful relations. We were discussing with Israelis a while ago, the prosperity deal, as it were called, we provide
them solar energy and they provide us water. That discussion has stopped now.
The peace treaty that we have with Israel now, which, in this environment, where people just see what Israel is doing, it will not allow for any kind
of interaction. So to be under the document collecting dust because people are simply outraged to the extent that they don't see any value of talking
or dealing with Israel now.
They pushed us back to beyond 30 years ago in terms of people's belief in the viability of peace. And that's all on Israel. Israel is not producing
security for itself by the killing of innocent Palestinians. It's putting the whole region on fire again.
And it has destroyed the hard work that many have made over decades to make sure that we come to a peaceful conclusion to this conflict so Palestinians
and Israelis can live in peace.
ANDERSON: Let me just ask you briefly, is that peace deal over, 1993 peace deal between Israel and Jordan, is that done?
SAFADI: I mean, look. We believe in peace, a strategic objective doesn't end for support. But practically, can you really now, can you imagine a
Jordanian minister sitting next to an Israeli minister, talking about a region of cooperation?
SAFADI: Israel has killed that environment. And again, that's on Israel, that's not on Jordan. What Israel is doing has basically sent the message
to all our people that we simply don't care.
Israel is acting in defiance of the world's international community. It's violating every tenet of international law. The Security Council just spoke
called for humanitarian pauses.
What is Israel reaction?
We're not going to respond. Again, any other country in the world that would have done a fragment of what Israel is doing would have been under
sanctions by now. So these are serious questions.
ANDERSON: Let me ask you about that.
SAFADI: To be honest, just one sentence, Becky, we cannot look our people in the eye right now and say that we're going to maintain cooperation with
Israel under these circumstances.
They are creating a mess. And the day after, which you pointed to, we're not going to go clean Israel's mess. Everybody wants to talk about the day
after, should stop Israel now so that we know what kind of day after. But Israel has a license to go destroy Gaza and then ask the rest of the world
to come and clean up after them?
That is nonsensical. That's not going to happen.
ANDERSON: Israel branded that United Nations Security Council resolution, voted on last night and passed and this was for multiple and urgent
humanitarian pauses, especially targeted at support and protection of children.
As, and I quote Israel here, "disconnected from reality and meaningless."
How important, at this point, is a U.N. security resolution?
I know it's a first step only but it's the first resolution that the U.N. is actually been able to get through, a binding resolution for urgent and
multiple humanitarian pauses since the beginning of this conflict.
SAFADI: The resolution is a step in the right direction. Obviously, it's not enough, it doesn't call for a cease-fire. It's only calls for
humanitarian pauses, which again, Israel bluntly, openly said it will not abide by. And that puts the test now, the challenge on the international
You have one country that's challenging your connective will, violating international law and not listening to anybody when they say stop the
And what are we going to do next?
What's the next resolution that's going to come from the Security Council?
And the world should ask the question, what will we do if Israel continues to say no and continues in challenging the whole world and acting as if it
is above the law?
These are serious questions that I think put the whole international community and the whole idea of international law and (INAUDIBLE) values on
the test fire (ph) here. We have failed at this thus far. The world has failed at this thus far.
And will Israel be allowed to continue with this?
Again, what Israel is doing is not about to bring about peace or security to anybody in the region, certainly not to the Palestinians but definitely
not to Israelis as well, because it's simply investing, creating an environment of hatred, of careless that will not be conducive to peaceful
That is one of the big things of what Israel is doing, killing an environment that could embrace a peaceful coexistence with Israel, which
is, again, extremely dangerous, extremely tragic.
But again it's on Israel, it's not on anybody else. They chose this path, they're continuing to fight the international community, they're continuing
to (INAUDIBLE) hospitals, with no convincing reason. This is bordering on the legal definition -- actually it is within the legal definition of
genocide. It has to stop.
ANDERSON: Ayman Safadi, the Jordanian foreign minister, joining us live from Amman.
Ayman, thank you.
Taking a very short break, back after this.
ANDERSON: The U.K.'s new top diplomat is putting the spotlight back on Ukraine's grinding battle for survival against Russia. David Cameron is
just traveling to wartime Kyiv on his first official overseas trip as foreign secretary.
He's trying to reassure the Ukrainian president about ongoing U.K. support for his country. Volodymyr Zelenskyy has been expressing new concerns about
divided world attention ever since the Middle East conflict erupted.
Last month, it's worth noting, Cameron's visit comes in the wake of what some observers are calling his political resurrection as the new British
foreign secretary. CNN's Anna Coren is covering his visit, joins us live now from Kyiv.
ANNA COREN, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Becky, as you say, this is his first trip as the new foreign secretary. He's only been at the job since
Monday. But it really shows Britain's support for Ukraine and their war against Russia.
They want to see Ukraine succeed on the battlefield. They've been a stalwart in support for Ukraine since the very beginning and really,
Cameron's visit today reaffirms that. And we heard from David Cameron, when speaking to President Zelenskyy here in Kyiv this morning.
And he said, "We are here for the long haul. We are here to provide you with moral, with economic and most importantly with military support for as
long as you need."
And we know, Becky, this is going to be a long war. Britain is obviously committed but there are countries in the West that are wavering. There is
great concerns, as to whether the U.S. will continue to support Ukraine, depending on what happens with the elections next year.
But certainly, Ukraine welcomed the visit from David Cameron. This has come at an extremely difficult point in the war. We are 21 months in, come next
week. As you know, the world is heavily distracted by what is taking place in the Middle East.
So really, to have David Cameron here, when the counteroffensive, which has been going on for four months, has not yielded the results or the
breakthroughs that the West was hoping for, this is really -- just the confidence, perhaps, that Ukraine needs to know that the world hasn't
ANDERSON: Anna Coren on the story for us, Anna, thank you.
You're watching CONNECT THE WORLD, there is more news just ahead, stay with us.
ANDERSON: Protesters around the world continue to call for a cease-fire in Gaza.
In Washington, on Wednesday night, protests turned violent outside the Democrats' national headquarters. Two groups who say they were involved are
refuting the account given by U.S. Capitol Police, who said six officers had to be treated for injuries.
And one person was arrested for assaulting an officer. But the political director of Jewish Voice for Peace Action said these were, quote, "peaceful
antiwar activists" and said "police turned violent."
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON (voice-over): Some 250 people protested outside a restaurant, where Canadian prime minister Justin Trudeau was dining on Tuesday night.
Police in Vancouver described it as a spontaneous pro Palestinian protest.
Nearly 100 officers were deployed to disperse the protesters. Police report two arrests. They say one protester punched a responding officer in the
face and gouged her eyes.
Outside the British Parliament, demonstrators waved Palestinian flags and called for a cease-fire in Gaza during a London rally on Wednesday. At the
same time, British lawmakers inside were voting down an amendment calling for a Gaza cease-fire.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Just some of what is going on around the world.
That is it for CONNECT THE WORLD, at least today. Stay with CNN. "STATE OF THE RACE WITH KASIE HUNT" is up next.