Return to Transcripts main page
Erin Burnett Outfront
Police: 12 Year-Old Opens Fire In Middle School; Dad Killed For Allegedly Texting At A Movie; Christie: "Mistakes Were Clearly Made"; Third Southwest Employee Suspended; America's New Crisis: Heroin
Aired January 14, 2014 - 19:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
DON LEMON, CNN GUEST ANCHOR: Next, breaking news, the school shooting at a New Mexico middle school. New details about the young gunman.
Plus, how did a Southwest plane land at the wrong airport? We take you inside the cockpit for an exclusive bird's eye view of what happened.
And a new crisis is in the U.S. Heroin! Let's go OUTFRONT.
Good evening, everyone. I'm Don Lemon in tonight for Erin Burnett. We're going to begin with some breaking news. Two shootings, the first one, in New Mexico involving a 12-year-old who entered his middle school gym and opened fire, two students were involved, one in critical. Two students were wounded, one in critical, the other in serious condition.
I want to get straight to CNN's Miguel Marquez with the very latest on this. Miguel, 12 years old, really, is this the youngest yet?
MIGUEL MARQUEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You would think it is, but shockingly it is not, perhaps not so shockingly. In 1998, there was a young man by the name of Andrew Golden who shot and killed, along with an accomplish, shot and killed five people in Jonesboro, Arkansas. This is the first time in a long, long time we have seen anyone this young, Don. We should be shocked by it, but the way these things are going, it doesn't seem we can be shocked by these shootings anymore.
LEMON: Unbelievable. As we look at video of that school shooting now. Apparently, it was a shotgun. It isn't small. Do we know how he got into the school, Miguel?
MARQUEZ: Yes, police are saying that he had it in a bag. There are reports that it was put into an instrument case of some sort. That's how he got into the gymnasium of the school. It was cold in Roswell this morning, this happened about 7:30 in the morning. He walked into the gymnasium and because it was so cold out. The kids, and this is a middle school, sixth grade to eighth grade, they were all in the gym.
He walked in, said the governor of New Mexico and started to open fire. It is still not clear if he was aiming for these two particular individuals or if he was just an angry young man wanting to kill.
LEMON: Miguel Marquez, thank you for your reporting. Let's move on now and talk about the other shooting where a 71-year- old retired police officer is facing life in prison after allegedly shooting and killing a man who was texting during a movie. It all started during the previews ahead of Monday afternoon's showing of the film "Lone Survivor" at a theater outside of Tampa Florida.
The 43-year-old Chad Oulson was at the movies with his wife texting with the babysitter taking care of their young daughter. Witnesses say the ex-cop, Curtis Reeves, told Oulson to put his phone away. The men argued but authorities say there was no physical contact. Oulson did throw popcorn at Reeves. That's when the police say Reeves took out a semi-automatic handgun and shot Oulson.
Martin Savidge is near the movie theater with this sad story. Martin, you're on the ground now. It must be a shock obviously to the community. How are they dealing with the tragedy?
MARTIN SAVIDGE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think, you know, Don, they are just like the rest of the country absolutely shocked and dumbfounded that this could happen. The movie theater which is located behind me here remains closed tonight. The sheriff at a news conference this afternoon, you could see he was visibly shaken and in fact, he says that this community.
This is pretty much a rural area, not the beaches and palm tree kind of Florida. This is the farm fields and tall trees kind of Florida. They are offering PTSD counseling for everybody in this community because that's how deeply this tragedy has been felt. So like everybody were how does it is happen. That's the feeling here -- Don.
LEMON: Martin, there you are back in Florida. You know when we talk about Florida. This happened there, is there any talk of stand your ground?
SAVIDGE: Yes, well that was the first thing that came up in a lot of people's minds because remember now, Curtis Reeves, this is the 71- year-old suspect who is in custody, he is claiming that there was an unknown object that was thrown into his face that came from Chad Oulson, he says. Now the witnesses who were there say the only thing that was thrown after this heated argument was a bag of popcorn. That was it. There were no punches thrown.
But the defense attorney was implying it could have been something else. So immediately the sheriff's office began investigating on the grounds of could it be a stand your ground case. The detectives have come back and the sheriff says there is no way the defense could use "Stand Your Ground" in this case. It does not apply. They do not see it as a legitimate defense -- Don.
LEMON: And prosecutors say that Reeves was part of a similar incident before. What are you hearing, Martin?
SAVIDGE: Yes, this is really weird. This came out both at the hearing. There was a bond hearing today that was held for Reeves and he was denied bond, by the way, and he appeared by a video link and he had what looked like a bullet proof vest or some sort of protective clothing. The prosecution alluded to this and then it came out with the news conference later from the sheriff.
A woman has now come forward and said that two weeks ago she was in this very same movie theater and she was also using her phone in some way and was accosted by a man. She is implying and the prosecution is implying this is the very same man, that is Curtis Reeves who is in custody now for the shooting.
She's implying that he apparently had words with her and that she felt very uncomfortable and it was considered to be an altercation. The authorities are investigating. They don't know yet if it was the same man or not, but it certainly is strange.
LEMON: Yes. It certainly is. Martin Savidge on top of the story. Martin, thank you very much.
Tonight, Chris Christie admits mistakes were made facing New Jersey lawmakers for his "State of the State" address. Governor Christie couldn't avoid the George Washington Bridge scandal that has plagued his administration recently so instead he tackled it right out of the gate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GOVERNOR CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), NEW JERSEY: Mistakes were clearly made and as a result, we let down the people we are entrusted to serve. I know our citizens deserve better. It's much better. I'm the governor and I'm ultimately responsible for all that happens on my watch both good and bad. Now, without a doubt, we will cooperate with all appropriate inquiries to ensure that this breach of trust does not happen again.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: I wonder if it was some sort of let's get this out of the way strategy. Jake Tapper joins us now from New Jersey State House in Trenton. So Jake, you know, did he do enough to address the scandal in his speech? He addressed it right off the top then he quickly moved on.
JAKE TAPPER, CNN CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPODENT: Yes, that was the game plan. He did three basic points when it came to the bridge scandal. He said that mistakes were made although you could quibble whether or not a vendetta is a mistake. Mistakes are made. He accepted responsibility. Said he would cooperate with any appropriate investigation and then with that said I moved on.
One of the interesting points that he made in his "State of the State" address was he kept on talking about working in a bipartisan fashion. Now, of course, in a state with a Democratic legislature and a Republican governor by definition, it has to be bipartisan.
But that is the selling point he's been trying to make not only here in New Jersey to voters, but to Republicans about winning an election. Look at me. I can win Democratic voters and I can work with Democrats and get things done. Of course, that reputation for building bridges has been undercut a bit by this bridge scandal. LEMON: He said this George Washington bridge scandal, quote, this is a quote, "Does not define New Jersey, but inevitably in some way, I don't want to read too much into this and I think people are reading a lot into it. Is this going to inevitably define Chris Christie, Jake?
TAPPER: I guess it's tough to say right now, but it's certainly the biggest controversy that he's ever of had to endure. So in that sense, yes, in the sense that if you look at every politician, if there is a controversy or a scandal on his watch that ends up defying him to a degree, you can say the Obamacare roll out defines President Obama to a degree.
You can look at the war in Iraq or the handling of Hurricane Katrina in the aftermath and say that defines George W. Bush. It will always be part of the litany of biographical details. It's hard to imagine this won't be in that, but Christie has an opportunity I think it's fair to say to move beyond it if it turns out that he truly had nothing to do with it. But the idea that staffers of his were involved in this apparently for a political vendetta, yes, that will probably be with him for a long, long time.
LEMON: I think what you're saying there it's not the mistake, it's the recovery. Sometimes that's more important than the actual mistake. Jake Tapper, thank you, sir.
And still to come, new developments in the Madeleine McCann case. The world followed every detail in the search for this little girl and now there might finally be a break in this case.
Plus a Southwest Airlines airplane lands at the wrong airport. How could this happen? Tonight, we take to the air to find out.
A shocking new crisis in America, you don't want to miss this report on heroin.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: There are new developments in the case of the Southwest plane that landed at the wrong airport. The airline has suspended the dispatcher who was sitting in the cockpit when the error occurred. Both pilots were placed on paid leave yesterday while the National Transportation Safety Board investigates how the plane with 124 passengers ended up at a small municipal airport 7 miles from its intended destination.
David Mattingly is in Missouri tonight with an exclusive bird's eye view on how it could have happened.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
UNIDENTIFIED PILOT: And cleared for take-off 5,000 on course, Chancellor 36887.
DAVID MATTINGLY, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Taking to the air over Branson, Missouri, we're retracing the last moments of a wrong way landing that put a very big passenger jet on a very small runway. Missouri flight instructor, Matt Zeiman, gives us a pilot's eye view.
(on camera): When you first heard about this, what was your reaction?
MATT ZEIMAN, MISSOURI FLIGHT INSTRUCTOR: My reaction was shock.
MATTINGLY (voice-over): A Southwest Airline 737 came to a screeching halt Sunday night at a small county airport, 7 miles from its intended destination in Branson. A potentially disastrous error we discover that seems surprisingly easy to make.
(on camera): So this is where they made their mistake right here.
ZEIMAN: That's exactly it.
MATTINGLY (voice-over): Our camera can't show it, but just 10 miles out, both airports are clearly visible. Just a slight turn of the wheel can make all the difference.
(on camera): Seven miles apart does not look like much up here.
ZEIMAN: No, not at all.
MATTINGLY: And if you're in a big commercial jet flying faster than we are right now, that difference is even smaller, right?
ZEIMAN: That is correct.
MATTINGLY: Can you see that, can you see the runway straight ahead of us?
ZEIMAN: Yes, clear as day.
MATTINGLY (voice-over): From up here the runway seems impossibly short. It's obviously obvious it wasn't built for large aircraft. Flying at night, the Southwest pilots probably didn't realize their mistake until it was too late. They passed the point of no return just 200 feet before they were in for the shock of their lives.
(on camera): When they realized their mistake, they had to be panicking. There was nowhere to go.
ZEIMAN: Yes, they had one choice. They could either go or they could or they're going to have to get it stopped.
MATTINGLY: How did they possibly stop it?
ZEIMAN: I have no idea how they got it stopped before the end of that runway.
MATTINGLY (voice-over): It takes just 10 seconds matching the landing speed of the 737 to go from one end of the runway to the other.
ZEIMAN: As we come up to the end of the runway here, you're going to notice, the big cliff.
MATTINGLY (on camera): Unbelievable. ZEIMAN: The aircraft is at downtown airport.
MATTINGLY: Look at that.
(voice-over): A view out the side of our plane reveals the abrupt drop and the unsuspecting motorists below. Amazingly, the 737 stopped averting tragedy with just 500 feet to spare.
(on camera): They could have so easily gone off the end of that right onto the expressway.
(voice-over): But as we fly safely away, the question of how could this happen seems overshadowed by something even harder to grasp.
(on camera): How did they pull this off safely?
ZEIMAN: It's actually -- it's a pretty incredible feat to be able to land such a large aircraft on a small runway.
MATTINGLY (voice-over): With no shortage of small miracles for the more than 100 passengers on board.
David Mattingly, CNN, Branson, Missouri.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Unbelievable. Thank you, David.
More new details we're following tonight in the case of missing British girl Madeleine McCann. According to Scotland Yard, investigators are asking Portuguese authorities for permission to interview three people who may be connected to the little girl's disappearance.
The 3-year-old was on vacation with her parents in Portugal back in 2007 when she disappeared and her case has generated headlines around the world.
Erin McLaughlin is in London with the very latest on this unsolved mystery.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ERIN MCLAUGHLIN, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): More than six years after their 3-year-old daughter vanished from a family vacation in Portugal, Kate and Gerry McCann still say they will never give up hope that they will find Madeleine alive.
After reopening the case last year, British police are still chasing down hundreds of leads. On Friday, the Crown Prosecution Services sent an international letter of request to authorities in Portugal, asking for permission to conduct interviews in connection with Madeleine's disappearance.
This latest development prompting speculation that the mystery of Madeleine's disappearance may be connected to a surge of burglaries in the area. Seventeen days before the Madeleine went missing, there were two separate break-ins near the apartments where the McCanns were staying on holiday.
JOHN O'CONNOR, FORMER SCOTLAND YARD COMMANDER: It's likely that the apartment was broken into by a burglar or burglars, and for some reason or other, they have seen the opportunity to take Madeleine.
MCLAUGHLIN (on camera): Police in Portugal tell CNN they have yet to receive this letter from Britain, but they say they are aware that Scotland Yard is focusing their investigation on three individuals. And they noted that those individuals have not been detained.
(voice-over): Almost three years ago, Scotland Yard launched its own formal investigation after Portuguese authorities had failed to make any arrests in the case.
ANDY REDWOOD, METROPOLITAN POLICE: Even if it's just 0.1 percent chance that she's alive, we will continue to fight for her.
MCLAUGHLIN: And in October, a public appeal for help. Authorities released these computer-generated sketches of a man they say was seen in the area at the time Madeleine disappeared. They have also scoured cell phone records and interviewed over 400 people across 30 countries.
O'CONNOR: I think a key -- a key issue here is whether the Portuguese authorities, having had a lot of criticism over their handling of the case in the initial stages, will show as much enthusiasm for this investigation as Scotland Yard has been showing.
MCLAUGHLIN: Erin McLaughlin, CNN, London.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Still to come tonight: heading into the Super Bowl weekend with a huge blowout for the NFL that could cost the league more than a billion dollars.
Plus, police search Justin Bieber's home and allegedly they find drugs.
And then how you can feel like Jennifer Lawrence.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Justin Bieber might have egg on his face tonight. Los Angeles County Sheriff's searched the pop star's home today in connection to an attack on his neighbor last week and ended up allegedly finding ecstasy. That's what they say.
According to sheriff's department, investigators went to Bieber's house to search his security system to see if it could shed any light on who led an attack, an egg attack on his neighbor last Thursday. Instead, they allegedly found ecstasy and arrested one of Bieber's houseguests. OK. Got all that?
Rob Shuter is the host of "The Gossip Table" on VH-1. He's OUTFRONT tonight in our "Money and Power" segment.
So, according to the sheriff's department, Bieber isn't commenting on this egg attack, but what's the real story here? What is going on with Bieber?
ROB SHUTER, "THE GOSSIP TABLE": Right. He hasn't said a word.
So, at about 8:00 this morning, he was still asleep, and about 12 police cars turned up at his house with a search warrant to try and link him to this egg attack on a neighbor. I should point out, I mean, it is funny. But it's ended up being very serious.
LEMON: OK.
SHUTER: Now, he lives in a very fancy neighborhood, and his neighbor is quite a powerful man who has had enough of these shenanigans and has managed to get a search warrant.
They turned up at the house and they were actually looking to see if they could find matching eggs or stuff that was related to the crime. He has an amazing security system on this house. And they have taken that system. They're going to be looking through it very, very carefully.
However -- and this is where it gets very tricky -- during the search, a white powder was found and...
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: But it has not been tested.
SHUTER: It is being tested right now.
LEMON: So, we don't know. They think it's Molly.
SHUTER: They think it's Molly.
So, initially, the report was cocaine. Now they are saying it is Molly, which is still a serious drug.
LEMON: I used to egg my neighbor's house.
SHUTER: You're a terrible person.
LEMON: I used to toilet-paper their house. I did crazy stuff.
SHUTER: You did?
LEMON: But I wasn't a young kid with that much money and no supervision, because, if my parents found out, I got my butt whipped.
SHUTER: Well, your mother's listening now, I think. LEMON: Yes.
SHUTER: But an egg at somebody's house is not great.
LEMON: Yes.
SHUTER: However, we should point out Justin has been a problem neighbor for some time.
LEMON: There's a history, right?
SHUTER: He's been driving his car fast through the neighborhood. He's had a couple of run-ins with the neighbors. He's a young kid still. He's had some wild parties at the house. And the noise has been a little much. So, I think this is the final straw.
LEMON: Yes, they had been complaining about that and about him allegedly speeding through the neighborhood.
SHUTER: Yes, indeed, yes.
LEMON: This comes on the heels. Kanye West, he is named as a suspect in an assault on a man after allegedly threatening his girlfriend, Kim Kardashian. Is there something in the water in L.A.? What's up here?
(LAUGHTER)
SHUTER: This story, though, started out quite shocking. So, the headline was Kanye had attacked an 18-year-old guy in his chiropractor's office.
Now the story is getting deeper. And there is a backstory. The young gentleman allegedly called Kim an N-lover.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Right.
Well, first of all, said that we're calling the paparazzi N's and other names.
SHUTER: And Kim said, that's not a word you should use.
He got very angry about this. And now there's reports he even threatened her life. The family are furious about this. Kanye is drawing the line in the sand and he's saying he's going to use every legal method to his means to try and stop this.
LEMON: I understand he's really upset. And if someone is yelling that stuff at your girlfriend...
SHUTER: Absolutely.
LEMON: He was upstairs in the mall at a furniture store, apparently. She was supposed to meet him. And, where are you, right? He calls her. He calls him and then says, hey, listen, this happened. (CROSSTALK)
SHUTER: Yes, she was really distressed, really upset about it.
And Kanye allegedly punched this guy. He's going to get into trouble for that. But the public sentiment and what I'm hearing is that some people think that Kanye here might have a little bit of sympathy, because this is very...
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: I understand that. You're upset. But you have got to be above that. You have to sometimes just ignore people and say -- especially when it's a teenager -- if you're already in trouble for assaulting someone.
SHUTER: I agree with you. But emotions sometimes, especially with that word, and it's your -- the mother of your baby.
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: Thank you, Rob Shuter. Appreciate it, "The Gossip Table," VH- 1.
SHUTER: Thank you.
LEMON: Still to come: America's heroin addiction, it could be in your town, maybe even your home. The governor of Vermont, who says it is a full-blown crisis in his state, is going to join us to talk about it. You don't want to miss that.
Plus, a week after he brought you -- we brought you this story of the so-called thug cycle baby, if you thought what happened to this little boy was bad, you won't believe what we uncovered tonight.
And new developments in the fatal carjacking that claimed the life of a New Jersey attorney. We have the 911 call the victim's wife made that night.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
911 OPERATOR: Nine-one-one. Is this an emergency?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, it's an emergency! I'm at the Short Hills Mall parking lot. My husband has been shot. They called an ambulance a half-an-hour ago. Where is the ambulance?
911 OPERATOR: They're -- it's on -- they're on their way, ma'am. They're on their way.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: Welcome back to the second half of OUTFRONT. New developments in the fatal New Jersey carjacking that claimed the life of attorney Dustin Friedland. CNN has obtained the 911 call his wife made that night. Authorities say he was walking around their Range Rover after opening his wife's door helping her to get in when he was attacked. A struggle ensued and shots were fired.
(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)
OPERATOR: 911, is this an emergency?
FRIEDLAND: Yes, it's an emergency. I'm in the Short Hills Mall parking lot. My husband has been shot. They called the ambulance a half an hour ago. Where is he?
OPERATOR: They're on their way, ma'am. They're on their way.
FRIEDLAND: When, when, when?
OPERATOR: They're on their way, ma'am.
FRIEDLAND: Give me a time.
OPERATOR: They're there. They're at the mall. They're at the mall. They're trying to get to you, ma'am. They're trying to get with you. Speak with the officers, ma'am.
(END AUDIO CLIP)
LEMON: Well, Friedland was pronounced dead at the hospital nearby. Four men have been charged with killing him. They have pleaded not guilty.
Not enough money. That is the reason a federal judge refused to OK a $765 million settlement tore concussion-related claims made by NFL players. The deal called for the NFL to fund medical exams and research but the judge is, quote, "concerned not all retired NFL football players who ultimately receive a qualifying diagnosis will be paid."
The suit which includes more than 4,500 plaintiffs alleges the NFL led a campaign to deliberately misinform players about concussions which the league denies.
All publicity is good publicity -- well, Tesla Motors said today it sold 25 percent more Model S sedans in the four quarter than it did in the previous quarter. This despite some bad press at the end of last year over reports of overheating and cars catching fire. Even George Clooney said he had been stuck on the road.
Our Poppy Harlow asked Tesla founder Elon Musk about the bad PR.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ELON MUSK, TESLA FOUNDER: If false negative perceptions are allowed to linger for a long period of time, obviously, that's going to make people reluctant to buy electric cars. (END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: So, as a leader in electric cars, Musk went on to say that what affects Tesla good or bad affects the progress of electric cars.
OK. Whatever you're doing, I want you to sit down and take a few minutes and watch this. We're going to talk about America's new crisis. We're not talking about politics or the economy or even national security. We're talking about something much more personal.
It is creeping into your state, into your town and maybe even into your own home and you might not note about it. We're talking about the crisis that is heroin.
Listen to this -- nationwide, heroin use jumped more than 100 percent between 2002 and 2012. And overdose deaths increased 55 percent from 2000 to 2010.
All you had to do is open your local paper and it is clear the problem stretches clear across this country. And it is growing. Exponentially in places you'd never expect. Like Vermont where that state's governor thought it was so important, was important enough to dedicate his entire annual address to this issue.
We're going to speak with Vermont's Governor Peter Shumlin live in just a moment. There you see him there on your screen, along winning former heroin addict Bob Forrest who is also in your screen, who you might recognize as the ahead of addiction counselor on "Celebrity Rehab".
But, first, Tory Dunnan reports on why the crisis is growing the way it is. Look.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
TORY DUNNAN, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Did you ever think that you would be addicted to heroin?
JAMIE, RECOVERING HEROIN ADDICT: Not in a million years.
DUNNAN (voice-over): At 33 years old, Jami is trying to get clean. The native Bostonian is about to leave a rehab facility in the Florida. He says he started at a young age drinking, smoking pot and quickly moved on to pain pills, then eventually heroin.
JAMIE: I never thought in my wildest dreams I would ever stick a needle in my arm. You know, no one grows up thinking you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to be a heroin addict when I grow up.
DUNNAN (on camera): Is this a growing problem?
JAMIE: It's huge. It's huge. It's rampant.
The readily availableness of heroin is astronomical.
DUNNAN (voice-over): Nationwide, heroin use is skyrocketing. Yearly government drug survey shows in 2002, 166,000 Americans over the age of 12 said they had used heroin. It jumped to 335,000 users in 2012. Rehab facilities are seeing it front and center.
ROBERT PARKINSON, CLINICAL DIRECTOR: Literately this is the first year that I can remember seeing this many people coming in here with an addiction to heroin.
DUNNAN: Some police in Florida say the spike in heroin use is partly due to closing down pill mills. People are now turning to heroin to get their high.
SGT. NICOLE GUERRIERO, SPOKESWOMAN, DELRAY POLICE DEPT.: People were getting pills for around $10 or so here. And now, it's much more expensive.
DUNNAN (on camera): Is that kind of how much you can get the heroin for now?
GUERRIERO: We've heard it for as low as like $6 a capsule.
DUNNAN (voice-over): In the first two weeks of 2014, Delray Beach Police say they seized more heroin than the past 10 years combined. And authorities say this could be a problem that extends well beyond the city limits.
PARKINSON: It's not just a Florida thing. We're seeing it from -- we've got people from New York, New Jersey, Kentucky --
DUNNAN: David, who doesn't want to show his face, is a self-described addict. He says his drug is Oxycodone. When he can't get it, he knows he can easily get heroin. He's been in and out of recovery.
DAVID, DRUG ADDICT: Heroin's a lot cheaper than the pills are and everybody's flocking to the heroine.
DUNNAN: And how easy is it to find?
DAVID: Literally five minutes down the road. It's everywhere. It's everywhere.
DUNNAN (on camera): Is this at an epidemic level yet?
PARKINSON: You know, I don't know if it's there yet but it's going to be there.
DUNNAN: It's that bad?
PARKINSON: Yes, it's that bad, yes.
DUNNAN (voice-over): For Jamie, it's a battle he hopes he will win.
JAMIE: It's a monkey on your back you can't shake.
DUNNAN: He knows leaving rehab doesn't mean he's cured.
Tory Dunnan, Delray Beach, Florida. (END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: I'm going to reintroduce them. We're going to be joined by Vermont Governor Peter Shumlin and Bob Forrest, head addiction counselor on "Celebrity Rehab", himself a former heroin addict.
Thank you both for joining us.
Governor, according to law enforcement officials, heroin is actually more expensive where you are than right here in New York City. A $6 bag in New York City, it can cost up to $30 or $40 in northern New England. Why is this -- why is this crisis so big in Vermont?
GOV. PETER SHUMLIN (D), VERMONT: Well, you know, as you just heard from the folks suffering from the disease, the addicts you just talked to, this is a national crisis. I think the difference in Vermont is that we're going to confront it head-on and use our extraordinary abilities as a community in a small state where we have an extraordinary quality of life, where neighbors help out neighbors, neighbors reach out to strangers, to turn the tide.
And you just mentioned the economics. You know, this stuff -- first of all, when the FDA approved OxyContin and other painkillers which is heroin in pill form, make no mistake about it, that has exasperated this challenge by taking folks from pills then to heroin once they become addicts because in Vermont and across this country now, heroin is cheaper on the streets than OxyContin on the streets.
So, we have to accept the fact that we've got a national challenge. I feel very strongly as a governor that we've got to treat this as a disease, the disease that it is, and a health care crisis we've got to cope with and obviously we can't continue to just say the old fashioned view that law enforcement alone can solve this problem.
LEMON: Right. Listen, much has been made today about New Jersey Governor Chris Christie, his State of the State address. He touched on issues about his state. He didn't focus his entire speech on it.
Last year, your entire speech was about education. This year, it's drug addiction. There's unemployment, there's all kinds of things to be talked about.
Do you think this is that big of an issue not only in your state but across the country that you would devote your entire state of the state to it?
SHUMLIN: You know, I'm not going to comment on the rest of the country. But I can tell you when you talk to Vermonters and the folks addicted, and the rise in crime you know, we don't have the crime in Vermont. We're a place where you can leave your key in the car. You don't have to lock your door in rural Vermont, where we trust each other.
But the rise in the kind I have crime that happens when you're feeding an addiction problem, the habit, that can cost up to 40,000, 50,000 grand a year, before you put a roof on your head, are food on the table, there's no question that this is a challenge that really does potentially sacrifice the extraordinary quality of life that we cherish in Vermont.
My job as governor is to work together with folks to find more creative ways to deal with it.
LEMON: I want to bring Bob in now. Bob, because you know about this personally. Not only you've dealt with it, but you deal with people now dealing with this issue.
Why is it so dangerous and more addictive, it appears, than other drugs?
BOB FORREST, HEAD ADDICTION COUNSELOR, "CELEBRITY REHAB": Well, opiates in general are the most addictive substance on the face of the earth. The fact is, what the governor is saying and I commend you so much, thank you so much. He's saying some of the things that I've known and been trying to say for the last five years. Which is this is a tsunami across America, Vermont, Las Vegas -- I work all over the country.
This prescription drug epidemic laid the fertile soil for this heroin addiction and the desperation that an opiate addict feels when they need a fix makes them do outrageous and crazy and violent things. And this is -- I'm just so touched by what I'm hearing from the governor.
This is amazing. We're going to -- we're going to deal with this problem, but we first have to know that it exists, 100 Americans are going to die today from opiate-related death, 100 today.
LEMON: Yes.
Bob, the governor has asked for more money for treatment programs. At the said in his annual address incarcerating a person for a week costs about $1,120, and for treatment at a state finance center it costs $123. I mean, how hard is this addiction to treat and should we be putting people into treatment rather than locking them up?
FORREST: Well, of course, it's more cost efficient. But we need new -- on my side of the table, we need more new and innovative methods of dealing with addiction and addiction treatment. Outpatient basis, more accountability to the payee and that's what I hope is this new generation of drug treatment is going to be new and innovative, and work with government and work with these social problems as a whole.
They're not separate problems. I've been saying for 10 years, we don't have a homeless problem in Los Angeles. We have a drug problem in Los Angeles.
You constantly hear reports about a homeless problem. The homeless population of drug addicted for the most part.
LEMON: Bob --
FORREST: It's all interrelated.
LEMON: Bob, Governor, thank you very much. We appreciate your time here on CNN.
FORREST: Thank you.
LEMON: Thank you.
SHUMLIN: Thanks for having us.
LEMON: Still to come, we have been talking about the Omaha toddler, the so-called thug cycle baby. Tonight, we tell you about another child and this time, the system failed that child.
Plus, the president of France addresses allegations of an affair with an actress.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: We are back with tonight's "Outer Circle".
Tonight, we go to France where French President Francois Hollande answered questions about his alleged affair with an actress and whether or not the first lady will accompany him on an upcoming trip to the U.S. I asked Jim Bittermann what Hollande said about the allegations.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIM BITTERMANN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Don, the French president clearly wanted to get the message out about his economic policy and he did that in his news conference. But there were a handful of questions about his personal life including the first one which a reporter asked him if, in fact, Valerie Trierweiler, the first lady, would be accompanying President Hollande when he goes to the United States for a state dinner. He's been invited by President Obama to do that.
And he answered it this way. He said, "Everyone in their personal life can face trials. That's our case. These are painful moments." And he went on to say he would answer the question whether or not she'll travel to Washington with him at a later date, sometime before the trip takes place.
He also said his security was never in question and any of his public or private travels. And he said he's not going to sue the magazine that revealed the allegations about his affair with the actress -- Don.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: All right. Thank you, Jim.
Kids in crisis. For over a week now, we have been following the story that Nebraska toddler who was caught on video using foul language and slurs.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Say (EXPLETIVE DELETED) I'm from deuce nine (EXPLETIVE DELETED).
What hood you from?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
LEMON: Tonight, as far as we know, the 2-year-old is still in protective custody waiting to be placed in a foster home with his 17- year-old mother. It is a story that's generating business response from you at home and raising serious questions about just how many other kids are living in dangerous environments.
Well, tonight we are learning more about another case of neglect. This time, it's a 4-year-old in New York City who was in desperate need of help, yet he slipped through the cracks and was ultimately killed. That's according to police by his own caretaker.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON (voice-over): The final weeks of 4-year-old Myls Dobson's life were allegedly filled with horrific acts of violence and neglect, according to a disturbing it criminal complaint.
POLICE COMMISSIONER WILLIAM BRATTON, NEW YORK CITY: It was a tragic death of that young boy. Horrific injuries sustained over a period of days.
LEMON: Dobson had been staying with 27-year-old Crissy King (ph) since mid-December. The boy's father, Okie Wade (ph), left Dobson in her care.
Responding to a 911 call, NYPD says officers found the boy locked in a bathroom at King's Manhattan apartment unconscious and unresponsive on the floor -- burned, battered animal nourished. The child was pronounced dead at St. Luke's Hospital.
In the complaint, King admitted to authorities she burned the boy with a hot oven rack and struck him with a belt leaving scars and bruises. On one of the coldest days of the year, King allegedly told police she locked him out on the balcony for up to an hour wearing only a t-shirt and shorts.
King was arrested on charges of first degree assault, first degree reckless endangerment, endangering the welfare of a child and unlawful imprisonment. Her attorney, Brian Konawsky (ph), told CNN, quote, "My client is not charged with homicide at this time and she is presumed to be innocent of allegations against her."
ASHLEE DOBSON, MYLS DOBSON'S MOTHER: I love my son. He always loved me and gave me kisses.
LEMON: Myls Dobson's case was already with New York's Protective Child Services. His mother says the city took her son away from her in 2012. She says it was due to presidential reasons. The boy was then placed with his father Okie Wade. Just days after Wade dropped his son off with King in December, he was arrested on conspiracy and money laundering charges to which he pled not guilty. Now, many are demanding answers.
TONY HERBERT, FAMILY ADVISOR: The city of New York thought it best to put the child in the care of the father who they knew was a felon.
LEMON: New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio called Dobson's death tragic, ordering a full investigation.
MAYOR BILL DE BLASIO, NEW YORK CITY: Each one of these tragedies, it's our job to try and stop and God forbid when they happen, it is our job to learn from them and try every time to do better so we can (INAUDIBLE).
LEMON: And reach them hopefully before it gets this far.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: I want to bring in Judge Glenda Hatchett and Mel Robbins, a former legal aid criminal defense attorney.
Thank you, guys.
This is just horrific, Judge Hatchett.
When you hear this case, how is it that a little young boy like this can be let down not only by his family, by law enforcement, by child welfare agencies, that are supposed to protect at risk kids?
JUDGE GLENDA HATCHETT, AUTHOR AND SPEAKER: Well, but the question really becomes, don, whether he was still being monitored after the custody was transferred to his father. And as I understand it, the mother lost custody. The father got custody. And at that point, had there not necessarily been allegations or complaints made of an investigation at that point, I am not sure that the authorities would have had any idea that this child was being tortured.
And I don't know that the system is designed to protect every child that is at risk. I mean, that is just the real reality of what happens because parents have rights. And unless you can show that there is a pattern of abuse, that there is some reason for the child to be taken from the father, then I'm not sure that authorities would have intervened in this tragic situation.
LEMON: Is this -- I want -- Judge, I want you to respond to this and then Mel. Are we talking here really about it starts with the family. It starts at home. Is this a breakdown of the family, Judge?
HATCHETT: It is a breakdown in a situation where this father made an assumption about a caretaker.
LEMON: Right.
HATCHETT: As I understand, he had not been dating very long. And so, the question is, are we really looking at who is caring for our children? And, Don, I have seen so many of these cases on the bench where somebody else is caring for a child that ends up abusing them and often killing them which is a question of judgment.
LEMON: Right.
Mel?
MEL ROBBINS, FOUNDER, INSPIRE52.COM: You know, Don, I want to scream honestly when I read through the details in this case. And here's a couple of things. This kid fell so far through the cracks he fell into the arms of a monster.
I'm going to say something that a lot of you at home are going to call me really horrible for saying, but the first line of defense for any kid is the family. The mother failed this kid in 2012 when the kid was taken away. He was then given to his father who -- I don't know about you, but how it is that the Department for Child Welfare determines that a guy with at least 13 arrests is the appropriate place for the custodial home of this kid? I mean, that's a whole another question.
And then the guy gets arrested and there's no system in place where one computer talks to another and if the kid's been in the system somebody's alerted to go check on him if the custodial parent is arrested.
But I'm not done yet, because here's the thing that really makes me angry, aside from the monster killing this kid, is the fact that this monster had this child not for one day, Don, not for two days, not for three days, he had him for three weeks, over the holidays. This kid has aunts and uncles and grandparents.
HATCHETT: Who went to see about him?
(CROSSTALK)
LEMON: That's my question, was this a breakdown in the family? Because we keep blaming everyone, yes. There needs to be a safety net.
ROBBINS: Of course it is.
LEMON: The first line of defense is the home.
ROBBINS: I agree with you, Don.
LEMON: A family in place.
Judge Hatchett and Mel, these type of cases, I just want to read these types of cases involve parents, children of all different races. 13- year-old Christian Choate from Indiana killed after he was beaten, starved and locked in a dog cage by his father and stepmother. That was back in 2009. The Indiana Department of Child Services visited Christian's household more than 10 times before he was killed.
Last year, 6-year-old Khalil Wimes was beaten, starved to death, locked in an empty room with only a urine-soaked mattress after officials released the boy back into the care of his parents. In both of these cases, authorities were aware of the situation that these children were in.
(CROSSTALK)
ROBBINS: I'll tell you, one strike and you're out. As far as I'm concerned, the decision to become a parent is one of the most sacred and important responsibilities that you can make as an adult. And if you screw up just once and you abuse that kid, you have proven to society you're not the appropriate person to have the child. I don't care what kind of training you go through.
HATCHETT: I understand that. I have seen thousands and thousands of cases, and there have been some -- now, I understand that it doesn't happen all the time. But I have seen some situations where people have actually been rehabilitated, the children have been put back with families, and they have actually done extremely well.
So, to say one strike and you're out I think is too broad a brush, because it has to be an individual situation that we have to assess. I really believe that strongly.
LEMON: If this case could not get any worse, we are told by police that the boy's body still has not been claimed, all right? Even in death.
HATCHETT: Oh, my goodness.
LEMON: Thank you guys.
ROBBINS: How is that possible? They're having press conferences, Don. The family's having press conferences around not even claiming the body?
HATCHETT: Beyond tragic. >
LEMON: Thank you. We'll talk more I'm sure. Hopefully this doesn't happen again but sadly the evidence shows it will.
Still to come, it's called Lawrencing. We're going to explain what it is next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
LEMON: There is one at every award ceremony. That dress that gets all the media buzz. Here's Jeanne Moos.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
JEANNE MOOS, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): No matter how great they say you look --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Jennifer, you look great.
MOOS: No matter how amazing.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You look amazing.
MOOS: Jennifer Lawrence learned the hard way that the fashion police are out to get you.
CHARACTER: This is a catastrophe!
MOOS: They had the nerve to compare her Dior gown to the sail cloth and rope that made up the Little Mermaid's outfit.
CHARACTER: You look sensational.
MOOS: There were some sensational imitations tweeted out by actor Colton Haynes, for instance. He dressed up in comforters. They dressed up in sheets. It became known as Lawrencing.
This Denver TV anchor tweeted out. "Who wore it better, Jennifer Lawrence or my floor director Aaron".
(on camera): Lawrencing was an instant hit, because it's so easy any idiot can do it. Using materials that everyone has at home.
(voice-over): We topped off our cabbage patch Lawrence look alike with gaffer tape to simulate the fashion gaffe. Then there's L.V., the puggle, combination pug and beagle.
ELLIE ROUNTREE, PHOTOGRAPED PUGGLE: Magic happens. That is L.A.'s magical dress.
MOOS: Magic made out of a pillowcase and two neck ties. When Elie Rountree and friend saw Jennifer Lawrence on the red carpet, they immediately decided to transform L.V.
(on camera): The outfit stayed on about five minutes?
ROUNTREE: Oh, not even. I would say about 30 seconds. And I think we really nailed it there with L.V.'s coy look at the camera.
MOOS (voice-over): But most who mocked Jennifer's outfit said they loved her.
JENNIFER LAWRENCE, ACTRESS: How do I hold it?
MOOS: As one fan put it, she could wear a burlap sack and it changes nothing. The haters are just jealous.
The much-maligned gown was still front and center on Dior's Web site.
(on camera): A spokesperson says the dress is available by special order, but since it's custom made she couldn't specify a price.
(voice-over): Attention is priceless so a tequila company dressed up a bottle.
LAWRENCE: I need to catch up on my drinking.
MOOS: The fine bedding company encouraged customers to don a duvet. Even Godzilla addressed the dress issue -- a dress that started out on the catwalk and ended up being mocked by a copycat.
Jeanne Moos, CNN, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
LEMON: Thanks for watching.
Here's Anderson.
