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Connect the World
CNN International: Talks to Pick Trump's Cabinet Underway at Mar-a- Lago; No Party Gained as much as Trump in more Than 30 Years; Federal Judge Strikes Down Biden Immigration Policy; Fed Chair Says he will not Resign if Trump Asks; Rockefeller Center Tree on its Way to New York. Aired 9-9:45a ET
Aired November 08, 2024 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[09:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: Well, it's 09:00 a.m. in Washington as the first details emerge of Donald Trump's plans for his new
administration. It is 06:00 p.m. here in Abu Dhabi. I'm Becky Anderson, welcome to "Connect the World". Also coming up standing firm.
The Chair of the Fed says he will not step down, even if the president- elect asked him to. Plus, what Vladimir Putin had to say about Trump's return to power. And violent assaults on Israeli soccer fans in Amsterdam,
Dutch authorities are calling it an antisemitic attack.
And the stock market in New York will open about 30 minutes from now. The futures are well, they are looking for direction today, perhaps a little
lower than they had been in recent days. We've had that Fed decision, the direction for rates going forward a little unclear at this point.
So perhaps investors taking a bit of a pause after what was a record session on Wednesday in the wake of the victory of Donald Trump, of course.
He is looking at his cabinet. Sources say it does appear that that is starting to take shape, at least with his first key selection. The
president-elect, choosing Susie Wiles, who ran his campaign as White House Chief of Staff.
Going forward, she will be the first woman to ever hold that position. A source telling CNN, one of her conditions for accepting the job was getting
more control over who can reach the president at the Oval Office. Trump praised Wiles during his election night victory speech. Have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND CURRENT PRESIDENTIAL-ELECT: Susie and Chris, the job you did. Susie come Susie come here, Susie. Susie
likes to stay sort of in the bag. Let me tell you the ice baby. We call it the ice baby.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: So, who will get the other top positions in the second Trump White House? Our CNN has learned that Trump loyalists have descended on his
Mar-a-Lago resort in Florida, where intense discussions are underway over who he should choose? Who is in the running?
Well, I'm joined by Bryan Lanza, Senior Adviser on Trump's 2024 campaign. He was also communications director for the 2016 presidential transition
team. So just to begin with, Bryan, and it's good to have you. How different are things this time, as compared to eight years ago and the
first administration or first transition back in 2016? How would you describe the differences?
BRYAN LANZA, SENIOR ADVISER OF TRUMP 2024 CAMPAIGN: First of all, good afternoon. Thank you for having me. Listen, I think the difference is, is
the broad spectrum of resumes, of people applying to work in government, is far different than it was in 2016 we're seeing at least in the Republican
side.
We're seeing record number of applicants who are African, Americans, who are Latinos. We're seeing a tremendous amount of interest from Silicon
Valley, which I suspect that's a direct result of Elon Musk's involvement in the campaign. Listen, it was a broad coalition of certainly much broader
than what we had in 2016.
And so, the resumes, the people who want to work in this government, the people who want to restore America shine, that is much broader itself. It's
truly amazing. I mean, the number of women who have applied in the last 24 hours after President Trump has announced Susie Wiles as the Chief of
Staff, is breathtaking.
I think people are seeing that this is going to be very diverse cabinet, a very diverse administration, and they're eager they engage, and we're eager
to bring the best and brightest forward.
ANDERSON: Well, Bryan, CNN reporting that the jockeying has turned into an all-up battle at the in the ballroom of Mar-a-Lago, those in the orbit
trying to get a good seat close to the president-elect, who is at least in the images that have been circulated, sitting behind a velvet rope, behind
closed doors.
We have seen people like Elon Musk, of course, and Caitlyn Jenner sharing shots from Mar-a-Lago. Any insight at this point into these discussions and
negotiations over who will staff the next White House? And I have to ask just how important are the displays of loyalty and the ultimate sense of
loyalty that Trump will feel have been or has been displayed to date.
[09:05:00]
LANZA: Listen, I think the people who are going down to Mar-a-Lago want to serve this country, and they want to sort of push forward an America First
agenda, which is what we've always asked for. We've been very clear on what we expect of President Trump, and President Trump has been very clear of
what he expects to deliver on.
And so, you see, you know, you see a diverse amount of people coming from all over the country. We've actually had people who have come from all over
the world to engage President Trump down at Mar-a-Lago during this transition. It's exciting. People know change is coming.
This country is very hungry for change, and they feel President Trump brings that change. As for the loyalty test. The loyalty test is always
America First. And I think that's what president -- that's what's always gotten lost in these things. President Trump wants the priorities of the
American people first, not the priorities of corporations, not the core priorities of special interests, and certainly not the priorities of
Washington D.C.
It's going to be the priorities of the American people that are going to be implemented. And so, for his loyalty and his loyalty test, I always think
it gets lost, but his loyalty test is to the American people. So, anybody who comes and serves in the administration, they're here to serve the
American people in this administration.
ANDERSON: You've said that the Trump transition team wants to display a united front and work with the Biden-Harris Administration. What does that
process look like from now until January the 20th? Can you explain?
LANZA: Yeah, it's certainly. There's a lot of meetings are going to be taking place between the agency levels. So, we have our people in the
transition who are already been assigned to serve in cabinet level positions, and they're going to be meeting with the Biden cabinet level
positions.
We definitely want to transition that President Biden has showed his -- to do transition. There's been a, you know, there's been a little bit of noise
in between there, but I think at the end of the day, you know, the Biden Administration has been very cooperative in working with us.
The future, Trump Administration is eager to engage Biden. He invited President Trump to a lunch. I think it's going to happen early next week.
Listen, the country wants change, and I think the Biden Administration understands that, and they're working eagerly with us.
ANDERSON: Bryan, Susie Wiles, the first female Chief of Staff ever, apparently, or it's certainly reported that she took the job on the
understanding that she could control who got to reach Trump in the Oval Office. Can you stand that up and give some context to why that might have
been?
LANZA: Of course, first of all, yeah, I'd like to say congratulations to my Mercury Public Affairs colleague, Susie Wiles. She ran an amazing campaign
for President Trump. We're honored to have as part of our team. We're disappointed we're going to be losing her. She was a huge asset to our
firm, but she's going to the White House.
Listen, Susie Wiles is smart. She's talented, and she knows how to execute. And she knows one of the most effective ways to execute President Trump's
America First agenda is making sure that the outside voices who don't prioritize the American First agenda get pushed to the side.
They don't get unfiltered access to the president. These next four years are critical for this country. Susie Wiles understands that, and she knows
that, you know that the time is of the essence, and so you're going to see the administration where the time of the president is maximized on the
American people, as opposed to everybody's own selfish agendas.
And that's what we had in the first administration, was a lot of people seeking time with the president for selfish personal agenda. That's not
going to happen under Susie Wiles, the American people are going to be put first, because that's the priority of the American President.
ANDERSON: You're losing Susie, and you wish her luck, and you clearly admire her as a colleague. Are you looking for a position? Should we expect
to see you in position going forward?
LANZA: Listen, I love this president. I love this country, and It'd be an honor to serve. But I said yesterday to you know, the transition team, that
I'm going to take a pass this time. It was a difficult decision. It's --
ANDERSON: We offer something.
LANZA: I don't want to get into details on what I was offered, but there's certainly conversations that they would like that they would have preferred
me in the administration. But the reality is, is I have a young family. I have a three-year-old and a six-year-old, and where, yes, you know, the
priorities of the president is America First. My priority is family first.
ANDERSON: What do you expect then on day one of the -- and I admire you for that. I have to say, as a mom myself.
LANZA: It's a tough decision.
ANDERSON: What do you expect on day one of the next Trump Administration? What's the priority? Give me a sense of that and the priorities for the
first 100 days, if you will?
LANZA: I think the priority has been very clear. President Trump has said that on day one, he's going to shut down the border to illegal immigrants.
We're going to open the border, and the border is going to stay open for people who come through the legal process. Everybody's welcome to America.
There's a view, as President Trump says, there's a beautiful door for people who play by the rules to try to get here. But if you're an illegal
alien and you come here to break our laws, you come here to hurt our people, damage our property and damage our values, you're going to be
deported.
It's very clear. He's been very clear with that. The second thing is, we're going to focus on the economy. It's, you know, it's a common-sense mandate
is what President Trump has. The mandate says, you know, we need to close the border to illegal immigrants. That's a very common-sense approach.
[09:10:00]
The mandate, the common-sense mandate says we need to help, you know, with affordability for the American people, and we're going to do that. So, the
mandate is very, very clear. It's common sense. It's fixed the border. It's fixed people's pocketbooks.
ANDERSON: Right.
LANZA: And it's certainly fixed some of the international concerns abroad.
ANDERSON: And I want to talk about foreign policy momentarily. What can you tell us about the specifics of that detention and deportation policy? And
how advanced are these plans? And is it clear whether undocumented spouses of citizens be caught up to a federal judge as understanding has just
struck down a Biden policy that would have protected those people.
LANZA: Yeah, listen, the laws are pretty clear. You cannot enter this country illegally, and so you will be deported. Now it's going to be a
phase in process. President Trump said yesterday that no budget. There's no limit to the budget to deport these people who are here illegally.
And so, the phase in first is going to be you're going to be targeting criminals. That's going to take a tremendous amount of time, but we're
going to be deporting people who have committed violent crimes against Americans. That seems very common sense. Every other country in the world
does that.
Something happened here in the last four years where we stopped doing that. So that's going to be the first phase, and we're going to learn from that
first phase. I would tell people who are in this country here illegally, you know, find a -- make a plan to go home, back to your country, because
it's not that you're not welcome.
We certainly want you here, but we want you here through a normalized legal process. We want you part of our economy through a good process. We
understand why people come to this country. It's because of the opportunity. It's because of American -- manifests destiny that Americans
feel.
But there has to be a process, laws that sort of are normal to this. We just can't have everybody shown up at the border claiming that they're a
refugee when they're not. And so, you know, it's going to be a phase in process. The first phase is going to be the criminals.
We're going to learn from that phase, and then we're going to adapt and we're going to be more efficient. But I do tell people who are in this
country here illegally, make a plan to go home in a peaceful way. Please don't have us show up and export you out.
ANDERSON: Right. OK. I mean, let's be quite frank here. There are a lot of people who can't go home to countries that they've come from. But anyway,
look, be that as it may. We'll watch, of course, to see how this policy is developed and indeed implemented on, as you say, day one. I do want to talk
briefly about foreign policy.
I'm here in the UAE, in the Gulf, obviously, the conflict has been front and center here for the last year or so. Donald Trump has said about
Israel's war in Gaza, and I quote him here, Bryan, you've got to get it over with, and you have to get back to normalcy. Has he given you any
insight into how he would propose to get it over and done with and return back to normalcy at this point, what's his policy very specifically?
LANZA: Yeah, his first policy is to return the hostages' home. I mean, that's been the policy of Benjamin Netanyahu, and that's the policy of
President Trump. There are American citizens that are held hostage. And what we've learned over the years is that America goes to great lengths to
bring those people back, and we will do that.
If you know, if there -- if these hostages are watching television, let me tell you, President Trump is going to put maximum effort to bring you back
home. Now the reality is Israel and Hamas are at war. It's a war that Israel didn't want, but it's a war that Hamas is engaged in.
You know, Hamas knows what they need to do to end this conflict. We will support President Netanyahu, and we will support Israel in ending this
conflict, but we will have maximum support to bringing those hostages' home. We cannot have American hostages taken abroad, everywhere and nothing
be done, because that's going to result in more hostages being taken.
So, it's pretty clear what our priorities are. It's to get those hostages first. We want peace in the Middle East, but it's not going to be the
expense of American heads.
ANDERSON: Bryan Lanza, it's good to have you sir, Senior Advisor to the Trump campaign, 2024, appreciate your time. Thank you.
LANZA: Thank you very much.
ANDERSON: Well, in his victory speech, Donald Trump said voters gave him an unprecedented mandate, while CNN has been running the numbers to see where
Trump gained ground and his or how his support compares to past elections. CNN's Harry Enten joining me now from New York with a look at the data, and
you have been crunching those numbers. Tell us what you found, Harry.
HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yeah, look, this is the case that voters gave Trump a mandate. Maybe I'll have a future segment arguing the
exact opposite, but this is the case that voters gave Trump a mandate, and it's really the breadth of support. My goodness gracious, compared to 2020,
Trump gained ground in 49 states.
There are only 50 states plus the District of Columbia. No party's candidate has gained that much ground over so many places in so many states
in the District of Columbia, any party's nominee since Bill Clinton back in 1992 who gained ground in 49 states plus the District of Columbia, compared
to Michael Dukakis' performance for the Democrats back in 1988.
[09:15:00]
It is no wonder that Donald Trump is on pace to be the first Republican nominee for president to win the popular vote since George W. Bush back in
2004. But it's not just the states in the District of Columbia where we saw Trump gain ground. It's the groups that Trump gained ground among.
All right, Trump's was the best GOP showing in a presidential election among ages 18 to 29 in 20 years. That's George W. Bush back in 2004. The
best GOP performance among black voters in 48 years. That's Gerald Ford back in 1976 and how about Hispanic voters?
Well, the exit polls only go back to 1972, but in the history of the exit polls, Donald Trump put in the best performance among Hispanic voters,
something a lot of folks might not have expected after that Madison Square Garden performance from that comedian.
And then finally -- are so important. So, it wasn't just that Trump did well. He dragged other folks across the finish line. How about the 2024
House Republican national vote showing, it was the best, it was the best for the Republican House candidates since 1928 in a presidential election
year.
And so, the bottom line is, Donald Trump did well across the map. He did well across groups, and he helped GOP candidates up and down the ballot do
well to a historic degree, Becky.
ANDERSON: It's always good to have you, Harry, thank you. Harry Enten is in New York for you. Well, the Dutch government condemning what it calls
antisemitic attacks on Israeli citizens. Israeli football fans were beaten and injured in violent clashes in Amsterdam late on Thursday, local time.
I want to warn you the following video is graphic. Israeli officials say at least 10 Israeli citizens have been hurt in the violence which broke out
after a match between Ajax, Amsterdam and Maccabi Tel Aviv. The Israeli Foreign Minister on his way to Amsterdam to meet with his Dutch
counterpart.
Well, the Dutch Prime Minister has been speaking just in the last few minutes about what's being called, these antisemitic attacks on Israeli
football fans. Let's have a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DICK SCHOOF, DUTCH PRIME MINISTER: Well, it's -- let's say that I'm ashamed that this happened in the Netherlands, and it's a terrible antisemitic
attack, and we will not tolerate and we will prosecute the perpetrators. And I'm deeply ashamed that it could happen in the Netherlands in 2024.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: I want to bring in CNN's Matthew Chance, who is live from Jerusalem. What's been the response there? What do we understand exactly
happened to these Israeli football fans? And what is the Israeli Government doing to get them out?
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, I mean, look, it's absolutely, you know, outrage reaction here in Israel, we've got
people like the Israeli Prime Minister calling the attacks, the violence horrifying, the Israeli President saying that this was a pogrom
reminiscent, all the official leaders saying it's reminiscent of the pogroms that took place during the Nazi era.
And obviously you've heard from the Dutch authorities there condemning these antisemitic attacks. But look, I mean, there's an effort underway to
get these football fans back to Israel now, a number of Israeli flights have been sent to pick up people who can come back straight away.
There's one flight on its way back right now. There are more flights coming back later on today. We're told that police teams, forensic teams, will be
meeting those fans at the airport, the Ben Gurion Airport, here in Israel. They'll be taking forensic evidence. They'll be taking statements and
liaising with Dutch prosecutors to try and being bring people to justice and to undertake prosecutions against some of the people that have been
arrested already by the Dutch authorities.
Also, the foreign ministry has been sort of looking at the warnings that were given to the Dutch authorities before this tax took place. There were
some warnings given. There was obviously a pro-Palestinian demonstration that took place in Amsterdam. It was moved by the Dutch authorities, but
foreign office officials telling me that they think the Dutch authorities should have and could have done more.
Also, an Israeli official telling me that in the aftermath of this violence in Amsterdam. There's a general review taking place of the safety
procedures for Israeli sports teams when they compete in countries inside Europe and other countries as well, and a security review taking place
about Israelis living abroad in general.
Not just in Amsterdam, but, you know, in countries all over the world, where they say there's been a distinct increase in antisemitic attacks,
particularly since the October 7th attacks by Hamas last year, Becky.
ANDERSON: Matthew, thank you. Well, still to come, another blow to the Biden Administration. A judge in Texas rules against a key policy that
protects thousands of immigrants from deportation.
[09:20:00]
We'll have a live report on that up next. Plus, congratulations for Donald Trump and talk of a New World Order. What Vladimir Putin had to say about
Trump's return to power.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANDERSON: Well, a federal judge in Texas has struck down the Biden Administration's plan that gave legal status to certain undocumented
immigrants. Will be parole in place policy protected some migrants married to U.S. citizens from deportation and allowed them to work legally while
seeking U.S. citizenship.
But the judge appointed by Donald Trump during his first term ruled that Congress had not given the White House authority to implement such a
policy. Well, Senior White House Reporter Kevin Liptak is with us. It sounds like striking down this policy will impact hundreds of thousands of
people, as I understand it.
So, two questions to you, how was parole in place to work exactly? And you know what -- frankly, what will its impact be now that's been struck down?
KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yeah, this program was really meant to allow the spouses, who are undocumented citizens
themselves, but are married to American citizens, to remain in the United States. Now, there were a lot of parameters that people would have had to
have met.
They would have had to have already been in the United States continuously for 10 years, they had to not present any kind of security threats. You
know, ordinarily, if you're not a citizen and you're married to an American citizen, you are allowed to try and become a citizen, but normally, you
have to apply for that from your own country.
You can't be in the United States. What this program would have done was allowed those people to remain in the United States as they go on this
pathway to gain citizenship. And this is really a big setback for this program and for President Biden's immigration policy as a whole.
You know, he signed this after Congress refused to move on comprehensive immigration reform back in June. And this was his attempt to try and keep
some immigrant families together who had made their entire lives in the United States, who are paying taxes here, who work here, and for whom it
would be very difficult to go back to their home country and apply for citizenship there.
But what Texas and a number of other Republican led states said was that this would strain their state resources and potentially incentivize illegal
immigration into the United States. And what this Trump appointed judge said was that President Biden did not have the authority to do this. He
said it stretched legal interpretation past its breaking point.
[09:25:00]
But certainly, this does now lend a huge degree of uncertainty for the people who could have potentially benefited from this, and it adds to the
uncertainty that already exists. Now that Trump is returning to the White House. Of course, he has promised mass deportations of undocumented
immigrants into the United States.
There was very little question that he would have gotten rid of this executive order anyway when he came into office. There's also little
question that his administration will not continue defending it in court, so certainly a lot of uncertainty for these families today, Becky.
ANDERSON: It's always good to have you. Thank you. Well, Russia's President says a New World Order is underway, and that new non-western powers are
rising, he said during a forum in Sochi. Vladimir Putin also said he's willing to talk to Donald Trump regarding the president-elect's comments
about ending Russia's war in Ukraine in quote, 24 hours.
Vladimir Putin says the comments, quote, deserve attention. Meantime, Ukraine's President has confirmed deadly clashes on the battlefield between
Kyiv's forces and North Korean troops, the result of a closer military partnership between Moscow and Pyongyang.
CNN's Fred Pleitgen is set in Berlin. Is it clear how seriously Putin is taking these comments by Donald Trump on ending the war? And how much
closer, if at all, we are up to a solution at this point?
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, I think we're still pretty far away from a solution. And you could see, really
overnight, once again, with that massive Russian attack also taking place using drones and missiles that obviously, this war is still very much going
on.
Of course, the Ukrainians right now on the backfoot, on their Eastern Front in the Donbas region as well. But I think what Vladimir Putin was saying
yesterday is that he doesn't necessarily take Donald Trump's comments at face value, thinking that this war really can be ended very quickly.
In fact, Vladimir Putin spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, said that he doesn't believe a fast end to the war is something that's realistic, but I think
that he sees the fact that Donald Trump is thinking about this, is telegraphing all this to the world as well, that he wants this war to end
as sort of something like a starting point.
It was quite interesting because I watched Vladimir Putin's entire speech and the question that he had afterwards, and this was really only a small
part of it, where he also, as you mentioned, talked about what he believed was a New World Order. But when he spoke about Donald Trump, he called him
a courageous man.
He congratulated him on winning the presidency. Dmitry Peskov later saying his spokesman saying that that was an official congratulation. But he also
said that he believed, at the very least, that he could speak to Donald Trump. I think one of the interesting things, though, about all that is
that Vladimir Putin said that if Donald Trump calls him and says, hey, Vladimir, let's have a chat, that he would be willing to do that.
But the Russians also seem to be saying that they are not going to initiate that themselves. So, they are saying they're open to countries coming to
them to try and normalize relations, speak about the situation in Ukraine, but it's not something that they are seeking out themselves and making the
first move that seemed to be very clear from Vladimir Putin's comments.
At the same time, of course, you do have a lot of concern on the part of the Ukrainians. You did have Volodymyr Zelenskyy, the President of Ukraine,
yesterday at a summit in Budapest in Hungary, where he warned European leaders not to get too close to Vladimir Putin. He said there's already
been 20 years of some leaders hugging Vladimir Putin, and that has led to nowhere, and that the situation was a lot worse now than it had been in the
past.
So, I think on the whole, we can sense a good deal of anxiety on the part of the Ukrainians, but also the Russians definitely believing that there
could be an in road to not necessarily normalizing relations with the United States, but certainly trying to at least get on better footing than
they have been over the past almost three years, Becky.
ANDERSON: Fred Pleitgen is in Berlin, of course, he said, has spent much of the past couple of years in and out of Ukraine reporting on that war. Thank
you, Fred. Well after the break, another U.S. interest rate cut as the Chair of the Fed defends his position just days after Donald Trump's
election victory, why he had to defend his position, is coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:30:00]
ANDERSON: Welcome back. I'm Becky Anderson in Abu Dhabi. Time here, it's just after half past 6 in the evening. Wherever you are watching, you are
more than welcome. Well, at the top of the hour, we saw the futures indicating a mixed open. The bell is just rung on Wall Street just after
half past 9 in New York. So, let's see where these markets are opening as we speak.
And as indicated, a mix and relatively, quite open, I say relatively given the action we saw in the wake of Donald Trump's victory on Wednesday. The
Federal Reserve cut interest rates, of course, on Thursday, for what was the second time in two months, the latest cut by a quarter of one point, or
25 basis points comes as the Fed gets ready for that new Trump Administration to pursue its economic agenda.
It was Donald Trump who appointed the Fed's current Chair Jerome Powell. They did, though later clash over rate policy. Well Powell said on Thursday
that he wouldn't step down, even if Donald Trump were to ask him to. Well, a senior adviser to Trump says the president-elect is likely to allow
Powell to finish his term, which runs to May 2026.
And more on this, I'm joined by Mohamed El-Erian. He is the Chief Economic Adviser at Allianz, and he joins me now from Cambridge in England. Now it
is good to have you, and I would normally start with you know how you would read this, 25 basis point cut and what happens next?
But let's not start with that. Let's start with the politics, which politics -- which Jerome Powell has been absolutely indignant. He would say
out, of course, you know his position is being politicized to a certain extent. We know certainly how Donald Trump has felt about him over the past
couple of years.
He said he wouldn't step down, even if Donald Trump were to ask him to. What sort of position does this put the head of the Fed in at this point?
MOHAMED EL-ERIAN, CHIEF ECONOMIC ADVISER AT ALLIANZ: He answered as a lawyer, and he is trained as a lawyer. So, he was asked two questions,
would he step down? And the answer -- if asked, and the answer was no. And then he was asked, well, what if could the president demote people at the
Fed?
And his answer was no. And then he said, it's the law. The problem with being such a lawyer on a question like that is that you could provoke the
other side. I suspect, looking back, it would have much better for him to do what he did on other questions that had a political angle. How will
trump measures impact the economy? Which is to say, I'm not going to address this here.
ANDERSON: That's interesting. Well, let's talk about how -- what we know about Trump's economic agenda? And how you believe it might affect the
economy, which is in a slowing phase?
[09:35:00]
This has been helped by monetary policy, a 25-basis point cut. What did you make of that move by the Fed? And what else do you expect to see happen
going forward? We've got what, at least one, if not two other meetings, because he's come in six-week phases before Donald Trump is inaugurated on
January the 20th.
EL-ERIAN: So, the Fed made it very clear, that it is not taking into account anything that the president-elect has said. It wants to see what
will actually be implemented. So, what did it say? One what we all expected that interest rates are coming down by a quarter of a percentage point.
It tried to maintain a bit more policy optionality about the future. And then unfortunately, and I feel for him, Chair Powell got into a model. Got
into a model about the economy, about the characterization of the labor market, about whether he wants real wages to be higher or lower, about
which inflation measure to look at.
And then when he was asked, in a very pointed fashion, stop talking about the past, tell us what you see in the future. He wasn't able to make that
pivot. So, what has happened is we've emerged from this meeting with views all over the place. There are some that believe we're going to definitely
get another interest rate cut and more to follow.
There are some that believe we're going to get a pause in December, and there's some who believe we could even get hikes next year. So, we no
longer have what's called a forward policy guidance anchor right now. The whole point of the Fed telling us what it expects to do is to anchor
expectations. And we're seeing quite a divergence in what the analysts are saying about what's likely to happen to interest rates.
ANDERSON: Well, this is really, this is fascinating. Do you believe that there is an overconfidence in the monetary policy's ability to fine tune
the U.S. economy at this point? And as we move forward in what appears to be a very muddled sort of environment here, with muddled thinking, is what
I think you are suggesting here.
How will the Fed be accommodating as it looks like -- at policy? What it understands to be Donald Trump's economic policy going forward?
EL-ERIAN: So first, a fine-tuning point, and that's a really important point, Becky. Economists learned a very important lesson in the 80s and the
90s is you cannot use monetary and fiscal policy to fine tune the economy. You can use it at extremes, when the economy is too hot, when the economy
is going to recession, but when you get closer to the middle of the distribution of outcomes, you should not try to fine tune.
You should step back and have a consistent steady course. That's not what this Fed is doing. And the reason why they are falling into this trap, a
trap that unfortunately, we've learned a lot from in the past, is that they are overly data dependent. So, it is like a pilot in a plane reacting to
the turbulence that they just had, not the turbulence that's ahead.
So, you tend to amplify volatility, rather than to provide an anchor to the economy and to market. And that matters just to finish the point on --
ANDERSON: Mohamed, it's always good to have you.
EL-ERIAN: Thank you.
ANDERSON: Go and finish your point very briefly.
EL-ERIAN: I'm just going to say and that matters, Becky, when other elements of policy which under the Trump election have become more
uncertain.
ANDERSON: And you and I will continue to talk about this as we move through the next weeks and months. It's always good to have you the view there of
Mohamed El-Erian, thank you. Well, still to come. Carol is getting to the holiday spirit as they send off what will become an iconic tree, where it's
headed for the holiday season is just ahead.
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[09:40:00]
ANDERSON: It is one of the most anticipated events of the U.S. holiday season. That is the Rockefeller Center Christmas tree. And it has been
chosen Carol is in Massachusetts, gave the 23-meter-high Norway Spruce proper send off on Thursday. The tree now on its way to New York City,
where it is expected to be put on display on Saturday.
And it will be lit up with 50,000, colorful lights topped off with a Swarovski star. The Rockefeller Sandy Christmas tree has stood as a holiday
beacon for New Yorkers and indeed for tourists for more than 80 years. "World Sport" with Andy Scholes is up after this short break. Stay with us.
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[09:45:00]
(WORLD SPORT)
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