Return to Transcripts main page

Connect the World

Aid Deliveries Face New Hurdles as Hunger Deepens in Gaza; Israel's Prime Minister Facing Pivotal Decision on Gaza; Bezos Wedding Weekend Underway with A-Listers, Protests; China Signals Approval of Rare Earth Mineral Deal with U.S.; Intelligent Future. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired June 27, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: Well, these are live pictures from Capitol Hill, where U.S. lawmakers are receiving a classified briefing

on Iran. It is 09:00 a.m. in Washington. It's 05:00 p.m. in Abu Dhabi from CNN's Middle East forecasting headquarters here. I'm Becky Anderson. This

is "Connect the World".

Well, the Health Ministry in Gaza says two more children died from malnutrition, as the struggle for Palestinians to get aid into the enclave

continues. And in Venice, the city prepares the hottest wedding of the summer as Amazon Founder Jeff Bezos and Lauren Sanchez gear up to tie the

knot.

And the stock market in New York opens about 30 minutes from now. And futures, indicating a flat to higher open more on that bottom of this hour.

Well, the U.S. House of Representatives today getting a classified briefing on the U.S. strikes on Iran, a day after a classified senate briefing.

Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth, Secretary of State, Marco Rubio and the Joint Chiefs Chair will talk to lawmakers about the effectiveness of the

strikes. These hearings happening as we are learning details about secret efforts by the Trump Administration to restart talks with Iran, including

floating the idea of allowing Iran access to up to $30 billion to build a civilian nuclear program that does not involve uranium enriched in Iran.

I want to bring in CNN's U.S. National Security Reporter Zachary Cohen, with that exclusive reporting. And these, it seems our secret efforts to

restart talks just explain what we have here.

ZACHARY COHEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yeah, Becky, the timeline here is really interesting, because we're told the key players from the

U.S. and the Middle East have been in contact with Iranian officials in the days since that fragile ceasefire between Iran and Israel was agreed to

earlier this week.

But this is a bit, has been described to us by sources as sort of a continuation of intense diplomatic discussions that really ramped up in the

immediate lead up to those U.S. military strikes on Iranian nuclear facilities over the weekend. And specifically, sources have described a

secret meeting that took place at the White House between Trump's top middle eastern envoy, Steve Witkoff and Gulf partners on Friday.

Again, 24 hours before that U.S. military operation where they really tried to put together a proposal that is aimed at trying to bring Iran and entice

Iran to come back to the negotiating table. And we're also told that the message the U.S., through intermediaries such as Qatar, has communicated to

Iran, is that they're still willing to come to the table under one non- negotiable condition, and that is no uranium enrichment in Iran.

But at the same time, several of these draft proposals that have been floating around and Trump officials say are preliminary and are evolving

constantly, do include incentives for Iran if they are willing to come back to the table. One of the biggest ones that we're told is access -- giving

Iran access to up to $30 billion for a civilian nuclear energy program.

This could even include, as one proposal, we're told, played out, include replacing the Fordow nuclear facility that the U.S. bombed over the weekend

as part of this new program. Other incentives have included easing sanctions against Iran as well as freeing up billions of dollars in

restricted Iranian funds.

So, some shades of the JCPOA Obama era agreement that President Donald Trump has criticized in the past, but some of these incentives that are

being mulled over by U.S. and Gulf partners do seem to have some overlap there. And look, it remains to be seen whether or not the U.S. and Iran

ultimately end up sitting down for direct talks.

That's something that we're told that there's still no firm date set for, despite President Donald Trump saying that talks would happen next week. It

remains to be seen, though, Steve Witkoff, the envoy that we were talking about who held the secret meeting, made clear yesterday, though, that the

U.S. does is seeking a comprehensive peace agreement with Iran, even after that military operation. Take a look or listen to what he said on

Wednesday.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY TO THE MIDDLE EAST: We're hopeful for a comprehensive peace agreement. We were hopeful when we first started

negotiations, it didn't quite work out that way. But today, we are hopeful. We've the signs are there, and we're hopeful for a comprehensive peace

agreement.

Now the issue and the conversation with Iran is going to be, how do we rebuild a better civil nuclear program for you that is non-enrichable,

very, very similar to the non-enrichment program that is in the UAE today, and that many, many other countries operate.

[09:05:00]

You don't need enrichment to run a nuclear energy program.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COHEN: So, some of the big challenges standing in the way of potential direct negotiations, beyond whether or not Iran will choose to come back to

the table, is this fragile ceasefire between Iran and Israel. Iran has made clear it will not negotiate with the U.S. as long as it's under fire.

And then there's the Israeli part of the equation, will Israel effectively hold off on continuing its attacks on Iran while the U.S. is seeking this

negotiating period? So, a lot of moving parts here. Becky, but at the end of the day, a very complicated and, as Witkoff said comprehensive agreement

that the U.S. is still trying to seek, even after it bombed Iran's nuclear facilities.

ANDERSON: Yeah, it's good to have you. Thank you very much indeed. All to Gaza. Well, the Palestinian Health Ministry says two more children have

died of malnutrition. It comes amid an even tighter squeeze on the provision of aid. On Thursday, the controversial Israeli back Gaza

Humanitarian Foundation was the only group allowed to distribute aid, an Israeli source told CNN.

Israel was frequently accused Hamas of stealing aid supplies, claiming used as justification for a months' long blockade earlier in the year, which has

resulted in spiraling levels of hunger. UN relief groups say there's no evidence that a significant amount of aid is being stolen.

CNN's Jeremy Diamond is live from Tel Aviv for us. The Trump Administration doubling down on its support for this controversial Gaza Humanitarian

Foundation, allocating $30 million dollars to the group. So, let's start with this first question, will this money help put food in the hands of

people who need it most?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, listen, there's no question that the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation has been able to feed some

Palestinians. There has been aid that has flowed through those distribution sites run by this private American organization with American security

contractors.

But what is equally clear right now in Gaza is that, that aid simply has not been enough to meet the enormous needs of the Palestinian people, and

also that distribution has been chaotic and that it has also led to the deaths of Palestinians, who while on their way to the sites, have come

under fire repeatedly, almost every single day over the past three weeks from the Israeli military.

We are now seeing the Trump Administration says they're going to allocate $30 million to this Gaza Humanitarian Foundation. They are going to be

repurposing a lot of that aid from funding that was previously for USAID. And they are, in addition to providing this funding, they are calling on

other countries to support the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation.

In fact, when asked whether or not they would pressure the Israeli government to allow aid to flow in from other humanitarian aid

organizations, they simply responded by emphasizing the Gaza Humanitarian Foundation, is the vehicle that should be bringing aid into Gaza, and that

it should be supported not only by the United States, but by other countries as well.

But it is clear at this point, after nearly a month of operations, that this Gaza Humanitarian Foundation simply is not meeting the needs of all

Palestinians in Gaza. The United Nations Office of Humanitarian Affairs says that nearly 500,000 Palestinians are now facing what they call

catastrophic levels of food insecurity.

We have seen as those humanitarian aid organizations have had their request to deliver aid to different parts of Gaza, particularly Northern Gaza,

repeatedly denied by the Israeli military, which is prioritizing its military operations over the flow of humanitarian aid to those areas.

And in fact, yesterday, the Israeli government didn't allow any aid to go into Gaza from non-Gaza Humanitarian Foundation sources. GHF was the only

group that was allowed to distribute aid in Gaza yesterday. This comes as we are seeing reports of looting of some of these aid trucks, as well as

some of these merchants and crime families in Gaza that are taking over the distribution of some of this aid.

A very chaotic situation that once again, only exists because of the limitations that have been imposed on aid going into Gaza by the Israeli

government.

ANDERSON: Yeah, very chaotic, as you rightly point out, Jeremy. Look as the ceasefire holds between Israel and Iran, and we await to see whether that

deal can provide some momentum, at least for talks to end this Gaza conflict.

[09:10:00]

The Israeli Air Force has struck aside in Southern Lebanon, allegedly used by Hezbollah. What more do we have on this? We've got any further details.

DIAMOND: Yeah, we have video of the incident, in fact, that shows a series of very large explosions just over the border in Southern Lebanon. This

happened in the mount shake area in which the Israeli military said they went after what they described as, quote, fire control and protection

systems of Hezbollah.

They say that it was part of an underground Hezbollah project which the Israeli military had previously struck, but that it now detected attempts

to rebuild it, according to the ceasefire agreement, Hezbollah is not meant to be operating south of the Litani River. And we have of course, seen the

Israeli military repeatedly go after Hezbollah targets in the months since that ceasefire agreement was struck.

Not only south of the Litani River, but also north of it, including two previous instances in which the Israeli military struck the Lebanese

Capital of Beirut, Becky.

ANDERSON: Good to have you sir. Well, Israel now facing a pivotal decision on its military strategy in Gaza, as it turns from Iran. In a recent

article for the "Financial Times", my next guest wrote, quote, wars are judged by how they conclude, Netanyahu has shown he doesn't know how to

bring war to a close.

I'm joined now by Veteran Foreign Correspondent Kim Ghattas. She's also a Contributing Editor for "The Financial Times" and a Contributing Writer for

"The Atlantic". It's good to have you, Kim, thank you for joining us. Benjamin Netanyahu framing the conflict with Iran as Israel's victory, and

he now says it opens the door to other peace agreements.

He's talking about Abraham Accords at this point, others talking about possibly one with Hamas. Bezalel Smotrich is his minister of defense, said,

quote, Mr. Prime Minister, let it be clear, you do not have a mandate, not even a hint of one or a lip service one. If there are countries that want

peace in exchange for peace, welcome.

If they want a Palestinian state, they can forget it. It won't happen. Do you see the opportunity for a tangible solution at this point on Gaza?

KIM GHATTAS, CONTRIBUTING WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: I think the words of Mr. Smotrich are quite telling, and they will be the sticking point to any

discussions with Gulf countries if the Israelis want countries like Saudi Arabia to come on board with other peace agreements between Israel and its

Arab neighbors.

Big moves, big sacrifices on the Israeli part towards the Palestinians, which include some form of a Palestinian state, are going to be a key

demand. I think the Saudi's have made it very, very clear that they want credible, irreversible steps towards a Palestinian State.

And whereas before October 7th, their demands for -- on the Palestinian front were somewhat limited, it's become very clear to them that they

cannot lower the bar. In fact, it's become quite a bit higher. Now, there is a lot of talk about -- Palestinian state, but something substantial and

sustainable, but it really depends on how Benjamin Netanyahu is going to go forward because a lot of Gulf countries are feeling irritated and

frustrated with his belligerence instead of his peace moves.

ANDERSON: And to your point, a high-level official just speaking to me, yesterday on background, just to suggesting that, you know, normalization

will not come without a Palestinian state. That is still absolutely the position of the Saudis. And as you point out, Gulf nations need, as does

the states at this point, you know, a partner to do business with.

And at the moment, there are many around this region who simply don't think that is Benjamin Netanyahu, who does certainly see some strength from the

operation in Iran, and may try to sort of leverage that with the drawdown of this conflict in Iran. Trump says that the road to expanding the Abraham

Accords is open. The fundamental issue of Gaza and the Palestinians, obviously hasn't been addressed.

[09:15:00]

Can you see countries in the first instance, like Saudi, Lebanon. Sorry, let me start again, like Syria, possibly Lebanon signing some sort of

normalization deal. I mean, we've already talked about how we believe that the Saudi simply, you know, aren't looking for that anytime soon. Do you

see more coming though?

GHATTAS: My short answer is no. I think Lebanon and Syria will come under a lot of pressure from the United States to sign some kind of agreement with

the Israelis, whether it's a security agreement or a normalization agreement. I don't see it happening. I know there are talks between the

Syrians and the Israelis on security issues, but you know, Lebanon is very far from agreeing to any peace deal with Israel.

I think the lead will have to be taken by the Saudis, they have some of their own demands, including towards the United States. I think they still

want their defense packed and so on. And I think it's important to point out, Becky, Saudi Arabia is not joining the Abraham Accords.

Saudi Arabia doesn't join anything. They want their own peace deal, normalization deal, whatever we want to call it, and they bring with them,

you know, 22 Arab countries and billions of Muslims. So Saudi Arabia will take the lead, and then Lebanon and Syria will potentially join that.

But the Israelis always try to do side deals. And it's been historical pattern with Israelis to do side deals that ignore the Palestinian

question. So, if Saudi Arabia is going to insist on a Palestinian state in return for normalization, or with establishing ties with Israel, the word

normalization is a little bit of an odd one.

It's become jargon, but establishing ties between Saudi Arabia and Israel. If that is a requirement of Saudi Arabia to have a Palestinian state, then

yes, the Israelis and the Americans are going to try to see whether they can pressure Lebanon and Syria into signing something with Israel.

I think that will be very difficult, despite all the pressure, and it will again ignore the core of this issue, the core of the problem, which is the

historical injustice done to Palestinians with the Israeli -- continued Israeli occupation and the devastation of two years of war, almost two

years of war in Gaza.

ANDERSON: I do want to talk about potential talks between the U.S. and Iran as well. All of this, of course, is connected an interview yesterday,

Iran's Foreign Minister responded to White House comments on talks. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ABBAS ARAGHCHI, IRANIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: No agreement has been made to resume negotiations now. I am stating clearly that no agreement has been

made, no promise has been made, nor have we talked to all about restarting negotiations, but the fact that we are examining among ourselves what is in

the interest of the Iranian people is another discussion. So far, there has been no agreement, no subject for negotiation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: The landscape today, of course, very different from that which it was two weeks ago before the Israeli strikes and consequent American

strikes on the nuclear facilities. Iran now not only pushing back on the possibility of talks, but pushing back on the possibility for the moment of

access by the IEA back into Iran to assess the state of the nuclear program and the infrastructure there. What options do you feel Iran has at the

moment? How do you read their calculus?

GHATTAS: I want to pick up on a few words that we just heard there. We will study what is in the interest of the Iranian people. I don't think the

Iranian regime is the leadership of the Islamic Republic is doing much in the interest of its own people. Otherwise, it would very quickly engage in

talks, make concessions on its nuclear program and lift so many of the restrictions and the oppressive measures it has taken against its people.

And I think it's important to point out, Becky, that at the moment, the Iranian people feel like they're, you know, a ball that is being tossed

around by their leadership, the Americans, the Israelis, the Gulf countries, and they've just lived through 12 days of horrific war, feeling

abandoned by the world, by their own leadership, even if we saw some sort of nationalism and rallying around because Iranians were not waiting to be

liberated by an Israeli bombing campaign.

[09:20:00]

And I think that the move towards a pushing for change from within the Iranian -- from within Iran has been set back. I suspect that the Iranian

regime will now clamp down even further, because its key goal is survival, and that's what they're going to be studying.

Should they make some concessions get access to those funds that have been frozen so that they can ensure their own survival. That's what there will

be looking at very closely how to achieve that.

ANDERSON: It's good to have you, always a pleasure. Kim, thank you.

GHATTAS: Thanks for having me, Becky.

ANDERSON: No, and I did mention that Smotrich was the defense of course, he is the Finance Minister of Israel. Just note that. All right, still to come

this hour. Beijing, signaling that it will approve a deal to export rare earth minerals to the United States. Asian stock markets have closed mixed

on the news, and we'll see how U.S. markets open to that news in about 20 minutes time.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON: Well Lalo Schifrin, the composer of the iconic "Mission Impossible" theme song has died. His son tells us the composer was battling

pneumonia. He passed away peacefully at his home in Los Angeles on Thursday. He was at 93 years old. In addition to the catchy "Mission

Impossible" tune, he wrote more than 100 arrangements for film and TV during what was his long and illustrious career.

Well, Jeff Bezos' wedding bash underway in Venice. Celebrity guests are, quite frankly, pouring into the floating city to celebrate the Amazon

Founder's nuptials to his fiance, Lauren Sanchez, among the A list celebrities attending. Oprah Winfrey, Actor Orlando Bloom, Singer Usher,

Kim and Khloe Kardashian, Ivanka Trump, the list goes on, but protesters are criticizing the excess of what some are calling the wedding of the

century.

Well CNN's Melissa Bell is live in Venice with more. It's been difficult to sort of work out just where all of the sort of moments around Venice are

likely to be this has been really kept under wraps. What have you seen and learned so far, and what's in store for this weekend?

MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, really Becky, we've just had to spend the last couple of days darting around the canals

on a small boat trying to figure out where to be now. I've had unhappier assignments to be clear. Right now, we've positioned ourselves here, and I

just want to give you a look at San Giorgio church back there.

That little island is where we expect Jeff Bezos and Lauren Sanchez to exchange rings, to exchange vows in about 2.5 hours, three hours' time. And

what we're learning little by little, because, as you suggest, Becky, they really kept everything under wraps in order to keep us away.

[09:25:00]

But also, the protesters over the course of this three-day extravaganza, what we're beginning to understand is that even as they tie the knot in

that extraordinary church behind me. They're going to be accompanied by Matteo Bocelli, the son, of course, of Andrea Bocelli, the pop opera

phenomenon so famous, not just in Italy, but around the world, his son will be accompanying them in music, even as they exchange their vows.

We're also getting a glimpse, by the way, about what's going to happen tomorrow. There has been so much speculation about who would perform.

You've seen the cast of celebrity guests and some of the questions this -- were about for the final parties on Saturday, which, by the way, are going

to coincide with some of the biggest protests we've seen yet.

That's what the protesters are threatening. We understand from our affiliate here in Venice that Lady Gaga will be performing tomorrow at the

arsenal, that part of Venice to which the final events have been moved they were planned at the Musee Caldia, which is a medieval church.

In fact, the protesters having threatened to jump into the canal to prevent guests from getting there, they had to move it to somewhere where they

could simply keep a closer eye and secure it make sure protesters stayed away. And of course, now that we understand Lady Gaga is going to be there,

you get an idea of how important it was that the show go on, Becky.

ANDERSON: It's good to have you. Like you say, there's been worse jobs. Good luck. Have a good weekend. Burglars have hit Brad Pitt's home in Los

Angeles. A law enforcement source tells CNN that three people break in for a front window late in Wednesday night and ransack the actor's place.

Police confirmed the break in but declined to name the victim. We don't know what the burglars took. CNN Affiliate KBC says Pitt was away doing

publicity for his upcoming movie. No one has been arrested. We're going to take a break at this point, back after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON: Well, the U.S. and China appear to have cleared a major obstacle in their trade war. Beijing is signaling that it will approve a deal to

export rare earth minerals to the United States. Well, the minerals had emerged as a big source of friction between the two nations. CNN's Marc

Stewart explains how weeks of negotiations might have paid off.

MARC STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: A major sticking point in this trade dispute appears to be resolved. The focus is on rare earth minerals, which

has been a point of leverage for Beijing. Businesses around the world, including American firms, depend on them to make things like consumer

electronics, electric vehicles, batteries, drones, even fighter jets.

[09:30:00]

China dominates the processing of these materials a 90 percent hold according to the International Energy Agency. It's basically been accused

of hoarding them, but now Beijing and the White House have reached a deal when it comes to access. On Thursday, President Trump, at a White House

event, said an agreement was signed with China.

Now, officials here in Beijing are confirming they're now on the same page. Previously, some restrictions were put in place by the U.S., including

export curbs on chip software, ethane and jet engines, while threatening to revoke the U.S. visas of Chinese students. The visa issue with Chinese

students was dropped recently.

This is all far from spontaneous. At one point, trade talks between the two nations hit an impasse. In recent weeks, we've seen a phone call between

President Trump and Chinese Leader Xi Jinping, as well as more face-to-face talks between these two economic superpowers in London.

A mixed day in markets on Friday, at least here in Asia, this has been an ongoing strain for both Wall Street and Main Street in recent months. Marc

Stewart, CNN, Beijing.

ANDERSON: Well, you saw the opening bell in New York, and as Marc brought up, got his bang up to date from Beijing, let's see how these markets are

settling into what is the end of the week trading day, of course. And futures were indicating a sort of flat to slightly better open, and that

indeed is what we've got.

In fact, I was watching these Asian markets and the futures markets when we got that news out of China. And I have to say, there hasn't been an

enormous amount of response to this. Perhaps it was baked in with investors. Anyway, we'll keep our eye on those markets and let you know how

they're getting on.

Right up next, TeamLab's, innovative approach to art and technology, opening an immersive new experience in Abu Dhabi, that is up next in our

"Intelligent Future" series.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON: Right, TeamLab phenomena. Abu Dhabi, a new art museum showcasing large scale interactive installations that evolve dynamically in response

to light, air and water, providing visitors with what is a truly unique multi-sensory experience. In the fourth episode of CNN's "Intelligent

Future" series, I spoke with Takashi Kudo, who is the co-founder of the art collective teamLab, which is behind what is these remarkable immersive

experiences. Have a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON: The room like this. You imagine the space. You create the space.

TAKASHI KUDO, COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR OF TEAMLAB: Yeah.

ANDERSON: And then you evolve the artwork through technology.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: You've obviously got this innate curiosity.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: I came through teamLab phenomena on the opening night, and it was quite the experience. How did the art collective begin? Just talk me

through its genesis.

KUDO: The story started on 2001 when we graduate universities, five friends --

ANDERSON: -- in Tokyo.

KUDO: In Tokyo. And actually, some honesty -- we couldn't enter any company in Japan, and we wanted to be with friends as long as possible. So, we

tried to make something new.

ANDERSON: So, you started off as a group of mates, basically from different backgrounds, from engineering, from robotics, from background in

philosophy. How did you move from what was a niche sort of art collective to what is now a global force? It's a remarkable story.

KUDO: It was a super big challenge for us, 2001 it's, you know, of course, that we wanted to do some things, but it's our technologies, and it's now

the system was, it's not enough to make it, so try to make all this, you know, slowly, slowly, try and error, and try and errors. And it's, you

know, all the output of what we've done.

It's in a stock. Most useful example is like, you know, I really like Louisville, Abu Dhabi. We can see the how did the human evolved? I don't

know. Like, from the beginnings, it was very simple. Somebody needed, or somebody wanted somethings, and it's tried to make over this new shape or

new like material to make somethings. And I said technology is almost same.

ANDERSON: So, you grew up here in Abu Dhabi.

KUDO: Yes.

ANDERSON: I mean, you were born in Tokyo, but you grew up.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: What sort of impact did that period of your life have on you?

KUDO: Of course, it's affected me so much. My father is a geologist, and he took me years, and he was working for this and oil company, I signed up

engineers, and was like, four years, something like that. And there was even no Japanese school here. And I really strongly remembered one day, my

father, and it's my mom, to took me to the -- desert, and we camping.

And 4 o'clock the morning, 5 o'clock the morning, I don't remember, but they say it's a super early morning, and it was cold outside, and it was

quite dark. Suddenly it started to hear the sound of these creatures waking up. And it's the sky started to be its a, you know, little bit changes the

colors.

It's very hard to explain by words, but it at times I really felt I am very tiny existence. But it's -- I am one part of this world, I think in the

first moment, I started to have interest, with quite a good curiosity, of this world.

ANDERSON: My sense is, well, as I understand it, no two people will get the same experience in these galleries.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: And these are galleries.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: At the end of the day.

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: I mean, we are in a museum or an art installation. Can you just explain in work, in terms I will understand, as somebody who's not imbued

in the world of mathematics and technology, how AI and machine learning digital technology has created this space?

KUDO: There is two ways, basically. We human going to go to the imagination world, for imagination world to bring to do it like in our physical world.

And I say no, to go to the imagination world. It's like, it's much more like, we're going to use all these, VR Googles, and it's, I can really try

to be inside with that.

And it's maybe in that perspective of the future, it's like, you know, maybe Matrix, or like, Ghost in the Shell, or whatever it's like that.

We're going to -- its connected to the HNO, like, digital world of this now -- there, but instead of that, we are interested in how to expand this

physical world to be imagination world.

ANDERSON: You talk about borderless world, right?

KUDO: Yeah, because the technology is focusing on how to expand this in our humanities.

[09:40:00]

But we are much more interested in how to expand with this physical world itself. We are very much interested in the kind of relationship between

human and the world and what is word for us. At least me, I understand the world is much more physically as, for example, like, I really like the

camping.

And especially with my sons, I try to teach them such and what is a forest. I try to explain by words, and I try to explain it showing the movie and

the stuff, but it's the best way is, you know, just go to the Ethan Forest and the camping and try to make all the fires. So, like we want to make the

people to understand the world more physically.

ANDERSON: You're not suggesting that this is a replacement for the real world, right?

KUDO: Yeah.

ANDERSON: I mean, this is just at the end of the day, an art installation. You're an art collective. This is a real challenge to people's traditional

perception of art.

KUDO: Yeah. Actually, one of this roles of Latin art is how to expand our perceptions. The art isn't, you know, I think it doesn't solve any

problems, but it's an art is just on your questions, and it's more like a design, or it's like a logic, or it's low, and these things is more

answers.

So, it's the artists made of these questions, and it's some smarter people try to make of this, you know, like an answer, and try to make of this

societies, maybe even after 10, 20 years later if our output, it could lead to the people's heart, and some smarter people, it's made with something

it's, you know, like, right, better word. And many people maybe call it an art.

ANDERSON: There has been criticism. This is ultimately a bit of a sugar rush, not really leaving any sort of long term, emotional sort of

connection to the artworks. What do you say to those critics?

KUDO: Yeah, I love any critics, because they teach me it's so many things, and for me, like this physical world is like in a sugar rush already.

ANDERSON: So, you say real life is a sugar rush, right?

KUDO: Yeah. We cannot take everything through this channel, too much. So, we need to pick up the subjective issues from this world that is something

very much fundamental part of what we believe.

ANDERSON: Thank you very much.

KUDO: Thank you very much.

ANDERSON: This is a remarkable --

KUDO: Thank you so much.

ANDERSON: Amazing. Congratulations.

KUDO: Thank you very much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON: -- back after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:45:00]

(WORLD SPORT)

[10:00:00]

END