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Connect the World

At Least 34 Dead as Migrants Breach Spain-Morocco Border; Spanish PM Calls Surge a Violation of Country's Borders; French Residents Accuse Officials of Prioritizing Tourist Areas; Record-challenging Heat Dome in Western U.S. This Weekend; Anthropic Blames Misunderstanding for Breaches, Not AI Actions. Aired 9-10a ET

Aired July 31, 2026 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN HOST, CONNECT THE WORLD: Well, tens of thousands of migrants rush the border between Morocco and the Spanish enclave of Ceuta.

03:00 p.m. there, 02:00 p.m. here in London. I'm Becky Anderson. You're watching "Connect the World".

Also making headlines, President Donald Trump says that there's a deal for the complete disarmament of Hamas. The details on that coming up. And

another AI Hack this time. It's Anthropic's model going rogue. Should this be a warning for the industry? Well, the stock market in New York opens

about 30 minutes from now.

And it does look like a relatively upbeat start to the last trading day of the week. Investors, it seems, perfectly sort of sanguine about Amazon's

results, especially the strength of growth in cloud services. More on that coming up. Well, Spain and Morocco have tightened security and reinforced

fences around the Spanish enclave of Ceuta after thousands of people breached the border to enter Spanish territory on Thursday.

In what were remarkable scenes, Spanish police appeared helpless to hold back the rush. Well, officials say about 60,000 people entered Ceuta by

land and sea, with border controls completely breaking down. In the surge to cross the frontier, at least 34 people died.

Ceuta has long been a flashpoint for migration, serving as a target for people trying to reach Europe. Spain says what happened on Thursday was its

most serious border crisis in years. CNN's Nada Bashir following the story for us. What more do we know at this point? And can you tell us about this

huge surge and reaction to it?

NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Becky, as we've seen in those videos, this was a huge moment of chaos for authorities and border officials in

Ceuta. As we've seen that dramatic surge of migrants attempting to cross the border from Morocco, it appears as though the majority of them were

crossing via sea to get to the land border of this particular coastal part of Ceuta.

Some appearing to also cross under and through the border gates that have been established to separate the land crossing between Morocco and the

Spanish territory. And of course, as we'd seen in response, almost immediately, authorities they're calling on the national Spanish government

to declare a state of emergency to deploy additional resources, including military resources, on the ground there to try to bring the situation under

control.

And this is an unprecedented number of migrants to attempt to storm that border crossing in one go, an estimated 60,000, according to government

officials. And of course, there has been a very strong reaction from the prime minister himself. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PEDRO SANCHEZ, SPANISH PRIME MINISTER: What has happened? Well, what has happened, in effect, is a violation of the territorial integrity of Spain,

of the borders of a Spanish city, such as the City of Ceuta.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASHIR: Now, of course, there are questions as to why exactly we are seeing this surge right now. It is understood that it may be connected to a

Supreme Court ruling in Spain, which took, which was handed down earlier this month, which essentially prohibits authorities from returning migrants

who have crossed via sea.

So, we've heard from the Spanish Prime Minister, as you saw there speaking earlier today. He has accused illegal trafficking rings, human smugglers,

of misunderstanding this Supreme Court ruling and exploiting it, encouraging people to use this as an opportunity to cross into Europe.

And as you can imagine, many of those who are crossing are, of course, desperate for a better life within the European Union, for opportunities

there, and of course, for many, they would have hoped that this would be the beginning of an opportunity to establish that better life.

But what we have seen, actually, just in the last few hours, in the last 24 hours since that surge began, is actually Moroccan migrants attempting to

return back to Morocco. Now, according to the Spanish government, they estimate around 25,000 migrants have already crossed back.

And we've seen some of them returning through the border, crossing under a heavy military surveillance. Others attempting to climb over fences once

again, or break through offenses that were once breached just yesterday. And clearly there is a sense amongst many of these migrants that those

opportunities, that better life that they had hoped for, is not actually available to them in Spain as it stands, or as may have been promised to

them.

[09:05:00]

But of course, this really encapsulates a broader migration crisis, and we've seen backlash amongst other European leaders, including Italy's Prime

Minister Giorgia Meloni, who has threatened to even exclude Spain from the visa-free Schengen travel zone if this situation is not brought under

control, Becky.

ANDERSON: Good to have you, Nada. Thank you. Well, U.S. President Donald Trump says an agreement has been reached for the complete disarmament of

Hamas and all other armed groups in Gaza. He announced it on a social media post. Officials on President Trump's border peace say the agreement follows

months of delicate negotiations.

And a senior Hamas official tells CNN, the agreement is contingent on the deployment of an international stabilization force to Gaza, and Israel

holding its or upholding its obligations under the October ceasefire agreement. This happening after a relatively quiet night in the Gulf region

with no reported U.S. strikes on Iran.

I want to bring in Jeremy Diamond, who's in Jerusalem. Kevin Liptak is at the White House. And I want to start with you, Jeremy, on the details as we

understand it of what has been agreed on this complete disarmament by Hamas and the militant group's response.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, that's right, Becky. I mean, this is the first time that Hamas has agreed to actual clear steps to

disarm inside of Gaza. Steps that they insist and is clear from the document are conditioned upon Israel taking some of its steps of its own

inside the Gaza Strip.

Namely the fact that Hamas will not begin the process of handing over its weapons to this transitional Palestinian government with the support of the

International Stabilization Force until Israel ceases fire in the Gaza Strip, pulls back its forces to the Yellow Line as it was originally agreed

to in October, and allows for a surge of humanitarian aid into Gaza.

The International Stabilization Force must also first deploy to Gaza before any of this can begin. And that was one of the key points that Ghazi Hamad,

a Senior Hamas Official, made to me when I spoke to him over the phone just in the last couple of hours. He said to me, the agreement is a quote,

package.

He said, we will not begin any weapons-related steps until Israel implements these commitments. And he said that unless Israel does so, then

Hamas will not proceed. It's important to note that as much as this agreement certainly represents major progress in these negotiations, after

months of stalemate in negotiations between the Board of Peace and Hamas.

It also remains very uncertain whether any of this will still become a reality, and that is because this agreement has been brokered between Hamas

and the Board of Peace, the United States, the Arab mediators that are part of this negotiation, but Israel has yet to publicly comment on this

agreement at all.

And as recently as yesterday, an Israeli official was casting doubt on the emerging agreement, suggesting that it would not be sufficient enough, and

that nothing short of the full demilitarization of Gaza would work for the Israeli government, it has also insisted.

Israel has also insisted on the weapons being removed from the Gaza Strip. Whereas this agreement, as we've seen so far, indicates that heavy weapons

will be stored under the auspices of this National Committee for the Administration of Gaza, a technocratic Palestinian government that will be

overseen by the U.S.-run Board of Peace.

So, it's not clear that this is something that Israel can stomach, and whether Israel will uphold its commitments will ultimately depend, will

ultimately determine, I should say, whether or not Hamas moves forward with any of this disarmament process.

ANDERSON: And it's really important that you bring up that sort of board of governors, as it were. You know, this is a group of individuals who have

not yet been given access on the ground in Gaza to start any of the work that needs to be done of course, so that will be part of, I guess, what

happens next.

Kevin, let me bring you in. What the agreement says matters. We've got very little detail, but what it says matters. This is about decommissioning,

full decommissioning. What happens next matters even more. Those are the words of Nikolay Mladenov, the official leading the Gaza effort on behalf

of the Board of Peace.

And he says withdrawal must move in lockstep with decommissioning. So, what are you hearing in Washington from the White House about whether or not

Israel is on board with this agreement?

[09:10:00]

KEVIN LIPTAK, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, they insist that this was negotiated in lockstep with Israel, and they have given a very

optimistic assessment of how this moves ahead. They're really framing this as a breakthrough that could lead to the complete transformation of Gaza.

But even those officials, I think, are still acknowledging that this is going to be a process that takes time, and that it will be sort of rife

with obstacles-military obstacles, political obstacles-before it is fully implemented. And I just want to read you a quote from what one official

told reporters yesterday.

When it comes to Israel's participation in what has been agreed to, they say, quote, we are not asking Israel for anything other than to implement

their commitments under the 20-point plan, referring to the Gaza peace plan that the president had unveiled. They went on to say, if they do not do

that, President Trump will be very disappointed.

I do not think the Israelis would want to escalate things with us right now. I think sort of an implicit acknowledgement that relations between

President Trump and the Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu are strained at the moment over the Iran war and Israel's other provocations in the region

that he sees as threatening the truce not only with Iran.

So -- and so far, as it exists at all, but also this plan with Gaza. And so even though they do believe that this is a major diplomatic coup in a lot

of ways, they do seem to be acknowledging that the road ahead will be very, very difficult. That these are very complicated and reciprocal steps that

will need to take place before the true fruits of this labor will be accomplished.

But there was a lot of work that went into it, and they do believe that this is now a success that the president can tout in a region where he has

had trouble finding successes over the last several months.

ANDERSON: Good to have you. And Jeremy, thanks to you as well, there in Israel. Well, firefighters in southwestern France say they have contained a

major wildfire, allowing 144,000 people to return home. Crews said the flames weakened further overnight as a spell of high temperatures began to

cool things down.

Scientists are saying climate change created a perfect storm for the fires to burn. They say the climate crisis made fire-prone conditions 20 times

more likely in Spain and doubled the likelihood in France. Meanwhile, in Crete, residents assessing the damage after wildfires there swept through

the area.

More evacuations taking place on the island as well as in central Greece, amid fears the country could become a new front for wildfires in the coming

days. Well, just outside Bordeaux, fire has destroyed much of the town of Le Porge. Now that the flames are out, people are returning to see what's

left of life there. As CNN's Melissa Bell reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is what the village of Le Porge in southwestern France looked like a week ago.

These videos, filmed by Mathieu Plessis, one of a handful of locals who stayed behind to try and help firefighters.

MATHIEU PLESSIS, LE PORGE RESIDENT: There were flames jumping of over a kilometer, we had flames 25 meters high, or even taller. It was -- well, it

was the apocalypse.

BELL (voice-over): By Friday morning, however, this was all that was left of his home.

PLESSIS: We're at my home. We're at my family home.

BELL: You've been here for seven generations, and his is what's left.

PLESSIS: But the next morning, when we come back. Everything was still burning.

BELL: What was inside that house, which has belonged to your family for generations?

PLESSIS: My whole life, there was an aquarium with fish. I had a snake in a terrarium. I couldn't save it. I couldn't save everything. Everything

burned, even the animals. It breaks my heart.

BELL (voice-over): Some locals here accuse authorities of sending firefighters elsewhere just when the fire hit hardest for them. As it

spread, they were engulfed and felt abandoned as firefighters raced towards the popular tourist hot spot of the Cap Ferret Peninsula.

PLESSIS: Everyone deserves to have their home saved to have their living space saved, whether they're rich or poor, we're all human beings.

BELL (voice-over): His neighbors didn't fare much better. Many of their houses were destroyed as well. Overall, in the village of Le Porge, 180

houses were destroyed, making it the hardest hit by the Gironde fire.

BELL: That trail of devastation that led to Le Porge began here just over a week ago at ground zero of the Gironde fire, and here on the outskirts of

the village of Saumos, you get an idea as well of just how violent it was. Melissa Bell, CNN, Saumos.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[09:15:00]

ANDERSON: Strong heat dome headed for the western U.S. this weekend, 12 states may see record heat there, prompting alerts for more than 40 million

people. Temperatures could soar up to a blistering 52 degrees Celsius in some parts, similar to the heat in Europe.

Climate change does appear to be driving the hot spell in the U.S. So, there's a lot of weather news, very extreme heat on both sides at the

Atlantic. Meteorologist Derek Van Dam joining us now live from Atlanta. And just provide some sort of context and detail for us here, if you will,

Derek.

DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Well, Becky, remember we're ending July, making our way into the first parts of August. This is climatologically

speaking the hottest time of the year for the northern hemisphere. So, we've got heat in North America, we've got heat across Western Europe.

We would expect that this time of year, but when we talk about how it compares to history, we're talking record-shattering temperatures, right,

for so many locations. In fact, 12 U.S. states will topple record high temperatures going forward this week. We've got 40 million Americans under

heat alerts.

This is inclusive, Phoenix, Las Vegas, Los Angeles. You say, hey, wait a second. These are places that are normally hot. You're right, but this is

exceptional heat. When we look at this forecast temperature for the day today, it's incredible. 47, this is a very populated part of the

southwestern U.S.

Of course, you get towards the coastline, and you, cool things off thanks to the influence of the waters. But there's been a rip current risk because

of a nearby hurricane across the Pacific that's making beach going a little bit on the dangerous side, especially if you approach the water.

So, look at all these dots. These are all locations that we expect to set record highs through the course of this weekend. When it peaks, the heat

dome will peak through Saturday and Sunday. So, heading into the weekend, we're talking about temperatures in Celsius, about 5 to 10 degrees Celsius

above where we should be this time of year.

That's extraordinary. And we've got more the same across the pond, right throughout the Atlantic and into Western Europe. Look at Madrid, the

current temperature at 36. Yesterday, it was about 40 degrees in Madrid, so impressive heat there. And this satellite image tells quite the story.

I'm showing this again because it's so impressive. We had a wet start to the winter here. We're going back a few months, right? And that allowed for

vegetation to flourish. Look at how green this is. And Becky, I'm going to fast forward this satellite image to just a couple of days ago, and notice

how quickly things have dried out.

Notice that brown tinge to the landscape here. That is because we turned the taps off. The water stopped falling from the sky. Yeah, it went from

green to brown. That means that the vegetation here is tinderbox dry, and so additional sparks could start additional wildfires, and that's what we

want to prevent obviously, we're concerned.

Authorities are warning in Greece, parts of Italy, not just what's happening in France and in Spain, that sparks, man-made sparks, whether

it's by lightning or by man-made influence could cause additional wildfire activity. There's not much relief in sight. Cold front being shunned by

this high pressure that centered itself across the Mediterranean, preventing cooler air and the necessary rain we need to help quell the

fires, Becky.

ANDERSON: Digging that jacket, Derek. Thank you very much indeed.

DAM: Thank you.

ANDERSON: Your insight and analysis hugely important. Thank you, mate. Well -- always well dressed up man. Ahead on "Connect the World", new terror for

civilians in Ukraine. One of the details of the targets that Russia is going for in its latest campaign. An eyewitness who saw a man get fatally

shot by U.S. immigration offices, is now speaking out for the first time about what happened. We'll have that exclusive story up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:20:00]

ANDERSON: In Ukraine, there is a new jet danger for civilians away from the front line in its latest phase of attacks. Russia has repeatedly targeted

gas stations, hitting more than 200 in the past two months, according to Ukrainian officials. My colleague Nick Paton Walsh with the details for

you.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Even stopping for gas in Ukraine can now be lethal. More than 200 fuel stations

have been attacked by Russia since June. That's about three a day in a country where the war has shut down commercial flights, they are a lifeline

with a huge role in a vast country.

The pumps now a place to listen out for the buzz of drones and know where the bomb shelter is. In Zaporizhzhia, policeman Mykhailo ran in to help

after a drone struck one station, but then he heard a second.

MYKHAILO TSYPLIAKOV, PATROL POLICE OFFICER: When I heard the drone was already descending, I saw a flash, got up and saw injuries to my arm, legs.

Maybe [Russia is doing this] to intimidate, to sow fear and create panic.

WALSH (voice-over): We verified 30 of the estimated over 200 attacks in June and July. They fall across Ukraine, but most are close to occupied

areas, the cities of Kramatorsk and Kharkiv worst hit. All in reach of Russian drones and intensifying fuel trucks and containers targeted, on a

simple level, impeding the war effort by making it hard to get gas, but also sowing fear far away from the front lines.

The growing range of Russian attack drones making once safe areas part of the kill zone.

YAROSLAV STAROVOITENKO, PRESIDENT OF OIL AND GAS ASSOCIATION OF UKRAINE: Gas stations became these key points of refuge as people fled the war. Then

Russia tried to cause an intentional blackout, cutting off electricity and heating to freeze us out in the winter.

And gas stations became the first facilities to be 100 percent equipped with generators. These were places where people could drink hot tea, fill

up their cars, warm up, and even prepare milk for their babies.

WALSH (voice-over): Near Kyiv that has an always worked.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There's always a risk. No one knows where the attack will strike.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was discharged from the army after being seriously wounded. If a strike comes here, what's the difference? It didn't kill me

on the frontline, so it won't kill me here.

WALSH: But many see this as a Russian response to the fuel crisis and queues imposed in Russia by Ukrainian drone strikes on refineries. Putin's

escalation inflicting the same back. Russia's elite drone units make a public point of their strikes on Ukraine, releasing a video here of nine

being hit.

The damage is real, unexpected, and growing. Another sign, absolutely nothing is off limits in Moscow's invasion of choice. Nick Paton Walsh,

CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

ANDERSON: A witness to the fatal shooting of a man by a U.S. immigration officer in Texas is now breaking his silence. Jose Trinidad was inside the

van of Lorenzo Salgado, who we see here, when Salgado was shot by an I.C.E. agent. Trinidad was sitting only a few feet away when gunshots rang out.

And now he is speaking up for the first time about what he saw to CNN's Ed Lavandera.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOSE TRINIDAD ROJAS PLIEGO, WITNESSED FATAL I.C.E. SHOOTING: I feel a bit traumatized or something like that. I'm sad about what happened, and

especially about what I saw, since I was the one who witnessed it all.

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Jose Trinidad says things will never be the same. That he's traumatized by the

shooting because he saw it all. The 52-year-old construction worker witnessed the final moments of Lorenzo Salgado's life from inside the van

driven by the man he simply called El Patron, the boss.

It was just before 07:00 a.m. on July 7th when I.C.E. officers in unmarked cars started pursuing the four-man crew of construction workers in East

Houston.

[09:25:00]

Trinidad says he was sitting a few feet behind Salgado in the van. Jose tells me during the pursuit he heard the men up front say they were being

chased by I.C.E. officers. Videos show I.C.E. officers pursuing Salgado's van in unmarked cars. At one point racing past the van on Canal Street.

The last video shows I.C.E. officers taking the three other men into custody and Salgado on the ground, handcuffed, just after being shot.

LAVANDERA: -- when the I.C.E. officer shot, where was he standing?

PLIEGO: On the side.

LAVANDERA: Who's side?

PLIEGO: Of his brother.

LAVANDERA: On the passenger side?

PLIEGO: The passenger's side.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): Trinidad says the I.C.E. officer shot Salgado through the passenger window. The Department of Homeland Security says

during the chase, Salgado attempted to evade arrest, then weaponized his vehicle and tried to run over an I.C.E. officer. And that's when an agent

opened fire in self-defense.

PLIEGO: That's a lie.

LAVANDERA: That's a lie?

PLIEGO: Yes.

LAVANDERA (voice-over): Trinidad says the DHS statement is a lie. There are no known videos that capture the moment of the shooting. The I.C.E.

officers were not wearing body cameras. Trinidad says I.C.E. agents were never in front of or behind the van, and that Lorenzo was about to turn

himself over to the officers.

The three men with Salgado inside the van have been in custody since the shooting, but this week a judge ordered Trinidad's release, and this is the

first time he's spoken publicly in detail about what happened. After his release, Trinidad paid tribute to his friend at the memorial honoring

Lorenzo Salgado on Canal Street, and then prayed at his friend's gravesite.

Jose Trinidad says he and the other men in the van were simply going to work, and that he's speaking out in hopes of getting Lorenzo Salgado and

his family justice.

LAVANDERA (on camera): We asked the Department of Homeland Security to respond to Jose Trinidad's allegations that their version of events in the

shooting was a quote lie. DHS referred all questions to the FBI, which is investigating the shooting. The other two men that were in the white van

with Trinidad, they remain in immigration custody.

Trinidad is out, but there are terms of his release which dictate he must check in regularly with I.C.E. He has to wear an ankle monitor, and he is

not allowed to work in the U.S. Ed Lavandera, CNN, Houston, Texas.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON: Welcome back. I'm Becky Anderson in London. Excuse me. I'm just going to put my chair back up. You're watching "Connect the World". The

headlines for you. Spain calling this surge of migrants its most significant border crisis in years. Officials say Spain and Morocco have

reinforced security around the Spanish enclave of Ceuta after nearly 60,000 migrants breached the border on Thursday.

[09:30:00]

The part of the western U.S. will see a record challenging heat dome this weekend. This unusually strong heat dome is expected to go higher in the

atmosphere than what is typical, meaning it could trap more heat underneath it. Well ringing the opening bell today on Wall Street, and there it goes.

Our members of the team at the women's clothing brand Reformation. What good clothes those are too. Let's see how the stocks are getting on. It was

expected to be quite a promising start to the trading week. Certainly, the futures markets indicating a better start, and that is certainly what we

are seeing, I would hesitate to take exactly those numbers.

I think we need to let these markets settle, particularly NASDAQ market. There you go, that market now. That number was errant when we first

started. So, each of these markets up by just less than 1 percent but not a bad start to the day. New today, Anthropic says some of its AI models

access the open internet and hacked into three separate organizations during routine security testing.

Now the company says the models weren't supposed to be online, but that a quote, misunderstanding with a testing partner gave them access. Well, that

discovery came only after rival OpenAI reported a similar incident, prompting Anthropic to take a closer look at its own tests.

Anthropic has now suspended all cyber testing. Let's get the latest from our AI Correspondent Hadas Gold. And we're talking about models going rogue

here. Exactly what happened? Just explain what happened and what Anthropic's sort of response has been?

HADAS GOLD, CNN AI CORRESPONDENT: So, after OpenAI disclosed that stunning breach where one of its models escaped its testing environment, got access

to the open internet when it wasn't supposed to, and hacked Hugging Faces systems. Anthropic decided to review its own cybersecurity test for its

system to see if anything similar had happened.

Anthropic says they reviewed more than 141,000 evaluations. And they found that in three incidences, their models did access the open internet when

they technically were not supposed to, and then did actually go on to breach other companies' systems.

They said that in these cases, the models were being tested in a capture the flag sort of test or game, where they were told that they needed to

capture some secret information or a flag that existed on another machine, and that they needed to break in in order to get that information.

Now, similar to OpenAI, the models' safety guardrails were reduced to be able to assess their full capabilities. Now, Anthropic says a key

difference in what happened here is that unlike OpenAI's model that actually broke out of its testing environment and seemingly knew that it

was doing so in order to cheat on the test.

Anthropic says that their models still believe that they were within their simulation and that it was a misunderstanding with a third-party provider

that helps them do the testing that gave them access to the internet when they weren't supposed to. And they actually pointed out that one of their

more advanced models recognized at one point that it was actually oops on the open internet and that this was real life and actually stopped itself

before continuing on.

But still, a very significant moment in this sort of world we're living in, where these AI agents are taking all of these incredible actions completely

independently.

ANDERSON: Thank you, Hadas. My next guest suggests that the AI race is entering a new phase-one focused less on how fast we can build AI and more

on who controls it, but with Anthropic and OpenAI revealing that some of their models breached outside systems during testing.

Then the debate is growing not over not just safety but accountability, access, who is ultimately in control, whether government should have a

bigger role in regulating this technology. I mean, frankly, you know, there is a long list now of questions. Shelly Palmer, across most of those,

always providing good analysis and insight into what is going on.

He's CEO of the Palmer Group and Professor of Advanced Media in Residence at Syracuse University's SI Newhouse School of Public Communications, and

I'm sure your students will be exercised by exactly what is going on. It's always good to have you. I think it's such an important day.

OpenAI says during a cybersecurity test, one of its AI agents, designed to take actions on its own, found a way outside its intended boundaries was

linked to unauthorized access at Hugging Face. That's a key platform where AI developers share models and research.

You write this quote, Shelly, the agent operated at machine speed. Detection, attribution, telemetry review, and cross-company coordination

operated at human speed.

[09:35:00]

That gap was the control failure. That's quite dense, and is I guess you know what you're writing there, designed for the real experts. I want you

to step out for the more general, you know, viewer and consumer of AI out there watching CNN. What's going on? And how concerned should we be at this

point?

SHELLY PALMER, CEO OF THE PALMER GROUP: OK. So, this is kind of important. I think everybody understands now. There was a test that was done by

OpenAI. The safety rules were turned off. It was in what's known as a sandbox, which is supposed to be a controlled environment.

The AI, this is GPT-5.6 Sol, their latest model, was able to break out or escape the sandbox. It went on the public internet to go find some cheat

codes from Hugging Face, which is as you said an organization that that makes AI models available to engineers and the public.

Now, people keep saying it went rogue. It did this. It did that. Let's be very clear here. We are now using AI in what's known as agentic workflows

or agents. And an agent, the dictionary definition, something that is an agent has agency. In other words, it works on your behalf.

The way you program this particular kind of AI is you tell it a goal. You say, I want you to bring me the broomstick of the Wicked Witch of the West.

I don't care how you do it, and it will try to accomplish that goal as best it can. It will look everywhere. It will do everything.

This is a rewards-based algorithm. It's got a score. It's got to make. It's just trying to accomplish the goal you've given it, and it will use all

means available to it to accomplish that goal. Now there are two problems with that. One, as a human being, you may give it a goal that you don't

fully understand.

And two, it's going to use every single skill, every single capability it's ever been programmed or given access to accomplish the goal it's been

given. So, this is a recipe for disaster, which is why they put it in a sandbox to test it. So, while everybody's getting crazy about oh this went

rogue, it did this, it did that.

Hey folks, they're testing. The tests are working, and they're learning what the agents are capable of and what they're not capable of. So, let's

be a little clear here. These are tests. The tests are working as designed, and no one should be surprised because how arrogant are human beings to

believe that they are faster than machines?

Machines are very fast. They're not very smart, but they're very fast, and so they're going to do stuff faster than you expect. And they may do things

that you have not fully comprehended or thought through because they work differently than we do. So, this is a really good thing, not a really bad

thing, and it's you know you can you can frame it as it went rogue.

ANDERSON: Yeah.

PALMER: You can also frame it as, hey, we've just learned something about these agentic tools, and we need to go repair that.

ANDERSON: Yeah. That is fascinating. It's good to get your position on that. The artificial intelligence race entering a new phase. One focused

less on how fast we can build AI and more on who controls it. That is your sort of the conceit of your argument or your pitch at present. Just explain

where you think, what you're thinking is.

PALMER: So, you know it's interesting when this happened. The last six weeks have been fascinating. You've had executive orders. You've got two

different bills, the Frontier Act in the United States and the AI Kill Switch Act. We've had the G7 talk about it. You've had the Dario Amodei and

the other CEOs of the AI companies go to the G7 and make a pitch to get regulated.

So now we're not going to see consumers with access to the most capable models. Those are basically going to be reserved for the military and for

governments. So, you've got, we've always had gatekeepers. The frontier model builders themselves have kept gates and only let you know consumers

or business partners have the models that they feel they want to commercialize.

Now the governments are getting involved. The Trump Administration's involved. They have an EO that executive order.

ANDERSON: Yeah.

PALMER: That's about six weeks old that says voluntarily you should give us a 30-day heads up before you release a model to the wild. So, we're in a

little bit of an interesting time where we as consumers and we as citizens, A, don't have access to the frontier, and B, we're not sure who's in

control of those models right now.

ANDERSON: Yeah.

PALMER: We don't know if it's the government, if it's the companies that are making them, or some combination of both. There's no transparency

there, not yet anyway.

ANDERSON: It is a fascinating time. Always good to have you on. Thank you very much indeed, Shelly Palmer in the house. So, folks, right, the FIFA

firestorm hasn't let up, with one of Gianni Infantino's senior advisers resigning. More on that is up next.

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ANDERSON: Right, two other federations or confederations have joined UEFA in speaking out after FIFA put forward its privatization plans for the

World Cup. We've also learned that one of Gianni Infantino's senior advisers has resigned. "World Sport" up next with Andy Scholes with a lot

more on that story.

We will do it too. 15 minutes from now, second hour of "Connect the World". So please stay with us.

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