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CNN International: Syrian Civil War Began with Protests in 2011; Biden: Assad's Fall is a Moment of Risk and Opportunity; Jay-Z Denies Claim he Sexually Assaulted a 13-Year-Old; Syrians Celebrate Fall of Assad Regime Amid Uncertainty Over who will Govern; Hunt Continues for Suspect in UnitedHealthcare CEO Killing; Notre Dame Reopens to the World. Aired 9-10a ET
Aired December 09, 2024 - 09:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[09:00:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: Well, it's 05:00 p.m. in Damascus in Syria, where you're looking at live pictures right now of a
city still absorbing the shock of the stunning collapse of the decades long Assad Regime. Syrians finally ready to turn a new page.
Well, celebrations across the country over the ouster of Bashar Al Assad in the end of his tyrannical rule. Thousands who have been forcibly separated
from their loved ones can finally reunite, and potentially millions who've been forced to leave their homes may finally be able to go back. It is a
new reality, but one that comes with great uncertainty about the country's future and crucially, who will govern it?
Well, the fall of Assad happening with lightning speed. An alliance of rebel forces seized the capital with little resistance just 11 days after
sweeping through the North Aleppo and other major cities, the leader of the main rebel group calls Assad's ouster a quote victory for the entire
Islamic nation.
Well, the Kremlin says Assad and his family fled to safety in Russia and have been granted asylum by Russia's President, the spokesperson not
commenting on Assad's whereabouts. Well, CNN's Chief International Correspondent Clarissa Ward is in Damascus today with a look at how Syrians
themselves are reacting to both a new reality and an uncertain future.
CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: You can see there are a lot of people out on the streets today. It's not scenes of celebration,
it's not scenes of looting like we were seeing today. Now people are trying to make sure that they have stopped up on all the supplies that they might
need.
Take a look at this line here we're outside of bakery. These people say they've been waiting more than half an hour, or some of them they're
waiting for bread. We've seen lines like this around the city. People are lining up for cash. They're lining up for gas. They are trying to make sure
that they have enough food to ride out this transitional period where nobody really knows what's going to happen.
Now, you can see behind me at the end of the road there, that is the Central Bank of Syria. Yesterday there was extensive moving there. A lot of
people in the city started to feel a little bit concerned that this was going to be a chaotic period. The more rebels arrived in the capital; the
looting appears to have stopped. It does seem very calm on the streets.
Of course, there are many people who are elated that Bashar Al Assad is finally gone. But there is also the day-to-day that people need to focus on
to ensure that they have enough bread, enough gas, enough cash, enough supplies to get them through this tenuous transitional period. Clarissa
Ward, CNN Damascus.
ANDERSON: Well, of course, the entire world waiting to see what happens next in Syria. CNN's Nick Paton Walsh looks at how the Assad Regime was
toppled with remarkable speed and ease.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice- over): Decades of savage horrific rule over in a matter of days. Thousands of Syrians celebrated in the streets of Damascus after Rebel forces
advanced on the capital early Sunday morning, declaring it free of President Bashar Al Assad.
YOUSSEF AL-YOUSSEF, SYRIAN REBEL NEWS ANCHOR: We announced to you from the Syrian News Channel, the victory of the Great Syrian Revolution after 13
years of patience and sacrifice. We won the bet and toppled the criminal Assad regime.
WALSH (voice-over): Facing crumbling resistance from regime forces Rebels launched a stunning lightning offensive. Russia undermining its long-term
ally by announcing he had fled the country and was granted asylum in Moscow. Hours of jubilation followed as civilians and rebels entered the
Presidential Palace, looting furniture with children running about a sign of how every day the suffering he inflicted would be. Some even touring the
presidential kitchen in a land where starvation was once a weapon.
What would you like one woman says while filming, are people are hungry. Take whatever you want. Traces of Assad were being dismantled across the
country. This statue of the man who had children gassed in a -- basement 11 years ago, toppled in the Eastern City of Tartus. His image torn down from
buildings in Damascus and on top of the gates of Homs City Center symbolically where protestors tore apart his image more than a decade ago
in a scene that defined the civil wars early days.
[09:05:00]
Inspired by the seismic shifts of the Arab Spring, Syrians rose up in 2011 demanding democracy, but were met with live rounds and eventually jet
planes, chemical weapons, and mass executions and torture. Hundreds of thousands were killed, millions displaced as rebels swept through the
capital on Sunday, images surfaced of prisoners being released from the notorious Saydnaya Prison from which so few emerged dubbed the human
slaughterhouse by Amnesty International.
The militant figure leading this rebel offensive is Abu Mohammed Al-Jolani seen here prostrating in prayer upon entering Damascus. Once affiliated
with Al-Qaeda, Jolani has been suggesting he has matured from his extremist roots. Though there are deep concerns about what kind of new Syria may now
emerge? At one of the oldest mosques in the world in Damascus, he was received with applause and cheers as he held total victory.
ABU MOHAMMED AL-JOLANI, LEADER OF SYRIA'S REBEL COALITION: This victory, my brothers, is a victory for the entire Islamic nation. This new triumph, my
brothers mark a new chapter in the history of the region.
WALSH (voice-over): Without doubt, a new chapter, but with the joy of change comes anxiety at the future, and surely a reckoning of sorts for the
decades of horror past that could admire the hope of the days ahead. Nick Paton Walsh, CNN London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON: Well, Bashar Al Assad has been granted asylum in Russia by President Vladimir Putin. Now the Kremlin spokesman describing what's
happening in Syria as quote, a period of transformation and extreme instability. CNN's Fred Pleitgen has more from the Russian capital for you.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: The Russians admit that they were surprised by the events quickly unfolding inside
Syria. Spokesman for the Kremlin Dmitry Peskov saying he believes the whole world was surprised how quickly Bashar Al Assad was ousted from power and
forced to leave Syria and come here to Russia.
The Russians also saying that it was Vladimir Putin himself who signed on Bashar Al Assad and members of his family being able to come here and being
granted asylum inside Russia, as the Russians say, for humanitarian reasons.
Now, of course, for the Russians, all of this could have very big repercussions. At the same time, the Russians do understand that there is a
new reality on the ground in Syria. As of this morning, the flag of the Syrian opposition flies above the Embassy here in Moscow. And we asked here
at the Embassy, and folks here told us that the Embassy is actually working as normally, even though, the transition in Syria is already very much
taking place.
For the Russians however, they were one of the biggest backers of the Assad Regime, and of course, still have major military assets inside Syria as
well. They have an air base in -- close to Latakia, which is very important for them, not just for air operations in Syria, but also to project power
into the Mediterranean and even all the way into Africa.
And of course, they have a major naval base in Tartus and -- just last week conducted big naval exercises, firing some high-powered missiles from ships
inside the Mediterranean Sea. The Russians admitting that for them, it's unclear what the future of those military bases will be. They say a lot of
that depends on who will have power in Syria in the future. The Russians say that their forces inside Syria are on high alert, but at the same time
also say that it is calm outside their bases. Fred Pleitgen, CNN Moscow.
ANDERSON: Well, with the situation in Syria, deeply uncertain Israel, says that it has struck weapons sites in Syria, including those with chemical
weapons capability to prevent them from falling into the hands of extremists. Now, Israel also says that has taken temporary control of
strategic areas near its border to prevent a scenario similar to the October 7th attacks last year.
This as the defense minister has ordered the creation of a security zone inside Syrian territory, and I quote him there, that is according to the
Israeli Defense Minister, one that would go beyond the Israeli occupied Golan Heights. Jeremy Diamond is in the Golan Heights in the town of Majdal
Shams joining us now. Describe what you've seen today. How are the Syrians of the Golan Heights reacting to the fall of Assad?
JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, listen, this is a Syrian Drews Community here in the town of Majdal Shams, and you can hear around
me, it is a very festive atmosphere.
You can see the flags of the Drews Community that are being waved alongside the flags of Syria of the Syrian rebels, the Former Syrian flag that has
now been re adopted by the Rebel Cause and perhaps by this new incoming government inside of Syria.
[09:10:00]
There are -- we have heard these children who have been in the Town Square here chanting cursing Bahar Al Assad inside of Syria free Syria to come.
But in addition to that, what we have also heard are the stories of people who have family in Syria, both those whose family are in Syria now finally,
feel free, but also those who have family who were political prisoners. We spoke to one woman, Hala Abu Aude, whose nephew was imprisoned 14 years
ago. And I'm just going to pause here as you have the children coming through with the flags with this scene of celebration.
And like I said, that is the dichotomy because this woman who I was telling you about, Hala Abu Aude, her nephew, was in imprisoned 14 years ago on
political charges. Several months later, they were given a death certificate, told that he died in prison. But now, as we are seeing these
prisons being -- these political prisoners being liberated in Syria, she is holding out some hope that perhaps there is a world in which her nephew is
still alive, and she is working to try and get information from relatives inside of Syria.
It is, of course, the story of so many in the Syrian diaspora but certainly here as well in Majdal Shams where many people have family on both sides of
this border, both here in the Israeli occupied Golan Heights, but also inside of Syria proper.
ANDERSON: Yeah, it's good to have you there, Jeremy. I can feel the atmosphere where you are. You were at that strategic buffer zone that you
speak of earlier today, the Israeli government seemingly like taking this opportunity to -- for a weakened Iranian access within the region by
launching airstrikes into Syria, crossing into the country for the first time since 1973. It's announced a curfew for five Syrian villages. So, as
you assess the situation and sort of do a deep dive on what's going on here, what's the real strategy?
DIAMOND: Well, listen, as we were walking along that buffer zone earlier today, the gate to that buffer zone was flung open. Two Israeli troops were
standing guard there, and Israeli military vehicles since yesterday have been going in and out of that buffer zone.
The Israeli Prime Minister sent Israeli troops into that buffer zone yesterday after he said that the Syrian troops on the other end of it had
abandoned their positions changing a dynamic that has existed over just over 50 years now where neither Israeli nor Syrian troops have been inside
of that zone.
But Israeli troops are also now coming beyond -- going beyond that buffer zone into Syrian territory to take up strategic positions there. The
Israeli military says that it is in order to protect communities like this one right here in the Golan Heights. But in addition to that, as you said,
Israel is certainly taking advantage of not only the fall of the Assad Regime to get rid of -- to carry out airstrikes on strategic weaponry, air
defense systems missiles that are stored inside of Syria by the Syrian governments.
And also, presumably to go after any Hezbollah and Iranian targets inside of Syria at this moment of weakness for that Iranian access. The real
question, I think is first of all, how deep into Syria will Israeli troops ultimately go? And then also, what kind of neighbor will Israel actually
end up with inside of Syria?
We heard the Israeli Prime Minister yesterday extending a hand of peace. He said to that, the future leaders of Syria, but what kind of neighbors will
Israel actually have, and what will their position be towards Israel after 50 years of a regime that ultimately maintained a kind of peaceful -- with
Israel during the course of half century Becky.
ANDERSON: And that hand of friendship, as it were extended by Benjamin Netanyahu there, and we are showing his image on the border. It's good to
have you there. Thank you, sir. U.S. President Joe Biden, calling the fall of the Assad Regime, an historic moment to, for opportunity during remarks
at the White House.
He also said the situation also comes with risk and uncertainty, and he said, the U.S. supports a peaceful transition of power to an accountable
Syrian government. At the same time, he said, it is working to prevent the resurgence of ISIS and is closely watching how the rebel groups proceed. As
part of that effort, the President said, U.S. forces conducted dozens of airstrikes against ISIS targets on Syria on Sunday.
Well, a short time ago, CNN's John Berman spoke to White House Adviser John Kirby, to discuss those airstrikes. Have a listen.
[09:15:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JOHN KIRBY, WHITE HOUSE NATIONAL SECURITY COMMUNICATIONS ADVISER: Pentagon is doing what they call a battle damage assessment of that, John. We don't
have a firm indication of the assessment of each and every one of those strikes. They do believe preliminarily that they were very, very successful
in hitting legitimate ISIS targets and further degrading their capabilities.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN HOST: Does the strikes continue this morning?
KIRBY: Well, I think that remains to be seen, John. I mean, we have kept the pressure up on ISIS now through the entire four years of this
administration through these kinds of strikes. We'll continue to do that as we see valid threats. So, I'm certainly not going to rule anything off the
table in terms of additional strikes on ISIS.
BERMAN: And what is the status of the U.S. troops stationed in Syria this morning?
KIRBY: We have good contact with all of them. There's not that many, I think, as you know they are there just to go after ISIS and every
indication that we have right now is that they are able to continue to prosecute that mission safely, efficiently, effectively. But as the
president said yesterday, this is going to be one of his top priorities.
A, to make sure that they can continue that mission against ISIS because ISIS remains a viable threat. And B, that their force protection, their
safety and security can be insured. So, we're going to be monitoring that literally every single day.
BERMAN: What contacts have there been at this point between the United States and Hayat Tahrir Al-Sham, this rebel group, the topple Bashar Al
Assad?
KIRBY: Yeah. I certainly can't speak to any direct communication that we would've had with the HTS Leader. I can tell you that we are already in
touch with counterparts. Some of those counterparts have ways of delivering messages to all the rebel groups, not just HTS. They're not the only group
involved here. And so, we are going to be, as the president said yesterday, exploring our avenues to communicate with all those groups.
BERMAN: Who -- who's running Syria this morning.
KIRBY: That's an open question. Right now, the rebel groups are in charge of Damascus again. Yes, HTS sort of was the vanguard here, but they're not
the only rebel or opposition group in Damascus as we speak. And I think they're trying to work that out amongst themselves. But it is an open
question.
In fact, the very fact that it's an open question, John gives us concern. As the president said, we're in a period of uncertainty here. And so, we're
going to be working through all the processes we can, including at the UN to make sure that there is adequate communication with these opposition
groups, and that we are all working together on the -- for the best aspirations of the Syrian people.
BERMAN: How much power have Russia and Iran lost in that region?
KIRBY: A lot, frankly, a lot. I mean, you look at Iran there are so-called axis of resistance. Hamas decimated Sinwar is gone. Hezbollah their leaders
gone. Nasrallah has gone, and they now a ceasefire with, with Israel. And now Assad, there are other, their other proxy in the Middle East gone. And
Syria's future very much as we said an open question.
Iran has also been hurt deeply by the sanctions regimes that the United States has kept and increased on them, as well as our European partners.
And of course, they've been degraded militarily by some of the strikes that Israel has conducted. So, they're looking at a very different Middle East
when they're waking up today.
And it doesn't include one that has them with the ability to execute any hegemonic ambitions that they had once had. Russia, the same way. Russia
wanted Assad in power so that they could have a footprint in the Middle East. Now, that footprint is in question because their proxy Assad is no
longer there.
And they need to answer, by the way, John, for why they're harboring Assad on Russian soil, a brutal dictator who killed millions of Syrian people.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON: John Kirby speaking to my colleague John Berman. And we are on the ground. We've got a lot of resources covering the fall of the Asad
Regime. You can follow the latest developments to this fast-moving story across our multiple platforms at any time of the day with a wealth of
analysis from our expert teams.
Well, we will of course, do more on this as we move through this show "Connect the World" with me, Becky Anderson. Still to come, Joe Biden does
call it a moment of opportunity. So how does Syrians themselves see it when we speak to one about what she wants for her country's future? Plus, Jay-Z
responding to an allegation that he and Sean Diddy Combs sexually assaulted a minor. More on that is after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:20:00]
ANDERSON: Billionaire Rap and Hip-Hop Mogul, Jay-Z denying an allegation that he sexually assaulted a 13-year-old with Sean Diddy Combs back in the
year 2000. A woman who is already suing Combs for alleged sexual assault has amended her civil lawsuit to add Jay-Z as a defendant. This is the
first time a celebrity has been accused in connection with Combs, who is facing about 30 civil lawsuits, as well as federal charges, including sex
trafficking.
Well, our Entertainment Correspondent Elizabeth Wagmeister is following the development, she joins us from New York where the sexual assault is alleged
to have happened. Jay-Z, typically a pretty quiet celebrity, but he is being extremely vocal about this claim, isn't he?
ELIZABETH WAGMEISTER, CNN ENTERTAINMENT CORRESPONDENT: That's right, Becky. He is an incredibly private celebrity. We almost never hear from him, but
his denial coming last night, I was in touch with his team, and Jay-Z wrote this lengthy statement himself.
I want to read you part of it, Becky.
He says quote these allegations are so heinous in nature that I implore you to file a criminal complaint, not a civil one. Whomever would commit such a
crime against a minor should be locked away. Would you not agree? Now, who he is directing that towards is actually the plaintiff's attorney. His name
is Tony Busby, and Jay-Z and his team say that he is being extorted.
They say that this is an attempt to blackmail him. He is denying that this ever happened. In fact, last month, Becky, Jay-Z actually filed an
extortion suit against this attorney. Now, I want to read you one more part of this statement where Jay-Z addresses his family. Of course, he is
married to Beyonce.
He says that his only heartbreak is for his family, my wife and I will have to sit our children down, one of whom is at the age where her friends will
surely see the press and ask questions about the nature of these claims, and explain the cruelty and greed of people. So again, Jay-Z coming out
fighting very hard against this rape allegation.
ANDERSON: Has Beyonce commented on this allegation?
WAGMEISTER: Beyonce has not. I reached out to her team last night, and I have not heard back. Again, Jay-Z, addressing Beyonce and his family,
although he did not name her in that statement. But I do not anticipate that we will hear from her, at least at this moment. I think that right
now, that is what Jay-Z said.
And again, it was very rare to even hear from him. But these allegations very serious. This young girl who was 13-years-old at the time in the year
2000, alleges that she was drugged when she attended this party and says that she was raped by both Jay-Z and Combs.
I should also note that it's not just Jay-Z that is denying this. Combs when this initial lawsuit came out in October, his team also denied that he
ever sexually assaulted her or anyone. He is denying all the claims against him Becky.
ANDERSON: Copy that. Thank you. Still to come, I'm going to speak with an expert about the role that Syrian women can now play in shaping the
country's future that is up next. And a look at the rise and fall of Basha Al Assad and of half a century of his family's oppressive rule.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:25:00]
ANDERSON: Welcome back. I'm Becky Anderson in Abu Dhabi. You are watching "Connect the World". Time here is just before half past six in the evening.
Well, Syria's brutal and deadly dictatorship is over. It lasted for five decades, only to fall with stunning speed, accused of severe and repeated
human rights violations and inhumane assaults against civilians for years.
President Basher Al Assad turned Syria's military insecurity forces against his people. According to the UN, the country's civil war left hundreds of
thousands dead and drove millions from their homes. Well, now many of them are celebrating on the streets across the world. It's unclear what kind of
leadership will take over in Syria following the regime's collapse. But for the first time in decades, those decisions will be made without an Assad at
the helm. CNN's Nic Robinson details the rise and fall of Bashar Al Assad's political rule.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR (voice-over: Bashar Al Assad inherited his father's totalitarian regime and left it and his
country in ruins a thuggish police state in a brutal repression turned war, where hundreds of thousands of civilians were killed, and more than half
the population fled their homes.
RAMI KHOURI, MIDDLE EAST ANALYST: He'll be remembered as one of the most violent rulers in response to the uprisings that started in late 2010 in
the Arab world. He'll also be remembered as the failing endpoint of the Assad dynasty that his father had started. That lasted for over 42 years,
but it collapsed under him.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): Bashar Al Assad never expected to take over from his father. His older brother Basel, was the heir apparent. Instead, Bashar
trained as an ophthalmologist in London. Former Assad family insiders say he didn't have the right stuff to run Syria.
[09:30:00]
ABDEL HALIM KHADAM, FORMER SYRIAN VICE PRESIDENT: His brother Basal bullied him as a child. His father never gave him as much attention as Basal.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): When President Hafez Al Assad died in 2000, Syria's Elite pushed Bashar into the presidency, keeping 30 years of their own
wealth, power, position, and influence intact.
RIFAAT ASSAD, BASHAR AL ASSAD'S UNCLE: Hafez was a leader, the head of the entire regime while Bashar never came close to that.
ROBERTSON (voice-over): At first, the new president agreed to modest reforms and released hundreds of political prisoners. But that brief moment
of optimism dubbed the Damascus Spring ended abruptly. Protest demanding change spread across Syria in early 2011. The regime cracked down, turning,
peaceful, protest into slaughter.
The UN found what it called massive evidence of war crimes, crimes against humanity, responsibility at the highest level of government, including the
head of state. The chaos spawned countless local militias and opposition forces. In the mayhem, the Ultraviolent Islamist Group, ISIS gained a
temporary foothold, spewing its nihilistic terror over the border into Iraq.
U.S. and Iraqi forces confronted and ultimately crushed them, but didn't challenge Assad's brutal authority. Russia too joined the fight. Assad and
his allies, Hezbollah from Lebanon and Iranian militia were losing ground, committing more forces than any other country with barbaric,
internationally condemned ground and air assaults, Russia turned the tide in Assad's favor.
But when Russia's forces went to war in Ukraine in 2022, the clock on Assad's rule began ticking down. By late 2024, his other main allies, Iran
and Hezbollah, were blooded by over a year long war with Israel. Assad's fortunes plummeted. Former Al Qaeda turned nationalist Islamists Hayat
Tahrir Al Sham surged out of their northern enclave, exploiting Assad's allies' weakness overrunning the country.
Within two weeks, Assad had fled to Russia, ending his family's half century ruthless repression of the Syrian people. His life in exile begins
living in the shadow of fear. His heinous crimes will eventually catch up with him. Nic Robertson, CNN London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
ANDERSON: Well, it's safe to say that scarcely as single Syrian has not been impacted by the Assad Regime, whether inside the country or out. My
next guess is from the City of Homs, but no longer lives in Syria. She wrote, after the Assad regime fell, referring to her deceased mother,
quote, I now have hope to visit her grave and continue to preserve her legacy by ensuring that women play the leading role they deserve in the
future of Syria.
Rim Turkmani is the also the Director of the London School of Economics, Syria Conflict Research Program, as well as member of the Women's Advisory
Board to the UN Special Envoy to Syria. And she joins me now. Thank you for joining us. Nic, distilling into just a couple of minutes, more than 50
years of dictatorship. For you, this is very, very personal. How are your family and friends on the ground today in Syria?
RIM TURKMANI, SYRIA CONFLICT RESEARCH PROGRAMME DIRECTOR, LSE: Thank you very much. They are well, but they're very concerned. They already started
seeing the very worrying sign. They're relieved that they can finally see the back of this regime. They suffered so much under his rule.
I mean, you - today the picture of that child who was found in the prison was circulating everywhere. My own cousin was detained when she was nine
months pregnant. She gave birth inside the prison. For 40 days her baby was living with her in the prison, and then was forcibly taken away from her
and put an orphanage.
And it has been horrendous, and it's amazing to see him leaving, but we are worried about what's coming next. There is going to be any better, to be
honest.
ANDERSON: Well, let's talk about that because we're 24 hours into this. Of course, it was lightning speed. So many people taken by surprise, perhaps
behind the scenes in back channelling. So, there'll be leadership around the region who perhaps were not quite as surprised as others. Let's talk
about the concerns that people are already then voicing to you. What are they telling you?
TURKMANI: Well, I think the biggest concern now is to give the Head of HTS leading role in the future of Syria.
[09:35:00]
This is a guy who didn't just spend like a month or two in Al Qaeda. He was for 13 years leadership position in Al Qaeda. He was very close to a -- the
brain behind 9/11. And while this guy seemed to have changed his behavior in the last 13 days, we have 13 years of extremely bad behavior to worry
about.
So, the record doesn't look good for anyone. It doesn't look for women in particular. I mean, the women representation is in his own group, is zero.
If anything, they're oppressed or suppressed his group have executed women publicly in the squares in the past. They're cruel. And I just can't
imagine them being in charge.
ANDERSON: So, we're talking about Abu Mohammad Al-Jolani here who has been trying to, as you say, recently distance himself from his past. My
colleague got an exclusive interview with him. Jomana Karadsheh spoke to him just days ago just before the push to Damascus. This was just after
they captured Aleppo, have a listen to what he told Jomana.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOMANA KARADSHEH, CNN CORRESPONDENT: People listening to this are going to wonder why they should believe you. You are still a specially designated
global terrorist by the United States with a $10 million bounty on your head. Your group is a prescribed terrorist organization by the United
States, by the UN, by the EU, and others.
AL-JOLANI: I say to people, don't judge by words, but by actions. I believe the reality speaks for itself. These classifications are primarily
political and at the same time, wrong.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Look, somebody pointed out to me earlier on today that there is no playbook for Islamist insurgents faced with the quote, challenges of
running a country. He is, of course leading a group that is at the vanguard of this sort of group of rebels who are now certainly going to be involved
in the transition.
There is no playbook, I say, but there is a precedent in the Taliban in Afghanistan, of course. Is that what is worrying you? Is that what's going
through yours and other minds at this point?
TURKMANI: Yeah, not only that, of course, there is no precedence, not only for Islamists, for anyone who assume power through military coup style.
They -- you know we know how they behave? But I'm worried about what they're doing right now. Al-Jolani said judge, by the actions, yes, I won't
go judge him by his actions.
He has been trying to give reassurances that he's going to protect Christians. What he did yesterday, just yesterday in Aleppo, his guys from
the De Facto Ministry of Justice, they called all the judges in Aleppo. They took over the Ministry of Justice, and they called the judges of
Aleppo to come and coordinate with them.
But they said, female judges don't come. Christian judges don't come. So, they're already excluding half of the country, women and the Christians,
because they want to draw an Islamist constitution for the country. They want to run it their own way. We don't trust them.
They judge them by their actions. Now, their prisons are full. Just three days ago, women in Idlib demonstrated outside his own prison, packed with
men who dare to disagree with him asking for the release of these men. And they were met with stones. They were hitting them with stones. This is --
these are his actions. He is desperate right now for international recognition. He knows he will never be able to be in a leading position if
he's -- he doesn't get the blessing from the U.S. and from Europe.
And we appeal to you please don't give him this recognition. Negotiate it, make sure he doesn't stay in leadership position. Otherwise, it's over for
us. It's over the country for the region. I mean, just think now of the allied community in Syria. They are all congregating in the coast. They are
armed. They're extremely angry. They have very bitter history with him.
He killed so many of them. He attacked their areas and called them the Alawite. I mean, it doesn't matter how he changed his language. Just look
at his language when he attacked the Alawite area. They will -- if they see him in power, like in leadership position, they will be extremely alarmed.
And we will be risking a civil war. He has a share. He's going to have a share in the -- in this fine, but don't risk the whole region and put him
in charge.
[09:40:00]
ANDERSON: So, you are a special advisor to -- or an advisor to the UN Special Envoy Geir Pedersen. I saw him a couple of weeks ago. I mean, it
was -- you know ahead of what was this sort of lightning speed offensive. And of course, there is much talk now about sort of the reviving of UN
resolution 2254, which was all about sort of negotiating a political solution for Syria.
Look, that is just frankly, old at this point. This was something that was put together, I think 2013, if I'm right in saying 2014, maybe 2015. What
do you see? What's your advice to Geir Pedersen at the moment? How does the -- yeah, how does the -- how does the international community get involved?
I mean, there's a lot of stakeholders at play here, looking at how Syria is going to look going forward.
Some of whom are -- you know significant supporters of some of these rebel groups. Others, the country where I'm, for example, in the UAE is not going
to want to see the emergence of Islamist groups in charge in Syria. Whichever way you spin the Rubick Cube on this one. So, what's your advice?
Just give us a sense of the conversations that you are having with Geir at this point.
TURKMANI: I didn't speak to Geir on this point. But I would say that now the only table that can bring everyone is the UN table every other table is
decisive, divided because everyone was involved in a way or another. So, the UN can bring everyone, and the internationals should come in because I
say everyone is now desperate for international recognition.
No future governing body of Syria can function if they don't have international recognition. So that recognition should not just be handed on
a golden plate to anyone. We need to see inclusive, legitimate representative body. It's not going to be elected right now. We understand
it's transitional period.
It's going to be sticky. It's not going to be ideal. But anyone can easily tell you who, what kind of -- you know composition can represent the Syrian
people. And it shouldn't be one just based on, yeah, give us few Christians and free Alawite. No, it doesn't work like this. We need to be seen as
citizens. We need to be involved.
The Syrian civil society is amazingly strong, and it is really what saves the country from collapse and from civil war. And that needs to be at the
table. Women need to be at the table. Women in Syria have been always very strong, always fighting for space for themselves, and they're not going to
be accepted to be pushed back. And they're not going to accept just lip service for representation.
Just have a woman here or there. No, we want a real share in this. We've been waiting for 53 years, 53 years. My mother, all her generations, the
women who came later, they fought so hard to have their space in this country. And let's not just -- you know hand it all to this guy and wait
for another 50 years. Just look at the representation of women now in HTS. It's zero. Absolutely zero. So -- you know let's prevent yet another
disaster.
ANDERSON: Rim, it's good to have you. I do hope that we can talk more in the days and weeks to come for the time being. Thank you. As millions of
Syrians who've been displaced, both inside and outside of the country begin to think about or already have got themselves on the move. The future for
the country -- you know is not clear at this point. But we do hope the best and we hope for the best for the women of Syria, very specifically. Rim,
thank you.
Still come, it's been five days since he shot and killed the CEO of UnitedHealthcare in broad daylight, and he is still on the run. Crucial
pieces of evidence still missing in, what is this deep investigation more on that is coming up out of the states. We're going to take a very short
break back after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[09:45:00]
ANDERSON: Well, the hunt continues for a man caught on video gunning down and killing Brian Thompson, who was the CEO of UnitedHealthcare. He did it
in broad daylight on a busy Manhattan Street last Wednesday. Now, police don't know yet who the man is. They believe he left New York City, and they
are piecing together the clues that they have, like the images of him caught here on security cameras, DNA from a Starbucks water bottle and a
discarded foam. There is still a lot that they simply do not know.
John Miller is our Chief Law Enforcement and Intelligence Analyst. He joins us from New York with the very latest. I mean, this will be intriguing for
our viewers around the world. Why is it proving so difficult for police to track this man down?
JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT & INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Because he planned it and maintained a high level of discipline to make it that way.
The idea that he was on the ground 10 days in New York City, that he came in on a bus from somewhere else, that in those 10 days going all over the
city, retrieving all of this video of him passing by, walking down the street in a McDonald's, having coffee.
He never really takes down that mask except one time in the hotel where you can see a partial view of his face. And these new pictures from inside the
taxi, you can look right into his eyes, but you haven't seen him in any case, without a hood without a mask with a full headshot where you could
see what he looks like.
He's been extraordinarily careful and fingerprints lifted from the phone, did not register in the automated fingerprint information system that
tracks people arrested for serious crimes or convicted. The DNA preliminary tests are done, but probably have the later results back on Tuesday, but so
far, nothing. It's going to be difficult. But with the pictures, they're hoping somebody's going to call because if you know him, you would know
him.
ANDERSON: There is a show of support online for this suspect, that perhaps our viewers around the world will be not aware of. And I wonder, in your
experience, is that in any way impacting the search? What will authorities make of that?
MILLER: Well, it is possible that there are people who know him who may know what his problem is with either the insurance industry or the
healthcare industry, a big business that may sympathize. It's possible that they're not coming forward. We've seen that before.
But usually when you put something out this far and wide, you get those calls and they're getting them, but right now, they haven't gotten one
that's a solid match. Here's a real question that grows out of that, which is, did he go to all of this trouble to get away with this crime, or did he
go to all that trouble because he intends to strike again?
ANDERSON: It's good to have you, sir.
MILLER: Thanks.
ANDERSON: Really Intriguing, thank you. President-Elect Donald Trump outlined some of his priorities once he becomes U.S. President during what
was his first major television interview since last month's election. It was a sit down with NBC News. And the president-elect said he will look at
issuing pardons to January 6th, rioters on his first day back in office.
But he is leaving room for his appointees to decide whether to go after those who led investigations into his conduct during the Capitol attack.
Trump was pressed on whether he'd direct his picks to send political opponents to jail?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND CURRENT PRESIDENTIAL-ELECT: For what they did.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Everyone on the committee, you -
TRUMP: I think everybody -- anybody that voted in favor of -
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you going to direct your FBI Director and your Attorney General to send them to jail?
[09:50:00]
TRUMP: No, not at all. I think that they'll have to look at that. But I'm not going -- I'm going to focus on drill, baby drill.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ANDERSON: Well, CNN's Alayna Treene is more on what we learned from that NBC interview.
ALAYNA TREENE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Now, Trump had previously said that he would support trying to protect Dreamers during his first term as well. But
then he also tried to end the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals Program and Obama era program that really would've protected Dreamers that
was later struck down by the court.
So, we'll see what this could look like in a second term, but I think it's clear that Donald Trump as he's having these conversations since he got
elected, he's having some political considerations about what this could mean as well. Now I also want to talk about another major issue that Donald
Trump addressed during this "Meet the Press" interview. And that was whether he wanted to double down on his claims to seek retribution against
political opponents.
Trump said that he does not plan to go after directly President Joe Biden. However, he did leave the door open to allow some of his political
appointees and people like Pam Bondi he has picked to leave the Department of Justice as well as Kash Patel has picked to leave the FBI really giving
them kind of a broad authority to go after whoever they believe maybe had committed crimes or acted in a corrupt manner.
He also talked about wanting to issue January 6th pardons on day one. Again, this is something that Donald Trump had repeatedly vowed to do
throughout his time on the campaign trail, but it's been unclear really ever since he won the election, how he would do that. He didn't really get
into the specifics during this interview, but I will say from my conversations with Trump's team, there are two different thoughts about how
to go about it.
Some people believe that really, he should have these wide pardons sweeping pardons for anyone who was convicted for what they did on January 6th in
the Capitol attack. Others, however, saying it should be on a case-by-case basis specifically looking at the people who did not -- you know attack
police officers or weren't committed on seditious conspiracy charges.
So, some considerations there. But again, this is something that Donald Trump said that he will do very early on once he assumes office. And I'd
also just add here that this is also a promise that I'm told he needs to follow through on. He didn't just make this promise broadly throughout his
time on the campaign trail.
He also promised this to specific people to their families. And so, this is something I am told that he is expected to follow through. The question is,
what will it look like?
ANDERSON: Alayna Treene reporting for you. Coming up, a week full of celebrations to kick off a new era for Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris. We're
going to get you some stunning images of that after this.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
ANDERSON: Well, worshipers filling the pews at Notre Dame Cathedral once again after the long-awaited reopening drew world leaders and tourists
alike to Paris on Sunday. Melissa Bell takes us to what was the weekend's exciting opening.
MELISSA BELL, CNN PARIS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris once again opened for worship. The very first mass held on Sunday
after a devastating fire ripped through the Cathedral in April, 2019. The grand opening ceremony was on Saturday night.
[09:55:00]
50 heads of state attended, including President-Elect Donald Trump and the Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, who had a chance to meet for the
first time since Donald Trump's re-election at the Elysee Palace before the ceremony.
Then that ceremony inside Notre Dame to celebrate its reopening, but the consecration of the altar and the cathedral as a whole, not until Sunday
morning allowing that first mass to take place. What we understand is the plan is now for three masses a day to be held each day for the next six
months. Such do they believe the appetite of the faithful will be to return to Notre Dame restored.
One of the main architects of the restoration explained to me, not so much to its grandeur of five years ago, but beyond that, to the grandeur of what
it was in the 19th century when it was last fully restored at the time when that spire that collapse so dramatically in 2019 was built. Melissa Bell,
CNN Paris.
ANDERSON: Fabulous. Well, our first hour of "Connect the World" is complete. Stay with me. We'll be back after this short break for more.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[10:00:00]
END
