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Dr. Drew
Jailed Kentucky Clerk Freed and Not Giving In; Dentist Who Killed Cecil the Lion Back at Work; Mike Huckabee and Hundreds of Supporters Greeted Kim Davis; Josh Duggar`s Past Comes Back to Haunt Him; Fat Shaming Viral Video. Aired 9-10p ET
Aired September 08, 2015 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[21:00:14] DR. DREW PINSKY, HLN HOST: Tonight, when do religious beliefs conflict with merely doing your job? The county clerk who refused to issue
same-sex marriage license is out of jail and she is not giving in.
Plus, the dentist who killed Cecil, the lion, is back, back at work and under tight security. He got a message for all the haters. And, Donald
Trump, guess what, he is at it again.
It all starts right now with the "Top of the Feed." Hundreds of supporters greeted Kim Davis as she walked free after five days in jail. Presidential
candidate Mike Huckabee was amongst them as the song, "Eye of the Tiger" blared. Take a look at this.
(LAUGHING)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(CROWD CHEERING AND APPLAUDING)
MIKE HUCKABEE, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Will you please help me welcome to the stage Kim Davis.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
KIM DAVIS, COUNTRY CLERK WHO REFUSED TO ISSUE SAME-SEX MARRIAGE LICENSE: I just want to give God the glory. His people have rallied, and you are a
strong people.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: The Rowan county clerk spent labor day weekend behind bars.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE REPORTER: Davis says it is her religious beliefs that prohibit her from issuing marriage licenses to gay couples.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: We do not need the Supreme Court when we serve the Supreme Being.
SUNNY HOSTIN, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: The hypocrisy that many people have pointed out; the fact that she has been married four times; the fact that
she has had these children out of wedlock.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CAL ZASTROW, PROTESTER/KIM DAVIS` SUPPORTER: Kim Davis is unlawfully being held in jail right now and being prevented from doing her job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: She is not in jail over her religious belief. She is in jail because she defied a federal judge`s court order.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HOSTIN: We cannot hold elected positions and then pick and choose, which law we are going to follow.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DAVIS: I love you all so very much.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Joining me, Samantha Schacher, "Pop Trigger" on Hulu.com; Areva Martin, attorney and legal consultant; Michael Catherwood, my co-host on
"Love Line" and KABC 790 here in Los Angeles noon to 2:00; "Chain Reaction" host on GSN; Segun Oduolowu, entertainment journalist and Ryan Sorba, head
of the Young Conservatives of California.
(AUDIENCE CHEERING AND APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: The judge who set her free warned Kim not to interfere with the efforts of her deputy clerks when they attempt to issue marriage licenses.
This is how she got in trouble the first time. Areva, A. Do you think we are going to be just deja vu all over again? She is going to go out there
and interfere with these clerks, or is somehow she is magically going to behave herself? And, what will happen with her?
AREVA MARTIN, ATTORNEY AND LEGAL CONSULTANT: Look at all that attention that, that clerk got. Did anyone know Kim Davis` name before all of this
all took place? Of course, she is going to defy the court order, because she is going to get parades.
PINSKY: What is going to happen? What is going to happen to her?
MARTIN: The court is likely to hold her in contempt again. Probably, fine her, may be put her back in jail. But, there is an opportunity for the
Kentucky legislature to step up. They can impeach her. They can force her out of office if she refuses to do her job.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: See, what I heard was that they are asking for a special session. Get ready, taxpayers. It is coming out of your pocket.
MARTIN: Yes.
PINSKY: A special session to have her removed from these licenses.
MARTIN: That is what she wants. Her lawyers are pushing for there to be a special session. The governor said no to that. They do not meet again
until January. So, in the regular session that will start in January, they have an opportunity.
But, we are talking about a pretty conservative legislature. And, we see all of the fanfare. We see Huckabee and all of these conservatives
leveraging Kim Davis and her defines. And, you know what, Dr. Drew? Did you hear that they are comparing her to Rosa Parks?
SAMANTHA SCHACHER, HOST OF "POP TRIGGER" ON HULU.COM: What?
MARTIN: Martin Luther King Jr.
PINSKY: Segun. Segun.
SEGUN ODUOLOWU, ENTERTAINMENT JOURNALIST: You know what? Listen, I do not think she is a dreadful person, but I do think she is a dreadful Christian.
And, I say that because she could have stepped down from her position.
SCHACHER: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: But what she did was grandstanding and me, me, me, me, me.
PINSKY: She could have stepped down?
ODUOLOWU: She could have stepped down --
MARTIN: Absolutely.
ODUOLOWU: -- because she is an elected official.
PINSKY: OK.
ODUOLOWU: And, what bothers me the most is she is doing it, saying it on God`s authority, like God is speaking to her to defy a Supreme Court
mandated law. That is grandstanding, and that is not Christianity. So, all of those people holding crosses and saying, she is a super Christian.
No, she is not. --
MARTIN: She is a selective Christian.
ODUOLOWU: -- Because she could have stepped down --
PINSKY: Ryan.
ODUOLOWU: She could have stepped down --
MARTIN: She is a selective Christian.
ODUOLOWU: -- and made a moral stance.
PINSKY: Ryan.
RYAN SORBA, HEAD OF THE YOUNG CONSERVATIVES OF CALIFORNIA: There have been so many things said in the last minute, minute and a half that are wrong
that I cannot even comprehend it. First of all, she has been pleading with the state legislature of Kentucky for months to pass a bill that would
allow her to just remove her name from the marriage forms. That is all she wants.
MARTIN: But, Ryan --
SORBA: She just does not want her name on them because she has sincerely held religious beliefs that go back to the book of Enoch, and the book of
Jasher, roughly 10,000 years --
[21:05:03] SCHACHER: Wait a second.
SOBER: -- that declared the behavior that these marriages are based on a sin, and there is nothing wrong with that. America has held that belief
for its entirety.
SCHACHER: She is not being discriminated against or jailed because of her religious belief. She is being jailed because she is enforcing her
religious beliefs on to everybody else.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SOBER: But -- But --
SCHACHER: Hold on. Wait. Let me finish.
SOBER: Wrong.
SCHACHER: Hold on.
SOBER: Absolutely wrong.
SCHACHER: She is an elected official.
SOBER: Absolutely wrong.
SCHACHER: She is an elected officer. Her constituents voted her into that position. Those tax dollars -- their tax dollars are paying her $80,000 a
year salary. So, she has no right to move their constitutional right.
SOBER: No --
SCHACHER: And, you know what? What a hypocrite. Here she is, trying to uphold the sanctity of marriage when she has been married four -- or when
she has been divorced four times?
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SOBER: Her anger -- listen, first of all --
ODUOLOWU: Hurray, Samantha!
SCHACHER: Thank you, Segun.
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: She has a kid who does not get her way --
PINSKY: Ryan. I will give -- Ryan, respond.
SORBA: Listen. She was married multiple times before she became a Christian. So, if you are going to -- then she became a Christian.
ODUOLOWU: Wait, all those marriages in front of the church, what were they?
SORBA: And, in addition to that, these people that are coming to get married are from Ohio. They are from Ohio. They came to Kentucky.
SCHACHER: But, Ryan, why do not you just love thy neighbor?
(CROSSTALK)
MARTIN: -- On the basis of residency, not on the basis of them being gay. We have not heard her say we are not going to marry you because your
residency is inappropriate.
SOBER: It does not matter.
MARTIN: It does matter. There is something called the law, Ryan. You do not get to ignore the law because you do not like it.
SOBER: -- But she wanted to wait until January for the next session.
ODUOLOWU: Areva --
PINSKY: One at a time. Whoah! Hey! I am going to the audience now. Do not step on each other anymore. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Here is my thing. She is an elected official. Her job is to issue marriage certificate. It does not matter,
who it is to. She has been divorced four times. She has had kids out of wedlock. Who is she to impose religious belief when she is not even
upholding it herself?
SCHACHER: Thank you.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
MICHAEL CATHERWOOD,CO-HOST ON "LOVE LINE" AND KABC 790 AND "CHAIN REACTION" HOST ON GSN: I certainly think that, you know, when someone is trying to
be a moralist you have every right to bring up their past. But, I also am a big believer in the idea of redemption. And, I do think, you know, it is
fair to say that maybe she did find God after all these divorces.
PINSKY: OK.
CATHERWOOD: But, you know --
SCHACHER: But, should she condemn everybody else?
CATHERWOOD: I think the argument of the separation of church and state and her doing it upon religious beliefs. It is founded on a false principle.
This is about someone not doing their job --
SCHACHER: Right.
CATHERWOOD: -- in a courthouse.
SCHACHER: Right.
CATHERWOOD: I mean she does not work at Appleby`s. I mean she has to uphold the law of the United States of America. I mean --
PINSKY: Is not it chilled down your spine when the guy said, I respond to the supreme being not the supreme court, like I am going to disregard the
Supreme Court because I speak to God.
SOBER: But, is not that what Martin Luther --
PINSKY: It was chilling.
SOBER: Is not that what Martin Luther King said in his letter from a Birmingham jail that I rely on the natural law?
MARTIN: Ryan. Ryan. Ryan --
SOBER: Hold on.
CATHERWOOD: There are tremendous difference . There are similarities --
SOBER: Our entire nation is based on the natural law. All right. Our declaration of independence --
PINSKY: But, Ryan --
MARTIN: Ryan.
SOBER: Our united states constitution.
PINSKY: But he was talking about local laws, not that he was trying to appeal to the law of the land.
MARTIN: He find a very clear --
ODUOLUWU: By the way, Martin Luther King was for the equality of all people.
SCHACHER: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: He was not talking for the equality of all people --
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SOBER: OK. But Martin Luther King has a letter --
MARTIN: First of all --
ODUOLOWU: -- under the flag in America.
MARTIN: Why are we having a conversation about Kim Davis and putting her in the same sentence with Dr. Martin Luther King?
SOBER: Dr. Marti Luther King --
MARTIN: Is there a problem with that? Is anyone seeing the problem with that?
(CROSSTALK)
SOBER: The real Martin Luther King --
CATHERWOOD: The real reason that is only appropriate --
MARTIN: We do not put her in the same conversation.
CATHERWOOD: There is only one reason that is appropriate --
MARTIN: She has press conference. She is a conversation. She has nothing to do with Martin Luther King.
CATHERWOOD: When you look at the antithesis of what Martin Luther King was doing and leading in 1967 when the Supreme Court of the United States of
America decided that it was going to go against laws that made it illegal for blacks and whites to marry, and there was a bunch of people, who are
very upset about it, Martin Luther King was one of the people who stepped forward in a very peaceful way to lead us to what would be the future.
SCHACHER: Right.
CATHERWOOD: Now, we are seeing it in the complete opposite. We are seeing that the Supreme Court has ruled that it is legal for a man to marry a man,
a woman to marry a woman. But, yet there are people who just do not want to listen to it because it goes against their --
SOBER: No. No.
PINSKY: This is Jim Crow for gay marriages, right? Yes, sir.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: I get it. I understand what she did was completely wrong by her job description. But, at the same time, I
mean, did she really have to go to jail for it? Why could not they just, you know, fire her or reprimand her or suspend her? Something like that.
I mean --
CATHERWOOD: Because she is very fat. She need to be --
PINSKY: No. No. No.
(CROSSTALK)
SCHACHER: That is not right either.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Well, I mean we have to -- but we have to understand that if it is her job, she should be reprimanded for it in
some kind of way.
PINSKY: She was elected --
SCHACHER: She is an elected official.
PINSKY: She was elected, they would have to impeach in the whole procedure.
MARTIN: They cannot fire her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Well, I mean -- hey -- I mean she has her -- she has a right to her opinion. We are not supposed to judge her
based upon her opinion. And, if we are judging her then that means, you know, we are wrong in our own way by judging her as well.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
MARTIN: We are not judging her.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: For saying that she is sticking up for her own religious beliefs.
SCHACHER: It is her job, though. It is not about her opinion.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: We are supposed to separate state from church, and we are not separating state from church by allowing her --
[21:10:04] CATHERWOOD: No. She is not allowing it.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Yes, but -
SOBER: If somebody asked you to deny a gay couple a marriage license and that was the law of the land, would you deny it or would you give that to
them?
SCHACHER: I would give that to them.
PINSKY: The law was to deny it.
SCHACHER: I would have to follow the law if that was ordered -- but what I would do, I would resign. I would resign. I would resign.
PINSKY: All right. Here we go. We got to stop for a second. We got to take a break. Conversation will go on.
Later on, we will talk about the killer of Cecil, the lion. He comes out of hiding, goes back to work. Hear what he is saying about all of this
tonight. We will be right back.
(AUDIENCE APLAUDING)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MIKE HUCKABEE, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Kim Davis is free.
MAT STAVER, ATTORNEY OF KIM DAVIS: Kim Davis is free.
(AUDIENCE CHEERING AND APPLAUDING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
STAVER: Will Kim Davis issue licenses for same-sex marriage? She cannot allow her name to be associated with something that conflicts with God`s
definition of marriage.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:05:05] UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: We simply said you cannot redefine marriage to the Supreme Court. Marriage is defined by God.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HUCKABEE: I have a message for the judge. Let Kim go. But if you have to put someone in jail, I volunteer to go. Let me go.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: Please. Please, everybody. Hundreds of supporters rallied outside the jail as Kim Davis walked free. She had spent five days behind
bars for refusing to issue same-sex marriage licenses at Kentucky where she is the lead -- what do we call it? Clerk of courts, right? She is the
senior clerk.
And, Mike, you and I know something when we were watching the tape -- it did not show up in this footage we just saw here. There are couple of
confederate flags waving in that audience.
CATHERWOOD: Yes. Nice crowd.
PINSKY: Yes. I am back with Sam, Areva, Mike, Segun, and Ryan. Now, I want to show you what Kim`s lawyer said when he was asked if she would
allow her deputies, again, other clerks in the court to continue to issue the marriage licenses with her name on it. Watch this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE PRESS: Will Davis authorize the deputies to issue same- sex marriage license?
STAVER: Kim Davis will not violate her conscience.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE PRESS: Will her deputies be able to entertain same-sex licenses? That is part of the provision as the judge ordered right now.
STAVER: Kim Davis cannot and will not violate her conscience.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE PRESS: Is she going to interfere? How much she interfere?
STAVER: I do know for very clear she will not compromise her conscience.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: She will not compromise her conscience. Areva, what does that mean?
MARTIN: Yes. It seems like he is playing it both ways. He knows what the judge`s order, which is for her not to interfere with the other clerks, but
she will not violate what he is calling her conscience.
And, we should know Dr. Drew, she did not just stop issuing licenses for same-sex couples. She stopped issuing all marriage licenses. So, she just
kind of redefined the rules, decided what she was going to do. And, that slippery slope is scary. What about people who have had abortions? What
about interracial couples?
SCHACHER: Right.
MARTIN: What about all kinds of people that she may deem to be living in sin or who have committed sin? So, if we allow this one person to defy
that rule, then we are going to have anarchy. And, clerks all over the country is going to say,
"This is my personal religious belief. I do not have to do it." That is the problem.
PINSKY: I noticed somebody tweeted me like, "Oh, you are going to put the Supreme Court`s law over God`s law?"
CATHERWOOD: Yes.
PINSKY: Yes.
MARTIN: Yes.
SCHACHER: Yes.
CATHERWOOD: All the time.
MARTIN: we are a country of laws. We are a nation of laws.
PINSKY: Hopefully, it is consistent with the natural law that Ryan referenced. It is consistent with our conscience. If not we have a system
to change it.
MARTIN: Yes.
PINSKY: It is not you do not have God speak to you and that is the law for you. What if he says, go kill somebody?
SCHACHER: Thank you.
PINSKY: That is just not the way it works. Now, she says issuing same-sex marriage licenses violates her Christian convictions. So, is following the
constitution an issue that should include these issues of religious conviction. Ryan.
SOBER: Absolutely. I mean if you look at the Dred Scott`s decision, Abraham Lincoln did not go along with the Supreme Court in Dred Scott.
Abraham Lincoln said, "Guess what? African-Americans are not three- fifths." They are 100 percent human beings.
PINSKY: Right. So, he fought through the system to change it.
SOBER: Exactly. Exactly.
PINSKY: He was more worried about Dred Scott two more than Dred Scott one.
MARTIN: And, we are talking about Dred Scott over to slave owners. It is really kind of troubling to me. No. it is not kind of, it is very
troubling --
SOBER: Wow.
MARTIN: -- that we are equating this issue of this woman making her own personal decisions with the lives of African-Americans, who were slaves in
the country. This is troubling.
PINSKY: Yes, ma`am.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: I mean I think she has the right to have her beliefs, but she was doing a job.
SCHACHER: Right.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: And, if you change your mind like, "OK, if I am working for a Deli and I am a vegetarian, I am not going to
like -- you are going to get fired if you do not serve people meat." So, I mean she should be doing her job.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: But, do you find it different that she was elected, though, right? It is a different --
MARTIN: It is absolutely different.
PINSKY: Yes.
MARTIN: She made a commitment. She stood up before the people that voted for her and said, "I will uphold the laws of this state and of this
nation." So, she has really betrayed the people that put their trust in her, and I think that is a big issue here.
SCHACHER: And their tax dollars in her pocket.
MARTIN: Absolutely. Absolutely.
PINSKY: Segun.
ODUOLOWU: For me, forget all about that. The Supreme Being and all of it, and the Dred Scott case and I agree with you, Areva. Let us not compare
this to slavery. But, first of all, judge not lest you be judged yourself.
Four divorces, baby out of wedlock. You are not the super Christian. Do not stand on a moral platform and try to preach to the masses like you are
doing some type of holier than thou thing.
PINSKY: But, Segun, if you are going to do it -- if you are going to be a paragon of Christian virtue, live like Jesus did. Encourage the prostitute
--
MARTIN: Absolutely.
ODUOLOWU: But --
PINSKY: And the real sinners are the ones you want at the table.
ODUOLOWU: But, Dr. Drew --
PINSKY: And, do not judge them and make things difficult. I am going to read you a quote from the bible. Mike, we are going to biblical
literalism.
CATHERWOOD: Let us keep the biblical, literally.
PINSKY: I am going to quote. Leviticus 20:10 says, if a man cheats on his wife, which -- or vice versa --
CATHERWOOD: Which she did.
PINSKY: Which she did.
ODUOLOWU: Yes.
PINSKY: She is like she got pregnant with twins out of wedlock.
ODUOLOWU: Did they stone her?
PINSKY: No, no. Here is Leviticus 20:10. "Both the man and the woman must die."
[21:20:00] SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: So, Mike --
CATHERWOOD: Yes.
PINSKY: On you.
ODUOLOWU: By stoning.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
CATHERWOOD: Like Mike Huckabee says, "Sign me up. I will do it." I will go kill her. I will go kill her, and whatever toothless redneck -- by the
way, who is the creepy giant farmer behind them? Like what does that do?
ODUOLOWU: Whose husband is that?
SORBA: That is her one and only husband these days since she has been a Christian.
(CROSSTALK)
CATHERWOOD: That guy is a giant. Why is he --
(LAUGHING)
SORBA: Listen. Listen, Mike. Mike. Mike --
PINSKY: Ryan, please.
SORBA: These are all ad hominem attacks on this person. They do not --
PINSKY: Yes, they were.
SORBA: They do not go to the substance of the debate.
PINSKY: But, go ahead.
CATHERWOOD: You are right.
SORBA: You can simply -- the same thing that the Plan B Pill has to do with. If I am a Christian and I do not agree with the Plan B pill, I
should have the ability --
PINSKY: Ryan, do not go there.
MARTIN: No.
PINSKY: The what?
SORBA: The Plan B pill, you are allowed to opt out if you are a pharmacist of dealing Plan B pills to people.
MARTIN: That is a private entity. You keep ignoring one important point here. She is in an elected office. She has been in an elected office.
This is not a private company. This is not a private individual. She is acting on behalf of the state of Kentucky. She needs to act on behalf or
get out of the way. Resign! Get out of the way!
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
CATHERWOOD: Listen. It is very similar. I used to wash dishes back in the day. I used to wash dishes and a kid that worked as a dishwasher with
me was Jewish. So, whenever, anybody ate anything with bacon I had to wash it, because he do not want to touch it. That is different. That is the
back of the kitchen. She works in a courthouse.
SORBA: But, she is OK with individuals getting their license, she just does not want her name on it. And, North Carolina has already passed a law
that allows her that and 30 clerks have signed up and no longer issue marriage licenses.
SCHACHER: But, she is telling the deputies not to authorize the licenses either.
PINSKY: Ryan, I have a suggestion. She should obey the law of the land and allow the legislative process to wield to turn, and to be patient and
get her name off those licenses but not take the law into her own hands in the meantime. How about that? Is not that right?
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SORBA: Well, I do not think so. I do not think so. Because she has to put her name, her stamp of approval on something that she believes and a
lot of people believe and for 10,000 years it has been believed that it is a sin.
I mean it does not matter if you think it is right or wrong. It has been believed to be a sin, A. And, B. She has to put her stamp of approval on
that. She should not be forced to have to do that.
ODUOLOWU: Mike, can I ask you a real quick question.
PINSKY: For Ryan? For Mike or Ryan?
ODUOLOWU: Ryan. I am sorry, Ryan.
SORBA: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: Can I ask you a real quick question?
SORBA: Sure.
ODUOLOWU: How can she love the process and be elected, but now she wants to fight the laws that actually put her in office? Like she is an elected
official. She was cool with it this time. But, now, that they pass a law she does not like she does not want to follow it.
It is like the Christian who says, "OK, I am not mad. I want you to follow the bible this way." But in Leviticus where it says, "Do not do blood
transfusions." I am not going to follow that. You do not get to parse the bible and parse the law.
PINSKY: Well, let me get to the audience here --
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SCHACHER: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: So, why do not she just step down.
SCHACHER: Yes, Segun! Yes.
PINSKY: Hold your thoughts. Yes, sir. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Well, first of all, Dr. Drew, I would like to -- I am totally appalled by the whole situation. I do not like the
comparison to civil right and gender marriage, first of all. And, second of all, this lady, obviously broke the law. I think three-strike law
should be applied to her. I really do.
PINSKY: That is interesting.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: And, I also feel that America needs to do more research on who they vote for.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: OK. Fair enough. Ryan, do you want to respond to Segun before we go out?
SORBA: I mean, she was elected before this law was passed. There are certain laws that we, as human beings, prior to even being Americans, have
a fundamental duty to obey our conscience over the law of the land. Like I am not going to go kill anybody no matter what, whether or not -- I would
not enact the death penalty.
I would not be the person that would enact the death penalty. I would not be the person who would perform an abortion, even if I was a doctor and
Obama Care mandated that it happen. I just simply would not do it.
PINSKY: OK.
(CROSSTALK)
ODUOLOWU: The bible calls for an eye for an eye.
SORBA: This is what happens when you got mutually contradictory world views living under the same democratic form of government. It is like
having a Marxist economy in a capitals economy --
MARTIN: It is not that complicated --
(CROSSTALK)
CATHERWOOD: Simply because nowhere did the founding fathers when they left a monarchy with religious ideals implemented into their government in
England when they got on ships and risked their lives to come here, nowhere did they say, "Well, we have different economic -- we cannot have different
economic ideas under this one blanket." They did say, "We cannot have a blend of church and state."
PINSKY: And --
CATHERWOOD: And moral ideas, ethical ideas do not have anything to do with the laws of this country.
PINSKY: I got to get out. I have to go. But, Ryan, I do think you are on to something about these world views, because that does keep coming up in
these conversations. But I would direct people to their history. Their different world views in the north and the south.
There are different world views about -- we keep coming back to issues of slavery. Whenever you see a minority that has been put down over long
periods of time, it is usually in the name of maintaining a certain kind of society, a certain kind of world view, same language that we are using
here. Just think it through, everybody.
[21:24:54] Next up, Cecil, the lion, killer is out of hiding. Tonight, he has a message for all the haters and you will hear it, back after this.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE SPEAKER: He is dead, lured out of the park, allegedly, by this American hunter and his professional guides of the dentist; who
Dentist Walter Palmer from Minnesota.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SCHACHER: I do not wish harm on him. I do not. But, I will call him what he is, and he is a piece of (EXPLETIVE WORD).
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
VANESSA BARNETT, SOCIAL COMMENTATOR: We have dominion over animals. We are the superior species around here.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCHACHER: To lure a lion away from its safe haven, to then shine a spotlight on it, shoot it with a bow and arrow, track it for three days
while it is suffering and then to shoot it, and then decapitate it and skin it, just so he can feed his ego.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SANDRA CLARK ANIMAL RICHGTS ACTIVIST: Cecil, the lion, does not care? How do you know that?
CATHERWOOD: If Cecil will eat --
CLARK: And I think -- for you to think that we are above --
CATHERWOOD: No. Listen.
CLARK: -- these animals.
CATHERWOOD: Sandra. Sandra, I am a huge -- I do not eat meat. I am very acutely aware of how animals have feelings. But, make no mistake, if Cecil
had his choice, he would eat all of us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHING)
PINSKY: The dentist who killed Cecil, the lion, is back at work after weeks in hiding. I am back with Sam, Areva, Mike, Segun, and joining us
Wes Siler. He is a Big Game Hunter and editor of "Indefinitely Wild."
[21:30:06] Now, Dr. Walter Palmer told reporters this, quote, " I need to get back to my staff and my patients and they want me back." So, Sam, you
know, social media these days has become, I do not know, a dangerous environment.
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: That is largely where a lot of this is being acted out. Should this man`s ability to practice and his livelihood be destroyed?
SCHACHER: Listen, I think he has a wife. He has a daughter. So, I do have grave concerns about that. And, I do not think anybody should be
threatening him or wishing him harm. I do think that social media has exposed him to who he is. I cannot --
PINSKY: Who is he?
SCHACHER: I think exactly what I called him in the tape. I think he is a piece of (EXPLETIVE WORD). I am sorry that you are here. I am sorry.
But, the thing is, when you are killing a live animal simply for the thrill of it, not for conservation, not for food or for survival, just so you can
decapitate it and hang it on your mantle, that to me really shows that you are a morally bankrupt person. And, I think that really speaks to the type
of character or lack of character that you have. Sorry.
(AUDIENCE APLAUDING)
PINSKY: Wes, are we way off base?
WES SILER, BIG GAME HUNTER AND EDITOR OF "INDEFINITELY WILD": What have you done for lions in Africa?
SCHACHER: Well, I have not done anything for lions.
SILER: First of all, what have you done?
SCHACHER: First of all, I am a vegetarian.
SILER: The lions exists --
SCHACHER: I am a vegan.
SILER: The lions exist in Africa today because of hunting for no other reasons.
SCHACHER: That is not true. That is not true.
SILER: They exist because we pay for it.
SCHACHER: That is not true.
SILER: That is exactly why they exist.
SCHACHER: That is not true.
SILER: $100 million a year specifically to animal conservation in Africa. How much do you contribute?
SCHACHER: There is a number -- first of all, I wish you guys would -- because I know it is an elitist sport. So, if you have the money to hunt
these beautiful majestic creatures, I would hope that if your goal, your aim is to help these communities, I would hope that you would rather donate
to the communities rather than use it as an excuse to kill an innocent being.
And, as opposed to like what have I done for animals? I have actually done a lot for animals. I am also a vegetarian. I am also a vegan, therefore I
stand behind. I do not agree with --
PINSKY: But his point is -- his point is -- let us stay with his point.
SCHACHER: There is a number of different things that you can do for conservation. And, first of all, African Lions, elephants, they are an
endangered species. So, how is killing an endangered species helping the conservation of it?
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: Go ahead, Wes.
SILER: What do you think local communities in Africa think about lions?
PINSKY: What did you say? I am sorry.
SILER: What do you think local communities in Africa think about lions?
ODUOLOWU: Well, I can answer that as an African.
PINSKY: Yes.
ODUOLOWU: I could do that.
PINSKY: Go ahead. Go ahead.
ODUOLOWU: Because the Maasai tribe actually hunt a lion as a rite of passage. So, they have always looked at it as a majestic beast, as Sam
said. But, I am not going to say what you may do. But most of you guys, they call yourselves hunters, you do not stalk the prey with manmade tools.
SCHACHER: Thank you.
ODUOLOWU: You are luring these animals.
PINSKY: Wait. Wait.
ODUOLOWU: You want to call yourself a hunter, stalk the prey. Do it with your bare hands. Give the animals a fighting chance.
PINSKY: Segun, wait, wait.
ODUOLOWU: Do not hide in the blind and start gunning them down.
SILER: Now, personally, I do stalk them myself -- by myself.
ODUOLOWU: I am talking about the majority of your brethren.
SILER: I use tools. I use real tools. I use bow and arrow. I use a rifle, right.
ODUOLOWU: Wait a second. You did not pour the metal for the rifle, like - - the bow and arrow --
PINSKY: Segun. Segun. Hey, guys. Hey, guys. Segun, you did not answer the question. How did the Nigerian people --
SILER: Zimbabwe. Zimbabwe.
ODOULOWU: Well, no, African people, in general --
PINSKY: How about in Zimbabwe, do you know?
ODUOLOWU: They always look as lions --
PINSKY: No, no. Forget the majestic quality. Are they frightened of them?
ODUOLOWU: No, they are not.
PINSKY: Are they interested of them?
ODUOLOWU: It is not a matter of --
SILER: I would argue that they are. I would argue that they are.
SCHACHER: So, you are a hero? If I lived in one of these -- If I lived in one of these --
ODUOLOWU: No. That is not true. They are not afraid of the lions, because they understand that the lions coexist in this area --
SILER: That is not the case. That is not true.
SCHACHER: Even if that is the case. If I lived -- Hold on. Even if that is the case, as a villager, then they are in fear of their children, of
their village at least for them that is survival. What is it to you?
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
SILER: A lion in Africa -- to Africans is nothing but a pest. It kills livestock. It threatens -- it is a pest. It is a --
(CROSSTALK)
SCHACHER: First of all, you are not -- you are not doing this for heroic reasons. Why are you really doing this?
PINSKY: One at a time. There is nobody can hear you because everybody is talking over everybody else. Yes, ma`am. Let us get this lady a mic.
Give her a microphone, please. Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Well, first of all, I am born and raised in Africa.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: Fantastic.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: So, for everyone speaking on behalf of the Africans --
PINSKY: Wait. Where were you born?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: I am born and raised in south Africa, spent time in Zimbabwe. My grandparents are from Zimbabwe.
PINSKY: And, help to answer Wes` question.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: We are not running around in fear of lions. They are in protected game reserves. These hunters are going in
and killing them in our game reserves and then saying, "Oh, we are population controlling."
PINSKY: So, hold on. I want to get more information. When did you leave Africa?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Four years ago.
PINSKY: Are people like Wes looked upon as somewhat encouraged?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: No.
PINSKY: Do they want their business?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: No. We do not want that.
PINSKY: Are people conflicted about it? Are they conflicted --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: That is why we have posters everywhere saying, "Stop poaching. You are killing our animals, our
rhinos." And, they are going back to America and saying, "Oh, the Africans want it." The Africans want it?
SILER: So, let us talk about rhinos for a second.
PINSKY: Yes.
SILER: In the early `80s, there were less than 1,000 white rhinos in South Africa. Today, there is over 11,000. That is specifically because of
hunting and because of game reserves. Game reserves exist to serve hunters. They do not exist for any other reason. They exist to serve
hunters, and they cover a couple area in South Africa to your national parks.
[21:35:12] PINSKY: Hold on, everybody.
SILER: Your national park system at conservation.
PINSKY: Everybody, hold. Hold. I will give you a chance to respond to it. I will give you chance to gather your thoughts. Think about it across
this quick commercial break. We will keep this going.
Later on, Josh Duggar`s past comes back to haunt him. Shocking. We got the latest. Back after this.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Do you feel that this kind of like fuels this online rage machine that it is like --
PINSKY: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: It just seems to me like the next in a long line of like instantly forgotten things, like over the weekend it was
Hulk Hogan being racist. Now, we are on to this guy.
PINSKY: Yes. You know, you are right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Tomorrow will be something else.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SIMONE REYES, ANIMAL RIGHTS ACTIVIST: The mob is walking toward compassion then I say let the mob run everybody else over who wants to murder and kill
animals.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:40:03] CAMERON HANES, BIG GAME BOW HUNTER: We are over animals. We are not equal with animals. People try to humanize especially Cecil.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARNETT: Sometimes it is like, "Yes, we can take some animal lives and this is legal, but no, not the famous lion. We do not want you to kill
him." And, I just need some consistency.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SCOTT NATHAN, PHOTOGRAPHER AND A BIG GAME HUNTER: I think everyone at one time in their life, if they eat meat should pay the full karmic price for
their food. It may make them vegan. It may make them a hunter but either way, it will teach them respect of where their food comes from.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Despite death threats, the dentist who killed Cecil, the lion, back in his job, back as his professional functioning as a dentist. I am
back with Sam, Areva, Mike, Segun and Wes. And, Wes, has this whole controversy change anything? Are people still going out on trophy hunts as
they always have?
SILER: I have had a lot of interesting conversations recently about hunting. I went on a bear hunt last month in Washington states and I got
into some very interesting discussion with --
PINSKY: Now, I want to stop you. My understanding is that bear hunts are conservation oriented. They need to do that.
SILER: Yes, they are. If you are managing a population --
PINSKY: Yes.
SILER: -- the animal would have to die regardless. If I did not pay money to go kill it, therefore fund conservation in America, that is what funds
conservation in America is the fees hunters pay to kill animals, absolutely has for the last hundred years, they do not have to be killed by wildlife
services using taxpayer money and be poisoned or trap it and it would suffer.
SCHACHER: But, Wes, is there -- OK, for you as a hunter -- I understand conservation hunting and hunting for food and survival. But, do you
personally -- do you see the difference or do you trophy hunt as well just for the thrill of it, and to hang its head on the mantle or are you more of
a conservation hunter?
SILER: Personally, I hunt for food.
SCHACHER: OK.
SILER: And, it is the healthiest food I can put on my table.
SCHACHER: I agree with you. It is much better than factory farming. That I agree with you.
SILER: Absolutely. Absolutely. I am with you on that.
SCHACHER: Yes.
SILER: Eating factory farm meat is disgusting.
SCHACHER: I know. As John Lennon always said, if there is a window at a slaughterhouse, we would all be vegetarians.
SILER: Absolutely.
PINSKY: OK. Now, I want to give my African friend here, a chance to answer the comments that Wes made before the commercial break. Wes, why
will not you -- can you summarize again what you were saying that got everyone kind of spun here before we went to commercial?
SILER: Hunting pays for conservation in Africa. There has to be specific economic incentive.
PINSKY: But she was saying that they were calling it poaching and you were saying --
SILER: Poaching and hunting are completely separate things. Poaching is evil and bad. Hunting is a legitimate sport, but the fees for hunting pay
for conservation.
SCHACHER: The only percentage of the fees actually go to the conservation.
PINSKY: I want to know how the African -- the people --
SILER: Can I address that?
SCHACHER: That is not true.
PINSKY: Let her speak first.
SILER: I apologize. Go ahead.
PINSKY: Go ahead.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: There is just a few things I want to know. First of all, going back to poaching, hunting. If it is an
endangered animal, you are poaching it. It is not hunting. You are killing an animal that we need on this earth and for everyone who says
lions run around and kill people, they do not. That is a myth.
PINSKY: Are you unusual in local population in terms of the opinion you hold?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: No.
PINSKY: Or are you representative opinion?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: No. I am with many.
PINSKY: OK. What about these conservation dollars? Where else would they come from?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: Sorry, what was that?
PINSKY: The conservation dollars that Wes keeps referring? Where would they come from?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: So, this is my question. How much does man pay to murder a lion? Where did that money go? Because I can
guarantee that money did not go back into conservation. I guarantee it went into the pockets of the disgusting people who are out there, allowing
them to kill these animals.
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: OK.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE AUDIENCE MEMBER: It is not going back to us. It is going back to those people in their pockets. I can guarantee that money
never went to a single conservation.
PINSKY: Segun, did you want to comment on this?
ODUOLOWU: Yes. I think we are going so far afield. This man did not hunt the lion. Luring the lion out of a game reserve and flashing a flashlight
in its eyes, to murder it and kill it. That is not hunting. So, everything that you do might be legal. It might even go to conservation,
but this guy did not do that.
PINSKY: Wes, finish this up first. How should we leave it?
SILER: You are absolutely correct. The money goes into people`s pockets. It is called capitalism and it works. And, the reason the lions exist is
because there is an economic incentive and the local economy benefits. People get rich off this.
PINSKY: OK. Last thought. We will give you final thought. We did this topic again with you in mind.
SCHACHER: I am sure you did.
PINSKY: So, I will give you the final thought.
SCHACHER: Because you wanted to get me riled up. Final thought, there is a number of different conservation efforts. I know that 3 percent to 5
percent from the hunters, typically only that small amount go to -- there is a number of other things where you do not have to kill the lions.
SILER: It is known as economic incentives.
SCHACHER: Why do not these elitists, why do not these rich people --
SILER: They would not exist, otherwise.
SCHACHER: No, that is not true.
SILER: They would not exist otherwise.
SCHACHER: That just helps you escape the public scrutiny.
SILER: For the last hundred years, hunting has paid for conservation.
PINSKY: I do not think we are going to solve this tonight. We are going to leave it. Thank you, Wes. Mike and Areva and I have been standing by
watching the argument.
SCHACHER: We have agreed on one thing, though. We did. We agreed on some things. It is fine. It is fine.
PINSKY: OK. Good. All right. So, farm food meat is no good.
SCHACHER: And, I cannot even -- it is fine.
PINSKY: Coming up --
SILER: Industrialized torture of animals is no good.
PINSKY: it is getting -- what?
SILER: Industrialized torture of animals is no good.
PINSKY: Coming up. It is getting worse and worse for Josh Duggar. I will tell you, what he is accused of going now of having done. We are back
after this.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
[21:45:04] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PINSKY: Time for -- That is right. It is time for "Click Fix," where my guests tell me what is trending on their Twitter, Facebook and Instagram
feeds. And, it is Sam, first.
SCHACHER: OK. So, my "Click Fix" is a video that has quickly gone viral. A video that was shot by YouTube star Nicole Arbor. She is a comedian. I
beg to differ.
PINSKY: Yes.
SCHACHER: And, this is a video -- a fat-shaming video that a lot of people are saying has gone too far.
PINSKY: Wait a minute.
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: Wait, wait, wait, before you -- She is a YouTube phenomenon for being funny.
SCHACHER: She is a comedian --
PINSKY: For having been funny. She thought this was funny.
(LAUGHING)
SCHACHER: She thought -- Yes, she is calling this satire.
PINSKY: Yes.
SCHACHER: She is also calling herself a hero. She is also saying that she wants to help people be healthy.
PINSKY: All right. Because I want to understand because I heard about this and I was disgusted but have not seen it yet. So, I want to sort of
set it up.
SCHACHER: I cannot wait for you to watch.
PINSKY: Let us watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[21:50:00] NICOLE ARBOR, POSTED A FAT-SHAMING VIDEO ON YOUTUBE: Dear fat people -- some people are really mad at this video. What are you going to
do, fat people? What are you going to do? What? Are you going to chase me? I can get away from you by walking at a reasonable pace. Fat-shaming
is not offense. Fat people made that up.
That is what race care with no race. Yes, but I could not fit into the store. That is discrimination. No that means you are too fat, and you
should stop eating. Fat people`s parking spot should be at the back of the whole parking lot. Walk to the doors and burn some calories.
And, they smell like sausages and I do not even think they ate sausages. They are so fat that they are that standing sweat fat. Crisco was coming
out of their pores like a [EXPLETIVE WORD] Play-Do Fun factory. Fat shaming, who came up with that? That is [EXPLETIVE WORD] brilliant. Yes,
shame people who have bad habit [EXPLETIVE WORD]. Fat shaming.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCHACHER: So, first of all, her video was taken down by YouTube as well as her channel suspended. However, YouTube spokesperson told CNN that
suspending her channel was a mistake. Now, it is back up.
Like I stated earlier, she is saying that she is not targeting overweight people because she is a, quote, "A-hole." She says her purpose for the
video is to make them quote healthier. I call her a bully. She is a bully.
PINSKY: Here is what I feel with this. It makes me -- I do not get angry. I get sad.
SCHACHER: Yes.
PINSKY: I feel hurt for people that she is shaming, and such bad judgment. I mean what --
SCHACHER: Nothing funny about it.
CATHERWOOD: Well, it also shines the light on this when people are like -- I am an internet celebrity. A lot of times that is great because it puts
the power back on the artist. But, usually, it means they did not have what it takes to make it through the crucible of the entertainment
industry.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
By the way, that video is funny for the chick who has the nice rack at the water cooler at your office. A regular -- like a real working comedian
took that on stage, you would boo him or her right off.
SCHACHER: Yes.
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
CATHERWOOD: It is totally unclever. I mean --
PINSKY: Areva?
MARTIN: OK. My "Click Fix" is about the newest sleeping aid. Have you heard about this, Dr. Drew?
PINSKY: What? You mean something for insomniacs?
MARTIN: Something that will put you to sleep.
PINSKY: Really?
MARTIN: Take a look.
(LAUGHING)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE ANNOUNCER: Having trouble sleeping at night? Too much energy? Need some low energy? They have an HSA in some companies. Some
companies do not, but I think the norm ought to be --
Jeb for all your sleeping needs.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(LAUGHING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: So, that was a Donald Trump ad?
MARTIN: Yes, the Donald Trump. The Donald posted this video to Instagram when a woman at Jeb Bush`s rally nodded off. So, Jeb responded by posting
that the woman -- and he tweeted something.
He said, "Look, I am in awe of working moms like Tara, who woke up at 4:00 A.M. after doing a 12-hour shift. Made me tired just hearing about it."
So, he tried to put a nice spin on it saying, "This is a working woman who came to the event. Fell asleep because she have been working, not because
he is low energy."
PINSKY: I am just glad to know that I have another treatment option for my patients who is sleeping disorder. Mike, what do you got?
CATHERWOOD: A 20-year-old student at Texas state is tooling around campus in a Barbie jeep. And, it is swirling around the social media kind of --
PINSKY: This is the best "Click Fix" I have ever --
CATHERWOOD: Yes.
PINSKY: This has been the best combination of "Click Fixes" ever.
CATHERWOOD: So, she got her license suspended for refusing a breathalyzer. Ultimately, she was arrested for DUI. Her dad took away her car because of
the DUI and gave her bicycle.
She sold the bicycle, bought this Barbie Jeep on craigslist for 60 bucks. And, her classmates began sharing her photos all over social media. She is
also being vilified by her critics, who say she is using the Barbie Jeep to make a mockery of her DUI.
SCHACHER: Oh, come on! She is resourceful. She is resourceful.
MARTIN: She is making a mockery of Barbie.
(LAUGHING)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: This is why I love working with alcoholics. They are wonderful. I will see her at AA later on. I will check it out. She needs a little 12
step. But, in the meantime she is certainly colorful.
Next, I will give you my take on Josh Duggar and his secret problematic past. Back after this.
(MUSIC PLAYING)
(AUDIENCE PLAYING)
[21:54:12] (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(AUDIENCE APPLAUDING)
PINSKY: All right, Josh Duggar reportedly remains in some sort of treatment for his sexual addiction. His past as the executive director of
the family research council, of course, continues to haunt him. Here he is in 2014 rallying against gay rights. Take a look at this.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOSH DUGGAR, SEX ADDICT: This is not just about marriage. As we know, marriage is between a man and a woman. And, I am honored to have been
married to my wife for over five years, and we have three wonderful children.
As, I think about the beauty of marriage and God`s design in that and the natural definition of marriage, I think about and I am reminded of all of
us who are people of faith, who hold strong and deep convictions in this area.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PINSKY: Well, apparently his faith conviction included visiting a porn star. She tells E.T. that she had sex with Duggar while his wife was
pregnant and that he had paid her thousands to remain quiet.
SCHACHER: Wow!
PINSKY: Now, a second mistress tells "In Touch" that she had a pregnancy scare with this guy, with Duggar after having had unprotected sex with this
married father of four.
CATHERWOOD: Well, he cannot use a condom, Drew. He cannot use a condom. It is anti-religious.
PINSKY: That must be against his faith. The porn star, good. Ashley Madison, good.
CATHERWOOD: Yes.
MARTIN: Sisters. Nothing is off limits.
PINSKY: Here is the deal. This guy got all the earmarks of sex addiction. This guy has had a long problem that his family has been in denial about.
I, actually, I am more angry with the parents and the family that kept this guy insulated from treatment.
And, it seems they are continuing to do so. He has been in some sort of faith-based treatment that will not be adequate for him. He needs real
treatment. It is going to get worse if he does not.
A reminder, we are on SnapChat. Join us there. It is DrDrewHLN. DVR us and you can watch us any time. I want to thank you all for watching.
Thank you, panel, and we will see you next time. .
[22:00:00] (AUDIENCE CHEERING AND APPLAUDING)
(MUSIC PLAYING)
END
