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Trump & Zelenskyy Meet Days After Trump-Putin Summit; Ukrainians Bury War Victims as Zelenskyy Heads to White House; Trump Pressures Zelenskyy to Agree to Terms, End War; Egyptian FM, Palestinian PMVisit Egyptian Side of Rafah Crossing; Arsenal Beat Man United 1-0 to Open Title Campaign. Aired 9-9:45a ET

Aired August 18, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAULA NEWTON, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: Well, you're looking at live pictures from the White House, where President Trump will be hosting

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy in just a few hours from now. It is 09:00 a.m. in New York. I'm Paula Newton, and this is "Connect the World".

Also coming up for us. Our Becky Anderson went to the Rafah crossing in Egypt that's just outside Gaza. She spoke with the Egyptian Foreign

Minister and took a tour of the much-needed aid trucks for Gaza. Also, ahead a look inside a Texas and California National redistricting fight.

More on what this could mean for U.S. political power and you we are just about to have the opening in New York in about 30 minutes from now. I can

tell you, our traders on edge, even though those markets are close to records, wondering to see what the fallout will continue to be from the

U.S. trade war.

Now, in the meantime, in just a few hours, Ukraine's President will make a return visit to the White House to meet U.S. President Donald Trump. Now,

unlike his disastrous first visit to the Oval Office in February, so many of you will remember this exchange, Volodymyr Zelenskyy will have backup

this time.

A host of European leaders also going to the White House today in a show of unity with Ukraine. What will happen in these meetings is so far unclear.

On Sunday night, President Trump posted on social media that President Zelenskyy should agree to give up Crimea and to never join NATO.

Both conditions Russian President Vladimir Putin has set for ending this war. Now earlier U.S. Special Envoy Steve Witkoff told CNN that Putin

agreed to what would cost calls robust security guarantees for Ukraine, and that was during that summit in Alaska last Friday. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

STEVE WITKOFF, U.S. SPECIAL ENVOY: What we're trying to accomplish on Monday is get some consensus from President Zelenskyy and his team. We had

some really good, specific, granular conversation on the plane ride home with President Zelenskyyabout what he would be seeking. And we don't think

that there are any obstacles in that conversation that we heard.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NEWTON:And this is our starting point for what is going to be an incredibly, busy few hours ahead. Clare Sebastian is following developments

in London. Ben Wedeman, though, is in Kyiv. Ben, we have to say Ukraine, this was predictable, enduring more deadly attacks from Russia.

I do want to point out that I've seen you speaking to Ukrainians, and I'm really curious to know, what are their expectations from the meeting today,

that they have to be more than a little bit nervous.

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: They are very nervous about this meeting that's going to take place in the White House today. And

in fact, if you look at the White House schedule, President Zelenskyy is going to be meeting one on one with President Trump, of course, with his

aides, but the European leaders aren't scheduled to be brought in until later.

So, there is a worry that, yet again, President Zelenskyy could get mugged in the White House. Although certainly the fact that those European leaders

are so nearby perhaps will dissuade President Trump and his aides from doing that yet again. Yes, we were at a funeral in Kyiv for a Ukrainian

soldier, one David Chichkan, who was a very popular Kyiv artist who was killed by a Russian drone on the Eastern Front earlier this month.

And we spoke to people there about their concerns, their worries in the hours before this meeting in Washington is going to take place. And of

course, everybody is well aware of this social media posting by President Trump overnight in which he said, you've got to give up.

He forgets about Crimea that he said that President Zelenskyy can end this war almost immediately, if he wants. And of course, the whole idea of

surrendering land, for many people we spoke to does not sound like a recipe for peace.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SASHKO, FILMMAKER: It's a fake peace. It just --it's like only the word that Donald Trump can use. But it doesn't look like a peacefor the

Ukrainians. You can't trade, you know, lives of Ukrainian people, our lands and our values, just for Donald Trump's desire to make business as usual

with the Russians.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[09:05:00]

WEDEMAN: And of course, the talking about Syria giving up land to the Russians that is currently under Ukrainian control, areas that I spent a

lot of time in and saw just how many sacrifices the Ukrainians have made to try to hold on to that land against this Russian onslaught.

Now, somebody else at that funeral today put it rather sort of bluntly. He said that if Ukraine stops fighting, there will be no more Ukraine. If

Russia stops fighting, there will be no war, Paula.

NEWTON: Yeah, certainly points that are not missed on people who are allied with Ukraine and hoping that they can reach a critical peace in the days

and weeks ahead. Clare, we'll pick up where Ben left off there. I mean, European leaders have been careful to compliment President Trump and thank

him for his efforts towards peace.

And yet, there have to be points on which they will have no choice but to speak up. What are those points in terms of where they diverge from the

U.S. position?

CLARE SEBASTIAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, it's interesting, Paula, because clearly there are a couple of points. And we had from a Downing Street

spokesperson earlier today who noted, for example, that there is only one person who is able to end this war in any moment, and that's Putin

obviously a key principle.

And then said Ukraine is on an irreversible path to NATO, which, of course, we know is also the NATO position, but it is very delicate, and I think

that's why you see in that lineup of European leaders, not just those distinguished by their prominence in Europe, but also those who've had a

famously good relationship with Trump in the past.

We've got Keir Starmer, who's got Trump arriving in a couple of weeks for what he's called an unprecedented second state visit. We've got Mark Rutte,

the NATO Secretary General, who just launched that now infamous charm offensive at the NATO summit in June.

You know, Alexander Stubb of Finland, who is seen by Trump, is a very good golfer, has played golf with him in the past. So, these are all

essentially, I think, counterpoints to allow Zelenskyy to stand his ground to avoid being backed into a corner and mortgaging the principles, frankly,

that his country has spent 3.5 years fighting for.

But I think, look, we reading between the tea leaves of what the European leaders are going to push for, we see really an emphasis on security

guarantees. The one potential glimmer of hope that came out of Alaska for Ukraine is that the U.S., according to Steve Witkoff, may now be involved

in future security guarantees for Ukraine.

Not really any mention in any of the commentary that's come out ahead of this from the Europeans, of the sequencing of a ceasefire and then a

settlement. Obviously, we know that Trump seems to have backed away from any idea of a ceasefire first and is now supporting a settlement.

But look, this is not going to be for these European Leaders, peace at any cost. Take a listen to Keir Starmer, the British Prime Minister, on the

plane over.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KEIR STARMER, BRITISH PRIME MINISTER: We've got to make sure there is peace, that it is lasting peace, and that it is fair and that it is just,

and that's why I'm traveling to Washington with other European Leaders to discuss this, face to face with President Trump and President Zelenskyy,

because it's in everyone's interests. It's in the UK's interest that we get this right.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SEBASTIAN: So, like all of this coming as President Trump seems in an even bigger rush, frankly, than before, telling European leaders he is looking

to hold a trilateral meeting between Zelenskyy and Putin and himself as soon as Friday. So, I think that's why you see this major show of force.

Frankly, from the Europeans all you know, upending their schedules in August, flying over to Washington to present this show of solidarity and

strength, lest, you know, Ukraine be the one under pressure once again, and of course, back at the scene of the Oval Office meeting in February, they

want to have Zelenskyy's back.

NEWTON: Yeah, an important point given of theatrics and what can go on in the Oval Office, which will be happening just a few hours from now. Ben

Wedeman in Kyiv, Sebastian in London. Grateful to both of you. I do want to bring in Dan Rice. He's the Former Special Advisor to Ukraine's Commander

in Chief.

Dan is now live for us in New York. Really grateful to have you. And I do want to pick up on Europe's goals here, because, to make a fine point of

it, the burden is theirs, right? It doesn't matter what the White House negotiates, it is Europe that will have to shoulder now both the cost and

compliance of any kind of peace deal with Russia.

So, picking up where Clare left off. Where do you believe Europe can draw the line with President Trump?

DAN RICE, FORMER SPECIAL ADVISOR TO UKRAINE'S COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF: Well, thanks for having me on, Paula. And I really think that this is an amazing

event to have all of these world leaders converge on Washington, D.C., simultaneously in such a short notice.

It shows how Ukraine is their top priority in August, which is usually vacation lunch in Europe. I think the Europeans are really adamant to have

one. Ukraine is going to be the decider of its future, and so President Zelenskyy and parliament will decide what is reasonable and acceptable.

I think the two biggest things are security guarantees for Ukraine, and then land who, where the lines are drawn. And those are the two major

points.

[09:10:00]

The third thing after that, a lower priority, but still important, is who is going to provide an international force after the conflict is over, and

we need an international force to prevent this ever happening again.

NEWTON: Yeah, you know it's interesting, because the UK has already said they may be willing, and yet that appears to be, again, a red line for

President Putin no European troops on the ground. I do want to get to presidential Envoy Steve Witkoff, hetold CNN making a lot of news, really,

about those robust security guarantees that you just mentioned.

And then I want to say Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, the U.S. Ambassador to NATO, coaching this a bit and saying, look, there's no detailed plan yet

for security guarantees. What does Ukraine need to see? Because to me, that would seem a deal breaker from the beginning, if you're President

Zelenskyy, getting into that oval office in the next few hours.

RICE: It's 100 percent a deal breaker. Ukraine cannot accept any peace in which it reduces its military as Putin wants or is at all exposed or

weakened. The whole reason for fighting, Ukraine has lost 50,000 dead, which is the equivalent of the U.S. losing about 500,000 dead per capita.

It's an enormous loss. They didn't go through this to give up their security. They need security. The Europeans know that the Europeans have a

self-interest in providing security for Ukraine. And so, security is going to be the top subject of both sides, Putin and the European side.

But I do think that President Trump has forced this issue so that it is getting to negotiating stage, which had never been in 3.5 years. So that is

incredible progress. The fact that there could be a trilateral meeting later this week, that is incredible progress. Now both sides are going to

be hitting each other hard on offensive operations to try to gain an advantage prior to these trilateral negotiations.

So, expect this week,last night, the Russians bombed SUNY State University. They bombed and they are hitting Ukraine hard on civilians, innocent

civilians, so they continue to commit war crimes. During the discussions in Alaska, they sent 85 drones against civilian targets. So, Russia is not

letting up.

Ukraine is not letting up on the military side, but you should expect this week there will be major offensive operations and hopefully a lot of

strikes into Russia, and that is something that didn't happen in the first couple of years. Now, Ukraine has the capabilities to strike deep in

Russia, and that is hurting Putin's economy, and it's hurting his military.

Putin has lost a third of his bomber fleet, a third of his Black Sea Fleet, 1 million men killed or wounded. Russia is getting hit hard, and Ukraine is

only increasing the OPtempo.

NEWTON: Yeah. And not to mention the fact that the Head of the Central Bank has also said in Russia, has said, look, this cannot go on forever, and

there is going to be adversity ahead for that Russian economy. I do want to bring in the UK Prime Minister, Former Prime Minister, Boris Johnson to a

reminder to folks here, look, he is a strong ally of both President Zelenskyy and Ukraine.

But also, he has gotten along well with President Trump, and he writes the most vomit inducing episode in all of the tawdry history of international

diplomacy. It made the gorge rise to see Putin welcomed on American soil. This is where he threads the needle, though.

Quote, puke making, though it was, Trump was right to try. He was right to meet Putin, because if millions of Ukrainians were watching with horror at

the red-carpet rehabilitation of the Russian tyrant, they were also watching with hope. I want to get your thoughts on that?

And look, I hear you. You already said that President Trump has really achieved something that other leaders have not been able to, at least get

to a point of talking.

RICE: Yes, it's that incident, the whole red carpet. It is for Ukrainians. It's nauseating. It was horrible for them to see the murderous, genocidal

leader that is attacking civilians be welcomed. But on the other hand, we've never had a madman with nuclear weapons like this on offensive

operations, and it's a very delicate to say the least situation.

President Trump is trying to thread the needle of getting Putin to the table. And with a madman, you don't insult him, you don't humiliate him in

public, because you know what happens more innocent Ukrainians die publicly. You meet with them, as he did privately.

Hopefully he said, we're going to crush your economy and we're going to crush your military,if you don't come to the table, that's where you have

you have it. You don't do it publicly. Unfortunately, we'd all like to see Putin hanging from a rope, from a lamp pole, immediately, but that's not

going to happen.

What we have to do is deal with a madman right now who started a war, and we need to finish the war, and in the best interest, the Ukrainians have a

secure peace. So many have sacrificed so much, but a secure peace with international force so that this never happens again.

We can't have like 1994 have a paper memorandum, like the Budapest Memorandum, saying, we'll support you. UK, I'll support you. We need to

have real security, and that includes potentially French nuclear weapons on Ukrainian soil. And that has been proposed by Macron.

NEWTON: Yeah, so many things that work here, including the European nuclear umbrella. And as you mentioned, the Budapest Memorandum, right?

[09:15:00]

The U.S. in 94 in fact, guaranteed Ukraine's sovereignty and said they would stand up for that when they gave up their nuclear weapons. Dan Rice,

you've really set the table for a very sobering meeting that will be ahead in the coming hours at the Oval Office. And grateful to you for that.

Appreciate it.

RICE: Thanks -- Very excited to see a potential but very positive outcome from today.

NEWTON: Yeah, hopefully the Ukrainians do have some hope in the future. Appreciate it. Now, displacement is a red line. We will not accept it.

Those the words of Europe's Foreign Minister speaking exclusively to CNN's Becky Anderson about Gaza and Israel's plan to displace some 1 million

Palestinians in that territory.

Now, just a short time ago, Badr Abdelatty and the Palestinian Authority's Prime Minister made a joint visit to the Rafah border crossing on the

Egyptian side, often seen as Gaza's lifeline for getting aid into that conclave, enclave, pardon me. Both officials held a news conference at the

crossing scene, and Becky Anderson was there and sent us this exclusive report.

(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN ANCHOR, CONNECT THE WORLD: You join me on the Egyptian side of the Rafah border crossing, and behind me here are trucks that are

filled with humanitarian aid waiting to get across this border. Just meters away, of course, is Gaza, the drivers, though, telling us that some of them

have been here for some 20 days waiting for access.

And these trucks just part of what I'm told by the Egyptians are some 5000 trucks waiting to get access. Now the Egyptian government, at present, is

under huge pressure to do more to alleviate the suffering and hunger of Gazans on the other side of this border. I traveled here with the Egyptian

Foreign Minister.

And I asked him what his response is to critics who say they are simply one not doing enough, and further that they are complicit in the blocking of

aid. This is what he told me.

BADR ABDELATTY, EGYPTIAN FOREIGN MINISTER: What's inputs made by some circles is a big lie. You have two terminals, one on the Egyptian side,

which is open, and the Palestinian terminal. The Israelis destroyed the Palestinian terminal four times, and we tried to rehabilitate. The Israelis

now, physically, they are on the Palestinian terminal of the Rafah crossing, and they are looking in.

They are not allowing any single truck or person to move in, because Israel is the main country which is blocking and putting restrictions on the floor

of humanitarian and Dominican.

ANDERSON: What's the point of having a peace agreement? Think he can't negotiate at.

ABDELATTY: Well, of course, the point of having peace treaty with Israel -- that this is the main pillar of stability in our neighborhoods. We have

contacts with them on the security level, on the intelligence level, and we are working very hard with them. The problem is, you know, sometimes, and

they are saying on the political level, the lack of political will to work out again, this the main impediment.

ANDERSON: We're here with the Egyptian and Palestinian delegations, who are extremely eager to counter any criticism or protest about what is being

done from the Egyptian side. President Sisi has said that this Rafah will be a gateway for aid, but it will not be a gateway for displacement.

ABDELATTY: You know, displacement is a red line. We will not accept it, we will not participate in it, and we will not allow it to be happening

because displacement. First of all, there is no moral, ethical or legal or political reason for that. Those people are attached to their homeland, why

we should state them from their homeland, this one issue.

Second issue, the displacement is one way ticket. I can assure you, those who will leave Gaza, they will never be allowed to go back to Gaza. And

that meant to have one objective, the liquidation of the Palestinian cause that's will give the hand of the senior call.

ANDERSON: What is needed, of course, to get this humanitarian aid moving, to get the hostages out and to get towards a sort of final solution, is a

ceasefire.

[09:20:00]

But when I asked the Egyptian Foreign Minister whether he was optimistic about the current round of talks. He said that he'd given up using the term

optimistic. Becky Anderson, CNN at the Rafah border crossing.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

NEWTON:And we are grateful to Becky, for that. You can see her full interview with Egypt's Foreign Minister tomorrow on the show that's at

05:00 p.m. in Abu Dhabi, 09:00 a.m. here in New York. Now continuing on with this story, as anger grows inside Israel over the war in Gaza, the

country's former military intelligence chief can be heard on a leaked recording saying the deaths of tens of thousands of Palestinians in Gaza

are, quote, necessary and required for future generations.

This follows massive protests right across Israel on Sunday some of the largest since the beginning of the Gaza war. Nearly two years ago, hundreds

of thousands of demonstrators took to the streets calling on Israel's government to secure the release of the 50 hostages still held in Gaza.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TAMAR MERIN, ISRAELI PROTESTER: I'm here today because this is our last chance to stop the insanity, stop the war, stop the government from

sacrificing our hostages, sacrificing many more soldiers, sacrificing basically us and the Palestinian people for its own political gain.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NEWTON: CNN's Oren Liebermann is in Jerusalem for us. Oren, you know I saw you were at the protest, and it was an incredibly large turnout. But I have

to ask you, what are the prospects for changing Netanyahu's mind on this and ending an operation in Gaza that as far as we understand, it's full

steam ahead on that for the Netanyahu government?

OREN LIEBERMANN, CNN JERUSALEM BUREAU CHIEF: That's perhaps one of the most stunning parts of this protest. Organizers say it was 400,000 or more than

that, many people in hostages square on Sunday evening and the surrounding streets, which is one of the largest we've seen since the beginning of the

war.

They say across the whole day of events in this grassroots effort, which came together only a week ago, it was about a million Israelis, which is 10

percent of the country, 1 in 10 people. So, you get a sense of the passion, the energy and the determination they have on calling on their government

to bring the remaining hostages, home and end the war.

And yet, for all of that, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and his far- right allies were absolutely dismissive of everything we saw. They dismissed it as strengthening Hamas and pushed for and are continuing to

pursue an escalation of the war with a takeover and occupation of Gaza City, trying to tell the Israelis that's the quickest way to end the war

and bring home the remaining hostages.

But as you can see, and more than see, you could feel on the streets last night, that's not a position or an argument that has gone over well at all.

A lot of this pushed, especially since Israel approved that takeover and occupation of Gaza City. They see that the protesters, that is, see that as

a death sentence for the remaining 20 hostages who are expected to be alive.

And that's why they promised that it wasn't just yesterday that we saw such a massive effort. They hope to keep this up and continue this. Does it

affect Netanyahu calculus? At least not yet. We haven't seen a shift, but their goal is to show not only the country but also the world, that Israel

is calling for the return of the hostages and an end to the war.

NEWTON: Yeah,it is an incredible turnout. We are looking at pictures of that now. Oren about that audio recording. What is the significance?

Because it is a tacit admission, right that civilians in Gaza would pay a heavy price for the actions of Hamas.

LIEBERMANN: It isstriking remarks from the Former Head of Israeli Military Intelligence, Major General Aharon Haliva. It's worth pointing out that he

was the first senior Israeli officer to resign after October 7th, taking the responsibility. A lot of this leaked audio recording is him trying to

shift the blame to other security agencies, the Shin Bet and elsewhere.

But in some of the most striking remarks here, he said, 50,000 Palestinians dead in Gaza is quote necessary. Let me read you part of these audio

recordings. He says, for everything that happened on October 7th, for every one person on October 7th, 50 Palestinians must die. It doesn't matter now,

if they are children.

The fact that there are already 50,000 dead in Gaza is necessary and required for future generations. In a statement to Israel's channel 12,

which is who aired this leaked audio, Haliva then said, this was supposed to be private conversations. And there's more context here, but it's

difficult to interpret this any other way, especially as Israel is facing growing condemnation for the military's conduct in Gaza.

Accusations of intentional starvation, war crimes and genocide, accusations that Israel has vehemently denied, and yet the criticism from around the

world keeps on coming, most recently from the Danish Prime Minister, who said Netanyahu has become a problem within himself.

Worth pointing out that Hamas also condemned the remarks, saying, quote, it confirms that crimes against our people are high level decisions and

official policy from the enemy's political and security leadership.

[09:25:00]

Paula, it's not clear exactly when the remarks were made, but the death toll in Gaza according to the Palestinian Ministry of Health surpassed

50,000 several months ago. So, these remarks are still fairly recent.

NEWTON: Recent, and as you say, quite striking. Oren Liebermann for us in Jerusalem, appreciate it, and we will be back with more news. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. ALEX PADILLA (D-CA): They're rigging the lines. They're rigging the system. They're trying to rig next year's election, and California is not

going to stand for it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

NEWTON: That's California U.S. Senator Alex Padilla rallying the troops to go toe to toe with Texas if it passes a Trump backed plan to redraw

congressional districts ahead of next year's midterms. Now, party control of the U.S. House may be at stake. Texas state Democratic lawmakers halted

a special session on redistricting earlier this month by actually flying out of the state just hiding to try and prevent a quorum.

Since then, California has stepped into the fray. Democratic Governor Gavin Newsom promised his state won't hesitate to offset any gains in the U.S.

House seats by Texas Republicans with new maps of its own. Arlette Saenz is following all of this for us, live from Austin.

And I am curious as to why the Democrats seem to be coming back here. And what about this gaming of the system and where it goes next?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Paula, the Texas House Democrats have outlined two conditions for their return back to Austin, one

of those being the end of the first special session, which ended on Friday. And then another is for California to officially introduce their maps in

the state.

The California legislator is set to convene a bit later this afternoon. So, both of those conditions now pave the way for these Texas House Democrats

to return. They could be back in the capital here in Austin in a little over three hours, when the House is set to reconvene.

And once a quorum is met, that will kick off the legislative process here in the Texas House, as this bill will make its way through the committee,

back to the floor for debate and votes, and Texas Democrats have vowed that they will use the coming days to really push back and fight against this in

the messaging battle.

But they're also conceding that they do believe this will eventually pass, and one of the things they will be looking forward to in the coming weeks

is the expected legal challenges that they will be filing against these maps in Texas. But even as you have all this action here in Texas, the

California state legislator is expected to move forward with their maps, potentially approving them on Thursday.

But the big difference between California and Texas is that here in Texas, these lawmakers can make the decisions, but in California, this will have

to go to, for a vote before the population in the state in November, and you already have Republicans vowing they are going to push back on that

ballot initiative in the fall months.

[09:30:00]

So, there is a lot of fighting that still is expected to happen out in California, but clearly both of these redistricting battles with Texas

Governor Greg Abbott kicking it off, first here in Texas and Newsome in California trying to counteract that, it's really setting up some high

stakes moments, especially when you think about the makeup of the next U.S. Congress for the second half of President Donald Trump's term.

NEWTON: Yeah, and depending on what happens in those next midterms, a lot at stake. In fact, some would say the whole bowl game. Arlette Saenz for

us. Grateful to you. Still ahead for us, three years since its invasion of Ukraine, Russia's economy is showing signs of strain. We talked to a former

adviser to Vladimir Putin about Russia's economic future. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

NEWTON: So, hours from now, Ukraine's President will be surrounded by key European allies as he gets ready to meet with President Donald Trump at the

White House. There are signs, though, that Russia's economy is beginning to falter from the strain of three years of war.

Earlier this summer, Moscow's Economic Minister warned the country was, quote, on the brink of recession. Meantime, Russia's budget deficit is

growing and oil revenues are falling, as President Trump warns he will slap India with a massive 25 percent secondary tariff if it continues getting

its oil from Russia.

Moscow is currently New Delhi's largest crude oil supplier. To discuss all of this. Andrei Illarionov, he's a Russian Economist and Former Advisor to

Vladimir Putin. He's also a Senior Analyst for Russian and European Affairs at the Center for Security Policy. Really good to have you today, because

this really does dictate whether or not Putin will continue to prosecute this war, as he has in the last 2.5 years.

The Head of Russia's Central Bank put the health of the Russian economy in stark focus as well. Last month, she said, we have adapted to some external

challenges, but this is key. We are facing very turbulent times ahead. What is she getting at there, and how much significance do you believe Vladimir

Putin puts on the health of his economy?

ANDREI ILLARIONOV, SENIOR ANALYST FOR RUSSIAN & EUROPEAN AFFAIRS AT THE CENTER FOR SECURITY POLICY: Nice to see you, Paula. Thank you for inviting

me. I think it's a very important issue for Putin for all his quarter of century that he is at the helm of the Russian power. It is still very

important issue for him today, during these 3.5 wide scale war against Ukraine that he is waging. Nevertheless, with all problems that Russian

economy is having right now.

[09:35:00]

It is not something that can limit his willingness and resourcefulness to continue his aggression against Ukraine, against Europe and frankly

speaking against the United States. I would like to underscore that the current economic growth of Russia is 1.5, 1.6 percent compared to the

previous year.

It's much lower than it was in 24, when it was more than 4 percent, but at the same time, it is not recession -- yes, recession yet. Yes, the risk of

recession exists, but it is not recession yet first and second, even with recession, Putin will not stop and Putin will not stop his aggression

against Ukraine and against the rest of the world.

NEWTON: And that's important context there, right? Because many believe they thought, in fact, at the beginning of this war, that crippling Russia

economically would actually have an effect. Not only has that not happened, as you say, even economic adversity won't stop him.

So, I need to ask you, then about these secondary sanctions. Now, there is no guaranteeing that the United States will even agree to them, but if they

do, do you believe that can have an impact on Vladimir Putin's decisions?

ILLARIONOV: It would have some impact if they would happen. So, as you are absolutely correctly mentioned, it's not a guarantee that they will be

introduced, but even if they will be implemented, it will have some impact on, probably some limitations of some expert earnings on the Russian side,

but will not affect decisions of Putin, his process of continuing his aggression.

I need to tell just once again that over the last 3.5 years of this open aggression against Ukraine, Russia received more than 800 billion U.S.

dollars as foreign exchange earnings. So, this number of resources is quite enough to continue this aggression. With any secondary sanctions or

tertiary sanctions, Putin will be able to continue this war essentially endlessly.

The only way to do something in the area of sanctions is to do something differently to do what I call it smart sanctions. What does it mean smart

sanctions? It means introducing is a particular share of expert earnings from Russia, especially from fuel experts, and to redirect those earnings

to Ukraine to finance civil reconstruction efforts, as well as probably to some extent, the defensive actions of Ukraine.

Just it is something different to force Russia to finance defensive actions of Ukraine against Russian aggression.

NEWTON: Andrei, I don't have a lot of time left, but given what you call smart sanctions, India and China, they must be brought on side for those to

work, right?

ILLARIONOV: Not necessarily, not necessarily, we understand that China is not going to help Ukraine. China took its position to some kind of

accurately, to help Russia, not publicly, not very loudly. But Chinese position is very clear, so they do not want to see Russia to be defeated.

Indian position is much more position of neutrality. So that is what it is, quite difficult to force these two countries to work on the side of Western

countries, European countries, United States, on the side of Ukraine. So that is why we need to understand that we need to use this situation.

NEWTON: Right.

ILLARIONOV: And those resources that Chinese, Indians or somebody else is paying to Russia.

NEWTON: Right.

ILLARIONOV:Would be paid, not in full, to Putin.

NEWTON: Understood.

ILLARIONOV: But especially to Ukraine.

NEWTON: OK, on there, we have to leave it there. Really grateful for your insights, though important as they are, appreciate it.Ahead for us in

sports, rivals square off to open the English Premier League Season. How Arsenal came out on top against Man U?

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[09:40:00]

NEWTON: The English Premier League season is up and running, and for Arsenal, a winning start against rival Manchester United, as they look to

finally get over the hump and capture a long-awaited league title. Amanda Davies joins us now. Amanda, you remind us all the time, right?

Not a sprint, it's a marathon, but a big win for the gunners, and I have to say, a big loss. Here we go again for Man U.

AMANDA DAVIES, CNN WORLD SPORT: Well, let's say there's progress, not perfection. Yeah, this is a very long campaign. It's been a very, very long

marathon over two decades since Arsenal last got their hands on that Premier League title, but it's always fascinating.

All that hope and expectation at the start of a new campaign, Liverpool, the defending champions, got off to a winning start amidst all that

incredible emotion after the loss of their player, Diogo Jota just a few weeks ago in that tragic car accident, but there was an emotional victory

for them.

And we're really going to be having a look at the runners and riders and what we learned from the opening weekend in just a couple of minutes on

"World Sport". I hope everybody can stick with us for that.

NEWTON: Appreciate it. Thanks, Amanda. We'll have "World Sport"for you in a moment and at the top of the hour, more news. Appreciate you being with us.

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[09:45:00]

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