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Global Markets Seesaw amid Tariff Uncertainty; E.U. Set to Impose Retaliatory Tariffs on U.S. if Talks Fail; Xi Touts China as Reliable Trade Partner in Southeast Asia; Trump Open to Sending "Homegrown Criminals" to El Salvador; Trump Administration Freezes $2+ Billion in Funding to Harvard; Another Columbia Student Faces Deportation; Strike Damages Hospital in Gaza City; U.S. Surgeon Volunteering in Gaza Says Al-Ahli Is "Nonfunctional"; Trump Projecting Expansive View of Executive Power; "The Breakfast Club" Stars Reunite after 40 Years. Aired 10-11a ET
Aired April 15, 2025 - 10:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE (voice-over): Live from CNN Abu Dhabi, this is CONNECT THE WORLD.
ELENI GIOKOS, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Welcome to the second hour of our show. I'm Eleni Giokos, live from our Middle East hub
and programming headquarters in Abu Dhabi where it is just after 6 pm.
Coming up this hour, the Trump administration's lack of clarity about the U.S. trade policy is leaving traders unsure about how to best position
their investments.
A Palestinian student at Columbia University went into an immigration office, hoping to begin the final step to becoming a U.S. citizen.
But instead of having an interview, Mohsen Mudawi, who has been a legal permanent resident for a decade, was taken away in handcuffs, the latest
case in a string of student arrests by the Trump administration.
In another controversial move, the White House announcing it is freezing $2.2 billion in grants for Harvard University after the school said it
would not follow the administration's policy demands. The school's president says Harvard will not surrender its independence or its
constitutional rights.
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GIOKOS: Buy, sell, hold; for weeks now the global financial markets have been roiled by U.S. president Donald Trump's tariffs and the multiple
revisions, delays as well as exemptions and muddied explanations that have come along with them from the president and his top economic advisers.
Now there's been extreme volatility as investors wonder if the most impactful tariffs will really happen. The White House insists that they
will. In the meantime, uncertainty reigns.
Today on Wall Street, in early trading, we're sitting well into positive territory. Dow, Nasdaq and S&P are well above that 0.5 percent mark in the
green. And this is quite important because we've seen real pressure coming through.
But the last few days we've seen some reprieve. And again it has to do with the messaging from the White House.
Meantime, European stock markets are edging higher today after president Trump said he's considering those exemptions on auto tariffs.
Here's a look at the major indices late in the trading day. As you can see, all in the green. The FTSE up 1.2 percent and the IBEX up almost 2 percent.
Now the E.U. announcing today it is going to impose retaliatory tariffs on hundreds of American products, ranging from clothing to toilet paper, if
trade talks with the U.S. fail. I want to bring in Nic Robertson from London. He's on top of the story for us.
And Nic, frankly, the Europeans have said if things don't go as planned and there's no negotiation and deal on the table, they are willing to embark on
countermeasures. So give me a sense of what is happening behind closed doors, what kind of conversations are occurring and whether the U.S. and
the Europeans can see eye to eye.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN SENIOR DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Well, they saw eye to eye yesterday, quite literally, because their top trade commissioner was in
Washington meeting with U.S. counterparts.
And he said, look, you know, beginning, taking this opportunity of a 90-day pause on these U.S. tariffs that president Trump had had initially said 20
percent on Europe on horizontal tariffs, taking it down to 10 percent, holding it off for 90 days.
OK. They're into these talks. But he did say this is going to be difficult. It's going to require both sides. And he also said that the tariffs were
unfair. So he is back in Europe now, briefing ambassadors. This is how the E.U. works about the nature and the result of and the content of those
conversations.
But what else is happening?
And you just talked about it. Well, last week the European Union took a decision on $23 billion worth of tariffs on the United States for -- OK,
we've got to look at this very carefully here because it was for aluminum and steel tariffs that the U.S. had announced back in February.
That came about. This is your question about what's actually happening behind the scenes. Coordination, conversations between the commission and
the constituent countries that make up the European Union; everything is a discussion.
Everything they say is done carefully. It's done, you know, sort of to the agreement of all the different parties involved.
So what you're talking about here, we got the details from the European Union today of the tariffs that they would have imposed today had president
Trump last week not put a 90-day hold, the European Union saying this is what we would have targeted, this basket of goods, which includes, as you
say, toilet paper, makeup.
But that's not the end of it. What the European Union agreed to last week was a phased rollout of tariffs.
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So you have those tariffs that would have gone out today. They're on the 90-day pause. You have tariffs that would have gone out, 25 percent by the
way, in May, on beef, on other agriculture products. You know, a graded pain threshold going up if you will.
And then in December, soybean, a massive export coming from the United States to the European Union. And no surprise, the European Union very
carefully -- this gets to what they're doing behind the scenes -- looking at what they target.
Soybeans produced, a lot of them coming from Louisiana. Louisiana's a red state. This is the European Union's signaling that it's trying to sort of
get to the, if you will, the producers of these products, who might have a political influence on president Trump's thinking. That's the calculus.
But here's another point. OK, so there's those 10 percent horizontal tariffs plus the 25 percent vehicle car tariffs that that the United States
has imposed on the European Union and the rest of the world as well. There hasn't been a response, reciprocal tariffs coming back from the European
Union on that. They're considering it.
And there are several massive areas of commerce, such as goods, pharmaceuticals, medicines, oil that it buys; liquid natural gas products
from the United States, energy products. They haven't touched that yet.
Neither have they touched services, which is another massive sector of financial importance, that the United States, in essence, exports these
services to the European Union. So this is a very, very graded response, carefully managed, step by step. That's what's happening behind the scenes.
GIOKOS: Yes, I mean, truly fascinating. And here's the reality. I mean, markets seem to have rebounded somewhat. It seems that, you know, there's a
little bit of reprieve here.
But from what I'm hearing and, based on what you're saying, the Europeans have many levers that they can pull, frankly, with the United States. And
from our sense, is you've got the global world trade order that is being rejigged, reworked completely. It seems like tariffs are here to stay.
Are the Europeans prepared for that eventuality?
ROBERTSON: I think they're signaling that they are. They're signaling and saying that they're prepared for tough negotiations. They'd rather have a
0-0 tariff relationship with the United States. But that's something the United States has turned down.
They say that they're ready for these negotiations to be tough. And the way that they're grading them, if you will, and sort of putting out the ones
that have less economic impact first.
Although, again, the point is they've put those on a 90-day hold -- that the way that they're stepping them out is designed to increase the pain
slowly and over a period of time.
So it was in early February that president Trump announced these 25 percent tariffs globally on aluminum and steel. It took until last week for the
European Union to make a decision on that. So it is in this for the long game, careful, slow.
And part of the messaging here -- and we've talked about this before -- is the European Union wants to send to its other trading partners a very clear
signal that they're not going to be reactionary and do things quickly in the way that the United States has, you know, has put these tariffs on,
announced the tariffs, backtracked.
Gone backwards and forwards, mixed messages, unclear signals, uncertainty, uncertainty. Businesses hate that, right. What the European Union is trying
to do here, not just in its response to the United States to send a message there but to send it to other trading partners around the world.
That they are consistent, that they are careful, that they are reliable, that they are stable.
And so are they prepared for the long game?
That's what they're signaling. And the markets are signaling that they're hunkering down for a longer game, where they can get back into some
positive territory. But I don't think anyone feels, particularly not in the E.U., in Brussels, that this is over by a long stretch.
GIOKOS: Yes, exactly. Let me tell you, I've covered markets long enough to know that every single country on the planet wants to increase its
industrial capacity and export as much as possible. So frankly, you know, what the United States wants, everyone wants. Nic Robertson, great to have
you with us.
All right. So moving on to China because it's -- the president there is responding to the Trump tariffs by working to build trade ties with some
regional neighbors. Xi Jinping is on a three-nation tour of Vietnam, Malaysia and Cambodia, painting China as a stable, reliable partner in the
global trade market. Steven Jiang has the details for us.
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STEVEN JIANG, CNN BEIJING BUREAU CHIEF: Xi Jinping's message to Vietnam and indeed, many other countries, is to join hands with China to resist
Trump's "Unilateral bullying" and work together to maintain the current global free trade system and supply chains.
Now this is going to be repeated and amplified throughout his trip. The goals of his trip very much twofold.
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Economically, China trying to continue to diversify its footprint.
And it's no coincidence he started in Hanoi because Southeast Asian countries as a bloc has replaced the U.S. and European Union as China's
biggest trading partner and Vietnam having the biggest share among all Southeast Asian nations.
That's why Xi Jinping has signed 45 different deals and agreements with Vietnam, not only trying to sell a lot of products now being shut out of
the U.S. But also while trying to invest helping Vietnam build infrastructure projects.
And this is happening despite the long running territorial dispute between the two countries in the South China Sea.
So that really speaks to the second part of its goal, that is more strategic, more foreign policy related with China trying to pull more and
more country closer to its orbit, even those that may have disputes with Beijing on major issues.
The message here being, if you've been unsettled by the tariff whiplash from Washington, then come hang out with us. Instead of fear and pressure,
as Trump has shown you, we are going to show you love. We are on your side.
Now this message perhaps a lot more resonant to a lot of countries compared to just a few weeks ago, as China continues to portray itself as the adult
in the room with an intensifying trade war with Washington and trying to play the role of the upholder of international order and norms.
And a lot of these countries, though, including Vietnam, have to be a little careful in terms of how they track. They don't want to be perceived
too close to Beijing and risk provoking Trump at a time when they still have to negotiate with the president on their pending tariffs.
And the U.S. president very much noticing this meeting Hanoi, characterizing it, in his words, as China and Vietnam figuring out how to
screw the USA -- Steven Jiang, CNN, Beijing.
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GIOKOS (voice-over): Well, next, he was wrongfully deported from the U.S. and now both the White House and El Salvador are making it clear they won't
return him.
Plus --
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UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This is literally political ransom.
GIOKOS (voice-over): Harvard giving a hard no to a list of demands from the Trump administration. And the school says it's not budging, even with
billions of dollars on the line. We'll be right back after this.
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GIOKOS: The U.S. and Salvadorian presidents are making it clear that a Maryland man who was wrongfully deported to El Salvador will not be
returned to the United States under their watch.
Nayib Bukele met Donald Trump at the White House on Monday, where the U.S. president made some bold proclamations about his immigration policy. Mr.
Trump said he's open to deporting, quote, "homegrown criminals" to El Salvador. It comes after Washington said El Salvador has agreed to house
violent U.S. criminals.
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And receive deportees of any nationality. We've got Alayna Treene at the White House for us with more.
And just to the point of the man that was deported wrongfully, the message that is being sent by Bukele as well as Donald Trump is that, if you're
caught in the crosshairs of this immigration policy, that they will not return you.
There isn't due process, essentially, because that is the under -- sort of the undercurrent of what was being discussed.
ALAYNA TREENE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's exactly right, I think. Look, the Trump administration had really been building to this line of defense for
some time now.
But they made it more explicit yesterday than they had previously, which is essentially they have no intention of returning Kilmar Abrego Garcia, the
man from Maryland to the United States.
That comes after, of course, that we've had two courts now, even the Supreme Court had reached that high of a level, had ruled that the United
States must facilitate the return of Abrego Garcia to the U.S.
Now this question was posed by CNN directly to president Donald Trump, who kind of asked some of his top advisers in the room, including his attorney
general, Pam Bondi, and deputy chief of staff for policy, Stephen Miller, about this. And they said that it's not in their power to do so.
The power now lies with the El Salvadoran president, Nayib Bukele. And Bukele was then asked about this and he said essentially that it would be
like trying to smuggle a terrorist into the United States and that he had no plans to do so.
So I think the key question now is, where does that leave this?
And it's really become one of the most significant showdowns between the judiciary and this White House since the president had taken office back in
January. And we do know that later today there is going to be a hearing with that initial federal judge in Maryland, who had ruled that he should
be brought back to the United States.
They are going to have a hearing today. I think next steps of what's going to happen from here, are the courts satisfied with this response from the
administration?
That really is the key question and hopefully we will get more clarity on that following that hearing. But again, I think, you know, just to put a
finer point on it, the administration has been clear that they feel like they do not have the power to do this, that now that this man has already
been deported to El Salvador.
It is not up to them to bring him back. And one of the arguments we've heard them make as well is that essentially the court should not be getting
involved in some of the foreign policy decisions that president Donald Trump and this administration are making. And that's really what they used
as the justification behind a lot of this.
GIOKOS: Yes.
And then the other major comment that president Trump made was that El Salvador is willing to accept any homegrown criminals, again, insinuating
U.S. citizens could also face deportation.
TREENE: That's exactly right. I mean, I think that was one of the most notable things that was said during that meeting. It's been lost in some of
this, you know, examination of this man, of returning whether or not he'll be returned to the United States is what else the president said.
And essentially, he argued that, one, he wants to ramp up the number of deportations that the United States is seeing in their -- in their move to
send a lot of these undocumented immigrants, particularly those who had allegedly committed violent crimes, to El Salvador.
And, two, I should say, not just to El Salvador but to go into this mega prison that they have developed there. But then the president said that he
would also like to send U.S. citizens there, what he labeled homegrown criminals. Listen to how he put it.
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DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: We always have to obey the laws, but we also have homegrown criminals that push people into subways that hit elderly
ladies on the back of the head with a baseball bat when they're not looking that are absolute monsters. I'd like to include them in the group of people
to get them out of the country.
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TREENE: So as you could hear him say there, that he would like to get them out of the country. Again, homegrown criminals, that he is -- the homegrown
criminals he is referring to are United States citizens.
Now, of course, there are many legal questions of whether or not that would even be possible for this Trump administration to try to do. But the
president also said yesterday that he would direct the attorney general, Pam Bondi, to look into that, to see if there is, you know, some sort of
legal course of action they can use to move forward with that.
I think bottom line here is that this president and this administration have made very clear that the deportations we've already seen of
undocumented migrants and so on to El Salvador is just the beginning.
When I asked Stephen Miller, his deputy chief of staff for policy, yesterday, about how many people they want El Salvador to take in, he told
me there is no upper limit. So I think this is just the start of what we are going to see, of a much broader effort by this administration to really
try and send a lot more people to El Salvador. Eleni.
GIOKOS: Alayna Treene, great to have you with us. Thank you.
Now a standoff between the White House and Harvard University is reaching boiling point.
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The Trump administration announcing a freeze on more than $2 billion in U.S. government funding after the nation's oldest university flatly
rejected its policy change demands.
And moments ago, president Trump, posting on social media, suggesting the school could lose its tax exempt status. The administration says the
proposed changes are in the name of fighting antisemitism on college campuses after a series of high-profile incidents. Here's one Harvard law
professor's take on what's happening right now.
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ANDREW MANUEL CRESPO, LAW PROFESSOR, HARVARD UNIVERSITY: It's a transparent effort to change what is taught, what we -- what we say in our
classrooms, what we teach our students, to make sure that the only things that are actually said on university campuses are things that the Trump
administration wants to hear and wants to be said.
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GIOKOS: CNN's Kara Scannell is live in New York with the latest.
And, Kara, I mean, what we're hearing from the White House is this is to tackle antisemitism. But frankly, the policy changes that the White House
is after, the Trump administration is after, extends far beyond antisemitism. In fact, there's a long list of things that they would like
to see implemented at Harvard.
KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: That's right. And the Harvard president had said that this would be akin to a federal takeover of a private
university because of the breadth of demands and changes that the federal task force is seeking.
Including the elimination of DEI programs, a ban on masks at campus protests, reforms to the merit-based hiring and admissions, as well as a
federal audit of those admissions and what professors they hire.
They want an annual review of that, as well as reducing the power held by faculty and administrators of a certain ideology; that is the wording of
the federal task force. So there are several changes that they are seeking to impose.
And the university is standing up and saying that that goes too far, that that goes beyond what is even allowed under the law for the federal
government to do and also just goes against the university's First Amendment rights.
So the Harvard professor speaking out, as you just played, as well as the university in saying that they would not back down from this. Now the task
force's response to this has been that they are sending a message to other universities here, that they need to show that they're going to make
substantial changes.
To put it, as you said, to combat antisemitism. But what happens next here remains to be seen. It's unclear what Harvard will do now. It's unclear
also which programs are affected by the $2.2 billion freeze in federal grants, as well as $60 million in contracts.
A lot of Harvard's funding comes from the National Institutes of Health and goes toward biomedical research into areas of infectious disease, HIV,
traumatic brain injury. So we reached out to Harvard, waiting to see exactly what they're going to do next and what programs might be affected.
But as you just said, the president has said that maybe it's that Harvard's tax exempt status should be challenged as well. So this kind of back-and-
forth here appears to be continuing. You know, the task force is saying that there's about $9 billion in federal funding that's at stake here.
Right now, it's about $2.2 billion that's frozen.
GIOKOS: Right. Kara Scannell, great to have you with us. Thank you.
Now Jewish leaders are among those condemning the detention of a Palestinian student who is now facing deportation from the United States.
Mohsen Mahdawi has lived in the U.S. for a decade and has -- was about to have his final citizenship interview. And you can see him here, being taken
away in handcuffs outside an immigration office in Vermont.
His lawyer says he is being targeted for speaking out about the war in Gaza. Mahdawi was an associate of Mahmoud Khalil, whose deportation case
has also made global headlines.
Now Vermont's congressional division, which includes Bernie Sanders, issued a joint statement on Mahdawi's detention.
And they said, quote, "This is immoral, inhumane and illegal. Mr. Mahdawi, a legal resident of the United States, must be afforded due process under
the law and immediately released from detention."
Democratic representative Becca Balint is part of Vermont's congressional delegation and now joins us.
Thank you so much for your time today. And, you know, listening and hearing the statement and seeing some of the footage of his arrest and knowing that
he was about to go for his final interview, you're calling for his release.
Tell me what you could do right now to try and secure that, what conversations you're having.
What legal recourse do you have?
REP. BECCA BALINT (D-VT): Yes. Thank you so much for having me. I am enraged and I speak for so many of my constituents. I was at a town hall
last night. And the topic of his detention came up. We are furious that the Trump administration is sending mass, unmarked cars to pick up legal
residents.
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To essentially disappear them because they are speaking their minds. We have free speech in this country. We have due process for every person who
is living within our borders. And it is inhumane. It's also an indication that this administration, the Trump administration, is not interested in
upholding the rule of law or the Constitution.
And it is up to good people across this nation to stand up. And I am demanding from the secretary of state, Marco Rubio, and the Secretary of
Homeland Security, Kristi Noem, that they provide us with a certification of the evidence that they have against Mr. Mahdawi.
And that they must appear before congressional committees and give us the evidence that they have for this detention. This should enrage everyone.
And this has a chilling effect across this country because it is about due process. It's about free speech.
And when you take it into context, when you have the president saying yesterday, with the president of El Salvador, that citizens of the United
States are next, they're going to be the next ones who are sent to a supermax prison in El Salvador.
He has already said he's going after birthright citizenship. Men and women across this country have to stand up and resist what this administration is
doing, because this has stopped being America at this point. This has stopped being a country that believes in due process if we allow things
like this to happen.
GIOKOS: So from what we understand, Mohsen Mahdawi was an associate of Mahmoud Khalil. And Mahmoud Khalil, the judge recently ruled that he can be
deported from the United States.
You know, when you're talking about due process, because what they've also said is that his beliefs or associations are against U.S. foreign policy
interests, because that is the line that is being used right now to justify these arrests and deportations.
BALINT: Exactly. That is the argument they are using. And what I am saying in my direct communication with the secretary of state, that it's not good
enough to just reference that part of the law.
He needs to certify it, that he personally will come before committees of the U.S. Congress and say that this man's speech and this man's ideas are a
danger and run counter to U.S. foreign policy.
Who's next?
I have spoken out against the war in Gaza. I have spoken out against U.S. policy. I have voted against sending additional weapons to Israel because
of the actions in Gaza. So look who's next.
Am I next?
Is every member of Congress who has stood up to U.S. policy, are we next?
Because that is the message that is being sent right now, that we can be attacked simply for our ideas and for our speech.
So I would like Marco Rubio to certify in front of Congress that, yes, this is the evidence that they have and that he personally is putting his job on
the line around these deportations. It is outrageous. And again, I will just say, if we continue down this path, we are no better than any other
authoritarian regime across this world.
GIOKOS: Yes, it certainly does cause concern in terms of the precedent that it possibly sets. Representative Becca Balint, great to have you with
us. Thank you for your insights today.
All right. Just ahead, Hamas says it's studying an Israeli proposal for a Gaza ceasefire and hostage deal as Israeli troops expand operations in the
enclave. We will get harrowing testimony from a doctor inside Gaza City's last trauma hospital, now out of service after Israeli strikes over the
weekend.
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GIOKOS (voice-over): Welcome back to CONNECT THE WORLD with me, Eleni Giokos. Here are your headlines.
Wall Street is higher in early trading as investors digest the latest developments in the Trump tariffs. The U.S. president says he's considering
a short-term tariff exemption for automakers. That's the news helping push global stock markets into the green today.
Hungary's parliament has passed a constitutional amendment allowing the government to ban LGBTQ+ events in public. Monday's vote fell along party
lines, with 140 votes for and 21 against. Critics and legal experts say the amendment puts Hungary's populist government another step closer to
authoritarianism.
A source tells CNN the next round of U.S.-Iran nuclear talks will likely take place in Rome but the location has not been fully nailed down. It will
be the second direct meeting between Iranian and American negotiators and is set to happen this Saturday.
GIOKOS: In his first comments since the talks began, Iran's supreme leader is warning about repeating past mistakes in the negotiations. Donald Trump
pulled out of the nuclear agreement during his first term in 2016 and instead opted for a maximum pressure campaign against Tehran. Here's what
Khamenei told his senior officials.
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ALI KHAMENEI, IRANIAN SUPREME LEADER (through translator): The mistake we made in the JCPOA should not be repeated. In those talks, we tied our
issues and made everything dependent upon the progress of those talks.
The first steps have been positive but we still need to watch closely. The red lines are clear. They are clear from the other side and they are clear
for us. And it all we can do is follow the talks.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Meantime, the U.S. special envoy says the talks moving forward will be about verifying the extent of Iran's nuclear program, stopping
short of calling for Tehran to dismantle it completely.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY TO THE MIDDLE EAST: This is going to be much about verification on the enrichment program and then ultimately
verification on weaponization. That includes missiles, the type of missiles that they have stockpiled there. And it includes the trigger for a bomb.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: When it comes to the war in Gaza, Hamas tells CNN it is studying Israel's first proposal for a ceasefire deal since it renewed fighting in
the enclave last month. Israel is offering a 45-day truce that would release 10 hostages in exchange for hundreds of Palestinians.
The proposal also calls for Hamas to disarm in Gaza, previously a red line for the group, making it unlikely to be accepted.
But for the people of Gaza, relief can't come soon enough. An Israeli airstrike early Sunday destroying parts of the last fully functioning
hospital in the north of the Strip. Dr. Samer Attar, an American surgeon volunteering there, sent us a dispatch from the scene.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DR. SAMER ATTAR, AMERICAN SURGEON, GAZA HOSPITAL VOLUNTEER: This is the inside entrance of Al-Ahli hospital about one hour after it was shelled.
The emergency department, the office where the paramedics hang out and the church got shelled.
We sheltered in place with the inpatients and a patient was injured and brought in from the streets. Paramedics here are risking their lives to
transfer people from here and from the streets to other hospitals.
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Because this hospital is currently out of service. All the patients are scared that the army will enter. For now, it's just shelter in place and
survive.
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GIOKOS: Dr. Attar joined me from inside Al-Ahli hospital to break down what happened and how his team is now pressing on.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ATTAR: Well, I didn't really know what was going on. Nobody really knew what was going on. There was a lot of miscommunication and misinformation
running around.
But I was woke up by a nurse, who just told me to get up and run. And I came downstairs, thinking that we had to do some surgeries. But I was
notified that there was going to be an operation conducted around the hospital.
But we still had about 40 patients and I saw patients, I saw their families, just men, women and children, who can't be evacuated. They've got
broken bones. They can't move. And I just -- I couldn't leave them and just decided to stay put with them.
GIOKOS: It's really quite horrific. And we're hearing accounts of just the difficulty of evacuating patients. Tell me what happened in that moment and
the ability of staff to get injured patients out and whether these patients could even be moved, given the severity of their injuries.
ATTAR: Well, many of them were on beds and some of them were carried out by staff. Others were carried out by their family members. Those that
couldn't be carried out had to get pushed out on beds with wheels.
And some ambulances that were available transferred these patients to other hospitals. I was told that a lot of these patients were pushed by their
family members on their beds in the dark to get to other hospitals. They were just pushing them along rubbled streets for 30-60 minutes, trying to
find another hospital to take them.
And some of them just took their took their families home to relatives. Most of them managed to get it out. There was one child that was oxygen
dependent and when he was taken off oxygen, ended up being -- ended up dying in the street, on his bed.
GIOKOS: Understanding is that Al-Ahli was the last fully functioning hospital in Gaza City.
What do you know about the ability of other hospitals to take in patients right now?
What kind of capacity are we talking about?
ATTAR: Well, the other hospitals, I mean, every hospital is already at capacity but Al-Ahli hospital in particular was the hospital for trauma in
Gaza City.
There was one night we had an attack on a residential area. There were about 30 people killed and 100 wounded. And there were people on the floor.
And the doctors here are amazing. They're remarkable. They're able to triage and they're able to save lives.
And the scenes are kind of horrific in the emergency department. You step over dead bodies. I remember one child that was foaming at the mouth with
blood. There was another child with his abdomen was open. His intestines were falling out. He was about 8 years old.
And all we could do was tell his brother and his other brother to hold his hand until he passed, because we had more incoming wounded to assess and
triage. And we had to prioritize those that we thought were going to make it.
So anywhere else in the world, we would have tried to save everyone. But in these settings, you can't do that. But this is what this hospital was for,
to help triage those mass casualty events.
And now that this hospital is out of function, the other hospitals just don't have the capacity that we have. We have four operating rooms. We have
a functioning emergency room. We had patient tents outside to extend the holding capacity of the hospital. Unfortunately, that capacity has now been
disabled.
GIOKOS: Tell me about the capacity you have right now. You're at least partially functioning in some way.
ATTAR: We got about 30 to 40 inpatients who have been here. Patients still require ongoing surgical care even after a blast injury. They have exposed
bones, non-healing wounds that require maybe three, four, five or six operations to get to heal.
So the operating rooms are thankfully still functioning and we're just taking care of those that are currently here in this hospital.
But it's hard because you hear the gunfire, you hear the gunships, you hear the bombs, you hear the airstrikes. And there are people in the streets
that you know are being injured but they have to be taken away to hospitals that are farther away. Even that might cost lives.
GIOKOS: It's so vital to hear these stories, especially at a time where you hear so many politicians saying, well, you know, it's part of the fog
of war. I want you to give us a little bit of an understanding of the severity of the situation right now versus the previous times that you've
been to Gaza because this is your 6th medical mission.
ATTAR: Yes, they all blur together. But the death, death and suffering is just -- it's nonstop. Wave after wave after wave of one horror and atrocity
after another. There was one day here before the attack, when we worked for 24 hours straight. We were just operating around the clock.
[10:40:00]
All the operating rooms were full. We didn't stop until about 6 in the morning. And then we started up again at around 10 in the morning.
And the one case -- I remember the first case, it was a was a 28-year-old girl. Her left arm was dramatically amputated and both of her -- both of
her breasts were avulsed from the explosion. And it was it was horrifying to see.
But in the operating room, the anesthesiologist started crying. The surgeon started crying, because they said they -- she reminded them of her, of
their daughters. And the nurse anesthetist started crying.
And it's rare that I've seen that sort of emotional breakdown. And that was the first case that we had prior to the start of that 24-hour day. So
there's this, this caged grief and despair that sometimes trickles out.
But when you -- when you're working for 24 hours and you know that people's lives depend on the functioning of all the staff at the hospital, you sort
of have to compartmentalize it and push it away.
But they've been doing that here for 16 months. They haven't really been able to even process those emotions. For them, it's all normal to see
these things. And for me, I get to drop in and out and I at least I still have that awareness that this is not normal. This is not -- this is not all
right.
GIOKOS: It's really hard to get your head around some of the stories that you're sharing with us and the sheer trauma that is involved in all of
this, because this is, as we said, your sixth mission.
What keeps you going back?
ATTAR: They keep me coming back. I mean, I think, when you have a skillset and an opportunity to help, I don't know. I don't know who wouldn't do it.
It's not just about -- it's not just about helping out. It's also just about showing up and doing what you're good at and standing in solidarity
with them, advocating for them.
Sometimes all you have to do is just show up and just be a presence and it lets them know that they're not alone and that they're connected to the
world. And that's why I keep coming back, because they need help and the work is nonstop.
GIOKOS: There's a blockade at the moment. Very little coming in to Gaza right now. We've heard accounts that you've described, things in terms of
not having enough blood for transfusions. We've heard the stories that keep on coming up in terms of no anesthesia available.
And then you've got to do amputations and take really tough decisions in order to assist patients.
So what's the situation at the moment in terms of medical supplies and what are your concerns?
ATTAR: Well, there's a lot of rationing. So there's not a lot of surgical gowns, surgical gloves, medications, anesthesia. And we have to ration.
Sometimes we'll do operations with just gloves alone, which isn't great when you're dealing with bones and infections and you're trying to get
people to heal.
When we're putting in pins and screws, they're dull. The drills sometimes break down. And what should only be 20 to 30 minutes in terms of an
operation can sometimes take two hours because the equipment is malfunctioning or the equipment isn't adequate.
And that that can be a problem when you know you've got 15 to 20 more surgeries to do.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
GIOKOS: Dr. Samer Attar there, live from Al-Ahli hospital in Gaza City. Important testimony of the situation on the ground.
All right. Well, still to come, president Donald Trump is urging U.S. government regulators to punish a popular television news program because
he didn't like what it reported. CNN's chief media analyst weighs in. We'll be right back.
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[10:45:00]
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GIOKOS: Welcome back. Now U.S. president Donald Trump is lashing out at the media again. And this time he's urging the FCC, a government agency
that regulates the media, to punish the "60 Minutes" television program and its broadcaster, CBS.
The network's current events program aired stories on Ukraine and Greenland on Sunday, which apparently angered the president. In a Truth Social post,
he called on FCC chairman and ally, Brendan Carr, to impose, quote, "maximum fines and punishments on the show and CBS."
So far, there's no evidence of illegal behavior by CBS. CNN's chief media analyst Brian Stelter joins me now live from New York.
Brian, good to see you.
You've been a very big critic of "60 Minutes" for many years now. He's filed this lawsuit, accusing the network of manipulating an interview he
gave to Kamala Harris. And this time around, it appears that he's encouraging a political ally, Brendan Carr, to apply government pressure
against CBS.
So what is going on here?
I mean, are we seeing something that was inaccurate on air?
I mean, what is the -- what is the actual process going to be?
BRIAN STELTER, CNN CHIEF MEDIA ANALYST: This is retribution in action in the same way that he's going after Harvard and big law firms and Democratic
politicians.
Trump is targeting CBS and specifically "60 Minutes," which is the highest- rated news magazine in the United States. "60 Minutes" has been airing hard-hitting segments about the impacts of Trump's policies.
And Trump has clearly been watching because his most recent Truth Social posts about the show were on Sunday night, right after the broadcast
happened. You know, he's basically accusing the show of committing crimes. And the important part here is he's pushing the FCC chair to punish the
network.
He promoted Brendan Carr, who was already a commissioner on the FCC, he promoted Brendan Carr to chairman several months ago. And ever since then,
Carr has been trying to cozy up to Trump; going to Mar-a-Lago, for example; flying on Air Force One; showing off his MAGA credentials.
Just last week, Carr was shown wearing a gold pin on his lapel with Trump's head. So Carr very much wants to be viewed as Trump's guy. And it will be
interesting to see what Carr does in this case. We've seen other agencies be pressured in the same way that the FCC is now being pressured.
I did reach out to Carr. He has not responded to Trump's post, urging the government to punish CBS. But you know, I think we should view this all of
a piece with Trump's use of the autocrat's playbook.
We heard him yesterday in the Oval Office, you know, cozying up to the El Salvadoran president, insulting CNN by name several times. We've also seen
Trump apply various tools in his toolkit against media outlets, like CBS and NPR. There are new reports today that he's going to try to defund those
public media outlets in the U.S.
And you mentioned the lawsuit against CBS, which is really interesting. It's a frivolous lawsuit filed by CBS -- excuse me -- filed by Trump back
when he was campaigning for office last year. But it has become a real problem for CBS' parent company, Paramount Global.
Why is the lawsuit a problem?
Well, if CBS fights it in court, CBS is almost guaranteed to win, thanks to the protections of the First Amendment. But CBS' parent company is trying
to get a merger, get through the government.
In order to get the merger approved, they need FCC approval. So it's possible that Brendan Carr could hold up that deal. And ultimately, that's
the kind of punishment Trump might be looking for.
GIOKOS: Brian Stelter, good to have you on. Thank you so much.
Now our next guest has some thoughts on all of this.
And he writes, quote, "The administration is projecting presidential authority in a broader and more overt way than any modern White House.
"Its expansive interpretation of statutes and questionable interpretations of judges' rulings is causing alarm about its impact on the rule of law,
freedom of expression, as well as the Constitution."
CNN's senior political reporter Stephen Collinson joins us now for more analysis.
Stephen, always good to have you on. And you said something really important here. It's like in a more overt way than ever before, because it
is in our faces. We're seeing it playing out in real time in the White House.
[10:50:00]
And president Trump is not holding back on what he really thinks.
STEPHEN COLLINSON, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, the White House is taking aim at institutions that either contain loci of criticism of the
administration and the president or actually constrain his powers.
So that's why he's going after the law as he tries to push this hardline immigration agenda. He's clashing on those areas with the courts, many of
which have tried to constrain his action. We're seeing it with his attempt to dismantle the federal government. That has caused many legal challenges.
It's the same thing now that the Trump administration is going after universities. And Harvard University, which has started to push back, that
is an attempt, I think, to constrain opinion and free speech about the administration's priorities and what it's doing.
And, of course, the media, that is a daily way that the administration's actions are highlighted and exposed in front of the populace.
One thing I would say, however, is that this -- all of these institutions are regarded as liberal and are seen by many of Trump's supporters as being
guilty of their own kind of excesses.
So while, for the liberal establishments themselves, this is a feeling that they're under attack, this could actually be quite a politically popular
thing, at least for Trump's most loyal voters.
GIOKOS: And he's actually said he wants to dismantle the liberal establishment. And I guess this is the way he's doing it.
So media, it is universities and so forth. But I was quite interested in your piece and when you said that he sat with El Salvador's president
Bukele and branded himself as the, you know, the coolest dictator.
But also saying, well, listen, if an innocent man is stuck in the crosshairs of the immigration crackdown, then, you know, tough luck. We
can't get you back. We won't get you back, which I think is a really strong message in this -- in this administration.
COLLINSON: Yes, that's one of the characteristics of autocratic regimes is that individuals who are caught up in the political schemes of executives,
who want to be all powerful, don't really matter and their rights aren't important.
That, of course, runs counter to what the United States is supposed to be about, which is everyone has certain unalienable rights.
So you can see the clash here that many people see between what Trump is doing and universal values, the crackdowns on sources of learning, of the
media, of the courts of government departments that are seen as hostile to presidents.
That is also a core tactic of autocratic leaders. We've certainly seen it, for example, in the case of Viktor Orban in Hungary, who, like Bukele, is a
leader that Trump admires very much.
GIOKOS: All right. Stephen Collinson, great to have you with us. Thank you.
We're going to a very short break. We'll be right back with more CONNECT THE WORLD. Stay with. CNN.
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[10:55:00]
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GIOKOS (voice-over): And we haven't forgotten, as the Simple Minds' classic tune demands. Look at all those baby faces.
And can you believe it?
It's been four decades, four decades since "The Breakfast Club" was first released. Stars of the 1980s' coming-of-age film, directed by the late John
Hughes, reunited for the first time in 40 years.
It was over the weekend at Chicago's Comic and Entertainment Expo, a homecoming of sorts since it was filmed in Chicago. The cast, including
Molly Ringwald, Ally Sheedy, Judd Nelson and Emilio Estevez, were all there. Ringwald recalled how watching the film with her own kids changed
the way she parented.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GIOKOS: Well, that's it for CONNECT THE WORLD. Stay with CNN. "ONE WORLD" is up.
Next.
END
